# Joint Home and mortgage: €200k; investment property in sole name €100k NE



## Boomer (8 Aug 2013)

Hello all,  i was told by  bank that the mortgage on an apartment that i have is unsustainable( in my own name only not in joint names like my home house) theres 5000 in arrears on it,
 have been paying 500 amonth this last few years (shortfall of 270 a month) but the tentant moved out in may so nothing has been payed since then,
 i have a new tentant now an i offered to pay 500 amonth to bank they said no,

 i must sell the property my questions is 

(1) if i sell it and theres a shortfall of lets say 100,000 can this be added to my home mortage.
(2) if so can i put my home in my wifes name to stopp this debt been added on?
(3)What if i leave ireland and still owe the 100,000 can they come look for it say in the UK.
Please Help dont know what to do ..


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## Brendan Burgess (8 Aug 2013)

(1) if i sell it and theres a shortfall of lets say 100,000 can this be added to my home mortage.

They can get a judgement against you and register it against your home.  It's not added to your joint mortgage with your wife as such.

(2) if so can i put my home in my wifes name to stopp this debt been added on?

The home loan mortgage company could allow your wife to take over the mortgage in full. But this is unlikely and it's best not to engage in such evasion. 

(3)What if i leave ireland and still owe the 100,000 can they come look for it say in the UK.
Yes. But you could go bankrupt in the UK. 





For a proper answer, please provide all the information. 

Standard Format for unsustainable mortgage Case Studies


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## Boomer (8 Aug 2013)

Personal and income details
Not working on SW
Income history: Been out of work since june 09
Net income partner/spouse: 400 per week SW
Income history:  as above
number of children 3
Amount of child benefit received  600 per month i think
Amount of Mortgage Interest Supplement received= none wont give me it
Lender:  PTSB
Amount outstanding:  210,000
Value of home:  ?/ not sure 200,000 was 700,000 in boom time
Interest rate: specify whether tracker or SVR  both
Monthly repayment  900= at presant 400 ( been offered a split mortgage  still thinking of weather to take it or not any thoughts welcomed)
Amount in arrears  20,000



Investment property - Yes
Lender: KBC
Amount outstanding:  170,000
Value of home:  70,000
Interest rate:   not sure normal rate
Monthly repayment  770
Amount in arrears 5,000
Monthly rent received 500

Other loans and creditors - 
Overdraft 1000
Credit Card 5000
Credit Union  20,000  shares 7000
Car loan e.g. payed 



How important is retaining the family home to you? 
Which of the following best describes your situatio
I really want to keep the family home even if it means having a large mortgage and negative equity for years to come.


Any other relevant information

What is your preferred realistic outcome? 
  to get rid of the apartment the (investment property) and have some sort of normal life


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## Brendan Burgess (8 Aug 2013)

Hi Boomer

You should agree immediately to sell the apartment. You will be left with a shortfall in your name of €100,000. 

You can then apply for a Personal Insolvency Arrangment - in fact, you can apply for it now. 

As you have no income, there is no point in having a 6 year PIA.  

The PIA would be something like this. 

1) Sell the investment property and write off the shortfall
2) Transfer the home and home mortgage into your wife's name 
3) Write off all your debts in 6 months. 

It's unlikely that ptsb or KBC would veto the deal. The others are too small to veto it. 

Brendan


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## Boomer (8 Aug 2013)

Should i sell it myslef or just hand the keys back to KBC.
 Theres a tenant just moved in  , should i keep the rent to help towards paying for the tranfering of home to wifes name dont have any other meens of paying for it


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## Brendan Burgess (8 Aug 2013)

You should sell it yourself. It will be quicker and you will convert your secured debt into an unsecured debt. After that, it's likely that KBC will be less interested in it.

You should pay the rent on the property to the lender on the property, KBC. otherwise it's strategic default. 

Brendan


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## primrose (8 Aug 2013)

Hi Brendan 
In this scenario if Boomer is able to have the mortgage transferred into his wife's sole name (why would they as she has no other income than SW i.e. surely it is better for the bank to have 2 on the mortgage in case one defaults) would this not be seen as evasion of having to pay one's debt i.e. judgement cant be made against the property.

 Is this scenario transferring of assets commonplace? His home appears not to be in negative equity. Lets assume home prices slightly rise and Boomer gains employment should this 100K simply be written off?  He would come out of this an awful lot better than most.


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## Boomer (8 Aug 2013)

primrose said:


> Hi Brendan
> In this scenario if Boomer is able to have the mortgage transferred into his wife's sole name (why would they as she has no other income than SW i.e. surely it is better for the bank to have 2 on the mortgage in case one defaults) would this not be seen as evasion of having to pay one's debt i.e. judgement cant be made against the property.
> 
> Is this scenario transferring of assets commonplace? His home appears not to be in negative equity. Lets assume home prices slightly rise and Boomer gains employment should this 100K simply be written off?  He would come out of this an awful lot better than most.



 Yes my home isnt in negative equity thank god, ptsb want me to take a split mortgage after 6 months have passed, i have 30 days or less to decide on this. have to see my accountant on this you guys any thoughts on this aor should i start a new tread?


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## Boomer (8 Aug 2013)

Brendan Burgess said:


> You should sell it yourself. It will be quicker and you will convert your secured debt into an unsecured debt. After that, it's likely that KBC will be less interested in it.
> 
> You should pay the rent on the property to the lender on the property, KBC. otherwise it's strategic default.
> 
> Brendan



 even tho the rent is much lower than the repayments kbc want? , they told me to sell it or give it up as they wont except 500 amonth for it??


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## Brendan Burgess (9 Aug 2013)

primrose said:


> Hi Brendan
> In this scenario if Boomer is able to have the mortgage transferred into his wife's sole name (why would they as she has no other income than SW i.e. .



Hi Primrose

He is insolvent. His wife is not. 

So if he applies for Personal Insolvency, rather than write down some of the home mortgage, they would be better off transferring the home into her name only. 

It's not like an ordinary case of solvent people where the bank would not allow such a transfer.


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## Brendan Burgess (9 Aug 2013)

Boomer said:


> Yes my home isnt in negative equity thank god, ptsb want me to take a split mortgage after 6 months have passed, i have 30 days or less to decide on this. have to see my accountant on this you guys any thoughts on this aor should i start a new tread?



You don't need to start a new thread.  Post the details of the offer in this thread.  But check the Key Post first

How to analyse an offer of a split mortgage


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## Boomer (16 Aug 2013)

i think they want me  to give up my tracker on the larger amount as theres no mention of me keeping it on the split mortgage offer wonder if they are trying to pull a fast one?


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## Boomer (7 Sep 2013)

Boomer said:


> i think they want me  to give up my tracker on the larger amount as theres no mention of me keeping it on the split mortgage offer wonder if they are trying to pull a fast one?



 Hi all got that wrong my tracker cant be touched its going to be warehoused so they the bank told me. no what would happen if i try to sell the rental property and get say 80k for it , would the 100k be put on to my home loan? or what happens to it, iam thinking if i go to the uk an go bankrupt leaving the wife and kids in my home in ireland??( so many questions its dam head recking).


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## Boomer (10 Sep 2013)

if my home mortgage goes into a split mortgage an my apartment mortgage becomes aunsecured loan can i go tot he uk and become bankrupt and keep my family home??


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## Boomer (12 Sep 2013)

if i get a court judgement  on my home how long does this last? and what happens if i sell my home after the judgement is up? or i become employed again?


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## Boomer (13 Sep 2013)

Could someone please answer my questions as i feel iam talking to myslef thankyou.


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## Luternau (14 Sep 2013)

Boomer said:


> Could someone please answer my questions as i feel iam talking to myslef thankyou.



Your posts are really hard to read-bad punctuation and spelling etc. That may be a contributing factor. 

People won't reply if they feel they have no advice to give. All the info on judgements, bankruptcy etc is already here or elsewhere. Why not make some searches for the information-it will help you get some idea of the issues/scenarios etc.

Best of luck with getting finances sorted/resolved.


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## Boomer (24 Jun 2014)

hi guys , just got a letter telling me  as a result of your defaulting on the terms of your loan facility we are now entitled to possession of the property, we hereby call upon you to deliver up possession of the property within 10 days, it then goes on to say that they will appoint a receiver over the property if i dont give it up within 10 days an that the bank may also issue legal proceedings in which it will seek possession. my question is which one will they choose and how long does it take from this point untill they take the propery over?


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## Brendan Burgess (24 Jun 2014)

Why did you not agree to sell it and go for a PIA? 

Have you been to an insolvency practitioner for advice? 

While you are on social welfare, it is a good time to go for a deal.

Brendan


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## Boomer (24 Jun 2014)

Brendan Burgess said:


> Why did you not agree to sell it and go for a PIA?
> 
> Have you been to an insolvency practitioner for advice?
> 
> ...


      Sorry no i havnt been to a PIA or a practitioner brendan,

 i cant go down that road i have my reasons, i was going to sell it but couldnt get the money together to pay the agent .

 so i guess they will take it back an hopefully put the shortfall against my home  for 12 years.


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## 44brendan (25 Jun 2014)

> so i guess they will take it back an hopefully put the shortfall against my home for 12 years


This all indicates a head in the sand approach from the perspective of negotiating with the Bank and agreeing a deal in return for co-operating with the sale. You have an aversion to insolvency practioners, yet your financial position would indicate that you need expert specific advice in that area. No matter what the ultimate outcome may be you are better off discussions all optios with the bank, rather than ignoring them and precipating a Court date and reposession proceedings.


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## Boomer (25 Jun 2014)

Yes i have discussions with the bank its there way or no way, i have asked for the interest an arrears to be put on the term of loan many times, they have done nothing to help me.  20k ist a mad amount too have extened on to the over all morgage they wont hear of it, as for the sale i dont have the money to sell it an the bank hasnt said that they would pay for it or it would be taking out of the over all sale.

 could someone please answer my question about the letter i got from the bank and the timescale untill they take the property over (back), iam hearing storys about months or even years??


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## Boomer (26 Jun 2014)

Boomer said:


> hi guys , just got a letter telling me  as a result of your defaulting on the terms of your loan facility we are now entitled to possession of the property, we hereby call upon you to deliver up possession of the property within 10 days, it then goes on to say that they will appoint a receiver over the property if i dont give it up within 10 days an that the bank may also issue legal proceedings in which it will seek possession.
> 
> my question is which one will they choose and how long does it take from this point untill they take the propery over?



Could some please help me out here thankyou.


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## Boomer (30 Jun 2014)

Anyone please?


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