The law is open to debate. That is why we have lawyers. If it wasnt we would not need so many lawyers.
If I got my arms tattoo'd and was told to cover them up I am sure I could get a lawyer who could argue my case in front of a judge and I would have a chance of winning. Maybe not in front of every judge but certainly in front of some.
My point is, you as an employer cant bend me to your will. If you try to I can bring a case against you. I may win, I may not. But if I put up a determined enough case/fight it will cost you more money (plus time and headaches) than me.
Still want to force me to cover my arms?
The law is open to debate. That is why we have lawyers. If it wasnt we would not need so many lawyers.
If I got my arms tattoo'd and was told to cover them up I am sure I could get a lawyer who could argue my case in front of a judge and I would have a chance of winning. Maybe not in front of every judge but certainly in front of some.
My point is, you as an employer cant bend me to your will. If you try to I can bring a case against you. I may win, I may not. But if I put up a determined enough case/fight it will cost you more money (plus time and headaches) than me.
Still want to force me to cover my arms?
No, I think that if they are not appropriately dressed, it can be one factor for borderline candidates that might tip them over into the No box of job candidates. In large companies, the front line of people that are assessing prospective new employees are not assessing their abilities to to job. They are faceless people from HR who are assessing the applicants for the their suitability to mesh with the company in general, and fit in with its corporate ethos. If they have to weed through 500 CV's to fill 5 positions, that probably means whittling down the 500 to the 50 that will be called for an initial phone interview, called in for a first real interview with HR, called back to come in and take an aptitude test, and called back again second interview. If you make a mistake during any of those steps, you will not get to go on to the next one. Wearing something overly casual or inappropriate during an aptitude test could very well be considered to be a mistake that scuppers your chances. Fair or not, it happens !
Employer's cant change terms and conditions retrospectively without agreement from employees.Employers can impose a dress code on employees as long as it doesn't discriminate and that includes asking people to cover up tattoos or not wearing flip flops to work (there isn't an actual law outlawing specifically that either in case you were wondering). You may not agree with it but that is the way it is.
Employer's cant change terms and conditions retrospectively without agreement from employees.
Employer's cant change terms and conditions retrospectively without agreement from employees.
Never said they could but most contracts of employment or staff handbooks in business organisations contain sections on appearance and dress code requiring you to look business like. Most normal people don't think a guy in a short shirt showing off his latest 'I love Lucy' tattoo looks business like. You are free to get them but the company is free to ask you to cover them. Just as they are free to ask you to remove piercings from your face. Just because something is not explicitly forbidden in a contract doesn't mean it is allowed.
Exactly... Ask being the operative word.
If a company tried to make you cover them then there could be a problem.
Say I worked in a cake shop. Did so for 18 months and was doing a great job. My uniform was short sleeved. I wanted and got a tattoo on my arm. My employer decided I should now wear a long sleeved tunic. Then I think we could have a problem.
Also, people do not confine tattoos to just arms anymore. Cheryl Cole has artistic design tattoos on her hand. Lots of females are copying this (rightly or wrongly). Do you now insist that they wear gloves?
Fergal Quinn had a programme on RTE recently where he helped people get their retail outlets in order by giving them advice etc... One girl who was a baker and had her own cakeshop had small tattoos behind her ear. Should she be made wear a balaclava while serving customers? Or should she be fired for getting them if she was an employee? She seemed pretty competant too...
Sorry, where exactly did I say that every company would have a problem with employees showing tattoos? If you are going to argue a point, make sure you are arguing the same point as everyone else.
You are arguing that employers have no rights to dictate anything. I am simply saying they have plenty of rights in this area.
Not true - you seem to be assuming that 'formal dress - no tattoos' is an assumed default in every contract of employment. This is not true. If an employer has a 'no tattoos' rule, they need to communicate this with employees during recruitment. If an employer wants to bring in a 'no tattoos' rule, they need to do this in consultation with their employees.That would only apply if "dress down" was explicit in the contract of employment.
Not true - you seem to be assuming that 'formal dress - no tattoos' is an assumed default in every contract of employment. This is not true. If an employer has a 'no tattoos' rule, they need to communicate this with employees during recruitment. If an employer wants to bring in a 'no tattoos' rule, they need to do this in consultation with their employees.
Not true - you seem to be assuming that 'formal dress - no tattoos' is an assumed default in every contract of employment. This is not true. If an employer has a 'no tattoos' rule, they need to communicate this with employees during recruitment. If an employer wants to bring in a 'no tattoos' rule, they need to do this in consultation with their employees.
You are perfectly entitled to ask that tattoos be covered up.
Best of all was the girl next to me, resplendent in White cut of jeans, low cut vest top, numerous gold chains rattling round her neck and to cap it off, trainers on her feet.
Maybe I'm too conservative/conformist, but I think wearing tatoos on visible body parts is just another thing you can do to make life just that little bit more difficult for yourself.
Especially if you fall asleep druing the procedure and get more than you bargained for.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/8104519.stm
i think we as a people are too hung up on dress code. We put our children into uniform at the age of 4 or 5 to send them off to school. Why? Because that is the convention.
it was the convention in the 50s to be subservient to the catholic church. No one questioned it.
i love the educate together ethos schools. Kids don’t wear uniform. They are individuals. I cant get my head around the idea that kids should wear a uniform at 4 or 5.
i heard the stories about google and the cloths policy. This is the way to go in my opinion. It you can do your job competently then any clothes you wear should not matter one iota.
challenge conventions, challenge norms.
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