# 30%  of heat and broadband as tax credit for those working from home



## Brendan Burgess (12 Oct 2021)

tax credit? I think


----------



## Baby boomer (12 Oct 2021)

That would be very significant.  Wait until we see the small print though.  Presumably terms and conditions will apply....


----------



## odyssey06 (12 Oct 2021)

Last year it was a tax credit of 10% for utility bills and 30% for broadband.


----------



## Brendan Burgess (12 Oct 2021)

From the Irish Times

Donohoe has announced an income tax deduction amounting to 30 per cent of the cost of vouched expenses for heat, electricity and broadband in respect of those incurred while working from home.


----------



## MugsGame (12 Oct 2021)

So 30% of the ~10% apportioned to working from home (i.e. not worth the effort to claim unless you can make a good case for a higher apportionment) or 30% of total bill?


----------



## Savvy (12 Oct 2021)

Tax credit of 30% of (Days worked from Home)/365 * (yearly Bill)


----------



## odyssey06 (12 Oct 2021)

MugsGame said:


> So 30% of the ~10% apportioned to working from home (i.e. not worth the effort to claim unless you can make a good case for a higher apportionment) or 30% of total bill?


I'd assume, based on last year's setup, 30% apportioned by the number of days working from home*.*
Which is about 220-230 days if you are working from home full time.





						What costs can you claim for?
					

This page explains what costs you can claim for Remote Working Relief




					www.revenue.ie


----------



## MugsGame (12 Oct 2021)

Thanks, still works out to be practically nothing in their [broken link removed]. Surely the cost of implementing and claiming this is more than it's worth.


----------



## odyssey06 (12 Oct 2021)

I'd be due €110 back under the new regime assuming it's a tax credit.


----------



## Peanuts20 (12 Oct 2021)

what does he mean by "vouched expenses". Does that mean we have to back any claim with the relevant bills?


----------



## odyssey06 (12 Oct 2021)

Peanuts20 said:


> what does he mean by "vouched expenses". Does that mean we have to back any claim with the relevant bills?


I think so - keep the bills like with medical expenses.


----------



## NoRegretsCoyote (12 Oct 2021)

MugsGame said:


> Thanks, still works out to be practically nothing in their [broken link removed]. Surely the cost of implementing and claiming this is more than it's worth.


That's before the proposals to allow 30% for heating. It was 10% until now.

But otherwise you're right it's not very much.

Budget 2022 measures are projected to cost the Exchequer €10m a year. Assume 500,000 teleworkers to some extent and you get to about about €20 each.


----------



## Paul O Mahoney (12 Oct 2021)

odyssey06 said:


> I'd assume, based on last year's setup, 30% apportioned by the number of days working from home*.*
> Which is about 220-230 days if you are working from home full time.
> 
> 
> ...


That would be right I'm actually doing last years and I can't believe she was here that long.....surly an additional relief should be given to spouses. 

Obviously tongue in cheek


----------



## discovery101 (13 Oct 2021)

This this apply to those self employed working from home?


----------



## JohnJay (13 Oct 2021)

what happens when your broadband is part of a TV/Phone/Broadband package?


----------



## jim (14 Oct 2021)

JohnJay said:


> what happens when your broadband is part of a TV/Phone/Broadband package?


Make a reasonable estimate. Look at what you provider charges for just BB.


----------



## Clamball (14 Oct 2021)

I did it last year, scanned all the documents, estimated the broadband, estimated the number of days at home versus in the office. 

It was not worth the effort of finding all the paperwork and filling in all the detail.  Plus the bill had to be in the year you were claiming for.  So if the esb bill covered dec-jan, it accepted the bill from Jan 2020 where I pro rated the cost to just cover jan 2020.  but rejected the bill from jan 2021 when I tried to pro-rata the dec cost. So I submitted the full jan 2020 bill instead.

I think I got €60 back, it is so much fanfare and little substance.


----------



## Gordon Gekko (14 Oct 2021)

I love the way these things are so clearly designed by public servants…

“only the days you work, so 5/7 x 365 less holidays”


----------



## Paul O Mahoney (14 Oct 2021)

Gordon Gekko said:


> I love the way these things are so clearly designed by public servants…
> 
> “only the days you work, so 5/7 x 365 less holidays”


My exact thoughts herself was doing double that for weeks and has over 52 days holidays accrued, that the company has made an exception on her taking them due to obvious reasons.


----------



## time to plan (14 Oct 2021)

What if there are two (or more?) of you working at home? Can you claim 30% each, or do you just work out the total number of days that at least one of you is working at home?


----------



## odyssey06 (14 Oct 2021)

time to plan said:


> What if there are two (or more?) of you working at home? Can you claim 30% each, or do you just work out the total number of days that at least one of you is working at home?


Id assume no double up just the dsys at least one person wfh.


----------



## MugsGame (14 Oct 2021)

You claim 30% of what you pay. So if one person pays, they are the one that claims, otherwise you split the cost and claim between you.


----------



## time to plan (14 Oct 2021)

MugsGame said:


> You claim 30% of what you pay. So if one person pays, they are the one that claims, otherwise you split the cost and claim between you.


Sounds right. So next question will be if one of us claims eWorkers allowance of €3.20 pd, can the other claim the 30%. (You can't claim both I believe).


----------



## Itchy (14 Oct 2021)

time to plan said:


> Sounds right. So next question will be if one of us claims eWorkers allowance of €3.20 pd, can the other claim the 30%. (You can't claim both I believe).



This was discussed to death in last years home working thread, if I remember correctly. You don't claim eWorkers. Your employer will either pay you eWorkers (in which case you cant claim the 30%) or they don't pay you (and you could claim the 30%).


----------



## time to plan (14 Oct 2021)

Itchy said:


> This was discussed to death in last years home working thread, if I remember correctly. You don't claim eWorkers. Your employer will either pay you eWorkers (in which case you cant claim the 30%) or they don't pay you (and you could claim the 30%).


Agreed.
But if I claim eWorkers and my wife doesn't, can my wife claim the 30%?


----------



## Itchy (14 Oct 2021)

time to plan said:


> Agreed.
> But if I claim eWorkers and my wife doesn't, can my wife claim the 30%?



The payments are supposed to cover the same thing "This payment is to cover expenses incurred such as heating and electricity costs." It would be doubling up. Overall, its unclear. https://www.revenue.ie/en/tax-profe...ains-tax-corporation-tax/part-05/05-02-13.pdf

May the odds be ever in your favour...


----------



## time to plan (14 Oct 2021)

Itchy said:


> The payments are supposed to cover the same thing "This payment is to cover expenses incurred such as heating and electricity costs." It would be doubling up. Overall, its unclear. https://www.revenue.ie/en/tax-profe...ains-tax-corporation-tax/part-05/05-02-13.pdf
> 
> May the odds be ever in your favour...


Fair points. I'll ask my accountant (and report back).


----------



## MrEarl (15 Oct 2021)

What's the estimated average daily benefit, does anyone knew? 

I'm wondering if it's actually worth the trouble that it'll take to calculate the claim etc. 

These things are often designed to be a pain, and of little real value, purely to let politicans pretend that they've helped the tax payer.


----------



## The Horseman (15 Oct 2021)

MrEarl said:


> What's the estimated average daily benefit, does anyone knew?
> 
> I'm wondering if it's actually worth the trouble that it'll take to calculate the claim etc.
> 
> These things are often designed to be a pain, and of little real value, purely to let politicans pretend that they've helped the tax payer.


I heard the max would be around €200 or so. Obviously depends on the cost of your bills etc.


----------



## NoRegretsCoyote (15 Oct 2021)

MrEarl said:


> What's the estimated average daily benefit, does anyone knew?


Government estimates that it could benefit 400k workers at a fiscal cost of €11m.

That's €27.50 on average, so not very much.

I haven't done the sums but you might just get into three figures if you have high bills and telework a lot.


----------



## Itchy (15 Oct 2021)

MrEarl said:


> What's the estimated average daily benefit, does anyone knew?
> 
> I'm wondering if it's actually worth the trouble that it'll take to calculate the claim etc.
> 
> These things are often designed to be a pain, and of little real value, purely to let politicans pretend that they've helped the tax payer.



Top rate tax payer, fully WFH: (€100 p.m. L&H + €30 p.m Broadband) * 230/365 * 30% * 40% = €115. €10 p.m.


----------



## MugsGame (15 Oct 2021)

I've been approaching this wrong, I need to invest in a power guzzling cryptocurrency mining rig and then claim 30% of the electricity costs back.


----------



## RetirementPlan (15 Oct 2021)

Paul O Mahoney said:


> My exact thoughts herself was doing double that for weeks and has over 52 days holidays accrued, that the company has made an exception on her taking them due to obvious reasons.


The obvious reason being that they are underresourced but not too bothered about improving things as long as their staff are picking up the slack?


----------



## odyssey06 (15 Oct 2021)

MugsGame said:


> I've been approaching this wrong, I need to invest in a power guzzling cryptocurrency mining rig and then claim 30% of the electricity costs back.


Alas, these credits are usually setup with some internal threshold above which you'll get asked for documentation to support your claim.
And that seems more like a home business than remote working from home.


----------



## odyssey06 (15 Oct 2021)

Bad news. The higher 30 percent relief for electricity doesnt kick in until 2022 !

So when claiming for 2021 its the same as 2020. 

Bait and switch alert.


----------



## MugsGame (15 Oct 2021)

Ah well, there goes the €20 extra a month I needed to upgrade by broadband to a 10 Gbps fibre link.


----------



## Paul O Mahoney (15 Oct 2021)

I tried to get exact figures today from my previous supplier as we for the first time changed in July, but alas I can't access the Bill's as " my online account is now closed " 

So, I added up the emails including vat got a figure and applied the 10% and said to myself " the sun was shining and I'm here in the shade saving €45" if I was working that would be an hours charge in old money, and I gave up an opportunity to play 18 holes badly,  and I like that. 

Fools and money are seldom parted.

It's like the voucher for staycation on the form 11, why?

So my strategy is if I make a mistake in my returns and I owe them a few quid I'm going to dig up everything and then say "we never claimed that " .


----------



## MrEarl (16 Oct 2021)

The more I think about this, the more annoyed I'm getting - my limited free time is valuable, and yet our government think its okay to waste it with this nonsense.

... I could end up spending longer collecting and filing the bills, doing the maths and then the tax return, than I'd get back for my troubles, in financial terms.

Maybe I'm better off not wasting time trying to claim this petty relief, but ensuring that I vote against the current governing parties, at the next election?


----------



## irbx (16 Oct 2021)

MrEarl said:


> The more I think about this, the more annoyed I'm getting - my limited free time is valuable, and yet our government think its okay to waste it with this nonsense.
> 
> ... I could end up spending longer collecting and filing the bills, doing the maths and then the tax return, than I'd get back for my troubles, in financial terms.
> 
> Maybe I'm better off not wasting time trying to claim this petty relief, but ensuring that I vote against the current governing parties, at the next election?


I was of the same option. But yesterday it appears to revenue online have a updated receipt tracker and now easier to claim.

You upload WFH bills to them directly. Input date,cost, broadband or light/heat upload picture or PDF and save.

I followed the guide on their website https://www.revenue.ie/en/jobs-and-pensions/eworking/how-to-claim.aspx . Were you then do a online return. This already prepoulated with incomes and credits. But just needed to attach the WFH credit. Which added up everything for you inputted working days for 2020. Job done took around 30mins.

Not sure of final figure will revert back here when it updated. But even if 34 euro or more this helps towards lowering the TWSS tax I got in Feb .


----------



## time to plan (16 Oct 2021)

It would be far simpler to just allow everyone to claim the eWorkers allowance equivalent as a tax credit, if their employer doesn’t pay it.


----------



## JohnJay (16 Oct 2021)

I assume there is an upper limit to what you can claim?


----------



## odyssey06 (16 Oct 2021)

JohnJay said:


> I assume there is an upper limit to what you can claim?


Sortof but they wont tell you that figure. You submit the amount and it fails auto approval and then they manually review, based on my xp with other credits.


----------



## MrEarl (16 Oct 2021)

time to plan said:


> It would be far simpler to just allow everyone to claim the eWorkers allowance equivalent as a tax credit, if their employer doesn’t pay it.


Correct - but then they'd have to honour the full cost if it! 

This way, they probably get away with paying less than half of it, while claiming they did something for us.


----------



## MrEarl (16 Oct 2021)

irbx said:


> I was of the same option. But yesterday it appears to revenue online have a updated receipt tracker and now easier to claim.
> 
> You upload WFH bills to them directly. Input date,cost, broadband or light/heat upload picture or PDF and save.
> 
> ...



Doesn't sound like it's quite that quick, tbh.

How do you record, and be able to evidence, that you worked from home on certain dates, for example ?

I don't know about you, but I've been WFH for most of the last 18mths. However, if you ask me to prove it, I'm not sure that I can prove that I was here every day, didn't keep a formal diary for example, and while I'm logged onto my employers systems,  you'd be a very long time waiting for them to verify your claim that you worked from home on a particular date.


----------



## Coldwarrior (18 Oct 2021)

MrEarl said:


> I don't know about you, but I've been WFH for most of the last 18mths. However, if you ask me to prove it, I'm not sure that I can prove that I was here every day, didn't keep a formal diary for example, and while I'm logged onto my employers systems,  you'd be a very long time waiting for them to verify your claim that you worked from home on a particular date.


Are Revenue really going to look for proof of WFH days for a measly 60 - 80 quid on average?


----------



## Paul O Mahoney (18 Oct 2021)

Coldwarrior said:


> Are Revenue really going to look for proof of WFH days for a measly 60 - 80 quid on average?


Probably not but if it a pain to fill out , which it is, and people don't do it the Revenue get more than they should. If 500,000 people didn't claim say €50 that's what €25m .The majority of these taxpayers are whacked in the pocket all the time,  and I personally think it should be easier. 
During the lockdowns income tax revenue didn't fall off the cliff, indicating that people who were working from home are really the main taxpayers it would be better to simply give €200 tax credit across the board,  after all hundreds of  thousands got pup filling in a simple form online.


----------



## silverfox239 (18 Oct 2021)

I like the idea "better to simply give €200 tax credit across the board, after all hundreds of thousands got pup filling in a simple form online."


----------



## MrEarl (19 Oct 2021)

Coldwarrior said:


> Are Revenue really going to look for proof of WFH days for a measly 60 - 80 quid on average?


Revenue may well check up - by a simple random "dip test" type approach, for example.

Remember, their staff get paid the same hourly rate, regardless of what they are doing, from hour to hour.


----------



## RetirementPlan (19 Oct 2021)

time to plan said:


> It would be far simpler to just allow everyone to claim the eWorkers allowance equivalent as a tax credit, if their employer doesn’t pay it.


Great point - the current set up also means that those who are financially and technically literate are more likely to make a claim and have a successful outcome, which is far from ideal.


----------



## Cilar (5 Nov 2021)

Worth it if you have an electric car and charge it at home


----------



## irbx (5 Nov 2021)

So in my case, it was a 171 euro refund. (Higher rate tax payer)


----------

