# Rental accommodation scheme (RAS): How does it work from Landlord & tenant POV?



## McGann

What advantages and disadvantages are there from the landlords point of view and likewise from the tenants point of view.

any feedback would be appreciated.
thankyou
Mcgann


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## minion

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*

you dont get to choose who is living in your property.

You get all the hassles of being the landlord, while getting less rent than the property is worth.

The property would have to be vacant a total of 6 months over the 5 year term for you to get less rent than RAS will give you.

I certainly wouldnt do it.


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## Shark Trager

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*

I have done enough research into it to realise there are very few advantages for a LL,not having much input into who will rent the house was frankly when I stopped reading up on it,probably suit laissez faire LLs who will no doubt have barrells of cash in reserve when anti social tenants trash the gaff,do not expect much compo from the council either.


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## Trustmeh

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*

Do a search and you will find pros and cons. mostly cons from those that havent done it.  Ill give a few pros from a long time "RA accepted" LL.

I have garunteed rent being paid for next two years.
straight into ban acct, no calling round or hassling for rent.
tenant is improving house as feels its her own. (plans to stay 10 years)
CC have increased my rent, and reviews every 2 years.
getting more than originally advertised.


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## DonKing

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*

There's no doubt that you may be lucky and get a model tenant who stays for 10 years. However as the council have full control over who can be housed in your house you are  relying on the council looking after your interest.....which they won't as they are not liable for any repairs to damage even  if it is criminal damage by the tenants.

Where do you think the council puts tenants who have been evicted by housing associations or unstable people in crisis situations?

The contract lets the council off the hook and until the councils  accept responsibility for unruly tenants and the damage they may cause you would want to be mad or desparate to sign up to it.


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## Trustmeh

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*



DonKing said:


> The contract lets the council off the hook and until the councils  accept responsibility for unruly tenants and the damage they may cause you would want to be mad or desparate to sign up to it.




Are you for real? What would the LL's do then? Just collect the councils money - your money, my money...and the LL sits back and claims every year for damages??  

In the real world the LL has to accept some responsibility for looking after their investment, their property. RA is a huge bonus/less hassle when managed correctly. I for one have had more hassle from so called "professionals" then I have had from RA. Im sorry my experience goes against your beliefs ... but im not makin it up.

BTW the council (in my county) does not do 10 year rentals. The tenant has told me shes wants to stay 10 years...but council will only do 2 years with rent review and option to renew. After two years i can put it back on the market if i want. I had the tenant in for 2 years (my own choosing not the councils) before we came to this arrangement so i was already pleased with such a great tenant. When they asked me to sign up to 2 years guaranteed rent with her...i said yes please.


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## Shark Trager

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*

I think you are confusing Rent allowance with the RAS scheme?I stand corrected if wrong.the RAS as far as I know runs for 5 years before renewal.


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## McGann

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS) replies*

Thanks for replies, did search on RAS, still making my mind up about it.
Cheers
McGann


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## Trustmeh

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*



Shark Trager said:


> I think you are confusing Rent allowance with the RAS scheme?I stand corrected if wrong.the RAS as far as I know runs for 5 years before renewal.


 
It may vary from county to county, but in the two counties where I use it...the old rent allowance is being replaced by the RAS scheme. And i believe the renewal is either 2 years max...or possibly up for negotiation. In my case it was 2 years.


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## DonKing

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*



yankinlk said:


> Are you for real?




Well yes... I am for real.


The council can put any sort of tenant it likes into your house, even ones who have been evicted elsewhere for various reasons(including damaging council property) and you the landlord will have to take up the tab if your property is thrashed.

The difference when you rent yourself or use an agent is that you can use your judgement and decide if you are happy with a particular tenant. 

You're giving away control of your property. 

If there is criminal damage to the property then it should be the council who is responsible for recouping the repair money from the "councils tenant". If the council's tenant won't pay then yes the coucil should have to pay the costs.

By the way. I have experience of social welfare tenants and to be honest they would be down my list of preferred tenants.


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## Shark Trager

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*

If there is criminal damage to the property then it should be the council who is responsible for recouping the repair money from the "councils tenant". If the council's tenant won't pay then yes the coucil should have to pay the costs.
 end quote
Agree with Don King.

Until the RAS scheme is properly and fairly re-evaluated and modified by Govt,no LL who has any common sense will touch this leper of a scheme with anything other than a search engine for its(few) pros and (mainly) cons.
There is a need for something akin to RAS but not in its Pontius Pilate,no responsibility form that it currently has.


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## Trustmeh

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*



DonKing said:


> The council can put any sort of tenant it likes into your house, even ones who have been evicted elsewhere for various reasons(including damaging council property) and you the landlord will have to take up the tab if your property is thrashed.
> 
> The difference when you rent yourself or use an agent is that you can use your judgement and decide if you are happy with a particular tenant.


 
I h8 to tell you lads, but not every RAS tenant is a criminal. Not every renter is either, and the bad ones don't carry signs around their necks.

Do a search on my previous posts and you will find that I have given the same advice you have. VET every tenant yourself. Giving the control of vetting youer tenants to an agent is exactly the same as giving it to the CC. is an agent gonna pay for cirminal damage?

Im sure you two have your biased reasoning that may even be coloured by some experience. I have always accepted RAS and so far have only chosen professionals once...and they are causing me more hassle tbh.


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## Trustmeh

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*

Let me eliminate another myth created by RAS haters. I have vettted all m,y tenants myself first day. I advertise my own houses, do my own interviews. If I decide I trust/like a tenant I will go through the process of RAS. It's at this stage that I can consider signing to a long term contract with the the tenant or not. AFTER I have done my own vetting.

Now, if it's the case that I have a contract in place and my tenant decides to up sticks and leave (not really a RAS tenant thing to do, they dont globetrot) then yes, I may have to take a tenant from the council.

But I have never had this situation happen yet! And I would like to hear from someone with real experience who can verify that this has happened during one of their tenancies. I suspect in that situation I could have an ad up and a tenant in before the CC would be fast enough to realize the house was empty.


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## Shark Trager

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*

Yankinlk,I hope you will continue in the future to be lucky with your tenants,good tenants are worth their weight in gold,and I will always go well past the last mile to keep them,I really wish the RAS scheme would be made more attractive to LLs,I think principle its an excellent idea for both tenants and LLs,but tbh the Govt are just been a bit too smart,failing to accecpt responsibilty for criminal damage caused by their client,and the inability of the LL to choose past the first tenant,makes this a non runner with a lot of LLs.


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## murphaph

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*



yankinlk said:


> Let me eliminate another myth created by RAS haters. I have vettted all m,y tenants myself first day. I advertise my own houses, do my own interviews. If I decide I trust/like a tenant I will go through the process of RAS. It's at this stage that I can consider signing to a long term contract with the the tenant or not. AFTER I have done my own vetting.
> 
> Now, if it's the case that I have a contract in place and my tenant decides to up sticks and leave (not really a RAS tenant thing to do, they dont globetrot) then yes, I may have to take a tenant from the council.
> 
> But I have never had this situation happen yet! And I would like to hear from someone with real experience who can verify that this has happened during one of their tenancies. I suspect in that situation I could have an ad up and a tenant in before the CC would be fast enough to realize the house was empty.


I think that's the way to do it-get someone in on RS and when they're there a few months and all is well and they say they want to stay, get them onto the RAS.


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## DonKing

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*



yankinlk said:


> I h8 to tell you lads, but not every RAS tenant is a criminal. Not every renter is either, and the bad ones don't carry signs around their necks.


 
Who said RAS tenants or renters were criminal? 




yankinlk said:


> Giving the control of vetting youer tenants to an agent is exactly the same as giving it to the CC. is an agent gonna pay for cirminal damage?.



No it's not the same. First of all an agent can select prospective tenants based on the landlords preferences and the landlord can still have the final say. This is what I do. Secondly a good agent will be looking for repeat business and should do their best to acquire decent tenants for their clients. I'm not sure if penpushers in the CC could actual give a sh**e about the LL's property.




yankinlk said:


> Im sure you two have your biased reasoning that may even be coloured by some experience. I have always accepted RAS and so far have only chosen professionals once...and they are causing me more hassle tbh.



Any type of tenant can turn out to be a bad tenant. My opinions are based on cold facts.....the contract is not a fair balanced contract and should be avoided unless of course you have property in the middle of nowhere and RAS is the only way you can get tenants.


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## DonKing

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*



yankinlk said:


> I suspect in that situation I could have an ad up and a tenant in before the CC would be fast enough to realize the house was empty.



This would be a breach of contract.


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## Trustmeh

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*



DonKing said:


> This would be a breach of contract.



You are one of those chaps that has an answer for everything. Look Don King - lets agree to disagree. My problem with you is that you don't speak about your RAS experience, I do. You continually make statements like the above that are based purely on your opinion.

I said before I would love someone with real world experience to join the discussion on what exactly happens when the RAS tenant ups sticks halfway through the tenancy. I have admitted that this has never happened to me (long may it continue). And I would presume that rather than have a property where the CC is paying me rent lay empty they would gladly work with a LL that actively looks for another RAS tenant...they might even allow him some leniency in vetting a few before he has to settle for a new one. I certainly have the experience of negotiating a RAS tenancy and I can tell you it was a back and forth discussion on terms/price/etc...We both left the table happy. And i actually got more rent than I had been getting the 2 years previous.


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## DonKing

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*



yankinlk said:


> You are one of those chaps that has an answer for everything.



No I don't, it's just that you have weak arguments.




yankinlk said:


> My problem with you is that you don't speak about your RAS experience, I do. You continually make statements like the above that are based purely on your opinion.



I'm sorry to hear you have a problem with me. 

Yes it is true that my statements are based on my opinion. Dublin Co Co contacted me a couple of years ago a asked if I would switch a tenant over to RAS. After discussions with them and a detailed examination of the propsoed contract, I decided to steer well clear of it for the reasons I have stated already. 



yankinlk said:


> I said before I would love someone with real world experience to join the discussion


Are you saying I live in some virtual world or something?



yankinlk said:


> to join the discussion on what exactly happens when the RAS tenant ups sticks halfway through the tenancy.



Have you not read your contract? I'm sure all the county councils RAS schemes are based on a similiar contract. The one I've seen (Dublin Co CO) is certainly very clear as to what happens in the scenerias you have mentioned.

If its not clear to you, I would suggest (in all seriousness) that you get your solicitor to advise you of your position.

I hope it continues to work out for you.


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## Trustmeh

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*



DonKing said:


> Yes it is true that my statements are based on my opinion.


Nuff said. My statements are factual, yours are not.



DonKing said:


> Dublin Co Co contacted me a couple of years ago a asked if I would switch a tenant over to RAS. After discussions with them and a detailed examination of the propsoed contract, I decided to steer well clear of it for the reasons I have stated already.



The reasons you stated already are:



DonKing said:


> However as the council have full control over who can be housed in your house you are relying on the council looking after your interest


I have shown how it is possible to use the RAS scheme to your advantage - and vet your own tenants like I did. I also propose that unlike your theory that the CC have a waiting list of unruly, criminal tenants waiting to jump into any house on the RAS scheme that in reality I could atually proactively organize a replacement tenant myself. If it ever happens to me that a tenant does leave I will surely try this and report back same.



DonKing said:


> Where do you think the council puts tenants who have been evicted by housing associations or unstable people in crisis situations?


I don't know, where? You seem to know it all...do tell us. They keep them locked in the filing cabinet with my RAS contract dont they? 



DonKing said:


> The contract lets the council off the hook and until the councils accept responsibility for unruly tenants and the damage they may cause you would want to be mad or desparate to sign up to it.



You are looking at the RAS contract all wrong. THe RAS scheme is a way for you to get a tenant/guaranteed rent provided by the CC. I ask you again are you saying that everyone that uses the services of the CC is some form of sub-human not worthy of respect and a warm safe home? 
When you sign a contract with RAS it is similar to an agency getting you a tenant. You have no idea what sort of tenant the agency will get you - they are just looking for their fee really. If the agency got you a tenant that caused criminal damage to your property, could you sue them? Of course not. The rental contract is between you and the tenant, not you and the agency.

Paint me mad and desperate then. I advertised my house and got a half dozen replies. Vetted and chose the best candidate that just happened to be RAS. Four years later shes still there. The CC has agreed to pay the rent for the next two years after which they will review at that point. If my tenant wants to stay (she is looking for 10 years) at that point they may pay me more in rent if I can negotiate same.

Look, just leave them to other LLs. I will never prove to you that its a good deal anyways.


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## DonKing

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*



yankinlk said:


> Nuff said. My statements are factual, yours are not.
> 
> 
> 
> The reasons you stated already are:
> 
> 
> I have shown how it is possible to use the RAS scheme to your advantage - and vet your own tenants like I did. I also propose that unlike your theory that the CC have a waiting list of unruly, criminal tenants waiting to jump into any house on the RAS scheme that in reality I could atually proactively organize a replacement tenant myself. If it ever happens to me that a tenant does leave I will surely try this and report back same.
> 
> 
> I don't know, where? You seem to know it all...do tell us. They keep them locked in the filing cabinet with my RAS contract dont they?
> 
> 
> 
> You are looking at the RAS contract all wrong. THe RAS scheme is a way for you to get a tenant/guaranteed rent provided by the CC. I ask you again are you saying that everyone that uses the services of the CC is some form of sub-human not worthy of respect and a warm safe home?
> When you sign a contract with RAS it is similar to an agency getting you a tenant. You have no idea what sort of tenant the agency will get you - they are just looking for their fee really. If the agency got you a tenant that caused criminal damage to your property, could you sue them? Of course not. The rental contract is between you and the tenant, not you and the agency.
> 
> Paint me mad and desperate then. I advertised my house and got a half dozen replies. Vetted and chose the best candidate that just happened to be RAS. Four years later shes still there. The CC has agreed to pay the rent for the next two years after which they will review at that point. If my tenant wants to stay (she is looking for 10 years) at that point they may pay me more in rent if I can negotiate same.
> 
> Look, just leave them to other LLs. I will never prove to you that its a good deal anyways.




You're statements are just getting silly now and I'm not going to bother to reply. You seem not to understand the risks associated with the contract. good luck to you anyhow.


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## murphaph

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*

Does anyone know if the councils are having difficulty obtaining RAS scheme properties?


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## Trustmeh

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*



DonKing said:


> You're statements are just getting silly now and I'm not going to bother to reply. You seem not to understand the risks associated with the contract. good luck to you anyhow.


 
Afraid its you that doesnt understand my freind. The risks with RAS are equal to the risks any Landlord faces when he/she puts his property up for rent. There is an equal chance that the tenant on RAS is a fine upstanding individual as any other that walks in off the street.

I figured this fact out a long time ago and happily accept RAS for RA.


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## gerry m

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*

no need to be arguing! - link to leaftet on RAS attached - gives the FACTs about the scheme


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## gerry m

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*

sorry link attached this time 

http://www.irishlandlord.com/index.aspx?page=documents&folder=Guides+And+Information


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## DonKing

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*



gerry m said:


> sorry link attached this time
> 
> http://www.irishlandlord.com/index.aspx?page=documents&folder=Guides+And+Information



This is just a general information pamplet taken from a government sponsered website. 

Landlords considering using the RAS scheme should examine carefully the contracts proposed by the respective county council and if they don't understand the contract or the possible implications of signing then they should consult with a solicitor for advice.

If anyone wants a copy of the Dublin County Council model contract I can send it on to them.

Gerry m you still havn't answered my question from the other thread.  Are you connected with the website Irishlandlord.com?


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## gerry m

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*

no, but I am a landlord and historically there has been very little good information and help out there for landlords so anything that helps and is Free to use is in my opinion to be welcomed and shared.


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## d6southsider

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*



DonKing said:


> If anyone wants a copy of the Dublin County Council model contract I can send it on to them.


 
Any chance you could send me copy?


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## d6southsider

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*



d6southsider said:


> Any chance you could send me copy?


 
I just read the following:

A series of contract types have been developed for use on the RAS scheme. These form the basis for contract negotiation. These fall broadly into three types.

1) An availability type arrangement to secure medium to long-term availability of accommodation (with us having nomination rights to accommodation).
2) A tenancy-by-tenancy arrangement to meet short-term accommodation requirements (we guarantee rent payment only for term that a specified tenancy is in existence)
3) A long-term PPP/Part V type arrangement between developers and us to secure long-term availability of accommodation.


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## Trustmeh

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*

exactly. In my experience if you aren't closed minded - the CC will work with you to come up with a solution that is agreeable to all 3 parties involved.


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## DonKing

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*



d6southsider said:


> Any chance you could send me copy?




I'm trying to figure out how to add attachments to PM's.....It may not be possible.

If you send me your e-mail address, I can send it via normal e-mail.


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## DonKing

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*



gerry m said:


> no, but I am a landlord and historically there has been very little good information and help out there for landlords so anything that helps and is Free to use is in my opinion to be welcomed and shared.



The amount of promonition you have provided for the site, you should really be looking for a fee from the website.


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## gerry m

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*

not a bad suggestion, they could hire me as their max clifford!


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## d6southsider

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*



yankinlk said:


> exactly. In my experience if you aren't closed minded - the CC will work with you to come up with a solution that is agreeable to all 3 parties involved.




I am considering a RAS contract, but I have reservations. 

The RAS scheme doesn't provide a Deposit to cover a Landlords security in the event of damage (which is more than routine wear and tear) to your property. Apparently you have to negotiate with your housing authority for reimbursement of your expenses and then they only guarantee the equivalent of up to one months rent towards the cost of repair/replacement.

As the scheme seems to be working so well for you could you advise me how you would approach this issue.


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## Trustmeh

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*

the tenant pays me a security deposit. just like any other tenant.


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## magero1001

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*

I am surprised at the level of negativity being circulated around here by some landlords about RAS tenants. I found this forum because i am looking for landlords that can accept RAS. As many people have said that probably those tenants that the Council put in your house are those that have anti-social behaviour, it seems that most people on this forum are making so much money that they are not in touch with the social reality.... RAS would be provided for those who are seeking to acquire some sort of stability in their lives, for example single mothers who want to work and thier income can not cater for their housing needs and budget for the kids. 

I am a good tenant and I have never lost any of my deposit to my landlords, even the landlords that tenants have told me they will look for every reason to hold money... My landlord doesn't want me to move but he won't accept RAS because he doesnt understand how it works. He wants me to give him more time, but i urgently need a RAS house. 

If you are a landlord that accepts RAS and you are living in dublin 15, and willing to give me a chance please contact me


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## murphaph

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*

check your messages magero.


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## S.L.F

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*

Hi magero,

welcome to AAM.

I can only speak for myself on this matter, until the CC's put better safeguards in place for landlords things will stay the same.

I read the DLRCC RAS contract and based on that I decided not to pursue SW tenants.

At least if a private tenant wrecks my place I can sue them.

That option is not there for SW tenants as they have no money.


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## AHEN

*A Tenant With First Hand Experience*

The Landlord in this scheme is in a Win WIN WIN situation, full rent from Council in my place it's 750euro a month this upstart of a Landlord is getting paid whether any of the places are occupied or not also there is a clause in there that if the tennant leave and leaves it a bit broken the council pay a bit towards the repairs......Wow what succers and when I was on rent allowance I would be told if I moved into a place of this price per month, that I should not be in a place of this price and would be refused rent allowance, but the council can pay the full whack, and I pay a nominal fee to the council every week.

The Tenant has no safety net in this situation as the Landlord holds all the rights and this guy whom I wasn't given the opportunity to meet to see if I would like to be a tennant of his has given me an eviction notice the lst one I ever got in my life of Private Renting, I got completely stress and even very low in myself as it was completely illegal and also the lease which I received from the Council nearly four months into my tenancy was dated wrong the wrong year and the start date of my tenancy was not even on it. The Landlord was not registered with the PRTB which is one of the legalities to rent through the RAS Scheme, so there is an Illegal Landlord giving out an Illegal Notice.

Before getting this I had lived through hell trying to get the Landlord to sort out an unearthly mad nosey woman beside me who made my life hell since she moved in shouting abuse if you hadn't time to talk to her and peeking out the door every time you came in or went out. She was very fond of my place. Then the guy downstairs could play his drums in the small hours of the morning even heard him mid week had to call down one morning at 5am bit daunting as he is in a basement flat under me outside the house, Landlord did nothing about either. I made a phone call to the Landlord re; a pipe in loo that needed seeing to and said if I was not back to let himself in he was extremely nice and said he should be up that night and have a look at it, I arrived back no pipe looked at but a sinister eviction notice under my door. This was the lst eviction notice I ever got in my life and knew I was set up by certain, or said tennants. going down the PRTB route discovered the eviction notice was illegal and also that he was not registered with the PRTB which is one of the serious legalities of joing the RAS scheme as a Landlord. He then tried to placate me by saying he's do all in his power to work with RAS to get me a better place, he was just looking for the 28 days to be up so I couldn't put a case in with the PRTB. I have suffered hell in this house and as a tennant have been thrown to the wolves by the Council who say these things are between the Landlord and me, I also had complained to them about this woman next door and the guy downstairs and they weren't bothered told me to tell the Landlord. On moving in the Council lure the tennant into a false state of security saying if anything goes wrong we will have to rehouse you on mentioning that there was a complete shutdown. I even now thing that the Landlord might be giving a back hander to some of these guys in the RAS scheme to turn the eye on he not being Registered.

Well to make this long story short and for someone who has an impecable record with renting to have to be dragged down by the likes of a twised up start of a landlord and the council is reall sad. I seriously feel like sueing him for defammation of character and extreme stress.

The Landlord has all to win and the tennant doesn't get a say in anything so here's your first had information.

Hope someone knows understands what I'm saying here.  

ps.  Also when on Rent Allowance in Private Rented got excellent references, was never behind in rent always full rent on time.  Never had trouble with Landlord or tennant.

Thanks for hearing me out 

AHEN


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## AHEN

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*



S.L.F said:


> Hi magero,
> 
> welcome to AAM.
> 
> I can only speak for myself on this matter, until the CC's put better safeguards in place for landlords things will stay the same.
> 
> I read the DLRCC RAS contract and based on that I decided not to pursue SW tenants.
> 
> At least if a private tenant wrecks my place I can sue them.
> 
> That option is not there for SW tenants as they have no money.


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## AHEN

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*

How


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## AHEN

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*

From renting in the Private Rented sector and with no problems from Landlords or tennants.  Unfortunately I had to write about my experience with being a tennant with RAS in an earlier post and never knew who my landlord was and never met him before I moved in, could have been a saving point for me, but never given the chance with DCCouncil.

The most Tennants who do a runner are one's who are working, lst they have the money to Rent again without having to source a Landlord who accepts Rent Allowance.  They give no notice and I know from Landlords asking me questions as to some that disappeared leaving substantial amounts of rent unpaid that the working people PROFESSIONALS as term used in ads, are the very one's you would never even catch again to lst get your rent that's due off them, 2 to sue them if they wrecked your place as they have their reference letters, names and even sometimes their real names not used....

A rent allowance tennant is the same, as a working person as they pay rent too, and not all of us are sub humans who are out to destroy property, some of us are in this situation due to situations in our life which sadly led us down this path, and are sometimes more educated, cultured and more honest than some of the Landlords collecting the rent.

Not saying this re; every landlord, ever RA Tennant, or Professional.

There is the good and the questionable and downright rough and ignorant in every walk of life so with the tennant getting a nice landlord it's a game of chance and if happens respect on both sides ensues thus a pleasant situation all round.  

Hope I have been of some help and put it from both perspectives.

Thank you

AHEN


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## S.L.F

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*



AHEN said:


> How



What?


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## edwardg

*Re: Rental Accommodation Scheme (RAS)*

Thank you all for the very infomative discussion on RAS. I have a tenant and his family who have rented from me for the last two years. He is an excellent tenant and I would like to keep him forever. He is a non-national and initially was here to study and was therefore receiving a health board allowance towrds the rent arounf Euro 1150 for Dublin.

Now that he is about to start work he wont qualify for the whole of this Health Board allowance and wants to move to the RAS scheme where he will get more of a subsidy towards his rent. I am happy to go along with this but on one condition that I can enter what is described by DCC as:

'a tenancy-by-tenancy arrangement to meet short-term accommodation requirements (we guarantee rent payment only for term that a specified tenancy is in existence)'

I only want to sign up for this tenant. Is that possible or do you have to sign up for a minimum of four years and take other RAS tenants if the original one leaves.

I would be grateful for any advice which you could give me on this matter.

Ed


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## Helen

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*

I've just been asked by my tennant to go on this RAS scheme, so I've just started looking into it. He has been a fantastic tennant for the last 2 years, so of course if there's something I can do for him, I will. 
My question is what is the difference to the tennant between the old RA scheme and the new RAS scheme? He is a non national, with average English so I couldn't really understand why when I asked him.


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## murphaph

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*

He will have more security of tenure in theory under the RAS scheme as it is designed for long term housing needs, hence the council contract your house for up to 5 years at a time. For practical purposes there is no difference to your tenant but I believe the powers that be want a migration to RAS and away from RS. He may well have been asked by them to migrate to RAS.


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## Helen

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*

OK thanks Murphaph. Had been wondering if I was missing something!


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## wollypolly

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*

Hi new to this posting thread stuff so bear with me!!  I'm a landlord & considering the RAS but council only offering 1k can tenant put towards this to make up difference? Anyone know how long process can take & if council allows you to meet tenants before accepting them. Thanks


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## diver

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*

Hi, the answer to your first question is no, the agreement is between you and the council, therefore if the council are offering 1k, that is it. RAS rents are generally 100 euro lower per month (maybe more) than the going rent for the local area. However, if your property is vacant for any period of time between tenancies, RAS still pay you this rent. I have a property with RAS for 2 yrs now, it was vacant for 3 months before they ever sent me my first tenants and I was paid rent every month until it was finally occupied!. The security of payments is well worth it in my book!
The process can take anywhere between 3-8 weeks depending on how busy your local county council is. Call them to find out. Your property will need to be approved and deemed habitable with all necessary smoke alarms, vents etc, this is done by Dept of the Environment prior to you being accepted as a RAS landlord.
Lastly, all council tenants are vetted by the council and have garda clearance before being accepted by the council onto the scheme. Therefore you don't vett them hence you have to accept them, you don't have a choice.
Hope this helps.


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## DonKing

*Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*



diver said:


> Lastly, all council tenants are vetted by the council and have garda clearance before being accepted by the council onto the scheme. Therefore you don't vett them hence you have to accept them, you don't have a choice.
> Hope this helps.



This is the problem with CERTAIN RAS contracts. The council can put whoever they like into your property and you have to foot the bill if there is any damage. The council may make a contribution (1 months rent) but that is not going cover any significant damage. In saying that, its not in the council's interest to have a string of landlords complaining that the council are placing unruely tenants into RAS accomodation.


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## Rusty Cogs

Has anyone renewed their RAS contract with their local council recently ? My four year contract is coming to an end and I'm wondering what the process is ?

i.e. will the rent be reviewd (possibly downward)
are CC walking away from properties with the amount of vacant choice out there ?


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## Novic

*Rental Accommodation Scheme*

I have a house rented  through this scheme and now two years into the agreement the council have decreased the rent by E 200.  Has anyone else had this experience.  The grounds quoted for the decrease was based on a rent review in the area.  I had no choice other than accept the new rent or pull out of the scheme. The council made the decision without and consultation.


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## blackrose

*Rental accomodation scheme*

Does anybody know how it works?, advantages, disadvantages?


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## colly

Guys I am looking into this too. I have an aprtment which for 4 out of the last 6 years had been rented and manged no problem without costing me any money. However last time the tenant movbed out it was empty for 6 months before I found anyone new. My current tenant never pays his rent on time and its a nightmare chasing him almost every week. I'm afraid to throw him out in case I'm another 6 months without anyone in there, paying the mortgage myself. I'd be happy to take a decrease in rent if I knew it was always coming as I would not have the hassle.

The thing is they ask for a tax clearance cert. What is this exactly and what does it mean? I have paid all my PRTB things etc for the last year - but I've never declared tax on it since I've never made any profit out of it really. Can anyone advise?


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## jonocon

i have a few properties with RAS, generally it works ok, in my experience they are reasonably fair but with the 2 year rent reviews they are unilateral, take it or leave it they say. You need your paper work in order, tax clearance cert, ber cert, and in my case I needed a fire cert, once all those things are in place the rent rolls in, fingers crossed with tenants, so far i havent had problems and i've been with them 5 years


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## philb

Hi Colly,

I'd recommend that you look into your tax situation as soon as possible.  You're obliged to file a return on your rental income even if you don't  make a profit. In my case, I'm a PAYE worker but I also file an annual  return where I state the amount of rent received, the amount of mortgage  interest and other expenses paid etc. The revenue then work out what  (if anything) I owe. Sometimes they owe me money and sometimes I owe  them but regardless, they will fine me if I file late.

Regarding making a loss, you need to be very sure that this is the case.  Suppose your monthly rent is €800 and your monthly mortgage payment is  €1,200. You might think that since you are taking in less than you are  paying out, that you are making a loss. However, the €1,200 is made up  of capital and interest payments (lets suppose 700 capital and 500  interest) and only the interest bit is deductable. Furthermore, not all  of the interest is deductable, currently only 75% of it is. So lets  imagine the following:

Monthly rent: 800
Annual rent: 9,600 (800 x 12)

Monthly interest: 500
Annual interest: 6,000 (500 x 12)
Deductable annual interest: 4,500 (75% of 6,000)

Your annual gross profit: 5,100 (9,600 - 4,500)

I apologise if this is stuff that you already know, I thought it was  worthwhile laying it all out for the benefit of other readers of the  site. 

As regards your historical position, if it turns out that you don't owe  anything, I'm sure revenue won't be too worried about not filing  returns. If you do owe them, then the fact that you have voluntarily  disclosed this will mean that they should be prepared to waive fines and  possibly reach a compromise on what you have to repay.

Good luck,
Phil


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## brightbuddy

Can anyone give me some real information from the Landlord's side on how the RAS 10 year lock in housing scheme  is working and is it working well, what are the drawbacks.


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## shazck

*ras*

im lookin for advice on how to find a landlord who wants to do ras my daughter is 21 with a 19mt old son and she has been approved for ras she is a very good tennent causes no problems wer lookin for a two bed apt or house on the northside if anyone can help i would very grateful tanx all


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## diceyreilly

*RAS Scheme*

Just wondering can anyone advise experience of this scheme with Waterford City Council. I am considering this scheme. 
However, if it is the same as rent allowance in Kildare I will not take it up. 
This is my experience and reasons why:
I agreed a tenancy with a very good tenant. We both requested that the rent be paid directly into my bank account.The rent was not paid for approx 2.5 months and this was posted (cheque)direct to tenant. Next month was paid (3 weeks late) direct to tenant less €100 and a week later this balance arrived by post again. This month is late again.
Each time the tenant rang the Rent allowance section in Dublin to request rent paid direct to my bank a/c.(always left holding for 40 mins plus).
The Tenant has now given notice and is moving home until money raised to pay rent some where without rent allowance. The tenant has said they are frustrated and embarassed by the constant problems incurred with the RA Section.I did not query the tenant at any stage as I know genuine efforts were being made to get rent paid.
It is a pity to lose a fine tenant as a result of actions (inactions) of a government agency and have to readvertise pay PRTB BER etc within such a short period.
This was the tenants and my first time to use this system and it looks like we both will not be using it again. Great little country.Sorry if I have taken off on another tangent.


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## Rugby77

Does anyone know how many offers the cc have to offer a ras tenant before they are deemed to have declined all offers & are then off the ras & housing list? Does it vary from county to county or does it go by original contract?


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## Dia

*Dear Trustmeh:*

I am writing to you in a matter of RAS scheme as I've seen that you are a landlord and also much aware of rules regarding this scheme but also very kind towards you'r tenants. I am a tenant myself,a tenant that has just signed into this RAS with my landlord last month trough his agency ( I would also like to mention that I live at this property for the last two years--from 2011). I am a single mother of one child that is 13 and in receipt of SW, but also been working part-time since an unfortunate event brought me into this situation. Anyway, because I had applied for a house with DCC for more then 14, they told me that I can only claim Rent Supplement for 12 moths and then I have to consider other housing authorities offers (Voluntary housing, RAS,etc), so they somehow made me move out from the landlord that I was with for 13 years(because I had only one bedroom and by law I had to have two bedrooms as I have a son, even though my landlady had given and created me all comfort, and all conditions I had to move out) . So I found myself searching for a good place, in a good area, with decent neighbours around me. I went to this agency and I told them my story, I told them that I am looking to move into a two bedroom property, where the landlord will agree with RAS. They showed me this property and they convinced me that all is going to go according our discussion(also gave me this in writing). Two years I tried to pursue them to make the contract, as for some reasons out of my knowledge they changed their mind couple of months after moving in and paying deposit and rent, and changing my son school. Finally they signed last month and it seems that the CC is paying them 50 euro less then the rent was. Now, I am paying to CC every week 15% of my income, while CC is paying them the rent but less 50 euro. For the last 3 weeks they call me, email me to pay ,,the balance that we agree'' , even though we never had such agreement or such talk. I called the information desk at the RAS department and ask them if I should do that or not. They told me that if they ever catch me doing it, I will loose all my entitlements, and that the only rent that I should pay is to them. The agency called me and threaten me that they are going to terminate the contract if I don't pay the balance. I called back CC, and just asked them what could happen if they change their mind and want to terminate,and they told me that the landlord signed an agreement and if him or his agency are threatening me to forward them   the emails and they will take it from there. They also told me that the landlord can terminate the contract only if: he wants to move himself in this property, he wants to sell the property or refurbish it.Is this true? What can happen? I would be very sad and upset if I would have to move again as this is my second home in the last 16 years in Ireland and I've invested allot of money in things to make it cosy and ,,home''. I would also be very scared that they would put me into a property that is not into a nice neighbourhood.I do not like moving from one place to another and it seems that I've lost a great landlord that had no two-bedrooms apartment for me, for this one that I didn't even get to see or to talk to in the last two years since I live in his property. And it is true, not all the tenants are criminals and outlaws... I worked and paid taxes for 10 years and my partner for 14 years before he died, I get benefits that I never wanted and I wish no one, landlord or tenant to ever go trough this. Thank you and best regards.


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## diver

Rugby77 said:


> Does anyone know how many offers the cc have to offer a ras tenant before they are deemed to have declined all offers & are then off the ras & housing list? Does it vary from county to county or does it go by original contract?


 

As a landlord with a RAS property, I was told by SDCC that their tenants get 3 offers of properties before they are off the housing list.


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## Dia

It might be different from county to county, but as a tenant, I was told that the rule had changed, and instead of 3 offers as it use to be, we only have 2 offers now.


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## diver

Dia said:


> I am writing to you in a matter of RAS scheme as I've seen that you are a landlord and also much aware of rules regarding this scheme but also very kind towards you'r tenants. I am a tenant myself,a tenant that has just signed into this RAS with my landlord last month trough his agency ( I would also like to mention that I live at this property for the last two years--from 2011). I am a single mother of one child that is 13 and in receipt of SW, but also been working part-time since an unfortunate event brought me into this situation. Anyway, because I had applied for a house with DCC for more then 14, they told me that I can only claim Rent Supplement for 12 moths and then I have to consider other housing authorities offers (Voluntary housing, RAS,etc), so they somehow made me move out from the landlord that I was with for 13 years(because I had only one bedroom and by law I had to have two bedrooms as I have a son, even though my landlady had given and created me all comfort, and all conditions I had to move out) . So I found myself searching for a good place, in a good area, with decent neighbours around me. I went to this agency and I told them my story, I told them that I am looking to move into a two bedroom property, where the landlord will agree with RAS. They showed me this property and they convinced me that all is going to go according our discussion(also gave me this in writing). Two years I tried to pursue them to make the contract, as for some reasons out of my knowledge they changed their mind couple of months after moving in and paying deposit and rent, and changing my son school. Finally they signed last month and it seems that the CC is paying them 50 euro less then the rent was. Now, I am paying to CC every week 15% of my income, while CC is paying them the rent but less 50 euro. For the last 3 weeks they call me, email me to pay ,,the balance that we agree'' , even though we never had such agreement or such talk. I called the information desk at the RAS department and ask them if I should do that or not. They told me that if they ever catch me doing it, I will loose all my entitlements, and that the only rent that I should pay is to them. The agency called me and threaten me that they are going to terminate the contract if I don't pay the balance. I called back CC, and just asked them what could happen if they change their mind and want to terminate,and they told me that the landlord signed an agreement and if him or his agency are threatening me to forward them the emails and they will take it from there. They also told me that the landlord can terminate the contract only if: he wants to move himself in this property, he wants to sell the property or refurbish it.Is this true? What can happen? I would be very sad and upset if I would have to move again as this is my second home in the last 16 years in Ireland and I've invested allot of money in things to make it cosy and ,,home''. I would also be very scared that they would put me into a property that is not into a nice neighbourhood.I do not like moving from one place to another and it seems that I've lost a great landlord that had no two-bedrooms apartment for me, for this one that I didn't even get to see or to talk to in the last two years since I live in his property. And it is true, not all the tenants are criminals and outlaws... I worked and paid taxes for 10 years and my partner for 14 years before he died, I get benefits that I never wanted and I wish no one, landlord or tenant to ever go trough this. Thank you and best regards.


 

DIA, sorry to hear of this.

Firstly, as a RAS tenant, your contract is with your County Council.

Your landlord's contract is also with the County Council.

Your landlord, or the agency representing him/her, would have agreed on the monthly sum payable by RAS to them before they would have signed their contract with RAS. Once that contract has been agreed and signed, rents can be negotiated upwards or downwards every 2 years at review time.

Your landlord/agency have no right to come to you looking to make up any "shortfall" in rent having an agreed rent amount in place so please take the advice you've been given by RAS and don't engage with them. 

Landlords can only cease a contract with RAS, thus terminating a tenancy if they're selling the property or require it for their own use.

Let the landlord deal with RAS, send all his/her correspondence to RAS as requested. Unfortunately this will decide the outcome for you.

I hope it works out.


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## Trustmeh

diver said:


> DIA, sorry to hear of this.
> 
> Firstly, as a RAS tenant, your contract is with your County Council.
> 
> Your landlord's contract is also with the County Council.



Im sorry but this advice is not correct.

There is a "trinity" between the 3 parties. The landlord and CC, the tenant and CC, and still the landlord and tenant. It is still the responsibilty of the landlord to manage the tenant, and a normal lease agreement is in place, with all relevant rights to both parties.

Its true that a LL no longer needs to collect rent, and its true they should not ask for the extra, however, it is common and widespread. Wether right or wrong, many tenants insist on breaking the rule, simply because the properties that fall within the CC pricing are NOT in good areas. tenants and happy to pay a little more to get a better place. This trinity i speak of means im afraid you still need to talk and deal with your landlord or agent.

Did you sign a lease? Did this lease ask for a monthly amount of money? Did this amount MATCH the amount the CC has agreed to pay in the RAS scheme? It sounds like it is not the same amount.


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## Trustmeh

diceyreilly1 said:


> Just wondering can anyone advise experience of this scheme with Waterford City Council. I am considering this scheme.
> However, if it is the same as rent allowance in Kildare I will not take it up.
> This is my experience and reasons why:
> I agreed a tenancy with a very good tenant. We both requested that the rent be paid directly into my bank account.The rent was not paid for approx 2.5 months and this was posted (cheque)direct to tenant. Next month was paid (3 weeks late) direct to tenant less €100 and a week later this balance arrived by post again. This month is late again.
> Each time the tenant rang the Rent allowance section in Dublin to request rent paid direct to my bank a/c.(always left holding for 40 mins plus).
> The Tenant has now given notice and is moving home until money raised to pay rent some where without rent allowance. The tenant has said they are frustrated and embarassed by the constant problems incurred with the RA Section.I did not query the tenant at any stage as I know genuine efforts were being made to get rent paid.
> It is a pity to lose a fine tenant as a result of actions (inactions) of a government agency and have to readvertise pay PRTB BER etc within such a short period.
> This was the tenants and my first time to use this system and it looks like we both will not be using it again. Great little country.Sorry if I have taken off on another tangent.



Im sorry i missed this post when it happened. The key part of this quote is where the LL believed all the tenant told them, without querying the CC directly. In my area, RAS is never paid to the LL directly, and you cannot change that, they will refuse. I have tried. 

Many a tenant has tried to use the CC as a reason to delay paying me rent or even a deposit. You need to be sharp,you need to be strict. When a tenant starts deviating from the normal rule of paying deposit and first months rent in advance of getting keys, you should hear alarm bells. It really is that simple.


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## Kirsty Ellen Mckenna

Good morning all, 

After carefully reading and evaluating comments on this forum about the Ras scheme,  I am quite surprised that some of you think that tenants who are on this scheme,  are uneducated criminals. We cannot define a personality or one's character based on their revenue. We cannot generalise as each person's situation is different,  poor pocket does not necessarily mean poor education or principles.

I am not quite familiar with the ras scheme,  but I have been researching it's pro's and cons as a tenant. I am open to any advice concerning the ras scheme. 

I am also looking for a Landlord that would be willing to sign up with my partner and I,  here are the various area's we hope to find a home: (,Bunclody, Bray, Camolin, Gorey, Greystones,).

Our personal Situation, and Experience with private renting.
I am an Irish national,  My partner is a French National,  having spent ten year's Studying and working in the South of France,  I am new to the Irish rental market,  we moved back too Ireland on the 31st of January 2014,  a pure delight to be home. In March 2014 we found private rental accommodation in Carnew Co.Wicklow, Despite that our current property is physically magnificent and very Spacious,  we were strongly misinformed about the property and area.

We have always paid our rent,  Which amounts too 715.00€ per month,  We had no rent allowance for the first 8 months and we never missed a day's rent. we consider ourselves as very good tenants,  we are quite, and like to keep to ourselves. We upkeep the property to a better standard,  than it was prior to us moving in. In less than a year we have covered all of our Landlords responsibilitys and expenses, This has amounted to 1500.00€ all receipts are documented.

Our house was advertised on many rental sites as furnished,  upon our arrival for a visit the house was empty,  and we had realised that they had used old photo's to advertise the property, The house was filthy beyond compare,  also the Garden was supposed to be fully fenced and secure,  as in photo's,  but Fencing had been removed.

We considered all the downsides that were noticed at that time about the property,  but we also had to consider the fact that a landlord that accepts rent allowance was rare,  as we visited over thirty properties,  to find that rent allowance was a no go.

We agreed in signing a lease of 12 months,  I would like to state that I have three children,  two of which have multiple Disabilities,  hence the reason I had to put a stop to my career. And the reason I am in receipt of social Welfare benefits.

We had ask the Landlord to remove all rubbish from the garden,  for hygiene purposes before we move in. Nothing was done,  we paid 110€00 too green star dump,  and another 140€00 too Maguires Skips. For the removal.

We had asked why the lino in the kitchen was bubbled,  we were told it was an amateur job,  clausible until the lino turned green with fungicides,  when removed what laid benieth was an outrage. We asked the landlord to replace the flooring,  nothing done. Another 180€00.

During the Summer we were left two months without hot water. 

The two bedrooms downstairs cannot be used due to high humidity.  That we have treated but has come back over and over again. 
The plumbing does not work upstairs.
There is no insulation in the house and the windows are not sealed properly.
There is no valid heating system.  We have a back boiler stove which would be marvellous if it heated all the radiators. It consumes 40kilos of coal every 24hours and the house is lukewarm,  and if we stop heating the house is Freezing within 20 minutes.

My children have been sick on numerous occasions and as I speak we are all ill with the flu.

The cuboard doors in the Kitchen fell on my 4 year old foot causing her to lose her toe nail,  and the pain my little one indured.

We have painted the house top to bottom with the Landlords permission of course,  as I am ocd when it comes to stains,  with high quality paint.

As a family we have been driven Insane by certain local hooligans,  smashing the windows,  throwing eggs at the house,  destroying my flower beds and garden Furniture,  we cannot leave the house unattended as we experienced attempted burglary three time's. 

The list goes on,  most of the above would not bother me if the Landlord was polite and grateful,  We constantly get attitude which is stressful as I prefer to avoid disputes,  hence why we are looking for a new home as we cannot enjoy this one.

We have a preference for Gorey and Bray as my partner has applied for the fire service.

Thank you for reading.


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## Eisenhardt

diver said:


> *Re: Rental accommodation scheme (RAS)*
> 
> Hi, the answer to your first question is no, the agreement is between you and the council, therefore if the council are offering 1k, that is it. RAS rents are generally 100 euro lower per month (maybe more) than the going rent for the local area. However, if your property is vacant for any period of time between tenancies, RAS still pay you this rent. I have a property with RAS for 2 yrs now, it was vacant for 3 months before they ever sent me my first tenants and I was paid rent every month until it was finally occupied!. The security of payments is well worth it in my book!
> The process can take anywhere between 3-8 weeks depending on how busy your local county council is. Call them to find out. Your property will need to be approved and deemed habitable with all necessary smoke alarms, vents etc, this is done by Dept of the Environment prior to you being accepted as a RAS landlord.
> Lastly, all council tenants are vetted by the council and have garda clearance before being accepted by the council onto the scheme. Therefore you don't vett them hence you have to accept them, you don't have a choice.
> Hope this helps.


I would agree with most of this... And yes you have a contract with cc... However, as soon as the contract is signed, everything else is between you and the tenant.. Cc will not get involved and will tell you it's between you and the tenant...  So when it goes above and beyond wear and tear, they will do nothing... NOTHING...  So don't expect any back up or any back up with be snide... Drawn out to give the tenant additional time in the house... 
Council will pay 90% of the rent in the area... And now this is for two years...  Which is ok..
We cannot wait to get out of the RAS... no guarantee it will be any better private... But tenant we have has broken everything in the house and expects us to pay to fix everything... And repair... The fairies must be breaking everything.. Hiw many washing machines and cookers should a landlord have to replace.. According to cc, there is nothing wrong with continually replacing these all the time... I don't think this is fair at all...   
We just want a tenant who will look after the house... And take some responsibility for things they break...


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