# Advise on renting out home



## Mrmr (13 May 2017)

Hi, Can anyone offer advise on the following

We are considering renting out our PPR/ home and moving to a bigger place.
We want to rent 3 rooms to individual people, and also retain a room for ourselves/storage, and also the right to be in and out of the place. We would be in effect live in landlords retaining the rights to the house, but not actually living there. 

For tax purposes we would register for income tax on the income, as our actual PPR would be a different house. We would not be registering with the PTRB as we are subletting rooms & retaining space in our house. 

I know I need a solicitor and accountant, are there any other 2nd property liabilities? Does that all sound OK, have a missed any significant problems I could cause tax or legally?


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## landlord (13 May 2017)

Are you looking to retain a room to take advantage of the rent a room scheme?  Obviously there are huge tax benefits in availing of this scheme,  however I do not believe simply retaining a room with your possessions will qualify you for this scheme considering you will be living somewhere else. 
I suggest you look at some of the key posts here regarding the many issues associated with becoming a landlord.


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## Mrmr (13 May 2017)

No, as I said we'll pay tax, I understand that. I don't want to be a PTRB landlord with all the problems that brings though.

For us it's to retain some space and say in the house, and run it as a sublet rather than rent whole house?


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## SirMille (14 May 2017)

landlord said:


> Are you looking to retain a room to take advantage of the rent a room scheme?  Obviously there are huge tax benefits in availing of this scheme,  however I do not believe simply retaining a room with your possessions will qualify you for this scheme considering you will be living somewhere else.
> I suggest you look at some of the key posts here regarding the many issues associated with becoming a landlord.


Wouldn't it be hard to prove he lives elsewhere?


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## Bronte (14 May 2017)

Oh dear, what a post.

My advice to OP is for her to re read her last sentence. And grow up.


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## torblednam (14 May 2017)

SirMille said:


> Wouldn't it be hard to prove he lives elsewhere?



No it wouldn't.

Not if his and his spouse's / partner's PPSN's are linked to a PRTB tenancy on another property.

Not if there are utilities or services in their name(s) at the other property.

Not if they've got valid motor insurance I.e. they've answered the "where is  your car kept overnight?" question honestly.

Not if they've got kids, which would seem likely, since OP says they're looking to let out a 4-bedroom house to move to something bigger...


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## Gordon Gekko (14 May 2017)

It's an interesting question.

The OP isn't trying to evade tax. 

The question is more whether it is possible to implement 'rent a room' style licence arrangements on the basis that the landlord will be there from time to time.


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## SirMille (14 May 2017)

Exactly Gordon, he also wants to keep control of his house, which is reasonable given the loopy legislation.


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## delfio (14 May 2017)

I am sure I read in another thread that this is not possible, the property has to be your PPR. Best contact the Tenancy bord for advice.


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## Gordon Gekko (14 May 2017)

I'm reminded of a time my Dad's tax advisors found a loophole that would save a nice few quid; only problem was my folks would have to separate. That went down well...


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## Brendan Burgess (14 May 2017)

Gordon Gekko said:


> I'm reminded of a time my Dad's tax advisors found a loophole that would save a nice few quid; only problem was my folks would have to separate. That went down well...



That is brilliant. 

Could be as good a reason as any. 

Brendan


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## Gordon Gekko (14 May 2017)

Brendan Burgess said:


> That is brilliant.
> 
> Could be as good a reason as any.
> 
> Brendan



Tax advisors can be law unto themselves!


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## Mrmr (14 May 2017)

Bronte, what is the problem? I want to retain a say in my house, and also some storage to make our move less stressful. I don't think there's any need for such a comment.

Again, we will pay income tax, register the leases and have 2-3 licensees as well as retaining a share. Any pitfalls or problems based on that?


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## SirMille (14 May 2017)

Brendan Burgess said:


> That is brilliant.
> 
> Could be as good a reason as any.
> 
> Brendan


The Swiss separate on paper for more advantageous tax


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## SirMille (14 May 2017)

torblednam said:


> No it wouldn't.
> 
> Not if his and his spouse's / partner's PPSN's are linked to a PRTB tenancy on another property.
> 
> ...


What if he keeps the leccy bill in his name?


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## Bronte (15 May 2017)

Mrmr said:


> Bronte, what is the problem? I want to retain a say in my house, and also some storage to make our move less stressful. I don't think there's any need for such a comment.
> 
> Again, we will pay income tax, register the leases and have 2-3 licensees as well as retaining a share. Any pitfalls or problems based on that?



I think the PRTB will not agree that you don't register with them.  You're for some reason that I don't understand trying to avoid do your obligation as regards being a landlord with tenants.  And one of those obligations is to register tenancies with the PRTB.

Do you have a mortgage on the property?

Why don't you run this idea of yours by the PRTB and see how you get on.

Why do you need storage space if your moving to a bigger place?


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## Mrmr (15 May 2017)

If theres an obligation to register thats fine too, what I don't want is to hand the house over to be wrecked. Ive read enough nightmare stories. I'll read the PTRB site closer.
The mortgage, it looks like, would need to be cleared or changed to a BTL rate.
Additional storage is always helpful and would make the move less stressful.

The only thing I'm looking to avoid is a nightmare with rent payments or tenants.


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## T McGibney (15 May 2017)

Bronte said:


> I think the PRTB will not agree that you don't register with them.


I wouldn't be taking their word for it - after all they have a direct vested interest in advising people to register and pay fees to them.

The OP should closely scrutinise the relevant legislation, with the benefit of legal advice if they want or need certainty or just reassurance.

I'm sure there are ways around the legislation. 

A few friends lived for a few years in a house dressed up as a "bed and breakfast" in late 1980s London.

The house was consequently stripped of cooking facilities - they used boil spuds in a kettle  and there were good chippers nearby - but it was cheap and presumably suited the landlord.


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## Bronte (16 May 2017)

You can't write off mortgage interest on rental income if you're not registed with the PRTB.  And the PRTB have given big fines to people who don't register. 

Anyway I await the legal advice and if that works we can all do what you're at. 

The OP would be better off saying nothing to the mortgage company and risking their mortgage rate changing to a high BTL rate.  But they most certainly need to inform their house insurance company.


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## Bronte (16 May 2017)

T McGibney said:


> I wouldn't be taking their word for it - after all they have a direct vested interest in advising people to register and pay fees to them.
> 
> .



Nevertheless it would be helpful to hear what they say and it would be exceedingly helpful if the tenant's complain to the PRTB about the landlord/non landlord popping in without notice.


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## T McGibney (16 May 2017)

Bronte said:


> Nevertheless it would be helpful to hear what they say and it would be exceedingly helpful if the tenant's complain to the PRTB about the landlord/non landlord popping in without notice.


Only as "helpful" as many naive posters find when they ring Revenue or other state institutions and are given misleading "advice" that is designed to suit the institution and frustrate the person making the enquiry.


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## Gordon Gekko (16 May 2017)

T McGibney said:


> Only as "helpful" as many naive posters find when they ring Revenue or other state institutions and are given misleading "advice" that is designed to suit the institution and frustrate the person making the enquiry.



+1

If I'd €1 for every time I've heard of Revenue giving bogus information to taxpayers, I'd be a happy person.


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## HipHip (16 May 2017)

I am interested in this...  

My house is mortgaged with tracker;  I remarried in 2015, my spouse has their own property approx 20 miles away, currently rented out since 2014 with no mortgage.  We rented her house because my bank refused to allow me keep my tracker if I rent my house out.

However my spouse wants to move back to her home, as her elderly aunt who lives a few doors away needs full-time support and care, she is taking leave from her job to become her Aunt's carer. We will give the tenants plenty of notice etc. 

But our problem is my eldest son who is refusing to move with us.  He is in college and working part-time our house is more practical for him to attend college and his job.  We were thinking of renting out two rooms, with my son taking the other room, as we cannot afford to be paying bills etc on both houses on one income.

Can we do this?


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## SirMille (16 May 2017)

Refusing? He has no chips.


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## SqueezedMiddle (1 Jun 2017)

Op why not just let it on airbnb?
Or even Monday to Friday. And airbnb it on Saturday and Sunday.
Probably lots of ways to skin this particular cat.
Anything to avoid involving the RTB and conventional letting where the landlord has no rights and basically hands over the property to a tenant who may or may not pay you rent for a few years.
Same thing to HipHip.


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