# Price of petrol



## fizzelina (24 Jan 2011)

My LOS rant for today is that it cost me €75 to fill a 1.4L Golf with petrol.....petrol is just so expensive!! At almost €1.50 a litre it has shot up at a time when wages are coming down and increased taxes are being paid. But €75 to fill a car with petrol so I can get to work for the week is really bothering me....


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## thedaras (24 Jan 2011)

I have a relative who lives in the country and travels each day to work in Dublin.
The cost of petrol is having an adverse affect on their income.

If it costs 75e a week that is (obviously ) 300 euro a month, to get 300e he probably has to earn the best part of 500e!! Mad Ted.


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## DB74 (24 Jan 2011)

thedaras said:


> I have a relative who lives in the country and travels each day to work in Dublin.
> The cost of petrol is having an adverse affect on their income.
> 
> If it costs 75e a week that is (obviously ) 300 euro a month, to get 300e he probably has to earn the best part of 500e!! Mad Ted.


 

Did they not know there would a commute from the country to Dublin every day?


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## werner (24 Jan 2011)

fizzelina said:


> My LOS rant for today is that it cost me €75 to fill a 1.4L Golf with petrol.....petrol is just so expensive!! At almost €1.50 a litre it has shot up at a time when wages are coming down and increased taxes are being paid. But €75 to fill a car with petrol so I can get to work for the week is really bothering me....


 
Petrol/Diesel is still a cheap commodity (when you remove the tax element)

Two thirds of the price of a litre is excise duty and tax so the price is kept artificially high by government policies

During the worst recession Ireland has ever experienced the Green/FF budget wants to impose additional stealth taxes i.e. carbon taxes on top of what you already pay

Total lunancy !


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## thedaras (24 Jan 2011)

DB74 said:


> Did they not know there would a commute from the country to Dublin every day?



They did ,why?


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## Shawady (24 Jan 2011)

werner said:


> During the worst recession Ireland has ever experienced the Green/FF budget wants to impose additional stealth taxes i.e. carbon taxes on top of what you already pay
> 
> Total lunancy !


 
I read in the paper yesterday that this government has added 20 cent extra tax per litre alone.


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## DB74 (24 Jan 2011)

thedaras said:


> They did ,why?


 
Just curious. Bit of a mad decision to leave that commute every day. Fuel has never really been cheap in Ireland with the amount of tax levied by the state.


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## TarfHead (24 Jan 2011)

We're, still, a two car family and last week I spent over €140 on petrol in the space of 12 hours.

This morning, on the way to work, I saw prices in the range 1.459 to 1.489. TOPAZ run a corporate card scheme and the cost, per litre, on the scheme is, this week, down 2c, so hopefully that follows through to the retail price.

I thought the Minister for Finance wanted to roll back costs to 2006  ?


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## thedaras (24 Jan 2011)

DB74 said:


> Just curious. Bit of a mad decision to leave that commute every day. Fuel has never really been cheap in Ireland with the amount of tax levied by the state.



It wasn't a "mad decision" rather a decision of necessity.He lost his job(local) and the only one available to him is in Dublin.


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## Caveat (24 Jan 2011)

thedaras said:


> It wasn't a "mad decision" rather a decision of necessity.He lost his job(local) and the only one available to him is in Dublin.


 
Kind of obvious really.


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## thedaras (24 Jan 2011)

Yep, I would have thought so too,but obviously not.


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## truthseeker (24 Jan 2011)

thedaras said:


> It wasn't a "mad decision" rather a decision of necessity.He lost his job(local) and the only one available to him is in Dublin.


 
Yeah Ive a pal in the same boat - currently its costing him 600 a month on petrol, plus he needs to have his car serviced and tyres replaced more often than an average driver, so its costing him close to ~800 a month for his commute. Madness.


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## thedaras (24 Jan 2011)

And sad too, I have to say,as the time they spend commuting is horrendous!
They miss out on so much,and play catch up all weekend,not to mention the pure wear and tear on the car and the person,and the risk of being involved in an accident must be higher!


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## Shawady (24 Jan 2011)

Ditto. My friend lost his job last year. He is living in Kildare and even then was spending over €100 on petrol and tolls commuting to work. 
If he got offered a job in Dublin, I could see the cost of commuting being a stumbling block in him taking a job, purely on economic grounds.
There must be plenty of people in satelite towns that are in the same position.

I thought at the time of the last budget that increasing tax on alcohol rather than fuel would have been fairer.


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## DB74 (24 Jan 2011)

Caveat said:


> Kind of obvious really.


 
Clearly I'm not as clever as you


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## truthseeker (24 Jan 2011)

thedaras said:


> And sad too, I have to say,as the time they spend commuting is horrendous!
> They miss out on so much,and play catch up all weekend,not to mention the pure wear and tear on the car and the person,and the risk of being involved in an accident must be higher!


 
Yeah - this particular individual spends between 3 and 4 hours a day behind the wheel. 

Personally if I were him Id leave the job, its costing him over 10k year on fuel, car servicing, tax, insurance etc and child care costs him roughly the same, 40k of the guys earnings are JUST to take home the spend on commuting and childcare!!


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## Caveat (24 Jan 2011)

DB74 said:


> Clearly I'm not as clever as you


 
Whatever you say.


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## thedaras (24 Jan 2011)

What Caveat said


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## rustbucket (24 Jan 2011)

Its not just the government levies. Some of the Petrol companies are acting like a Cartel.

Howcome Every Petrol Station in Bray Charges at least 4 cent a litre more than anywhere else ive seen.


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## BillK (24 Jan 2011)

Unleaded petrol is costing £1.30 (sterling) in my local area in England, which would be about €1.60 assuming exchange rate of €1.13 to £1.


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## huskerdu (25 Jan 2011)

Here is comparison of petrol prices across Europe. 

http://www.aaireland.ie/AA/Motoring-advice/Petrol-Prices.aspx

I'd love to see a breakdown of the cost of a litre of petrol

How much is tax / cost of petrol coming into Ireland / margin and profit for retailer/wholesaler  ?

Any ideas where I would get this ?


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## huskerdu (25 Jan 2011)

In answer to my own question, according to www.revenue.ie. the excise duty on petrol, including carbon tax in Dec 2010 was 57.6c per litre. 

Is this the correct calculation for the cost of a litre of petrol

Amount going to the retailer  73.5c
VAT 21% of 73.5c               15.5c
Excise duty                        57.6c
TOTAL                               1.46


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## Shawady (25 Jan 2011)

During the last spike in oil prices two years ago, the OPEC countries were quick to point out that western governments made more money from petrol and diesel than the oil-producing countries themselves.


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## onq (25 Jan 2011)

fizzelina said:


> My LOS rant for today is that it cost me €75 to fill a 1.4L Golf with petrol.....petrol is just so expensive!! At almost €1.50 a litre it has shot up at a time when wages are coming down and increased taxes are being paid. But €75 to fill a car with petrol so I can get to work for the week is really bothering me....



+1 to that.

Its costs like this that made me re-think my career and decide to work  mainly from home. 
Even when I was working in Baggot Street and living in  Wicklow, I wasn't getting paid for the commute mileage. 

People wonder wonder why I get annoyed at the thought of having to do a planning application for €500 "all in" in the current market.

Its simple - ever mind the overheads, insurance, heating and whatnot - just driving around to do the work costs a fortune. e.g.;


 survey the site
research recent precedent [some still not online]
 research older precedent [most are not online]
 meet the planner
 get the Ordnance Survey Maps
 meet the client [more than once]
 collect the cheque [sometimes a repeat call required]
 lodge the application
 deliver the client copy
  All the above can cost up to €100 depending on where they live.
Transport can be €100 of the fee and you have to pay tax on that to earn it, so heading for a third of the €500 "fee".



ONQ.


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## onq (25 Jan 2011)

BTW, for those of you near the South City, I have found the garage at the KCR - Kimmage Cross Roads - to be very competitive.

Unless its against some new forum rules, it might be useful to post locations and prices.

I'm sure others will know of better places to fill up.

ONQ.


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## Boyd (25 Jan 2011)

onq said:


> Unless its against some new forum rules, it might be useful to post locations and prices.
> 
> ONQ.



http://www.pumps.ie already offer this service explicitly


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## huskerdu (25 Jan 2011)

Dundrum / Ballinteer is not bad at the moment for petrol prices.
Tesco, Apple Green, and Maxol all compete and drive down the prices overall. 

On any given day, you cannot predict which is cheaper, but if you check them, one will be quite competitive.


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## Time (25 Jan 2011)

I am currently paying the equivalent of €1.17 for my petrol. My road tax is €34 per year. 

It is great not being in Ireland.


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## Caveat (25 Jan 2011)

Time said:


> My road tax is €34 per year.


 
Ah, but is that because you virtually don't have "roads" where you live?


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## onq (25 Jan 2011)

Time said:


> I am currently paying the equivalent of €1.17 for my petrol. My road tax is €34 per year.
> 
> It is great not being in Ireland.



You live on a boat?

ONQ.


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## onq (25 Jan 2011)

username123 said:


> http://www.pumps.ie already offer this service explicitly



Thanks - I didn't know about pumps.ie.

I'll add Harolds Cross Road to my shortlist. 

ONQ.


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## Ancutza (26 Jan 2011)

> I am currently paying the equivalent of €1.17 for my petrol. My road tax is €34 per year.
> 
> It is great not being in Ireland.


 


We must be living in the same country!  That's what I pay too.


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## Homer (26 Jan 2011)

huskerdu said:


> In answer to my own question, according to www.revenue.ie. the excise duty on petrol, including carbon tax in Dec 2010 was 57.6c per litre.
> 
> Is this the correct calculation for the cost of a litre of petrol
> 
> ...



As far as I know, VAT is charged on the total price. If this is correct and excise duty is 57.6c and the price at the pumps is €1.46, then the split is as follows:

Total amount going to the retailer, wholesaler and oil company 63.1c
Excise duty                        57.6c
VAT 21% of 120.7c = 25.3c
TOTAL                               146.0c

That means that the total of VAT and excise duty  is 82.9c, which equals 56.8% of the total retail price.


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## Chris (27 Jan 2011)

Homer said:


> As far as I know, VAT is charged on the total price. If this is correct and excise duty is 57.6c and the price at the pumps is €1.46, then the split is as follows:
> 
> Total amount going to the retailer, wholesaler and oil company 63.1c
> Excise duty                        57.6c
> ...



You are absolutely right. VAT is paid on the excise duty as well, which is a scandal, but so common throughout Europe that I don't think anything would be done about it. It also makes me laugh when you hear the general public and politicians giving out about how much oil companies are charging with all their greed and exuberant profits. Here is a chart for Shell's profit margin: [broken link removed]
Oil companies' profits are dwarfed by the greed of governments, who at the end of the day have no involvement in the business risks of making the petrol. People need to wake up to the fact that we are not being ripped off by oil companies but by our very own government.


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## huskerdu (27 Jan 2011)

Homer said:


> As far as I know, VAT is charged on the total price. If this is correct and excise duty is 57.6c and the price at the pumps is €1.46, then the split is as follows:
> 
> Total amount going to the retailer, wholesaler and oil company 63.1c
> Excise duty                        57.6c
> ...



Thanks for that clarification. 
I have relooked at the revenue site and I saw the following line in relation to a budget increase.

"Excise duty will increase, such that, after VAT is added, the increase in a litre of petrol will be 4c." 

This must mean that VAT is calculated on the price after excise duty is added.


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## Shawady (27 Jan 2011)

Isn't VAT charged on VRT when you buy a new car? 
In effect, a tax upon a tax.


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## DB74 (27 Jan 2011)

Shawady said:


> Isn't VAT charged on VRT when you buy a new car?
> In effect, a tax upon a tax.


 
Yes


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## shnaek (27 Jan 2011)

Chris said:


> People need to wake up to the fact that we are not being ripped off by oil companies but by our very own government.


Hear hear, but judging by this article 

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/trust-in-the-government-reaches-record-low-2513212.html

it looks like people have woken up to the fact that the government is not our friend. In my dream world this realisation actually results in change. Here's to hoping.


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## Chris (27 Jan 2011)

shnaek said:


> Hear hear, but judging by this article
> 
> http://www.independent.ie/national-news/trust-in-the-government-reaches-record-low-2513212.html
> 
> it looks like people have woken up to the fact that the government is not our friend. In my dream world this realisation actually results in change. Here's to hoping.



Hoping is all we can do. Unfortunately the devil is in the detail in that article, even just in the deadline. Big difference between trust in "the government" and trust in "government" in general. Anyway, veering off topic a bit.


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## Protocol (27 Jan 2011)

Why do people keep going on about VAT on the duty-inclusive price?

It has always been like that, and it is like that in all other countries.


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## Protocol (27 Jan 2011)

Fuel excise duties across the EU:

[broken link removed]


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## Protocol (27 Jan 2011)

Fuel duties are much more sensible than 50%+ marginal income tax rates on 30-40k wages.


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## Chris (28 Jan 2011)

Protocol said:


> Fuel duties are much more sensible than 50%+ marginal income tax rates on 30-40k wages.


Actually less taxation in general and less government spending is the most sensible option.



Protocol said:


> Why do people keep going on about VAT on the duty-inclusive price?
> 
> It has always been like that, and it is like that in all other countries.



Just because something is doesn't mean it ought to be. The reason this has been brought up is because lots of people tend to immediately blame oil companies and petrol stations for high petrol prices, when government is the biggest profiteer when it comes to fuel.


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## grahamo (19 Feb 2011)

AAargh! i hate the govt. They forced up the price of houses so people couldn't afford to live in the area they grew up in anymore. Then when said people buy a car as they now NEED one to get to work as they've been forced to live out in the sticks they hike up petrol prices. Aaaargh! Rant over!!


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