# Sponsorship of family for Christmas



## Easel (27 Aug 2019)

Hi,

Pretty crazy to be talking about Christmas in August but the topic came up the other day.

Is it possible to sponsor a family for Christmas- Gifts/food etc? And, what's the best way to do it?

Last year my family & extended family spend way too much on giving nonsensical gifts to each other just for the sake of it.

I would like to see if it is possible to directly sponsor a family for the period and spend €20 each on a secret santa type of set up.

I already give to charities and like the idea of shopping specifically for a family over giving an additional donation to a charity.

I am not looking to meet the family directly and like the idea of getting general info on them to assist with what to buy.

e.g.

family of 5, 2 boys aged 5,8 and 1 girl aged 12 listing some of their interests.

Has anyone done anything like this before? Is there any merit to it or is it just self serving?


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## noproblem (27 Aug 2019)

The Lions Clubs around the country donate food, presents, etc, to needy families over the Christmas period. You could see if there's a Lions Club near you and make the donation of food, presents, etc, to them and it will get to the appropriate family.


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## Peanuts20 (27 Aug 2019)

No shortage of charities that you can donate to, SVDP is another example of one that does excellent work at that time of year. Shoebox appeal is one to consider for kids in the 3rd world. you could also try the Temple street donate a present campaigh


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## Leper (27 Aug 2019)

I remember visiting families to distribute butter from the butter-mountain and meat from the beef mountain back in the day. Some of the people to which I distributed the stuff were better off than most people. The term Freeloaders comes to mind. I ain't gettin' involved and my score (€20) per person will go to St-Vincent de Paul.

Please find it in your heart to forgive me. I'm still a cynical Leper in the final stages of leprosy. I must ring my bell and shout "Unclean!"


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## gnf_ireland (27 Aug 2019)

there are a fair few charities who ask for donations of presents which are handed out to families at Christmas - normally called Toy Appeals or similar. One of the things they always ask for is for stuff for teenagers who sometimes get forgotten when it comes to presents. 2fm do one, as does temple street and think SVP does as well. They have been organised in both myself and my partners place of work over the last few years.

The shoebox thing is done via the schools out our way...



Leper said:


> Some of the people to which I distributed the stuff were better off than most people.


Always people who will take advantage of the goodwill of others. There was a case on another site a few years back where someone claimed to be badly stuck at Christmas for presents for the kids after being very active on the site for a fair few months and forming 'bonds' with people. A lot of people donated money to them secretly, and the person disappeared immediately afterwards. Once it became known that it was a play (by accident), turns out the person had 'benefited' by close to 5k through peoples generosity !!


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## Easeler (27 Aug 2019)

I always thought we were poor growing up there was 12 of us in a 3 bed council house and not a penny spent on it . The father was tight with money and you left school at 15 and got a job to pay your way and move on as quick as you could. Sadly the father died in sqaller but left a sizeable estate after him. The moral to my little rant is how do we know who is rich or poor.


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## Purple (28 Aug 2019)

Peanuts20 said:


> SVDP is another example of one that does excellent work at that time of yea


SVDP have a policy of never saying no if someone asks for help, so I never give them anything.


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## Easel (28 Aug 2019)

Purple said:


> SVDP have a policy of never saying no if someone asks for help, so I never give them anything.


My god, is this what the country has come to? I always thought SVP were one of the best to give to. What charities would you consider worthy?


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## Purple (28 Aug 2019)

Easel said:


> My god, is this what the country has come to? I always thought SVP were one of the best to give to. What charities would you consider worthy?


I have a problem with a charity that gives people's hard earned money out without any real consideration for whether the recipient actually needs it. That's what the government is for.


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## Easel (28 Aug 2019)

Are there any charities you would recommend that don't do this?


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## Purple (28 Aug 2019)

Easel said:


> Are there any charities you would recommend that don't do this?


10% of what I earn goes to social protection. That's about enough. I'm not a big fan of the Homeless Industry or the Charity Industry in general. I support the Merchant's Quay Project and a couple of overseas development Charities.


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## shopgirl (28 Aug 2019)

What about an organization like Jack & Jill or The Laura Lynn Hospice.  Families with children who avail of services of these 2 organizations are often under financial pressure as often a parent has to give up work to care for a very poorly child & they have the financial burden of trips to the hospital & not being able to go home for long periods of time due to childrens’ lengthy stays in hospital.


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## Purple (29 Aug 2019)

shopgirl said:


> What about an organization like Jack & Jill or The Laura Lynn Hospice.  Families with children who avail of services of these 2 organizations are often under financial pressure as often a parent has to give up work to care for a very poorly child & they have the financial burden of trips to the hospital & not being able to go home for long periods of time due to childrens’ lengthy stays in hospital.


They both do great work. Jack & Jill deliver services at 1/3 of the cost of the HSE.


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## Peanuts20 (29 Aug 2019)

Its not always obvious from the outside looking in why people need help. I've seen the SVDP give help to a family with a big house where the father had got into gambling debt. SVDP money and food went to the wife. You can argue that it was the fathers fault but at the end of the day, if it meant the kids went to bed with food in their tummies...

Many Health charities are great but do a bit of digging

An alternative is to donate your time.  Plenty of charities always looking for volunteers









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## luckystar (30 Aug 2019)

Purple said:


> SVDP have a policy of never saying no if someone asks for help, so I never give them anything.



That is absolute rubbish. There is no policy - it's at the discretion of the volunteers visiting. Svp is an enormous charity that helps a significant amount of families and every penny donated to a local conference will be spent locally.


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## Purple (30 Aug 2019)

luckystar said:


> That is absolute rubbish. There is no policy - it's at the discretion of the volunteers visiting. Svp is an enormous charity that helps a significant amount of families and every penny donated to a local conference will be spent locally.


No, that's complete rubbish. I have first hand experience. 
When someone  is re-paying €900 a month on the €120,000 worth of cars in their driveway they should trade down before they look for charity.


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## Setanta12 (30 Aug 2019)

I had a tenant overstaying and was in considerable arrears. Once when I was visiting for the latest non-rent, I discovered my tenant's sister had moved in with her family.  As I was leaving, walking down the road I noticed Svp people dropping in - I waited to talk to them.

People in the house told Svp they were living there years and paying the rent was causing them hardship with Xmas only 2-3 weeks away. 

I took great pleasure apprising them of the true state of affairs, and then going back to tell the squatters!


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## Easeler (30 Aug 2019)

Charities are big business. I had a very nice young lady call to the house here the other evening I am in rural co Galway  looking for me to sign  up for dogs trust Ireland. She was a good salesperson in fairness and I gave her a bit of time but unfortunately told her the sad tale of  4 kids going back to school and the 12 direct debits we already have I thought she was going to give me a few euro but she  left with a smile.


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## Leper (31 Aug 2019)

I never denied that cynicism is the main component of my DNA. Back in the day I had issues with St-VdP dishing out money the way they did. However, in my later years I reckon St-VdP are doing lots of good. OK! there is a per-cent of every contribution going to hands that don't deserve but, I'd rather see somebody who is genuine in his/her poverty getting something rather than nothing.  There are the freeloaders and we'll always have them. That says a lot about our Ireland.

But, what if? - Say St-VdeP and other worthwhile charities decided to cease existence (even for 6 months) and handed the poverty problem back to our government. I just wonder how much more the poor would be less well off.

I hear some contributors here calling for sale of personal possessions, downgrading of living standards. Great! Very shortly we'll be screaming for the effluent of the affluent to be cleaned by the poor in thanks.

Before anybody points the finger, bear in mind that circumstances can change quickly and you could be in poverty and faster than you think.


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## luckystar (31 Aug 2019)

Purple said:


> No, that's complete rubbish. I have first hand experience.
> When someone is re-paying €900 a month on the €120,000 worth of cars in their driveway they should trade down before they look for charity.



The volunteers (mostly elderly with svp) are calling to families in their homes. If they choose to lie to gain charitable help then that's sickening. Volunteers can only go by what they're told and can see around them. Long time volunteers become quite astute as to what they're being told and get to know the families in the area. If it's a transient population with lots of renters then that becomes more difficult. And don't for one second think huge sums are being handed out. Far from it. Educational assistance is huge as is back to school and Christmas.


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## Purple (2 Sep 2019)

luckystar said:


> The volunteers (mostly elderly with svp) are calling to families in their homes. If they choose to lie to gain charitable help then that's sickening. Volunteers can only go by what they're told and can see around them. Long time volunteers become quite astute as to what they're being told and get to know the families in the area. If it's a transient population with lots of renters then that becomes more difficult. And don't for one second think huge sums are being handed out. Far from it. Educational assistance is huge as is back to school and Christmas.


We'll have to agree to differ but I've seen first hand where people with the ability to free up tens of thousands by just trading down their cars were given money. I work with a few guys from ballymun and the running joke at christmas is when  they tell the VDP give "help" to those who don't need it (and didn't ask for it).
The line I heard is that "We're not here to judge people and if someone asks for help we don't say no".


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## Peanuts20 (2 Sep 2019)

Charities, like many other organisations, don't always get it right but in my view, the SVDP get it right far more often then they get it wrong. They don't judge and we should be careful also when we don't know the full facts of a story. I know of someone who got help from them, her husband is earning €100k a year and from the outside you'd think nothing was wrong, big house, big car, big wig down the golf club. Reality was he was up to his ears in debt through gambling, would put the months wages on a football match and when his wife tried to leave, he put her in hospital. She went to the SVDP one weekend when she had no food for her and the kids and he was off on a bender some place.


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## Purple (2 Sep 2019)

Peanuts20 said:


> Charities, like many other organisations, don't always get it right but in my view, the SVDP get it right far more often then they get it wrong. They don't judge and we should be careful also when we don't know the full facts of a story. I know of someone who got help from them, her husband is earning €100k a year and from the outside you'd think nothing was wrong, big house, big car, big wig down the golf club. Reality was he was up to his ears in debt through gambling, would put the months wages on a football match and when his wife tried to leave, he put her in hospital. She went to the SVDP one weekend when she had no food for her and the kids and he was off on a bender some place.


She should have called the police. Getting bread money from well meaning amateurs does nothing other than enable her husbands addiction. It would be no different to paying off his drug debts. I wouldn't be surprised if they do that too.


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## Leper (2 Sep 2019)

Hi Purple,

Can you offer a solution as to how the likes of St-VdP should operate?


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## Easel (2 Sep 2019)

Purple said:


> The line I heard is that "We're not here to judge people and if someone asks for help we don't say no".



I can't believe that there is a significant number of people seeking help from a charity like SVP when they don't need it. Whilst I'm sure it does happen I can only hope that these cases are in the vast minority.


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## Purple (2 Sep 2019)

Easel said:


> I can't believe that there is a significant number of people seeking help from a charity like SVP when they don't need it. Whilst I'm sure it does happen I can only hope that these cases are in the vast minority.


Sure, just like nobody commits welfare or tax fraud.


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## Easel (2 Sep 2019)

Purple said:


> Sure, just like nobody commits welfare or tax fraud.


You would hope they are also in the vast minority.

I, probably to my own nativity, believe a lot of the work SVP does goes to worthy recipients.


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## Purple (2 Sep 2019)

Leper said:


> Hi Purple,
> 
> Can you offer a solution as to how the likes of St-VdP should operate?


I'd suggest that when the Vinnie de Paul arrives at the home of someone has liquid assets worth tens of thousands of Euro which they can dispose of with minimal impact on their lifestyle they should not give them money which was donated by people who have much lower incomes. 

Maybe treat the money, and the people who gave it to them, with a bit more respect.


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## Purple (2 Sep 2019)

Easel said:


> I, probably to my own nativity, believe a lot of the work SVP does goes to worthy recipients.


 So do I. I also believe a lot of it doesn't.


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## Leper (2 Sep 2019)

The high moral ground is a great place to be and long may it last. But, unless you've stocked future lotto numbers that will win you the jackpot or work in the field where there are huge guaranteed bonuses, you cannot afford to be smug. We can easily run into another recession, our investments can turn sour, our well paying jobs can cease, for some reason or other our life savings can disappear and let's not forget divorce which brings poverty to many too. Health is a major issue. If any of these fails we can slip from a smug existence to poverty almost overnight.

Even in Cork, house rental has gone through the roof. In Dublin it's worse. We are in an age where it is becoming increasingly difficult to even acquire the deposit to buy a house. Gaining a mortgage is difficult also. The long and the short is that people are becoming more poor and it seems there is no end in sight. Some of the posters here nearly want those in difficulty to wear sack-cloth and even look and act poor. God help the poor if they own a car! I wonder how many contributing here were ever homeless, had the bank on their case re inability to pay the mortgage, were out of work for long periods, had businesses that failed, etc etc.

We never had so much real poverty as there is now. Somebody comes up with the idea of sponsoring somebody for Christmas. What about sponsorship for the other 364 days? I remember a rent-a-grandad-for-Christmas-Day a few years ago promoted by well meaning people of Cork. What happened? Grandad showed up for the Christmas Dinner which he shared with a well meaning family; got cast out later to his lonely poverty stricken bed-sit and his dead body was recovered from the Lee some days later.

I remember the Christmas Eve Midnight Mass where after the Consecration unwanted toys were presented at the altar for distribution to the poor. Even the priest asked from the altar "At this late stage, to whom can we give the toys?" We're all great at solving the poverty situation after we've had a few pints while sitting on a bar stool, but the following morning we can't solve anything.


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## luckystar (2 Sep 2019)

Purple said:


> I'd suggest that when the Vinnie de Paul arrives at the home of someone has liquid assets worth tens of thousands of Euro which they can dispose of with minimal impact on their lifestyle they should not give them money which was donated by people who have much lower incomes.
> 
> Maybe treat the money, and the people who gave it to them, with a bit more respect.



I'd suggest you volunteer your time in a deprived area and see first hand how svp is much needed. Perhaps ballymun as you mentioned above. And I think volunteers are very aware that its donations they're handing over and don't do so without asking questions


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## Purple (3 Sep 2019)

luckystar said:


> I'd suggest you volunteer your time in a deprived area and see first hand how svp is much needed. Perhaps ballymun as you mentioned above. And I think volunteers are very aware that its donations they're handing over and don't do so without asking questions


I spent years collecting for the SVdP and have seen first hand how they "distribute" that money.


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## Purple (3 Sep 2019)

Leper said:


> The high moral ground is a great place to be and long may it last. But, unless you've stocked future lotto numbers that will win you the jackpot or work in the field where there are huge guaranteed bonuses, you cannot afford to be smug. We can easily run into another recession, our investments can turn sour, our well paying jobs can cease, for some reason or other our life savings can disappear and let's not forget divorce which brings poverty to many too. Health is a major issue. If any of these fails we can slip from a smug existence to poverty almost overnight.


I agree completely. How smug is it to dive out money to those who don't need it when there are so many who do.


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## Peanuts20 (5 Sep 2019)

Its very easy to say "they don't need it" but there are plenty of cases where in an abusive relationship


Purple said:


> She should have called the police. Getting bread money from well meaning amateurs does nothing other than enable her husbands addiction. It would be no different to paying off his drug debts. I wouldn't be surprised if they do that too.



She did and he broke her nose after he was released. Its sorted now, she has left him and they are now in the process of seperating. However the SVDP was what put food in their kids bellies whilst this was going on. It was the kids really they were helping here


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## Easter (5 Sep 2019)

I would rather SVP get conned occasionally and still helped the thousands of needy people it does every year, than it folded and their amazing work stop. The vast majority of people svp help badly need it. 

This is a really begrudging thread, I hope it won’t turn people off donating. It would be impossible for svp to have 100% certainty every time, but experience of SVP volunteers I hear from is that they are visiting people in dire need for the most part. Sometimes hardship and difficulties are less visible. Sometimes someone will get something they might not need as much as they could, but applying the principle of totality, SVP are providing a much needed service.

Their shops are great too - they sell things at a good enough price to raise money and cheap enough for people in need to afford them - unlike oxfam and others whose clothes are still not affordable for the poor. Donating clothes and other items to SVP is a great way of ensuring you’re helping those in need through providing affordable preowned essentials and raising funds for them.


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