# Speed Van car flashers



## Evander73 (30 Mar 2015)

Ok, so no one particularly likes them, some think they are only there to generate revenue or increase detection rates by 'shooting fish in a barrel', & some of these arguments 'can' be valid.  However, from personal experience, on a daily basis, I see a significant number of motorists flashing their head lights to warn on coming speeding traffic of a speed van ahead.  The route I usual take is a primary road, but contains a number of stretches where there have been serious collisions, yet the warning flashing continues.

Recently two cars racing each other passed me at a frightening speed, but then got caught in traffic, luckily for them on coming traffic flashed the row of traffic and all slowed down while passing the speed van.  Too many deaths and life altering injuries are caused by serial speedsters - I think it's time to have another think - to flash or not to flash - who are we really helping, or more importantly, what could we possibly help to avoid, by not flashing?


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## STEINER (31 Mar 2015)

Flash to warn someone to slow down if you want, but don't flash to warn someone of a speed detector van, let them be caught and modify their dangerous driving.


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## Purple (31 Mar 2015)

I know someone who was stopped and charged with obstructing a Garda in the course of his duties for flashing oncoming traffic to warm them about a speed trap. Good enough for them.


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## michaelm (31 Mar 2015)

Purple said:


> I know someone who was stopped and charged with obstructing a Garda in the course of his duties for flashing oncoming traffic to warm them about a speed trap. Good enough for them.


Was it a privateer van?  Were they convicted? It's a legal stretch to say they were obstructing a Garda (although they make it up as they go along in the district court).


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## Purple (31 Mar 2015)

michaelm said:


> Was it a privateer van?  Were they convicted? It's a legal stretch to say they were obstructing a Garda (although they make it up as they go along in the district court).


I've no idea how it ended up. He was complaining about being stopped for doing it, just outside Naas.
It was a Garda with a speed gun thingy.


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## Ceist Beag (31 Mar 2015)

michaelm said:


> It's a legal stretch to say they were obstructing a Garda (although they make it up as they go along in the district court).


+1 Whilst I don't flash other drivers and would be happy to see those driving at dangerous speeds being caught, I do find this argument a bit strange, and legally tenuous to put it mildly, given that the Gardai support the idea of warning signs on our roads for where the private vans may be present. Either they are in favour of warning drivers of speed checks or they are not, they can't have it both ways!


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## blueband (31 Mar 2015)

I always flash my lights to warn other drivers...it them against us.


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## Purple (31 Mar 2015)

blueband said:


> I always flash my lights to warn other drivers...it them against us.


In the grand scheme of things I don't see the big deal either way.


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## blueband (31 Mar 2015)

the government extracts more than enough money from every motorists as it is...


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## The_Banker (31 Mar 2015)

When the Gardai/Government start using speed guns in housing estates I might then believe that they are interested in road safety rather than revenue raising.


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## STEINER (31 Mar 2015)

The_Banker said:


> When the Gardai/Government start using speed guns in housing estates I might then believe that they are interested in road safety rather than revenue raising.



There doesn't appear to be a lot of fatalities on roads in housing estates, judging from the almost daily RTA bulletins.  Motorists should obey the speed limits regardless of where the roads are.  It is parents' responsibility to keep their children from playing on roads in housing estates.


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## Leper (31 Mar 2015)

I find it repugnant that people flash their headlights to warn of speed traps of any sort.  Speed is the biggest killer on our roads.  Add in the stupidity of many Irish drivers who don't care a whit for any other road users with a plethora of bad driving habits like speeding through red lights, taking up yellow boxes, failing to use indicators when turning etc etc.  If somebody is caught flashing lights warning other speed merchants, I have no problem with them being jailed and fed on stale bread and cloudy water and kept in a damp draughty cell forever.


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## Booter (2 Apr 2015)

If the motivation is to get drivers to slow down.....and flashing other drivers causes them to slow down...job done, no?
Maybe that's what the Gardai themselves should do...drive around in unmarked cars, flashing other drivers at random!!


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## blueband (2 Apr 2015)

Booter said:


> If the motivation is to get drivers to slow down.....and flashing other drivers causes them to slow down...job done, no?
> Maybe that's what the Gardai themselves should do...drive around in unmarked cars, flashing other drivers at random!!


but the motivation is to collect revenue.....plain and simple


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## Gerry Canning (2 Apr 2015)

blueband said:


> but the motivation is to collect revenue.....plain and simple


Leper,

You are a wee bit harsh {stale bread and cloudy water for ever} .
And I thought flashing  was people just being friendly!

On the positive  side , even being flashed must temper peoples driving.


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## Purple (2 Apr 2015)

Gerry Canning said:


> And I thought flashing  was people just being friendly!


You are talking about headlights, right?!


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## gianni (2 Apr 2015)

blueband said:


> but the motivation is to collect revenue.....plain and simple



Really?

There was me thinking they were trying to save lives (and money - a fatal traffic accident costs the state €€€'s)


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## Evander73 (3 Apr 2015)

Ceist Beag said:


> +1 Whilst I don't flash other drivers and would be happy to see those driving at dangerous speeds being caught, I do find this argument a bit strange, and legally tenuous to put it mildly, given that the Gardai support the idea of warning signs on our roads for where the private vans may be present. Either they are in favour of warning drivers of speed checks or they are not, they can't have it both ways!



Personally, I would favour a covert speed detection system, which should make us all keep within the speed limits at all times, & not just when we happen to see a warning sign. So, drive within the speed limits and you've no problem, regardless of where a speed van is - what's wrong with that?

The 'both ways' argument is well made, but I suppose the difference between flashing lights, and warning signs, may be the overall behaviour of certain motorists - serial speedster may be less likely to see or obey a sign, whereas flashing lights from multiple cars is literally a more in your face warning.  So if there happens to be a speed van in a high risk accident area they get flashed and slow down, but if not, they speed on and thereby increase the potential for causing a serious collision into the future, by not being caught & penalised.

Serial speedster need to be put off the road.  It should be socially unacceptable, as it is one of the main causes of collisions, which are ruing peoples lives through death and injury.  The 'us versus them' attitude should be binned in favour of a collective 'lets save lives by doing the right thing' approach - a visit to a local graveyard or injury rehab hospital may concentrate some doubting minds.  RIP.


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## blueband (3 Apr 2015)

gianni said:


> Really?
> 
> There was me thinking they were trying to save lives (and money - a fatal traffic accident costs the state €€€'s)


yep..thats exactly how they want you to think..


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## Gerry Canning (10 Apr 2015)

I don,t think its the fatal accident that costs us ,( the State) , a lot.
It is the cost of those who live with serious injuries that cost us.

Speeding kills , so am for anything that slows us, but then I have a niggle when I see traffic police cars shooting fish in a barrel at end of wide straight stretches.


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## roker (13 Apr 2015)

Leper said:


> I find it repugnant that people flash their headlights to warn of speed traps of any sort.  Speed is the biggest killer on our roads.  Add in the stupidity of many Irish drivers.


 I was done for doing 60 kph in a 50 (6 mph over) hardly dangerous driving, its very difficult to tell the difference if you are not looking at the speedo. I would have no problem flashing someone unless they were overdoing it.


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## Leper (14 Apr 2015)

But, Roker, NEWSFLASH! - You were driving over what was already deigned as a speeding limit. It was marginally over, but over.  Take it on the chin.  I bet you have been driving more safely since!


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## Leo (14 Apr 2015)

I'm not directing this at anyone in this thread, but I always find it funny how people's attitudes to road traffic law adapts based on their circumstances. There have been threads on here looking for cyclists to be locked up for breaking a red light or cycling on a path, yet the same motorists consider breaking the speed limit fair game, and parking fines or clamping unjust.


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## Purple (15 Apr 2015)

Leo said:


> I'm not directing this at anyone in this thread, but I always find it funny how people's attitudes to road traffic law adapts based on their circumstances. There have been threads on here looking for cyclists to be locked up for breaking a red light or cycling on a path, yet the same motorists consider breaking the speed limit fair game, and parking fines or clamping unjust.


We all see the world through our own prism but some rational thinking should give us some insight.


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## Leo (16 Apr 2015)

Purple said:


> We all see the world through our own prism but some rational thinking should give us some insight.



Absolutely true, but in these discussions/ arguments, rationality seems to go out the window rather quickly.


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## Purple (16 Apr 2015)

Leo said:


> Absolutely true, but in these discussions/ arguments, rationality seems to go out the window rather quickly.


I can't believe you said that about me!


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## Firefly (16 Apr 2015)

I've been known to give the odd flash myself


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## Leper (16 Apr 2015)

Firefly said:


> I've been known to give the odd flash myself


Wow!!!!!


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## roker (8 May 2015)

STEINER said:


> There doesn't appear to be a lot of fatalities on roads in housing estates, judging from the almost daily RTA bulletins.  Motorists should obey the speed limits regardless of where the roads are.  It is parents' responsibility to keep their children from playing on roads in housing estates.


 In that case, why have they decided to put speed bumps in housing estates?


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## Leo (11 May 2015)

roker said:


> In that case, why have they decided to put speed bumps in housing estates?



Because it's popular with the masses.


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## mathepac (13 May 2015)

+1 Leo. Our local residents' association issued dire warnings to motorists about driving carefully in the estate and the need for more speed bumps. I wrote back to the committee pointing out that if parents instructed their kids that a roadway is a roadway and not a play area and supervised their children better they'd achieve more. These same parents drive around with unrestrained children sitting three abreast in commercial vehicles, supply them with 25 cc mini-motos which they use on the public road and allow children out on bicycles  with no idea of the rules of the road, no lights, no hi-vis vests, no helmets yet in the event of an RTI involving some unfortunate child with useless parents it'll be because of speeding and a lack of speed ramps.


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## roker (15 May 2015)

And the driver is blamed and has it on his conscience


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## Gerry Canning (3 Sep 2015)

roker said:


> And the driver is blamed and has it on his conscience


Roker.

I have yet to hear of a car being killed by a child, yet kids are killed by cars.
We can probably correctly blame poor supervision,  but do never forget, that cars kill kids, and kids will be kids !.

mathepac.
Agree with your comments and would add Lazy Parenting to your note.


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## Leper (5 Sep 2015)

If the LE Niamh saved two hundred refugees from the Mediterranean it would be world news and rightly so.  Annually, we have 150 - 200 deaths on our roads due to speed, bad driving, stupidity etc.

The fault is not the cars, the roads, the traffic lights, the yellow boxes, the bus lanes, the weather, the Gardaí, the cyclists, the pedestrians etc.  It is people like you and me who disobey every rule in the manual when we feel like doing so.  Of course, it will never happen to me!!!!!!!

Does it have to take a photo of a child lying face down on our roads to get us to cop on to our dreadful driving habits?


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## cork (7 Sep 2015)

Is the speed van operation not a private entreprise?

Better off if the Gardai enforced the laws rather than a private operation.


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## Leper (8 Sep 2015)

cork said:


> Is the speed van operation not a private entreprise?
> 
> Better off if the Gardai enforced the laws rather than a private operation.



Even if it were Purple, Roker or Déise I couldn't care less who enforced the traffic/road use laws as long as they got people to drive safely.  I'll tell you one thing, if I were the enforcer our national debt would be cleared fairly fast and many drivers would be walking, waiting for the 15A or sitting in some prison.


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## Leo (8 Sep 2015)

cork said:


> Is the speed van operation not a private entreprise?
> 
> Better off if the Gardai enforced the laws rather than a private operation.



Do you think the Gardai were doing better in terms of speed detection/enforcement than the current GoSafe operation? What specifically about the current model would you change? There are a few aspects I think should be changed by the way.


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## Deas (11 Sep 2015)

roker said:


> In that case, why have they decided to put speed bumps in housing estates?


 
In many cases it was in order to spend the local council's budget to secure the same again the following year roker.


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