# Gardai: Right to enter your house?



## Jane (15 Jul 2008)

Just having a discussion about this with some friends. I know that in the States the police have to "ask" for permission to enter your house if they do not possess a warrant.

What's the situation here? I mean, if they think something untoward is happening, can they enter your house without your permission? 

The example we were using was if they were called to a house were a party was happening and believed the occupants to be underage. Can the enter the house then?

Thanks !


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## murphaph (15 Jul 2008)

Jane said:


> Just having a discussion about this with some friends. I know that in the States the police have to "ask" for permission to enter your house if they do not possess a warrant.
> 
> What's the situation here? I mean, if they think something untoward is happening, can they enter your house without your permission?
> 
> ...


http://www.citizensinformation.ie/categories/justice/arrests/powers-of-search might be some use as a starter.


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## j26 (15 Jul 2008)

The exemptions are


If they suspect you of an arrestable offence (>5 year max sentence) and see you enter a dwelling they can follow you in, or they have reasonable cause to believe you will abscond before a warrant can be obtained, or you are a suspect (with reasonable cause) and you ordinarily reside there.
If you are seen entering a dwelling and have reasonable cause to suspect you of driving causing death or serious injury (hit & run)
If they suspect a child is in danger they have extensive powers of entry.


Pretty much any other entry into a dwelling without warrant is unconstitutional.


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## bond-007 (15 Jul 2008)

Can they enter thru an open front door?


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## j26 (15 Jul 2008)

bond-007 said:


> Can they enter thru an open front door?



Nope, unless one of the above apply.


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## bond-007 (15 Jul 2008)

j26 said:


> Nope, unless one of the above apply.


That is a good one so. I had a fire at my house a few years ago. About 6 Gardaí walked straight in thru the front door which was open (firemen were busy going in and out) and straight into my front room. I certainly did not invite them in and they had no warrant. They were very reluctant to leave after I asked them to do so.


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## mercman (15 Jul 2008)

Jane, if a child is underage in a Private House, what difference does it make ???


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## bond-007 (15 Jul 2008)

It would be still illegal for that underage child to consume alcohol.


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## SNOWBALL (16 Jul 2008)

what did they say to you when they went it? If your front door was wide open maybe there where passing and decided to have a look because they noticed the firemen going in and out.If you have nothing to hide what is the problem.If you feel so strongly about it contact your local garda station and make a complaint!!!


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## Welfarite (16 Jul 2008)

What about serving a court summons? I'm thinking if a preson wanted to avoid it being served by refusing to go to the door (say after their partner/parent had answered the knock/bell.


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## Caveat (16 Jul 2008)

I'm assuming it doesn't work like the TV way anyway - i.e. the documents have to only touch you to have been 'served', hence people getting paperwork literally tossed at them?


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## Welfarite (16 Jul 2008)

Don't know about that, Caveat, but I heard someone saying that a summons cannot be served in a place of work and also I heard a story of a guy refusing to accept a summons served to him in a pub! 

(The funny bit was that is was for a DD charge and the idiot drove away from the pub fifteen minutes later only to be caught again a hundred yards down the road by the same cops lying in wait for him!)


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## bond-007 (16 Jul 2008)

SNOWBALL said:


> what did they say to you when they went it? If your front door was wide open maybe there where passing and decided to have a look because they noticed the firemen going in and out.If you have nothing to hide what is the problem.If you feel so strongly about it contact your local garda station and make a complaint!!!


They came out especially. Apparently it is standard procedure with fires. I did make a formal complaint to the super and the matter was resolved to my satisfaction. 



Caveat said:


> I'm assuming it doesn't work like the TV way anyway - i.e. the documents have to only touch you to have been 'served', hence people getting paperwork literally tossed at them?


Correct, the documents only have to touch the person concerned. But documents can be left with any adult at the address to be served.


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## SNOWBALL (16 Jul 2008)

they may not be as quick in the future to call to your house if you are  robbed considering you made a formal complaint to your local station.Thats just my opinion


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## Caveat (16 Jul 2008)

SNOWBALL said:


> Thats just my opinion


 
Or is it insider knowledge of the way the gardaí operate?


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## SNOWBALL (16 Jul 2008)

no  just i thought that came in to my head, all job sectors have bad apples but most are good hard working people.


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## bond-007 (16 Jul 2008)

SNOWBALL said:


> they may not be as quick in the future to call to your house if you are  robbed considering you made a formal complaint to your local station.Thats just my opinion


No need to worry. I am on very good terms with the local super.  It turned out that the particular members were not from the local district. The super was most concerned by that aspect. 

I did have a visit shortly after from the local guys who did knock the open door and asked permission to enter. They were most courteous and helpful with the clean up after the fire.


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## huskerdu (16 Jul 2008)

j26 said:


> The exemptions are
> 
> 
> If they suspect you of an arrestable offence (>5 year max sentence) and see you enter a dwelling they can follow you in, or they have reasonable cause to believe you will abscond before a warrant can be obtained, or you are a suspect (with reasonable cause) and you ordinarily reside there.
> ...


 
Interesting. I thought that the gardai also have the right to enter a dwelling when they have reasonable cause to believe that a crime is currently being committed ( an simple  example would be if you can hear someone being beaten up or attacked). Is this true ?


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## ClubMan (16 Jul 2008)

Another useful link in relation to your rights and the _Gardaí_/law.


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## Jane (16 Jul 2008)

Thanks for all the replies. I know this is an interesting subject and it's a fact of life that many of us don't really know where we stand when things like this happen.

Time to brush up on our rights, thanks for the link Clubman.


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## John joe (16 Jul 2008)

bond-007 said:


> It would be still illegal for that underage child to consume alcohol.


 
Jane didnt mention anything about the underage child consuming alcohol she only said that they were having a party. Does alcohol automatically have to be associated with a party?

And if the child was consuming alcohol then its a matter for the Gardai to breathlise the child.


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## SNOWBALL (16 Jul 2008)

all very interesting but if you are not breaking the law then you should have nothing to worry about.Im sure they can enter a house if they have reason to believe there is dugs involved or activities that are illegal.At the end of the day  all they have to do is get a warrant signed by seargent and enter your premises.I dont see what the big issue is here about who is allowed and who is not


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## efm (16 Jul 2008)

SNOWBALL said:


> all very interesting but if you are not breaking the law then you should have nothing to worry about.Im sure they can enter a house if they have reason to believe there is dugs involved or activities that are illegal.At the end of the day all they have to do is get a warrant signed by seargent and enter your premises.I dont see what the big issue is here about who is allowed and who is not


 
You obviously don't care much about one's civil liberties then - I, as a law abiding tax paying citizen, would rather not have the gardai enter my house uninvited or perform any other kind of illegal search on my person or possessions, with or without anything to hide.

I have great respect for the gardai and the job they do and I believe the majority of them are excellent upstanding and law abiding - however, not all of them are and I would not want to give anyone _carte blanche_ to enter my property at any time without the proper warrants.

In my opinion bond-007 (who knows his law afaik!) did the correct thing by pointing out the illegality of the gardai's actions.


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## MsGinger (16 Jul 2008)

In my younger days, we had the guards called on us a few times by our neighbour.  They always asked if they could come in and have a look around and we never had any problem letting them as there was nothing untoward going on....


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## efm (17 Jul 2008)

MsGinger said:


> In my younger days, we had the guards called on us a few times by our neighbour. They always asked if they could come in and have a look around and we never had any problem letting them as there was nothing untoward going on....


 
That is different - the gardai were invited into the house.  I have always invited the gardai into my house anytime they have called (which to be honest hasn't been that often) - however, they do not have the right to walk in uninvited without a warrant and that is the way it should be.


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## SNOWBALL (17 Jul 2008)

Well if they believe someone is in danger or a crime is being commited they can enter ,im sure they are not going to waste time getting a warrant if someones life is in danger.Anyhow do you think a garda can be bothered going in to house unless he has a valid reason for it?.He/She does not enter anyones house just for the fun of it.


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## j26 (17 Jul 2008)

SNOWBALL said:


> Well if they believe someone is in danger or a crime is being commited they can enter ,im sure they are not going to waste time getting a warrant if someones life is in danger.Anyhow do you think a garda can be bothered going in to house unless he has a valid reason for it?.He/She does not enter anyones house just for the fun of it.



That falls into the "extraordinary excusing circumstances" exemption set out by the courts.  Unless such a breach of a persons constitutional right is justified by the circumstances, any evidence a garda obtains while illegally in a dwelling is excluded as unconstitutionally obtained, so while they might stop the crime, they won't be able to use the evidence they got while in there to prosecute.


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## SNOWBALL (17 Jul 2008)

yes but the most important factor is to stop the crime in process they can deal with prosecution later.No point in waiting to get a warrant and the victim could be badly injured or even dead.


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## j26 (17 Jul 2008)

SNOWBALL said:


> yes but the most important factor is to stop the crime in process they can deal with prosecution later.No point in waiting to get a warrant and the victim could be badly injured or even dead.



True, but the fact that the evidence is excluded means that the gardai will think carefully before entering a property, which is the intention of the rule.  IMO that's fair as they can go in if needs be, but only in exceptional circumstances.


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## Ruam (17 Jul 2008)

bond-007 said:


> It would be still illegal for that underage child to consume alcohol.



Is it illegal for a parent to give a glass of wine to a 16 year old in a private house?  

Ruam


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## efm (17 Jul 2008)

SNOWBALL said:


> Anyhow do you think a garda can be bothered going in to house unless he has a valid reason for it?.He/She does not enter anyones house just for the fun of it.


 
You are assuming that all gardai are 100% honest and 100% law abiding - I would say that the vast vast majority are but not all (as recent evidence has shown) - the laws of illegal search are there to protect us, in part, from this minority.


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## DrMoriarty (17 Jul 2008)

A number of posts have been deleted because they were veering into personalised attacks and/or letting off steam territory. Please keep it civil.


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## Thirsty (19 Jul 2008)

> Is it illegal for a parent to give a glass of wine to a 16 year old in a private house


No.


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## picene (24 Jul 2008)

sort of off topic but I believe customs can also enter your house w/o a warrant and in more extensive circumstances will try and find link


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## bond-007 (24 Jul 2008)

Indeed they can. They have far more powers than the Gardaí.


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## efm (25 Jul 2008)

picene said:


> sort of off topic but I believe customs can also enter your house w/o a warrant and in more extensive circumstances will try and find link


 
Indeed - but afaik Customs cannot stop you on the road if you are driving - only the Gardai can do that.  I wonder can anyone clarify it that is correct?


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## bond-007 (25 Jul 2008)

You are correct, hence Customs men are always with Gardaí.


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## sam34 (25 Jul 2008)

guards can also enter a house if they suspect someone in there is suffering from a mental illness and requires assessment by a psychiatrist, the guards have the power to bring that person to a psych ward for assessmnet


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