# 'Missing' credit union loan repayment!



## marfsmal (25 Jul 2009)

Hey everyone, would really appreciate any help on this one just to get it sorted asap.

I had ordered my credit union statement cause the balance was more than I had calculated, got the statement Friday with a note from them saying that no payment (it's 400 each month) had been received for May and to contact my bank! I have a monthy repayment with them same date every month.

So I rang the bank just to confirm that the money had gone out and sure enough it had and they even gave me the date that it was posted (as in the S.O is scheduled for 12th of each month but it takes a few days to arrive at my credit union)

So yeah rang them to say that the bank deducted the amount and they were insisting that they received no payment! So I stuck to my guns and said maybe it's an admin problem on their side and the money was sent to someone else's account by mistake. They were still saying you'll have to call your local branch again! 

Seriously, does anyone know how credit unions work and how this could have happened? This happened Friday and they said they'd call me again about it on Monday so I'd like to have suggestions for them since they only seem to be able to say 'No we didnt receive it'.

Thanks


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## cleverclogs7 (25 Jul 2009)

Gosh,never had that happen before.Mine is taken from my account 24th of each month.never a problem.why dont you show them a copy of your bank statement.should look like this 24/7/09 BRAY C.U XXX.and tell them to take it up with your bank.its not your fault,error on the other side.


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## marfsmal (25 Jul 2009)

The woman in the credit union said 'I believe you', and I was just thinking why the hell would I be making it up!! ?   People just like to take the easy way out and say, no, it's not our fault, it must be the bank (the other person)! So I'll end up paying for bank statement, more calls to my bank, and then they'll probably look into it and say oh it's our fault after all. 

I have no problem with them liaising with my bank themselves to sort it out but do I need to be the go-between?

I'm also annoyed they didn't ring me when no payment went in- I never had any problems paying them and my loan will be paid off in a few months. They could have called me to confirm it.

I just think it's sloppy admin. The interest rate is 10% too on a 6k loan- to be honest I wouldn't borrow from with them again. The banks even offer lower rates. Shouldn't credit unions be lowering interest rates for the community they 'serve'.


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## cleverclogs7 (25 Jul 2009)

Better you go to your bank monday,ask them to look up your ststement for may,tall him/her to print it off (wont cost anything)and hand it into the c.u  . then when the c.u see it in print,its up to them to fix the mess.


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## Ann1 (25 Jul 2009)

You might also ask your bank to check the credit union account details they have on record for the standing order. I know the direct debit has gone through successfully many times but something could have gone wrong in that area. Sounds as if the money is sitting in a suspense account somewhere due to routing details being incorrect maybe?


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## marfsmal (25 Jul 2009)

Thanks to both of you. Yep I'll call up my bank again and confirm that it was routed properly and get copy of bank statement. May need a letter from my branch as well. I'll go mad if it was credit union's fault though and their insistence the bank was at fault after 15 minutes of looking through their files.


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## Ann1 (25 Jul 2009)

Your bank will do a trace for you at your request but ask about the charges first. If the problem is at the credit unions end you will be charged by the bank.


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## marfsmal (26 Jul 2009)

I have a student's account.. I get a lot of these charges waived. Will check beforehand.

Do you know if the credit union normally will liaise with the bank in this scenario or is it up to me?

The reason I don't trust them at my credit union is that they had been routing my second small lodgement of 50 euro to my loan instead of to my shares savings even though I specified it was to be going into shares. It was just 50 euro. If I worked there I'd think now that's a bit odd, someone paying 400 off their loan each month and putting in another 50 by direct debit/s.o.

I normally don't get worked up about stuff but this is just sloppy. Why can some people not apply a little bit of thinking??!!


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## Sue Ellen (26 Jul 2009)

If you use internet banking copy the transactions over to Word and bring a copy of this to your credit union.  With AIB used to be able to print off a free copy of transactions on machine in branch.


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## Ann1 (26 Jul 2009)

Banks are forbidden under legislation to discuss your account with a third party.....even with the written permission of the account holder they are cautious or reluctant to do so. Your bank statement is a confirmation of transactions on your account only. Your statement cannot confirm that the funds being transferred have reached their destination. Your bank will do a trace for you. It might be an idea to put your requests in writing to both your bank and credit union. To be fair to the credit union they may not have received the funds. Sometimes these things happen and its usually human error. It can be as simple as a file being changed to manual while a maintenance is being done by IT and somebody forgetting to flag it back to auto. Don't worry your money is there somewhere.


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## marfsmal (27 Jul 2009)

Okay so today credit union rang me to say they had checked all May records for my reference number and that they payment definitely wasn;'t there. She asked me to check with my bank to see was I credited again with the payment!!!!!!

Rang my local branch, confirmed once again the money was withdrawn from my account  (and not credited back ) and she said to get the credit union to call them and that she would confirm it with them. So I rang credit union back, and told them lady's name and phone number of bank, and also said to them that woman in bank said they cannot trace standing orders- that if there had been a problem it would have been rejected by the credit union's bank and sent back!  So credit union now seem to believe me and said they can get their own bank to trace it and will get back to me later today.

Okay, so obviously this is a different kind of trace? I thought this is what they were supposed to have done before ringing me back this morning to say they'd checked everything.
And is it definitely true you can't trace a standing order apart from checking the reference number is in order?


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## Brendan Burgess (27 Jul 2009)

This is what happens in this situation.

Marf's bank (AIB for simplicity)  sends money to Credit Union bank(Ulster Bank) 

Ulster Bank has got the money or else it would have been sent back to AIB. 

So there are two sources of error

Ulster Bank may have credited it to the wrong account - unlikely, but possible.
Credit Union may have credited it to the wrong account - much more likely.

AIB presumably has been sending this Standing Order through to Ulster Bank for some time. Unless you changed the details, then there is no reason for a mistake to suddenly appear. 

Some Credit Unions are very well run and have good systems. Others are manual. If there is some manual intervention in this, I would guess that this is where the error lay.

Don't expect an apology. Most Credit Unions are arrogant and it is a sin to every criticize them or question their rates or policies.

Brendan


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## bren1916 (27 Jul 2009)

I had a similar problem with a CU in Nth Co Dublin 2 years ago.
Upon checking the balance I couldn't beleieve my ears when they'd told me that I had only made a 2 payments in 13 weeks! (Although my wife's had gone through).
Long story short - I visited the CU with bank statements of the DD leaving my account every week and going into the CU account, only to be told that due to an 'admin error' they'd been crediting the 'wrong' account intermittently!
I didn't take it any further once I was re-imbursed and interest deducted apart from moving my account elsewhere.
On an alarming note, I have since heard from family that a further 2 accounts holders have experienced the same issue in the same CU.
Often thought about reporting it.....


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## Brendan Burgess (27 Jul 2009)

> due to an 'admin error' they'd been crediting the 'wrong' account intermittently



This is worrying and suggests a manual system rather than a computer system.



> Upon checking the balance I couldn't beleieve my ears


The Credit Unions should focus on getting their basic IT systems right and forget about gizmos such as talking bank statements.


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## marfsmal (27 Jul 2009)

Brendan said:


> Ulster Bank may have credited it to the wrong account - unlikely, but possible.
> Credit Union may have credited it to the wrong account - much more likely.
> 
> AIB presumably has been sending this Standing Order through to Ulster Bank for some time. Unless you changed the details, then there is no reason for a mistake to suddenly appear.
> ...


 
Yeah what's with that? She hadn't even called her bank before ringing me to say they definitely didn't get the money.

I've been nice to her so far but firm because she was so matter of fact!

If they did credit to another account by accident will there be any problems getting that reversed do you reckon?


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## bren1916 (27 Jul 2009)

marfsmal said:


> If they did credit to another account by accident will there be any problems getting that reversed do you reckon?


 
No problems getting your money back as bank records will show they received it to their account and did not credit your CU account.
Also - ensure they deduct any interest accrued in that time.
In my case I was led to believe by the Manager of CU that it was a clerical error on their behalf (but I must admit I did suggest a veiled threat of informing the Financial Regulator) which worked absolute wonders in having it sorted out within 24 hours!


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## bren1916 (27 Jul 2009)

Brendan said:


> This is worrying and suggests a manual system rather than a computer system.
> 
> The Credit Unions should focus on getting their basic IT systems right and forget about gizmos such as talking bank statements.


 
They suggested that they had incorrectly entered my 4 digit account number on at least 10 occasions....what can you say??


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## MANTO (27 Jul 2009)

bren1916 said:


> They suggested that they had incorrectly entered my 4 digit account number on at least 10 occasions....what can you say??


 
Worrying to say the least - if they are 'manually' processing these transactions they must have a team of Umpa Lumpas working 24/7 - doomp a dee doo.


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## marfsmal (27 Jul 2009)

What happened to Bren was ridiculous! I'd have reported them to be honest, espec when he knows people it has happened to! 

Re. my own little experience my bank is now tracing the standing order and is ringing me back when they get the information. The credit union said my payment wasn't on their statement from their bank so hey maybe it't not their fault.


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## Towger (27 Jul 2009)

Brendan said:


> The Credit Unions should focus on getting their basic IT systems right and forget about gizmos such as talking bank statements.


 
Brendan,

Ever CR is its own entity (kingdom!), they all bank with different bank have different levels (and versions) of computerisation. I believe some even got their own sort-codes in the last few months, however the majority are not as umm... progressive. I am always amased when I hear that someone wants their salary paid directly into their local CR, all it needs is 'Mary' to go sick or off on holidays and they don't get their pay for a week. Thats apart from the fact that it may take a day longer to get their money in the first place.


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## marfsmal (28 Jul 2009)

Heyas again. Well all has been sorted  

Credit union is closed today but I had a voicemail this morning from manager who said they had been going on their internet bank statements, but she got the full paper statement from the bank and sure enough the money had been received by their bank. And she will be getting on to IT about it! 

IT?

Bizarre explanation! Funny now at least though. Sorry for being a bit cranky in messages yesterday, bureacracy is one of those things that gets to me when it's  a problem!

And thank you all for the advice and help. Am really grateful.


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## cleverclogs7 (28 Jul 2009)

Thats great news.Have a good day


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## Brendan Burgess (28 Jul 2009)

You should leave a voicemail saying that you will be getting onto The IT about it yourself. They would like to see an article in The Irish Times about it. 

Brendan


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## Towger (28 Jul 2009)

She needs a bigger monitor, so she does not have to scroll down the screen when changing from page to page of transactions on the banks internet site!

Up to a year or two ago my CU was still running Novell Netware 3.1.2!!


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