# Problem Tenant



## Kiernp (17 Nov 2005)

Hi,

I would be interested in other people's opinions on my situation.

I have been renting a house to a seperated father of two, on social welfare, for about six months. The contract is for a year. Under the terms of the contract he was required to set up a direct debit for the rent. This he never did, despite being asked on any number of occasions.

Around the time he moved in, I spent over 5k on the property, some of it at his request, on new floors, tiled kitchen floor, new furniture etc.

The thing is, although he is on rent allowance, getting the rent from him is a battle every week. He is always a week or two behind and frankly I am sick of having to make multiple phone calls every week and have to listen to his lies, evasiveness, whining and shouting to get the rent. When I am trying to get the rent he tells me to get off his back etc.

In the new year, I am thinking of giving him notice. Does anyone have an opinion on the strength of my case or on how best to handle him?

On a cautionary note I'd say to people considering buy to rent that it is certainly not all a bed of roses and that I have had plenty of problems with tenants.

Regards,
Kiernp.


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## markowitzman (17 Nov 2005)

Do you have a written contract drawn up by solicitor?


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## Kiernp (17 Nov 2005)

It is a written, signed contract but it was not drawn up by a solicitor.


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## delgirl (17 Nov 2005)

Hi Kiernp, if he's on rent allowance, why don't you ask him to sign a waiver which will allow the rent to be paid directly to you by the Health Board.

I don't have any rent allowance tenants myself, but a friend has. I understand they pay in arrears and she has no problem with receipt of rent, although she insists that the tenants sign the waiver _before_ they move in.

Perhaps you could visit him with the waiver and explain to him that it would be better for both of you if he would agree to have the rent allowance paid directly to you.  I can imagine with 2 children and on welfare, it would be a temptation to spend the rent allowance, particularly coming up to Christmas.

My friend gave me a copy of the waiver she uses (in case I ever get rent allowance tenants, it's key to get them to sign before they move in) - if you'd like a copy, just PM me your e-mail address and I'll send it to you.


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## markowitzman (17 Nov 2005)

I would go to solicitor first and have contract assessed and let solicitor take it from there if deemed appropriate.


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## sandrabing (17 Nov 2005)

try your local citizens information bureau, they offer free, impartial and confidential advice on what your rights are legally etc. Also try Threshold they are also an advice centre, I think they only give advice to tenants but I am not absolutely sure...........maybe worth checking out ?


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## markowitzman (17 Nov 2005)

With respect spend the few quid to get good legal advice.
You have too much to lose.


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## ninsaga (17 Nov 2005)

..are your registered with the PRTB...you could advise them of what you are doing also & they might guide.

ninsaga


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## DonKing (18 Nov 2005)

Kiernp,

Get rid of that guy. He has no respect for you and I very much believe the situation will probably get worse going forward. 

As suggested above I would seek legal/professional advice if you are not sure yourself.

Did you get this tenant through a letting agency? If so I would complain to them. If they are any good they should also be able to assist.


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## ClubMan (18 Nov 2005)

I can see the relevance of this:


			
				Kiernp said:
			
		

> he is on rent allowance


but not really of this:


> a seperated father of two, on social welfare


Maybe you could explain?


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## markowitzman (19 Nov 2005)

Fair play to the Securitate but at the end of the day.........!!!
Sorry could not resist.....coming from a die hard Liverpool fan.
Clubman to be serious I think the fact that tenant is separated etc could be a factor in a court case if it gets this far....mitigating circumstances and all that.
It could be very easy for the tenant with good legal advice to turn this potential case against the landlord from the point of view of personal problems and alleged harassment from the landlord.
Which is why one needs to tread carefully and get good legal help.


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## ClubMan (19 Nov 2005)

markowitzman said:
			
		

> Clubman to be serious I think the fact that tenant is separated etc could be a factor in a court case if it gets this far....mitigating circumstances and all that.It could be very easy for the tenant with good legal advice to turn this potential case against the landlord from the point of view of personal problems and alleged harassment from the landlord.


I don't see that as very likely myself to be honest.


> Which is why one needs to tread carefully and get good legal help.


I agree with you there.


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## LizaM (21 Nov 2005)

God,  how i wish you were my Landlord KIERNP!!

I too live in rented accomodation and also recieve a small amount of rent allowance. 

I set up a direct debit from the time i came in and every month put the rent allowance in together with my own.

My point being, you sound like a very decent landlord hence having spent over 5k on your house, Ive being trying to get my landlord out  to  fix a kitchen light and a couple of sockets in the kids room for 3 months now!!!! It took me over a year to get a new washing machine!

Maybe your tenants reluctance to set up the direct debit could be the fact that he doesnt have a bank account?  Could you maybe give him details of your bank account so he could simply walk into the bank and  deposit your rent there every month?

BTW when he moves out can I move in instead!!!!


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## Kiernp (25 Nov 2005)

Hi,
Thanks to everyone that posted.
I have informally spoken to a solicitor who tells me that I have a strong case for breach of contract but that it could take six months to get him out.
I mentioned the children in my original post because I have been more tolerant of the tenant's behaviour because of his children, especially coming up to Christmas.
He has now paid me 1/2 of his arrears but I am sick of dealing with his lies, evasions and aggression. I don't have the time or the inclination to spend several hours a week chasing this guy, checking the bank for rent, making unanswered phone calls, calling to the property for rent that is permanently in arrears etc. 
I am going to write to him, explaining my position, which I have done verbally many times, and informing him I will be terminating the lease if there is not an immediate improvement. This will probably cost me but I have had enough.
In the four or five years since I have been a landlord, I have had two tenants that had to be chased on a regular basis for rent, one of whom went eyeball to eyeball with me to try and intimidate me, I have also had several tenants who have left the place in a filty, condition. And I mean filty, including faeces liberally dropped all over the carpet in one room, not untidy. I'm not sure if I am a bad judge of potential tenants or if it is the area or if I have been unlucky or a combination of all three.
I think that there should be a register of problem tenants but I'm sure that would be contentious.
Regards,
Kiernp


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## RainyDay (26 Nov 2005)

Kiernp said:
			
		

> I think that there should be a register of problem tenants but I'm sure that would be contentious.


You'd support a register for problem landlords too - right? Ratemylandlord.ie perhaps?


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## Kiernp (28 Nov 2005)

Yes, I'd have no problem with a register for landlords.


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## ClubMan (28 Nov 2005)

One already exists - the PRTB.


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## DonKing (28 Nov 2005)

Kiernp,

Would you not consider using a letting agent to find a tenant in the future. When I first rented a property I was given that advice from a seasoned landlord.

If you use a reputable agent, then he should be able to advise and assist if there is a problem with the tenant he sourced for you. I know you might say he's not contractually required to do anything, but I think if it's a reputable agency, then they should help, particularly if they know that they will get another fee when they source another tenant for you.

I also feel a rogue tenant may respond better to a no nonsense experienced letting agent rather than a landlord who they feel they can pull the wool over their eyes.

It genarally costs one months rent, which isn't alot considering you don't have the hassle of interviewing and showing people around etc.


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## markowitzman (28 Nov 2005)

Agree with Don. Letting agent would help.
Also a large deposit might weed out the potential problem tenants.
I think the book RENTING OUT PROPERTY FOR DUMMIES is a fantastic reference to help in all aspects of buy to let.
It is slanted towards the english market but it has been a huge help to me over the past few years.
Highly recommended!


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## onekeano (28 Nov 2005)

markowitzman said:
			
		

> Agree with Don. Letting agent would help.
> Also a large deposit might weed out the potential problem tenants.
> I think the book RENTING OUT PROPERTY FOR DUMMIES is a fantastic reference to help in all aspects of buy to let.
> It is slanted towards the english market but it has been a huge help to me over the past few years.
> Highly recommended!



Have to say I would much rather find my own tenants - the trick is to get a large(ish) deposit, make sure if something goes wrong you get it fixed quick and let them and in general treat them like adults not serfs.... Too many landlords f**k around with penny pinching ("should I get the hoover fixed etc") when they can claim this stuff on their tax. This sends out completely the wrong signal to tenants, after all it IS THEIR HOME and it's just an investment property for the landlord.

Roy


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## Kiernp (29 Nov 2005)

Hi,
Clubman
Re PRTB: I think the post referring to rating landlords meant an actual rating system. I am registered with the PRTB but I regard it as just an administrative overhead.
I have used an agency before but I found that they didn't check references. I have heard other landlords complaining about agencies being negligent in one way or another so that put me off them. Incidentally the reference for the current tenant came from that agency I once used so perhaps I should have been wary.
OneKeano: re
"make sure if something goes wrong you get it fixed quick and let them and in general treat them like adults not serfs.... Too many landlords f**k around with penny pinching ("should I get the hoover fixed etc") when they can claim this stuff on their tax"
This certainly isn't my position. As I mentioned in the original post, I have spent about 5k on the house around the time this tenant moved in, tiled floor in kitchen, new furniture in bedrooms & kitchen, new washing machine, freshly decorated etc.
I fully accept that a rented property is the tenant's home and i have no wish to intrude: I rented for 20 years myself and am now renting again because I have had to travel for work commitments so I am very aware of a tenant's position.
Personally all I want from the tenant is to pay the rent and treat the place reasonably (and of course that doesn't mean it needs to be kept in a pristine condition.)

Thanks
Regards,
Kiernp


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## JaneyL (29 Nov 2005)

I wouldn't rent out to welfare recipients myself. They're not paying the rent personally, so won't give a monkeys about your place. Better to stick with tentants who are paying for the rent themselves.


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## delgirl (29 Nov 2005)

Hi Kiernp,


			
				kiernp said:
			
		

> am going to write to him, explaining my position, which I have done verbally many times, and informing him I will be terminating the lease if there is not an immediate improvement


Why don't you ask him to sign the waiver so that you can get the rent directly from the Health Board, surely this will solve your problem with him?  It is, I understand from 3 fellow landlords, common practice.  In fact, they won't let any rent allowance tenants into their properties unless they sign the waiver in advance.

I have learned through past experience that you have to act fast and decisively when a problem such as this arises. I dithered once in the past and a tenant ended up owing thousands and left never to be seen again!

If he doesn't sign the waiver, contact the Health Board direct and explain the situation to them. Tell them that he is going to make himself (and his children) intentionally homeless if he continues to withhold the rent allowance. Perhaps they will agree without the waiver to pay you direct?

You sound like a really good, fair landlord and you musn't allow yourself to be worn down by the repeated lies, evasion, aggression, etc. That's what he's counting on.

Have you contacted the PRTB?


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## Purple (30 Nov 2005)

Hi Kiernp,

This sounds like a stressful situation. You say that you have been renting for six months, how much is your tenant in arrears? I assume that it is a one year lease so with six months to go I wouldn’t get a solicitor involved too much as the cost will most likely be greater than the arrears for the next six months. 
I think that Delgirl’s suggestion of contacting the health board directly is a good first step. Other than that you will just have to put up with your existing tenant for the next six months as if he refuses to leave it will get nasty (and expensive).


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