# what's going on with my Anglo Irish Bank Shares



## infocalnet (29 Dec 2009)

I have 30000 Anglo Irish Bank shares in my AIB online share dealing account with set value as "0"

Can anyone tell me what can I do or any chance to get some back? Thanks for your help!


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## Horatio (29 Dec 2009)

sounds like an error to me, ring them.


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## strmin (29 Dec 2009)

0 is exact value of your shares now.


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## roro123 (29 Dec 2009)

Lost cause I'd say. Northern rock shareholders are not being compensated by the uk government, don't know when our government will eventually announce they will not compensate anglo shareholders.


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## rustbucket (5 Jan 2010)

Technically, at the moment. You are still the legal owner of the shares until the government decide what payout to exisitng shareholders (if any- an the likely scenario is there will be none) and all the legal work is finalised.

As such, if you hold the shares online, they will be held in nominee by your broker. Therefore they are legally obliged to show your shareholding of 30000 shares and list the current value on your portfolio. In this case the value is zero and more than likely will not change.

The shares are delisted. They cannot be traded, you cannot get a share certificate, you cannot transfer them, they are if you will, in limbo, until the legal issues with the nationalisation are sorted out.

Your 'valuation' cannot be removed from your online account or portfolio. In some cases you can request your broker or account manager to remove 'worthless' stock from your account, but by doing this you may be signing away any rights to any future payouts etc if the government do decide to pay something.

Just ignore it on your statement. once it is all sorted they will be removed automatically and if you are due any funds (unlikely) it will be paid to your account.

The only consolation is that if you have other investments you may be able to write off the loss made on your Anglo Investment against any profit or capital gains tax on other investments. Although you best speak to your broker on this


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## beekeeper (5 Jan 2010)

rustbucket said:


> The only consolation is that if you have other investments you may be able to write off the loss made on your Anglo Investment against any profit or capital gains tax on other investments. Although you best speak to your broker on this


 
I was informed by someone in the revenue that you can only offset any losses for capital gains purposes made on Anglo shares in the year that the losses or the gains in those where realised.  They said that all losses on Anglo shares must be offset against any profits in 2009 as that is the year that anglo shares where realised.

This seems strange to me as these shares are still in existence (although valued at zero) until the legal implications of the nationalisation are sorted out and also it seems a bit of a sly move on behalf of the revenue if this is the case as most people wouldnt have had any substantial gains on shares in 2009 for which they could offset the Anglo losses ???


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## WaterSprite (5 Jan 2010)

beekeeper, I don't think your Revenue contact is correct.  You can carry forward losses indefinitely, but cannot carry forward gains to offset against future losses.  So s/he is right in a limited way -  that one can only offset the Anglo losses against gains in 2009 *or gains in future years*.


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## OPTIMUM (5 Jan 2010)

Revenue says:
http://www.revenue.ie/en/practitioner/ebrief/2009/no-762009.html
Revenue eBrief No. 76/09 
*03 November 2009*

*Negligible Value Claim – shares in Anglo Irish Bank*

Where, resulting from the provisions of the Anglo Irish Bank Corporation Act 2009, shares in Anglo Irish Bank are transferred to the Minister for Finance, there will be a disposal to which Section 538 TCA 1997 applies. Where a claim is made, the shares will be treated as of negligible value and a loss for 2009 may be calculated. If it later transpires that compensation is received, under the terms of the Act, in respect of the transferred shares, this will be treated, under Section 535 TCA 1997, as consideration for a disposal at time of receipt. In such a case, if a negligible value claim was made earlier, there will be no base cost and any chargeable gain arising shall be computed accordingly. If a negligible value claim was not made, the costs of acquisition of the shares transferred will be the base cost to be set against any compensation proceeds. 
In this instance, no separate claim need be made. If the loss is being claimed for 2009, it may be set against other gains, as appropriate, in arriving at Capital Gains Tax due on 15 December 2009. In making any Capital Gains Tax return or in completing the CGT panel of an Income Tax return, the loss may be used without separate comment.


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## WaterSprite (6 Jan 2010)

OPTIMUM said:


> Revenue says:
> http://www.revenue.ie/en/practitioner/ebrief/2009/no-762009.html
> Revenue eBrief No. 76/09
> *03 November 2009*
> ...



So, if you choose, you can opt to have the Anglo shares treated as being disposed of in 2009 for zero value.  If you do this, you have to pay CGT on any value actually received for them in the future.  If you write them down, then that's a capital loss, to be treated as any other capital loss (i.e. offsettable against gains in 2009 or future gains)


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## beekeeper (6 Jan 2010)

Si if I am interpreting this correctly my revenue contact was in fact correct.  Losses on the Anglo shares can only be set against any profits from  acapital gains perspective in 2009.  i.e. if you had no gains in 2009 and made some money in 2010 its not possible to put the Anglo losses against these ?


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## WaterSprite (6 Jan 2010)

beekeeper said:


> Si if I am interpreting this correctly my revenue contact was in fact correct.  Losses on the Anglo shares can only be set against any profits from  acapital gains perspective in 2009.  i.e. if you had no gains in 2009 and made some money in 2010 its not possible to put the Anglo losses against these ?



No, I don't believe that's correct.  You can't carry forward capital gains from earlier than 2009 but can carry forward the 2009 loss against CGT in future years.  I don't see anything in that Revenue Briefing to contradict that but perhaps you read it differently and I'm missing something.


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## tiger (6 Jan 2010)

Maybe you should read this thread on the property pin:
"Could an Anglo shareholder sue Seanie?"
link


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## monagt (6 Jan 2010)

No- You can carry your Capita losses and use against any future Capital Gains


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