# Aptmnt block with high level of non payment of mgt fees: impact of property tax?



## northsideboy (28 Jun 2010)

I'm unfortunate enough to live in an apartment block where there is a high level of non payment of management fees. The majority of units are let out. 

Will the forthcoming property tax further affect matters? 

I suspect it will unless there is some reduction in the level of property tax for those who pay a management fee.

Opinions welcome.

(Mods, I know this could fit in a taxation thread but more relevant here)


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## Eithneangela (28 Jun 2010)

I assume that they will have to take into consideration net income, mortgage on property, management fees on property, tax status etc.


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## deeheg (2 Jul 2010)

I hope they take into account the above, cos I cant take any more losses! i dont think we should take these taxes sitting down , we are accepting what is bring thrown at us to easy, it wouldnt pass so easy in our european neighbours


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## Leo (2 Jul 2010)

northsideboy said:


> I suspect it will unless there is some reduction in the level of property tax for those who pay a management fee.


 
Why would there be a reduction for those who pay a management fee (and chose to live in a development that operated in such a manner)? Should there also be a reduction for people with really large one-off houses with big gardens? They cost a lot to maintain too.


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## noel_c (2 Jul 2010)

northsideboy said:


> I'm unfortunate enough to live in an  apartment block where there is a high level of non payment of management  fees. The majority of units are let out. Will the forthcoming property  tax further affect matters. I suspect it will unless there is some  reduction in the level of property tax for those who pay a management  fee. Opinions welcome. (Mods, I know this could fit in a taxation thread  but more relevant here)


Exemptions have been talked about recently for people who have paid  stamp duty which I can understand. But I'm not sure why or how  management could be taken into account. A property tax will also be a burden on everyone else who spends money maintaining  their properties themselves! Should it be reduced for those people too? Many people deliberately  opt not to buy properties that involve management fees, often paying more to avoid them. It's a choice. 

Sounds like what we really need is better legislation for managing properties and harsher penalties for the scroungers who refuse to pair their fees.


deeheg said:


> i dont think we should take these taxes sitting down , we are accepting what is bring thrown at us to easy, it wouldnt pass so easy in our european neighbours


Not saying I agree with a property tax. But I thought most of our European neighbours already pay a property tax?


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## Towger (2 Jul 2010)

*Property Tax*
To be honest, I don't see a property tax happening, not this year or next.
How would it work? Value, Square footage, number of windows etc...
How do you value a house in the current climate?
How would the politicians justify someone with a small 3 bed semi detached in Dublin paying more than someone with a 6 bed room Mac Mansion with double garage etc in the country.

*Poll Tax*
Now a Poll Tax is another option, again their would be riots (this is Ireland so we don't hit the streets, just Phone Joe)... It would cause less grief to have a flat rate across the country, than as in the UK the local council setting the rates .

*Water Rates (Tax)*
Water Charges... Now there is a easy tax to introduce, we will of course have the standard Irish bodge and not bother with meters. The bulk of the 'tax' will be a standing charge for supply, with maybe a standard 20% extra on consumption and if you are not happy with the standard 20% you can pay to get a water meter in...


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## maybelline (2 Jul 2010)

I know it's not finalised yet but there was something in the proposal of properties paying someone to be assessed. So surely in a managed development the assessments would be organised by the management company, not individual owners, and the assessor (engineer? architect? surveyor?) could be employed once and report that e.g a 2 bed should pay €X and a 3 bed pay €Y etc
Or would that be too sensible??


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## pbcup (21 Aug 2010)

*Property Tax On Owners?*

I think this is an interesting one.  Technically apartment owners do not own their apartments.  Most usually, they hold a long lease on the use of it and ownership remains with the management company.

So if Joe Soap owns an apartment valued at 200,000 euros in a development of 100 similar apartments, does this mean that the management company needs to pay a the property tax on the building valued at 20 million-ish as a whole?  This would of course have to be paid by the apartment owners in the end.

I'm sure apartments will be addressed in any forthcoming property tax bill, but does anyone know how this would work?


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## Leo (23 Aug 2010)

pbcup said:


> I think this is an interesting one. Technically apartment owners do not own their apartments. Most usually, they hold a long lease on the use of it and ownership remains with the management company.


 
And who owns the management company???


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## pbcup (24 Aug 2010)

> And who owns the management company???



Yes, I know, but my point is that the company owns the whole building, rather than individuals owning their individual apartments.  So, do the owners share the tax on the building as a whole, or do they pay individually?

There is no actual tax, so it's a bit academic, but I was wondering if anyone knew how the tax would apply to management company-owned apartment blocks.


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## Sunny (24 Aug 2010)

pbcup said:


> Yes, I know, but my point is that the company owns the whole building, rather than individuals owning their individual apartments. So, do the owners share the tax on the building as a whole, or do they pay individually?
> 
> There is no actual tax, so it's a bit academic, but I was wondering if anyone knew how the tax would apply to management company-owned apartment blocks.


 
Its a fair point. I don't think even the Government know how a property tax would work.


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