# UK State Pension / Irish State Pension



## dovetail (1 Apr 2020)

I worked in the UK for a period of time and paid UK National Insurance contributions for a full 7 years. I found out recently that I can voluntarily top up my UK NI contributions  by 3 years, to bring my total UK contributions level up to 10 years, which is the minimum requirement to qualify for the minimum UK State pension at the UK retirement age.

Regarding the Irish State Pension, I  had contacted the relevant department (long before I became aware of the above option), who advised at the time that UK contributions could be taken into account when it gets to the time for me to apply for the Irish State Pension.

Q.1. Does anybody know, if I decided to top up the UK contributions, and then apply for the minimum UK state pension when the time comes, can the 7 years of paid UK contributions still be taken into account when it comes to the time to apply for the Irish State pension?

Q.2 If in this case, the 7 years UK contributions could NOT be used in the calculation for the Irish State pension, can I voluntary top up the Irish contributions for these for these 7 years (2001-2007)?


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## Feemar5 (1 Apr 2020)

As far as I know your 7 years can be added to your Irish contributions.   There are big changes in qualifying for the contributory pension in Ireland - see citizens information website, age you first contributed, average of paid contributions . You can buy contributions but you must have 520 paid and it appears that it must be from the first week after you leave compulsory insurance.   Get citizens information to check it out for you.


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## NoRegretsCoyote (2 Apr 2020)

Do a search of some threads here. I have heard some contradictory advice. Some say that you can't claim both state pensions, others saying that they are in receipt of both.


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## Hooverfish (2 Apr 2020)

Question 2. No, I think you are too late to top up for those years in either jurisdiction. UK currently allows you to top up from 2007 to current years. You definitely can get both pensions (my husband does). The only issue is where you buy back years from the UK (given they only allow you to buy back recent years) that you already have a full Irish contribution for. That's where some people are saying they have done this and they got both pensions paid, others are wondering will they ever see a return on the buyback? I have recently decided to do a buy back myself, but I still think it is to some extent unclear.


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## Feemar5 (2 Apr 2020)

[My husband bought back some years in the UK and he gets two pensions - Irish and  reduced UK.     I also got a reduced  UK pension on his contributions which was a great surprise!!     It was the best investment he ever made.


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## dovetail (2 Apr 2020)

Feemar5 said:


> As far as I know your 7 years can be added to your Irish contributions.   There are big changes in qualifying for the contributory pension in Ireland - see citizens information website, age you first contributed, average of paid contributions . You can buy contributions but you must have 520 paid and it appears that it must be from the first week after you leave compulsory insurance.   Get citizens information to check it out for you.


Thank you for you reply back. Yes I have checked, and the 7 year UK contributions can definitely be taken into account for Irish state pension calculation. But if I use those years to be taken into account for the Irish state pension, then perhaps I cannot use them against calculation for reduce UK state pension. This is the part I am hoping to clarify.


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## dovetail (2 Apr 2020)

NoRegretsCoyote said:


> Do a search of some threads here. I have heard some contradictory advice. Some say that you can't claim both state pensions, others saying that they are in receipt of both.


Thank you  for the reply back. I did some research for this also, and I can be in receipt of both Irish and UK state pensions, albeit it will be a reduced UK state pension.


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## dovetail (2 Apr 2020)

Hooverfish said:


> Question 2. No, I think you are too late to top up for those years in either jurisdiction. UK currently allows you to top up from 2007 to current years. You definitely can get both pensions (my husband does). The only issue is where you buy back years from the UK (given they only allow you to buy back recent years) that you already have a full Irish contribution for. That's where some people are saying they have done this and they got both pensions paid, others are wondering will they ever see a return on the buyback? I have recently decided to do a buy back myself, but I still think it is to some extent unclear.




Thank you  for the reply back. I checked with UK Pension service. I can buy back 3 years post 2007 required to bring me up to the 10 year minimum required for reduced UK state pension. Its definitely a worthwhile investment!


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## dovetail (2 Apr 2020)

I agree with Hoover Fish that is probably too late to buy back 2001-2007 years for Irish state pension. 

I will continue to research information to find the answer Q.1 on the initial posting. Basically, If I claim the reduced UK state pension, can I still use those UK years to also plug the gap with it comes to claiming the Irish Sate pension?   i.e. the UK contributions can only taken into account for 1 claim in 1 county. or the same UK contributions can be taken into account for both claims / both countries?


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## jpd (2 Apr 2020)

Under EU rules both countries do two calculations - one based solely on your contribution in each country and a second one based on your total contribution in both countries to calculate what your pension entitlements would be. In the second calculation, each country then calculates the portion of that pension which they pay pro-rata to your contributions in that country. This is compared to the first figure and they pay you whichever is the bigger - for example if you had 30 years in Ireland and 10 in the UK, the Irish would calculate 30/40ths of the Irish pension based on 40 years service. If this is bigger than the Irish pension based on 30 years contribution in Ireland, then they will pay this

I think Ireland & UK may have other reciprocal arrangements as well


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## JSnowWinterfell (2 Apr 2020)

Hello, I also need some direction on this issue. Am I correct in that to get the Full Irish State Pension you need 520 monthly contributions?

I am in a position in which I have UK contributions and citizenship for a period up to 2012, enough to get a minimum pension. I then had 4 years of United States Social Security, lastly my contributions in Ireland only first started at age 30 in 2016. 

I was planning to reach out to UK to see if I could get US contributions recognised in the UK, but my base assumption was that I would get both a UK pension and an Irish pension at retirement.

Is there anything I need to do to ensure I get an Irish State pension given 520 contributions is 40 years, and I hope to retire prior to that.


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## Marc (2 Apr 2020)

Joomag
					






					view.joomag.com


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## jpd (2 Apr 2020)

The contributions required for a full pension and the amount of a "full" pension is a moving target and will change in the next 10 years, so it is not possible to answer your question with any great degree of certainty.


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## Conan (2 Apr 2020)

JSnowWinterfell said:


> Hello, I also need some direction on this issue. Am I correct in that to get the Full Irish State Pension you need 520 monthly contributions?
> 
> I am in a position in which I have UK contributions and citizenship for a period up to 2012, enough to get a minimum pension. I then had 4 years of United States Social Security, lastly my contributions in Ireland only first started at age 30 in 2016.
> 
> ...


Currently, to get the minimum State Pension in Ireland you need a minimum of 520 weekly contributions (10 years).  To get the maximum State Pension is currently a more complicated calculation requiring an average yearly contribution history of 48 pa from when you first stated paying PRSI. However it is proposed to change the calculation model over the next few years to a 1/40th of the State Pension for each year of contribution. Whether this will go ahead or not is unclear currently.
If you have a UK history it is currently possible to add the UK years to your Irish PRSI record to maximise your Irish Pension. Since you are only in your mid 30’s it is impossible to predict how this will work out in the future.


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## Coolaboy (12 Apr 2020)

Hi folks. I worked in the UK for 9 years and it would be great to get an UK pension. Who do I contact about putting this place and possibly buy some extra years to build up my pension. Many thanks. James.


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## Conan (12 Apr 2020)

The Dept. of Work and Pensions (Based in Newcastle)
Have a look at their website and if you have your details (National Insurance No.) you can check on any entitlement.


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## Marc (12 Apr 2020)

I have just gone through this process myself. Very simple process to obtain projection, they specify the missing years. 
The key benefit is that as a non resident you pay class 2 national insurance rates rather than the more expensive class 3









						Voluntary National Insurance contributions and the State Pension | MoneyHelper
					

Voluntary National Insurance contributions can help make sure you have enough qualifying years to get the full State Pension. Find out more here.




					www.pensionsadvisoryservice.org.uk


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## NoRegretsCoyote (13 Apr 2020)

Marc said:


> I have just gone through this process myself. Very simple process to obtain projection, they specify the missing years.
> The key benefit is that as a non resident you pay class 2 national insurance rates rather than the more expensive class 3



How long did it take for a response? I sent them a letter two months ago and nothing back yet.


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## Marc (13 Apr 2020)

That was my experience too. When I called them they said that their service standard was something like 2 months.


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## Hooverfish (13 Apr 2020)

My most recent letter 9 Feb has not yet received a reply. Can't say I'm surprised at the moment!


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## dovetail (13 Apr 2020)

Marc said:


> I have just gone through this process myself. Very simple process to obtain projection, they specify the missing years.
> The key benefit is that as a non resident you pay class 2 national insurance rates rather than the more expensive class 3
> 
> 
> ...


I was in touch recently with the Dept. of Work and Pensions to make voluntary contributions. They posted out a UK state pension forecast, and they also asked me to complete form NI38/CF83 which I have done. (when I was filling out the form it did not feel like the form was geared towards non-residents). Anyway, I am hoping now they will get back to me with the total cost to top up for the missing years to take me to the minimum 10 years.

Just cheking if I am on the right track. Is this the form NI38/CF83 the last thing that you also sent to them?


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## Hooverfish (6 May 2020)

My letter from 9 Feb got replied to today, 6 May. So they are still working, it's just very delayed... I'm delighted, as I spent about an hour trying to get through to them by phone (no luck) yesterday and was wondering what to do next!


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## NoRegretsCoyote (6 May 2020)

I got my letter back in Mid-April, so about a nine-week response time.

It was somewhat cryptic but said that eligibility will be assessed on the basis of my PRSI record, which I have since sent back to them.


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