# EBS Summit versus Choice Funds



## ClubMan (16 Feb 2007)

I have some money including my matured _SSIA _in _EBS Summit Funds_. Seeing that (post _Montgomery Oppenheim _leaving for _Rabo _and _ILIM _taking over _EBS _fund management) they now offer _Choice Funds _including a few index trackers I thought "great - maybe I'll switch into the index trackers". But it seems that this is not possible. To do this existing _Summit Fund _holders must cash in, reinvest in _Choice Funds _and then face the first five years early encashment penalty of 5% down to 1%. Poor show on _EBS's _part in my opinion especially for long term loyal customers and members. As a result I'll be taking this opportunity to cash in and move to somebody with lower charges and no silly penalties such as _QL _or _New Ireland SmartFunds _(where the encashment penalties can be waived by going through an execution only broker).


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## DrMoriarty (16 Feb 2007)

Poor show, indeed. Our own EBS SSIAs will mature in April and, pending a couple of other investment/reinvestment decisions that I won't really have time to sort out until later in the year, I'd planned to switch the SSIA proceeds straight into their index tracker funds. Now I'll probably encash them instead and transfer the funds to Quinn Life...


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## ClubMan (16 Feb 2007)

Yeah - I was surprised/disappointed when the _EBS _rep called me back this afternoon. At least the _Liffey Street _branch is handy for me to sort out encashment etc. I'll leave my €130+ in the _Optimise _account to retain my membership though. 
_
QL _*ETF*?!? Do you mean that or index tracker?

Actually - while I'm at it I must voice my disappointment directly to _EBS _as well for what it's worth. Care to join me?


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## DrMoriarty (17 Feb 2007)

It would do no harm; sign me up! (or do you mean to post them a link?)
And yes, sorry, got my munds fuddled up there.

So — what day exactly did you say you'd be walking up Liffey Street with all that lovely SSIA cash on your person?


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## Lance (17 Feb 2007)

Something else to consider also. According to last Sunday's Business Post, there is a 0.7 per cent MVA being imposed on maturing Summit funds.


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## ClubMan (17 Feb 2007)

Oh dear - thanks for flagging that _Lance_... 

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## messyleo (17 Feb 2007)

sorry guys, my father's ssia was in the ebs summit funds and is maturing in may. he got a form saying 'tick the box if you wish to continue your summit funds direct debit after your ssia matures' which he (stupidly!) just ticked and sent back without thinking about it or asking for my advice. is it still possible to continue the summit funds post-ssia or do you have to switch to a choice fund? I don't like the sound of clubman's discovery if that's the case. there doesnt seem to be anything on the ebs website about the summit fund option, which makes me think it no longer exists? sorry about this, it's just i want to check my father hasnt (self-inflictedly it must be said!) made an error on this one?

thanks guys


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## ClubMan (17 Feb 2007)

gravitygirl said:


> is it still possible to continue the summit funds post-ssia


Yes.


> or do you have to switch to a choice fund?


 No. In fact you can't switch as such. You have to cash in and then reinvest. Ridiculous! 


> there doesnt seem to be anything on the ebs website about the summit fund option, which makes me think it no longer exists?


 Summit Funds still exist but they may not be marketing/selling them as such any more. They are also managed by _ILIM _(for whom _EBS _are now a tied agent) and no longer _Montgomery Oppenheim _since they switched to _Rabo_. 


> sorry about this, it's just i want to check my father hasnt (self-inflictedly it must be said!) made an error on this one?


 If he wanted to continue as before _SSIA _maturity then he has made no mistake. Bear in mind that _EBS's _annual management charges are not the most competitive.


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## messyleo (17 Feb 2007)

thanks clubman - a fountain of knowledge as usual!


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## alpina (18 Feb 2007)

To carry on the above subject and as EBS Summit growth funds in particular appear to be performing pretty healthy at the moment does everyone still feel it is more advisable to cash all in and go search...QL etc
Still pretty new to this site so am probably missing out on obvious issues, some I have read and also as Clubman explains.

Thanks for any opinions.

Alpina


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## RaboDirect (18 Feb 2007)

Small but important point of clarification: EBS sold their business to ILIM as opposed to Oppenheim Investment managers leaving. 

Oppenheim decided to create two new funds intended to replicate the Summit Funds and offer them via RaboDirect: 
[broken link removed]
[broken link removed]

This now gives Summit Fund investors a choice - to have ILIM manage their Summit Funds or stay with Oppenheim and their particular investment management style. 

Note: existing Summit Fund investors with EBS would have to encash their investments and then open an Investment Account with RaboDirect. The normal RaboDirect entry fees of 0.75% have been waived until the end of February. RaboDirect's exit charge when you sell units in a fund is 0.75%. 

Some AAM readers may be aware that RaboDirect co-hosted a couple of investment seminars recently with Oppenheim to give more information about the Oppenheim Growth & Balanced funds. We recorded the last seminar and will be posting a podcast of the RaboDirect, Jill Kerby and Joe O'Dwyer (joint MD of Oppenheim) on our website shortly. 

Warning: Past performance is not a reliable guide to future performance. The value of your investment may go down as well as up. 

Regards,
RaboDirect


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## ClubMan (18 Feb 2007)

RaboDirect said:


> Small but important point of clarification: EBS sold their business to ILIM as opposed to Oppenheim Investment managers leaving.


Sorry - my mistake. I should have read the letter that I got from _EBS _a while back more carefully!

Fair play for the clear factual information and no hard sell above _RaboDirect_!


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## ClubMan (18 Feb 2007)

alpina said:


> To carry on the above subject and as EBS Summit growth funds in particular appear to be performing pretty healthy at the moment does everyone still feel it is more advisable to cash all in and go search...QL etc


Two comments: past performance is no guide to future returns and _QL's _ongoing charges are generall lower that _EBS's_. There are other factors to be considered (e.g. including this new 0.7% reduction on encashment if applicable) though.


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## ClubMan (19 Feb 2007)

Sort of out of inertia I had undertaked to continue my €254 p.m. investment by _DD _into _Sumimt Funds _post _SSIA _maturity. I will be cancelling this now and switching to _QL _for further regular contributions and writing to _EBS _to inform them that this is because (a) I can get lower charges that way (b) they (_EBS_) do not facilitate switching to their new funds without encashing first, reinvesting and having to face first 5 year early encashment charges and (c) they (_EBS_) are imposing additional exit charges on long standing customers/members such as myself. I will review the situation with regard to my matured _SSIA _and other _Summit Funds _investments but will most likely be moving them at the most opportune moment (e.g. if/when this additional penalty is removed).


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## macnas (25 Apr 2007)

Got this email from EBS during the week. They say there is no deduction for withdrawing money!  




> There are three options on maturity of your SSIA:
> 
> 1) You can receive a full cheque for the amount posted to your address.This is posted to the members two  working days after the account matures. In order for us to issue a cheque *we require a written request signed by you*. There is no penalty for withdrawing your funds on maturity or thereafter.


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## lotus (26 Apr 2007)

I have no dealings with the EBS but i want to open an account and put in €150 incase they demutalise sometime soon.  Which of their accounts do I need to put my money into to be eligible for windfall in the future?

Thanks


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## ClubMan (26 Apr 2007)

An _Optimise _account should do it but ask which accounts are share/investment/membership accounts (their website used to carry a list but I can't find it at the moment) that qualify the holder for membership and (after a period of time) voting rights.


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## ClubMan (26 Apr 2007)

macnas said:


> Got this email from EBS during the week. They say there is no deduction for withdrawing money!


It's possible (I don't know because I have not checked further yet) that _EBS_ are not charging any penalty but the fund managers are and subsuming it into the unit price or something like that.


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## falcon7xs (12 Feb 2008)

ClubMan said:


> Sort of out of inertia I had undertaked to continue my €254 p.m. investment by _DD _into _Sumimt Funds _post _SSIA _maturity. I will be cancelling this now and switching to _QL _for further regular contributions and writing to _EBS _to inform them that this is because (a) I can get lower charges that way (b) they (_EBS_) do not facilitate switching to their new funds without encashing first, reinvesting and having to face first 5 year early encashment charges and (c) they (_EBS_) are imposing additional exit charges on long standing customers/members such as myself. I will review the situation with regard to my matured _SSIA _and other _Summit Funds _investments but will most likely be moving them at the most opportune moment (e.g. if/when this additional penalty is removed).


 
Just wondered did you get out of the Summit funds in the end and if so where did you move them to on what basis?


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## stir crazy (12 Feb 2008)

I cashed in all my summit funds circa June after cashing out half the january before. Its the best thing I ever did. I suspect anyone who stayed in the funds got hammered and not only due to the stock market troubles. I moved to the rest of my spare money in the Quinn Life fund, made a lot of money in China and emerging markets, then went 100% cash and bonds since September and got out with a good profit for the year. Now I will wait a few months and see what happens. I am not overly worried about making a lot of money ( am happy to preserve my wealth and stay ahead of inflation so wont let greed cloud my judgement) but if the investing climate starts improving , my view will be that the bad news has finally ended and its time to get back in.


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