# Ex Girlfriend, Neg equity and trying to get on with life



## SwordsMan (5 Jun 2012)

Hi, 

Just looking for bit of advice of what I can do, if anything at all
As bit of back-story, bought a house very late 2006 for 400k. 2 bed house with my GF at the time, both names on deeds/mortgage

I split up with gf shortly after and moved out , she still lives there and pays for half of mortgage and I rent out room(350pm) and pay remaining which works out at approx. 360 pm.

She looks at this house as her home, I look at this as a noose around my neck. This place will never be my home and is just a bad investment now.

Move on couple of years, im now in happy relationship and due to become a father in few months. I currently renting a one bed apartment in Dublin City and this is costing me about €700 pm Gf pays €300. However with little nipper on way and bills that go with it , one bed apartment is not a long term solution 

I need to either (a) save up and get a place of my own or (b) rent a bigger place, however the only way I can do either (a) or (b) is by stop paying this 360 a month.

Now I do not really want to do this as I have always paid bills on time and I don’t want my credit rating wrecked but I simply can not go on paying for this the rest of my life as it will have a major impact on the quality of it…

Now just so people do not get wrong impression I drive a banger 1996 car, do not go out that often as have little amount of disposable income after all bills paid etc

I guess you could argue that I can afford to pay for this mortgage but only if I live in (a) a dump or (b) tiny shoe box 

I do not mind making some sacrifices but I do not want a decision I made when I was 25 years old ruining my life…. 

I’m not saying I'll stop paying to this house , I will continue to rent it out and this money will go into paying off mortgage and presume my ex will continue to pay her half. As said she looks at this house as her home, as its beside her family and she is not interested in renting out whole place even though we get bit more for it e,g (900pm). 

Just I can not go on for ever paying this , so when do I say enough is enough and to make this even more complicated I work for Bank I got mortgage from(although I did not want I got it!!)

Any advice greatly appreciated


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## SwordsMan (5 Jun 2012)

sorry that was meant to say

"Just I can not go on for ever paying this , so when do I say enough is enough and to make this even more complicated I work for Bank I got mortgage from (although I did not(work for Bank), when i got it(mortgage)!!)"

Biilo - no one forced me to get mortgage, im not saying that,,,im saying NOW, and in future (bar a lotto win)  i can not continue to pay this and have decent standard of living .... i hvae family coming along and in my list of proirities this House is way way down....

and u have to remember in 2006 , it was different world, im remember watching house prices going up and up every month and it was a case of if u di not get on ladder now, u never will and for all those people who say "well i did not" ...i just put it down to good timing , 6 more months and i probably would not have bought ...


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## Brendan Burgess (5 Jun 2012)

Your story is very difficult to follow



> I rent out room(350pm) and pay remaining which works out at approx. 360 pm



Please supply the actual numbers in a list form

Mortgage balance
Current value of property 
Lender
Interest rate 
tracker or not?
Term 
Total monthly repayment 
Your share 
Monthly rental income 

I presume that when you bought the house, you didn't do a purchaser's agreement with your then girlfriend? 

Brendan


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## SwordsMan (5 Jun 2012)

Hi Brendan 

Mortgage balance - approx 335k
Current value of property -approx 200k -hard to tell , probably bit lower, brought it for 370k
Lender - 
Interest rate - 180k on 4.05% , 155% on 4.33%
Term - 29
Total monthly repayment - approx 1400
Your share - 700
Monthly rental income - 350.
Savings - approx 1k!!! - 

I presume that when you bought the house, you didn't do a purchaser's agreement with your then girlfriend? - No , 
Brendan


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## Brendan Burgess (5 Jun 2012)

OK,

I don't see any good news here. You have a loan of €167,500 on an asset worth €100k.  There isn't anything which will probably work for you. 

At €350 per month, you are getting a poor return on your investment of €100k.

You should enter into discussions with your ex that you sell the house and try to split the negative equity between the two of you. This will not help you much financially - the repayments would still be around €330 per month. 

But it would get rid of the hassle of the house for you. 

It's unlikely that she or the bank would agree but it's worth a try. 

She might then try to find a buyer for your share of the house but you would still be left with the negative equity.


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## SwordsMan (5 Jun 2012)

thanks brendan, but i think you missed my point, i can not continue to pay this 350 or sell and pay the 330. 

I have other proirities and this house is no where near top of my list,,

I already have 2nd job on weekends  and this 2nd job pays for 350 a month on property. 

i just feel like quitting 2nd job, actaully enjoy a weekend for once and tell bank they can not get blood from a stone, repossess home if they want cos honestly i do not care...I would happily walk away and give them the keys...as far as my mind is concenred i have already walked away from house. 

I am trying but i can not keep doing what im doing,  its financailly crippling me and if im honest, i read about the man with 20 houses and not paying his 2 million mortgage or whatever it was  for over 2 years and think...how is that right ....am i the only plonker who is working 6 days a week to keep head above water ... 

If i stop paying...what can happen?? i don't mind doing a SFS as i don't earn that much and put simply i do not have money to pay rent, support a family  and pay for a mortgage on house i do not want ....

if i stop paying this mortage  ....will it be impossible to get another one...say in 5 or 10 years time?


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## ryan-neil (5 Jun 2012)

Why not move into said two bed house with your GF. It is half yours and you are entitled to be there. This will free up funds for both you and your Girlfriend, to get some saving together, your rent will be freed up but lost again in your loose of rental income but your GF will have her rental income freed up and as its two beds and half yours you are entitled to your room. a lot of couplles have the child in the room for a year or two or three anyway. 

If your ex doesn't like it tough... you don't seem to have any other options and this makes the most sense financially in the short to medium term.


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## truthseeker (5 Jun 2012)

It would seem to be a fairer solution for your ex to move out and for you to both rent out the entire property.

Im not really sure its fair for you to be paying what you are paying currently in mortgage plus rent.

Look at it this way, you both bought the house, the cost per month each was approx 700.

Then you moved out due to the split, and now it costs you rent of 700 + contribution to mortgage on house of 360 = 1060.

But it costs your ex 700. So you pay 1060 and she pays 700 and she gets to live in a 2 bed house and you get to live in a 1 bed apartment.

How is this fair? She is effectively profiting by staying in the property, and now you have rental expenses on top of mortgage expenses but she doesnt. Why did you ever agree to this?

The only fair way to do it would be for both of you to move out, and let the place be fully rented, then make equal contributions to the shortfall. Or, to calculate the total cost of mortgage plus rent for both of you and split that in two. But as things stand, you are being done over on this.


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## SwordsMan (5 Jun 2012)

Hi Ryan

If my ex does not like it..I DO NOT LIKE IT!!!

So i move my pregnant GF into a 2 bed hse with my ex , ...Are u seriously saying that... 


sorry why would i want to make my life miserable again..... we did not break up becasue we were unbelieveble happy together...

sorry if i come across being short but that is not a runner... i trying to get on with my life , not dig up past.


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## SwordsMan (5 Jun 2012)

hi Truthseeker

Thanks for reply... guess reason why i agreed to current situation , was i broke up with her, felt very bad about whole thing and just sort of agreed to anything as i hurt a few people (her./her family etc)

Now .fast forward, we are where we are and i can not keep paying what im paying. 


If we rent it out i would get say 900-1k but then i run risk of losing TRS and getting put on BTL rate.

My aim is to get the cost of this house down.... if i can not what happen if i walk away? ...


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## SwordsMan (5 Jun 2012)

thanks looking 2011

moving back in, is not want i want to do, her family all live close by and i do not want a 3 hr a day commutte to work. 

think ur situation is slighly different, u had small daughter and pregnant, i do not know how ur ex could show his face after doing that to u. 

Guess there is nothing stopping me moving back in BUT I DO NOT WANT THIS AT ALL.. 

i want nothing to do with house,have not stepped inside it in about 3 years... but am currently paying cos i can "afford" to do so...


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## elcato (5 Jun 2012)

truthseeker has crunched the numbers above and that is what you need to bring to the attention of your ex. Explain that and tell her you will walk away but that you cannot afford to pay for it any more. I'd say she would be happy enough.


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## truthseeker (5 Jun 2012)

SwordsMan said:


> hi Truthseeker
> 
> Thanks for reply... guess reason why i agreed to current situation , was i broke up with her, felt very bad about whole thing and just sort of agreed to anything as i hurt a few people (her./her family etc)
> 
> ...



Yeah, I can understand how it came about - although she should have offered to do a fairer split from the start.

Anyway, have you talked to the bank at all? Could you go interest only and let the room renters money cover your part of the mortgage?

Or have you talked to her at all? Would she be willing to take over the whole thing and let you walk away? Or would she be looking for some of the negative equity from you? Could you do a deal with her on things? Does she earn enough?


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## SwordsMan (5 Jun 2012)

No i have not talked to bank or ex. 

just trying to figure out options and guess with baby on way has forced my hand to do something about it

As said i work for same Bank so do not overly want my colleguesges knowing my business but guess i do not really have a choice here 

I could ask for IO althou this is not long term solution. 

Hvae not talked to her about it althou i know she would not be in position to take over all of it( or she would be a hermit as no disposbale income left) and also know Bank would never agree to it. 

but whatever happens i can not afford this in near future , as i have no savings and no decent place to call home. 

guess my option are  - 
talk to ex, tell her im not paying and see what happens
or 
ask bank for some sort of I/O but that is only deferring problem

ok - now im thinking out loud - so i go with option one. she tells me she can not afford to cover my half or Qtr (depends if have someone renting out room) and now only half or 3/4 mortgage is being paid.

Will i ever be able to get a mortgage in future....r am i stuck renting for rest of life, which obvoulsy is unstainable


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## truthseeker (5 Jun 2012)

Sorry, I just noticed something else. Why is your current gf only paying 300 and you 700 for rent? Why are you paying more than her?

I think your best move is to try to renegotiate the sums with the ex - such that she is not profiting from the break up AND a more even split with the current gf on rent. And possibly a less expensive rental? Can you look into cheaper rent? 1000 is a lot for a 1 bed. Is it in a city centre? Can you look into something cheaper?

None of these solutions are long term, but you might get some breathing space.


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## SarahMc (5 Jun 2012)

I really don't see any way out of this keeping your credit rating intact. Also I suspect your ex may only negotiate with you if you make life uncomfortable, either by threatening to move back in, or by stopping your top up payments.

It's difficult, as you are jointly and severally liable, so she can threaten to stop paying and walk / fly away too leaving you with a 330k debt.


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## truthseeker (6 Jun 2012)

SarahMc said:


> I really don't see any way out of this keeping your credit rating intact. Also I suspect your ex may only negotiate with you if you make life uncomfortable, either by threatening to move back in, or by stopping your top up payments.
> 
> It's difficult, as you are jointly and severally liable, so she can threaten to stop paying and walk / fly away too leaving you with a 330k debt.



The ex holds a trump card that he does not. She is in the house. If her credit rating is threatened, so what, she has a home?

The OP does not want to move back in, commute too far, its beside her family etc... He wants no threat to his credit rating as he wants another mortgage.

The situation is unequal. The OP needs to equalise the situation, but she may refuse to move out and rent it out (why would she, itd cost her more) and he doesnt want to move in.


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## SwordsMan (6 Jun 2012)

hi 
with current rent reason im paying more is simple. I earn more and it works out that we both have roughtly same amount of disposable income after rent. 

As for finding a cheaper place, sure i can find a cheaper place but as i said i do not want to live in dump in a Dublin city centre and i looked for cheaper places but im in 30's now and do not want to live like a student.  I've done my time. 

trying to find a place within canals with cark parking under 1k that is nice/decent is very hard imo - don't think i can get much cheaper than want i currently have.


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## SwordsMan (6 Jun 2012)

ok back to my credit rating if i can.... 

either way,i can not go on continuing to pay for this indefinity, maybe i can pay this for next yr then i will have to find a bigger place, at this point i im going to fall short on mortgage payments. 

So that will mess up my Credit rating...

so whats the point of continueing paying i keep myself asking... either way, my credit rating is doomed be it now or say in yr or two time...I seem to be between rock and hard place 

if my credit rating is wrecked say due to this - what happens in 5 /10 years time does anyone know... will this hang over me forever or is this say insolvency bill potentially answer to my prayers..

but i think you guys are right i need to bring that payment down as much as i can and if that means renting out house, then i should go down that road but i can not see ex going for that as someone pointed out...while it improves my situation its does opposite for her.


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## elcato (6 Jun 2012)

Your credit ratings are only stored for 5 years by the ICB. Banks can be very forgiving once circumstances change. Why are you so keen to possibly make the same mistake again though ?


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## truthseeker (6 Jun 2012)

SwordsMan said:


> trying to find a place within canals with cark parking under 1k that is nice/decent is very hard imo - don't think i can get much cheaper than want i currently have.



Do you need to live within canals? You could shave a lot off that rent in a nice place a little further out.



SwordsMan said:


> so whats the point of continueing paying i keep myself asking... either way, my credit rating is doomed be it now or say in yr or two time...I seem to be between rock and hard place



I think its a temporary rock and hard place. You really need to equalise the situation with the ex to free up some cash immediately. But longer term, there will come a point where this house has equity or can be sold to cover remaining mortgage. So you *can* work this out over time without destroying your credit rating. But given your changed circumstances, do you want to?


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## SwordsMan (6 Jun 2012)

elcato said:


> Your credit ratings are only stored for 5 years by the ICB. Banks can be very forgiving once circumstances change. Why are you so keen to possibly make the same mistake again though ?


 
Not so keen to make same mistake again. Just i know i can not rent for the rest of my life and im early 30's now .

Do i rent till im 66 and then what??  If i do not get a house by time im 40 , i would have only say 25 yrs to pay it back.


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## SwordsMan (6 Jun 2012)

Does it have to be in canals. No i guess not but ideally within 30 mins of work. I done the long commute (well ive done the long stuck in traffic all day commute) and wasted 3 hrs a day leave at 730 home at 7, and i don't want to go back to that 

if i hang in there and say continue to pay for this house and hopefully one day (say 15 years time!) i can sell it off to clear rest of loan... ..just seem like a harsh price to pay ..its not my home , it never will be,but i could end up spending say 20 years of my life paying for it just to sell it to clear balance and all the time having negative effect on my family.

i know the moral hazard gang will say i signed up so should pay up and if i could afford to i would. I just do not think i will be able to without having adverse effects on others and for want.... 

thanks for all the comments guys...does give me a good bit to think about.
May wait till Banks bring out forbearance products and see if one of these is suitable to my situation but catch 22 is that u  probably need to be in arrears to "qualify"...the fact that ur living cash strapped , have a 2nd job so ur not in arrears does not seem to come into play.... 

although think these may be to keep people in homes..I want out of mine


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## truthseeker (6 Jun 2012)

Yeah I wouldnt do a long commute myself, but for example, my hubby went from Firhouse to dublin city centre daily for a year and he cycled it to beat the traffic - so there are ways and means around things.

You never know what will change though, maybe your ex will meet someone who wants your interest in the house gone and the two of them will take over the mortgage?

Im not personally a member of the moral hazard gang, I do think that you need to find a better solution than current. But I dont see a full way out without harming yourself in the process, re credit rating, ability to buy again etc..

But I do think you can juggle the situation so it costs you less. However, the ex will have to step up and agree to this.


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## gemma1 (6 Jun 2012)

Swordsman I am in the same situation. Ex bf is in the house, will not co-operate at all. I want to move on with my life and leave this stress behind. He is with a new partner, I really don't know why he is refusing to try and get me out of his life. Seems to be very little the ex who is out of the house can do.


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## SwordsMan (6 Jun 2012)

truthseeker said:


> Yeah I wouldnt do a long commute myself, but for example, my hubby went from Firhouse to dublin city centre daily for a year and he cycled it to beat the traffic - so there are ways and means around things.
> 
> You never know what will change though, maybe your ex will meet someone who wants your interest in the house gone and the two of them will take over the mortgage?
> 
> ...


 


I hear you, i actually did end up cycling into town as i got sick of the bus, 10 mile trip each way and it was quicker but the other half will not be cycling thats for sure. and when winter comes along, its cold, tough and actaully quite dangerous from my experience

yeah - tend to agree with u, no way i'll come out smelling of roses on this one and i would love to sign away my interest in house to some lucky dude ) althou he would probably be wondering "what have i done"  as i begin clicking my heels in the air as he signs


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## SwordsMan (6 Jun 2012)

gemma1 said:


> Swordsman I am in the same situation. Ex bf is in the house, will not co-operate at all. I want to move on with my life and leave this stress behind. He is with a new partner, I really don't know why he is refusing to try and get me out of his life. Seems to be very little the ex who is out of the house can do.


 

If i knew my ex was living with her partner (if she has one now that is)  in house, i would stop paying straight away. cos i would be pretty sure that is a game of chicken i would win.

I already feel like an eejet for paying, but if i knew some other bloke was living it up and me paying for it, well that would make my mind up and no advice or comments for anyone of AAM or else where would change my mind.


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## Thomas1 (16 Jun 2012)

OP, I work in one of the major banks and deal a lot with loans and lending. Your ex should be 'renting' the entire house i.e. paying €1k (or whatever the going rate is for an equivalent house) towards the mortgage and you both split the deficit after that. Simple as. It's her business then if she wants to rent a room.


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## SunnyDay (16 Aug 2012)

Thomas1 said:


> OP, I work in one of the major banks and deal a lot with loans and lending. Your ex should be 'renting' the entire house i.e. paying €1k (or whatever the going rate is for an equivalent house) towards the mortgage and you both split the deficit after that. Simple as. It's her business then if she wants to rent a room.



That's an interesting solution, although I feel the ex would feel like she is being done on this.. but in reality it is fair. I am in a very similiar situation but never thought of this solution. I am contacting my solicitor now!


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## mark12 (16 Aug 2012)

Although i never feel much sympathy for people who freely mortgaged their lifes away during the boom, i have to say that i feel sorry for the original poster in this particular case, i can't believe some of the advice given here like ''move into your ex, with your pregnant gf????''.
If i were you i would tell the bank that you need a reduced payment, more than IO but less than current payment you cant live like that, this way you and your ex are still paying capital and interest, only at a longer term. 

Another way to do this is to have the bank to agree to refinance at 40years instead of 29. All over Europe you have 50 year mortgages, ye you end up paying 2.5 times the original value but people get by, why do our banks think they are special and do 35 years max?


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