# Transferred money to wrong account no, HELP!!



## katemc (25 Sep 2011)

Hi 

I bank with Natwest and made an online instant payment to (what I thought was) my partners lloyds TSB credit card account. 

I inputted the account number wrongly and now my bank are saying I cant find out where it went to and they cant help me at all because of the data protection act. 

Please please please help! I need to find a way to get this money back to the correct account.

Thanks 

Kate


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## Knuttell (25 Sep 2011)

Hi Kate,this is an Irish site,not sure about data protection regs in the UK but it sounds like a load of rubbish,ring your Branch on Monday am and speak to someone there that will be some help to you...this happens a lot and for someone associated with your bank to tell you that they cannot interfere or help  is absurd.


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## katemc (25 Sep 2011)

Thanks, I cant understand how they cant look into it, i'm at my wits end!


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## Brendan Burgess (25 Sep 2011)

Knuttell said:


> Hi Kate,this is an Irish site,not sure about data protection regs in the UK but it sounds like a load of rubbish,ring your Branch on Monday am and speak to someone there that will be some help to you...this happens a lot and for someone associated with your bank to tell you that they cannot interfere or help  is absurd.



Hi Knuttell

Data Protection may indeed be absurd, but don't blame the banks for adhering to the law. 

This has come up before and if you give the bank the wrong instructions and they follow them, there is very little you can do. 

Natwest made a payment to a Lloyds TSB account. Natwest can't do anything.  If the OP has the account number, Llloyds TSB might contact the customer and ask their permission to reverse the transfer. But Lloyds are under no obligation to help. And the customer is under no obligation to refund the money.



Brendan


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## katemc (25 Sep 2011)

I had read somewhere that it is a criminal offence to hold the money knowlingly. Lloyds have been very helpful and may think that it will be in a suspense account, which i'm praying it is. So I have to call back tomorrow. 

Although i'm starting to lose hope now....


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## athens2004 (25 Sep 2011)

years ago someone lodged money into my A/C the bank got on to me and I had to give it back.


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## onlineprint (25 Sep 2011)

Thats a interesting question, i done a transfer myself and I inputted the wrong sort code for a AIB branch but the right account number in my local AIB, there is no sort code to match what I typed in so what happens now? Anyone any ideas?


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## Gulliver (25 Sep 2011)

There is also the Payment Services Directive (EU 2007) which has been brought into UK legislation. The directive reads:- 
_Article 74_
_Incorrect unique identifiers_
_1. If a payment order is executed in accordance with the unique identifier, the payment order shall be deemed to have been executed correctly with regard to the payee specified by the unique identifier._
_2. If the unique identifier provided by the payment service user is incorrect, the payment service provider shall not be liable under Article 75 for non-execution or defective execution of the payment transaction._
_However the payer's payment service provider shall make reasonable efforts to recover the funds involved in the payment transaction._
_If agreed in the framework contract, the payment service provider may charge the payment service user for recovery._
The Account number is the unique identifier referred to in this directive.
Until the directive, the bank was obliged to check that the name on the account as well as the number matched that on your credit transfer. Now they are only obliged to check that the account number matches.  The bank is obliged, however, to make reasonable efforts to recover the money.  The Directive does not define "reasonable efforts"

The message is very clear for all users of payment systems - make every effort to ensure that you do not use an incorrect number in future.


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## ClubMan (26 Sep 2011)

onlineprint said:


> Thats a interesting question, i done a transfer myself and I inputted the wrong sort code for a AIB branch but the right account number in my local AIB, there is no sort code to match what I typed in so what happens now? Anyone any ideas?


I suspect that the money will eventually "bounce" back if the destination account does not exist. I did something similar before - large transfer from one (_PTSB_) a/c to another, got the destination sort code wrong but it happened to be valid and identified another _PTSB _branch. However I suspect that the combination of "wrong" sort code and "correct" account number did not actually identify a valid account. Took a few days but the money "bounced" back. If the mistaken details had identified a valid account then I don't know what would have happened - e.g. how much hassle it might have been to reclaim the mistaken transfer.

Obviously in the case of a mistaken transfer you should get onto your bank to flag the issue and try to chase it up one way or another.


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## onq (26 Sep 2011)

katemc said:


> Hi
> 
> I bank with Natwest and made an online instant payment to (what I thought was) my partners lloyds TSB credit card account.
> 
> ...




More nonsense due to the over-the-top interpretation and implementation of this act.

The original idea of the act was to allow a person have access to information held by them, not to prevent information transfer in cases like this.

Besides, there is nothing to stop the banks in-house inner working tracing the transfer and requesting it back.

Whether the other side honours this request is another matter!

The unintended beneficiary of the amount you transferred might need to look to his laurels to avoid an additional tax burden this year.

€27K bounced through my account from a Friday to a following Tuesday, co-incidentally on a weekend on which I was in hospital, so I could prove it was nothing to do with me.

I had to ask the bank to confirm in writing what had occurred to square it with the Revenue.


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## Mpsox (26 Sep 2011)

A lot depends here whether or not the funds have gone into an actual live bank account or not. Banks use a system called modulus checking to see if the details input are correct, in effect it takes the 6 digits of a sortcode, the 8 of the account number and performs a mathamatical algorithim on these numbers, if the answer is a particular amount, then it is a valid account number.

However, it should only credit this valid account number if the account is actually open and in operation. If it's not, it should bounce the amount to a suspense account, creating an internal difference which someone in the bank will need to resolve. These can take time, especially if 2 banks are involved. 

Most of the banks will allow for a "credit trace " to be carried out, in effect, they will write out and ask the other bank in question, where did the funds go?. Most of the banks will provide that information back but in the case of a wrongful transfer that has hit a "live" bank account, it could be between the person making the transfer and the person who got it to resolve the matter if the benificiary doesn't want to pay it back


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## ClubMan (26 Sep 2011)

Mpsox said:


> A lot depends here whether or not the funds have gone into an actual live bank account or not. Banks use a system called modulus checking to see if the details input are correct, in effect it takes the 6 digits of a sortcode, the 8 of the account number and performs a mathamatical algorithim on these numbers, if the answer is a particular amount, then it is a valid account number.


I presume that online banking systems don't necessarily (or at all?) do this check in real time/interactively but rather at the "back office" end once the transfer request has been entered into the system?


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## Mpsox (26 Sep 2011)

ClubMan said:


> I presume that online banking systems don't necessarily (or at all?) do this check in real time/interactively but rather at the "back office" end once the transfer request has been entered into the system?


 
It can depend, for example, many GPGs (Generic Payment Gateways) will have it built in so, for example, if you are internet shopping and put in the wrong credit card number with, e.g. one digit wrong, you won't be allowed to proceed. 

However, if it is an inter bank transfer, the online system for one bank may not have the rules built in for other banks so, as you say, it happens in the back office


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## 44brendan (26 Sep 2011)

However there are a number of precidents that would help mthe case of the OP. Errors in implementing account numbers are normal in the banking system. Just because someone inputs an incorrect account number and funds are transferred to your account does not entitle you to hold on to the funds. In fact a number of legal cases have held that spending these funds is effectively theft.
In the event that the lodgement slip contained the correct name of the account but the account number was incorrect the Bank should immediately reverse the lodgement transaction. In my experience most banks will do this provided the transferror can clearly point to the transaction being an error. The request should be made directly to the account holding Bank with full facts. they will have a copy of the lodgement slip to check to their own satisfaction that the error was made.


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## Mpsox (26 Sep 2011)

44brendan said:


> However there are a number of precidents that would help mthe case of the OP. Errors in implementing account numbers are normal in the banking system. Just because someone inputs an incorrect account number and funds are transferred to your account does not entitle you to hold on to the funds. In fact a number of legal cases have held that spending these funds is effectively theft.
> In the event that the lodgement slip contained the correct name of the account but the account number was incorrect the Bank should immediately reverse the lodgement transaction. In my experience most banks will do this provided the transferror can clearly point to the transaction being an error. The request should be made directly to the account holding Bank with full facts. they will have a copy of the lodgement slip to check to their own satisfaction that the error was made.


 
True, but if the funds are gone.......

Also, if the transfer was done electronically, there may be no lodgement slip


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