# Moving in with wife's mother



## samfarrell (18 Dec 2013)

My wifes elderly mother is living on her own in a large house in Dublin. My wife wants to move into the house so she can look after her mother at home rather than going to a nursing home. We own our own home which we had thought about renting out. Our own family is growing and tbh our own house is getting small for our needs so the proposed move would be beneficial to us also
My wifes grandmother left the main house to her daughter (my mother in law) as a life legatee and named her three grandchildren (one being my wife) to inherit the house equally. My wifes siblings do not currently live in the house with the mother, but they do have their rooms still there, which they would be giving up
My obvious concern is that we dont own the house so making it a family home might be risky as in all likelihood one day we will have to leave it, we arent really in a position to buy out the others share. The other siblings have agreed that it would be good if we move in but obviously I am worried that situations change and we could find ourselves in a difficult position one day
Just wondering if people had done something like this before, or how it could be agreed upon realistically ?


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## STEINER (18 Dec 2013)

I lived with my elderly MIL temporarily for a year while we decided what/where to buy/build.  It wasn't the worst, but it wasn't ideal, TBH towards the end I couldn't wait to get my own place.  She was ok from an independence viewpoint and managed to live at home for several years after we bought our own place.

When you say your wife can look after your MIL at home, what does this entail, what are your MIL's needs from a care point of view?  I have a relative in a nursing home because the 24/7 needs cannot be met at home either by family or care workers and I understand how difficult it can be emotionally, physically and financially to do what is best for everyone.

The aspiration is to move in and be in a position financially to buy the other 2 sibling's shares in the future.  You need to look at the figures involved.  How much is your house worth? How much is the large house worth etc?  Does your wife work outside the home?  Will she survive on Carer's Allowance?  What assets does your MIL have, can she gift/will any cash to your wife to help her acquire the house upon her passing?

The other siblings agree it would be a good idea to move in.  From their point of view, Mother is not in a nursing home, but at the same time your wife is doing all the caring and they could sing a different tune when MIL passes.  You don't want your wife to be shafted when they inherit their 1/3 shares.


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## Dermot (18 Dec 2013)

I think STEINER's post is very good and I can appreciate that the post comes from a real experience.  
I have been there to a point when both of my elderly parents needed a lot of care in the home. They died within a short time of one another but for a period of almost 2 years my brother/sister and myself cared for them. We all were in jobs as well and even though the three of us worked as a unit it was very demanding. Our parents wish was to die at home which we were able to facilitate.  We all found it demanding but for the fact that we all done our share none of us would have appreciated how much work was involved.
A lot depends on the needs of your MIL.  It could be 24/7.  Be prepared for your work not being fully appreciated by your SIL's.
Every situation is unique and hard to give specific advice. Good luck to you all.


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## Guns N Roses (18 Dec 2013)

I would consider drafting up a written agreement between your wife and her siblings setting out the terms of the agreement in order to avoid any rows in the future.

Some things to consider will be:

- will your family be paying rent while you're living in your MIL's home?

- will your family be paying for maintenance of the property while you reside there?

- will your wife's siblings be paying your wife for her caring duties and any medical expenses?

- what happens when your MIL finally passes away ie. do you leave the house?

- are the siblings willing to give up their claim in exchange for your family taking on the financial burdeon of caring for your MIL?


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## meathman (18 Dec 2013)

I would think very carefully about this. living in someones elses home means adapting to their routine. While that might be easier for your wife who has grown up in the house it will be more difficult for you and your children. Everything from children having friends over to the house to the noise they are making may become issues.
Your wifes other siblings will still feel like its their house (having grown up there) and may come and go as they please while you feel you have to ask permission to make small changes. 
Also the health of your Mum in law will only deteriorate. This will create difficulties if you are the main carers. You may find it impossible to take a holiday or leave her for even a few hours in the house. 
Finally your Mum in law will qualify for a better home care package if she is living alone. This combined with support from her children may be a better quality of life for her. Sorry to be negative but I would put my own children first in this situation. While wanting to help this lady is a nice Isentiment, I think moving in with her is going too far. As for the bigger house, I would take being happy with my own family in a smaller house without the extra stress anytime.


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## Brendan Burgess (19 Dec 2013)

Some very complicated family, legal and financial issues here. 

At its simplest, if you move into your MIL's home and rent out your own, it is a very reversible decision. If your MIL needs to move into a nursing home, you still have that option. If it interferes with your family relationships, which are the most important, you can move out and then let the 3 siblings get involved again. 


It might work well financially. You will be better off by the net rent after tax and costs. I assume that you will not be paying any rent to the MIL, and of course, this should be put down in writing now with the siblings. 

The beauty about moving in and keeping your own home is that is reversible.  And for that reason, I think you should try this approach to see how it works, before doing anything more permanent. 

You could buy out your sibling's interest in the home now. If the house is worth €300k without a life tenancy, you could discount their share to €50k each cash now.  Of course, you would not have to pay cash now. You could buy their share with payment deferred until you can afford it. Which could be when your mother dies and you can then remortgage the property. 

The problem with this is what happens if your mother has to move into a nursing home. She may simply refuse to vacate a house in which she has a right to live. 


An alternative would be that your mother gives up her right to live in the house. Then you can sell the house. Use the proceeds to buy a house with a granny flat attached.  I have seen this done and it caused huge rows. The son who had committed to minding his mother, changed his mind after a few years and shipped her off to the sister, having got a fine house in the process. The family split down the middle and the two sides are not talking.

There is no easy answer, which is why I suggest the reversible option.


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## samfarrell (19 Dec 2013)

STEINER said:


> I lived with my elderly MIL temporarily for a year while we decided what/where to buy/build.  It wasn't the worst, but it wasn't ideal, TBH towards the end I couldn't wait to get my own place.  She was ok from an independence viewpoint and managed to live at home for several years after we bought our own place.
> 
> When you say your wife can look after your MIL at home, what does this entail, what are your MIL's needs from a care point of view?  I have a relative in a nursing home because the 24/7 needs cannot be met at home either by family or care workers and I understand how difficult it can be emotionally, physically and financially to do what is best for everyone.
> 
> ...



Thanks. At the moment my MIL does not require constant care. However her mobility is deterioating and she is finding it increasing difficult to get around. Caring for her at the monent would not be too bad, she is actually able to manage by herself with some small assistance but I guess soon enough she wont be. In terms of the house value her house is worth quite a bit while ours isnt worth so much. As someone pointed out we have the idea of renting out our own house so that if things didnt work out we can always go back there. I am not sure we would ever be in a position financially to buy out the other siblings, which is the worrying part for me right now


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## Black Sheep (20 Dec 2013)

Is it not possible for the other siblings to share the caring. They will never appreciate what carers do unless they take their share.

We (3 of us, not all the family members) shared the caring of our Mum. She moved to each house every 5 or 6 months. She was quite mobile and did not require a lot of care but someone needed to be in the house at all times. Only in the last few months did she need more care.

While this is not a solution for many situations it worked for us


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## Sue Ellen (21 Dec 2013)

Be very careful about doing anything with MIL's house i.e. selling or change of ownership etc. as this can have a major affect on Fair Deal application.  Nursing homes are very expensive places.


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## Brendan Burgess (21 Dec 2013)

Hi Sue

I am not sure that the house belongs to the MIL? 


> My wifes grandmother left the main house to her daughter (my mother in  law) as a life legatee and named her three grandchildren (one being my  wife) to inherit the house equally.


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## Sue Ellen (21 Dec 2013)

Brendan Burgess said:


> Hi Sue
> 
> I am not sure that the house belongs to the MIL?



Think you're right Brendan.  Had seen that the other day but did not read back over the post to refresh my memory when replying  

Presumably for Fair Deal purposes a 'life legatee' does not suffer any financial commitment - anyone able to comment on this aspect?


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## irishmoss (21 Dec 2013)

It's a big step moving in with your MIL and taking care of her. From a financial point of view you would gain your rent from your current house which would be taxable. You will have to take into account wear and tear as you most likely won't get it back in the condition you rented. 
You don't know how long you will be living with MIL. With the best will in the world your wife may not physically be able to take care of her, life can throw many curve balls.
It sounds as if you would love to own your MIL house but it is out of reach financially now and in the future. If it was me I would let go the dream, the other two sisters need to do their share. Your wife could do all the caring in the world for your mother but nothing can change the inheritance. Your wife will left her one third share but nothing more.


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