# Selling Vodafone shares - clueless



## Shei

Sick of getting my tiny dividends and wads of paper on my 78 Vodafone shares.  How do I go about selling them with minimal cost?  Will I have to pay tax?  Will the bitter memories ever fade?


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## daveccork

to be honest i would think it is hardly worth selling - what is the current price ? 163p or so? that would be £127.14 convert to €190 (estimated) fee to sell €25 min i would think ....... check best buys etc. This would not leave you with much ...... maybe hold on and wait for a miricale 

if you decide to sell then you would go through a broker e.g. sharewatch and they will handle the sale on your behalf. you should check the best buys to find out the cheapest. there are also various other posts detailing peoples experiences with various stockbrokers - you might also want to view these.

I doubt you would pay tax. You get a CGT allowance each year of €1,270 - once your total proceeds from the sale of chargeable assets (less purchase and selling costs) in the current year don't exceed this, then there would be no CGT payable. (if shares / other assets are in joint names the yearly allowance would be €2,540)


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## z108

> Postal share dealing service
> A low cost postal share dealing service is available for holders of 1000 shares or less through our Registrars, Computershare Investor Services PLC. Shareholders may use the service to either increase their holding or sell their entire holding. The commission is £12.50 or €19.00. In addition stamp duty, currently at 0.5%, is payable on purchases. Shareholders wishing to take advantage of this service should contact Computershare at the address given below to obtain the necessary documentation.



See this webpage:

 [broken link removed]


Alternatively you could sign up for the dividend reinvestment plan and have the dividends reinvested in shares and hold long term (which depends on your age and financial condition). This is still in my opinion much better than leaving the  €190  in the bank. The value is too small (I think) to be worried about risk and Vodafone has actually been doing quite well lately. Its possible your shares may be bought out in a takeover or  by private equity which would eliminate the possibility of having to pay any commission to a stockbroker. There is a lot of interest in Vodafones new strategy in India and of selling off parts of the company.
We got Vodafone and Eircon share paper at the height of the dot com bubble so these companies are not as much  to blame for the bad share price we bought in at as the greedy people who bidded all share prices up to unsustainable levels at the time.


I'd like to know at what price for Vodafone do we recover our initial eircon investment ? Does anybody know ? 
I would really love to know this.


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## ClubMan

sign said:


> I'd like to know at what price for Vodafone do we recover our initial eircon investment ? Does anybody know ?
> I would really love to know this.


Tricky to calculate at this stage due to the various splits, takeovers, payments etc. since the original _eircom _days. You could start here if you were inclined to try though:

CGT losses on eircom shares


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## z108

ClubMan said:


> Tricky to calculate at this stage due to the various splits, takeovers, payments etc. since the original _eircom _days. You could start here if you were inclined to try though:
> 
> CGT losses on eircom shares



I'll have a look and get out my old pieces of share and dividend paper  but I'm not looking forward to this


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## GreatDane

Hi

Just wondering, if a number of "small" shareholders pooled togeather, signed their original share certs and delivered them togeather could they sell them under one trade with a stock broker and save the fees ?

It's very unfortunite, the way there are so many (ex Eircom) small Vodafone shareholders stuck with small numbers of shares they cannot sell due to the costs -vs- overall return and with such small dividends (sterling cheques, which probably cost to convert and lodge ?) it's not like they really want to keep the Vodafone shares in many instances I've heard about.

Thanks

G>
ps - thankfully one of the few who got out of Eircom at a good time, though not as good as those who've gone through few ownership changes needless to say


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## ClubMan

I thought that the _Vodafone _small shareholder postal dealing service had relatively competitive charges albeit probably no option to do limit orders?


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## z108

Garrettod said:


> ...with such small dividends (sterling cheques, which probably cost to convert and lodge ?) ...



In my opinion anybody who is stuck with a tiny amount of these shares they are not selling should not be receiving sterling cheques for tiny amounts  which they will be charged to cash in and also charged to convert into euro currency. They should be signed up to the DRIP dividend reinvestment plan. 


I'm very pleased with my last/second last DRIP purchase as I have received a return of about 50% on that price since then. It could reverse direction next time, who knows,  but  its a very good value and efficient method of investing the dividend and if held long term theres the hope of eventually building up a decent enough sized holding to sell properly.


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## MrKeane

I got some bumpf in the post today and it looks like you can register online and sell shares, the markets are closed now but I went as far as I could and it looks straightforward enough. I am trying to flog some shares belonging to somebody who is dead almost since the original flotation so hopefully I have finally figured out how to liquidate these by getting the money deposited into my bank account.


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## ClubMan

The link to this service was posted earlier in this thread!


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## MrKeane

ClubMan said:


> The link to this service was posted earlier in this thread!


 
Yes but i got some serial numbers and stuff in the post which presumably I need.

Anybody know what the breakeven point is to get our initial investment back? I guesstimate its about £3 - roughly double what it is now.


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## ClubMan

Unless you are a new shareholder you should presumably have had the shareholder reference number already? Do you have all your share certs in a safe place?

The question about the breakeven value was asked recently but I can't locate the thread at the moment. Due to the different events over the years since the original _eircom _shares were issued it's difficult to calculate the breakeven figure as far as I know.


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## MrKeane

No, I have no share cert and this online option looks like it does not need them? I probably have the shareholder reference number before but never got around to it.


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## ClubMan

You should either have shares or a nominee account containing your shareholding. You need to ascertain which.


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## MrKeane

ClubMan said:


> You should either have shares or a nominee account containing your shareholding. You need to ascertain which.


 
My understanding is that there were share certificates at one stage but this online dealing service appears to avoid the need to have them in your hand?


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## ClubMan

I don't think so and assume that if you hold your shares in certificate form then you need to pass these certs to the broker when selling. Otherwise they will need information about your nominee account. Can you quote (copy & paste) the relevant information that leads you to believe that this is not the case?


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## MrKeane

ClubMan said:


> I don't think so and assume that if you hold your shares in certificate form then you need to pass these certs to the broker when selling. Otherwise they will need information about your nominee account. Can you quote (copy & paste) the relevant information that leads you to believe that this is not the case?


 
Using the bumpf I got yesterday I managed to get an online page which allowed me to sell the shares except the market was closed so it said they would be sold when the market opened. However these were my wifes shares and not the dead persons so I will get my hands on the dead persons bumpf and try it and let you know, but from the way I read it all I needed to do was press the execute button and the shares would have been sold at that price.

Lots of interest in vodafone all of a sudden as the share price rises.


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## ClubMan

MrKeane said:


> I am trying to flog some shares belonging to somebody who is dead almost since the original flotation so hopefully I have finally figured out how to liquidate these by getting the money deposited into my bank account.


You cannot sell shares belonging to somebody else! The executor of the will should have dealt with this by transferring the shares into the name of the beneficiary of the will.


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## MrKeane

They forgot about these at the time so I am trying to get rid of the shares ever since, never actually got round to it though, although now it appears possible without major hassle.


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## ClubMan

Are you sure? My father's _Vodafone _shares are marked "U/D" whatever that means and cannot be touched until we eventually get them transferred to my mother's name which - 5 years on - we have still not managed to do!  Maybe our mistake was to say anything to them about his death and if we had said nothing we could have sold them?


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## MrKeane

All my mother-in-law says about the issue is "I thought the solicitor sorted all that but I am still getting cheques for him" It comes up everytime something arrives in the letterbox about vodafone, I tell her I will sort it and it gets forgotten about until the next time some bumpf arrives.

In any case I will let you know how I get on, hopefully it has been overlooked completely and I can just sell them online and lodge the money into a bank account avoiding the hassle of getting a cheque in his hame which I usually have trouble cashing.


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## ClubMan

My mother still gets the dividend cheques for my father's shares and can lodge them even though I think they're in his name! I tried signing her up for the _DRIP _scheme to avoid these small cheques but for some reason could not. I don't think that she can sell his shares while they are in his name. It'll be interesting to know how you get on - thanks.


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## MrKeane

I've just come across [broken link removed] page, perhaps you can try this route to do the name change?


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## ClubMan

Thanks - I might try that but I suspect that the "U/D" designation on my late father's shares may be significant and may prevent anything being done until the necessary paperwork is processed. The problem is documented elsewhere but basically _Vodafone/Computershare_ wanted a grant of probate etc. but the will/estate did not go to probate. Then they wanted some "small estates indemnity form" which we sent but they rejected the application for some reason but held onto the draft for c. £65 in admin fees. I must get back to this and try to get it sorted once and for all.


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## MrKeane

Thats a pity that they are making it so difficult for people, I hope we are not "U/D" as I keep getting nagged about it everytime there is vodafone stuff in the post.


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## ClubMan

Well the added complication was that my mother had lost all of the original share certs (her own and my father's) so the situation was even more complicated (e.g. also needed a letter of indemnity to get the original shares issued before transferring them to her name). However since _Vodafone _issued new shares last year after their capital repayment/restructuring this issue has gone away. So basically - our situation was complicated so I'm not surprised that there was hassle. Don't know why they never returned the draft for the money though...


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## MrKeane

I tried to sell the shares this evening and it appears to have succeeded. However, there is another problem, they will require us to send them the share certificate and they will issue a cheque but I doubt I will be able to locate the share certificate. The value of the shares is only about €100 so I don't know if it will be worth the hassle.

Like yourself the estate was only transferred between husband and wife so it may not have gone to probate etc. especially if they are likely to look for £65 in administration fees.


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## GreatDane

ClubMan said:


> I thought that the _Vodafone _small shareholder postal dealing service had relatively competitive charges albeit probably no option to do limit orders?


 

Do you have further info on this please ?

(besides whats on this link: [broken link removed] )





sign said:


> In my opinion anybody who is stuck with a tiny amount of these shares they are not selling should not be receiving sterling cheques for tiny amounts which they will be charged to cash in and also charged to convert into euro currency. They should be signed up to the DRIP dividend reinvestment plan. ....


 

True, 

Assuming the holding is large enough to buy you a number of shares each year, from the dividends - are there charges for this btw ?





MrKeane said:


> I tried to sell the shares this evening and it appears to have succeeded. .....


 

What were their costs pls, was it just €19 ?



> *Postal share dealing service
> *A low cost postal share dealing service is available for holders of 1000 shares or less through our Registrars, Computershare Investor Services PLC. Shareholders may use the service to either increase their holding or sell their entire holding. *The commission is £12.50 or €19.00. In addition stamp duty, currently at 0.5%, is payable on purchases.* Shareholders wishing to take advantage of this service should contact Computershare at the address given below to obtain the necessary documentation.
> 
> You can contact Computershare at the following address:
> Computershare Investor Services PLC
> P. O. Box 82
> The Pavilions
> Bridgwater Road
> Bristol
> BS99 7NH
> England
> Or by telephoning a representative on:
> +44 (0)870 702 0198
> (phone lines open between 09.00 and 17.00 GMT)
> *Telephone share dealing service
> *Computershare also provide a telephone share dealing service, through which you are able to:
> Buy or sell your shares quickly and simply
> Have the share price at which you deal confirmed whilst you are still on the telephone
> Call directly without needing to complete any forms in advance
> Receive sale proceeds in either Euros (EUR) or Sterling (GBP)
> Find out more by telephoning a representative on:
> +44 (0)870 703 0084
> (phone lines open between 08.00 and 16.30 GMT)


 


Thanks


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## z108

Garrettod said:


> True,
> 
> Assuming the holding is large enough to buy you a number of shares each year, from the dividends - are there charges for this btw ?



As far as I am aware the cost is about as good value as you can get and you're charged proportionally and not like with a stockbroker who would charge a flat fee in excess of the small purchase of shares . Even my mothers holding of 400 euro manages to add something like 2 shares a year. Its not much but further down the line the company could be bought out by private equity eliminating stock broker fees or else head towards a point where it is economic to deal with a stock broker.
So its a really good home for your dividend .. assuming the shares rise in value of course.


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## ClubMan

Garrettod said:


> Do you have further info on this please ?
> 
> (besides whats on this link: [broken link removed] )


What more information do you need? I'm not sure if they only allow for market orders rather than limit orders.


> Assuming the holding is large enough to buy you a number of shares each year, from the dividends - are there charges for this btw ?


 Yes - see [broken link removed]. The low cost share dealing charges apply as does _UK _stamp duty of 0.5% on purchases.


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## rebelred

I too am looking to sell Vodafone shares.

I have my original certificate which was 400 shares.  However, having checked online my actual holding is now 350 shares following the reorganisation that vodafone did in the shares.

Does anyone know if new share certificates were issued at the time of the reorganisation or is it my original certificate that is the still the one I need to send to the broker to sell them.


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## ClubMan

rebelred said:


> Does anyone know if new share certificates were issued at the time of the reorganisation or is it my original certificate that is the still the one I need to send to the broker to sell them.


Yes - new share certs were issued at the time. The old shares (certs) are worthless. They did not ask for them to be returned at the time just that you disposed of them securely. Are you sure that your shareholding is in certificate form and what you're looking it are actually share certs and not just nominee account statements or something? You should contact _ComputerShare UK _about _Vodafone _shareholding queries such as this.


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## Billo

Just sold some Vodafone shares using computershare with settlement date of 26/11/08.
Today I got letter from computershare to say that as I was still on the shareholder register as at 21/11/08 I will still receive a dividend payment with total value of only a few Euro. I was in the DRIP scheme, so I should get maybe 3 or4 shares .
They want me to write a cheque and send it off to them.
The problem is I do'nt want the extra shares.
How would I sell them ? It would cost me badly.

I wanted to put this whole nightmare behind me for once and for all, but it looks as though I may be haunted by it for a while yet.
Any ideas ?

Billo


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## extopia

Are you sure you read your letter properly? I got one today from computershare too, but the gist of it was that they wanted a cheque because they'd paid me the recent small dividend even though I was no longer a shareholder (the shares had been sold but not actually transferred). It's only a few euro, hardly worth sending a cheque, and hardly worth their while processing it. How enforceable is this - to be honest I couldn't be bothered sending them the sixteen euro or whatever it is...


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## Billo

Hi Extopia.
I am sure I read the letter properly
Here is an extract

"Following your recent sale of 348 shares, you are no longer entitled to receive dividend payments on this stock.
Unfortunately, as you were still on the Shareholders Register on November 21 2008, the date the Registrar uses to determine who to pay, you will still receive a dividend payment. This will be at a rate of 2,77 cents per share, giving a total value of €9.66 payable on February 6 2009.
However, as you sold your shares before the Ex-Dividend dateof November19,2008 which determines who is entitled to the dividend , we must recover this amount from you so that it maybe sent to the new shareholder.
We would be grateful if you could forward us a personal cheque made payable to TD Waterhouse" etc.

Thanks for the reply

Billo


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## Car Mad

sign said:


> In my opinion anybody who is stuck with a tiny amount of these shares they are not selling should not be receiving sterling cheques for tiny amounts which they will be charged to cash in and also charged to convert into euro currency.
> 
> .


 
My dad is also getting cheques for small amounts. Does he be charged a fee by Vodafone each time he cashes the cheque? If so any idea how much this would be. I am also going to look about cashing these in for him later


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## larry wisely

does anybody know the vodafone dividend for feb. i.e what was the dividend per share?


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## Billo

2.77 cent per share as in my post above.

Billo


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## extopia

Car Mad said:


> My dad is also getting cheques for small amounts. Does he be charged a fee by Vodafone each time he cashes the cheque?



No. And in fact he can arrange direct deposit to his bank account rather than have to lodge those tiny cheques.


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## Car Mad

I have sold some Vodafone shares through the on line process and I am posting my info here so others will undersand it and the cost process.

Your current holding (shares):177 *

 Closing price per share (last available price) 120.1000p
Please note the following calculation is based on the last available price quoted, as stated above. This price may change when the market opens. *The following details are displayed for information purposes only:* 

Estimated amount of money raised before charges:          £ 212.58 
Estimated dealing Charges:                                           £ 15.00 
Estimated total amount of money raised after charges:     £ 197.58


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## finty

I've vodafone shares since they bought out eircom and have signed up to the computershare website to manage them. 

Recently I was updating my details online when I clicked into the outstanding payments tab. It had a couple of small amounts from cheques I hadnt cashed so I got them reissued. 

However, it also said something about "there are other outstanding payments due that cannot be displayed here". 

So I emailed computershare about it and got this response:

"Dear Mr *******

Thank you for your enquiry.

Outstanding payment
We confirm that the outstanding payment is for the redemption of your B shares and is worth €38.46. To reissue this, please write to the address below.

Computershare Investor Services PLC
PO Box 82
The Pavilions
Bridgewater Road
Bristol
BS99 7NH
United Kingdom

This payment cannot be reinvested into dividends."

Certainly dont remember getting a cheque for this amount and not lodging it. And not sure what these B shares are seeing as I stopped reading correspondence from vodafone years ago........maybe thats why I still have them.

Might be worth checking out if you still own these shares!


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## nowlan

re clueless comment
i often wonder is there any place for the small invester


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