# advice regarding the purchase of a camper van



## Henny Penny (10 Jan 2006)

Just looking for some advice regarding the purchase of a camper van. We are seriously thinking about buying one ... possibly second hand. Mr. HP is thinking of going to Germany/Holland to import one. Any advice or recommendations would be greatly appreciated. Also very keen to hear about the pitfalls and stuff to watch out for. Thanks


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## PGD1 (10 Jan 2006)

I have imported on from Germany. It was easy and I saved about 10,000 to 15,000 off the prices in irish dealers.

Germany is a good place to buy . huge market and loads of good quality german brands.

the dealers will sort out your export docs etc etc


Biggest issue is getting a van the correct weight so you don't have to pay VRT.

Are you aware of all this type of stuff?


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## Henny Penny (10 Jan 2006)

Thanks PGD1 for your reply. 
Are you saying that there is an exemption in VRT if the camper is a certain weight? 
Did you buy new or second hand? 
What make is your camper? 
We are 4 so for comfort we will be looking for a 6 berth.


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## zag (10 Jan 2006)

Henny Penny - we went to Germany 2 years ago and did just this.  I understand PDG did it last year.  There is big money to be saved doing it this way.  For example, we spent in or around €20K (including flights, ships, hotels, VRT, everything) for a vehicle that a) wouldn't have been available here in the first place and b) would have cost €25K+ if it was here.

In addition you get a huge choice over there.  By way of example, the 2nd hand market here might have (maybe) 70-100 vehicles in total at any one time.  Check out Buy & Sell and some of the dealers to get an idea of the numbers.  Meantime in Germany we came across quite a few dealers within spitting distance of Munich who had literally hundreds (each) on their forecourts - and that was on a 2 day trip to nowhere in particular.

There is a relatively fine line between a vehicle over 3 tons which doesn't attract VRT and one over 3.5t which requires a new license (and driving test).  You will find that many 'standard' 4-6 berth vehicles are under 3t, while those with all the bells & whistles (TV, satellite, microwave, electric steps, etc . . .) are over.  VRT for the 

Check out  and then click on "Wohnmobile & -wagen suchen" to see what is available and example prices.  Try giving it low and high prices and see what is available in your price range.

Campervan'ing is great fun altogether - we love it and try to get away as often as possible in the Summer and take it out over Winter for somewhere warm and dry to retreat to (and to eat in) after walks in the country.

Try doing a search on the site here for campervan and you should get a good few old posts with hints and tips which have been made over time.

Have fun,

z


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## daviehug (11 Jan 2006)

If you are buying a 2nd hand check the following:

that there is an official German registration document which shows all the vehicle details
the chassis number on the vehicle to ensure it agrees with the reg document

it is over 6 months old
it has travelled over 6000km  *Once these conditions are met you will not be charged VAT in Ireland.*
For VRT purposes the charge is only €50 if it exceeds 3 tonne unladen weight.  You will need to get it weighed ( go to your nearest landfill site) before you call to the registration authorities in Ireland.  If it is close to 3 tonne it may need to be weighed again...buy something that is well over 3 tonne

Happy camping

dave


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## PGD1 (11 Jan 2006)

the mobile.de site has an engligh version... check the bottom of the page.


You have to be very careful with the weights. VRT is based on the unladen weight of the van. This i sthe van from the factory, plus anything bolted on, plus a tank of fuel.

Some manufacturers will quote the van weight as the unladen weight. Some will guote is as the MRO... Mass in Runnin Order. MRO also include gas, water and (I think) 75kg for one person.

It's a bit of a chance but if the van weights over 3000kg then there is NO VRT (well €60 or something).

I was in exactly the same situation as you..4 people but getting a 6 berth. I bought a Knaus Sun Traveler 608k. It is over the weight and has an excellent layout, and is a good quality make.

There are always a few for sale on mobile.de

Another important fact is that as the vans get older (and cheaper) they start to loose things liek 4x full seatbelts in the rear... and headrests in the rear (on the dining areas).

It's easy in Germany to find a fully loaded van. The one I got has upgraded suspension (to 3850kg) air suspension, climate ,reversing camera, awning, roof box. alloy wheels with camping tyres, upgraded interior, upgraded sound system etc etc etc

I definately saved over €10k

The other MAJOR issue is payload.

Most vans are rated to carry 3500kg. Now if you are avoiding VRT then your unladen weigth is going to be 3000kg at a minimum. Add in 100litres of water, gas and 4 people and you have no weight left to carry anything!!!

Solution: get a van that is rated to 3850kg or higher... but then your B licence won't allow you to drive it. It's a tricky one to be honest. If you get a van <3000kg you end up with VRT t0 pay and also perhaps a smaller van that doesn't suit.

In my case I got a van that had already been upgraded to 3850. I got the dealer in Germany to "re-plate" (document) it as 3500. In Germany they are very efficient and when they did this it was noted I could only carry 4 people. Fine.

In Ireland it was recognised as 3500 but 6 people. I might break the 3500kg limit, and I will be breaking some road traffic act, somewhere, but I know the van is safe. I haven't never met anybody who has been fined for breaking the weight although there are random test and some EU countries would be worse than others. 

If you have more questions then feel free to PM me.

BTW there is an excellent site called www.motorhomefacts.com


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## PGD1 (11 Jan 2006)

one other thing!

The absolute most important thing when choosing a campervan is the interior layout. There are so many options and manufacturers seem to change it year to year, without changing the model number. So check carefully!

The van I got has a HUGE double over the cab. a full double in the dining area. It also has a small dining area at the rear (for the kids!) which folds into bunk beds.

The advantage of this layout is:
1) the adults and kids can sit seperately in the evenings if requried.
2) you can have dinner without having to undo a bed
3) all can go to bed without clearing a dinner table

I'm assuming you have children. In this case you shoudl really go for an EU make. Alot of the popular English ones don't have bunks.

Also, the most respected brand, Hymer, are generally targetted towards the older generations and won't have bunks.


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## PGD1 (11 Jan 2006)

one more reason to get a camper!..

a self catering holiday via Keycamp etc for July this year would cost me €3000 - €3500 for 2 weeks

I am doing a 3 week trip in the 'van for approx €1200


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## Christy (11 Jan 2006)

The only thing to keep in mind when buying from abroad is after sales support, will you have to go back to Germany if something goes wrong?

But like all the others I think camper vans are deadly.

Christy


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## PGD1 (11 Jan 2006)

the approach I took was that I was saving €10,000 on the price... if anything went wrong and I had to ay extra to get something from Germany then I'd still be saving money.

Most of the vans are based on FIAT Ducato's etc anyway. Anywhere can fix them. Otherwise you just get a part from any motorhome service centre... they all share parts anyway for major components.

At least I hope so!


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## Christy (11 Jan 2006)

A useful magazine to get is 'Which Motorcaravan' the February edition is due out Jan 12, you can order back issues on their web site, I found them extremely useful when buying mine.


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## minion (16 Jan 2006)

I know several people with camper vans and they sit in the yard for 50 weeks a year.
They were a novelty at first but now these people will go on holiday in the camper for the the sake of using it rather than a different type of holiday each year.
They are also limited in where they can go - Europe.

Why not just rent one when you need it and see how it goes.  We did this in the usa last year and it was fantastic but not every year.  There are hundreds of companies in the us and europe who rent camper vans.

If you think you would make use of one after that they buy one by all means.


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## IsleOfMan (16 Jan 2006)

Good post minion, I had this problem with a mobile home I owned in Brittas Bay. Anyhow, slightly off topic. Has anyone rented a camper van to tour New Zealand?


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## Henny Penny (17 Jan 2006)

Hi minion

Thanks for the post ... food for thought. 
I think it comes down to whether you're a traveller or not ... I think a camper would offer the freedom to visit places off the beaten track a bit. Our children are still little so they aren't looking for amenities ... they are easily amused. 
A friend of mine who bought a boat a couple of years back said you have to be prepared to 'muluck', not have clean clothes every day and find public toilets wherever you go ... but you just leave your cares behind and off you go. 
I don't see Europe as limiting ... how many of us have done more than our two weeks in the sun in some resort? I think a holiday home somewhere would be much more restrictive ... justifying the cost by going there every year whether you wanted to or not. 
We considered the cost of renting a camper in Ireland and it is ridiculous.


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