# New speed camera vans being deployed from today



## briancbyrne (22 Sep 2008)

Reported today that New speed camera vans being deployed in accident blackspots throughout the country


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## theoneill (22 Sep 2008)

About time too, it's a pity there are not more around the country.

Is this part of the rollout of hundreds of detection units or have the government given up on that idea?


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## briancbyrne (22 Sep 2008)

as long as they are indeed deployed at the blackspots I couldnt agree more!


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## ubiquitous (22 Sep 2008)

briancbyrne said:


> as long as they are indeed deployed at the blackspots



Do you really think they will?


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## briancbyrne (22 Sep 2008)

ubiquitous said:


> Do you really think they will?


 

nope - but one can only hope that a sensible approach is taken and they arent found on such streches as the Ashbourne by pass !


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## theoneill (22 Sep 2008)

briancbyrne said:


> nope - but one can only hope that a sensible approach is taken and they arent found on such streches as the Ashbourne by pass !



I wouldn’t mind a camera or two on that bypass. In recent months I’ve seen cars planted on the roundabouts after crashing through the warning signs and increasing lengths of crash barrier seem to be getting crashed into. I would imagine anyone who will speed on a motorway wouldn’t have any problem speeding on any other road should they feel they would get away with it. Personally I’d be in favour of having speed cameras on the entrance and exit of every town. I can’t see it happening though.


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## Frank Zappa (22 Sep 2008)

This can only be good news for the construction industry.

We will need to construct big walls all over Ireland for these new stealth vans to hide behind.

Gone are the days when Plod the police biker simply hid behind a hedge.

Now with cutting edge technology vans they will be able to go undetected behind large stonewalls.

Everyone is a winner.

Beware of any new stonewalling projects in your town as it is sure to conceal Irelands latest tax collection vans.


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## gebbel (22 Sep 2008)

More details from the


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## z101 (22 Sep 2008)

The idea of these particular vans IS high visibility. They are to be as much a visual deterent as anything else. 

I agree with above - I hope they are in 'actual' blackspots and not shooting turkeys on the Portlaoise or Carlow bypass or where ever other piece of road in the country that actually allows you to pass a truck.


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## Frank Zappa (23 Sep 2008)

Here is the problem.

Where does the money for the fines go?

I believe it makes it's way to the Garda fund.

This is why you will never see vans like these parked in plain view.

Why do they need "Stealth Vans"?

Why not have huge Garda vans at the side of the road?

The simple reason is that there is NO MONEY to be had from being visible.


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## LennyBriscoe (23 Sep 2008)

Frank Zappa said:


> Here is the problem.
> 
> Where does the money for the fines go?
> 
> ...


 
The simple solution is keep the speed down and keep your MONEY in your pocket!


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## DavyJones (23 Sep 2008)

When I lived in the UK, they had signs up warning of cameras, fixed and mobile. If slowing people down is the idea then I am all up for overt operations.


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## deadwood (23 Sep 2008)

Frank Zappa said:


> I believe it makes it's way to the Garda fund.
> 
> This is why you will never see vans like these parked in plain view.


Those mortgages in Rathmines won't pay for themselves, you know!


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## starlite68 (23 Sep 2008)

Ceatharlach said:


> I agree with above - I hope they are in 'actual' blackspots and not shooting turkeys


 
you can bet your life they will be just shooting turkeys....thats where the handy money is!


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## Frank (23 Sep 2008)

If they want to raise money then don't have the commisioner on the telly saying they are doing it to discourage instead of catch people.

gardai hiding behind bus stops on a 60 KPH dual caiageway is a money making excercise.

And don't go preaching about staying under speed limits on roads that are clearly marked down to catch people.


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## sam h (23 Sep 2008)

They were on the M50, near the M1 roundabout....clocking the traffic going southbound.  I reckon that was like shooting fish in a barrell !


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## jown100 (25 Sep 2008)

Here is the problem, blah blah blah. 
The problem is that if people did not exceed speed limits, no fines would be incurred. They are not stealth vans; clearly marked and clearly visible vans will now be on patrol.
And speed limits are limits, not orders to drive at that speed or a little above it. Instead of blaming government/gardai/anyone else, isn't it about time, drivers took some responsibility for safe driving. This means staying within limits and following the rules of the road not because rules exist or drivers are afraid of getting caught, but because it actually would mean a reduction in unsafe driving, injuries and deaths. 
Perhaps if drivers took some responsibility, fewer traffic corps would be required. 
Though I am probably living in dreamland, expecting people to be responsible.


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## werner (25 Sep 2008)

briancbyrne said:


> as long as they are indeed deployed at the blackspots I couldnt agree more!


 
Blackspots?

Most developed country's engineer out of the road system any so called blackspots

Cash cameras Vans giving out fines do not impose road safety.

Sweden one of the most safety concious societies in Europe recently increased it's speed limits. It can do so because it recognises that speed is only a small factor in traffic accidents relative to poor driving standards

The standard of driving in Ireland is absymal

Instead of the Gardai doing their usual revenue collecting and doing nothing for road safety the money would have been better spent on ironing out any "blackspots" and employing more Traffic corps Gardai to enforce correct driving as well as training for learners before they get a licence


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## tinkerbell (25 Sep 2008)

Local authorites set the speed limits, the gardai enforce them and the motorists who speed recklessly endanger lives.   Most people caught speeding claim they never saw the speed zone signs.   If they didnt see them because of excess speed what other errors could they make?  Just look at traffic lights - how many cars speed through on red chancing their arm?   If they saw a Garda at the lights they wouldn't do that? If its such a money making racket putting speed detectors vans out who can come up with the figures please?   I for one would love to know how much is actually profit for the powers that be?  And I agree - driving standards here are appalling but dont go blaming the Gardai for that!!


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## Mers1 (26 Sep 2008)

They were on the N7 the other day just past Newlands Cross going South, a usual hotspot!!! Fish and Barrels.....

As an aside the woman in front of me practically stopped her car she braked so hard! and she wasnt even doing the speed..........


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## z103 (26 Sep 2008)

> Here is the problem, blah blah blah.
> The problem is that if people did not exceed speed limits, no fines would be incurred. They are not stealth vans; clearly marked and clearly visible vans will now be on patrol.
> And speed limits are limits, not orders to drive at that speed or a little above it. Instead of blaming government/gardai/anyone else, isn't it about time, drivers took some responsibility for safe driving. This means staying within limits and following the rules of the road not because rules exist or drivers are afraid of getting caught, but because it actually would mean a reduction in unsafe driving, injuries and deaths.
> Perhaps if drivers took some responsibility, fewer traffic corps would be required.
> Though I am probably living in dreamland, expecting people to be responsible.


Source?

I'd love to see the research that backs up your claims.


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## werner (26 Sep 2008)

tinkerbell said:


> Local authorites set the speed limits, the gardai enforce them and the motorists who speed recklessly endanger lives. Most people caught speeding claim they never saw the speed zone signs. If they didnt see them because of excess speed what other errors could they make? Just look at traffic lights - how many cars speed through on red chancing their arm? If they saw a Garda at the lights they wouldn't do that? If its such a money making racket putting speed detectors vans out who can come up with the figures please? I for one would love to know how much is actually profit for the powers that be? And I agree - driving standards here are appalling but dont go blaming the Gardai for that!!


 
As usual the Gardai are targeting the wrong people

Try cross-referencing the Garda and Courts Service tallies for penalty points with the National Roads Authority's, Road Accident Facts report. 

A massive 27 per cent of all penalty points were awarded to Dublin drivers. Given the presence of so many dangerous drivers, one would expect Dublin to have a similar share of fatal accidents. 

It doesn't. Just 13 per cent of fatal accidents were in Dublin. 

It amply demonstrates the waste of manpower and uselessness of targeting so called "speeding"

It removes the assumed correlation between the dangerous driving that attracts penalty points and the fatal accidents 

The vast bulk of penalty points are awarded for so called speeding. Thousands of people have been caught by speed cameras, or mobile Garda speed traps. The government's expensive road safety campaign revolves around the simple message that `speed kills'. 

According to the NRA, in 80 per cent of all fatal crashes no one was speeding! 

Not surprisingly as these are Revenue cameras, a large proportion of speed traps and cameras are on dual carriageways and motorways. But according to the NRA, a* minuscule 0.3 per cent of fatal accidents occur on these roads*.Some 86 per cent of fatal crashes happen on single carriageway roads. 

The NRA reports that when cars collide and people die, "improper overtaking" or "went to wrong side of road" was responsible far more than any other factor. 

And so when a motorist in low-accident Dublin does 45 miles an hour on a dual carriageway where the speed limit is 40, and gets a heavy fine and two points on the licence, he or she is absolutely correct in considering that what has happened is unfair, and perfectly right to feel resentful. 

Worst of all the Gardai are failing to tackle the real causes of fatal accidents and just raising revenue instead.

Here are some of the useless areas that are targeted

 Belfield Bridge, Dublin.The speed limit on the Stillorgan dual carriageway drops to a ridiculous 40 mph. Cars gather momentum as they go through the underpass, and gardai clock them as they emerge.

The Lucan bypass:A fixed GATSO speed camera installed opposite Spa Hotel on N4. Speed limit on dual carriageway is 40mph.The trap is located at the bottom of the slope on the westbound carriageway exiting Dublin.

Kilmacanogue to Glen of the Downs:Motorist are forced to crawl along at 40mph.Daring to exceed this limit carries risk of speed trap and penalty points.

Cork City: Dual carriageway (speed limit is 60mph) from Bishopstown roundabout heading towards Sarsfield roundabout . Coming upon Sarsfield roundabout one turns a bend and the speed limit drops from 60mph to 30mph and the gardai are frequently there with a speed gun.Worse still you may even get a few penalty points.​


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## Pique318 (26 Sep 2008)

Speeding kills...utter tosh ! INAPPROPRIATE speed can cause premature death. I can easily drive at 90mph on a mothrway in a 1L Fiesta or Micra and not kill anyone. However, if you drive at 50mph on numerous roads around the country, you are taking a massive chance.

Engineering the danger spots out of the roads is a very long term approach and the majority of roads are not included in these plans.

Donegal has a massive proportion of fatal accidents per head of population and where are the enforcements being placed ? Motorways. Yeah, it's all about prevention...pish!


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## ubiquitous (26 Sep 2008)

werner said:


> As usual the Gardai are targeting the wrong people
> 
> Try cross-referencing the Garda and Courts Service tallies for penalty points with the National Roads Authority's, Road Accident Facts report.
> ...




Well said. 
A contender for post of the year, imho


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## starlite68 (26 Sep 2008)

great post werner.


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## briancbyrne (30 Sep 2008)

got this from Boards.ie 


Just Heads up for the GATSO parked behind roadwork sign just after the M50 slip and before the airport exit its in the 80K wouldn't you know. I spotted it and slowed alright but i can see a pile up happening....so much for road safety 

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055387797

see pics above - 

If only they'd this much enthusiasm and creativity catching real criminals.


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## Caveat (30 Sep 2008)

Is it my imagination or are those posters who are most obsessed with speed cameras also the most likely to have accrued penalty points?


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## briancbyrne (30 Sep 2008)

Caveat said:


> Is it my imagination or are those posters who are most obsessed with speed cameras also the most likely to have accrued penalty points?


 
reasoning????? - From what I can gather from the posts above, the "obsession" ( I would use the term "concern" ) is that these new vans would be used in areas which are relatively safe, (with regards to the amount of accidents in that stretch of road) rather than in true accident blackspots


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## Caveat (30 Sep 2008)

Not necessarily directed at at the above posts, it was a general comment and this thread seemed as appropriate a place as any to make it.

I understand and accept that there are common sense issues regarding speed cameras and enforcement, but just do a search based on speed cameras and see who is objecting the most. Then do a search on penalty points and see who has them.

Are these all just 'concerned' citizens or maybe just habitual speeders who hate getting caught?


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## starlite68 (30 Sep 2008)

i would say mostly citizens who would like to see their tax money put to better use!


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## LennyBriscoe (30 Sep 2008)

starlite68 said:


> i would say mostly citizens who would like to see their tax money put to better use!


 
I cant see any better method to improve road safety. Speed restrictions are there for a reason, stick to them and you ill have no problem with the cameras...

Advertisements on tv just dont cut the mustard!

Maybe we should have a declaration of penalty points on this thread?!!


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## starlite68 (30 Sep 2008)

LennyBriscoe said:


> I cant see any better method to improve road safety. Speed restrictions are there for a reason, stick to them and you ill have no problem with the cameras...


in an ideal world maybe...also speed cameras and vans dont really work for very long..people who are on the road every day just get to know where they are and spread the word


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## ubiquitous (30 Sep 2008)

LennyBriscoe said:


> I cant see any better method to improve road safety. Speed restrictions are there for a reason,



If only. Some speed restrictions are highly debatable, for example the change of limit from 100kph to 80kph on the old N4 between Kilcock and Kinnegad, which many people suspect as being merely an "incentive" to use the M4 toll road. Another is the 50kph limit on the Ratoath-Kilbride-Hollystown road which miraculously *increases* to 60kph once once reaches the built-up area around Hollystown 


LennyBriscoe said:


> Advertisements on tv just dont cut the mustard!



You're right there. I would go so far as to suggest that some of them even glamourise speeding in some people's eyes.


LennyBriscoe said:


> Maybe we should have a declaration of penalty points on this thread?!!


Fair enough. Zero in my case. What about yourself?


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## LennyBriscoe (30 Sep 2008)

Zero also...

Then again I live in a rural area far from 40KM speed zones!!


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## Caveat (30 Sep 2008)

A zero for me too BTW. Nor have I ever been stopped for speeding for that matter.


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## theoneill (30 Sep 2008)

I'm on zero too, though I was caught for speeding just before the points system came into force, the UCD underpass of all places. Since then I've moved into the safety of the countryside  but many of the roads around me have been marked out for special attention due to the high rate of crashes, however in four years I have yet to see a single speed trap on them.

That said I am all for the strict enforcement of road traffic laws, the standard of driving in this country is appalling.


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## starlite68 (1 Oct 2008)

werner said:


> The standard of driving in Ireland is absymal


 
believe it or not..a report carried out about a year ago,i think by insurance companies...showed that we are no better or no worse that other countries in europe....so perhaps we should not be too hard on ourselves.
if you really want to see bad driveing go to italy!


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## QED (1 Oct 2008)

werner said:


> As usual the Gardai are targeting the wrong people
> 
> Try cross-referencing the Garda and Courts Service tallies for penalty points with the National Roads Authority's, Road Accident Facts report.
> 
> ...


 
Maybe the enforcement (and issuing of penalty points) is the REASON for the lower fatalities ????


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## getagrip (8 Dec 2008)

Here's a thought .........................

There has to be 3 fatal accidents in the area for a fixed camera to be installed there, and its not a secret where the cameras are, you are _supposed_ to see them so you will slow down in this dangerous area, although I would agree that you cant sometimes !!

There are also different departments within the police too, for those of you who suggest that the traffic cops catch _real _criminals instead of doing the job they're assigned to, there are actual police officers who deal with the _real criminals _so that the traffic corps can do their job and make the roads safer for everyone, including the drivers who seem to be in a hurry all the time.

I'm not a police officer or a civilian worker just some-one who has worked in this environment previously and seen the consequences of what reckess driving can do, the same old opinion of "it wont happen to me" is silly because although you may be in control of your own car and what you can do with it, you dont know what the car in front or beside you is or isnt capable of !!!!! 

Just thought I's put the thought forward !!

Regards


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