30kmh limit to protect cyclists and pedestrians

pat127 said:
I was thinking along the same lines. If the average speed in the city centre is 12kph, then what's all the fuss about?
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The average is 12kph. That includes the time you spend sitting at 0kph and driving at 50kph. If you knock 20kph of the max in the city you will bring the average down into single digits.

And yes it's a dumb idea
 
sinbadsailor said:
And if pedestrians actually stayed on the foothpaths until it was safe to cross on a green man?.....you see where it goes...let people take responsibility for their actions.
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What about young children in housing estates etc. - I know, we should teach them not to, but there is always a risk that they will run out on the road after a ball etc etc. So I believe that 50 kph is too fast in residential areas, close to schools etc
 
Looking at the speedometer in my car, 30kph is 20mph. While it's low, it is used in some areas, and it isn't as mad as the 5kph limit that they tried to introduce (I think) on the road out to Bull Island.
 

If residential areas and schools were where we have been talking about I would agree with you 110%. But then again in some housing estates it's the kids breaking the speed limits on their quads, scramblers and hinda civic's

They are other issues though, we should not be changing speed limits to protect adults who try and skip through a line of moving traffic rather than do as they teach their children and wait for the green man?
 
diarmuidc said:
The average is 12kph. That includes the time you spend sitting at 0kph and driving at 50kph. If you knock 20kph of the max in the city you will bring the average down into single digits.

And yes it's a dumb idea
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Look at another way. What's the point of travelling fast between blockages, wasting fuel and creating unnecessary pollution when all you do is lose the gain on arrival? Would it not make more sense to try to match the arrival of traffic at the blockage with the flow of traffic away from it ?
 
Doesn't this sound like the thin edge of the wedge?
30kph today, pushing your car tomorrow, no car allowed the day after.
Eventually the aim is to ban cars and trucks from the city centre, but of course the Irish version of congestion charging will come in without the necessary improvement in public transport infrastructure. Like everything done in this state it will be halfassed and make us a joke.

With regards to cyclists, can any of them answer how come they want truckers and motorists to be forced to jump through hoops while most of them do not bother with the rules of the road or at least the ones that pertain to junctions and traffic lights ?
Maybe if cyclists actually used cycle lanes and stopped at junctions when they do not have the green light, they might help protect a few pedestrians from injury.
 
jmayo said:
Maybe if cyclists actually used cycle lanes and stopped at junctions when they do not have the green light, they might help protect a few pedestrians from injury.
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The injuries produced by a cycle/perestrian incident are generally minor. Car/cyclist or car/pedestrian impacts produce much more severe injuries in the person without a steel box around them. The car driver is usually uninjured in these incidents.
 
Having been in the most unfortunate situation of knocking someone over with a bicycle a few years back I can confirm that not all accidents involving pedestrians and cyclists result in 'only minor' injuries!
 
spoken like a person who has never used a cycle lane (or a bicycle) a lot of the cycle lanes in the city arer a shambles with very poor surfaces. At least when the weather is is good you can see the potholes etc but when it is raining it is very dangerous as you cant see them. And as for junctions! the amount of lanes that just stop and start for no particular is very frustrating.
 

Of course the condition of the road surface in the bus lane has nothing to do with the proposed speed limit decrease. The road surface in the city as a whole is third world, but thats another topic.

People comment on what they see, and as far as I can see from my time in the city, cyclists do not take due care and diligence while cycling in the city centre. Everyone has to use the same road, the speed limit is OK.

I would think that it's the likes of iPods in the ears of cyclists preventing them from hearing whats going on around them, and not giving hand signals etc while turning, changing lane etc that casuses them to be involved in accidents.

This sort of leisurely bicycling should be kept to the phoenix park on a sunday morning. Any other time, your full concentration is required as is the case for drivers and pedestrians alike...
 

so are the potholes the reason cyclists go through red lights then ?
Or maybe it is the fact that they need to get the next bit of coloured cycle lane on the other side of the junction ?
 
I presume that all those drivers who are pontificating about cyclists breaking red lights don't break speed limits on a regular basis while driving around the city?
 
RainyDay said:
I presume that all those drivers who are pontificating about cyclists breaking red lights don't break speed limits on a regular basis while driving around the city?
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Two wrongs dont make a right! Cyclist in the city can be extremely careless, we know it's a fact.

And unless they will be pushing their cars, they wont be able to help breaking the limit if this idiotic change comes in!
 
I'll rephrase so...I spend a lot of time driving in the city during peak times and I don't know how many times I have seen cyclists zipping in and out of traffic, cycling out in the middle of the lane on the quays with an iPod in their ears. I mean some of these couriers dont even have 2 functional brakes on the bikes.

So..in my opinion from what I have seen, a lot of cyclists behave in a manner that only increases the risk of them being involved in an accident with a motorist, with their actions bring the main cause.
 
Thats ok then. Its a fact...in your opinion

For what its worth you are right in some of what you say but you are generallising a fair bit. I dont think it is fair to compare couriers to 'normal' cyclists
 
sinbadsailor said:
Two wrongs dont make a right! Cyclist in the city can be extremely careless, we know it's a fact.
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Yes, of course we all see cyclists driving dangerously. Just as we all see drivers driving dangerously (breaking speed limits, lane hopping, phoning/texting while driving, poor lane positioning, poor observation etc etc).

And don't get me started on those jay-walking iPodded pedestrians...
 
ludermor said:
Thats ok then. Its a fact...in your opinion

For what its worth you are right in some of what you say but you are generallising a fair bit. I dont think it is fair to compare couriers to 'normal' cyclists
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True. Couriers are mainly on the pavements so you rarely have to worry about them. There isn't a high standard or driving or cycling in the city.

The big problem is lack of enforcement of the existing rules. We don't need more rules to ignore.
 
aircobra19 said:
True. Couriers are mainly on the pavements so you rarely have to worry about them. There isn't a high standard or driving or cycling in the city.

The big problem is lack of enforcement of the existing rules. We don't need more rules to ignore.
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I agree, reducing the speed limit will not help the situation, as everyone will know that there will be no enforcement of the limits.

This is true for the bulk of our new legislation. A well-manned, informed, common-sense approach by our Gardai would take care of a lot of the issues we are talking about. A Garda on the beat could have a positive influence on unsociable behaviour, petty crime on a daily basis, possibly dangerous driving/cycling, jailwalking etc. The gardai have a lot of powers already, they dont need more, we just need more of them
 
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