# house inheritance question



## superfan (21 Aug 2014)

Looking for a bit of information for a friend if anyone can help.
His parents are dead and he has always lived in the family home,his siblings all moved out over the years.their father left the house to all of his children in the will and for years my friend lived there without any protest from his siblings but now they want him to sell the house.
He was told if he has been living alone in the family home for over 12 years without any opposition from the rest of the family that he can't be forced to leave/sell the house,does anyone know if that's the case?
He is now 15+ years living in the house alone..


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## WizardDr (21 Aug 2014)

In law there is a concept called adverse possession.

Take a straight forward example - if there ever is any - X inherits house - leaves for Australia an is not seen for 13 years.

Y moves into the house as a squatter and treats it as his own and is there for a full 12 years without ever knowing X.

Y would be likely to succeed in gaining title by way of adverse possession.


Z moves into another house for 12 years  but is granted a 'licence' and signs it from W -Z wont succeed in adverse possession.


To your case:

- what were the circumstances of his acquiring use of property?
- was there any acknowledgement by him that the house is all of ours etc?
- you can see where this is going..
- more facts better answer.

On the bare minimum - maybe adverse possession.


Hope this helps as it tells you what the concept is.


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## superfan (21 Aug 2014)

WizardDr said:


> To your case:
> 
> - what were the circumstances of his acquiring use of property?
> - was there any acknowledgement by him that the house is all of ours etc?
> ...


First of all thanks a lot for taking time out to reply.
He's the youngest child and was the only one still living there when his father died and has lived there ever since.he was only a teenager when his father died and had nowhere else to live.apparently the father stated that as long as any of the children wanted to live in the house it wasn't to be sold but I'm not sure if that is in the will.
He has never denied that the house belongs to all siblings.
I get the impression that it's not all the siblings pushing for a sale,probably only 2 of them.


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## terrysgirl33 (21 Aug 2014)

It seems a bit messy to have a house owned by all the siblings for 15+ years.  It is reasonable for them to leave him living in the house as a teenager and in his 20s, but surely there comes a time when he is expected to share with the others?  Has he any plan to buy or rent his own house?  I spent my 20s renting, as where I was working was no-where near my parents, and I imagine a lot of other people were in the same boat .  After all, he will get his share of the house value towards getting a place of his own when it is sold...

ETA, how many siblings?  I assume his mother predeceased his father?


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## superfan (21 Aug 2014)

Yeah their mother died first.
Adverse possession is probably what he was advised about in the past,having read a bit about it it sounds like he'd have to claim sole possession of the house.can't see him going down that road because he has always acknowledged that they all own the house.
I think he just assumes that because he's more than 12 yrs living in the house unopposed he can't be touched.
There are 6 children btw.


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## PaddyBloggit (21 Aug 2014)

Why now? .... why wasn't this sorted years ago? 

And what has prompted this now?


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## moneybox (21 Aug 2014)

The most sensible thing to do here is to go and get legal advice on the issue.


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## Thirsty (21 Aug 2014)

At a guess I would say that the house wasn't a very high value c. 15 years ago & divided by 6 wouldn't have amounted to a huge amount of money.

In the mean time youngest sibling is taking care of property (granted living rent free) and house price rises have now made it worth while to look to sell...

Who was the executor of the will?  Was probate completed?


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## Branz (21 Aug 2014)

Thirsty said:


> At a guess I would say that the house wasn't a very high value c. 15 years ago & divided by 6 wouldn't have amounted to a huge amount of money.
> 
> In the mean time youngest sibling is taking care of property (granted living rent free) and house price rises have now made it worth while to look to sell...
> 
> Who was the executor of the will?  Was probate completed?



The rent free bit is interesting because if the house is deemed to be owned by the 6 sibs and the young one has been living there rent free, there is a possible gift tax implication for him as outlined in this link

http://www.revenue.ie/en/tax/cat/guide/free-property-loans.html

As suggested earlier, was probate granted and who name(s) are on the deed?

a search for the ownership is a cheap enough exercise


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## mandelbrot (21 Aug 2014)

ircoha said:


> The rent free bit is interesting because if the house is deemed to be owned by the 6 sibs and the young one has been living there rent free, there is a possible gift tax implication for him as outlined in this link
> 
> http://www.revenue.ie/en/tax/cat/guide/free-property-loans.html
> 
> ...



I don't see how a gift tax issue arises, unless the annual mkt value rent of the house exceeds 18k it's not even going to eat into the threshold amount.


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## delgirl (22 Aug 2014)

There's an interesting article  on adverse possession claims in layman's terms.

Legalities aside, would he want to alienate his entire family by claiming the property as his own?



superfan said:


> Adverse possession is probably what he was advised about in the past,having read a bit about it it sounds like he'd have to claim sole possession of the house.can't see him going down that road because *he has always acknowledged that they all own the house.*
> I think he just assumes that because he's more than 12 yrs living in the house unopposed he can't be touched.


Also, as he had acknowledged that they all own the house, his claim will not be successful.

By making this statement, the son admits that he did not have "the necessary intention to preclude the true owner and all other persons from enjoyment of the property", thus making any claim invalid.


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## superfan (22 Aug 2014)

the father is 17 years dead and as far as i know the eldest daughter is executor.
the house is still in the father's name,about 18 months ago the eldest sister gave him a form to fill out but he ignored it,presumably all 4 other siblings got the form too.last week he got the form again but this time it was sent by a solicitor advising him to fill it out and return it as soon as possible.as far as i know the form is to legally change ownership over to all 6 siblings.
communication doesn't seem to be great between them, he's not sure if all of the other 5 are pushing this or if it's just the eldest sister and he doesn't know if she/they just want to tie up a legality but he is convinced it is the first step towards forcing a sale on the house so won't sign the form.
maybe she/they are aware of this adverse possession and are making sure he can't claim that by getting him to sign this form?
as far as he's concerned the house should not be sold because that was their father's wish once any of the children were living there.i doubt he wants to alienate the rest of the family but to be honest there doesn't seem to be much of a relationship there anyway and i suppose in his eyes by forcing a sale they're alienating him.
i can see both sides of the argument but he is the only member of the family i know,he wouldn't know much about computers or the internet so i just said i'd try and find out some more information about that 12 year rule he was told about previously.
thanks again for all the replies.


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## niceoneted (23 Aug 2014)

What about him buying his siblings out? Would he be in a financial position to do this?


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## Branz (23 Aug 2014)

mandelbrot said:


> I don't see how a gift tax issue arises, unless the annual mkt value rent of the house exceeds 18k it's not even going to eat into the threshold amount.



I posted it as something they might not be aware of.
I am not saying any tax is due but it is relevant if he has been there rent free for 17 years.
\Its also relevant in the context of who paid for insuring and maintaining the house.



superfan said:


> the father is 17 years dead and as far as i know the eldest daughter is executor.
> the house is still in the father's name.


Be interesting if the 5 lose out on their cut due to the failure of the executor to do the paperwork in time will the Gang of 4 have a cut at the executor for the financial loss.


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## superfan (23 Aug 2014)

niceoneted said:


> What about him buying his siblings out? Would he be in a financial position to do this?



Doubt it to be honest,certainly not at full market value anyway.


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