# Shopping outside the country - unpatriotic?



## shesells (29 Oct 2008)

There's a couple of threads in dontaskaboutmoney where people have brought patriotism into the discussion where shopping outside the country has been discussed - specifically in the US and Northern Ireland.

At a time when taxes across the board have been increased, capped with already higher prices here and the 0.5% increase in VAT - shopping outside the state is increasingly attractive.

It is really an issue of patriotism? 

My two cents worth - I don't think it is. If prices here were competitive then apart from souvenirs we would not need to shop abroad, but we're not. And the VAT increase will only make things worse. I would shop at home all the time if I could afford to but it's just too expensive. 

On  budget day I decided that Newry once a month was going to be an important shopping trip. 0.5% on top of an already higher VAT rate this side of the border means my money goes further up North. Seeing as I won't have as much money to spend any more, I need to get that value, our government have made it that way. It's nothing to do with patriotism.


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## Towger (29 Oct 2008)

Mary Harney told us to shop around, and by God that is that I do. Sure what else was the internet invented for


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## Bubbly Scot (29 Oct 2008)

Comes down to choice too. If I can't get it here, I will go abroad.

Newry...I really need to think about a trip there sometime.


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## Simeon (29 Oct 2008)

Hope Willie O'Dea/Brian Lenihan don't read AAM ........... otherwise hello customs cabins at border crossings


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## Sunny (29 Oct 2008)

Simeon said:


> Hope Willie O'Dea/Brian Lenihan don't read AAM ........... otherwise hello customs cabins at border crossings


 
Not much they can do. We are all one big happy European family now. (Rejection of Lisbon apart)


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## Sylvester3 (29 Oct 2008)

Didn't the Anglo-Irish agreement come before all that anyway? I vaguely remember my dad being stopped at a cabin checkpoint just past Newry on the way South during the Silly Season and being checked over for smuggled spirits etc, but that must have been a good 25 years ago.


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## mell61 (29 Oct 2008)

is it unpatriotic? I don't think so, look along any high street now and its all UK, European companies, so anything you are spending is heading out of the country to a head office anyway!
Tesco are now sourcing most of their stock in the UK, moving from their irish based suppliers, so its not like we're keeping jobs in the country, most of the suppliers are letting people go because they've lost a large portion of their business.
I shop in Lidl, Aldi, local butcher and local market, with 2-3 trips up to Belfast cash and carry for all the store cupboard / household stuff / alcohol.


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## bamboozle (29 Oct 2008)

I travelled through Newry on Bank Holiday Monday afternoon and I was stunned at the length of southern reg cars queuing up to get off the Motorway into the city, there must have been 3 or 4 miles of cars bumper to bumper, I knew there were some people who travelled up there but just didn’t realise there were that many!!!

And just for the record I did my own little price watch up there, in Dublin I bought a 2L bottle of Ballygowan in a petrol station- it cost €2.40. I checked its price in 2 shops in Co. Down the first sold it for £0.95 and the second for £1.05.

Plus i also noticed signs from lots of shops in Newry offering £1 : €1 exchange rates


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## Towger (29 Oct 2008)

bamboozle said:


> in Dublin I bought a 2L bottle of Ballygowan in a petrol station- it cost €2.40. I checked its price in 2 shops in Co. Down the first sold it for £0.95 and the second for £1.05.


 
€1.25 in Dunnes in Sandyford Ind Estate last week.


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## Mpsox (29 Oct 2008)

we shop in Newry about every 6 weeks to 2 months and save a small fortune, especially on baby goods

never ceases to amaze me how some people can claim that shopping in the North/overseas in unpatriotic and how we should keep our money at home yet never seem to remember the billions we got from overseas in grant aid(ie from Brussels)


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## NorthDrum (29 Oct 2008)

How could anybody argue that its unpatriotic*? *Sounds like something that would come from the republican party in the U.S.

Is travelling abroad for holidays unpatriotic*?
*
Is watching Sky TV unpatriotic?

Where does Petrol come from, certainly not off the coast of connacht!!!

Its up to the government and the shops down South to make life easier for the consumer and to take away the motivation to travel so far for groceries.

I dont think its unpatriotic to save money. Somebody once told me charity starts at home. I used to think it was a selfish saying but in times like these when everybody else is looking after their own house, its the only thing people can do to get by.


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## majik (29 Oct 2008)

I understand people nipping over the border to get cheap items, its convenient.

I just don't understand people schlepping all the way to NY to buy a few items of clothing. Whats the point? Its just not worth it. A couple of hundred euros for the flight, two whole days travelling, more money on a hotel and food in the one of the most expensive cities in the world, all to save maybe 70 or 80 euros on one item?! Then you have to deal with the real possibility of being nabbed by customs on the way back. I've also found people are willing to 'lower' their standards in NY just so they feel they are getting a bargain compared to back home. Cheap crap is cheap crap no matter where you buy it.


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## z104 (29 Oct 2008)

you incorporate a short holiday into your shopping trip. If you were to buy enough clothes to last you a few months it would pay for the hotel and flight.

This assumes that you are buying branded clothes like Tom Hill, e.t.c. and assumes that you were going to buy the same amount of clothes here in the first place.


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## Purple (29 Oct 2008)

I'm in Holland at the moment and am thinking of buying a beer in a few minutes... is that allowed?


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## LDFerguson (29 Oct 2008)

Purple said:


> I'm in Holland at the moment and am thinking of buying a beer in a few minutes... is that allowed?


 
No.  Go straight to bed and staple your wallet closed until you get home.


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## shesells (30 Oct 2008)

Seriously, check out some of the posts on the shopping in NY thread at the moment. I'm just glad treason isn't a capital crime any more!


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## ubiquitous (30 Oct 2008)

Niallers said:


> you incorporate a short holiday into your shopping trip. If you were to buy enough clothes to last you a few months it would pay for the hotel and flight.



 You're not Elton John by any chance?


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## majik (30 Oct 2008)

Niallers said:


> you incorporate a short holiday into your shopping trip. If you were to buy enough clothes to last you a few months it would pay for the hotel and flight.
> 
> This assumes that you are buying branded clothes like Tom Hill, e.t.c. and assumes that you were going to buy the same amount of clothes here in the first place.



Sorry I don't understand your logic? Or maybe I do?

So if I spend X amount on clothing and Y amount on flights/accomodation I will save Z amount. X+Y=Z (saving)?

Or maybe you are saying that the money saved on buying in NY (the extra 60 euro at most per item you'd spend extra in Ireland) would compensate for your flight and hotel. Yes they may just cover that cost but then you have inconvenience of going to NY to buy clothes. 

Think of the value of your time shopping, is that not worth something? The countless hours spent in airport line-ups, immmigration line-ups, customs line-up. The costs of getting to and from the airport, not to mention the total of 14 hours you will spend in a cramped economy seat.

In the end you may end up still saving a few schillings if you factor in these unseen costs but really, was it worth it?


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## ubiquitous (30 Oct 2008)

Imho, New York is too good a city to be wasting much time shopping, although its nice to visit Macys or other stores at the end of a long day's sightseeing. I can't really understand people wasting a whole day going to Woodbury Common.


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## Complainer (30 Oct 2008)

LDFerguson said:


> No.  Go straight to bed


Not always good advice for saving money in Holland, particularly certain parts of Amsterdam


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## majik (30 Oct 2008)

ubiquitous said:


> Imho, New York is too good a city to be wasting much time shopping, although its nice to visit Macys or other stores at the end of a long day's sightseeing. I can't really understand people wasting a whole day going to Woodbury Common.



Exactly how I feel. Its not that I want to discourage people from visiting NY, but for outlet shopping, no thanks!


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## bond-007 (30 Oct 2008)

I left over 500 euro in Northern Ireland yesterday. I feel great. I am glad that Cowen and CO didn't get anything.


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## shesells (31 Oct 2008)

bond-007 said:


> I left over 500 euro in Northern Ireland yesterday. I feel great. I am glad that Cowen and CO didn't get anything.


 
And all perfectly legal too


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## Caveat (31 Oct 2008)

Another thing is quality. I would be happier to "buy Irish" if the quality was there but it often isn't IMO. Off the top of my head I can think of 3 or 4 well known Irish food brands that I would never buy, simply because I can buy comparable alternatives that are not only cheaper, but better.

Re shopping in the north, I live close to NI - shopping in the north is not a new phenomenon for me. Relative value fluctuates due to currency/budgets etc but over the last 20 years, there has never been a time when it hasn't been worthwhile for me to do at least some if not half of my purchases there.

Having said that, I do buy Irish when I can and when there is no disincentive for me.


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## rabbit (31 Oct 2008)

If everyone done all their shopping / purchases outside the state, there would be no VAT to pay the wages of our very well paid and secure public service, not to mention our politicians.


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## bond-007 (31 Oct 2008)

And? 

A win win situation for us all.


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## Purple (1 Nov 2008)

rabbit said:


> If everyone done all their shopping / purchases outside the state, there would be no VAT to pay the wages of our very well paid and secure public service, not to mention our politicians.



Oh, they'd find the income for the wages; look what Fitzgerald did in the 80's.


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## rabbit (1 Nov 2008)

Purple said:


> Oh, they'd find the income for the wages; look what Fitzgerald did in the 80's.


 Not the point.   Those who get their income from the state should  support the state financially.


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## ubiquitous (1 Nov 2008)

bond-007 said:


> I left over 500 euro in Northern Ireland yesterday. I feel great. I am glad that Cowen and CO didn't get anything.



Good man yourself. I presume you feel equally happy that the combination of semi-retired gunmen and religious fanatics that populate the Northern Ireland "government" will spend your VAT money wisely


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## bond-007 (1 Nov 2008)

:d


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## Caveat (1 Nov 2008)

rabbit said:


> Not the point. Those who get their income from the state should support the state financially.


 
I do, I pay tax/PRSI...and stamp duty...and tolls....etc etc


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## Purple (1 Nov 2008)

ubiquitous said:


> good Man Yourself. I Presume You Feel Equally Happy That The Combination Of Semi-retired Gunmen And Religious Fanatics That Populate The Northern Ireland "government" Will Spend Your Vat Money Wisely


:d


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## redstar (3 Nov 2008)

"Shopping outside the country - unpatriotic?"

"Over-charging inside the country - unpatriotic?"


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## ubiquitous (3 Nov 2008)

redstar said:


> "Over-charging inside the country - unpatriotic?"



High taxes inside the country - unpatriotic? 
High wages inside the country - unpatriotic? 
High property prices & rents inside the country - unpatriotic?


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## Mpsox (4 Nov 2008)

rabbit said:


> Not the point. Those who get their income from the state should support the state financially.


 
So does that mean that farmers who get grants from the EU should do their shopping in whatever country makes the largest contribution to EU funding?


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## rabbit (4 Nov 2008)

A farmer, by definition, is someone who farms.   Somebody who produces food and farms should get their income from selling that food.   Farmers, like others who work hard in workshops, factories, shops, construction etc in the country pay their taxes to support our public sector.  If this money is spent in the country it goes around , pays our vat ETC.  If those who get their hands on the money spend it on shopping trips to New York etc then it does not circulate in this country.   There are not too many farmers going to New York I imagine....and many others in the wealth producing sector of the economy ( manufactruring etc ) are finding things tough too in todays real world.


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## gflood (3 Jan 2009)

I love this line - "I left over 500 euro in Northern Ireland yesterday. I feel great. I am glad that Cowen and CO didn't get anything."

I am glad you feel great. Will you feel great when you are out of a job and are asking why? Will you feel great when you need to drive 100 miles to go to a store because ones near you are closed down? Will you feel great when our national debt is a national embarrassment?

This is NOT about Cowen or those other muppets in Government. This is about keeping the wealth of the country where it belongs. In OUR country. Stuff IS cheaper up North but the fact is that when you spend locally you support local economy, infrastructure and other services.

A friend of mine is from Northern Ireland but lives and works in the Republic and recently he got a new (very nice) LCD TV and got it in a local store in Dublin. Why? because he said if he works and lives here the least he can do is support local busisness where possible. 

2009 is going to be a BAD year. There will be protests no doubt and I wonder how many of thsoe complaining about services having being cut will then go into their cars and spend their money in another country.


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## Strathspey (3 Jan 2009)

gflood said:


> ......This is about keeping the wealth of the country where it belongs. In OUR country.


 
 Are you having a laugh? Need you be reminded that Ireland was not a net contributor to EU funding until two years ago. Ireland was a recipient of EU 'aid', even during the boom years, in much the same way that African countries are recipients of Irish aid, that so many hypocritical Irish wish to curtail, to bolster the public coffers. This wealth was definately not Irish wealth but more likely Germanic wealth. At this point, let me tell you that the only patriotism I feel, is to my wallet.


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## bond-007 (3 Jan 2009)

gflood said:


> I love this line - "I left over 500 euro in Northern Ireland yesterday. I feel great. I am glad that Cowen and CO didn't get anything."
> 
> I am glad you feel great. Will you feel great when you are out of a job and are asking why? Will you feel great when you need to drive 100 miles to go to a store because ones near you are closed down? Will you feel great when our national debt is a national embarrassment?
> 
> ...


Personally I would not care if the local supervalu closed down. It is overpriced anyways. But Supervalus will never go out of business from northern shopping. Their key demographic is little old ladies (who mistakenly believe that all their stock is Irish) and other types that have no transport. Those are enough to keep most supervalus afloat. 

In this times I want value for my euro and if the retailers of the republic cannot deliver this well they can go out of business.


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## glowinthedar (3 Jan 2009)

It makes me wonder when politicans say that shopping up north is unpatriotic when goverment departments do this all the time.

One example is that a lot of the leaflets and documentation produced during a campaign such as the lisbon treaty and local elections are done up north and in England, some are even produced as far away as China and India. Therefore taking money out of the country and Irish printers, That are more than capable of producing these jobs at the same cost and lower turnaround time.

If the goverment feel that the ordinary shopper spending their hard earned money up north are hurting the Irish economy, they should lead by example and also 'shop' locally when spending our money.

But then again it would mean that these 'trade-missions' would not be to exotic locations such as Dubai but rather Cork.


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## bond-007 (3 Jan 2009)

Guess where the Garda uniforms are made? Londonderry!


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## truthseeker (3 Jan 2009)

Just spent 250 quid on amazon.co.uk - use them all the time anyway, but between january sale items and the sterling/euro exchange rate its a brilliant time to bag a bargain there. Dont feel remotely unpatriotic - Im keeping An Post busy at least


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## Joody1 (3 Jan 2009)

truthseeker said:


> Just spent 250 quid on amazon.co.uk - use them all the time anyway, but between january sale items and the sterling/euro exchange rate its a brilliant time to bag a bargain there. Dont feel remotely unpatriotic - Im keeping An Post busy at least



   If the Irish governments wants people to travel to Ireland then why not let pensions who have Irish passport that live  in the UK travel at half prices on public transport that would bring a lot of people to Ireland and when there they would be spending hence boosting the economy.  After all pensioners that people live in Northern Ireland.  which is part of the UK are allowed to travel down to the south using public transport and this is free for them, therefore why not let the rest of the Irish pensions living in the  UK have the save privilege.  

In these times we have to travel where there is good value for moeny therefore how can it be *unpatriotic *to go where there is savings to be made.

Joody


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## Taxi Driver (4 Jan 2009)

Minister for Finance Brian Lenihan has urged shoppers to do their “patriotic duty” and resist the urge to avail of bargains in the North. However if people can save €50 or €100 on their weekly shop this is extra money that they can spend in pubs, restaurants, cinemas and on taxis and other services in this country that can't be bought on a shopping trip to the North.

Brian Lenihan's patriotic duty involves reducing the incomes across a whole range of occupations. It just that these are unseen and not seen like traffic jams into Newry on a Saturday morning.

Taken from here a piece on The Broken Window of Patriotic Duty


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## Caveat (5 Jan 2009)

bond-007 said:


> Guess where the Garda uniforms are made? Londonderry!


 
Ha! never knew that!

What about the outsourcing of various suppliers to state bodies/public sector as well as many building projects within the state too?

At least some of those rely on materials and workforce sourced outside the state.


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## gflood (5 Jan 2009)

You make an point there glowinthedar.

And to be honet after reading about Cooper Flynn and her allowance any feelings I had about keeping spenidng in the Republic is rapidly fading. I mean not only is this costing us and our future generations 41k but we also need to borrow that and pay interest. All too often we hear about these 'small' amounts of money squandered. But it all rapidly adds up.


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## parkmagic (5 Jan 2009)

saved 4 grand buying a car in the UK, nothing to do with patriotism.


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## glowinthedar (5 Jan 2009)

Caveat said:


> What about the outsourcing of various suppliers to state bodies/public sector as well as many building projects within the state too?
> 
> At least some of those rely on materials and workforce sourced outside the state.


 
Of course there are somethings that need to be sourced and purchased outside the state, but for things that are available in the state through Irish businesses then government should actively leverage these sources.

So if our government doesnt do this, in the name of saving tax payers money, who would the ordinary person???

Good on everyone for shopping around and keeping the money in your pocket. Not in the government coffers which only seem to be spend on TD's undeserved bonuses/expenses/junkets etc...

BTW we are all in debt of €12,000 each due to this governments reckless spending!


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## micmclo (6 Jan 2009)

bond-007 said:


> Guess where the Garda uniforms are made? Londonderry!



Londonderry? 

Contracts like this have to be tendered across the EU. An Irish company had just as much chance of applying for this but maybe they weren't the best option on price or whatever criteria is used.

If they started awarding contracts to only Irish companys and never bothered to tender them where they are supposed to,you can be sure the EU would get involved and if it's not an open process, you'd be getting into brown envelopes for contracts. We've seen it all before

Sure the Leaving Cert papers are printed by a UK company. Well they were when I did it


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## bond-007 (6 Jan 2009)

Londonderry is the legal name of the city.


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## Nermal (6 Jan 2009)

rabbit said:


> A farmer, by definition, is someone who farms.



welcome to ireland!


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## putsch (6 Jan 2009)

Yes I think its at least shortsighted (not sure about unpatriotic) to shop outside Ireland - the vat, corporation tax etc forgone will only have to be recouped elsewhere at some stage. Only makes sense if you don't plan to pay tax in Ireland eventually.


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## Joody1 (6 Jan 2009)

The Irish government must think of ways to get tourists into Ireland, so many people came to the UK to do shopping before Christmas they said that it was because the exchange rate as well as the VAT of 15% in the UK , and also the fares were very cheap to fly with Ryanair.  It makes a lot of sense to go where the prices are right for people and there are savings to be made.

People cannot afford to paterotic when they struggling to make ends meet. 

Joody


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## hawkmar (7 Jan 2009)

Even aer lingus no its cheaper in the north, unpatriotic my foot, people shall do what they must in times like these.


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## anon473 (8 Jan 2009)

If you follow the patriotism arguemennt shouldnt you try to buy irish products from irish shops. I read somewhere that some companies (Tesco was the headline) label products as produced in Ireland if they are manufactured in the North or South. How does this affect patriotism? how does banking with Ulsterbank, shopping in Tesco, eating in Pizza hut affect it? 
Yes I know that spending locally increases the local economy, but if you follow the patriotism arguement to its conclusion you could end up avoiding most of the companies in the country.

ps I am a British citizen living, working and paying tax in ireland so I am doing *my *patriotic bit by spending as much money as i can in the North!
anon473


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## DerKaiser (8 Jan 2009)

For me a simple arguement is this (VAT = 20%).
Collectively if we all buy goods costing €10bn up North that would cost €12bn down here we are saving nothing.  Of the €12bn we would have spent here €2bn would VAT.  Some people like to think that this €2bn will come out of Cowen, Harney, Lenihan, etc's wages, but luckily they don't earn that much so unfortunately it ultimately is €2bn out of all of our pockets.
The plus side is that the extra €1.5bn collected by Her Majesty's Exchequer will pay for some nice roads around London which we can use when we're all forced to move there due to lack of economic activity here.


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## billb (16 Jan 2009)

There are other reasons for shopping outside Ireland than price - i.e. service.

I recently ordered 2 bathrooms suites from Germany and actually received them by next day delivery, well packaged and complete. 

I ordered another one from Cork City, only 15 miles away, and it arrived broken with bits missing 5 days late and on the back of a pickup.

I'm sure that there are efficient Irish retailers but there are too many lazy inefficient ones that have had it too easy for too long. We need to see better service in this country as well as better prices before I shop for more things at home. If market forces are allowed to come to bear then those lousy, expensive retailers will go bust. Then once Irish retailers become as efficient and compeitive as European retailers they will get my business.

When it comes to prices differences whilst we share the same currency and have similar rates of VAT I found that quality German bathroom goods as and example are over twice the price here for the exact same item.

So should I be "patriotic" and shop for sanitary ware in a local shop where the owner drives a Porsche on his profits ?? Or should I buy abroad and buy my own Porsche with the change ?


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## remey (18 Mar 2009)

*Shopping in North? Unpatriotic?*

Hi all,

I am expecting a baby this summer. Friends have gone over the boarder and picked up some nice bargains on baby stuff.
My husband really doesnt like the idea of us buying in the North as we should try help our economy and buy as much as we can from here. He said people are giving out about shops closing and people losing their jobs and this kind of thing doesnt help.

I'm all for being patriotic when its realistic but seriously I want to save a few bob, I do understand where he's coming from and wish I could be more sympathetic. I'm sort of of the view that what difference will it make if WE shop in the North too. It'll hardly save jobs???? 
I'd love to hear opinions from those who agree or disagree with my husbands view.
I would gladly shop here if the differences were just marginal but I've heard of people saving hundreds on buggys alone! What are we supposed to do....


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## Purple (18 Mar 2009)

*Re: Shopping in North? Unpatriotic?*

This thread covers the topic already.


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## samanthajane (18 Mar 2009)

*Re: Shopping in North? Unpatriotic?*

I think this is a case where shops, especially the larger chains that operate in ireland and the uk stop charging more in ireland. It didn't help with the VAT increase just before christmas either. I would say 90% of my christmas presents were got in the north, because it was a lot cheaper not just a couple of euros either, one presents for my son in symths at airside was €69.99 i got it in smyths in newry for £34.99. I did all my food shopping in sainburys ( apart from turkey and ham ) I had a trolley and a half of stuff.......€175!!! There is no way i could of got half of that if i had shopped in my local. 

I remember a while ago a report about how much extra you paid for an item in ireland compared to the same product in the uk. Some big items like telly's there was a couple 100 in the difference. 

If you were going to mothercare in the north to buy your baby things i dont think that is going to close down all the mothercares in ireland just yet. People are always going to look for the bargins and the sales and it's a fact as you said it is a lot cheaper to buy in the north, Yes the country needs help but we need to look after ourselves as well.


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## z103 (18 Mar 2009)

*Re: Shopping in North? Unpatriotic?*

Shop in the North.

Ireland needs tough love. Prices here will only come down when people stop paying them.


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## bond-007 (18 Mar 2009)

*Re: Shopping in North? Unpatriotic?*

Agree 100%.

The govt need to be taught a lesson in basic economics.


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## sparkeee (18 Mar 2009)

*Re: Shopping in North? Unpatriotic?*

The U2 tax situation,now thats unpatriotic.


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## DubShelley (18 Mar 2009)

*Re: Shopping in North? Unpatriotic?*



leghorn said:


> Shop in the North.
> 
> Ireland needs tough love. Prices here will only come down when people stop paying them.


 
Totally agree!!! The high chair I recently bought my sister for her newborn was €113.99 in Argos in ROI and £78.29 in NI, for the exact same chair = saving of €30. There's just no justification for that!! If I made that saving on just 1 thing, imagine what could be saved if you bought your cot, pram, sterilisers etc up there too!


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## meatmonger (18 Mar 2009)

*Re: Shopping in North? Unpatriotic?*

lorry driver in north = paid about 450 stg p w
lorry driver in south was looking for 1000-1150 euro p w.
min wage 20-30% cheaper in north

same goods from same factories up to 50% cheaper.

tell me which part is unpatriotic


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## Mpsox (18 Mar 2009)

*Re: Shopping in North? Unpatriotic?*

2 packets of nappies in Sainsburys weekend before last, £10.50
1 identical packet in Tesco in the South on the same week, €11

15 cartons of Aptimil already mixed in Sainsburys: £8.85
15 identical cartons in Tesco in the South: €17.85

if your husband can afford to be "patriotic" at those prices, good luck to him

anyway, are we not all Irish?????


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## askalot (18 Mar 2009)

*Re: Shopping in North? Unpatriotic?*

When politicians start trying to appeal to our sense of patriotism it is time to remember the words of Samuel Johnson: 

''Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel''.


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## bond-007 (18 Mar 2009)

*Re: Shopping in North? Unpatriotic?*



askalot said:


> When politicians start trying to appeal to our sense of patriotism it is time to remember the words of Samuel Johnson:
> 
> ''Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel''.


 Very well said.


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## Latrade (18 Mar 2009)

*Re: Shopping in North? Unpatriotic?*



Mpsox said:


> 2 packets of nappies in Sainsburys weekend before last, £10.50
> 1 identical packet in Tesco in the South on the same week, €11
> 
> 15 cartons of Aptimil already mixed in Sainsburys: £8.85
> ...


 
There's more reasons for those prices than just shops ripping us off. I agree, the UK stores based here have little defence when the gaps are so signficant, but the irish retailers are at a disadvantage because it's a small country and small operation. The UK has a much bigger population and market, we're the size of a mid sized city (in UK terms) and so can't get the same discounts on stock at cost level. It's seen all over, especially "named" brands, the cost prices to Ireland are higher, then comes transport, then comes rent, then comes wages, then comes, tax, then comes energy etc etc.

Me: I'd rather see the people in retail/hotels in a job and earning, I'd rather not see more retail closures, especially of domestic businesses. And prices are comming down, I've seen it on the weekly shopping bill. Still shop in the same places and still buy more or less the same items, yet it's down by up to €50 per week. 

It's not unpatriotic, but if done en masse it could be short-sighted and more harmful in the long run.


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## extopia (18 Mar 2009)

*Re: Shopping in North? Unpatriotic?*

Think about what is being suggested. It hasn't been thought through. If we are going to play the patriotism card, we might as well go the whole hog and boycott all "foreign" retailers that operate in Ireland.


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## RMCF (18 Mar 2009)

*Re: Shopping in North? Unpatriotic?*



extopia said:


> Think about what is being suggested. It hasn't been thought through. If we are going to play the patriotism card, we might as well go the whole hog and boycott all "foreign" retailers that operate in Ireland.



I think Dunnes Stores/O'Brien sandwich bars are already trying to play this card, mentioning the old favourite line "because we're Irish" in their adverts.

I think at the end of the day people will buy off them if they are competitve. If they aren't, then the business will go elsewhere.


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## bond-007 (18 Mar 2009)

*Re: Shopping in North? Unpatriotic?*



> I think Dunnes Stores/O'Brien sandwich bars are already trying to play this card, mentioning the old favourite line "because we're Irish" in their adverts.


It is that sort of line that will ultimately discourage people from buying from them.

I find the use of phrases such as "Because were Irish" so patronising. They obviously think we are stupid.
Dunnes use the exact same ads north of the border but they are careful not to include "Because were Irish".


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## Bubbly Scot (18 Mar 2009)

*Re: Shopping in North? Unpatriotic?*



leghorn said:


> Shop in the North.
> 
> Ireland needs tough love. Prices here will only come down when people stop paying them.




I agree. I get a bit of stick for going Up north for shopping but even taking the cost of petrol and tolls into account I can save hundreds. On Christmas presents alone I saved a small fortune...well I didn't really because I had a budget, it just meant my children got more and we had a bigger range of food over the festive season.

It's not just money either, I loved the sheer choice I had up there. I'll continue to go North while it remains economical for me to do so.


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## MrMan (18 Mar 2009)

*Re: Shopping in North? Unpatriotic?*

If tough love is needed to be given out then why not give it to the retailers who charge different prices north and south. People rave about the savings but don't seem to mind that the same retailers who are charging the higher prices in our country are making a killing from the irish rushing to spend their money in the united kingdom. People will find any number of reasons to make themselves feel alright and even though it is contributing to the lack of spending in our own economy which obviously affects jobs in our own country people will continue to take whats on offer because 'its the govts fault blah blah blah'.


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## Complainer (18 Mar 2009)

It seems that FF have managed to get over the patriotism issue in bringing in some Yanks to develop the new party website, despite us having large numbers of very skilled web developers at home.


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## micmclo (18 Mar 2009)

Today the Euro went up and the US Dollar and pound sterling went down after the Fed announcment.

This weekend is a good time as any to go shopping up north!


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## Jock04 (18 Mar 2009)

For one thing, Uk companies are not the only people running retail outlets here.

For another, imho, lofty morals & the bigger picture will not put food on the table of a normal working class family, or indeed one which has suffered job loss, this week. There are many families running on a very tight budget week to week, to ask them to spend more than they have to on patriotic grounds is both churlish & unrealistic.

And for yet another, the supervalues & local supermarkets have suddenly been able to source produce at better prices & pass these onto customers. There can be little doubt that prices have come down, special offers abound. So why weren't they charging those prices 6 months ago? Little wonder the populace feel little loyalty towards them.


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## Bubbly Scot (18 Mar 2009)

Well said, Jock!! I would love to spend locally, help keep people in jobs and all the rest of it but it comes down to the bottom line..or MY bottom line. I shop mostly in Tesco and Aldi here in ROI but every now and again I go North to bulk buy.

On an aside...Out with friends tonight one joined us late, came in and announced "I'm out of work at 9am today" Two people swore that's what we heard and assumed she'd lost her job. Turns out she'd actually said she was out AT work. In the current climate we didn't think it unusual she was announcing her "redundancy". Only when we started commiserating loudly did everyone realise the mistake.

We then spent the next hour discussing the best places (locally) to get bread, milk and the best deals this week.

A sign of the times we now live in.


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## Caveat (19 Mar 2009)

Good post Jock.


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## MrMan (19 Mar 2009)

Jock04 said:


> For one thing, Uk companies are not the only people running retail outlets here.
> 
> For another, imho, lofty morals & the bigger picture will not put food on the table of a normal working class family, or indeed one which has suffered job loss, this week. There are many families running on a very tight budget week to week, to ask them to spend more than they have to on patriotic grounds is both churlish & unrealistic.
> 
> And for yet another, the supervalues & local supermarkets have suddenly been able to source produce at better prices & pass these onto customers. There can be little doubt that prices have come down, special offers abound. So why weren't they charging those prices 6 months ago? Little wonder the populace feel little loyalty towards them.


 
The uk retailers are the ones constantly being described when comparing prices such as buggy in argos was €90 here but argos in the north only charged £35 why not boycott argos altogether? 
As for lofty morals and putting food on the table how many more jobs will be lost on account of retailers in the south continuing to lose business? You don't have to look at it on patriotic grounds, think of it more on selfish grounds i.e I would like the country to get back on its feet so that some day soon I will have less to worry about when it comes to putting food on the table.
The local shops have started to drop prices significantly but that doesn't mean that it is profitable for them and that they can do so and maintain job levels in the long term. I know small to medium builders that are pricing work at a loss to stay in business and not face hefty redundancy payments so while everything may look cheap and rosey on the outside there are going to be repurcussions down the line that will affect this country.


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## Jock04 (19 Mar 2009)

MrMan said:


> The uk retailers are the ones constantly being described when comparing prices such as buggy in argos was €90 here but argos in the north only charged £35 why not boycott argos altogether?
> As for lofty morals and putting food on the table how many more jobs will be lost on account of retailers in the south continuing to lose business? You don't have to look at it on patriotic grounds, think of it more on selfish grounds i.e I would like the country to get back on its feet so that some day soon I will have less to worry about when it comes to putting food on the table.
> The local shops have started to drop prices significantly but that doesn't mean that it is profitable for them and that they can do so and maintain job levels in the long term. I know small to medium builders that are pricing work at a loss to stay in business and not face hefty redundancy payments so while everything may look cheap and rosey on the outside there are going to be repurcussions down the line that will affect this country.


 
Why did people know the price of the buggy in the Argos Stores here in the first place? Because even with the ludicrous difference between the ROI & Uk prices, they were still better than the locally owned shops. I was in a Next store just off Trafalgar Square in London a while ago. Noticed a jacket I had bought in their Glasgow store was £20 dearer. But rather than boycott them, I choose to think about where, location wise, I shop.

This thread was asking about lack of patriotism, not selfishness, but in any case I won't be party to protectionism. Garages that were delighted to sell petrol to Northerners now squeal about imports, and actually now advertise that they are selling imports themselves. Shops whine about cheap prices in the UK, then suddenly find themselves able to offer a 6-pack of coke on buy one, get one free. Guess what, it's UK coke. So we shouldn't do what they do, we should do as they say? 

I'm very fortunate that I'm not amongst those I was referring to earlier, those who are really struggling to make ends meet, quite possibly for the first time in their lives. But I absolutely see why they choose to save a couple of hundred a month on their shopping, rather than subsidise the local shops who aren't trying hard enough to compete, just to keep Mary down the road in her part-time job.
Wanting to help the country is a very noble ambition, all I'm saying is that for a lot of people, that ambition is one they just can't afford.


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## Bubbly Scot (19 Mar 2009)

Jock04 said:


> But I absolutely see why they choose to save a couple of hundred a month on their shopping, rather than subsidise the local shops who aren't trying hard enough to compete, just to keep Mary down the road in her part-time job.



I'm a "Mary down the road in her part time job" but even I won't shop in the place I work unless it's 11pm and Mr Bubbly has texted to say we're out of milk! Local shop prices can be scandalous and I don't work two jobs to support that. If my own job falls by the wayside because I go North now and again, well so be it. The bigger picture is, local shops might take note and become competitive enough to want to actually keep me shopping there.


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## Jock04 (19 Mar 2009)

Hullo Mary 

seriously, I'm glad you took my comment in context.

I'd like to think people _would_ care about Mary losing her job - but not everyone can afford to subsidise it right now!


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## MrMan (19 Mar 2009)

Jock04 said:


> Why did people know the price of the buggy in the Argos Stores here in the first place? Because even with the ludicrous difference between the ROI & Uk prices, they were still better than the locally owned shops. I was in a Next store just off Trafalgar Square in London a while ago. Noticed a jacket I had bought in their Glasgow store was £20 dearer. But rather than boycott them, I choose to think about where, location wise, I shop.
> 
> This thread was asking about lack of patriotism, not selfishness, but in any case I won't be party to protectionism. Garages that were delighted to sell petrol to Northerners now squeal about imports, and actually now advertise that they are selling imports themselves. Shops whine about cheap prices in the UK, then suddenly find themselves able to offer a 6-pack of coke on buy one, get one free. Guess what, it's UK coke. So we shouldn't do what they do, we should do as they say?
> 
> ...


 

Mary down the road will probably survive this as the local shop has long been the last place that people do their shopping in the week. I'm not advocating blind patriotism and I don't agree with protectionism but people should really just say it as it is - we want our cake and to eat it. 
I don't understand how people can whine about a particular chain in the south and then get in their car drive for hours and hand over their money to that same chain in a different country.
The type of purchasing going on doesn't represent people on the breadline because people are making savings on more than the necessities so it doesn't stand to say that its helping people put bread on the table. I understand people taking the stance that suits themselves but I hope it doesn't bite us all in the long run.


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## shanegl (19 Mar 2009)

Maybe we should go around and break a few windows and doors. Give a helping hand to our tradesmen?


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## MrMan (20 Mar 2009)

maybe companies should look outside our country for cheaper workers, oh I forgot thats already happening and its just on a larger scale to the shoppers taking their money out of Ireland.


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