# Opening small Coffee Shop



## CafeCulture

I have recently got a lease on a Coffee Shop within the public area of a professional office area. 

I expect to have between 100 and 150 transactions per day- i.e. customers- members of the public and staff etc

Any ideas re. what menu options i should consider?

Also a number of other full service Spar type shops etc are located nearby.

Any advice or ideas welcome...

Thanks


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## euroDilbert

I would suggest starting with a menu consisting of some standard items and some new things you like doing yourself or think your customers would like.
This is just stage one. The main trick is to find out from your initial customers what they would like your to do in the future, and then keep them coming back.


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## CCOVICH

Good coffee, friendly staff, get to know your regulars.

Offer a variety of breads-sliced pan, bagel, ciabatta, pannini etc.


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## CafeCulture

*Home made scones etc*

Thanks for those ideas. Appreciate that.

Any idea where i could learn to make home made scones etc?


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## ClubMan

You're not in the _Capel Street _area by any chance!?


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## woods

What about juices and smoothies. Both go down well these days.


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## brian.mobile

Coffee is black gold. Statoil (while the cofee isnt great) are minting it with their self service style sections. Close to two fifty and you pour your own.

Maybe look at this option? 

BM


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## CafeCulture

No not Capel Street. Wouldn't have the resources to go there yet- but are there any opportunities there?


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## ClubMan

Sorry - just that a coffee shop opened in our building and I just wondered if it was you. Looks like a very competitive business even if everybody is jacking up the prices lately!


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## CafeCulture

So anyone any ideas on home cooking? where do i get help - for scones etc?


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## ClubMan

Just curious - did you consider these issues before obtaining the lease? Did you draw up a business plan?


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## Marion

Scones are the least of your worries. How good are you at making muffins - blueberry/cranberry/chocolate? Do you have a decent coffee machine?

Marion


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## askalot

CafeCulture said:
			
		

> So anyone any ideas on home cooking? where do i get help - for scones etc?



Best of luck with the new venture. I think there are hygiene regulations regarding home cooking and selling the product onto the public.


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## CafeCulture

Thanks for the info.

Does anyone know a bakery in West Dublin towards city that i could buy pasteries, scones, muffins etc?


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## Lorz

As the others have said, I think the main essential areas would be-

GREAT coffee, fresh produce, friendly staff and quick service - if your based in an area with high % professionals, these people will require prompt service.  While they may have an hour for lunch they don't want to be queueing for 15mins, waiting another 15mins for food and then trying to rush their food in 10 mins before they have to get back to the office.  If you serve and seat them quickly they may stay and enjoy a coffee before they head back to the office - heck on a Friday they might even splurge on a slice of cake! ;-)  

Smoothies and Fruit Juices are another great idea and usually retail at about ~€4 - dilute them down with plenty orange or apple juice and you should have a nice little earner!  You could also target the new health conscious consumers by offering the addition of health shots (idea stolen from a Juice Bar!)  Add shots of ginger, vit C or Echinacea - help fight off colds & flus.

Nothing beats the smell of freshly baked muffins - too tempting to resist. Back to the GREAT coffee required - please ensure when your staff are making milk based coffees like Cappuccino and Latte etc that the milk used is HOT and so the customer gets a HOT coffee - it infuriates me to get a cold or luke warm coffee.  I also think the little things can make a big difference - like a free refill.  The cost is small  relative to the feel good factor for your customers.

Nothing like a bit of market research - go out at lunch time to a busy coffee shop in a similar area, sit next to the ordering area and see what people are ordering!
Hope this helps,


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## Carpenter

Who makes their own stuff anymore?  Not in a small stand alone coffee shop anyway.  I know a local coffee shop, probably the best in town and as I see it they have a few simple golden rules that keeps customers (like me) coming back.  First off is the quality of the coffee- I'd judge any coffee shop by its Americano- strong, rich flavour and good aroma with a little froth around rim of the mug is what you want!  The shop I know uses a fair trade coffee which is really very good.  Muffins, chocolate brownies and scones are all very popular and are all bought in, they always offer to warm them up in the microwave with a bit of cream on the side- which is a nice touch.  As for savoury food- the usual pannini, ciabata, bap and roll with the usual fillings.  The menu doesn't change much in the place I frequent, although they do a daily special.  I've been frequenting my local coffee shop for 4 or 5 years, 2 or 3 times a week and they are consistent; their friendly efficient staff is their biggest asset- and they offer really good value for money, in fact their prices are the ones by which I judge everyone else.  Typically an Americano is €1.60 for a large mug, pannini with (small) side salad and potato wedges is €5.50.  Ok it's not Dublin but it's no greasy spoon either.  It all sounds so common sense that EVERY establishment should be run like this, but they're not obviously.  So do the small, simple stuff well.


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## Janet

CafeCulture said:
			
		

> Thanks for the info.
> 
> Does anyone know a bakery in West Dublin towards city that i could buy pasteries, scones, muffins etc?



Better possibly to go to lots of other coffee shops, try out what they have, decide what you like and then contact the manufacturers (if it's a packaged muffin, it'll have the name on it, if not a little casual conversation along the lines of "those muffins are lovely, do you make them yourself?" should get you some idea).  The manufacturers will then have details of wholesalers where you can buy their products.

As has been said above though, these are really all the things you should have considered and done before signing a lease - how did you decide to pursue this without any research beforehand?

Also, make sure  you have great hot chocolate for those of us who don't/can't drink coffee but still like to have a warm, frothy drink from time to time.


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## Lorz

Janet said:
			
		

> Also, make sure you have great hot chocolate for those of us who don't/can't drink coffee but still like to have a warm, frothy drink from time to time.


 
Don't forget the marshmallows!  I must say I LOVE the real choc flakes that Butlers add to their hot chocolate!


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## runner

Since you are in a 'professional office area' maybe provide free wi-fi access.

As for food, do visit the Muffin place in dundrum shopping centre,top floor where they make all muffins on site, and the place is always packed.


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## justsally

Good luck with your venture Cafe Culture. Is your coffee shop, sit down, or take away.   If you're doing take away snacks etc. be aware that you will have a busy period between 12.30 and 2 and a slack period before closing.  that is assuming you are catering for mainly city office workers.
So get your bread delivery in early and have things set up for the rush.   If people have to queue for long at lunch hour they won't come back.  I'll watch this space *s*.   Good luck


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## CafeCulture

Thanks everyone for all your advice and tips- they are really good! And only way i can think to thank you is to offer you all whatever you fancy from the Cafe!!

In any case, the place is located deep within the campus complex, so not sure if there will be any lunch time trade. Busy mornings with the professionals and their clients. 

After that, i have been told that perhaps i may get business providing teas/ coffees and snacks, sandwiches, wraps for meetings. These will have to brought to the offices directly etc


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## Fintan

Hi 

I have to echo what clubman has said, it really doesn't sound like you have prepared a business plan before signing the lease. 

The one and only thing you need to do is make sure you make the best coffee within a 2 mile radius. 

If you are not from a catering background go get training, I would recommend talking to Karl from http://www.coffeeangel.ie/ for advice on coffee making. 

Don't go down the bewleys slop in a cup route. 

In terms of food, what facilities / how big is your premises?  Look at what you have to work with and then decide what you can realistiacly offer. 

You also mention that you don't expect a lunchtime trade, are you sure your business model can support this? I would have thought lunchtime would be your busy period (busier than your morning trade). 

Consider the demographics of people passing your store, are they all walking , driving / mixture of both?

If driving your morning trade will be dead, if walking morning trade will be much better. 

Anyway, sorry for the long post and bad spelling. Best of luck with the new business and let us know how you get on. 

Im also happy to offer my coffee and food tasting services  
ummmmm coffee and pastries


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## ClubMan

Fintan said:
			
		

> Don't go down the bewleys slop in a cup route.


Actually the new Bewleys is a big improvement on the _Campbell Catering_ incarnation.


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## Carpenter

CafeCulture said:
			
		

> After that, i have been told that perhaps i may get business providing teas/ coffees and snacks, sandwiches, wraps for meetings. These will have to brought to the offices directly etc


 
The place I was referring to do a lot of this, especially for HSE staff amongst others.  I'd imagine it's a good way to fill in time and the till between the early morning and lunchtimes rush periods.


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## Icarus

CafeCulture said:
			
		

> I have recently got a lease on a Coffee Shop within the public area of a professional office area.
> 
> I expect to have between 100 and 150 transactions per day- i.e. customers- members of the public and staff etc
> 
> Any ideas re. what menu options i should consider?
> 
> Also a number of other full service Spar type shops etc are located nearby.
> 
> Any advice or ideas welcome...
> 
> Thanks



I had a similar set up a few years ago. Do a search as there a few other threads on this subject. Here's a reply I gave to the same quetion on another post:

 I used to run a similar operation that ran the exact same hours (9-3). Mine was city centre in a multi purpose building. One of the areas I focused on was the staff and pupils of the building. Having such a captive market gives you incredible oppurtunity for a level of market research others would kill for. Just ask them what they want and give it to them. 11 and lunch will be automatically busy periods and are all about being able to deliver at the right speed. The other times can be incredibly quiet so be aggresive for these times.
 What is your prep/kitchen area composed of? Any gear in place? Plumbing to potable water outlet? Enough power points?

 Here are some thoughts:
 * 1/2 price teas & coffees until 10am (but give it until 10.30) and after 2.30.
 * Make the sandwiches yourself if at all possible. A damn good sandwich is a great thing and it's not that hard.
 * Take orders in advance and have them ready for lunchtime.
 * Vary your menu. People expect variety in their food like they do from no other product. Although some will eat the exact same thing at the exact same table at the exact same time for years!
 * Cater well for any regulars with diabetic, coeliac, special requirements etc. They'll stick by you.
 * Depending on how much on site cooking and prep you do adopt a minimal waste policy in your kitchen. It's difficult but with such small seating what you save can be alot more important than what you earn.
 * Consider asking them to give you the concession & electricity for free. It really could work as you are providing a genuine service and amenity.
 * Get a fast cappucinno machine. Nothing worse than a queue of 20 people and a machine that does 1 coffee a minute. I've been there!
 * Sell good coffee. I tried every coffee availble and decided that La Scala was the best and tastiest for the Irish palate. Bewleys make it. if you buy everything from them (filter coffee & tea bags) tell them you want a free cappucinno machine and a pour over coffee (filter) machines for free. They should give it.
 * Examine how many people use the local coffee shop. You could probably afford to be a little more expensive but see what sells well for them.
 * Good quality homemade food would undoubtebly be your best option but you consider prepared and quality microwavable snacks. They are individually expensive but you need less gear and they make HACCP compliancy alot easier.
 * Hit the phones and tell every supplier what you're doing ask them what they have that would work and then tell them to give you a free sample then decide for yourself.
 * I went through a really quiwt period when nothing seemed to be working. Despite alot of advice to the contrary I decided to run a tab for staff and regulars. My god did it work!! The small amount I never recouped was well worth the jump in income.
 One word of warning. Beware the soggy quiche!!!

Best of luck with it!


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## ClubMan

Icarus said:
			
		

> * Get a fast cappucinno machine. Nothing worse than a queue of 20 people and a machine that does 1 coffee a minute. I've been there!


Whatever you do don't get one of those awful vending style coffee makers! Ugh...! To a certain extent speed and quality are conflicting goals when it comes to coffee. Obviously get a good "industrial" style _Gaggia _or the like with a high pressure system.


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## Icarus

ClubMan said:
			
		

> Whatever you do don't get one of those awful vending style coffee makers! Ugh...! To a certain extent speed and quality are conflicting goals when it comes to coffee. Obviously get a good "industrial" style _Gaggia _or the like with a high pressure system.



Aside from producing below par coffee automatic machines are also the slowest. Unless you have a pub that only sells a few coffees or a self service dock they are out of the question.


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## lukegriffen

Marion said:
			
		

> Scones are the least of your worries. How good are you at making muffins - blueberry/cranberry/chocolate?
> Marion



I have to disagree on the scones.  I've even taken a trip into town on a Saturday just to get a good scone & coffee.  Muffins are too sweet for me, & very fattening for anyone on a diet.

Scones should be so simple to make, but it's almost impossible to find a decent scone that isn't floury & bland.  Best scones in town are in Kehoe's on Andrews St., or to get them from a bakery, go to the newsagent in Kimmage Crossroads & find out what baker makes his scones - these are the best I've tasted.  Also this shop has great eclairs, maybe it's from the same baker.

Good luck


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## Marion

Hi lukeGriffen

I suppose I was suggesting that CafeCulture should broaden their baking repertoire. I like scones myself - as long as they are not too sweet. The same holds for muffins. Some of the plastic covered muffins are totally dire. They are too sweet and sticky.

I would also have added almond croissants to my list - but I have never attempted to bake those. Butler's Café have nice pastries.



> Muffins are too sweet for me, & very fattening for anyone on a diet.



Hmm ... I don't think people on diets should be eating eclairs either 

Marion


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## Thrifty

Those French plaited pasteries with chocolate in them - beautiful when heated a little. Interesting reading the above, not so much for the advice given which is very good but just feel my mouth watering as i read other people's descriptions of food and coffee. Nice to see some real appreciation of good food and drink (often its so underrated). I would definitely second the recommendation about making your own sandwiches, i'd had some awful prepacked ones - particularily at bus and train stations.


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## carina

I cannot believe that you have taken a lease on a coffee shop & dont know anything about it!! i am the opposite, i have made all the plans in the world, just have no idea where to get the money!! does anyone hav any thoughts on the FAS "starting your own business" courses. are they worth it?


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## Jack The Lad

First - wishing you good luck with your new venture!

I'm not involved with cafe/coffee shops, but I do love my coffee, and love a good coffee shop too. For me, the number one criteria for returning to a coffee shop is the *coffee*. Full stop. Everything else is icing on the cake. Any one I know who visits coffee shops regularly is of the same opinion, and will not return to a coffee shop if it serves vile coffee, no matter how nice the sticky buns might be.

Become a coffee guru. Know as much as you can. That's my advice.


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## euroDilbert

*Re: Opening small Coffee Shop - Fas course*

Carina,

there is a separate thread on the Fás courses on AAM - you should be able to search for it.

I did a Fás SYOB course last year, but found it a little disappointing. The syllabus is good in theory, but our particular lecturer could have done a lot better. I learned a few things, but not much I hadn't come across by looking at AAM, and the (few) Irish-oriented business books and websites.

I think it would be most suitable for someone who has done very little personal  research, and doesn't know where to start.


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## carina

Thanks! Will hav a look at that threat, am now to this site so still trying to find my way around. Cheers!


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## carina

i meant thread!!


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## gearoidmm

Not meant to discourage you completely but pointing out some of the pitfalls that might occur in setting up a coffee shop (although this was in New York)
 
http://www.slate.com/id/2132576/


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## Winnie

On the stuff other than coffee - I hate places that buy in everything.....scones/danishes etc that they sell in O'Briens are manky.........
Fab place in town that I go out of my way to get scones & there is always a Q there in the morning for the scones........


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## moneygrower

My tupence worth - don't go mad on your coffee machine! I have had some of the nastiest muck out of fancy coffee machines and if you complain they can't believe their twenty grand machine could produce anything other than black gold. I don't know why this happens maybe its the beans or or the machine's not cleaned properly. just wanted to warn you in case some coffee machine wholesaler convinces you that a big expensive machine is the b all and end all.


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## CafeCulture

*New Coffee shop (Dublin) opened today- thanks to all AAM posters....*

Hi everyone- good news- our new Coffee Shop finally opened today- yipee. It was slow for first hour cause a lot of people didn't know we were open- sold out of all our fresh bake etc by 2pm! 

Just want to thank everyone for all their encouragment and advice they gave to my many postings. The guidance was gratefully appreciated and all taken on board.

We had a few minor glitches- forgetting to get bags for takeouts etc. But all in all it has gone great so far- only had about 15 minutes free since we opened and we aint closed yet!!

Anyone want a fresh coffee, cappuchino, expresso, latte, mocha, macchiato, americanco, chocolate or even a nice soothing cup of tea???

Thanks again all.


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## ClubMan

*Re: New Coffee shop (Dublin) opened today- thanks to all AAM posters....*



			
				CafeCulture said:
			
		

> Anyone want a fresh coffee, cappuchino, expresso, latte, mocha, macchiato, americanco, chocolate or even a nice soothing cup of tea???


Is it free?


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## CafeCulture

Hi Clubman...

It was free- we gave out preopening vouchers on Friday- think we got about 50 back today.


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## ClubMan

And you never even offered vouchers to all the kind _AAM _contributors who gave you feedback and advice. Tut, tut...


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## Calvin

I would recommend that you set up a smoothie / juice section. These are on a major growth path and should make you a good margin too!


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## carina

Thats great! I am delighted for you Cafeculture!! Where are u based? Would love to have a look! Well done on today.


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## brodiebabe

I'd love to know where you are as well and what your opening hours.  I am always on the look out for a nice coffee shop.


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## Ceist Beag

Hi Cafe Culture. I'd be interested to hear how you are getting on with your venture as it's similar to something I'm thinking of doing myself, and like you I'd be coming from a completely different background to the catering industry.


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## CafeCulture

Hi all

Glad to report that alls going well so far. Has been a bit of a rollercoaster but we now know a lot about working out what to order, staffing, etc

I would sincerely like to thank everyone on AskAboutMoney.Com for their interest and guidance. It's always great to have people who have ideas and advice on the sidelines...

Who's for coffee... or anything tasty from our menu?

Many thanks all


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## ClubMan

CafeCulture said:
			
		

> Who's for coffee... or anything tasty from our menu?


If it's free count me in.


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## DrMoriarty

Glad to hear it, CafeCulture.





			
				carina said:
			
		

> Thats great! I am delighted for you Cafeculture!! Where are u based? Would love to have a look! Well done on today.





			
				brodiebabe said:
			
		

> I'd love to know where you are as well and what your opening hours. I am always on the look out for a nice coffee shop.


Will you be keeping your location and opening hours a secret, then..?


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