# Is the E200 owed if only one property owned but it's rented out?



## speirbhean (1 Sep 2009)

Hi all, I've been doing some research but can't find an answer to this. My sister owns one apartment in Dublin, she now lives abroad and is renting her place here. She is registered with the PRTB and fully tax compliant. I am her 'agent' in this country - I pay the tax and have been issued with a seperate PPS number to do this.
I have two questions
- Since this not a 'second property' but her only property is she still liable for the new tax because it's a rental property?
- If the answer is yes - which PPS number do we use to pay, her own or the one that was issued for rental tax purposes?

Thanks for anyone who can help


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## Howitzer (1 Sep 2009)

Yes the tax is due. Not because it is a 2nd property but because it is not her principle private residence. This is the only criteria under which this is judged.

I don't know which PPSN to use, presumably her's.


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## Istabraq1 (1 Sep 2009)

Not the only criteria , there are exceptions
from the act,
(5) If, on a liability date, an individual who is the owner of a
residential property—
(a) is incapacitated by reason of long term mental or physical
infirmity, and
(b) had been obliged, at a time prior to that date, due to the
said mental or physical infirmity, to vacate the said property,
which had been, immediately preceding that time,
his or her sole or main residence, and
(c) is normally resident in a place of which he or she is not
the owner,
then he or she shall not be liable to pay a charge in respect of that
property in relation to that liability date.

my understanding from this is that you are except from the tax under 5 (c)


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## murphaph (1 Sep 2009)

Good post there Istabraq. You've just saved me 200 quid. I was all set to pay this poxy tax (another joke of an agency like the PRTB no doubt) until I read that. I'm pretty sure I'm exempt under 5(c) as well though!


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## helllohello (1 Sep 2009)

if you think that you are exempt, would you advise to make contact with the nppr to clarify your position ?


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## contractor (2 Sep 2009)

I have a similar situation where I am not the owner of the house I'm living in.  I do own an apartment but it is unoccupied and on the market.  I just read on the rte website that the tax applies to anyone who owns a vacant property which is not their PPR. This has me confused, due to the clause 5(c) outlined below I should be exempt, right?  It's a 2nd home tax and I only own 1 home.

Also, does anyone know if there is a PPR register?  Is it the same as the TRS form?  Can I assume that if I am getting TRS on the mortgage then it is also registered as my PPR? Or are they totally unconnected?

This tax is clearly designed to trip people up and squeeze extra money out of us.


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## WaterSprite (2 Sep 2009)

Istabraq1 said:


> Not the only criteria , there are exceptions
> from the act,
> (5) If, on a liability date, an individual who is the owner of a
> residential property—
> ...



Sorry but this does not mean that, if you own a property in which you are not living, but rent another property to live in, you are exempt from the tax.  The conditions above are cumulative, not alternative and apply only to someone who is incapacitated.  You can contact the relevant authority for clarification but I think it's pretty clear that the above does not apply in this case. (Sorry)

Sprite


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## Howitzer (2 Sep 2009)

Another case of people hearing what they want to hear. This situation looks pretty clear cut to me. The property is a rental property. The owner just happens to be living in Marbella as opposed to Mullingar.


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## contractor (2 Sep 2009)

WaterSprite said:


> Sorry but this does not mean that, if you own a property in which you are not living, but rent another property to live in, you are exempt from the tax.  The conditions above are cumulative, not alternative and apply only to someone who is incapacitated.  You can contact the relevant authority for clarification but I think it's pretty clear that the above does not apply in this case. (Sorry)
> 
> Sprite


Yes you're right the clause before it has an AND at the end of it:



> (5) If, on a liability date, an individual who is the owner of a
> residential property—
> 
> (a) is incapacitated by reason of long term mental or physical infirmity, *and*
> ...



Does anyone know is there a PPR register?  I want to check which property is registered as my PPR.


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## Howitzer (2 Sep 2009)

contractor said:


> Does anyone know is there a PPR register? I want to check which property is registered as my PPR.


It's self assessed but you can only have 1 PPR (with some exceptions which really only account for a tiny number of scenarios).

The TRS can only be claimed against your PPR, but again that's self assessed to a large extent, though it wouldn't be unknown to be claiming illegitimately.


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## sadie (2 Sep 2009)

Hi Contractor, the house to which Revenue, Social Welfare, Voting Cards etc all go to - that is your PPR. 
There is no list, and no one really checking. 
If someone asked you if House A was your PPR you would have to prove that you were living there by showing recent and past post from Government agencies to back that up. 
Sounds like loads of people who are renting out other houses are pretending that the house is their PPR in order to claim the mortgage relief. So someone in that situation would have to prove they have lived at their house since they bought it. 

As a tenant myself I think it would be more fun it they got also all current tenants to register the houses they are living in. Then Revenue can check one list against another...


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## speirbhean (2 Sep 2009)

Thanks for the replies... thread meandered a bit there  but I'm guessing it's a yes to my first question. Thought so anyway!


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## newyork (2 Sep 2009)

My response from SDCC with regard living abroad and having a house rented in Ireland.

*SDCC Customer Contact System*

Dear Mr 
As you are the owner of the property in Ireland and it is not your principal residence you are liable for the levy. You can register the property and pay the levy on www.nppr.ie
Regards,

Customer Care
property tax query for non resident
Hi, i live in Australia, and registered as non-resident in ireland. I own a property in Dublin which is rented and fully tax compliant, do I qualify as having to pay the 200 euro property tax. Thanks


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## murphaph (2 Sep 2009)

Ah well, was too good to be true. Another tax for the government to waste.


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## contractor (2 Sep 2009)

...doesn't matter.


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## newyork (2 Sep 2009)

Silly question, but I assume its not tax deductable.


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