# slip and fall



## sullyck (22 Jan 2009)

was collecting materials at a local building provider yard was walking across the yard and i slipped on some ice and hurt my sholder. One of the guys that works in the yard came over and asked if i was ok and told me that he had fallen the day before because of the ice,funny thing is that they sell the salt to grit foothpaths and roads in the store.

rang the store later as i had to leave work early could not stand the pain felt i was not being unreasonable asking for the cost of the doctor. Never rang me back so rang again and the manager was so rude telling me that even though i was on their property because it was ice they had no liability never even gave me a chance to say i only wanted the doctor s fee. Even an apology would have being nice but all i got was the feeling the i was trying to get compensation. 

E-mailed someone at 9am this morning from the company and still have not recieved a reply.Again not looking for compensation but i think the price of the doctor is a small price to pay


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## tech3 (22 Jan 2009)

This also happened to someone I worked with and she claimed  for a hurt finger and wrist and was awarded €2500.
well, if there is total disregard for peoples safety then I think she was quite right to claim.
Dont let them off without raising a stink.


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## Smashbox (22 Jan 2009)

Sully, whats the question? I don't see one in your post.


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## sam h (22 Jan 2009)

I'd reckon they are thinking that if they give you the doctors fee, they will leave themselve wide open if there are further complications.  

Peronally, I think you don't have a leg to stand on.....what if the postman slipped on your driveway on an icy morning & claims you have salt in your kitchen, you should have used that to clear the ice?  Or if your car had skidded in the car park & hit another car?  Ice is beyond their control, I can't see how they could be held negligent.

Sometimes things happen....sometimes it's nobodies fault, thats life.


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## iggy (22 Jan 2009)

How old are you Sullyck?
Did your mammy never tell you that if you decide to walk on ice you may slip and fall?
Ice forming is an act of nature.
It`s always someone else`s fault isn`t it.


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## McCrack (23 Jan 2009)

iggy your patronising post is not the point. Business owners have a duty of care in tort to any persons on their premises and a statutory obligation under the Occupiers Liability Act and Health and Safety Legislation.

To sullyck I would say after you have gotten medical treatment contact a solicitor who practices in litigation. You clearly will not get any compensation directly from the company yourself.


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## MaryBe (23 Jan 2009)

McCrack said:


> iggy your patronising post is not the point. Business owners have a duty of care in tort to any persons on their premises and a statutory obligation under the Occupiers Liability Act and Health and Safety Legislation.
> 
> To sullyck I would say after you have gotten medical treatment contact a solicitor who practices in litigation. You clearly will not get any compensation directly from the company yourself.


 

Perhaps we should all take a step back and look at this in a mature manner. If there are icy patches around a private/public premises, it is up to the user to take due care. The private and public sector cannot be held responsible for every incident in or around their premises. There were many parts of the country not salted over the icy period - does that mean the Councils are responsible for accidents. We as people need to take responsibility for our actions - be it walking or driving. Under tort, I believe that sullyck was 'aware of possible consequences' in taking the action to walk on the ice and therefore has no case.


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## MrMan (23 Jan 2009)

At least morally you should accept that it was an accident and that you will have to pay for it because you and nature were the only two involved. If you go the legal route you may win some compo but that is not a fair or mature approach, it is simply profiteering.


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## iggy (23 Jan 2009)

Similar situation.....http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055467593


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## sparkeee (23 Jan 2009)

just be thankful there are no broken bones or serious damage,these things happen in life we cant always be compensated for everything.


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## rob30 (23 Jan 2009)

It is a recession, less conveyancing, poor solicitors have to make it pay somehow!


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## sullyck (23 Jan 2009)

As i said i am not looking for compensation maybe the doctor fees and an apology. I am self employed and if i dont work i dont get paid. I tried going to work after the accident but was in alot of pain so went to the doctor. I to hear about al thes people making false claims and we the tax payers are the ones who have to bear the burden and of course this is wrong. I work with my hands so now i am out of work for around a week. I walked through the yard and didnt feel it was very icy and as for the place i slipped it was icy and i did not see it. The thing is a guy had fallen the day before so they knew that it was a danger and did nothing about it. 

I repeat i am not looking for compo but at this stage an apology would do.
I think i would have a good case but do not wish to go down that road hate giving solicitors money when it could have being sorted out with a phone call


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## Padraigb (23 Jan 2009)

One possibility is that the builders' providers are keeping their heads below the parapet because of a fear of expensive litigation -- but I don't think that is a wise strategy. On the facts outlined by sullyck, I would think that they have a liability.

Like sullyck, I am not enthusiastic about grabbing large handfuls of compensation. But  think small handfuls are often justified. I would ask for the cost of the doctor's visit and a the amount of earnings lost.


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## theengineer (25 Jan 2009)

Were you collecting the materials for yourself or for someone else eg your employer?


This firm owed you a duty of care which they breached. ,The place was opened to members of the public and should be safe,


They must report this accident to the H.S.A. as a member of the public had to receive medical attention as a result of their business activities. There is nothing stopping you reporting this to the HSA

You will not get the doctors fees from them !!!
Unless you chase them through the courts. 
The statute of limitation in this state is now 2 years from the date of the incident. 
Write out notes straight away of your rec ollection of the event, description of the employee who fell the previous day etc.
Try to get this employees name if possible without making it obvious.

Be aware this firm could close down shortly due to the lack of construction work beng carried out.

This slip could have been avoided and they were under a legal obligation to do all that was reasonably practical to make the place safe.


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## Vanilla (25 Jan 2009)

A good litigation solicitor would get you what you are looking for plus their own fees in one phone call. But I see you don't want to give a solicitor loads of money?


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## theengineer (25 Jan 2009)

you are not entitled to loads of money, but you are entitled to not be at a loss.

Was first aid given to you at this premises?


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## theengineer (25 Jan 2009)

If it was me I would go to a solictor


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## Latrade (26 Jan 2009)

theengineer said:


> This firm owed you a duty of care which they breached.


 
Sorry, but no one is in any position to make this statement that a breach has occurred on the basis of the information supplied to date in the OP. 

Under the general criteria of negligence, it would have to be demonstrated that the premises didn't take reasonable care and that cannot be established based upon the small bit of information provided. Even if a breach of statutory duty was applied, the standard for slips and trips changed in 2007 to include "reasonably practicable", again nobody is in any position to say whether that is the case based upon the current information. Besides which, it's for the judge to decide on liability, not forum posters thankfully.

Sometimes unfortunate things happen and no one is to blame, just one of those things. 

If you do feel suitably aggrived by the response of the company to this, then of course it is your right to pursue it any way you wish, but do not feel that you have a "cast iron" case.


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## theengineer (26 Jan 2009)

Did some slip in their yard? yes
did this someone get injured? yes
did managment have prior notice of this yard being slipeary? yes
could this have been avoided ? yes
did they do all that was reasonably practical to avoid this? no 
was there negligence? yes


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## Smashbox (26 Jan 2009)

theengineer said:


> did managment have prior notice of this yard being slipeary? yes


 
Where did the OP state this, I can't find it? Just because a man who works there fell the day before, doesn't mean he notified ANYONE.

Perhaps this accident was down to the fact that THIS guy didn't do anything about it.


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## JoeB (26 Jan 2009)

theengineer said:


> did managment have prior notice of this yard being slipeary? yes
> could this have been avoided ? yes
> did they do all that was reasonably practical to avoid this? no
> was there negligence? yes



Did managment have prior notice of this yard being slippery?

Who knows.. did the employee report it? Was an investigation scheduled? Was a committee deciding on a course of action? Maybe it was icy due to a spill earlier.. an unreported spill.

Imcompetence isn't negligence...

It would be nice if the company offered some money towards the bills... don't think they will however.

I'd say the OP would win in the courts but I'm not sure... could be construed either way.. and it will defo cost a lot. OP, you'd really need photos if possible.


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## sparkeee (26 Jan 2009)

Imagine a fellow jumps over your garden wall to get his ball,he breaks his ankle on landing on a dog turd that you hadn't cleaned up,you don't have a dog,how much would you contribute towards his hospital care and rehabilitation,please answer this question,i am dying to know.


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## Latrade (27 Jan 2009)

sparkeee said:


> Imagine a fellow jumps over your garden wall to get his ball,he breaks his ankle on landing on a dog turd that you hadn't cleaned up,you don't have a dog,how much would you contribute towards his hospital care and rehabilitation,please answer this question,i am dying to know.


 
In fairness to the engineer, this isn't the same. Someone entering your property for commercial purposes is completely different.

However, as others have pointed out since your reply engineer, there is absolutely no way you can make those claims based on the information supplied. Just because there was a slip it doesn't automatically mean there was negligence.


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## sparkeee (27 Jan 2009)

the onus is still the same.


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## iggy (27 Jan 2009)

Think on this....




 
*An Obituary printed in the ** London Times........ Interesting and sadly rather true. H.*

Today we mourn the passing of a beloved old friend, Common Sense, who has been with us for many years. 
No one knows for sure how old he was, since his birth records were long ago lost in bureaucratic red tape.  
He will be remembered as having cultivated such valuable lessons as:     
Knowing when to come in out of the rain; why the early bird gets the worm; 
 Life isn't always fair; and maybe it was my fault.  


Common Sense lived by simple, sound financial policies (don't spend more than you can earn) and reliable strategies (adults, not children, are in charge).

His health began to deteriorate rapidly when well-intentioned but overbearing regulations were set in place. Reports of a 6-year-old boy charged with sexual harassment for kissing a classmate; teens suspended from school for using mouthwash after lunch; and a teacher fired for reprimanding an unruly student, only worsened his condition.

Common Sense lost ground when parents attacked teachers for doing the job that they themselves had failed to do in disciplining their unruly children.

It declined even further when schools were required to get parental consent to administer sun lotion or an aspirin to a student; but could not inform parents when a student became pregnant and wanted to have an abortion.

Common Sense lost the will to live as the churches became businesses; and criminals received better treatment than their victims.


Common Sense took a beating when you couldn't defend yourself from a burglar in your own home and the burglar could sue you for assault.

Common Sense finally gave up the will to live, after a woman failed to realize that a steaming cup of coffee was hot. 
She spilled a little in her lap, and was promptly awarded a huge settlement.

Common Sense was preceded in death by his parents Truth and Trust, 
by his wife Discretion his daughter, Responsibility, and his son Reason.

He is survived by his 4 stepbrothers;

I Know My Rights.
I Want It Now.
Someone Else Is To Blame.
I'm A Victim.

Not many attended his funeral because so few realized he was gone. 
If you still remember him, pass this on.   
If not, join the majority and do nothing.





​​
                    Iggy.......


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## sparkeee (27 Jan 2009)

so true.


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## McCrack (28 Jan 2009)

sparkeee said:


> the onus is still the same.


 
The onus is not the same. The duty of care owed to both entrants is different. The duty of care owed to a trespasser (person jumping over your garden wall) is lower than that owed to a visitor (e.g a customer on a builders yard premises)

See the Occupiers Liability Act 1995 for further.

O and Iggy that piece of whatever is the biggest load of sentimental nonsense I've read in a while and doesnt assist the OP who has suffered an injury possibly caused by another's negligence.


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## theengineer (29 Jan 2009)

sullyck said:


> was collecting materials at a local building provider yard was walking across the yard and i slipped on some ice and hurt my sholder. One of the guys that works in the yard came over and asked if i was ok and told me that he had fallen the day before because of the ice,funny thing is that they sell the salt to grit foothpaths and roads in the store.
> 
> rang the store later as i had to leave work early could not stand the pain felt i was not being unreasonable asking for the cost of the doctor. Never rang me back so rang again and the manager was so rude telling me that even though i was on their property because it was ice they had no liability never even gave me a chance to say i only wanted the doctor s fee. Even an apology would have being nice but all i got was the feeling the i was trying to get compensation.


 
Were you collecting the materials for yourself or for someone else?
Seems like a solictor should be instructed in this case. My advice call to a solictor today!!!


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## JoeB (29 Jan 2009)

I wonder would people be so quick to advise going to a solicitor if it happened somewhere else..

The problem was ice on the ground during a freezing period...

If it happened in a supermarket carpark...?
If it happened on the street...?
If it happened in a friends house...? 

I think that simply because someone has an accident doesn't automatically mean that someone else is responsible... the judge would likely want to see demonstrated that the injured party took precautions.. (obviously the business should also have done some things but as I say, the management may not have known)... but it may have been reasonable for the injured party to take more care, to examine the area for hazards etc etc.

I do feel for the OP, I am self-employed too and an injury would have major effects on me and my earnings. I think a claim may be successful... but I also think that many people could probably claim for many things.. the real winners are the solicitors on both sides...

Incidentally I have been injured due to probable negligence.. I crashed a motorbike after driving over frozen ice (years ago).. there was a burst pipe and thick ice 'downstream' from it.. thick ice... half an inch thick, covering half the road, on a slope, also on a corner and definitely coming from a burst pipe... I didn't bother claiming for that... (no serious injury but damaged bike, hurt body etc)

But the OP has to make his own decision.


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## TwoWheels (29 Jan 2009)

The OP went out of his house in freezing conditions, What precautions did HE take ?

Appropriate footwear?
Padded clothing in case of a fall?
Extra vigilant when walking?
Called clients to try to postpone work until better weather?
extra checks of his van/car ?

Did he salt/grit the driveway of his own home?

Would he feel it was his responsability if the postman slipped in his driveway that morning?

Grow up please, You slipped, You hurt yourself, Get over it, It's not always someone elses fault. Nobody owes you money because you were not careful enough.


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## MaryBe (29 Jan 2009)

Can we please end this thread!!!! we seem to be going round in circles.  Leave the post by TwoWheels as the final word.


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## theengineer (29 Jan 2009)

TwoWheels said:


> Would he feel it was his responsability if the postman slipped in his driveway that morning?
> .


 
He may not feel responsible but He would be responsible if the postman slipped on his drive way. he would need to show he did everything that was reasonably practical. 
A tesco deliver driver slipped in a drive way and is sueing both his employer and house holder. FACT !!


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## theengineer (29 Jan 2009)

I agree with maryB, lets end this post.


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## sullyck (29 Jan 2009)

I would like to thank everyone for their thoughts on this matter, both positive and negative points of veiw have merit and still dont know what to do. Shoulder is still painful and have missed a full weeks work. On the other hand no one died so i might just let it go. Still think its extremely bab the way i was treated after but guess thats how company s are these days. thanks again for all replies


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## Yeager (29 Jan 2009)

Sullyck - sorry to hear about your unfortunate incident but i think you have a valid case on your hands

Under the Safety Health and Welfare at Work Act 2005 there is an onus on employers to protect non employee on their property.

Chapter 1 Part 12 states the following

Every employer shall manage and conduct his or her undertaking
in such a way as to ensure, so far as is reasonably practicable,
that in the course of the work being carried on, *individuals at the*
*place of work (not being his or her employees) are not exposed to*​*risks to their safety, health or welfare.*


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## sparkeee (29 Jan 2009)

I think these sort of claims are the problem nowadays with schools not playing contact sports and play areas shutting down.Sometimes it can be just your fault.


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