# Eircode not be used by An Post



## c00lcarl (19 Nov 2015)

I recently received a delayed envelope with a label from an post saying it was delayed due to incorrect postal address however the eircode which is meant to be an individual postal reference for each building was clearly written on the envelope so I rang An Post to see why this was delayed (as delayed post this is a common problem  in our area as there are 2 villages with the same name, I thought that eircode would finally sort this out)

I was told by the An Post official that An Post are not using Eircodes as they did not win the tender for the postal code system - this is the most ridiculous nonsense I have ever heard - that a postal code system has been put in place and the national post service is disregarding it when it is written on a posted item.

Also I recently bought prizebonds and the eircode was left off the postal address, so I wonder how many other Gvot depts are choosing not to use the system


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## odyssey06 (19 Nov 2015)

An Post is being used by Eircode... as a trojan horse to make sure a useful postcode system is not made available to any of its potential competitors.


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## Leo (19 Nov 2015)

An Post are bitter they lost out, simple as that. So as the mature efficient organisation they are, their response was to throw the toys out of the pram and refuse to play along.


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## c00lcarl (19 Nov 2015)

A postcode system is as useful as you want to make it - it either identifies the street as in the UK or the more administratively onerous option of identifying each property as adopted in Ireland, 

it is up to the private sector couriers/sat nav manufacturers to integrate it into their systems, for the private sector it is optional, however when the government spends 38 million of tax payers money on a post code system that is workable then the publicly owned national postal service should adopt it and use it, otherwise if they want to pick and choose what government initiatives they adopt then the postal service should be privatised and they can then do what they want as they will be self funding, they cant expect to receive all the job security, pensions etc of the public sector and then stick two fingers up to their customers (the taxpayers) whenever they dont like something that would actually improve what is currently a second rate service compared to other western EU countries


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## T McGibney (19 Nov 2015)

c00lcarl said:


> it is up to the private sector couriers/sat nav manufacturers to integrate it into their systems, for the private sector it is optional, however when the government spends 38 million of tax payers money on a post code system *that is workable* then the publicly owned national postal service should adopt it and use it,



Ahem.

http://www.independent.ie/opinion/c...payers-the-real-longterm-losers-34158906.html


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## thedaddyman (19 Nov 2015)

many companies that I deal with through my work are not using it at the minute for 2 reasons, firstly to let teething issues be resolved and secondly on grounds of cost, both in terms of licences and accessing the eircoda databases and also changes in their own systems to accomadate it


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## Steven Barrett (19 Nov 2015)

The eircodes for both my home address and work address are incorrect. I contacted Eircode to notify them and they said they can't change them. With an approach like that, why would I use a postcode on an address if I know there is a chance is could be wrong and that Eircode are refusing to correct them? 

Then there is the fact that it is not mandatory. People don't like change and if they are getting by with the old system, they will continue to us it. 

It looks like another white elephant that can go in the bin with the evoting register and ppars system. 


Steven
www.bluewaterfp.ie


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## so-crates (19 Nov 2015)

Out of curiosity how did you identify they were incorrect? Was it that the code received in the post not match the website search results?


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## c00lcarl (19 Nov 2015)

Yes how is an eircode incorrect?


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## 44brendan (19 Nov 2015)

So €40mln is just flushed down the toilet and this is not even noted as an issue of concern!!! If this was corruption there would be a cacophony of voices from opposition, the press etc. looking for heads on platters. The fact that it is incompetence and  involves both present and past government parties seems to indicate that a shrug of the shoulders and "nothing to see here" is the appropriate response. I fully realize that this type of incompetence is not unique to Irish Governments but nonetheless when you look at what €40mln could have done for the homeless situation, the Health Service etc. you have to wonder what kind of mindless imbeciles are making decisions like this with our money.
If this kind of wanton waste was discovered in a business scenario heads would certainly roll and systems would be changed to ensure that it would not recur. However, there would appear to be no accountability for waste of public money in either the Civil Service or the political establishment.
Is this the price we must pay for democracy or is it a natural part of the process of bureaucracy??


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## c00lcarl (19 Nov 2015)

T McGibney said:


> Ahem.



As you havent said anything other than "ahem" it is not clear what your point is? the article states "
From the start, An Post and its union did the 'dog in the manger' and stalled the process of designing a new postcode for a full seven years.

It did so to protect itself from competition from couriers in the lucrative parcel market, in which An Post is a major player."

So this is the problem An Post never wanted a postcode system and so they are refusing to use it now it has been created, regardless of the improvements it would make to their postal service, at the moment the service relies on the local knowledge of the postman which is fine if it was still 1950 when people rarely moved, the same postal staff served an area for decades and there was no competition, but they need to come to the realisation that they can no longer rely on a comfy public service monopoly position, competition will overcome poor customer service business models, more and more private courier services are targeting the non commercial delivery sector.

But anyway my main point is that if we the taxpayer have had to shell out 38million for the system then the publicly owned postal service should be using it and working with eircode to iron out any problems with it.


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## Steven Barrett (19 Nov 2015)

c00lcarl said:


> Yes how is an eircode incorrect?



For my work address, I am not longer in the building that they have the eircode for, I'd moved out months before hand. 

For my home address, the eircode pin points to my house, but the postal address is incorrect.

In both instances, they refused to update their records. It seems like a lot of effort to get An Post or Ordinance Survey (or whoever) to correct my address and pass it on to Eircode. Seeing as no one uses the thing, I've just left it.  

Steven
www.bluewaterfp.ie


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## T McGibney (19 Nov 2015)

c00lcarl said:


> As you havent said anything other than "ahem" it is not clear what your point is?



My point is indicated in the quote I included in my post, specifically the part I highlighted:



> it is up to the private sector couriers/sat nav manufacturers to integrate it into their systems, for the private sector it is optional, however when the government spends 38 million of tax payers money on a post code system *that is workable* then the publicly owned national postal service should adopt it and use it



The most important line in Eoghan Harris' piece, for me, is the following:



> In sum, the whole procurement process was a shambles and at the end of it Eircode is not fit for purpose.



It's increasingly obvious that Eircode isn't workable. Hence my "ahem"



c00lcarl said:


> But anyway my main point is that if we the taxpayer have had to shell out 38million for the system then the publicly owned postal service should be using it and working with eircode to iron out any problems with it.



I would take the opposite view. If the Eircode system is not fit for purpose, An Post and everyone else should be avoiding it like the plague.   The fact that a crazy amount of money has spent on an inadequate and dysfunctional system is not sufficient reason for public and private sector firms to use it.


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## mathepac (19 Nov 2015)

said:


> Yes how is an eircode incorrect?


Simple - the eircode location data is based on postal address information supplied by An Post.

My eircode is incorrect as I pointed out in a series of posts that seems to be either locked or deleted. (either that or I made the posts in another forum - age)

When I input my allocated eircode I get my address as recorded by An Post. Bear with me here! Let's assume it's the correct address in full text format as it would appear on an envelope. It isn't but that's another story. I also get a little map of my estate with my address highlighted with a red icon. Except it isn't my address, it's a house 2 doors away which displays on its doorway a number which is lower than mine, which is the number allocated to the house on the map.

I contacted eircode about this and they say they can neither verify my contention about the incorrectness and even if they  can prove it is wrong they cannot fix the error as the data they use are supplied by An Post. If I want to get the map corrected I need to contact An Post and convince them their geolocation maps are wrong.

So 40 to 50 million for a system that doesn't work and cannot be made work unless an incalcitrant 3rd party cooperates.


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## Leo (19 Nov 2015)

Sounds like a significant part of the Eircode problem is the dependence on data from an organisation whose interest is best served by having it fail.


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## cremeegg (24 Nov 2015)

Leaving aside An Posts feelings about Eircode. 

My understanding of what it does is assign a 6 digit code in 2 parts to every address. The first part, 3 digits, refers to a large geographical area say Limerick, the second part is uniquely identifies a specific address. The second part is completely random. So the two adjacent houses will share the same first 3 digits but there is no connection between the second set of 3 digits.

I don't understand how this can this benefit anyone.

Where I live there are a number of non unique addresses, say Mrs Smith Ballybeg. The way it works at present is that the postman knows which Smith is which, and if he doesn't he knocks at the door and asks. While this isn't ideal it works.

How would having the Eircode help? Mrs Smith Ballybeg XYZ 123 is useless if its not next-door to XYZ 122. Is the postman supposed to use some mapping software as well as the Eircode to show him where XYZ 123 is located ? That would be ridiculous even if the internet worked in Ballybeg which of course it doesn't.


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## Páid (24 Nov 2015)

cremeegg said:


> Mrs Smith Ballybeg XYZ 123 is useless if its not next-door to XYZ 122



If you have two Mrs Smith's in Ballybeg you cannot know which Mrs. Smith a letter is for without also having the eircode.


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## Thirsty (24 Nov 2015)

> Mrs Smith's in Ballybeg you cannot know which Mrs. Smith a letter is for without also having the eircode


My dad once received a letter from one of his grandchildren addressed to 'Grandad, Ballybeg, Co Yadayada'.... and it was safely delivered!   So stuff eircodes I say!


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## Leo (25 Nov 2015)

cremeegg said:


> My understanding of what it does is assign a 6 digit code in 2 parts to every address. The first part, 3 digits, refers to a large geographical area say Limerick, the second part is uniquely identifies a specific address. The second part is completely random. So the two adjacent houses will share the same first 3 digits but there is no connection between the second set of 3 digits.
> 
> I don't understand how this can this benefit anyone.



It benefits those running the system. If you make it too logical so that anyone can work it out, then you have no need to licence their software/database to make use of the system. The government in their wisdom decided our postcode system should be a commercial undertaking, so Capita who run it are entitled to earn a return on their investment.


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## theresa1 (25 Nov 2015)

I noticed Revenue have it when I logged in earlier to the LPT section.


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## losttheplot (25 Nov 2015)

I also noticed it on a form for Prize Bonds.


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