Aer Lingus worth €1.5bn

TarfHead said:

Well .. sometimes .. the stock allocation is related to corporate performance, not individual. If you sit there dossing all year, you'll get the offer of stock, same as the person who gave it their all.

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Yeah, good point. Always felt a bit guilty taking the shares

ronan_d_john said:

That's fine. No problems there. The staff are receiving the stock as a bonus depending on targets achieved.

They're not receiving them just because they're employees. Back to my question to the Aer Lingus employee. Sorry, over to you meccano.

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That is exactly the same process as occurred in Aer Lingus - this is all in the poblic domain, but you'd prefer obviously to assume the worst. Your prejudice is obvious.

That is obvious also in your reference to Aer Lingus' staff as 'monkeys'.
You made an issue of my use of that word before and I removed it. I also pointed out that if you found it so unacceptable you would remove your post which quoted the comment.
I noted then that you did not do so, and now you have repeated the word yourself, ergo it's plain for all to see that your objection was feigned for a debating advantage and you are merely a hypocrite.

Tarfhead I have no problem with the government extracting every last penny per share when floating a public asset. It's up to the Financial institutions who buy them to decide whether the asking price is fair or not.

I have no sympathy for the people who bought shares in Eircom if they lost money. Adults take responsibility for their actions and a large proportion of the people who bought turned the shares over quickly and made a profit.

Mecanno, the employees only co-operated with the floatation once they had extracted their pound of flesh and that is not co-operation, that is extortion.
Seems people in the public sector expect pay rises every year. Working on this premise it seems Aer Lingus employees expected shares in lieu of lost salary. This is not a concept that most private sector employees are familiar with.

Meccano said:

That is exactly the same process as occurred in Aer Lingus - this is all in the poblic domain, but you'd prefer obviously to assume the worst. Your prejudice is obvious.

That is obvious also in your reference to Aer Lingus' staff as 'monkeys'.
You made an issue of my use of that word before and I removed it. I also pointed out that if you found it so unacceptable you would remove your post which quoted the comment.
I noted then that you did not do so, and now you have repeated the word yourself, ergo it's plain for all to see that your objection was feigned for a debating advantage and you are merely a hypocrite.

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You called Ryanair employees monkeys. I can find it unacceptable, and I don't think its hypocritical to remind you of the fact that you used this term to describe human beings.

My use of the term in relation to Aer Lingus was in relation specifically to your comment, since soon, all Aer Lingus staff will become Ryanair staff. Since you obviously have a prejudice in favour of Aer Lingus staff, I was merely asking if your opinions re Ryanair staff and monkeys would continue in that situation.

Regarding posts and removal of posts, just because you removed the post doesn't mean that you didn't say it, and doesn't mean that it's not what you still believe.

And I don't believe that I'm in any way hypocritical to be quoting your comments to show that you're arguments are mostly over the top, and more and more, not even worth taking heed of.

Back to my question which you haven't specifically answered. In response to your comments here -

Meccano said:

The other 11.9% is NOT being GIVEN to them - they are BUYING it through further foregone wage increases and performance pay.

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I asked this simple question -

ronan_d_john said:

Are these foregone wage increases and performance bonuses something that were contractually promised? Or were they notionally indicated that they could be provided?

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Again I say, this is important to distinguish. Shares would be paid in the former case, but given away in the latter case.

Your most recent post seems to say that these shares would be paid on foot of performance bonuses. Which is fine. But none of the future performance targets have been achieved yet - they can't be. They're in the future.

Yet they've been given the shares already. So basically, this was a give-away rather than the Aer Lingus staff earning anything at all with regards to the majority of their shareholding in the company.