# Merchantable Quality? Lawnmower pouring smoke.



## OIAM (22 Jul 2006)

We bought a lawnmower at B&Q Swords on 20/6/05. Albeit late (due to holidays)I brought it back to B&Q today 21/7/06 & explained that while we were away our daughter was mowing & it began to pour smoke from the underside. She contacted myself & I asked her to leave it until my return last Sunday. When I examined it there was nothing blocking the underside & indeed when I turned it on, it billowed smoke. B&Q's only concern was that the warrenty was out of date,true... (I was unable to fly home to get same), They said that having contacted the Irish Agents the reply from them was "absolutly not". The duty manager at B&Q confirmed that was what his collegue was told & his reply was the same. I think any electrical product which is just a year old,obviously overheating & so becomes a hazzard requires someones attention. Is the cost the primary concern or would any reputable supplier be interested to find out what the problem was with a relatively new item. 
Costing e149 I reckon we must have used it about 20 times given that 6 months of the year it is idle. Is it merchantable quality? Consider the Sale of Goods Act > Goods must be of _merchantable quality_ – goods should be of reasonable quality taking into account what they are meant to do, their durability and their price<
I did not receive any other advice from B&Q as to repair of the mower at a charge. 
I would appreciate your comments.

PS. A sales assistant commented that Irish Consumer Law did not apply to them as they are an English Company!  Honest!!


----------



## CCOVICH (22 Jul 2006)

*Re: Merchantable Quality?*

Have you talked to the [broken link removed] on the matter?


----------



## OIAM (22 Jul 2006)

*Re: Merchantable Quality?*

Thanks for the link CCOVICH!


----------



## OIAM (8 Aug 2006)

*Re: Merchantable Quality?*

I decided to return to B&Q & asked to see the store manager, whom I was informed was on holidays. OK fine, can I see whoever is in charge in his absence, 'sure'. I spent 20mins waiting while they paged & searched 
for the manager. It happens, no probs I'll call back in the morning. Next day, they're at a meet after another 20 min search. Ok, whats the store number i'll ring? Nobody knows??  Eventually somebody gets it from their mobile. 
Later I ring the manager & after a discussion of the above problem re my lawnmower they agree something must be done! 'I would not accept it myself' was the managers remark. I'm advised 'leave it with me until friday' (last friday). 'We have an internal process to do here but dont worry we will look after you & sorry for your trouble'. 
Alas, friday comes & with no contact I ring the manager. 'Sorry they are not here today its their day off' 
Saturday - with no call I ring & its the manager who answers, I enquire politely as to why their promised callback on friday did not happen & am taken aback by the reply that they promised no such thing. 'I am not the person in charge of the lawnmower section a message was left for that manager who is not due in until monday'. We have your number upstairs & they will ring you then. As it turns out the manager they named is the original duty manager who agreed that I would 'absolutely not' get any repair or replacement. Monday - no callback!

I notice there is no in-store customer service counter - just a counter with a RETURNS sign on the left as you enter the store. This area appears to be not specifically manned & missing anyone in authority, on my visits I found myself explaining to two separate inexeperienced workers.

Am I wasting my time & effort with them?

Is this buck passing or what? (I was advised by someone in the know that this is common) 

Should I continue until they grind me down & I perhaps 'go away' which I now believe is their 'process'?  (again 'in the know' tells me this is the 'process'). 

or

*Should I take them to the small claims court?*

and if so

can I claim any expenses for doing so, 15.00 fee for taking the case. 



Any thoughts or advice welcome!


----------



## Grizzly (8 Aug 2006)

*Re: Merchantable Quality?*

LONDON (AFX) - Kingfisher PLC, Europe's largest home improvement retailer, said underlying sales at its B&Q chain in the UK continued to fall in its second quarter but at a slower rate than the previous quarter. 
For the 11 weeks to July 15 (the bulk of the group's second quarter) B&Q's like-for-like sales were down 2.4 pct -- a performance better than some analysts had been expecting and a sharp improvement on the first quarter fall of 8.8 pct. 
B&Q's second quarter gross margin was predicted to be similar to the same quarter last year, having been down 300 basis points in the first quarter. 
Gerry Murphy, Kingfisher's chief executive, welcomed "early signs of progress at B&Q in the UK despite a continuing weak consumer market for home improvement." 
In France the group's Castorama chain saw like-for-like sales increase 0.5 pct, while like-for-likes at Brico Depot were up 2.5 pct. 
Kingfisher shares closed Wednesday at 236-1/2 pence, valuing the business at 5.57 bln stg. newsdesk@afxnews.com jdd/gp

No wonder this company is having problems. Maybe contact their headoffice through www.kingfisher.com


----------



## Superman (8 Aug 2006)

*Re: Merchantable Quality?*

You have no rights under the merchantable quality issue in the Sale of Goods Act, as you kept the product too long.  
Will write more later if I've time.


----------



## MB05 (8 Aug 2006)

*Re: Merchantable Quality?*

I saw a clip from the best of Ireland AM over the weekend and they had some guy on that was promoting a book on the consumer rights.  He said  a common mistake people make is assuming goods can no longer be repaired/replaced/refunded after the initial warranty period is up.  He said products can be returned for up to 6 years afterwards as long as you have proof of purchase.  He siad it all came down to what is reasonable.  How long could you reasonably expect a product to last, in your case how long should you expect the lawnmower to last.  I would expect it to last a lot longer than 13 month's.  If you paid €30 for it I would say fare enough you got what you paid for but you should expect to get 4-5 years out of a decent lawnmower.

As for them being an English company so Irish law doesn't apply to them, pure rubbish.  If you live or trade in a country you have to uphold the laws of that country.  A lot of our laws come from old English one's.  Our laws are very similar so I would bet money on England having similar consumer laws to us.

Try to get some info from the ODCA website relating to the above or ring them and ask them.  I'm sure they would be delighted to hear that they have no jurisdiction over B&Q as they are an English company!!


----------



## OIAM (8 Aug 2006)

*Re: Merchantable Quality?*

Thanks for the Kingfisher link Grizzly, have sent them an email basically asking for someone to intervene & make a decision yeah or neigh. 

I am interested to hear further on Superman's point 'You have no rights under the merchantable quality issue in the Sale of Goods Act, as you kept the product too long'.

The lawnmower I had for just over 12 months & to quote the *Sale of Goods and Supply of Services Act, 1980*. *Your rights when things go wrong. *Para 1*. *'If goods are not of merchantable quality or are not fit for their purpose or are not as described the consumer is entitled to a remedy'. Additionally, *FAQ.* *Goods and Services, 1: Goods, What are the main rights a consumer has when buying goods? *'A consumer has the right when buying goods to expect that; The goods are of merchantable quality (i.e. goods are of an acceptable standard).' (this is my beef, I have been advised that it is not worth repairing due to cost versus new, its 12 months old, scrap value, it is not what I expected when I bought it or indeed I suggest anyone would expect, therefore it is not standard or acceptable. 

Act; Para 3.'If the goods have been used for some time, or if there is undue delay in making the complaint, or if there is reason to believe that the goods have been accepted, the consumer's entitlement, at best, may be to a repair or to a partial refund.' (Nowhere in this act can I find mention of relinquishing my rights because I keep the product too long). If anybody finds mention I stand corrected.

Para 4.'There are no hard and fast rules as each case has to be considered on its merits.'

MB05 made another valid point which is mentioned in the act under Goods & Services; Para 9: *Five years after purchasing a suite of furniture, the frame collapses but shop refuses to do anything on the basis that it is five years old. *'The "statute of limitation" (limit of time in which a case can be brought to court) with regard to the Sale of Goods and Supply of Services Act is six years. Consumer may have a case, but as the circumstances of each case will be different, only a Court can make a decision in such a case.' 

As for the Sales assistant stupid comment, well this is what I’m up against, I mean the lady was called by another assistant to listen to my grievance and her first remark is that 'Irish Consumer Law did not apply to them as they are an English Company'! When I challenged this she goes off & when she returns says she rang the Irish agents who answered 'absolutely not' a manager who was called has a short conversation with her before he approaches me & tells me what she was told by the agents and that his reply is the same. The manager was obviously not aware that it is the sellers responsibility not the agents as I discovered later from the ODCA website. 
Act Para 8: *A shop insists that consumer deals with the Manufacturer of goods which turn out to be faulty? *
'The consumer's contract is always with the seller of the goods.'
'In this case, if the consumer paid money to the retailer, contract is with the retailer and it is up to the retailer to deal with the situation.'


----------



## OIAM (13 Aug 2006)

*Re: Merchantable Quality? Patiently Not!*

I contacted Kingfisher through the link provided by Grizzly (many thanks Grizz!). They put me in contact with B&Q CS UK who in turn requested an explanation from B&Q Swords (or so I’m told). Anyway in the blink of an eye lo & behold I received a full refund having been given a choice of this or a new lawnmower. 
While I’m waiting at the store the original plonker of a sales assistant who made the comment 'Irish Consumer Law did not apply to us we're an English Company' appears, she looks at the lawnmower that's being returned & say's of it 'There's parts missing off that, where's the grass box!' 
Indeed people, now *WHERE* *IS* *THE GRASSBOX? *ANSWERS ON A POSTCARD PLEASE! or Let me explain! Well on this common gardiner lawnmower you (she) sell (s), day in -day out and is supposed to 'KNOW' in case some customer (desperate) might ask and you (she, again) w i l l l o o k s t u p i d (as she now looks) if you go looking for the grass box somewhere where it isn’t, 'I T' S I N S I D E' 
'see' in there -
It's a Vision Window but it doesn’t work off an Aerial!
No, guaranteed not a Tele! Deffo!
It dosen't turn green because of bad colour either!
Won't be able to see Corry on it! (I know, you've tried) 
O K!!
G o t I t N o w!!! 
I don’t think she does,not of an acceptable standard or dare I say, Merchantable Quality!


----------



## ClubMan (13 Aug 2006)

*Re: Merchantable Quality?*

Your posts are making less and less sense as this thread progresses. Might be an idea to state your feedback/queries more concisely and clearly so that people can provide useful feedback.


----------



## Bongo (15 Aug 2006)

*Re: Merchantable Quality?*

My sister is in a similar situation.  Bought a 37" Phillips Plasma TV in Dec 04 for €2,500 from DID, which packed up this week.  12 Months manufacturer warranty has expired & nobody wants to know.

Found two useful links:
[broken link removed]
http://www.eccdublin.ie/index.html

EU consumer centre advised warranty is irrelevant.  Sales of goods act covers you for 6 years & your redress is with the retailer. not the manufacturer!!!


----------



## Humpback (16 Aug 2006)

*Re: Merchantable Quality?*



Bongo said:


> My sister is in a similar situation. Bought a 37" Phillips Plasma TV in Dec 04 for €2,500 from DID, which packed up this week.


 
That'll teach her by plasma instead of LCD


----------



## Retail Mngr (16 Aug 2006)

*Re: Merchantable Quality?*

Hi OIAM

"at the store the original plonker of a sales assistant"

When you were in B&Q did anyone call you a plonker? What on earth gives you the right to call a member of my staff a plonker? 

If you have an issue with this member of staff why did you not raise it while you were dealing with me in store? 

Regards 

A Retail Manager


----------



## OIAM (19 Aug 2006)

*Re: Merchantable Quality?*

Hi Retail Manager



> If you have an issue with this member of staff why did you not raise it while you were dealing with me in store?


 
You say I was dealing with you? I did not know whom I was dealing with; the manager I asked for certainly did not deal with me, as you well know! You were told that I was there to see you but choose to leave the issue of the credit to someone else, correct? 




> When you were in B&Q did anyone call you a plonker?


 
Yes there was an attempt to make me feel like a 'plonker' what I did not mention in my previous post is that the receipt was taken off me by the person (knowing full well that it was being dealt with by you - I told her so) & she restated her previous assertion that "This is out of date" Quite deliberate in front of a witness.

Sincerely 
OIAM

PS - A latter email was received from the manufacturer briefly -

'We were sorry to learn of the failure of your Husqvarna product, but as you may appreciate, without examining the unit, it is rather difficult to comment on the cause.
Would you please leave the complete machine in the possession of your local Husqvarna Service Repairer who should be requested to examine the machine and supply a report, showing all parts and relevant part numbers required for the repair, the cause of failure and the labour charge to be made for the repair. Would you then send the report to us with a covering letter advising the date on which the machine was purchased and also receipts relating to any repairs which may have been carried out previously.'


----------



## Marion (20 Aug 2006)

In fairness, I think the information requested by the company is reasonable

OIAM, it would be in your best interests to comply  with the information required.

Marion


----------



## z107 (20 Aug 2006)

One of the main drawbacks with dealing with such companies (Argos, B&Q etc...) is that there is no real accountability. The 'manager' will always have to check back with head office - usually over in the UK, where the money goes.

I prefer dealing with independently owned retailers, where you can really speak to the boss.


----------



## Guest107 (20 Aug 2006)

I find Argos CS is better than B&Q anyday.

email the MD if there is a problem, here



[broken link removed]

or

[broken link removed]


----------

