# Cost of heating controls



## OkeyDokey (16 Aug 2011)

SEI offer a grant for heating controls.

Does anybody know roughly how much it costs before the grant?

I live in a two story terraced house built in the 50's. The hot water cylinder is upstairs and located near the centre of the house.

The gas boiler was replaced three years ago and is an energy efficient condenser.

The house is approximately 1025 square feet in size.


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## Shane007 (17 Aug 2011)

It really depends on a number of factors such as:

1. How easy is it to split your heating system?
2. Will a new open safety vent pipe be required to be installed and piped back to before the first zone valve. This can happen where the OPSV pipe can be interupted by the installation of a zone valve which is most definitely not allowed.
3. Is the earth bonding up to standard, i.e. 10mm earth wired on all pipework and back to the fuse board?
4. How easy will it be to run wiring from the newly installed room thermostats downstairs and upstairs back to the newly installed wiring centre? (Without surface trunking!)
5. Will carpets & floors need to be lifted and re-instated? We have to do this on a regular basis.
6. How easy will it be to tie in to the existing wiring to the boiler?
7. What quality of materials do you wish to use, i.e. zone valves such as Myson are best on market with very few failures whilst most cheaper ones will most likely failure just when they seem to be out of warranty!
8. Horstmann timeclocks, I find best but they too are more expensive than many others.
9. Does your existing hot water cylinder have a suitable lagging jacket or factory insulation.
10. Do you have a separate timeclock for the your immersion heater and is it located outside of the hot press? This is a requirement for the grant.
11. Once the system is drained and re-filled, do you wish to have a system inhibitor added to the system for long term protection, such as Fernox MB1.
12. Do you wish to zone the house into 3 zones, i.e. downstairs, upstairs and hot water or 2 zones, i.e. heating and hot water? The latter will require a minimum of 50% of your radiators to have TRV's (thermostatic radiator valves) installed.
13. Do you have any solid fuel fires with a back boiler as this will always have to remain as unzoned with no valves whatsoever on that circuit?

So basically, it is very difficult to ascertain how much the installation will cost as there are so many variables.

Best to have a SEAI registered contractor to have a look and make sure to check their references. Also ask who will be doing the wiring for the installation, a plumber or an electrician!


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## OkeyDokey (17 Aug 2011)

Thanks Shane for taking the time to respond and providing so much detail.

Judging by your post there is a lot involved. It's a small house. I am guessing that it is expensive. To expensive to be economical for a small house.


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## Shane007 (17 Aug 2011)

No, not at all. For companies that are regularly doing this, it is not. We normally have this work carried out in 1 day. It is definitely worth zoning as they cost benefit is definite and worthwhile, let alone the convenience factor of being able to turn on only that zone when you want.

Especially with gas, as they are modulating, only the energy required is used to heat that particular zone.

It costs nothing to get a few quotes!


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## hastalavista (18 Aug 2011)

OkeyDokey said:


> SEI offer a grant for heating controls.




Which means that the price of the job goes up by at least the grant.

I know this is a bit harsh but is true, The chair of Bord Snip II has confirmed this to me.


Re "Best to have a SEAI registered contractor."

This means nothing really if there is a problem down stream as SEAI dont want to know about shoddy workmanship or the like. The registration has more to do with being tax compliant than anything else as its EU mula that is being spent.

If I am wrong about this am will to be corrected.

OP: I would look at you existing air tightness, attic insulation, lagging jacket / timer on HW cylinder and simple things like this first


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## Shane007 (18 Aug 2011)

hastalavista said:


> Which means that the price of the job goes up by at least the grant.
> 
> I know this is a bit harsh but is true, The chair of Bord Snip II has confirmed this to me.
> 
> ...


 
Perhaps I should correct you on this. The SEAI is only ensuring a code of practice and insisting that if you are availing of a grant, then the installation/upgrade must be carried out to the standards of the current Building Regulation. Not many people are aware of this. For example, if you are replacing a boiler, it is a Building Regulation that you upgrade the heating system to the current Regulation by installing zoning, etc. If you are carrying out this work, you are required to install it to meet this standard, including boiler interlock, wiring, time and temperature control, etc. It must also be with a boiler of minimum 86% efficiency although SEAI insist on minimum 90% efficiency. In the UK, there is a certification system that must be submitted to Local Government Building Control to ensure that this measure is carried out. Recently, an installer there was imprisoned for 6 months for repeated offences. Building Regulations are legal requirements and are not just there as guidelines. They are also there for the good of the homeowner and not to make it easier for the installer to cut corners.

All installations should meet this Building Regulation, otherwise the installer is breaking the law. Thus, in Ireland where there is no Building Control overlooking this, there are many poor installations. And who suffers, the client! 

Even if it is true that it costs as much as the grant to get it done correctly, then it is justified as the result is the client pays the same amount nett to get it done right!

At least if the client goes for the grant, it must be installed to this standard. If the work still turns out to be "shoddy", there is a definite comeback. SEAI insist that all contractors have a signed contract in place before any works commence. All contracors are regularly audited and if found to be carrying out works to non-compliant standards, they will receive penalty points and/or struck off the approved list of contractors.

If you are still doubtful of picking a contractor from an unknown list, you can always go through the ESB Halo Scheme and still receive the SEAI grant. Your installation contract will be with ESB Halo and not the installer. Their installers not only go through the SEAI auditing system, but they also go through the ESB auditing system.

Regarding being just a measure to ensure tax compliance, this is not true. Should we not all be tax compliant and therefore operate our businesses in a professional manner. How would it look if we the taxpayer contribute to a grant payment to a contractor who is a tax dodger, working for cash and signing the dole at the same time.

Believe me, I have many gripes with the SEAI, however, on this one, I am with them all the way!


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## serotoninsid (18 Aug 2011)

Shane007 said:


> If you are still doubtful of picking a contractor from an unknown list, you can always go through the ESB Halo Scheme and still receive the SEAI grant. Your installation contract will be with ESB Halo and not the installer. Their installers not only go through the SEAI auditing system, but they also go through the ESB auditing system.


From the esb website:
_Typical cost for 2-zone heating control installation for a 3 or 4 bed semi is *€2,372*. With available grants of €400 this can drop to as low as €1,972 _

Are they for real with those costs?  I know there are variables (ie. each job has it's own quirks and circumstances) but those costings are ridiculous.


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## DavyJones (22 Aug 2011)

serotoninsid said:


> From the esb website:
> _Typical cost for 2-zone heating control installation for a 3 or 4 bed semi is *€2,372*. With available grants of €400 this can drop to as low as €1,972 _
> 
> Are they for real with those costs?  I know there are variables (ie. each job has it's own quirks and circumstances) but those costings are ridiculous.




I would suspect they include a boiler change also.


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## OkeyDokey (22 Aug 2011)

serotoninsid said:


> From the esb website:
> _Typical cost for 2-zone heating control installation for a 3 or 4 bed semi is *€2,372*. With available grants of €400 this can drop to as low as €1,972 _



That's prohibitively expensive if it's just for heating controls.

Can somebody provide an average cost or approximate cost band for heating controls?

I can say from experience that a solar system for three people (300l hot water cylinder and 20 evacuated tubes) costs between €3500 and €4000 after the grant. That's based on three quotes from reputable installers. You can probably add plus or minus 10% for awkward layouts or new builds.


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## Leo (22 Aug 2011)

OkeyDokey said:


> That's prohibitively expensive if it's just for heating controls.


 
The €400 grant figure would suggest heating controls only. The grant rises to €650 if a boiler replacement is included.
Leo


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