# Looking for Architect ?



## dodo (29 Apr 2010)

I might do this planning application myself,but if any one knows cheap guy around please pass on his name, I will be building up about 6 blocks on gable wall thus reducing exsisting hipp, and stick in a window, and would love to have a dormer window to the front of the house(not over looking anyone except the Dublin mountains but I heard it is hard to get planning at the front


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## z101 (29 Apr 2010)

Are you sure you need planning for that? I dont believe you need permission if it's under 40sq/m extension.

What do you consider cheap by the way.


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## dodo (29 Apr 2010)

Ceatharlach said:


> Are you sure you need planning for that? I dont believe you need permission if it's under 40sq/m extension.
> 
> What do you consider cheap by the way.


 No you have to get planning permission as this will effect the look of the hous even from the front


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## onq (29 Apr 2010)

dodo,

There plenty of architects around without very little work on.

ONQ.

[broken link removed]


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## Brigid (30 Apr 2010)

Just in relation to that comment 'there are plenty of architects around...' above, as I mentioned in another post we met 3 last weekend as part of the Simon Open Door initiative and 1 of them (whom I would have thought was not that long established and looking for work) quoted 10% of the over all cost and the other who has only been in private practice for about a year (having been made redundant) said between 8 and 10%.  The third who we would be most interested in retaining as he seemed the most practical and we were most in tune with, is a partner in a busy firm and said that percentage quotes were no longer feasible and it would depend on the brief and work done etc.   Sorry ... what I am trying to say is that of those 3 the only one willing to move from what I think is the ridiculously high % scale was the busiest ... therefore I wonder if there are that amount of 'hungry' unemployed architects out there???


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## onq (1 May 2010)

I cannot speak for too many other architects or practices Brigid, but I'll reveal this about mine, since you asked.
As I'm self employed with some work on I cannot technically be said to be unemployed, but our income has fallen to a tithe of what it was and the phones are relatively silent.
A large office I've doen some work with which had staff of 125 two years  ago is down to 25 on three day weeks trying to keep skilled people  gainfully employed.
Of two smaller other practices I have had occasion to deal with over the years, one has gone from 21 to 2 persons, the other from 17 to 2.

A cynic might say that you went - not to a charity - but to a marketing  exercise by Members of the RIAI, and that the assurance of protection to  the public offered by Membership of the RIAI means very little if they  don't offer lower fees in a recession having made contact with new  clients.
The response might be that offices are required to perform certain due diligence work whether as part of Health and Safety exercises or Continuous Professional Development training, plus maintaining professional indemnity cover, paying grossly inflated rents in a recession and paying staff whose salaries.

Many offices have gone to the wall because they cannot find profitable  work, and while they have work on, those that remain will seek  profitable work first and stick to their fee levels until they are  unable to pay their bills.
At that stage of course, it will be too late for them to ring you up and offer to do the work for 6-8% because the house will be built using a more competitive service from someone else.

To get good work done for a 6-8% fixed fee [or lower - ulp!] you'll have to limit yourself to signing off on the drawings prior to commencement and not make changes on site.
It is this kind of time-consuming work, known as "alterations to finished drawings" that increases an architect's time once the house is on site and eats into his fee income.

In my experience this is almost impossible for most first time house builders.
Some people genuinely cannot read drawings and this means a lot of changes on site.
Many clients only consider the proposed new house in detail after permission is granted.
Sometimes they are afraid to discuss reburied revisions with their architect before the work starts.
As soon as you start changing things on site you increase costs to both  the builder and the architect.

From your posts above you seem to be able to read a drawing and see where improvements can be made.
The best way to move forward if you have a client that can read drawings is to make all changes pre-tender.
Mind your on our last job we were instructed to change the entire roof design after we had appointed the builder!
So whatever you do, or regardless of who you choose, you need to sit down with them and discuss all changes now.

Finally, in this economy, you need not only someone you get along, with, or whose design ability can give you your desire.
You also need someone who will sit for a while pre-tender to iron out the remaining bugs and put in some extra time on site for free.

HTH

ONQ

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## onq (1 May 2010)

Actually I was re-reading my post and the thread.

You may be able to get the fees down towards 6% because you already have the planning permission.



ONQ.


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## slim jim (26 May 2010)

"Just in relation to that comment 'there are plenty of architects around...' above, as I mentioned in another post we met 3 last weekend as part of the Simon Open Door initiative and 1 of them (whom I would have thought was not that long established and looking for work) quoted 10% of the over all cost and the other who has only been in private practice for about a year (having been made redundant) said between 8 and 10%. The third who we would be most interested in retaining as he seemed the most practical and we were most in tune with, is a partner in a busy firm and said that percentage quotes were no longer feasible and it would depend on the brief and work done etc. Sorry ... what I am trying to say is that of those 3 the only one willing to move from what I think is the ridiculously high % scale was the busiest ... therefore I wonder if there are that amount of 'hungry' unemployed architects out there???"

I suppose it boils down to how much time you expect your architect to invest in your project and this in turn depends on what you value and what you expect your architect to do for you. If you are using an architect simply to get over the 'technical' humps such as planning, providing construction drawings, certifying etc.. then you can make this clear and seek out an architect who is willing to provide a 'bare bones' service.  On the other hand if you truly want the best out of an architect and see a value in someone taking the time to assess your needs and provide creative solutions then you must be willing to accept that this time invested has a value and is worth paying for. Like anything else in life it depends what you value. As someone in a well paying full-time job it annoys me when people are mercilessly beaten down on price when the are seen to be in a vulnerable position. i.e 'hungry' architects.  I get to hear about this all the time - my wife is one! - Shes on a two day week by the way....My advice?  Talk to a few architects, suss them out and see if they can offer what you want - most would be fairly willing to discuss the options if you are up-front with what you want out of the deal.


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## Brigid (26 May 2010)

Hi Slim Jim,

I am not looking for a 'cheap deal' and my point was that if architects are still charging a % of the build then maybe they do not realise that a lot of people cannot afford to pay it.  every one is being hit by the recession ... my husband too has been reduced to a 2 day week and I am a self employed person who doesnt know where my next pay cheque will come from. it has nothing to do with exploitation, it has to do with being realistic.  i got quoted 4850 plus VAT for specs and drawings.  I really like the architect  who quoted, and I think that we would benefit a lot from his insight and advice and I would have confidence in his advice, but that amount of money is just too much and we wont be in a position to pay it.  it is as simple as that.


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## onq (27 May 2010)

Brigid,

With respect, you ARE looking for a cheap deal, so come out and admit it.
I happen to sympathise a lot as I am in a similar position to you and the prospects for new work are bleak.
I don't know where we will be in another six months, since it looks like Greece has scuppered the EU recovery this year.

I do applaud you for considering using an architect, but at this point my life is full of clients who expect me to work for little or nothing.
As someone trying to put bread on my own table, I cannot really sympathise when you get what seems to be a reasonable fee for working with someone I would consider relativley high maintenance.

High-maintenance in client is not the same as in relationship terms - it means someone who asks endless questions, won't accept much of the advice offered in response and cannot seem to make a decision.
That's not intended as an insult - review the number of replies you have had  from me alone, never mind all the other good advice you have had here.
You can disagree with me, but of your 45 posts how many have been seeking alternatives to what you've already got done/been told/been quoted?

Q.E.D.

ONQ

[broken link removed]


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## Brigid (28 May 2010)

I do disagree with you!  unfortunately (or fortunately) I don't have the time or wish to analyse my 45 posts to disprove the conclusion to which you have arrived!


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## onq (28 May 2010)

Here are the six threads you've started:


_Why is Architect reluctant to give me CAD drawings? and architects' qualifications?_
_ how to increase attic space without increasing ridge height_
_ Meet an architect, 1 hour -€50.00_
_ Insulated Poroton single leaf build_
_ Who is better to supervise a once off build - an Engineer or Architect?_
_ If we seek to amend our planning permission..._
   Here are the 5 threads on building matters to which you've contributed:


_Looking for Architect ?_
_ Architects fees (cost per hour)_
_ Architect fee for house extension - Is this reasonable??_
_ Building new Home_
_ Window Manufacturers_
   Your comments in the above posts appear to:

(i) centre on finding cheap fees/complaining you can't get cheaper fees and 
(ii) confirm that you're still looking at making revisions after getting the permission.

Feel free to correct this view or put another gloss on it, but that's my understanding of your position.

ONQ.


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