# Good customer unhappy with product, Should I refund or offer free product?



## dmos87 (27 Mar 2010)

I made a cake last night for a repeat customer. It was her sons birthday today and as he's an only boy it's a very big deal to her. I put my all into the cake and the finished product was amazing to look at - I really was very proud of it when I delivered it today. She was thrilled and so was her little boy. 

Got a missed call from her this evening, called her back. She told me that she was sorry to call me but she wasn't happy with the inside of the cake. It is a two layer cake made separately with different flavourings and one layer she didnt like. 

Genuinely, I feel awful - I have a knot in my stomach since the call. I know the day was very important to her and I wanted it to go well which is why I put so much effort into it - proabably too much as I spent 3-4 hours last night just decorating it. As well as that she has always been a pleasure to deal with and always loves my cakes. She was not nasty at all on the phone, but sounded a little down about it. 

When I delivered the cake she told me she would be ordering another one soon from me for another birthday, so when she told me she wasn't happy with the cake she got today I offered to make the next one free of charge. She was happy to hear this but I still feel bad.

Its the first time someone has had a complaint about my cakes and its not settling well for me, I'm very annoyed at myself. 

Should I refund her the money she paid today? Or is the offer of the free cake enough?


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## Eithneangela (27 Mar 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*

I would gently request the reason for your client not liking the cake.  A little piece of me is fairly suspicious unless there are specific grounds for the cake not being liked - another one to follow soon with the reasonable expectation that you'll offer to do it for free!!!  You need to get specific information before you offer free stuff!


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## dmos87 (27 Mar 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*

She said she "couldn't" eat the layer because of the taste and that one other person at the party was the same. I have never had a complaint about the flavours I use before but again, peoples tastes do vary. This flavouring was by no means an unusual one but I dont think I had used it in her previous cakes as they were quite particular (chocolate fudge, etc.). She didnt request any particular flavourings at all for this one, just wanted a design on the cake. I dont think she is doing it to get a free cake but that could be me beating myself up about it. I'm a perfectionist so I take things like this to heart.


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## tenchi-fan (27 Mar 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*

it's a matter of taste really. If only she and one other person didn't like it I wouldn't lose sleep. Next time ask her what flavours she'd prefer or stick to something safe (chocolate/ madeira) 

the offer of a free cake was pretty generous and hopefully will keep her as a return customer. I would be a bit wary of accepting undue criticism from her again though. You want to make money, not take grief and give away free cakes!


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## dmos87 (27 Mar 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*

This time I am giving her the benefit of the doubt and taking her word for it. Obviously if this becomes a pattern I wont be long telling her no more! honestly, had she received the cake I made from a company or bakery she would have paid at least 60 euros more. 

This has knocked my confidence though, I have a cake booked for Monday that I'm now v. nervous about.


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## z107 (27 Mar 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*

Was there anything wrong with the cake? Did you sample it?
If there wasn't anything wrong with it, then there's no problem.

I would suggest getting your customers to fill in and sign an order sheet prior to baking with stuff like:
 - Cake flavour
 - icing type
 - any allergies or stuff not to put in the cake
 - colour of decoration, icing whatever...

Then you provide the cake to their specification. Keep the order sheet if there are any problems.
With regards to customers in general, if you want to run a business you need you really toughen up a bit. People want everything, and generally for nothing.

Why were you charging her €60 less?


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## dmos87 (27 Mar 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*

I generally work for cost price plus extra for the time and ESB bill. Other people would have overheads and staff to pay, I don't as I do them from home so I can justify it. Obviously if the customer wants a very detailed cake they will have to pay for the time to do it but I can keep most cake decorating to 2 hours or less. Generally a competitive price keeps people coming back, just like this lady. I agree with you though, I will have to toughen up and price a bit better. I'm a little heartbroken tonight after all the effort and extra time I put in. Wish I could post a picture to show you 

The order sheet is a great idea, thank you! I will definitely be doing up a few of them. Lesson learned as they say.


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## aristotle (27 Mar 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*

You are clearly someone who has pride in their work and thats a great attribute to have. But you do have to balance it out in that when one customer dislikels your cake it should not knock your confidence or get you down. There will always be the odd complaint along the way, even the biggest and best companies have customer complaint departments.

You obviously make good cakes or you wouldn't have repeat orders. The order sheet is a good way of limiting any further problems like this, but to be honest it sounds like the customer just didn't like the taste or the flavouring. Thats subjective and down to personal choice. Someone else could have loved it.

So all I'd say is to not worry about one small blip thats probably down to the customers taste. The offer of the free cake is a good idea and very fair (maybe too fair) but you will get repeat orders again from her, but ensure it doesnt become a pattern with her.


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## Capt. Beaky (27 Mar 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*

I'd be a little suspicious of her call. Not quite sure that she initially angled for a freebee. Is she a strong personality that thinks you may be a pushover? As an adult she could have got over the fact that she didn't like the taste. Or was the other person who did not like it a person who she regards as an expert/someone that she looks up to/someone that she takes seriously? But the call was meant to upset you - and it succeeded. She thought before she dialled. You have the experience and you understant layering and flavouring. Often, the argument is not about the argument. Think about it. Before you do the next cake ask her what ingredients she would like included. Or, better still, cut your losses and tell her to go to M&S.


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## dmos87 (27 Mar 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*

Thanks Aristotle. You're advise is bang on. I need a thicker skin and a better backup to avoid this happening again - the order sheet is a really good idea. If complaining does become a pattern with her I will have to reconsider making her cakes in the future as it will cause more trouble for me in the long run.


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## dmos87 (27 Mar 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*

She is a strong personality but I dont think she would have seen me as a pushover, we've always got on well and had a good bit of banter each time I deliver a cake. The other person that didnt like the cake was a relative of hers who is definitely opinionated- thats why she called me, or so she said. She said this person not liking the cake put a dampener on the day for her and she felt she needed to call me.

Basically, this person kept commenting all day on not liking the cake and probably annoyed her.


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## Chocks away (27 Mar 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*

Hi dmos 87. My sister is a professional confectioner in Montreal. Over the years she has developed a system to avoid such complications. An order form, detailing flavouring, layering, frosting, colouring, designs and size. She also kept a photo portfolio of previous designs. If someone leaves the ingredients open, she went with the standard Lemon or Vanilla sponge. Hope this helps and good luck. A price hike may also be in order. You seem to be on the low side.


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## pudds (27 Mar 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*



> Its the first time someone has had a complaint about my cakes



Jeepers.....we'd all love to have a record like that......sounds like you have been doing everything *A1* stop beating yourself up about this


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## helllohello (27 Mar 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*

Could you phone her back in the morning and ask if you can have what is left of the cake back so you can check it? if there is no cake left, then everyone else must have liked it.


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## Hillsalt (27 Mar 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*

Good call.


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## aristotle (27 Mar 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*

If they didnt like the cake they probably just binned it.


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## helllohello (27 Mar 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*

Bin men proberly dont collect on a saturday evening, so it could still be retrieved, just to see how much of it still exists.


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## jack2009 (28 Mar 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*

its obvious you take pride in  your work and no doubt your client knows this too. if you have not already conveyed to her how you feel do so and perhaps give her a small cake of some description as a piece offering.


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## dmos87 (28 Mar 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*

Thats pretty much what I did - the next cake wont be nearly as big as yesterdays one and I told her as long as its an 8" squared with not too much detailing it will be free. Her sons cake was a 16" round layered cake so it was also quite chunky. 

I really dont want to nit-pick about everyone liking / not liking the cake. She has already told me that her and one other person didnt like the cake and chances are that there were a lot of people at the party. If it was not eaten chances are they binned it as one poster said and she might be annoyed with me asking for the remains back. It could cause more trouble than its worth.

I think this morning after sleeping on it that offering the next one free of charge is enough to keep her happy and I need to accept that complaints like this can happen in this industry. The order sheets are being done pronto and I will be sure to stick to them in future.


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## Complainer (28 Mar 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*



dmos87 said:


> I really dont want to nit-pick about everyone liking / not liking the cake. She has already told me that her and one other person didnt like the cake and chances are that there were a lot of people at the party. If it was not eaten chances are they binned it as one poster said and she might be annoyed with me asking for the remains back. It could cause more trouble than its worth.


Maybe, but it would be a great response in case of any future similar complaints like this.


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## dmos87 (28 Mar 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*

Oh absolutely - I will certainly remember to ask that in future. I think calling her back the day after asking for the remains of the cake can be seen as defensive, however had I asked her to provide the cake to me at the first call it would have been fine.


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## MandaC (28 Mar 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*

You definitely need to get more assertive. Some good advise on this thread, one about the order sheet, secondly, about asking for the cake back to test if it was not used.  Agree asking for it back now would be seen as a bit petty.  But you will know for the next time.

My sister had a wedding cake made, one layer of traditional cake, one layer chocolate and biscuit and another layer of toffee and something else.  I liked the other two layers except the fruit cake, because I dont like traditional wedding fruit cake.  Did not mean there was anything wrong with it though. Those who liked it had that.

One customer not liking the cake should not be enough to knock your confidence either.

Big difference between "not liking" the layer or "something wrong" with cakes.  Food is always very subjective. 

Person must have a great life if someone not liking a cake ruined their day. I would think the narky relative cheesed her off so she vented at you. Little to be worried about in this day and age.


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## AgathaC (28 Mar 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*

You obviously take great pride in your work, try not to worry anymore about this. I actually would consider it very bad manners if I was a guest at a party, to start whining that I didn’t like the taste of the cake.  
There have been some good suggestions here, so all I will add is-let this go, and if your customer tries to drag the subject up again, be ready with a light-hearted response. You have been more than generous in offering her a free cake. Put it down to experience and keep up the good work.


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## niceoneted (28 Mar 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*

Sounds to me like it was the mother in law (granny of her son) who didn't like the flavour of the cake!!!
I'm getting hungry for a slice of cake reading this.


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## Ash 22 (28 Mar 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*

Yes you should'nt worry atall about the cake as was previously stated there was nothing wrong with the cake it was the flavour she did'nt like. We don't like the flavour of everything we eat but we don't keep complaining.
Also it was strange for the person to keep saying to her throughout the day that he/she did'nt like the cake. I imagine once would have been enough to say it and if they had any cop on they would have ate the cake and said nothing.


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## Sue Ellen (29 Mar 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*

Very bad manners actually.  Even if I didn't like the cake I certainly wouldn't upset the hostess by constantly going on about it especially when she was busy with her child's birthday party.  

Also 3 to 4 hours is far too long to spend on one cake if you want to make a living from it.


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## becky (29 Mar 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*

plus one.


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## dmos87 (29 Mar 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*

Plus 2!!! 

I would never spend that much time on the cake normally, but as it was a special occasion and she is a repeat customer I did it this time. I certainly wont be doing it again. 

I've done out order sheets too, they look great so hopefully they'll safeguard me somehow.


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## homeowner (29 Mar 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*

Another idea to safeguard yourself is to offer your customers sample tastes of the variety you do, eg a bit if fruit cake, sponge w/jam, chocolate, etc.....  That way they know up front what the inside is going to taste like.  When I ordered a cake from a shop recently, they had bite size samples ready packed in celophane for me to take away before I filed in the order form.


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## dmos87 (29 Mar 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*

Not a bad idea homeowner, the only snag is sometimes my orders are by phone only (last minute orders from people who forgot to order from other places). The order forms are ideal anyway as it can be emailed to them for completion very easily.  Anyone ordering in advance this is a good idea!


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## StaroftheSea (29 Mar 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*

Some people want their cake and to eat it.......


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## browtal (31 Mar 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*

Hello,
It is always difficult dealing with the public. 99% are wonderful to deal with. You will always get the other type too. Also remember peoples taste differ. The order book is a great idea, it will save you.
Make sure the customer selects the flavour and details anything else they want. That takes the ownus from you. 
Bear in mind also that you would need to be god to always get it right. 
A token of a small cake would please most genuine customers. It is a good offer. Maybe the lady depends a lot on her perhaps 'know all friend'. Personal taste varies. Maybe the friend always thinks she could do it better.
Should you have a complaint ask for a sample of the offending product. If there is none, politely apoligise and say that 'like any complaint you will need to be given the opportunity to see what the problem is'. 
You could state that you have a quality control company that does occasional work for you, and you would be happy to get them to check it out. Having worked with the public all my life I thoroughly enjoyed it but after you handle your first compalint satisfactorily you will be much more confident. Best regards Browtal


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## haminka1 (31 Mar 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*



dmos87 said:


> Not a bad idea homeowner, the only snag is sometimes my orders are by phone only (last minute orders from people who forgot to order from other places). The order forms are ideal anyway as it can be emailed to them for completion very easily.  Anyone ordering in advance this is a good idea!



if she is a repeat customer, next time she orders something from you stick to her favourites - if she wants something really different, definitely ask her to come over to your shop and taste it /or bake a little sample and bring it over to her/. then she definitely cannot complain.
i'd also watch for repeats of this kind of behaviour, if she jumped on the "complain and get it for free" wagon, you don't want her as a customer anymore because she not only will misuse you, she'll also spread the gossip about the presumably bad services


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## liaconn (1 Apr 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*

Your customer was definitely out of order. It doesn't appear that (a) there was anything wrong with the cake or (b) you had introduced a flavour she had specifically asked you not to.  One person at the party didn't like the taste of one layer of the cake - that could happen no matter who had made the cake and where she had got it from. I think she had a bit of a cheek to ring you, to be honest, and accepting the offer of a free cake was a bit brass necked.


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## vectra (1 Apr 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*

please don't let this upset you.  i'm sure you take great pride in your baking.  chin up.  if she complains again tell her to go elswhere.  some people really have some cheek!!!.  i'm sure there was nothing at all wrong with the cake.

best of luck


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## ajapale (1 Apr 2010)

*Re: Customer not happy - I feel awful*

Moved from  Miscellaneous  Non-financial Questions to Askaboutbusiness.


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## ajapale (1 Apr 2010)

Hi Dmos,

What you describe is a classic Quality Management dilemma, one which small and large businesses alike grapple with everyday.

You are lucky in a way that you are a perfectionist crafts person who is very close to your customer and is so passionate about your business.

If I were you I wouldnt get too hung up about how cheeky your customer is (this might be true but it wont get you or your customers very far!)

Step1. Ensure that immediate customer is happy.
If your customer was a longstanding good customer I would offer her a free cake.

Step2. Identify what went wrong in this instance.
Enlist the help of the customer (Make them work for their "free" cake!).
This step is not as easy as it seems but it is more than worthwhile in the long term.

Step3. Take steps to ensure that this does not happen again.
Some other posters have made some excellent suggestions (some form the confectionary trade) as to how this might be done.


Chocks away said:


> Hi dmos 87. My sister is a professional  confectioner in Montreal. Over the years she has developed a system to  avoid such complications. An order form, detailing flavouring, layering,  frosting, colouring, designs and size. She also kept a photo portfolio  of previous designs. If someone leaves the ingredients open, she went  with the standard Lemon or Vanilla sponge. Hope this helps and good  luck. A price hike may also be in order. You seem to be on the low  side.



Step4. Encourage Customer Complaints and Comments.
Seperate out the spurious ones and act to address the issues raised by the genuine comments/complaints.
then return to step 1!


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## fmc (6 Apr 2010)

dmos plus one on all of the above  but with one caveat don't ask for peoples allergies just give a list of ingredients and let the people with the allergies decide if they can eat the cake or not. By asking for their allergies before hand its putting the onus on you to make sure its alright for them to eat.


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## dmos87 (7 Apr 2010)

Guys thanks so much for posting! I feel a lot better about the situation after reading the posts. 

I've done up order forms which are detailed enough to keep everything straight-forward and will be putting them into effect immediately. Its mostly tick-the-box for choosing your cake and is clearly described. I also put an allergy waiver at the end of the form re: dairy, nuts, etc. just to inform people of what is generally used in all cakes. It also states should that I cannot guarantee there are no traces etc. so hopefully allergies wont be a problem!! 

I actually saw the customer in question on Saturday night...she went out of her way to avoid me despite me waving to her to say hello. hmmm....!!


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## Complainer (7 Apr 2010)

dmos87 said:


> I also put an allergy waiver at the end of the form re: dairy, nuts, etc. just to inform people of what is generally used in all cakes. It also states should that I cannot guarantee there are no traces etc. so hopefully allergies wont be a problem!!


So you don't want customers with allergies then?


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## dmos87 (7 Apr 2010)

I have no problem tailoring a cake to suit their needs as long as I can safely guarantee it, but because I make cakes containing nuts, etc. on a regular basis I cannot 100% guarantee their exclusion. Their may still be traces of the products though not actually used in the making of the cake. 

If the customer is happy with this, then there is no issue (minor allergies). Should they require a cake that 100% guarantee's no nuts, etc. completely due to a very serious allergy I will not be able to do this and I will have to recommend they go somewhere specialised. I only mentioned the allergies in reference to someones comments on this thread. 

I personally have no problems tailoring a cake for allergies - I have dairy allergies myself and also have a sister who is a severe Coeliac so I am very familiar with how difficult it is to find products that 100% guarantee the exclusion of certain products.

Business is business and I am not one to refuse it, I need all I can get.


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## Complainer (7 Apr 2010)

I was stirring it up a little bit with my comment about allergies. It is good to see that you understand the business benefits available from meeting the needs of as many customers as possible.

I've no idea what would be involved in taking it to the next level, and preparing foods that are OK for those with severe allergies. I presume that no social situation can 100% guarantee that there are no food particles on (for example) a restaurant seat, or a door handle or whatever.


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## Wishes (7 Apr 2010)

If the opinionated in-law didn't like the flavor of the cake then that's tough.  If you ask me I would be in no rush to bake another for her.  You don't need problematic customers like this.


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## Featherhead (7 Apr 2010)

OP, I think its lovely that you take cush pride in your work and that you are concerned about customer satisfaction but as others wisely advised be careful of people taking advantage of this. If a customer does not 'like' the taste of a cake then that is an issue with their taste and preferences and not the cake itself. 

For example my boyfriend does not like mint which is handy as he will not steal any of my after eight easter egg . The fact that he does not like my easter egg does not mean that there is anything wrong with it though and does not warrant me going back to the shop with it and expecting a free easter egg next time just because he does not like mint flavour. I would imagine if a customer is going to invite 20 - 30 people to a party then inevitably some people will not like the cakes flavour or maybe some will not eat cake at all. Thats why you often see wedding cakes with the three or four cakes with different flavours as that way you have more chance of pleasing the majority. 

The order forms are a great idea - get a record of what flavours and filling people requested and as you are doing it by email its easy for you to store them too so if you get a complaint in future you can refer back to their order. 

The offer of a free cake is more than enough for this customer so please stop feeling guilty about it - you have to deal with this a little more business like I think even though its clear its a passion for you. Give them the free cake and next time they order charge full price and ask in advance exactly what they do or do not want. Don't spend ages on the free cake either 3-4 hours is madness

Don't lose the passion and enthusiasm you have for what you do though - its often what sets people apart from the rest


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## dmos87 (8 Apr 2010)

For example my boyfriend does not like mint which is handy as he will not steal any of my after eight easter egg . The fact that he does not like my easter egg does not mean that there is anything wrong with it though and does not warrant me going back to the shop with it and expecting a free easter egg next time just because he does not like mint flavour. 


LOVE this quote!! puts it all in perspective


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