# we are both executors, HELP!!!



## THEDUB (13 Nov 2009)

OK, my Father died in April and left myself and my brother as executors in the will. probate will be over soon so we just have to split the house. 
I Made my brother a reasonable offer to buy the house 5 months ago (based on a valuation arranged by the solicitor handling the estate) and he said he needed time to think about it.

As we all know prices have come down again so i took 10k off the original offer. He has now gone to live in Canada (dont know where!) and called to say that he doesnt want to sell the house till the price rises again.

Where do i stand on this? Surely I can sell the house even if he doesnt want to? Maybe I cant sell it to myself but I surely dont have to wait till the price suits him.

Any ideas??


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## Vanilla (13 Nov 2009)

What was the wording of the will regarding the property. What stage of probate are you at.


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## THEDUB (13 Nov 2009)

all assets are split down the middle 50/50. The lawyer has the will at the moment so dont have exact wording. Probate, so we have informed by the lawyer will be complete by next month so we just have to sort the house out.


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## dinjoecurry (13 Nov 2009)

I would say that as the house was left 50/50 and you want your 50% there would be no problem selling the house If it was sold you at the current market price I don't see why your brother would have a problem .You could wait a very long time for prices to go up as IMHO they will fall a lot more before they go up again


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## Ravima (13 Nov 2009)

was thehouse simply left to the both of you, or is it to be sold and proceeds divided? You need to get some legal advice as there may be some method of where you make an offer to your brother seeking his 50% and at the same time offering to sell him your 50% at the same price.

The situation as it now stands is not satisfactory, given that he is away. Who is minding/caring the house? what about insurance/ESB etc?


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## THEDUB (19 Nov 2009)

We are living in the house at the moment paying ESB etc. Does that make any difference?


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## csirl (19 Nov 2009)

Assuming that there are no clauses in the Will regarding the right of anyone to live in the house for life, you are fully entitled to sell the house. It's up to you or your brother to offer you a fair price for your half or to bid for the house if it is put up for sale. Executors must make reasonable efforts to do their job within a certain period of time - they cannot wait for house prices to change.


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## Ravima (19 Nov 2009)

I thought he was gone to canada


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## tatler (19 Nov 2009)

Well if he's in Canada and you are living in the house it's costing you nothing why worry about it. Stay where you are.


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## Billo (19 Nov 2009)

THEDUB said:


> We are living in the house at the moment paying ESB etc. Does that make any difference?



Are you paying your brother for the use of his part of the house (maybe €500 a month). 
If not you are on a winner.


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## mf1 (20 Nov 2009)

tatler said:


> Well if he's in Canada and you are living in the house it's costing you nothing why worry about it. Stay where you are.



Except that the issue remains unresolved and will continue to remain  unresolved unless its dealt with. The issue is quite complicated as the joint beneficiaries are also the joint executors and, presumably, the Grant of Probate is to them both in which case they have to act jointly when dealing with the estate. 

Mind you, if the brother has gone to live in Canada, does that mean that it was OP only who is extracting the  Grant? That would change things. 

If all else fails, a Court action can generally solve most things!

mf


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## trailite (24 Nov 2009)

I am not a lawyer. However, I am basically in the same situation as you. Only in reverse. I own a third of a house, (sister owns a third) and brother the other third.

Some of the regulars on here might recognise my story, and wonder why this issue is
still ongoing.

Brother refuses to sell. Sister and I want it sold. It is now ten years, and he won't budge. We tried legal route, only to come to a standstill when we would have to force the issue into court. Barrister fees, were required up front to do this. Forcing ones brother into court is not an easy decision.

Long story, two thousand Euros later in solictor fees and still he would not agree to
sale of the house.

In the meantime, he pays no rent. (lost revenue to us) as it was rented out prior to his moving in. (last tally was 16,000 Euros to me, same to my sister) in lost revenue.

So I guess, in your case, you are living in your house, (but he also ownes half of it)

As long as he does not ask you to pay rent to him, I would say you are ahead.
but if he refuses to co-operate with sale of house, I would say you have to take him to court. (if you can find him) in Canada.
The threat of adverse possession comes into play also for my sister and I.
Two more years and he will be there. (12 Years) 

Sad when families are torn apart. Who would ever think this could happen, but it does and way more often than you think.


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## Bronte (24 Nov 2009)

trailite said:


> Some of the regulars on here might recognise my story, and wonder why this issue is
> still ongoing.


 
The issue is still ongoing in your case because you haven't taken your brother to court.

And that's precisely what the OP will need to do or else prepare to live for a long time with a very messy situation.


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## SparkRite (24 Nov 2009)

Is it not the case that if the will stated "that the house is to be sold and the proceeds divided between you and your brother"  then the house HAS to be sold.

Assuming that this is so and also assuming that a fair price is offered then is it not true that the sale MUST proceed whether you, or your brother, agree or not.

After all my understanding is that a will MUST be carried out in a reasonable time frame and it is not up to you or your brother as to when this happens just to suit yourselves.

I myself am in a somewhat similar situation, where two of the executors brother/sister are also benificieries and are not talking to their other two siblings who are also benificieries. Simplest of will, house to be sold and proceeds divided 4 ways, however the brother who is a bully, of the highest order, is doing ABSOLUTLY nothing, except refusing any offer made on the house so far and will not even discuss the matter with his sisters. Going on over two and a half years now,(house depreciating all the time) only path open to us now is to go legal with it.

Sorry, don't mean to hijack your thread (might start my own, actually) the best of luck with your situation, but I don't think it will be easy for you.


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## mf1 (24 Nov 2009)

"Is it not the case that if the will stated "that the house is to be sold and the proceeds divided between you and your brother" then the house HAS to be sold.

Assuming that this is so and also assuming that a fair price is offered then is it not true that the sale MUST proceed whether you, or your brother, agree or not."

The difficulty is in compelling someone to do something. Court is where these cases have to head and usually settle as , what I call "the light", goes on. People can get very thick about wills and property and until reality dawns, nothing happens. 

I have heard people rant and rave about "their own sister/brother" suing them, conveniently forgetting that it is their behaviour that  has pushed the sister/brother into a Court situation. 

mf


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## SparkRite (24 Nov 2009)

mf1 said:


> The difficulty is in compelling someone to do something. Court is where these cases have to head and usually settle as , what I call "the light", goes on. People can get very thick about wills and property and until reality dawns, nothing happens.
> 
> I have heard people rant and rave about "their own sister/brother" suing them, conveniently forgetting that it is their behaviour that has pushed the sister/brother into a Court situation.
> 
> mf


 
Well said Mf1, unfortunatly I  believe this is often the case.

I have started my own thread, pertinant to my own situation, so not to hijack "Thedubs" thread.


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## csirl (25 Nov 2009)

trailite said:


> I am not a lawyer. However, I am basically in the same situation as you. Only in reverse. I own a third of a house, (sister owns a third) and brother the other third.
> 
> Some of the regulars on here might recognise my story, and wonder why this issue is
> still ongoing.
> ...


 
This is not the same situation. The property of a deceased being distributed is very different from three people owning a house. 

The OP should also bear in mind that if the executor does not distribute the proceeds within a reasonable time, usually c.12 months, the beneficiaries can get him removed for failing to do his duty and claim compensation for any costs or financial losses from him. 

In the case of distributing property according to a Will, the default situation is that the assets are liquidated and proceeds divided.


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## THEDUB (25 Nov 2009)

It looks like its Lawyer time. No joy at all. thanks to all for advice. Quick question though. 
Can i retain the lawyer that is currently dealing with probate and handling the estate etc. I believe the Lawyer is excellent and trustworthy and would really like to use him to proceed with the necessary.

This lawyer was working on the deceased estate, valuing assets, revenue return etc . Surely when probate is done and dusted I can retain him


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## mf1 (25 Nov 2009)

THEDUB said:


> It looks like its Lawyer time. No joy at all. thanks to all for advice. Quick question though.
> Can i retain the lawyer that is currently dealing with probate and handling the estate etc. I believe the Lawyer is excellent and trustworthy and would really like to use him to proceed with the necessary.
> 
> This lawyer was working on the deceased estate, valuing assets, revenue return etc . Surely when probate is done and dusted I can retain him



I don't think so - I think there would be an element of conflict of interest - after all, he has acted for the other Executor. I don't  think it would be appropriate for that solicitor to act for either of you. 

mf


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