Architect fees, percentage of what? client supply?

[monkstownman]

Hi,
I have the standard architects RIAI contract with our architect.
They get paid a percentage of the contract sum.
The contract sum initially included an extension and a kitchen when we signed the contract. 20000 was agreed for the kitchen. However, it was agreed that the architect would not do the kitchen and we would get a third party to design and install the kitchen.
Now the architect wants us to pay a percentage on the amount we paid for the kitchen. Is this correct?
Also, there were several items that were client supply that we bought, some bathroom fittings and tiles. The architect wants us to supply receipts for these and get a percentage on this. Is this correct?
Any guidance on this would be gratefully appreciated.

 

[snowdrop]

I have an extension going on at the moment - full RIAI architect service - design, planning and supervision - for 12% of main contractor cost - its not cheap but I respect the knowledge and skill required to do it properly (so far 15 site visits and reports). I am buying fittings and some services eg sanitary ware, tiles, tiling, robes, painting etc and managing same myself in which is well within my capability - he does not get a % of this.

I'd tell your guy to hump off - politely of course

 

[monkstownman]

I'm embarrassed to say it but we paid 15%. We've had terrible problems with this architect. In fact, he took us on but a quarter of the way through the project he passed it over to his wife, a real amateur. When we tried to get rid of her we were told that because she was a member of the practice and as we had engaged the practice we had to take her. We never saw any examples of her work and certainly would not have gone with them if we had known we would have to deal with her. We never got on with her. We never got proper reports like you seem to have got and only belatedly got Architects Instructions. Anyhow, we have a load of issues with them.
The kitchen floor (at around 10,000) is faulty and they never correctly snagged it. We think it was put down before the cement floor dried out.
Do you know anything about the arbitration process with the RIAI? It looks like things are heading that route

 

[snowdrop]

I'm afraid to say I don't know much about the riai arbitration route but to my mind it sounds like you have a case. AFAIK part of the riai contract includes the site visits, reports, specification lists etc. and he is responsible for dealing with the contractor and rectifying any mistakes. I know that our guy has had the contractor redo certain things a number of times until he was happy with them plus he checks after each report that the items in the previous have been dealt with.

BTW are you Cork or Dublin monkstown?

 

[ubiquitous]

Agreeing to pay Percentage fees to an architect is insane, as it incentivises the architect to justify the highest possible build cost. This is the madness that ensured that the State was ripped off on most major construction projects until the system was reformed a few years ago.

 

[snowdrop]

hi ubiquitous

Actually it's not 'insane'. We gave our architect a budget to which he had to work which included his fees. The project was designed and specced accordingly with this budget in mind, tenders were received and a contractor appointed so in effect I have a fixed price from day one and a professional to manage it. This is the second time we have worked with this architect and are v. happy with the value we receive.
I might also add that we have a building which is designed purposely for our specific needs and its site, highly specced in terms of insulation etc., and by the way also is of architectural merit in terms of its visual design (never had a planning query on design).

I hazard a guess that our individual property will weather the downturn a bit better than a) the insensitively designed one-offs or b) the identikit solutions.

A successful project is one where all parties communicate and collaborate effectively from day one. Not all architects are out to rip you off and not all clients are eejits so your generalisation is unhelpful.