# Emigrating and Banks not cooperating



## Bigbird (8 Oct 2013)

Hi,unfortunately due to the dire unemployment situation in this country we have to emigrate.  I have been getting little bits of work here and there but nothing substantial i.e. not enough to live a reasonable standard of living.  We have eaten into any bit of savings in order to repay mortgage debt and have lived an INCREDIBILY frugal lifestyle.  We are driving cars that are bangers and according to our local garage need to really be replaced as there is so much repair work required on both vehicles. We have no social life and things are quite bleak.

I bought my house in 04 and it's in negative equity.  My plan is to rent it out but the current rent will not cover the mortgage.  My partner who has nothing to do with the mortgage helps me out with household bills but is a bit resentful that his hard earned cashed is being pumped into a financial situation that he has nothing to do with.   I can afford to meet the bills due to my partner's help but are only existing ourselves and keeping other people in jobs (ie supermarkets, esb, gas etc)  

I rang the bank to find out if I could reduce the mortgage to interest only and they have come back saying that I have to fill in some kind of financial statement thing.  When I looked at it I was horrified to see that they want to know everything about your life.  We have been scrimping and living a MISERABLE MISERABLE life in order to save a bit to set up elsewhere so we have  cut costs and living expenses down to a minimum. * My question to you is that after filling in our outgoings we have roughly E300.00 to spare each month (which we have been saving).  What chance do we have in getting an interest only repayment on the mortgage?  *

Also I was talking to a neighbour who is in a similar situation.  What struck me about her was that she is living it up.  Good cars, great social life and literally spends every red scent she has.  She told me her mortgage had been restructured.  She goes on a few holidays a year, weekends away, concerts and is always spending.  *Where we foolish to live like peasants to pay the bills in order to give over the pittance we're saving to the banks? *I'm really annoyed at this unfair set up. 

S*hould I just throw the keys in the letter box and flee but if we wish to return in years to come and apply for credit what are my chances of getting any?  On the other hand if I restructure the payments to interest only is it possible that my credit rating will also be affected.  *

Please please help.  I'm at my wits end and feel like a fool for scrimping and saving pittance only to hand it over to the bank when I'm not lucky enough to get work.  We're only existing and have absolutely no quality of life.


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## so-crates (8 Oct 2013)

First thing that jumps out at me...

Why does your partner resent helping pay the bills? Does he live with you? If not I can understand it but if he does live with you... How much would it cost him to rent somewhere else and pay bills there? That is a good basis for what he should be paying to you. Otherwise he is living rent-free and basically sponging off you!

As for your neighbour - firstly, don't assume she can afford the lifestyle you accuse her of. Secondly, how is her mortgage restructured? (Longer term, interest only, etc). She may have no savings to speak of and and she may be storing up problems for tomorrow. You don't know. You are speculating.


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## ClaireM (8 Oct 2013)

The bank don't know you have been scrimping rather than living the high life because you have not filled out the Financial Statement. You will not get a restructure without doing this.

When you say you have €300 per month left so save is this after paying a full interest and capital mortgage repayment?

Are your expenses below the Reasonable Living Expenses? If your own expenses are lower the €300 you are saving could legitimately be included as an expense that would allow a provision for car maintenance, Christmas presents etc You could later decide to use this money for something other than Christmas, car etc


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## Brendan Burgess (8 Oct 2013)

You will need to complete 

Standard Format for unsustainable mortgage Case Studies

to get any meaningful suggestions.

Brendan


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## Bigbird (8 Oct 2013)

In relation to my partner, yes he could rent somewhere else and live in a far better location (to work) and house for what I'm paying in mortgage repayments.  The house was built during the boom years.  It's extremely poor quality (I always think if you lean long enough against the walls then they'd collapse) and out in the middle of nowhere.

Yes you're right I am speculating about the neighbour. But the banks show no recognition for those who are living miserable lifestyles in order to service their debts.  There are plenty of people who are putting family and lifestyle first and then the banks.


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## Bigbird (8 Oct 2013)

Claire M I'm not sure.  I remember reading an article in the Business Post about a year ago in relation to Reasonable Standard of living according to some charity (sorry the name escapes me). I was horrified as we were well below it. After that I improved my spending not on anything exciting mind you but on things like for example psychotherapy. I had denied myself help for my mental health issue up to that point but then started to spend money for support as recommended by G.P.  
Yeah Brendan, I'll complete that and see what the upshot is.


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## ClaireM (8 Oct 2013)

Bigbird said:


> But the banks show no recognition for those who are living miserable lifestyles in order to service their debts. .



The bank can't recognise anything until you go through the correct procedure which is to submit a Standard Financial Statement.

[broken link removed]

The link is to the Reasonable Living Expenses set out by the Insolvency Service.


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## Bronte (8 Oct 2013)

Bigbird said:


> Please please help. I'm at my wits end and feel like a fool for scrimping and saving pittance only to hand it over to the bank when I'm not lucky enough to get work. We're only existing and have absolutely no quality of life.


 
I'm sorry for the circumstances you find yourself in.  Many of us were like you when we first got mortgages.  It doesn't make you a fool though.  Do you consider trying to pay what you owe foolish. 

You'll get more concrete advise when you fill out the form, please put as much detail as possible.


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## Bigbird (8 Oct 2013)

Yeah Bronte I can appreciate where you are coming from but I haven't met many people who on their first mortgage were landed in a property that a)does not meet their growing needs (too small for family life) b) is out in the middle of nowhere c) is constructed in a sub standard way (can hear people in next room scratch in the middle of the night) d) paid over the odds 180k and it is now worth approximately 90k (with a bit of luck).  e) Was earning E36k at the time and was given a mortgage of 180k without a bother. Oh dear, just looking my description there, there is a comic element to it - so pathetic.  Black humour.


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## so-crates (8 Oct 2013)

Bigbird said:


> In relation to my partner, yes he could rent somewhere else and live in a far better location (to work) and house for what I'm paying in mortgage repayments.  The house was built during the boom years.  It's extremely poor quality (I always think if you lean long enough against the walls then they'd collapse) and out in the middle of nowhere.



But does he pay rent? It is awkward I know but fundamentally it doesn't matter if he could live somewhere else. He isn't and if he is living with you for the price of an electricity bill he is getting a deal he could not get anywhere else so resenting it is neither fair nor constructive. I am not saying start charging him rent but perhaps he needs to consider whether he is being fair to you. His unwarranted resentment cannot be contributing to your well-being or his.



Bigbird said:


> Yes you're right I am speculating about the neighbour. But the banks show no recognition for those who are living miserable lifestyles in order to service their debts.  There are plenty of people who are putting family and lifestyle first and then the banks.


You have said yourself that you have not filled in the statement for the bank so how can the bank have any notion you are struggling? You have to be reasonable too, blaming the bank without engaging with them is not reasonable. I think your concern is to keep your saving habit? You view that €300 as being cash not available to the bank and you are afraid they will insist it means you don't qualify for interest only.

As for people trapped in properties too small, there are far too many - I have friends with growing families stuck in 2-bed apartments. People with paper thin walls, I have heard of more than one person upset by this. In the middle of nowhere? Try living in one of the few houses/apartments occupied in a ghost estate - I've met more than one person in that (frankly creepy) situation. Paid twice what it is worth now? Try most people that bought in the last ten years. Asked for and received a mortgage at the limits, or beyond, of their affordability? ... Do you really think you are that unique? Bigbird, you are far from alone.


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## Bigbird (8 Oct 2013)

I certainly don't think I'm unique! But I have to get on with my life and due to lack of work unfortunately we have to emigrate.  Of course my OH contributes (understatement of the year) to the household!! Without his support (in more than one ways) I don't know where i'd be - he's amazing. But we're living in a location (like so many) we have no interest in and it's too remote. 
Leaving the country is our only option.  I plan to rent out the house but the rent collected will not meet the mortgage repayment. We're not sure what life will hold on the other side as we have no jobs lined up as yet.

Yeah I see very little point in living a life whereby you're working to exist.  What's the point?


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## Bronte (9 Oct 2013)

Bigbird said:


> Of course my OH contributes (understatement of the year) to the household!! Without his support (in more than one ways) I don't know where i'd be -


 
Well that's a bit of a change. So how about giving us some details. How much would your house rent for? How much is your OH paying you in rent. Paying half the household bills, well everybody has to do that, and where one partner has zero income, there should be no question but that they should pay 100% of those. How much would it cost him to rent nearer his workplace. 

I'm not entirely sure what it is you are planning on doing. Are you definitely emigrating or thinking about it. I understand you're saving the 300 € for that, I personally see nothing wrong with that. You're worried the bank will want it. Yes they will. Naturally if all your income is taken up on bills and life, as long as it's not riduculous than you'll be ok. Have a look at the recommended amounts by the Insolvency Board. If you come straight out and say to the bank you have an extra 300€ a month you are goosed.

I don't understand how you are going to emigrate and rent the house out, particulary if the rent will not cover the mortgage.  Can you clarify that.  Are you trying to hold onto the house in case things don't work out.  

It's exceedingly difficult to understand the financials without any figures.  It may be the case that you should just give up the house, even without emigrating.  If you've no job, well you're in the perfect situation to default.


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## Deas (9 Oct 2013)

Is the title of this thread correct - I cannot see where the banks are not co-operating.  It appears from what you have stated that you have not yet responded to the bank?


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