# New Ireland



## oscarbandit0 (25 Jan 2009)

I am not sure if this is the correct place to query this - 

Anyway . My husband has a policy with New Ireland - He pays approx E120 a month into it.  I realise that this is small money to some.  He has been paying into it for 10 years now.

They wrote to us recently about increasing the premium slightly and included in the letter that the life policy amount on death was E21,000. This figure 2 years ago was over 30,000.  I noticed that they did not state that the benefit was reduced.  just stated this amount.  

Does anyone know what this is about? 

What questions should we be asking New Ireland re investment? Can anyone comment on New Ireland?

Thank You.


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## mercman (25 Jan 2009)

I am well able to comment on New Ireland !! Check my other posts on other theads in Investments. The life assurance value has dropped I can only assume is that the value of the fund has dropped. Did you invest directly with NI or through your own broker or a Tied Agent. I am unable to see a reason as to why they want you to increase your premiums other than trying to ensure the commission of the broker is maintained. What fund has your hubbie invested in ?? NI operate slightly different in various parts of the country. As far as I can see in Dublin it is OK, but in the West they treat people as if they are dopes. As a company that is part of the BoI group their attitude is quite distasteful. Call them and ask some questions and report back to this forum.


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## mullking (26 Jan 2009)

I took out my ssia with N.I.After it matured, I continued to invest 254 p.m. for about 3 years. Then, like all else, came the crash. After my units bottomed out, I decided it was a good time to buy in at the bottom and gave my broker a sizeable sum to top up my units and cease to pay monthly. After holding my sizeable sum for more than a month, it was returned, saying it had to be continued in monthly payments. I was at the loss of a months intrist while they gained. About your decrease in life payment, I had the same experience. As you get older you become a bigger risk of dying. The insurance co. either double the monthly premiums or halve the payout.


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## sparkeee (26 Jan 2009)

The way things are going you will have to pay them when you leave this earth.


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## mercman (26 Jan 2009)

mullking said:


> After holding my sizeable sum for more than a month, it was returned, saying it had to be continued in monthly payments. I was at the loss of a months intrist while they gained./quote]
> 
> This shows the lunacy of the company in question. You invest a sizeable sum and they return it as they tell you it has to be in monthly installments. You should chase them for your interest as if they really knew the terms of business and what they were doing, your cheque should not have been cashed. Before you invested did your broker offer you a deal concerning Allocation Bonus or reduced Management Charges, as if they are unteid brokers you are more likely to receive an investment deal rather than if you dealt with the company directly or their own tied agents.


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## johnnygman (27 Jan 2009)

Your are like a broken record, pointless stuff again, continuos harping on about being offered deals on allocation fees and management charges.
These kind of comments 

"NI operate slightly different in various parts of the country. As far as I can see in Dublin it is OK, but in the West they treat people as if they are dopes. As a company that is part of the BoI group their attitude is quite distasteful. Call them and ask some questions and report back to this forum"

in my opinion are not only unhelpful but are borderline libellous.
You should not be allowed to post on this site any longer if you continue with this kind of stuff, as you do not seem interested in helping peoples questions but only in slinging mud because of your personal issues/case with this company.


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## mercman (27 Jan 2009)

You have no right to try and discipline my posts. Every single matter I have posted in this regard can be backed up with legitimate paperwork. There is nothing libellous about my posts. If you are working for the said company that is your business, but you hold no right to try and silence me from stating the facts. If you have a problem that's your problem not mine. I am simply offering experienced opinions in this regard and making endeavours to assist others.


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## johnnygman (27 Jan 2009)

Forget it wast of time trying to do any kind of reasoning with you ends up the same every time.
What you are suggesting time and again is scandalous even a dog in the street can see that the statenents youre making are in no way helpful, each thread on this and similiar stuff turns into the same bashing theme over and over.
You should be removed or banned that is my personal judgement on this ,to call the like of this fact is just plain ridiculous "As far as I can see in Dublin it is OK, but in the West they treat people as if they are dopes. As a company that is part of the BoI group their attitude is quite distasteful"

This is nothing personal my friend, if you cant see what you are doing is both unhelpful and out of order then you have lost all objectivity.
I have no problem with your own issues on your case, but you are letting these posion every response that you make on these type of queries.


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## mercman (27 Jan 2009)

johnnygman said:


> see what you are doing is both unhelpful and out of order then you have lost all objectivity. I have no problem with your own issues on your case, but you are letting these posion every response that you make on these type of queries.



This is a Forum for the purpose of others to offer opinion and help. I am offering a straight opinion from an experience which I have had to endure.I do no class these as unhelpful especially for those who might be contemplating a lump sum investment. In the same manner I have not pointed any damming post concerning the fund managers. Did you ever consider your posts might be unhelpful by castigating others for opinions which you seem to know very little about ??


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## TomOC (27 Jan 2009)

boys please stop bickering! Johnnygman stop trying to stir s***!


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## johnnygman (28 Jan 2009)

I am not castigating anyone other than you and i have clearly pointed out the kind of stuff you have been spouting which is unhelpful.
None of this you have been able to refute. As i said waste of time, im sure you will be straight into the next post on a smiliar topic with more of your "helpful comments" TomOC please dont talk nonsense im doing nothing of the sort, if you had looked at any post from this clown you would see the never ending these with this guy a chip on his shoulder the size of his head-huge.


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## mercman (28 Jan 2009)

johnnygman said:


> I am not castigating anyone other than you and i have clearly pointed out the kind of stuff you have been spouting which is unhelpful.



Maybe but you have been slinging mud at me since you got reading my posts. How can you state that I am been 'unhelpful', by offering others the benefit of an experience and to ensure that others do not get trapped in a similar experience.

If you class me as having a chip on my shoulder you are so wrong. I have now spent over 2 years in trying to have a simple matter rectified to no avail. Its pretty obvious that you are involved in the Financial Providers industry. Otherwise you would not keep on drawing the matters out. Give it a rest please. I'm trying to move on and keep personal insults out of this. The truth always hurts and thankfully i'm not winging and wining.


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## johnnygman (28 Jan 2009)

If you class me as having a chip on my shoulder you are so wrong. I have now spent over 2 years in trying to have a simple matter rectified to no avail.

Sorry m8 but you just made the point for me, i rest my case.


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## mercman (28 Jan 2009)

Your case might be rested after the Authorities have made a ruling.


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## johnnygman (28 Jan 2009)

Dude that has nothing to do with me my job or otherwise i do not work for NewIreland and couldnt care less how you get on with this, if you have been mis sold something then good luck and im sure this will come out fine for you. At least i think you have seen the light here, and hopefully can appreciate what i have tried to illustrate to you, hopefully you will try to be contructive in future posts on these issues and not keeping trying to bang your drum till all are in agreement.

In Ireland the joke is made about "The well balanced Irishman : a chip on both shoulders". This is someone who has an endless supply of current and, more often historical, socio-political injustices to complain about. It is quite probable that all these are true; but the perception that the individual never misses an opportunity to raise these issues, often combined with the perception that they have never suffered these injustices themselves, leaves the person open to satire.


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## PaddyW (28 Jan 2009)

He was given misleading advice, from what I can remember written promises were withdrawn (or something along those lines, vague recollection of the post I read regarding Mercman's issue). From where I'm standing he is trying to right a wrong. Spending two years trying to rectify a simple matter, which the company got very wrong, is not having a chip on his shoulder. The matter is simple, they should have sorted it ages ago. Nothing to do with having a chip on his shoulder. And I think the fact that he is letting people know how wrong the company in question got these matters is very helpful to potential investors.


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## mercman (28 Jan 2009)

Paddy, thank you for your support. It would be far worse if I watched persons invest and then to place their trust in the company concerned when similar occurrences could well occur. Not alone should the matter have been sorted, the amount of deceit that has gone on is incredible. Anyway, for the purpose of my own dignity and to save the insults, I intend leaving the matters at present until a result from my complaint has been forthcoming. When published and with the permission of the Mods, I will post the findings on AAM. Thanks again. Merc.


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## oscarbandit0 (9 Feb 2009)

sorry to have caused some dissagreements.

I am not sure which funds are been invested in.  My husband is burying his head in the sand lol. he paid in 14,000 and it is now worth 9,000. so a lose of 5,000.

And we keep paying the monthly payment!!!!!


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## mercman (9 Feb 2009)

From my part no disagreements caused at all. Just others trying to defend the indefensible.

In relation to your hubbie's contributions, I am sure he went into investing in these funds on a long term basis. The only advantage (assuming there is one) is that the mix is been pretty averaged out, where he has invested in when the funds were high along with when they are low. Historically (and nobody knows the future) is that they should normally creep back. It is not going to happen overnight though. Obviously the letter you received was from an agent who wanted you to increase your amounts for them to receive a higher commission. In relation to the other questions why not phone them and ask them for answers.

There are no funds which have not been effected by the turbulance in the world markets. All asset classes have been hit.


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## oscarbandit0 (10 Feb 2009)

Thanks for that infor mercman. We do not go through an agent just direct with New Ireland.  I have found out that the increase is just to keep investment inline with inflation!


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## mercman (10 Feb 2009)

oscarbandit0 said:


> I have found out that the increase is just to keep investment inline with inflation!



Well I would love to know how they work that one out ? Are you investing for Capital Growth or pure inflation tracking ?


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## mercman (20 Mar 2009)

johnnygman said:


> None of this you have been able to refute.



Now johnnygman, if I have been spouting such a heap of bull, why has the Financial Regulator's office taken a very special interest in the ongoings in this case.


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## mercman (10 Jul 2009)

Just to report that the Financial Services Ombudsman determined on this case in mid June. As New Ireland have not launched an appeal, I will be, as previously stated providing the details of the Ombudsman's report and the cost to New Ireland. No settlement has been forthcoming from NI, but after waiting 32 months (2 years 8 months) for some justice, it will happen. I will post the findings as soon as my solicitor has given the OK to the findings and to avoid litigation.


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## mercman (18 Jul 2009)

Just to advise an appeal has been lodged (not by self) against the Ombudsman's determination. As soon as the matter is outside the legal process the full report will be posted.


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## Car Mad (20 Jul 2009)

mercman said:


> Just to advise an appeal has been lodged (not by self) against the Ombudsman's determination. As soon as the matter is outside the legal process the full report will be posted.


 
ok so what was the Ombudsmans findings against New Ireland? They didnt persue the case for you or something?


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## mercman (20 Jul 2009)

Car Mad said:


> ok so what was the Ombudsmans findings against New Ireland? They didnt persue the case for you or something?



No, I pursued the case and the Ombudsman made a determination which has now been placed under Appeal. I must wait until the matter s brought before the Courts before the findings may be released, if it goes that far.


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## mercman (2 Aug 2009)

Well the Appeal papers were received on Friday last. The Appeal is against the Ombudsman's determination. They have not and never refuted the matter of extortion; the provision of false figures to display that investments which are held, are better  without an allocation bonus; the request not to disinvest until commissions were paid to the Tied Agent. Just another delaying tactic by NI which will cost them tens of 000s just to be heard.


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## mercman (18 Oct 2009)

Tomorrow, 19th.October the Appeal by New Ireland is due to be heard in the High Court. After this I am free to place the entire on the web to evidence and display the problems of investing in Irish based funds.


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## Barbie doll (23 Jun 2010)

"are better without an allocation bonus".  Sorry Mercman but I was wondering if you could explain this term to me.  I have a copy of a memorandum from New Ireland writen in the hand writing of agent and it states 2% investment bonus Negotiated on behalf of clients.  My Agent is employed by NI.  Do you know what this means?  I am sorry to waste your time but I have no idea what this means.  I only recently got copy of this.


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## Eithneangela (23 Jun 2010)

I'm really frightened by this thread - don't know the original query or complaint, but they have had my pension for the past 20 years and I'm about to cash it in (bit of lump payment, rest in monthly payments of under €200) and I'm kind of waiting for it, depending on it, need it etc. etc. They verbally told me the pension was mainly in cash in the recent past, so hopefully I haven't lost too much of the sums I paid in - but, by God, I need this, so let me know if anybody is having a problem with the pension from New Ireland (pension was based on a Director's fund).


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## mercman (23 Jun 2010)

Barbie Doll, An allocation bonus is an Investment Bonus of a percentage based on the original investment. i.e if you invested €10000 in the Japanese Fund of €1 per unit. Then with the Investment Bonus you should receive 10200 units. (without the Bonus you would have received 10000 units. If you have your offer in writing it should have stood. Check did you receive the Bonus and if not write to the Co explaining the circumstance, copy the papers and if they decline ask them for a letter of Final Response and then send to the Ombudsman. Keep sending the questions and I will keep answering them. My problem is nearly 4 years old and we still can't get to the bottom of it.


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## Barbie doll (23 Jun 2010)

Eithneangela whats the name of the investment.   Mercman has been extremly helpful to me and I hope he wins his case.  Is there any word on that yet.  With the investment you have Eithneangela is this the first time you have been asked to pay an increase to keep in line with inflation.


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## mercman (23 Jun 2010)

barbie, i won the battle but lost the war, if you know what I mean. Ombudsman found completely in my favour but did not refund the investment, just with NI but never to be charged a Management Fee on these Policies. There is a massive issue concerning Trust which the Ombudsman identified, and still NI still carry on as if nothing happened, even though they did try and cheat me out of tens of thousands.(€50k so far)

And just in case the Mods interfere with that comment, I can prove the lot in writing and intend doing so in a few weeks.


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## Barbie doll (23 Jun 2010)

mercman, sorry you didnt get everything you wanted. I would be very interested to read what ever your working on. I asked New Ireland for an historical reduction in yield I was asked "what's that". This is an odd reply given the fact that they send out projected reduction in yield reports. 

Just one other thing a friend of mine arrived at my home tonight and had a Terms of Business card from New Ireland and it said 

"The Company may at its absolute discretion record all or certain telephone conversations including those held between a client and/ or their agent and the Company". 

My Agent calls to my home.........does that mean he could record our conversation or does it mean that when I call my Agent on his mobile he can record our conversation. I merely ask this as I am requesting information under the Data Protection Act and if this has happened then I should request these recordings as well.   I think it means only phone calls.


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## mercman (23 Jun 2010)

Am unable to comment n the actions of their agents on the Road but all calls to their offices are recorded. It is vital to get everything on any Financial Product you invest in to get everything in writing.  

Bottom Line -- I only ever took out 5 Investment Policies with New Ireland / Bank of Ireland Life and significant problems with each one. 

*A PARCEL OF CROOKS*


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