# heat pump electricty costs poll



## windheat (22 Mar 2012)

What is the satisfaction level with people that have had heat pumps installed. There does seem a lot of people surprised by the size of their electricity bill. Do installers under estimate your running costs at the consultation stage or what has been peoples experiences?


just tryed to add a poll to my thread but it is not giving me the option? am i missing something?


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## Leo (23 Mar 2012)

Polls are disabled on AAM. Discussion is welcome though.

My own opinion, quite a few (not all) renewables suppliers state the best possible case, or even unrealistic figures in order to justify the high up front investment and convince people to part with their cash.


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## bluemac (23 Mar 2012)

over all im happy with mine the installers expected my bill to be below €1000 a year and it comes in at €500.  the charges were clear from the installers but it was all the extras outside of there job that added to my cost, digging out the area, sand in it, refill, manhole down to pipes etc etc.

Its en expensive option, I believe I will make all the money back and in the long term save a little...  Not sure thats the point why people do it though..

I personally did it 
25% for enviromental reasons 
5% because I love new technology 
50% for lower bills year on year 
20% because of uncertain & rising costs of oil and gas
0% to save money


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## lowCO2design (23 Mar 2012)

bluemac said:


> I personally did it 25% for enviromental reasons


how is the electricity for your heat pump generated?  not to mention the losses in conversion (2.5 times approx)


> 20% because of uncertain & rising costs of oil and gas...


given that oil & gas, currently make up the majority of electricity production fuels, and will do so for at least the life time of your heat pump, will you not see electricity prices rise in-line with will oil/gas prices?

are you a rural or city home-owner? did you consider a log gasification or wood pellet boiler? did you build/design your home to reduce the need for fossil fuels?


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## windheat (24 Mar 2012)

lowCO2design said:


> how is the electricity for your heat pump generated? electricitygeneration-in-ireland/ not to mention the losses in conversion (2.5 times approx)
> given that oil & gas, currently make up the majority of electricity production fuels, and will do so for at least the life time of your heat pump, will you not see electricity prices rise in-line with will oil/gas prices?
> 
> are you a rural or city home-owner? did you consider a log gasification or wood pellet boiler? did you build/design your home to reduce the need for fossil fuels?



Log gasification and wood pellet boiler's are co2 and particle contributor's no?, the sustainability factor they have is unquestioned however. Fossil fuel burning at power stations will be a diminishing percentage over the next 10 20 30 years. The gases are scrubbed also which does not happen with solid fuel especially with pellet boilers.
Heat pumps have their issues but the cop means they have a role to play.
 In summary then heat pumps are very suitable for some people as they have some advantages (cost, efficient, no transport carbon required, clean, low maintenance) , as do solid fuel. This thread did not set out to compare them with other renewable s. I am interested in HP performance and problems/disadvantages seen by users, so any more heat pump experiences out there?


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## Ceist Beag (26 Mar 2012)

We have an Air-Water heat pump and the costs are on a par (probably slightly cheaper) with the cost of the oil burner we had before we had this installed. The big difference is we have hot water 24/7, the house is a constant temperature (as the heating is on 24/7) and we aren't directly affected by the price of oil (alright admittedly everything including cost of electricity is affected eventually but not on the same scale!). So overall we're very happy with the product but the cost is a lot more than the brochures led us to believe and it will probably take a lot longer to recoup the original cost of the system than we thought - but as I said for the benefits I've outlined we're happy with it.


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## windheat (28 Mar 2012)

Ceist Beag said:


> We have an Air-Water heat pump and the costs are on a par (probably slightly cheaper) with the cost of the oil burner we had before we had this installed. The big difference is we have hot water 24/7, the house is a constant temperature (as the heating is on 24/7) and we aren't directly affected by the price of oil (alright admittedly everything including cost of electricity is affected eventually but not on the same scale!). So overall we're very happy with the product but the cost is a lot more than the brochures led us to believe and it will probably take a lot longer to recoup the original cost of the system than we thought - but as I said for the benefits I've outlined we're happy with it.



Thanks for you input Ceist Beag
I presume then that cost is not the largest factor for you in your overall satisfaction. From your post i assume that the biggest factor is it operates to your desire.  
Just wondering if in your case there is a some tweaking you could do to re balance cost, by lowering the temperature in 1 or 2 of the zones in your house, turn down your dht temps by a degree two etc. You should be able to run cheaper than oil at its current price given the rate of increase over the past few years.


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## bluemac (28 Mar 2012)

lowCO2design said:


> how is the electricity for your heat pump generated?  not to mention the losses in conversion (2.5 times approx)
> given that oil & gas, currently make up the majority of electricity production fuels, and will do so for at least the life time of your heat pump, will you not see electricity prices rise in-line with will oil/gas prices?
> 
> are you a rural or city home-owner? did you consider a log gasification or wood pellet boiler? did you build/design your home to reduce the need for fossil fuels?



I am Rural, and intend one day to have a wind turbine in the mean time Airtricity get about 25% of the electric from wind or you can choose to pay extra for 100% wind energy.. Wood pellet meant a store of wood pellets and building a second building, plus the fire risks etc I decided not.


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## Ceist Beag (29 Mar 2012)

windheat said:


> Thanks for you input Ceist Beag
> I presume then that cost is not the largest factor for you in your overall satisfaction. From your post i assume that the biggest factor is it operates to your desire.
> Just wondering if in your case there is a some tweaking you could do to re balance cost, by lowering the temperature in 1 or 2 of the zones in your house, turn down your dht temps by a degree two etc. You should be able to run cheaper than oil at its current price given the rate of increase over the past few years.


Absolutely on both counts windheat. The level of comfort is way beyond what we had before (not to mention not having to get up during the night to turn on the heat for an hour!!). The total bill for electricity last year was €2400 which was a bit more than we had expected (we figured around €1800-€2000 for the year) so this year so far we have turned down the heating a couple of notches (with no obvious difference to our comfort in the house) and it does seem to have made a difference - that said the average temperature this year must be significantly higher than last year as we barely had a winter since the turn of the year so that obviously plays a part in the reduced usage too.


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## Clonback (13 Dec 2019)

I am currently looking at installing heat pumps in a property built in 1980's.I would appreciate any current thoughts on electricity costs and payback periods versus natural gas.


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## Zenith63 (14 Dec 2019)

I’m debating retrofitting it to a house with gas as well, the consensus seems to be that if you can get your insulation and air tightness up to very good levels then heat pumps make sense. That might be easier said than done for a 1980s house though?


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## Clonback (14 Dec 2019)

I am going to insulate all external walls and attic as its going to be replumbed/ rewired.Is it crucial to insulate ground floor for heat pump as that would appear to be major surgery?


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## KOW (14 Dec 2019)

windheat said:


> What is the satisfaction level with people that have had heat pumps installed. There does seem a lot of people surprised by the size of their electricity bill. Do installers under estimate your running costs at the consultation stage or what has been peoples experiences?
> 
> 
> just tryed to add a poll to my thread but it is not giving me the option? am i missing something?



Did a self build 2900 sq ft. house A3 rating. In it a year and a half. Air to water system. Total electricity bill for 12 month period including everything 1800 euro.
Very happy.


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## Redshoes (14 Dec 2019)

I have a groundfloor apartment in a building from 1999 so rather poor insulation in the building.  I installed a heat pump when I bought the apartment 5 years ago.  I love the hot water 24/7.  I set the curve to a particular number and it keeps the place warm, BUT, because of the age of the building and poor insuration, and old windows there is a lot of heat lose.  For my 80 m2 apartment it costs from €100 to €150 a month, which I feel is higher than I had expected, but at least I'm warm.  I've read reports where people are heating large new builds for that amount of money, but they have good insulation and perhaps ground floor heating.


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## KOW (14 Dec 2019)

Redshoes said:


> I have a groundfloor apartment in a building from 1999 so rather poor insulation in the building.  I installed a heat pump when I bought the apartment 5 years ago.  I love the hot water 24/7.  I set the curve to a particular number and it keeps the place warm, BUT, because of the age of the building and poor insuration, and old windows there is a lot of heat lose.  For my 80 m2 apartment it costs from €100 to €150 a month, which I feel is higher than I had expected, but at least I'm warm.  I've read reports where people are heating large new builds for that amount of money, but they have good insulation and perhaps ground floor heating.



Yep Redshoes Triple Glazing. Air tight and top spec insulation is the name of the game. Much easier for me in all fairness on a new build. Retro fit can be done but not as easy and expensive.


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## Susie2017 (16 Dec 2019)

Can i ask how the set up works in an apartment. Could it be done for a second floor apt that currently has gas heating.


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## Blackrock1 (16 Dec 2019)

we have an air to water heat pump in an a3 rated new build, circa 200 sq/m annual electricity bills are 1200 or so for a family of 4, cant complain with that.


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## Leo (16 Dec 2019)

Susie2017 said:


> Can i ask how the set up works in an apartment. Could it be done for a second floor apt that currently has gas heating.



Unlikely, the air-to-water unit is pretty chunky and has to be installed outside and I can't see too many management companies allowing that as a retrofit.


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## Leo (16 Dec 2019)

Clonback said:


> I am going to insulate all external walls and attic as its going to be replumbed/ rewired.Is it crucial to insulate ground floor for heat pump as that would appear to be major surgery?



It would be highly recommended. Unless you hit high standards for air-tightness and insulation, a heat pump will cost a lot more than you're paying for gas.


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