# litter fine for something you didnt do



## laobhise (4 Jul 2011)

My mother has just received a litter fine from Fingal County Council for  supposedly leaving 2 boxes on top of the bottle bank back in April- the fine arrived today. My mother has been using the bottle bank for years and always brings a bag. She is adamant that she didnt leave the boxes as she doesnt use them. What should she do? She is very stressed about the whole thing. €150 is a lot of money.


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## pudds (4 Jul 2011)

I would call into the council and explain the situation and see what their response is and if they insist she's responsible then ask to see any evidence they have to prove this.  Maybe local T.D. after that.


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## mradaly01 (4 Jul 2011)

First thing I would do is to ring them / call into the office .. Find  out what evidence have they of this? How did they get the details that  is was your mother.. They may not talk to you directly, only to your  mother.. if you get nothing back from that phone call, then email  (quicker than post) them (if you are posting a letter, keep a copy &  register it). They have to have some proof of that taking place... so  challenge it & don't admit to anything.. Is your mother even able to  put 2 boxes up on top of one of those bottle banks? Ones I use are  pretty high up... good luck with that, let us know how you get on.. last  thing - keep ALL details of discussions - dates / times / who you  talked to (full names) / details of what was discussed... just write  everything down... conversation details are forgotten about after a  short time...


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## laobhise (4 Jul 2011)

It said on the fine that cctv was in operation and a sign was in place but not that she was doing it on cctv. She insists that she couldnt have been as she never brings boxes. She even has her bottle bank bag!! Not sure about the height of them-my mam is 5 foot 5 inches. We spoke earlier about writing a letter and basically she was going to state that she never brings boxes and has been using the bottle bank for about 15-20 years. We were going to say that before even considering the fine that we want to see some proof. My mam is not the type of person to do anything unlawful and is very stressed out by the whole thing. I have a half day on Friday and could call into the council with her- do you think we should do that instead?? Or both??


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## horusd (5 Jul 2011)

How did they identify her? Know her name and address etc?


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## zztop (5 Jul 2011)

The firm monitoring the banks would have her reg number recorded
so they must have some evidence??? that the boxes were left.Just
ask the council to review the footage  & if they still insist it was her
ask to see the footage to satisfy yourself.It will cost the council
a lot of money to prosecute so they will want to make sure they have
a case.


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## mradaly01 (5 Jul 2011)

Laobhise - I would fight it... but before you call on Friday... give them a call first as you may need to talk to someone else in a different place / department ... & when you do call down, be prepared to put up a fight... don't take their word for it... as mentioned, ask to see the evidence... unless they have evidence of your mother putting the boxes on the bank as they state, they have no case... It may be get frustrating (talking to a brick wall) when you get there & try to talk to someone, but keep your cool... you may be there for a few hours... & ask to see supervisor / manager to discuss if not getting anywhere... again, ask for full names & write them down on a notebook in front of them, to show them that you are taking details... re-assure your mother that it is only a mistake & that it will be sorted out... Good luck with it...


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## dereko1969 (5 Jul 2011)

Make a request under the Data Protection Act to see the footage, Your mother will have to do this, this will cost you €6.50 (or so).


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## Sunny (6 Jul 2011)

I know someone that this happened to. They rang and said it wasn't them. The council said grand and apologised for the confusion.


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## dereko1969 (6 Jul 2011)

enoxy said:


> This happened to me with one of the dublin councils last year. I mistakenly left a box after me at a bottle bank and they had me banged to rights as it was on cctv.
> 
> I wrote a letter saying that I apologised for the mistake and that I couldn't afford to pay. They wrote back to me waiving the fine.
> 
> I'd be surprised if they have don't have footage of the OP's mother. Might be worth doing what I did and play the sympathy card.


 
Interesting set of priorities you've got there....wasn't a box of beer was it?

http://www.askaboutmoney.com/showpost.php?p=1174329&postcount=10


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## confusedude (6 Jul 2011)

enoxy said:


> I'd be surprised if they have don't have footage of the OP's mother. Might be worth doing what I did and play the sympathy card.


 
If she doesn't use boxes then it wasn't her. CCTV probably shows the boxes were left there around the time her car was there. They may be chancing their arm and sent this fine to a few people who had a car there at that time. The guilty party realises they've been caught and pays up. The innocent ones, including your mother, contest the fine and are let off. Council get paid, a few people get unfairly upset but no major damage done...


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## Jazz01 (6 Jul 2011)

Did she per-chance move the boxes out of the way to get access into the bottlebank? I understand that she only brings her bottles in a bag & didn't bring the box(es) with her... but at times, with all the "rubbish" left around the banks, she may have just inadvertently moved the boxes... but either way, fight it...


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## laobhise (6 Jul 2011)

Just a quick update- thanks for all the comments to date. My mother has drafted a letter and is going to hand it into the council tomorrow and then we are going to follow this up by calling in on Friday. She is adamant that she didnt leave any boxes. The only bottles that go to the bottle bank are household ones such as olive oil etc, wine bottles and vodka. It is just my mother and grandmother in the house and neither of them drinks any beer so no beer boxes. My mother drinks wine and my 94 year old grandmother just drinks her vodka every night 

She is happy to pay the fine if it was her-although it still does seem a bit unfair when people purposely dump rubbish and if someone left a box by mistake or moved it as one poster said (although as I said she doesnt believe she did). They sent the fine last Fri and supposed this happened in April so its not like you can even remember if something out of the ordinary happened!!


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## Jazz01 (15 Jul 2011)

Hi laobhise.. how did you get on with the council? Good result?


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## laobhise (15 Jul 2011)

Hi Jazz, 

Sorry meant to post last weekend but just been so busy. Went up to the council with my mam and they were extremely helpful. They let us look at the cctv footage and there was my mother leaving 2 boxes on top of the bottlebank!!!! 

So they gave us an extension until middle of August and my mam is going to pay the fine. She remembers now that she actually took someone elses bottles and that is why she had boxes. She didnt read the signs and just left the boxes on top. So think she has learnt her lesson-not to leave boxes and more importantly to read the signs!!! Thanks a million for all the advice


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## Jazz01 (15 Jul 2011)

another lesson - "leave others bring their own bottles to the bank"?- seems no good deed goes unpunished... thanks for the update... being a few months back it's difficult to remember what one did at a specific date in time... at least the mystery is solved now


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