# Limited Company - Complete AR but not trading



## aindriu80 (4 Dec 2012)

Hi,

I have an Annual Return (AR) date in the spring for my limited company which has not been trading at all to date.  I want to keep the company so I must complete the AR.

From what I can gather this is my first AR and according to the messages on CORE I do not have to enclose accounts.


Do I just have to fill out the B1 and submit it online via CORE for AR ? 
Are there any other forms I need to submit during the year ?
Can I prepare accounts by myself to submit in subsequent years ?

I got in touch with an accountant and he offered to do the limited accounts for €1500 which is too much.  I really want an cheaper alternative.


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## kennyb3 (5 Dec 2012)

aindriu80 said:


> Hi,
> 
> I have an Annual Return (AR) date in the spring for my limited company which has not been trading at all to date.  I want to keep the company so I must complete the AR.
> 
> ...



Just file the B1, as long as you are sure of the info. no accounts for that one.

For the next B1, if you havent traded it's unlikely you'll have much in terms of accounts - you will have to attach a balance sheet at least showing the share subscription and payment/money due for same.

€1,500 seems crazy - if it's dormant. More like about 300 to 400 euro. (assuming its not a company limited by guarantee and needs to be audited).


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## mandelbrot (5 Dec 2012)

The real question is why anyone would keep alive a dormant company that has never traded. Unless you have a clear intention to trade through the company in the next 2 years, it'd be cheaper to just have it dissolved (very straightforward & cheap in this case), and then form a new company in the future (also straightforward and increasingly cheap)...


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## Time (5 Dec 2012)

People do keep limited companies open as vehicles to own property and cars etc. They may never trade but they do have a use.


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## aindriu80 (5 Dec 2012)

Thanks for the response !  I intend to use the company in the next year or 2 so I am keeping it.  

I logged into core.ie website and there are two messages informing me A B1-ANNUAL RETURN - NO ACCOUNT has been registered FOR this COMPANY. 

That was back in 2012-03-13.  My next AR is 08/03/2013.  I am not 100% sure if accounts are required this time.  

I can do the B1 myself if its just the form but the dormant accounts I will have to get done.  I was told €150 - preparation of dormant accounts plus VAT at 23%.  The balance sheet option sounds grand if I could do that !


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## T McGibney (5 Dec 2012)

€150 (very reasonable) or €1,500 (ludicrous)??
​


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## aindriu80 (5 Dec 2012)

yes €150 plus VAT is a lot more reasonable than going to an accountant at €1500 but kennyb3 suggested a balance sheet might be enough.


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## Time (5 Dec 2012)

For dormant company the balance sheet is enough.


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## aindriu80 (5 Dec 2012)

thanks, I will try the balance sheet.  If I could get a copy of an example somewhere.

I also have to check if just returning the B1 with balance sheet is ok officially.


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## Time (5 Dec 2012)

Buy the returns for a small company online from the cro. I just copied one.


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## aindriu80 (5 Dec 2012)

Time said:


> Buy the returns for a small company online from the cro. I just copied one.



Do you have a URL I can get the returns from ?


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## stephenbyrne (9 Jan 2013)

The accountant that quoted €1500 is still living in celtic tiger Ireland by the sounds of it. €150 is reasonable.


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## Bill Struth (10 Jan 2013)

aindriu80 said:


> Do you have a URL I can get the returns from ?


 http://www.cro.ie/en/downloads-information-leaflets.aspx

Pages 13 & 14 of info leaflet number 10 have an example of what is required.


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## aindriu80 (21 Jan 2013)

hi

I am going to go ahead with the dormant accounts option.  Its costing me €188 which is ok as I do expect to use it in 2013.

I have a question, is filing my B1 along with dormant account the correct solution for me ?  I hope to use the company in 2013 and I was wondering if filing dormant accounts signals that I wish to close it?


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## Time (21 Jan 2013)

Nope.

Filing accounts means you want to use it.


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## aindriu80 (21 Jan 2013)

Thanks, I am going to go ahead with it then.  If I start trading with the company soon all should be ok ?


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## Time (21 Jan 2013)

Of course. As long as everything is up to date at the CRO.


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## T McGibney (21 Jan 2013)

aindriu80 said:


> hi
> 
> I am going to go ahead with the dormant accounts option.  Its costing me €188 which is ok as I do expect to use it in 2013.
> 
> I have a question, is filing my B1 along with dormant account the  correct solution for me ?  I hope to use the company in 2013 and I was  wondering if filing dormant accounts signals that I wish to close  it?





Time said:


> Nope.
> 
> Filing accounts means you want to use it.



Sorry, this is totally incorrect.

Filing accounts is not optional, it is compulsory, regardless of the directors' future intentions regarding the company. 

However accounts need not, and should not, be filed with a company's first return, made up to the date six months after incorporation.

Unless you know what you're doing here, you should get professional assistance. The CRO can and will reject improperly completed returns and you don't want to incur late fees and/or lose audit exemption if this happens. 

If someone has tried to charge you for preparing abridged accounts that you don't need, you should be asking them why.


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## aindriu80 (21 Jan 2013)

Time said:


> Of course. As long as everything is up to date at the CRO.



Yes everything is up to date until March 2013.  Thanks for your reply !



> Sorry, this is totally incorrect.
> 
> Filing accounts is not optional, it is compulsory, regardless of the directors' future intentions regarding the company.
> 
> ...



hmmm....You don't need the account in the first year.  It didn't trade since so I can go the dormant accounts route.  I hope to trade soon and can do so with my current approach so the above is not very helpful and confusing.


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## T McGibney (21 Jan 2013)

aindriu80 said:


> Yes everything is up to date until March 2013.  Thanks for your reply !
> 
> 
> 
> hmmm....You don't need the account in the first year.  It didn't trade since so I can go the dormant accounts route.  I hope to trade soon and can do so with my current approach so the above is not very helpful and confusing.



Apologies, I saw your opening post but didn't see your later post of 5/12/12 where you said:


> I logged into core.ie website and there are two messages informing me A  B1-ANNUAL RETURN - NO ACCOUNT has been registered FOR this COMPANY.
> 
> That was back in 2012-03-13.  My next AR is 08/03/2013.  I am not 100% sure if accounts are required this time.


Just to emphasise my earlier point, Filing accounts is not optional, it is compulsory, even for a dormant company.


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## aindriu80 (21 Jan 2013)

Yes, well I think I got it cleared up but I wasn't getting clear cut answers I was hoping for earlier.  The dormant accounts will do me for this March.


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