# Gas bill so high



## Toby (24 Jan 2007)

Is 430 an insane gas bill for a 4 bedroom house over 2 mths?? Its for heating and the hob - oven is electric. We've been meaning to get thermostatic valves on upstairs heaters to reduce wasted energy during the day - seems like a hell of a lot to me though


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## BillK (24 Jan 2007)

I currently pay £84 per month over here in England for a 3 bedroom house. We have recently completed the replacement of all our single glazed windows with double glazed and have thermostatic valves on all radiators.

I suggest you check out the state of insulation in your house as well as getting the valves fitted.

I have to say that even with freezing temperatures outside, our heating clicks on a 16 or 17 degrees in the morning. (We control the heating via the thermostat and turn it down to 10 degrees at night.)


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## Sn@kebite (24 Jan 2007)

Toby said:


> Is 430 an insane gas bill for a 4 bedroom house over 2 mths?? Its for heating and the hob - oven is electric. We've been meaning to get thermostatic valves on upstairs heaters to reduce wasted energy during the day - seems like a hell of a lot to me though



I heard on Sky-news Ireland that gas prices are to reduce by up to 13.5% in March or there abouts. If that settles your nerves a bit?
Wether you want to believe it or not is up to you...


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## mo3art (24 Jan 2007)

In short yes!!!  I'm really shocked at that.
On average our Gas bill costs €75 per month which includes the increases this year.  That's also for a 4 bed house, however it is mid-terrace.
HTH


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## Toby (24 Jan 2007)

Would you have the heating on during the day or just evenings? Theres someone here most of the day so its off and on all day - usually on for about 30 minutes, off for 1 hour. Maybe I need to turn down the thermostat - is it on the boiler itself yeah?


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## mo3art (24 Jan 2007)

We normally have it on a low setting on the thermostat (<20 degrees) & only increase the temp in the evenings (22 degrees).  Also only use radiators in rooms that are in regular use - e.g. bedrooms only get turned on at night.
Yes, the heat is on during the day as there are people here!


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## davidoco (24 Jan 2007)

Same here 4 bed semi di, no wall insulation, occupied all day, €400 for past two months.  We use a programmable stat which does not turn on the heating upstairs at all in the morning but brings it on in the evening.

Stat €60, zone valve €80 euro, fitting ??


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## ClubMan (24 Jan 2007)

mo3art said:


> We normally have it on a low setting on the thermostat (<20 degrees) & only increase the temp in the evenings (22 degrees).  Also only use radiators in rooms that are in regular use - e.g. bedrooms only get turned on at night.
> Yes, the heat is on during the day as there are people here!


Can't you read/monitor the gas meter to see how much you are using each day and then work out what the average daily cost is?

BTW - 20 and 22 degrees seem pretty high for background heating levels but I guess it's a personal thing.


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## c1aro (24 Jan 2007)

Find myself in the same situation - bill on 19.12.06 for the two months was €421.60 (bill for same period last year was €280 with only 700 less kws).  This is the highest bill I've ever had, but not the highest usage.  Price per kw was 3.939 in December 2005 (having gone up from 3.145) and is 5.271 in December 2006!  If pricing is to come down as one poster mentioned above it will be more than welcome.
I'm in the house all day and heating only clicks on when temp drops below 21 - but in the evening this sometimes goes up to 25 and upwards.  I leave all the rads  on - my house is relatively new (6 years), but still can feel cold on occasions.
I need to wear more layers!!!!!!!


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## Toby (24 Jan 2007)

Our heating is either on or off per the timer and does not seem to have the capability to switch on or off based on the temp of the house as mentioned above - its a brand new boiler since we renovated the house - should it have this capability or do you need something special?


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## c1aro (25 Jan 2007)

AFAIK the room temperature thermostat is not built in to the boiler (boiler unit could be anywhere in the house or even in an outdoor building so would not be useful).  There is a temperature control on most boilers (ie when the heating is switched to on it will heat up to a certain degree - my boiler has settings up to 10 and I leave it at approx 5).
The thermostat in my house is separate from the boiler and is located in the hall.  I leave the boiler switch on all the time and turn the thermostat in the hall to 21 degrees.  Even tho the boiler is switched to the on position it will only kick in when the temperature in the hall falls below 21 degrees (or whatever temperature I set it at).  My previous house did not have a thermostat and therefore I had to set the timer to come on and off at certain times (bit of a chore as it only had settings to come on and off twice a day so numerous trips to the garage to click it on and off).  Don't know how big a job it would be to get a thermostat installed to an existing system.


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## Barley (25 Jan 2007)

Our latest one was 220 for 2 months in a 3-bed semi. We use it for most things - heating, water, hob and gas fire. And we did not scrimp on it's usage. I'd have collapsed in a heap on the floor at a 400+ bill.


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## davidoco (25 Jan 2007)

c1aro said:


> I need to wear more layers!!!!!!!



Or invest a few quid in either TRV at most rads so that the heating delivered to that room can be regulated.  

If you see the heat going up to 25 on some thermostat that is not linked to the system you need to maybe think of getting at least one to stop the rad delivering heat when you got anywhere near that temperature.

Ideal house setup.

Gas boiler controlled by 3 channel time clock - €100.  One channel for downstairs controlled by TRVs in all rooms.  One channel for upstairs controlled by TRVs in all rooms.  One channel for hot water.  €500 spend now might give a payback over say 5 years but the comfort levels you get with the TRVs and time clock would far outway the return on investment.


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## GON10 (25 Jan 2007)

Need to get gas boiler serviced, I am in Lucan area anyone any contacts they can recommend and how much should I pay


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## pat127 (25 Jan 2007)

Toby said:


> Would you have the heating on during the day or just evenings? Theres someone here most of the day so its off and on all day - usually on for about 30 minutes, off for 1 hour. Maybe I need to turn down the thermostat - is it on the boiler itself yeah?


 
4-bed detached. Cavity block construction with insulation pumped in. Proper attic insulation, good windows etc. Gas for heating only. 2 people living in house normally. I expect to be paying 100/month this year as rates are at present. Haven't seen the most recent bill yet. I have only one control, on the boiler itself, which controls the heat of the water, with thermostatic valves on downstairs rads. I generally keep upstairs rads off except when we have visitors but bed/bath are put on for short periods mornings and late evenings.  A big rad in hall keeps reasonable temp upstairs otherwise. I can isolate all upstairs rads by control-valve which makes things easier but I adjust the boiler control as the weather changes. I have 3 programmed times on boiler but manually switch on/off as well when appropriate.

Some thoughts. Is your 30min on/1hr off routine better or worse than longer runs at a lower temp? Someone might have a comment. Do you lower the water temp during the day? Are you on the right tariff, it's worth running the numbers?


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## PGD1 (25 Jan 2007)

if your thermostat is in a hallway then it you need to heat both the hall and probably the upstairs, plus there is a higher risk of draughts from the front door.... plus drafts from any doors leading off the hallway.

You need to fit TRVs in eahc room and set them individually.

I turn off the TRVs in rooms I'm not using... turn it onto 3 in rooms light bathroom etc to keep the chill out.. and put it to 3-4 in rooms I am using.
I don't use any heat upstairs except on really cold nights where I put the landing to 3 and leave the doors open ... jus tto take the chill out.

2000sq and the biggest bill I ever had was €320, with somebody at home.


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## onekeano (25 Jan 2007)

Came in @ 420 myself this month - not happy!

However a buddy came in @ €800+ so .......

Must send that thank you card to the regulator for awarding them an increase even Bord Gais said they didn't need!!!!

Roy


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## annR (25 Jan 2007)

Can someone explain to me how the temperature controls work?

We've moved into a new house.


On the gas boiler itself there is the dial which looks as if it controls temp.
In the hallway there is another temp dial
People here have mentioned thermostatic valves on the radiators.  What are they?  Do you mean the basic knob by which you turn the rad on and off?
My question is how do they all work together, which of them actually does control the temperature?


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## Danmo (25 Jan 2007)

Our last bill was €250 which is astronomical for us.
- rooms not used not heated
- head only on for couple of hours in evening
- house insulated etc
- thermostat at 19 degrees

it's the price hike
see the CSO website
There was a recent article in Indo re: same

Also, I would say this bill reflects the Xmas period - home all day - heating on more etc


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## blueshoes (25 Jan 2007)

just got my gas bill 190euro.

Im at home all day with baby, have it on in the afternoon for a couple of hours.

Then the other half likes to have it on constanly in the evening.

Its set to 21 degrees. we  also have it timed to go of a couple of times during the night (because the baby gets cold otherwise)

I would defintely question a bill over 400 that sounds mad to me TBH.

Blue


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## New Girl (25 Jan 2007)

I don't know one person who didn't get a bit of shocker with their gas bill this month. we work FT so are only there in the evenings & at weekends. Thermostat is not above 20. Our bill prior to this was just over 100. This one was 220! i know there has been a cold snap but that's some jump. my folks & my sister both had bills over 400 so i count myself "lucky". Am eagerly awaiting the price drop for gas....


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## Toby (25 Jan 2007)

pat127 said:


> Some thoughts. Is your 30min on/1hr off routine better or worse than longer runs at a lower temp? Someone might have a comment. Do you lower the water temp during the day? Are you on the right tariff, it's worth running the numbers?


 

Interesting suggestion above re relative cost of leaving it on longer at low temp. Anyone know?

What do you mean by the tarriff - is it on the gas bill? Thanks.


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## davidoco (25 Jan 2007)

annR said:


> Can someone explain to me how the temperature controls work?
> 
> We've moved into a new house.
> 
> ...




If you look here [broken link removed] at the thermostatic valves often fitted in Ireland.

If you were going to the trouble of getting TRVs on some rads you would be just as well for the small added cost get them fitted on all rads with something called a bypass fitted then you can disconnect your stat in the hall.

The dial on the gas boiler sets how hot the boiler will heat the water and hotter water gives hotter rads therefore faster heat times in the rooms.


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## pat127 (25 Jan 2007)

Toby said:


> What do you mean by the tarriff - is it on the gas bill? Thanks.


 
Bord Gais has a range of tariffs aimed at different levels of usage. It’s not on the bill as far as I can see but you can work out what you are on from the rates used in calculating the charges. You are probably likely to be on either the Standard Rate (4.456c per kwh + a 2-monthly service charge of €57.14), or the High User Commitment Rate (5.982c per kwh, no service charge,  but you must pay for a minimum of 16,000 kwh).

According to my calculations (not totally guaranteed!) at 16,000 which is about what I use, Standard Rate will cost approx €113 more per annum than High User. I was automatically allocated the Standard when I signed on for gas 3 years ago and I called them a year later to change it to High User.


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## Toby (25 Jan 2007)

Thanks, I'll check it out


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## marvin (26 Jan 2007)

Our gas bill was also c. €400 for Nov-Dec. Now I am presuming that this is partly explained by the ungodly recent increase in prices and in part by the fact that our last couple of bills were estimated (obviously underestimated).

Now my problem with the latter point is that because of the underestimation, we have now been charged for gas we used at the new prices, even though the prices at the time of usage were c.38% less. In such a scenario it is wholly beneficial for Bord Gais to underestimate readings in the knowledge that an increase is on the way. 

Does anyone else have a problem with this and if so, is there anything that can be done?


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## pat127 (26 Jan 2007)

marvin said:


> Our gas bill was also c. €400 for Nov-Dec. Now I am presuming that this is partly explained by the ungodly recent increase in prices and in part by the fact that our last couple of bills were estimated (obviously underestimated).
> 
> Now my problem with the latter point is that because of the underestimation, we have now been charged for gas we used at the new prices, even though the prices at the time of usage were c.38% less. In such a scenario it is wholly beneficial for Bord Gais to underestimate readings in the knowledge that an increase is on the way.
> 
> Does anyone else have a problem with this and if so, is there anything that can be done?


 
The policy from Jan '04 is to take 3 readings a year and estimate in between so if there is a discrepancy it's confined to one bill. The only way to be sure of the accuracy of the split bill would be to take your own reading at date of price change and call it in.


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## Janeom (26 Jan 2007)

just a question about thermostatic valves on the radiators. We have one on a radiator in a newly coverted garage and even when we have it down at the lowest setting (the star below 1) the radiator is still roasting. Do you think the valve is n't working ?

We have no temperature control in the house....just can set the heat to come on/off three times a day. boiler is set at 75 C. The rest of the radiators are older and have no thermostatic valves but never get as hot as the new radiator.

just want to have some background heat in that room but will just have to turn it off totally I think.

Janeom


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## gipimann (26 Jan 2007)

Janeom,
Sounds like a stuck valve - I've had similar problems.  There's a small metal rod inside the valve which can get stuck either fully open or fully closed.  I was able to remove the control knob and ease the metal rod out using a pliers (I'd seen a plumber do it so knew it was ok!).   

A plumber suggested that when you have heating off in summer, you should open the thermostatic valves fully to prevent them sticking in the closed position.


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## 1carrot2 (5 Feb 2007)

I am signed up to the high user commitment.
I have the zoned heating i.e. upstairs only, downstairs only, water only.
We have had all our external walls insulated - and the attic.
Our entire heating system and all radiators are brand new....
...and we still got a bill for €470 this month!


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## pennypincher (5 Feb 2007)

Just got mine at 368 Euro for a 4 Bed Detached.Rang BordGais suggestion was to look at moving to a higher Kwh rate but I wouldn't have to pay standing charges.I would have to use 16000Kwhs per year as a minimum.They can tell you based on the KWH units you've used last what tarrif would be best for you.


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## fredg (5 Feb 2007)

agree with above,last gas bill E250,v annoyed,
but xmas has to be taken into acc i suppose.oil per year cost
my friend E400 last month?????
Fredg.


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## gipimann (6 Feb 2007)

Received mine yesterday, 320 euro (4 bed detached).  I use the heating as sparingly as possible (1hr morning, 1 hr teatime, 1-2.5 hrs at night depending on weather).   When I add in 2 cylinders of gas which I also used during the bill period (another 50 euro), it's a heck of a lot to keep the house from freezing (I wouldn't call it warm!).
Did you notice that the 2-month period was actually extended by a week?  The previous bill was the same, so that could be a factor in the higher than expected increases people are seeing.  I received one bill covering the period 1/9 - 15/11 and the next one covering 15/11 - 24/1.


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## Newbie! (14 Feb 2007)

Just to update this thread, we got our second bill yesterday in our house. Our first bill was €190 and the only thing we changed over the following 2month period was to turn the thermostat down from 20deg to 18deg. New bill came in at €140...thrilled but cant fathom it!!


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## davidoco (14 Feb 2007)

Newbie! said:


> Just to update this thread, we got our second bill yesterday in our house. Our first bill was €190 and the only thing we changed over the following 2month period was to turn the thermostat down from 20deg to 18deg. New bill came in at €140...thrilled but cant fathom it!!



You often read that turning down the stat by 1 degree will save you 10%.  You have shown that you save a little over 10% for each degree you turned it down.  You've probably reached the limit at 18 though.


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## MB05 (14 Feb 2007)

newbie, Bord Gais reduced their charges from the 1st of Feb by 10% so that might account for some of the savings.


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## pnh (28 Jun 2007)

Maybe some better news for us gas consumers http://www.rte.ie/business/2007/0628/bordgais.html?rss
"new tariff structure more user frinedly"
" prices next year lower then current year"
All will be revealed soon no doudt


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## Toby (22 Jan 2008)

Just had to say that after a gas bill of €430 for nov-dec last year I just got our bill for the same period this year and its only €150!! So pleased. Maybe its been a lot warmer but we've been fine with having heating on less and also got thermo valves installed so less waste on heaters upstairs being on all day.


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## coola (22 Jan 2008)

turn off the heating. its not iceland ye are in (exceptions for baby of course) . but having it on constantly all over the house in the evening is a bit mad. zone it and turn off the rads where no one is. simple

to cut electricity bill turn off the lights. people just dont seem to understand that leaving lights on uses electricity and they wont use energy efficent ones


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## gary71 (23 Jan 2008)

I would suggest that if you find you are having high bills then check what kind of system controls you have and make sure they are set to give you best  economy at a temperature that suits you, i would turn down the room stat to maybe 19 and than over time slowly turn it up until the property is at a temperature that you are happy with, i would also turn down any rads in an area that needs less heat than the rooms you would spend more time in,i would turn down my cylinder stat to 55-60 C and time the hot water, don't worry to much about the position of the boiler stat as this will have no real impact on the gas bill if you have a room stats fitted, it works more like a throttle, controlling the time it takes to get the house to the temperature you have set it to. Having no or little control on any heating system will cost a fortune in heating cost so the minimum i would want is programmer, cylinder stat, and room stat, trvs are great but don't fit them in the same area as a room stat as they will fight against each other, i will shut up now, hope this helps, Gary


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