# Next door neighbours from HELL



## mrso'brien (23 Mar 2011)

Myself and my husband are in a severe dilemma...

We bought a house (a semi-d) in November of last year (4 months ago). We renovated the house, i.e. painted and carpeted it, and throughout the renovations there was ferrocious drumming noise coming from the house attached on to us. We thought, 'ah not to worry, it will stop when we move in and they are only doing it while there is nobody in the house'.

How wrong we were....

we tried to be neighbourly to them when we moved in and WE called to them with a bottle of wine for Xmas and a box of chocolates. We were not invited in to their house, nor did we so much as get an Xmas card back in return.

There has been ongoing drumming since we moved in. We have been in to them pleading with them (in the nicest possible way) to stop drumming when we are there or at least get dampners for their kits (it turns out there are 2 drum kits in the house).

They own their house and there is 3 of them living there -father, 20 year old son and mother. It's the son and the father who are the drummers.

The drumming can start at any time of the day. It is never at night after the first time we called in to them. It was at night when we first moved in. 

The thing is, we have a baby, and it's at the point now that I cannot put her into her cot in her bedroom for a nap during the day. Because if the drumming starts it will wake her, or if it's going on at naptime she cannot sleep. So now, she sleeps in her buggy or in a travel cot in the sitting room for her daytime naps. It's terrible coz we cannot kick back and watch a bit of telly or anything then.

We work Mon-Fri 9am to 5pm and have told them to drum all they like when we are not there. The father's answer to that was 'I will drum as loud as I like, as long as I want and as late as I like'. It's a disaster.

The first 9 times we called in to them we stood at their door and spent at least 1/2 hour each time explaining to them how we need the baby to sleep, how our light fittings vibrate, how our house alarm is being set off during the day by the drumming, how it's affecting our lives. Still they don't care.

The father has stood on the driveway and screamed and roared at us. We would never stoop to that level in return and have always remained polite and calm.

However, the last time we were in to them..my baby was sick and I was off work to mind her (creche wouldn't take her and she was too sick to go to the creche anyway). Next thing...bang, bang, bang. So I went next door and rang their bell for 20 mins..no answer. So I dropped a note in the door. Still...bang, bang, bang for a further hour. The poor baby was so distressed, exhausted and sick...I was so upset. She needed to nap and couldn't with the noise.

I have bought noise level meters and record the noise, which can be 1.5 - 2 times the ambient level downstairs and 3-4 times the ambient dBA level upstairs. Doesn't help that they often drum with the windows open so it vibrates all over the place. Bad enough that they do it with the windows closed.

They are not polite at all, have slammed doors in our faces and roared and screamed all sorts at us. 

The last time we went to them was the night time of the day I put the note in the door asking them to please be quiet as the baby was sick. For a finish, after 45 minutes of pleading with them, I said 'this is pointless talking to you, it's like talking to a brick wall' and I asked the mother 'As a mother, can you not understand that the bady can't sleep with the noise'. 

We have invited them in 4 times to hear the noise (i.e., the son could play and them sit in our sitting room and hear the racket). No joy, they won't come in.

Anyway, since the last time, they have started throwing rubbish into our back garden. It started pretty much immediately after the last conversation with them 4 weeks ago. It's all compost rubbish and will attract rats. There are cats constantly in our garden now...tonnes of them all the time with the rubbish. It could be leftovers from their breakfast that's just tipped over the wall, ashes from their fireplace, old fungus covered bread, carrots, potato peels, carrots, gone off veg etc.

The garden and the roof of our shed would literally be littered with the rubbish. Sometimes we clean it up in the morning, go away and come home to find they've done it again.

we are at our wits end. The mother has started parking her car up on the kerb between the 2 houses to try make us not have enough room to open our car doors fully.

We've been to the Gardai and logged a complaint with them. They've said they will call to them. We've said don't. We are afraid that they will come back on us twice as bad. My husband's friend is a Garda and he said to us that if we call the Gardai out to them next time they are drumming, that 9 out of 10 times, people like that only come back worse.

They are very rough people. Anyone I have asked who knows them or knows of them say 'Oh God help you living next door to them'.

We don't know what to do. If we go down a legal route and get legal proceedings, it'll be attached to the house for good and if we went to sell, we'd have to declare.

We're thinking of just pulling out, cutting our losses and selling up.

We asked the auctioneer before we bought the house but he didn't know anything about drumming and the previous owners lived way up the country and had the house rented out. Their tenants, co-incidentally for the last 4 years also had a drum kit so it was nice and handy for the neighbours!

What would you do in our situation? I don't want to bring my baby up in an environment like that.


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## Guest105 (23 Mar 2011)

I feel so very sorry for you, are these people tenants? if they are make every effort to contact the landlord and if they have been placed there by the council get on to their housing department.  This is a horrendous situation and swift action is needed before you get a breakdown. How dare this scum treat you and your baby in this fashion. It makes me sick.


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## mrso'brien (23 Mar 2011)

Thanks Cashier. Unfortunately they own the house.


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## hollacia (23 Mar 2011)

What an awful situation to be and I think the only thing you can do is take this further i.e. legal. See the Citizensinformation.ie for procedures on complaining about noise levels.

I'd also advise documenting everything - keep a diary of the noise, the levels and your attempts at reasoning with these 'people'.


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## Guest105 (23 Mar 2011)

You are going to have to do something, from reading your post you have done everything possible to get these people to stop.  You will have to take the legal route, have a read through this: http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/environment/environmental_protection/noise_regulations.html

The guards should also be contacted and they will have to act on this complaint, I think they will have to act with due care on this one seeing you have responsibility for a small child.  No one should be expected to put up with the racket you are subjected to on a daily basis.


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## truthseeker (23 Mar 2011)

Much as I would feel (and on your behalf do feel) very self righteous about this, how dare they etc.... (and make no mistake, they are scum to behave like this), and I can think of plenty of advice regarding taking them to court about noise levels, putting a camera up to catch them throwing rubbish over etc.....There is also a side of me that thinks - you could spend years and years of your life frustrated and upset and stressed about this, and their antics could get worse, and because they own the house you end up fighting it legally for your own peace but the price of all this is your own sanity and stress levels.

I really think that if I was in your situation, given that you have tried to be nice about it and to no avail, Id consider moving.

What price is there on a peaceful life not living next to scumbags?


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## mrso'brien (23 Mar 2011)

Thank you for your replies.

However, where we are caught is that if we take legal action and then in the future go to sell our house, we must declare that we took legal action and say why.

Our solicitor has told us today that if we do that, we are likely to lose some value in our house and it will be very hard to sell with a disclosure like that.

That's why we are just thinking of pulling out now and selling now. 

I don't know. I am very confused and upset.


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## mrso'brien (23 Mar 2011)

truthseeker said:


> What price is there on a peaceful life not living next to scumbags?


 

Truthseeker, yes I agree with you. Just that we have put every single penney we own into this own. if we sell now, we will not afford to buy a house again for at least 10 years.

I guess I just need someone to tell me the right thing to do in this situation. We just are at a loss as to what to do. I wish I could predict the future and know that whatever decision we make is the right one.


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## z107 (23 Mar 2011)

> We're thinking of just pulling out, cutting our losses and selling up.
> ...
> What would you do in our situation? I don't want to bring my baby up in an environment like that.



I would sell ASAP.


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## mrso'brien (23 Mar 2011)

Thanks for your advice umop3p!3dn


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## shesells (23 Mar 2011)

There is specific legislation in relation to drumkits as far as I know. A friend was going to buy one for her son to use in the garage as his Christmas present but there was a list of soundproofing that was compulsory, so in the end she got him an electronic one and headphones. Try the environment department of your local council, they should be able to advise on this and also how to obtain a noise abatement order against your neighbours. There is also an environmental health issue re the littering, again the council is your best chance here.


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## Guest105 (23 Mar 2011)

Will your house sell easily seeing the housing market is very stagnant, how will you explain the noise when the viewers come to see the house.

No easy answers here, you read about these sort of neighbours and watch the tv programmes but I imagine that to actually experience this sort of antisocial behaviour is uncomprehendable for a lot of people.


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## truthseeker (23 Mar 2011)

mrso'brien said:


> Truthseeker, yes I agree with you. Just that we have put every single penney we own into this own. if we sell now, we will not afford to buy a house again for at least 10 years.


 
How much have you put into the house - in terms of renovation?

Would you be able to sell it for roughly what you paid for it?

Would you be able to sell it for more than you paid for it given you have painted and recarpeted it?

Could you break at all even on the situation? I dont see how you have lost 10 years here unless youve put many thousands into carpeting and repainting and the property has lost value since you bought it (which is a possibility but surely not years of value?).


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## mrso'brien (23 Mar 2011)

truthseeker said:


> I dont see how you have lost 10 years here unless youve put many thousands into carpeting and repainting and the property has lost value since you bought it (which is a possibility but surely not years of value?).


 
Unfortunately, we lost big on our last house - sold it at a loss and put 40k into it. We took out a personal loan for this. We had to move house due to my job and thought moving nearer would give us a better quality of life. So we decided to sell for 40k less than the mortgage and got a 40k personal loan.

Then we put 20k into the new house, did it up fabulously. Best of carpets, solid wooden floors, new bathrooms and a new kitchen, painting etc, new radiators.

And the market has bottomed out even further since we bought. I see a house the same as ours at the bottom of the road for sale with an asking price of 10k less than we paid.

We are not on big salaries. We saved for about 7 years for that 20k and the stamp duty money as we knew we would move sometime in the future. And now with the baby and creche fees, we are unable to save anything at the moment. My husband did the maths and said he thinks it'll be 10 years before we'd be able to scrape a deposit together.


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## mrso'brien (23 Mar 2011)

Shesells, no unfortunately no legislation for drumkits. There are the noise regs EPA Act 1992. But that's it. 

We have tried the council and the HSE Env. Health but because this is only affecting us (as in 1 family and not multiple families) they won't act. Can you believe it?!! I even rang the Head Office of the HSE in Naas as I was sure the girl in the Local Office was wrong, but they told me the same thing.

The law is a joke. And even if we wanted to CCTV them throwing the rubbish, we are not allowed, under the Data Protection Act, to film outside our boundary wall. So how to we have proof it's them??!


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## liaconn (23 Mar 2011)

I would sell and get away from them. As Truthseeker said, life is just too short. Do you really want it ruined by scumbags like that?
I know it's a huge hassle and expense to move but I think it would be worth it in this situation. If you bought the house last November it won't have gone down in value too much. 

I know it's awful that people like that can effectively force people out of their home, it really is.

Sorry, just seen your previous post where you explain your financial situation. Ignore the above.


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## bluemac (23 Mar 2011)

We had a similar bad neighbour and it just got worse and worse.

we rented out the house 5 years ago, find a tennat with a loud mean dog for starters and go from there..  we have not been back and I still think it will be the same if I did.

IF you cannot sell rent it out you have to move one way or an other you have no other option.

if you decide you cannot move very thick 112mm insulated plaster board on the joing walls including in the loft.  maybe even some proper sound damp stuff..  it will help a bit.

no point fighting them it will only get worse it always does.

just be really nice to them all the time smile and say hello it will drive them mad.. or some times people start to think a bit more..


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## truthseeker (23 Mar 2011)

wow mrsob - my heart really goes out to you.

Re the financial situation - you would have sold the last place for the 40k less no matter what new house you bought - so thats that and unrelated to the new house.

All you have lost in real terms is what it has gone down in value by and what you have spent on it.

If its gone down in value since you bought - so have other places that you would buy now - so there is no real loss here either.

So youre only going to be out the money you spent on renovation work - and that might not be a dead loss either because you will probably be able to use it as leverage for a better price.

I still think sell up.


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## mrso'brien (23 Mar 2011)

Thanks everyone.

We wouldn't consider renting out the house as these people have a vendetta against us now and would pleasure themselves in knowing that they could drive our tenants out on us. 

As the Garda said to us, they are targeting us. they are out to get us due to our complaints to them re: noise. and I am pretty sure that it would be their pleasure to drive us nuts even further by driving tenants out of our house on us.

It sickens me that we saved so hard, put 20k and 10k stamp duty into the house, plus solicitors fees, removal fees etc. on top of that. That was hard earned money and took a lot for us to save it.

And now with the baby and drop in salaries etc. we haven't got a penney. If we sell, which we will prob have to do, we will lose out and defo not be able to buy again for years and years. 

I thought my rental days were over but it looks like we will be back renting again, always with the fear of 'will the landlord sell the house, will we have to move each year etc.?' We are so sad. It's unreal the way scumbags can interfere in your life, isn't it?


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## tinkerbell (23 Mar 2011)

My heart goes out to you Mrs OBrien.   I know sadly what you are going through.   The night we moved into our semi 20 years ago we heard the sound of drums next door.  I had 4 kids aged from 0 to 9 years old. My husband worked nights.  Our neighbour said her kids could be "doing worse than making music" from dawn to middnight. And that was their attitude for ten years until her kids finally grew up and moved away.   Hell on earth I know and migraines to endure with no place to lie down where you wouldnt feel the vibrations and hear the racket.   Gardai could do nothing.   We had eggs thrown at our windows and all the bratish behaviour you could expect from selfish people.    If it were today I would def bring them to court.  I wouldnt endure it for the sake of so called good relationships with neighbours.  I wouldnt sell up either - you have done nothing wrong they have!   Gas thing is around here we are labelled the cranks and have done nothing wrong except appeal for quiet for our kids to sleep.   The same woman wont speak to us now but good riddance I say!   Horrible how neighbours selfishness can cause such upset.  I really hope you dont have to wait as long as I did for peace in your own home


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## NickyK (23 Mar 2011)

Approach your local Sinn Fein candidate and ask him kindly to call into your neighbour to resolve the sitaution.


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## Hillsalt (23 Mar 2011)

I have no advice to give you but I feel sorry for you and your family. 

Is your house second hand or new? If previously owned, why  did the previous owners' move out? Is there an obligation on the seller to inform you that they moved out because of the noisy neighbours?

How do you know for 100% certainty that they are not renting? 

As a matter of record, why don't you video tape some evidence from various rooms in your house? It might come in handy at a later stage. If your baby is distressed, then you owe it to him/her to pursue all avenues. 

Good luck with it.


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## mrso'brien (23 Mar 2011)

Thank you all for your comments.

Some answers to your questions...I 100% know they are the owners as a friend of mine has lived in the estate for 18 years and knows them. Also Gardai were able to see from their computer system that they own the house.

secondly, we don't want to go to court because if we have to sell up, we have to disclose legal proceedings and the nature of them to new buyers. This will mean we will have problems selling and also decrease the value of our home.

Also, the previous owners had the place rented out. The tenants who were here for the previous 4 1/2 years had a drumkit ( we saw it when we viewed the house), so obviously there was no nuisance to them!


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## Mucker Man (23 Mar 2011)

+1 to Nicky K's advice

Ask you local Sinn Fein councillor or GE candidate to have a word with them.


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## mercman (23 Mar 2011)

Mucker Man said:


> Ask you local Sinn Fein councillor to have a word with them.



Does the OP really hate them that much ?


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## Ann1 (23 Mar 2011)

The noise must be also annoying other neighbours........People are entitled to peace and quiet in a residential area. I found this on citizens information.
'The maximum fine for conviction on breach of noise regulations is €3,000 or 12 months in prison or both.'


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## Bronte (24 Mar 2011)

This is a terribly sad story.  And terribly sad that the only advice that can be offered is not to stand up to the bullies.  

There must be a way of standing up to bullies surely.  I would not accept anything I heard from officialdoom unless it's in writing.  Such as the remark that if the behaviour only affects one person that they cannot do anything.  

In relation to you selling, what rule about disclosing the noise are you referring to ?  It's caveat emptor so you don't have to tell any potential purchasers why you are selling.


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## truthseeker (24 Mar 2011)

I found this on citizens information.

Some interesting sections:


> *What is anti-social behaviour?*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 


> *Who issues a behaviour warning?*
> 
> A Garda may issue a behaviour warning to you if you are behaving in an anti-social manner. The Garda does not necessarily need to observe or witness the behaviour and can act on a complaint from any member of the public. A behaviour warning cannot be issued more than one month after the behaviour took place, or in the case of persistent behaviour, more than one month after the most recent occurrence of the behaviour.
> The Garda can issue a behaviour warning verbally or in writing. If it is given verbally the Garda must record it in writing as soon as reasonably possible and then serve it on you personally or by post.
> The Garda may require you to give your name and address for the purpose of the behaviour warning or for the written record of the warning.


 


> *When can the gardaí apply for a civil order?*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
So it looks like you could go down the anti social behaviour route and that way if they up the ante (like for example throwing the rubbish over into your garden), then you go back to the guards looking for another behaviour warning - 3 of those in 6 months and there is a possibility of an ASBO.

The above seems to imply that you yourself are not opening legal proceedings - the guards are the ones who are issuing the behaviour warnings etc on the basis of your complaints.

Do you think these people will continue to up the ante if they are getting repeated visits from the guards for anti social behaviour?


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## alaskaonline (24 Mar 2011)

OP - my heart goes out to you. Although I am not faced with drum noises (thank god!) my neighbor would still call their ignorance a bliss. There are so many ways to terrorize your neighbors and it makes my blood boil. They don't need a reason so don't think they do it simply because you complained. 

Anyway I agree with previous poster by saying I wouldn't sell up (yet). You can install CCTV on your property facing the fence. I am sure there is a way around that legislation in terms of using it for safety reasons and not stalking reasons. Also you don't need to set it as high in terms of you don't need faces on the camera. It's enough (I'd say but correct me if I am wrong) to see someone from your neighbor's garden throwing stuff over into yours. (the thought of it alone makes me mad )

Also, how much worse could it get? They already overstepped the mark by throwing their nasty liter into your garden, by screaming/ insulting you in public, parking their car so close to yours that it's impossible to open your car door etc.

Also check this out Anti-Social-Behavior (playing loud music is mentioned there too) - it might give you some confidence. If not, you can always do the runner cause as you said before, you're at a loss already.


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## mrso'brien (24 Mar 2011)

truthseeker said:


> The above seems to imply that you yourself are not opening legal proceedings - the guards are the ones who are issuing the behaviour warnings etc on the basis of your complaints.
> 
> Do you think these people will continue to up the ante if they are getting repeated visits from the guards for anti social behaviour?


 
I also rang Citizens Information. They were very nice and helpful and told me to contact the HSE re: Environmental problems with noise and rubbish. But the HSE gave me the advice re: it only affecting 1 family! Ludicrous! I didn't believe the girl in the local office and so I rang their head office in Naas only to be told the same thing.

I agree Truthseeker that it does imply that it'd be the Gardai who'd be opening legal proceedings. if that was the case, then that would be great...if it wouldn't affect future sales with disclosure of the proceedings. My husband is going to ask our solicitor this morning about this to be sure.

The community Garda rang me last night...such a lovely man. Really sympathatic ear and gave me lots of advice including going down the ASBO route. He gave me his direct phone number and told me to call him whenever and he would be happy to intervene.

There was no noise yesterday evening, but we were on edge waiting for it. The Garda said that nobody should have to put up with such a level of noise at any time, whether it's 3pm or 3am!

If we could be 100% sure that going down teh Garda route will not come back to haunt us if we go to sell and that it will not draw the purpetrators on us further, then that's the route we would like to take.

I hate all this. Dreadful being involved in such confrontation. We have always got on so well with our neighbours everywhere myself and my husband have ever lived.

In relation to selling up, the auctioneer said he would be confident he could sell our house, it's in a fantastic location and it's really nicely done up (well, we think so!).

Thanks everyone for your advice.


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## mrso'brien (24 Mar 2011)

alaskaonline said:


> You can install CCTV on your property facing the fence.


 
Thanks for your advice.
I've phoned the Local Authority and they told me I need to send in a photo of my house and they will comment as to whether I need planning permission to install the CCTV cameras.

I've ordered a CCTV system and am collecting it today. Boils my blood with the amount of money that we don't have to spare that we have had to spend on sound level meters and CCTV system.

Our house will look like Fort Knox but I don't care. Just have to wait on the Planning Authority to get back to me then.

Hopefully by putting up CCTV it would show that the rubbish is being thrown from them. In saying that, there has been no rubbish since the weekend. I have my clothes out on the clothesline today with the fabulous weather and I am just praying they will not be littered with rubbish when I get in from work.


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## truthseeker (24 Mar 2011)

mrso'brien said:


> The community Garda rang me last night...such a lovely man. Really sympathatic ear and gave me lots of advice including going down the ASBO route. He gave me his direct phone number and told me to call him whenever and he would be happy to intervene.


 
Follow this up and call him anytime there is noise or other anti social behaviour that interferes with your enjoyment of your property.



mrso'brien said:


> If we could be 100% sure that going down teh Garda route will not come back to haunt us if we go to sell and that it will not draw the purpetrators on us further, then that's the route we would like to take.


 
I can see how it would come back to haunt you - its not like anything legal would be attached to your property - like a lien or anything like that? Just as an abstract example, if your home was broken into and you personally caught the burglars in the act in your home and called the guards, and then 6 months later sold the house - there would be nothing to say you had to disclose the robbery and subsequent catching of the criminals on the property?


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## mrso'brien (24 Mar 2011)

truthseeker said:


> Just as an abstract example, if your home was broken into and you personally caught the burglars in the act in your home and called the guards, and then 6 months later sold the house - there would be nothing to say you had to disclose the robbery and subsequent catching of the criminals on the property?


 
Good point Truthseeker. I'll have to get onto our solicitor to verify this for us. As my husband said last night, 'if we are going to sell, then we may as well at least try the Garda route first.'

Thanks a million to everyone for all of your advice.


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## Bronte (24 Mar 2011)

mrso'brien said:


> I also rang Citizens Information. They were very nice and helpful and told me to contact the HSE re: Environmental problems with noise and rubbish. But the HSE gave me the advice re: it only affecting 1 family! Ludicrous! I didn't believe the girl in the local office and so I rang their head office in Naas only to be told the same thing.
> 
> .


 
I wouldn't accept this.  Get it in writing by writing to the Naas office.  My parent had to get the environmental officers out in relation to car wrecks but it took a lot of effort to get them going.  They try to fob you off.  

When you write to them (by registered post) it forces them to act.  It's easy to brush off people with the girl in the office telling you they can do nothing.


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## amh (24 Mar 2011)

This type of disgusting behavior has become more common place. It appears to reflecta lack of appreciation of other peoples right to live in peace. These morons shouldn't be allowed to get away with tormenting the ordinary decent people who work hard to provide a decent lifestyle for their families. There is a portion of the population who have an attitude similar to that of dare I say it, a pig. Possibly that would be an insult to a pig.

Again this is a typical example of how society is set up to protect the wasters and those who enjoy nothing better that destroying the quality of life for anyone else around them. This situation should be easily resolved but it's not. I feel really sorry for the OP and after reading your posts my blood boils. I hope you get some resloution to it, if it were me I'd probably pack up and sell. Over your life time the loss of 40K will work out at a small amount and you cant buy peace, happiness and time so that's what I'd do.

Best of luck and keep us all up to date.


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## mrso'brien (24 Mar 2011)

Bronte, amh and everyone else..thanks for your support and comments.

Yes it is a dreadful situation to be in and as amh said, it should be easily resolved but unfortunately it's not.

As my husband said, if we were as rough as they are, we would give it back to them twice as bad. But we are not and we would never ever do anything to them in retaliation or to draw them on us. 

We haven't even raised our voices to them. I am very conscious of not doing anything that could come back to haunt us.

We just want to be left in peace to raise our child and to have a happy marriage without this stress. There are enough problems in the world and we are lucky enough to both still have jobs and to have our health. We don't need this trouble in our lives and while we are all fit and healthy we should be able to enjoy life in our home and as a family.

Thanks again


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## looking2011 (24 Mar 2011)

I had this problem when I was renting years ago, I kept calling the landlord and Gardai after months of pleading with the next door neighbours because their teenage kids kept playing techo music at top volume at night. Their parents worked nights so didn't care about the level of noise.
I was about to move out when my brother offered one last attempt at solving the issue.
He moved in (he was student at the time!) and I moved out for a few weeks and he played Pavarotti and other operatic music really loudly...I'm talking sub-woofers all over the place and all the loudest equipment he could borrow.
Did this in shifts with his friends, days and nights.....non stop.
Thankfully I wasn't there....dson't think i would have done that. Few large burly students were off-putting and there were no complaints.
Their all night techno music playing stopped 2 weeks into the non-stop opera-fest in my house.
Not saying its the right moral way to go but worked for me !!!


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## amh (24 Mar 2011)

I did something similar re alarm clock. Neighbour was setting their clock for 5.30 and not getting up til after 8 every morning. I set my alarm and went off for the weekend , hasn't happened since. Again this might not be something you would feel comfortable to do something similar


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## truthseeker (24 Mar 2011)

While I appreciate the sentiment of the previous couple of posters, if I were the OP I would not get into a retaliation situation - its not worth it if these people decide to come back harder again.


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## Firefly (24 Mar 2011)

Hi Mrs O'B.

Sorry to hear about your situation. 

I would record a log of when the drumming starts / stops over the next 3 weeks and get recordings if possible. 

I would then:

Report the matter to the Gardai along with your log and recordings. Make sure if you can to get written confirmation from the Gardai that this matter has been  reported

Contact your solicitor and get them to write a letter outlining the next legal steps you will be pursuing along with a copy of the report submitted to the Gardai. 

After that I would proceed with the matter legally...the pen is mightier than the sword. 

HTH.

F


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## Leper (26 Mar 2011)

I know this wont be much of a help, but you are bringing back memories of a flat where I stayed years ago.  There was a German girl in the flat next door and every morning 6.00 am she would put on a long playing record of Makem and Clancy and would turn it up as loud as possible.  She would leave for work around 7.15am and the record would play and play all day (you could set old record players for continuous playing).  The walls of the flats were very thin. 

I pleaded and pleaded with my neighbour to show some neighbourliness.  So did other people living in the building. All to no avail.

My job at the time had Midnight, 5.00am, 6.00am, 9.00am, 2.00pm, 6.00pm starts depending on my duties in the Post Office. These times obtained at weekends also. (I think you see where I am going!).

I got out my only Rory Gallagher LP (complete with scratches etc) and whenever I left for work I had Rory Gallagher playing "Messin' with the Kid" playing continouusly back in the flat.  In effect I terrorised the terrorist.  She pleaded and pleaded with me to stop.  Her love-in weekends at her apartment had become impossible with Gallagher stratocasting away next door and of course Messin' with the Kid . . . 

I think you will have to do something similar.  Find out what music your neighbours hate and treat them to hours and hours of it.


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## stephen1381 (26 Mar 2011)

Sorry to hear about your nightmare.

As you seem to be stuck there, sound proofing seems to be the only way to go.

If you do get the Guards out, ask them to get your neighbours out to discuss the problem and have the Guards act as mediators. But really it seems like soundproofing is your only solution.

Hope it works out for you. All the best.


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## JP1234 (26 Mar 2011)

+1 to what Leper recommends as it seems you have gone down the polite route.

We used to live in a house sub-let into flats and the people who lived above us only seemed to have one record, "Fairytale of New York", which they would play continuously at all hours.  Our way to get back was to put The Pixies Debaser on continuous play on a Sunday then go out for a few hours. We would put the speakers on top of the wardrobe facing up just to be sure. They soon got the message!.


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## AgathaC (27 Mar 2011)

OP I have no advice but just want to say that I hope things improve and that the gardai will help. I (thought I) had noisy neighbours from time to time in the past but after reading your thread I realise that you really have the neighbours from Hell. Best of luck and I hope that things improve greatly.


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## Pope John 11 (27 Mar 2011)

Put an ad on daft:
"Music recording studio house to let to bands for 8hr sessions, 3 per day, all bands welcome"

They may come back to you in 2 weeks suffering from lack of sleep. 

Alternatively take a holiday or rent elsewhere for 2 weeks and hire the loudest speakers you can find & do exactly what a previous poster did.


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## Purple (27 Mar 2011)

JP1234 said:


> +1 to what Leper recommends as it seems you have gone down the polite route.
> 
> We used to live in a house sub-let into flats and the people who lived above us only seemed to have one record, "Fairytale of New York", which they would play continuously at all hours.  Our way to get back was to put The Pixies Debaser on continuous play on a Sunday then go out for a few hours. We would put the speakers on top of the wardrobe facing up just to be sure. They soon got the message!.



I did that to my neighbours in my first place... but I went away overnight. I knew the people above were away as well (we got to know each other because of the noise from my neighbours).


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## Purple (27 Mar 2011)

I looked at this thread because of a 21st two roads over that kept the whole area awake 'till 3.03 this morning. In the end the police had to call twice to get them to shut up. I walked over at 3.15 to get the numbet of the house.
I'll be over knocking on their door at 6.30 next Saturday and Sunday morning; if they want to dictate what time I go to sleep at then I'll dictate what time they wake up at.


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## micmclo (27 Mar 2011)

amh said:


> I did something similar re alarm clock. Neighbour was setting their clock for 5.30 and not getting up til after 8 every morning. I set my alarm and went off for the weekend , hasn't happened since. Again this might not be something you would feel comfortable to do something similar



It's not realy similar at all to the OP's case.

Nobody sets off an alarm at 5:30 just to annoy the neighbours. Maybe they were getting up to do study for professional exams for a few hours before work. I used to get at 5am to do this for a few months. Or lifting weights and exercising in their place.

The fact that you can hear your neighbours alarm clock says a lot about shoddy building quality in Ireland.


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## Ancutza (27 Mar 2011)

I once rented a flat in a small town in Meath.  Like you this kind of crap was going on day and night from the sister and brother who rented next door to us.  I was sharing with my soon-to-be bro' in law at the time.  We spent a hundred pounds on a CD player with 'Repeat', bought a Guns 'n' Roses CD, turned it up, pressed play and moved out for a long weekend.  They 'understood' and in fact moved-out themselves a couple of months later.

You probably will have to fight fire with fire in this instance however unpalatable that might be to you.


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## zztop (28 Mar 2011)

You have recourse to the District Court for noise pollution.I would advise
you to get a solicitor and bring a case immeadiately.As nothing is working
for you its now your only choice.The threat of costs being awarded against
them might even solve it.An acoustics engineer can cost up to €1500 but
I doubt you would need one with your evidence.


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## Bronte (28 Mar 2011)

This thread is fantastic, never realised people had such clever ideas to deal with noisy neighbours.


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## Chris (28 Mar 2011)

I think that Firefly's advice is probably the best way to approach it, where you first ask a guard to "mediate" and then get a solicitor involved. Fighting fire with fire may go against you if you proceed down the legal route.

Alternatively, should you choose to fight fire with fire, I had a problem with a neighbor about 10 years ago where there were parties going on until 5 in the morning pretty much 5 days a week. It took a bit of experimenting with different styles of music, but the one that did it for me was a CD I got in a second hand shop with really bad and screechy alternative Jazz. I picked the shortest song on the album and played it on repeat from 7am until I got home from work. Parties stopped very soon after.


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## foxylady (28 Mar 2011)

Hillsalt said:


> I have no advice to give you but I feel sorry for you and your family.
> 
> Is your house second hand or new? If previously owned, why did the previous owners' move out? Is there an obligation on the seller to inform you that they moved out because of the noisy neighbours?
> 
> ...


 
If people selling their house were honest about the neighbours, lots of peoples houses wouldnt sell.


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## Wishes (28 Mar 2011)

Hi OP, having read your posts my heart goes out to you and your husband.  I just wanted to say that I agree with the posters who say sell up.

I don't have noisy neighbors but I do have neighbors that do exactly as they please and have trespassed on my property more than once.  I have contacted the Gardai and made complaints but got nowhere.  The system seems to work more in the favor of these people than it does for somebody who wants to keep to themselves.  If I had the chance again I wouldn't think twice of moving but that is not an option for me now.


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## Firefly (29 Mar 2011)

Why don't we come up with a "various hits" compiliation!! I'll add "Top of the Morning to Ya" from the House of Pain. Played at 5.30am should do the trick nicely


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## horusd (29 Mar 2011)

I'm very lucky with de neighbours, one's never there and the other is quiet as a church mouse, except for highheels on a wooden floor! I tend to play some music loud enough when I'm in the garden potterin or washing the car.  But not at 5am I hasten to add.  Just glad I don't have firefly, Ancutza or some of the other posters exacting revenge on me .


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## shnaek (29 Mar 2011)

To paraphrase Sean Connery in 'The Untouchables' - if you go down the route of taking them on, how far are you willing to go? Because you need to be willing to go all the way. 

You have my sympathies - sounds like you are in a bad situation. I really hope it all works out for you, however you chose to handle it.


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## asdfg (29 Mar 2011)

i may be wrong here but you dont have to disclose legal issues if your moving or selling in ireland ,but if as i suspect your english ,? then in england you do.


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## johnd (29 Mar 2011)

foxylady said:


> If people selling their house were honest about the neighbours, lots of peoples houses wouldnt sell.



In the UK a seller has to disclose any problems they have with bad neighbours/area or any problems with the house itself. The purchaser can get their money back if these facts are not disclosed.

 Best bet is the District Court with dates, times etc. Plead with the Judge with baby in arms - and ask for a court order forcing them to stop the drumming or reduce the noise level. I know someone who did this and it worked!


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## Leper (29 Mar 2011)

Let's have a look at some of the solutions provided:-
(a) Negotiate with the noise neighbours, pointout the errors of their ways.
     Useless, they dont want to even know.

(b) As the Gardaí to be intermediaries.
     They have more pressing problems on an hourly basis.

(c) Sell the house.
     Possibly already in negative equity and probably not a runner.

(d) Fight fire with fire, but by using your head.
     Be unhelpful, disregarding, show contempt, smile and be a villain,
     be unavailable, show no empathy, be condescending, dont show
     obvious disregard, use cold shoulder, dont loan him tools, dont
     accept his mail, never offer him or his family a lift etc

(e) Sooner or later "Junior" next door will be preparing and sitting exams.
     Then borrow a set of drums and bagpipes if possible.  Return the 
     noise, but with interest.

Then let your neighbour negotiate with you.


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## Birroc (29 Mar 2011)

Leper said:


> Let's have a look at some of the solutions provided:-
> 
> (b) Ask the Gardaí to be intermediaries.
> They have more pressing problems on an hourly basis.



Yes indeed they do have more pressing problems e.g. arresting corrupt politicians that ruined this country, senators who abused expenses, govt ministers who influenced multi-million euro mobile phone license deals for personal gain, county councilors that took bribes for zoning, bishops and priests that covered up shocking crimes against children, senior bank executives who paid themselves a fortune while at the same time ruining their own banks and the economy, unscrupulous developers who created ghost estates and left others unfinished, financial regulators that slept on the job etc etc.

Obviously they are flat out. Let me guess, a file is being sent to the DPP....


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## RoyRover (29 Mar 2011)

Worth investigating if the previous owners had a documented dispute with the neighbours that they omitted to declare at sale. You may have recourse against them.


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## Bubbly Scot (8 Apr 2011)

> =Leper;1153732
> (e) Sooner or later "Junior" next door will be preparing and sitting exams.
> Then borrow a set of drums and bagpipes if possible.  Return the
> noise, but with interest.




I play the bagpipes, I was pondering practicing outside today since the weather's so nice. Might rethink that as the neighbour may think it's payback for their dogs barking all night!


I had a neighbour from hell, he's driven four lots of tenants out of the house I used to rent. Thankfully we bought out in the country and got away from him. I don't have any advice but I do feel for the OP. The right to peaceful enjoyment of your home should be enforced on every level.

If you need me.......holler! I'd be happy to practice at your place..I'd even be sure and play very, very badly!


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## horusd (8 Apr 2011)

Bubbly Scot said:


> *I play the bagpipes,....*
> 
> 
> If you need me.......holler! I'd be happy to practice at your place..I'd even be sure and *play very, very badly*!


 
LOL that revenge would be very sweet. Is there any other way to play the bagpipes!!!...( only joking).


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## Leper (9 Apr 2011)

This might be a solution, but, don't quote me.  Years ago after leaving flatland I rented a house (a big step up at the time).  One of my housemates was an artic truck driver.  He worked all sorts of hours and came and went at unearthly hours.

During cold or wet spells he would start his truck just to warm it up while he was having his breakfast etc.  We didn't realise it but the loud purring sound from the truck engine tantalised our neighbours.  Of course, they complained and of course the artic driver copped on and all remained OK.

Therefore, the solution to unwanted neighbourly noise could be to get a sympathetic truck driver to park outside your door and leave the truck engine purring as often as possible.


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## extopia (12 Apr 2011)

*Some perspective needed*

This is a very sad thread.

Couple doesn't do research, ends up buying a semi-d with bad neighbours who like to make a lot of noise.

Description of conditions leads to immediate diagnosis of "scum".

Gardai approached, offer advice. Legal options touched on and abandoned. Everyone then seems to agree no real help will ensue...

Real issue here is an Irish desire, by both house builders and buyers, to privilege badly built and unsoundproofed buildings. We build them, you buy them. No meaningful building survey regulations to protect either you (the buyer) or your neighbours (who have to live with whatever nuisance you might decide to rain down on them) from vandalism of any kind.

Once we start talking about people being "scum", all cooperative options have been exhausted. The word was mentioned within a couple of replies to the OP. The OP immediately co-opted the terminology.

Buying a semi-D (or terraced house) should involve a huge amount of research. 

You bought a pig in a poke. Sell up if you bought into a "scum" (your word) neighbourhood and don't like it.

Tough love

E


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## Leper (12 Apr 2011)

You can do all the research in the world and you dont know who or what will live next door to you. Nobody ever asked for noise problems.  There is only so much research you can do and it is amazing how little information you can absorb from existing neighbours.  There is the "I'm living with it, why can't you" syndrome.

We are not entitled to much, but we are entitled to peace and quiet.


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## HMC (19 Apr 2011)

horusd said:


> LOL that revenge would be very sweet. Is there any other way to play the bagpipes!!!...( only joking).


 

What is the definition of a gentleman?
One who can play the bagpipes, but doesn't.


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## Bubbly Scot (19 Apr 2011)

HMC said:


> What is the definition of a gentleman?
> One who can play the bagpipes, but doesn't.



What is the definition of a lady?

One who can play the bagpipes and  smiles politely when people make the assumtion she's a man


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## HMC (19 Apr 2011)

Bubbly Scot said:


> What is the definition of a lady?
> 
> One who can play the bagpipes and smiles politely when people make the assumtion she's a man


 

Sorry hen, I never guessed !!


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## Bubbly Scot (19 Apr 2011)

HMC said:


> Sorry hen, I never guessed !!



No worries


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## Yachtie (5 May 2011)

I spoke to a local guard (kildare) who assured me that there is some sort of by-law re noise polution. This was in relation to my next door neighbour's child kicking the ball against our joint front wall for hours on a daily basis. Not as bad as drumming, but still 'accounted for' by the council. Luckily, my 25 second screaming like a deranged banshee at a child solved the problem for good.

Surely, all that drumming must be heard by the other people living on your street and even though it may not be as much nuisance to them as it is to you, it's still a nuisance. I would go to the local council and insist on speaking to somebody in person. 

Secondly, if you really like everything other than you next door neighbour and want to keep the house, invest in soundproofing.

Thirdly, wait for a few years and buy the noisiest trumpet for your child and quality ear plugs for yourself. Oh, and don't pay for any trumpet lessons.


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## zxcvbnm (6 May 2011)

extopia said:


> This is a very sad thread.
> 
> Couple doesn't do research, ends up buying a semi-d with bad neighbours who like to make a lot of noise.
> 
> ...


 
A truly bizarre response.

Your main beef seems to be that posters have referred to these neighbours as 'scum'.
Wise up buddy - there's a time to call a spade a spade. These neighbours are very much scum.

I'm not sure you'd have the same cold-hearted viewpoint if you were in the OPs shoes.


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