# False P45 issued for 2009



## denmcn (4 Feb 2010)

The company I used to work for never re opened in Jan 2009 after Christmas holidays.The boss was trying to raise funds to keep it going but was unable to do so.Promised that he would pay us when he got sorted but never did .I never signed onfor social welfare until Aug 4 2009.When I rang his accountants they have issued me with a P45 showing as if I got paid right up until the end of July 2009 even though we never got a penny of it.How can this be legal.[/quote]


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## DB74 (4 Feb 2010)

*Re: False P45 isuued for 2009*

It's not legal.


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## DB74 (4 Feb 2010)

*Re: False P45 isuued for 2009*

If you cannot get it sorted by your employer then I would contact NERA as soon as possible.

[broken link removed]


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## Graham_07 (4 Feb 2010)

*Re: False P45 isuued for 2009*

It's interesting and somewhat coincidental that they issued a P45 dated up to the very week before you signed on. Did someone tell them when you signed on from? Did you work at all for them from Jan-July 09? Would you have had any redundancy entitlements ( working there for > 2 years) , if so then again I'd contact NERA / DETE .


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## denmcn (4 Feb 2010)

*Re: False P45 isuued for 2009*

Graham 07 .The accountants that they used will not talk to me and have only said that this was the details given to them by my former employer, even though would know that is in correct .Plus what is the effects on me of have no prsi paid for 7 months .I have worked for the last 20 years continually.


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## denmcn (4 Feb 2010)

*Re: False P45 isuued for 2009*

Graham 07.No I rang my old boss and said I need my P45 as I need it to sign on and I did not work for them at all during this time.


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## Graham_07 (4 Feb 2010)

*Re: False P45 isuued for 2009*

Sounds awfully like once you said you were going to sign on they did p45 up to then. The employer may have given them details and the accountants made it up from what was given to them (in good faith). However whatever the situation is is definitely suspect, especially since the employer should end up paying PRSI on that pay on the P45. 

Not having the necessary 39 weeks in a governing PRSI year may affect your entitlements, especially when you have no credited ( from signing on ) contributions either. You definitely need to speak with someone in NERA / DETE about what to do.


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## denmcn (4 Feb 2010)

*Re: False P45 isuued for 2009*

Thanks for that Graham 07.Because of this P45 it is impossible to do tax returns for 2009.Also have a daughter due in college and this makes it diffcult to try and get a grant based upon this false figure in the P45.Why would they issue this way when I think others got P45s with zero pay


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## papervalue (4 Feb 2010)

*Re: False P45 isuued for 2009*



denmcn said:


> The company I used to work for never re opened in Jan 2009 after Christmas holidays.The boss was trying to raise funds to keep it going but was unable to do so.Promised that he would pay us when he got sorted but never did .I never signed onfor social welfare until Aug 4 2009.When I rang his accountants they have issued me with a P45 showing as if I got paid right up until the end of July 2009 even though we never got a penny of it.How can this be legal.


[/quote]

around what date did you commence employment with him

did you get a P60 for 2008 
how much are you owed at 31/12/08?

did you do any work at all for him in 2009
are you owed any money for 2009
what was put on p45 for 2009
cessation date
gross
tax 
employee prsi
total prsi
number of weeks

did you give the p45 to social welfare.
why do a tax return based on incorrect p45

i wonder did the revenue get a copy of p45 (ring to find out what figures they have)


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## denmcn (4 Feb 2010)

*Re: False P45 isuued for 2009*

Got P 60 for 2008 , was done up to look right but was left short by a few grand in wages, and told it would be sorted out in new year.Did not work 4 him with the exception of a few hours one or two days in 2009.He agreed to pay us when he got funding.I decided at the end of July as we had run out of savings and my husbands work was put on a four day week at the time.The cessiation date and all the other details on the p45 are coorec t as if i got paid normall and all add up.Did not have it for social welfare at the time .Would it be possible to correct one issued reflecting correct figues of zero


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## papervalue (4 Feb 2010)

*Re: False P45 isuued for 2009*



denmcn said:


> Got P 60 for 2008 , was done up to look right but was left short by a few grand in wages, and told it would be sorted out in new year.Did not work 4 him with the exception of a few hours one or two days in 2009.He agreed to pay us when he got funding.I decided at the end of July as we had run out of savings and my husbands work was put on a four day week at the time.The cessiation date and all the other details on the p45 are coorec t as if i got paid normall and all add up.Did not have it for social welfare at the time .Would it be possible to correct one issued reflecting correct figues of zero


 
as you dont tell how long you were employed their- is it a redundancy situation and claim for unpaid wages at 31/12/08 as your employer is insolvent maybe

if you got no pay in 09- can get him to amend p45 to zero 

i would check tax office tomorrow whether they received the p45 and what figures were on it or call in to tax office and explain situation


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## denmcn (4 Feb 2010)

*Re: False P45 isuued for 2009*

Sorry papervalue, I worked for them since  March 07 .They owe a lot of money through their business dealings.At this stage it has got so messy, as the true figures for our income for 2009 would leave us eligible to apply for a grant for college for our daughter.Would it be possible for accountants to issue correct P45.By having false details on the P45 for 2009 , does that mean I am covered for stamps ?


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## papervalue (4 Feb 2010)

*Re: False P45 isuued for 2009*



denmcn said:


> Sorry papervalue, I worked for them since March 07 .They owe a lot of money through their business dealings.At this stage it has got so messy, as the true figures for our income for 2009 would leave us eligible to apply for a grant for college for our daughter.Would it be possible for accountants to issue correct P45.By having false details on the P45 for 2009 , does that mean I am covered for stamps ?


 

it is an odd position, you want to get a lot more advice on it and what would the ideal position be for you,

you should ring nera for advice, maybe they could be redundancy claim plus claim for unpaid wages as on p45 now you are over 2 years

it is possible for accountant to issue amended p45 but he would have to get permission from the employer.

not certain on stamp situation but the main thing now is to get college grant for son/daughter.

maybe contact employer and accountant to solve


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## denmcn (4 Feb 2010)

*Re: False P45 isuued for 2009*

Thanks for your help and advice papervalue.Very hard to get this sorted out.Probaly comes down to having no prsi payments for seven months, trying to get a correct P45 and getting the grant based upon our correct income.


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## denmcn (5 Feb 2010)

*Re: False P45 isuued for 2009*

I was mulling over some of the answers received.Presuming i get the P45 sorted out as been zero for my wages for 2009.I received 4256.30 euro from social welfare and my husband earned 36404 euro.

1.Is JB taxable 
2.Do I get a tax credits / allowances for that year.
3.What would our tax bill be for the year based upon normall allowances for married couple.


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## papervalue (5 Feb 2010)

*Re: False P45 isuued for 2009*



denmcn said:


> I was mulling over some of the answers received.Presuming i get the P45 sorted out as been zero for my wages for 2009.I received 4256.30 euro from social welfare and my husband earned 36404 euro.
> 
> 1.Is JB taxable
> 2.Do I get a tax credits / allowances for that year.
> 3.What would our tax bill be for the year based upon normall allowances for married couple.


 
http://www.revenue.ie/en/tax/it/leaflets/it24.html

Above is taxation of job benefit(taxable) first €13exempt 

you might want to add is your husband under paye system them

1. married credit
2. paye credit husband
3. paye credit spouse( get your income at 20%)
4. take off tax per p60 paid by husband
5. any other deductions for medical receipts/bins.uninion subs etc
5. get tax bill or refund


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## denmcn (5 Feb 2010)

*Re: False P45 isuued for 2009*

Thanks papervalue,
the following are our figures.Baseduon them waht would the situation be as I am unfamilar with how the system operates.

1. married credit - 3660
2. paye credit husband-1830
3. paye credit spouse( get your income at 20%)-1830
4. take off tax per p60 paid by husband-5103
5. any other deductions for medical receipts/bins.uninion subs etc-89
5. get tax bill or refund


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## papervalue (5 Feb 2010)

Some one on board may be able to do proper comp for you. Ignoring income levy i say refund their in region of €3k plus?

Maybe some one can confirm?


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## simplyjoe (9 Feb 2010)

*Re: False P45 isuued for 2009*



denmcn said:


> Sorry papervalue, I worked for them since March 07 .They owe a lot of money through their business dealings.At this stage it has got so messy, as the true figures for our income for 2009 would leave us eligible to apply for a grant for college for our daughter.Would it be possible for accountants to issue correct P45.By having false details on the P45 for 2009 , does that mean I am covered for stamps ?


 
Technically yes but legally no. Claiming on this basis would be wrong and dangerous. What of u claim and the DSW subsequently find out that no stamps were put up. You would have to repay the overclaimed amounts. The only solution is to get the corrected P45. If the NERA or DETE dont help you,and I find them useless, you may need to get a solicitor to obtain the corrected P45. If you dont qualify for JB then you dont qualify. 
As an aside why did you wait so long to claim benefit? I find this a lot with people being denied their entitlement. Lads you paid the stamps you deserve the benefit.


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## denmcn (9 Feb 2010)

We were promised that he would pay us our wages, but never did.Left us high and dry and then gives us a crap P45 with false details on it.


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## csirl (15 Feb 2010)

Ring up the employer. Tell him that if you dont get 2008 P60 and 2009 P45 with correct figures i.e. the actual amounts you were paid, within 7 days, you will be reporting the matter to the Revenue Commissioners. If you dont get the correct documentation, call into your local tax office and inform them. They should be able to force the correct paperwork to be issued and may take action against your former employer.


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## simplyjoe (19 Feb 2010)

Take it from me the Revenue will do diddly squat and anything they do do will take ages. Threaten court - in Mayo you would not want to come up in front of Judge Mary Devins!!! I assume other districts are similar.


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## Caveat (19 Feb 2010)

I have plenty of issues with the customer service of govt depts and local authorities generally but have always thought that revenue were generally professional and obliging? Admittedly, have never been on to them about anything too complex though.


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