# New free market think tank launched - The Hibernia Forum



## Brendan Burgess (5 Oct 2015)

About time we had some group to challenge the left wing viewpoint in Ireland. 

The Hibernia Forum is an independent advocacy group dedicated to the principles of a free market, individual liberty and responsible and prudent Government. It seeks to build on the natural entrepreneurial instincts of Ireland and its open and progressive economic atmosphere, and attraction to foreign inward investment.

Specifically, the Hibernia Forum calls for a restraint and accountability in Government spending, reasonable and fair taxation, as well as support for small business and entrepreneurs. The Forum seeks to enhance the competitive atmosphere in which both smaller and larger employers and job creators can operate.

Most of all, the Hibernia Forum calls for honest and fact-driven debate about our society and economic situation and a balancing of the public discussion in favour of those who do not believe that a high-spending State is the solution to all our problems.

The aims of the Hibernia Forum are:


Prudent and responsible Government spending
A free and supportive atmosphere in which enterprise and commerce can flourish
Reduced taxation
Greater personal responsibility, as opposed to reliance on the State
Greater efficiency in Government operations and services
More honesty in public debate
Greater civic involvement in political decision-making
Support for Ireland’s low corporate rate, and the conditions which make the country  competitive and attractive to foreign direct investment.
Support for the reform of our welfare system, and for the encouragement of people to  return to the workforce, where possible.
The executive Director of the Forum is *Eamon Delaney. * He is an author, commentator and former diplomat.

The Chairman of the Forum is *Cormac Lucey.* He is an accountant, commentator and former Government adviser.

The Forum has a further founding group of other individuals.  They are all passionate about the Forum’s ideas and principles and represent a cross section of Irish economic and political life. These are as follows:


*Aidan Brophy*, real estate surveyor and former National Executive member of Fianna Fail.
*Joe Lawlor*, equity analyst/investor and member of Fine Gael.
*Aaron McKenna*, businessman and commentator.
*Conor McWade*, businessman, former member of the Progressive Democrats, now a member of Fine Gael.
*Keith Redmond*, dentist and small business owner. Fingal County Councillor (Fine Gael).
*Sarah Ryan*, businesswoman and former Dublin City Councillor (Fianna Fáil).


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## Sunny (5 Oct 2015)

Free market with supports for small businesses and entrepreneurs? So not really a free market then.......

Why is ok to say individuals should be become more self sufficient rather than rely on the State but the same argument isn't used for companies who don't even pay the 12.5% corporation tax because of various tax breaks and incentives.


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## Delboy (5 Oct 2015)

Sounds like a breakaway group from Renua!!!

A counter weight to the Nevin Institute but I wonder will they get anywhere near the same media time that the Reds get


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## T McGibney (5 Oct 2015)

Sunny said:


> Why is ok to say individuals should be become more self sufficient rather than rely on the State but the same argument isn't used for companies who don't even pay the 12.5% corporation tax because of various tax breaks and incentives.



Sorry, I'm lost here. Can you explain?


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## trojan (5 Oct 2015)

The name reminded me of the old Hibernia Magazine in the eighties.


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## Brendan Burgess (5 Oct 2015)

Brendan Burgess said:


> Specifically, the Hibernia Forum calls for a restraint and accountability in Government spending, reasonable and fair taxation, as well as support for small business and entrepreneurs.





Brendan Burgess said:


> Support for Ireland’s low corporate rate, and the conditions which make the country competitive and attractive to foreign direct investment.





Sunny said:


> Free market with supports for small businesses and entrepreneurs? So not really a free market then.......



It's a good question. I presume that they do not mean financial supports.  They are having a press conference tomorrow and if I attend, I will ask them to clarify that point.  

As I understand the free market philosophy, they want low taxes, low regulation but no financial subsidies - I have heard the term "corporate welfare" used, which I understands means the likes of grants to companies to set up in business.

Brendan


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## Sarenco (5 Oct 2015)

While it's certainly good to see a new Irish think tank being established with an alternative viewpoint, I would be curious to know who is funding their operations.  While they describe themselves as being an "independent advocacy group", he who pays the piper...


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## Brendan Burgess (5 Oct 2015)

Hi Sarenco 

I will ask this tomorrow as well.  

Brendan


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## Sarenco (5 Oct 2015)

Many thanks.  

I know the Nevin Institute is quite upfront about the fact that they are funded by a number of trade unions.


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## Brendan Burgess (6 Oct 2015)

Cormac Lucey, the Forum's Chairman,  has written a great article in the Sunday Times about ending the housing crisis.

It is reproduced on his blog: 

http://cormaclucey.blogspot.ie/2015/09/noonans-wrong-to-blame-central-bank.html

_Noonan’s call for a change in the mortgage finance rules may make for good politics. It suggests any problems in the housing market are principally the result of poor Central Bank decision-making. But is Noonan’s implied criticism of the policy justified? I don’t think so. Making it easier to get a mortgage won’t help those renting or those seeking social housing. 


...


In any event, most mortgages are advanced to secure the purchase of existing, rather than new, homes. Last year, according to Department of the Environment statistics, for every euro lent by an Irish bank to buy new homes, more than six euros were lent to buy existing houses. So easing mortgage credit availability is more likely to feed an increase in the prices of second-hand houses than increase availability of new ones. 

...

The government should remove one-off taxes on house sales and shift the burden of those taxes on to the annual property tax, and thus onto the cost of owning a home. It should also abolish all council levies on house construction. This has become a racket whereby local authorities can pocket up to €60,000 per new house. Similarly, stamp duty on property sales should be scrapped and, again, rolled into the ongoing property tax. Consideration should also be given to a tax on derelict sites in areas already zoned for housing to spur activity further. 


Then there’s the thorny question of repossessions. The OECD recently said that “the repossession of collateral on non-performing loans is inefficient”. It wants authorities to accelerate through the courts “the resolution of non-performing loans that require repossessions”. Raising the tally of repossessions would have a beneficial side effect of freeing up additional properties for sale. 

The problem with all these measures to improve housing supply is that they are unlikely to produce any discernible benefits in the short term, certainly not this side of the general election. So, if you’re a finance minister under pressure to deliver now, it’s easier to point the finger at the Central Bank than to accept any blame for the crisis in the sector._


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## Duke of Marmalade (6 Oct 2015)

Somebody in the _Sunday Times_ suggested that capital gains should be taxed at the full marginal rate of 51% (58% for public servants) and that thresholds for inheritance tax should be abolished and the CAT rate should similarly be increased to 51%(58%) .  We need the likes of this new Forum to put a stop to that sort of commie nonsense


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## KlausFlouride (6 Oct 2015)

Brendan Burgess said:


> - I have heard the term "corporate welfare" used,
> 
> Brendan



Unfortunate terminology, sounds like something Mussolini would have dreamed up..


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## Sarenco (6 Oct 2015)

I see RTE are reporting that this group is funded by "entrepreneurs".  Sounds very vague to me.

RTE are also reporting that they have consulted with "like-minded groups" such as Americans for Tax Reform (ATR).  ATR were founded in the 1980s by supporters of Ronald Reagan and oppose any efforts to increase taxes on individuals or businesses as a matter of principle.


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## 44brendan (6 Oct 2015)

Brendan Burgess said:


> In any event, most mortgages are advanced to secure the purchase of existing, rather than new, homes. Last year, according to Department of the Environment statistics, for every euro lent by an Irish bank to buy new homes, more than six euros were lent to buy existing houses. So easing mortgage credit availability is more likely to feed an increase in the prices of second-hand houses than increase availability of new ones.


Another example of using statistics to prove a point without any analysis of the underlying reasons as to "WHY"! Sale of 2nd hand homes in 2015 in Euro terms were six times greater than sale of new homes. QED - more demand for 2nd hand homes.
However, this presumes an equality availability of both new and 2nd hand homes which was patently not the case. Had there been an equal availability of new and 2nd hand homes this ratio would surely have been completely different!


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## T McGibney (6 Oct 2015)

Sarenco said:


> RTE are also reporting that they have consulted with "like-minded groups" such as Americans for Tax Reform (ATR).  ATR were founded in the 1980s by supporters of Ronald Reagan and oppose any efforts to increase taxes on individuals or businesses as a matter of principle.



Great to see someone willing to make that case. There's certainly enough of a lobby (much of it directly or indirectly State-funded) arguing for the opposite.


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## Brendan Burgess (6 Oct 2015)

Sunny said:


> Free market with supports for small businesses and entrepreneurs? So not really a free market then.......



I asked about this at the press conference. They were surprised at the question. It does not apparently mean giving cash to them. It means improving the business environment. Reducing taxes including VAT and reducing red tape.


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## Brendan Burgess (6 Oct 2015)

Sarenco said:


> While it's certainly good to see a new Irish think tank being established with an alternative viewpoint, I would be curious to know who is funding their operations.  While they describe themselves as being an "independent advocacy group", he who pays the piper...



I asked this at the press conference and they said that it was funded by individuals and business people. However, they have received very little funding, so far as they have had very little expense so far. They will not be disclosing the donors,although some of the donors may themselves choose to say that they donated.

I asked Eamon Delaney a bit more about it afterwards. They have got some donations in excess of €1,000. They have received no donations from overseas.

I don't think that they will become like  a Nevin Institute with offices in Dublin and Belfast and 6 or 7 employees. 

Brendan


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## Sarenco (6 Oct 2015)

Brendan Burgess said:


> I asked this at the press conference and they said that it was funded by individuals and business people. However, they have received very little funding, so far as they have had very little expense so far. They will not be disclosing the donors,although some of the donors may themselves choose to say that they donated.
> 
> I asked Eamon Delaney a bit more about it afterwards. They have got some donations in excess of €1,000. They have received no donations from overseas.
> 
> ...



Thanks for that Brendan.


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## Brendan Burgess (6 Oct 2015)

Sarenco said:


> But from what I've read, I suspect the Forum members would simply dismiss me as a bleeding heart, pinko liberal!



I don't think so.  They want to expand the debate from the only solution being the state spending more money to people taking personal responsibility.  I didn't see much disparaging, as distinct from criticising, the conventional socialist solutions.


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## Sarenco (6 Oct 2015)

That's good to hear Brendan.

A plurality of ideas and perspectives has surely got to be welcomed.  We have a tendency, in my opinion, to coalesce a little bit too quickly around consensus opinions in this country.  Even if we find ourselves ultimately adopting a centrist, or even conservative, position on a particular issue it is never a bad thing to have to debate or justify that position.

I wish the new Forum well even if I suspect I will rarely agree with their proposals.  Who knows, they might convince me otherwise!


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## Firefly (7 Oct 2015)

I think one of the major issues this group will face would be their (derived) association with all that went wrong in the banking crisis. (as mentioned several times here it was actually a bail-out of depositors). Although banking is important, it is only a subset of wider capitalism. Capitalism has a bad name at the moment, again linked to the aforementioned banking crisis, but for better or worse, it is the best known way to lift people out of poverty and to provide opportunity. 

Regarding a flat rate of tax, I would be in favour this coupled with a Basic Income. However, politically I don't think it's feasible. It would be like shooting fish in a barrel for someone like Pearse Doherty  to proclaim that X percent tax on "the most vulnerable" is a lot tougher than X percent on someone making >100k a year. In addition they would be giving out about someone on 100k a year receiving a basic income. Even if it was brought in there would be changes year on year to make it more "fair" and we'd be back to our welfare payments with a progressive tax system again in no time.


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## Brendan Burgess (8 Oct 2015)

The Chairman, Councillor Keith Redmond, has just announced that he is leaving Fine Gael for Renua.

http://www.independent.ie/irish-new...r-party-under-kennys-leadership-31593152.html

_The councillor has not declared his candidacy for the forthcoming General Election but Renua hope to run him in the five seat Dublin Fingal constituency, where he would take on Children’s Minister James Reilly and Fine Gael TD Alan Farrell._



Brendan


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