# €25k pa job - Is it worth it?



## nomorejob (16 Apr 2009)

My wife and myself are still unemployed and get €391 per week for JB (€1695 per month).

My wife may be offered a job for approx €25k per year. Using an online tax calculator, she would get approx €2000 per month (€461 per week).
I understand that if she takes this position, my JB will be reduced to €204 per week (€884 pm) as i would loose her part as dependant and the 2 children parts.

So, *on assumption *I don't find a job in the near future, we would get €665 pw (her salary + my JB) from now until Oct 09 (i lost my job in Oct 08). But from Oct09, i will be accessed under JA rather than JB.
Because my wife is getting €461 per week, i don't think i will be entitled to anything from JA. So, effectively, the house income drops to just €461 pw.
If I take into account travel expenses like petrol/car park/etc, we would probably be left with approx €400 pw which is the same as if we were not to work.
As much as we want to get out of SW system, we don't want to be left out of pocket by taking employment.

Can somebody confirm that the above is correct?


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## Guest116 (16 Apr 2009)

There are other factors to consider - it is better to be working and in employment. You will learn new skills and in the future you would expect to earn more as you progress.

You also have real job offer, something a lot of people would love, taking it would reduce the strain on the country (yeah I know just a miniscule amount but if everyone turned down jobs like this we would be in a worse position).

Take the job! Your handouts will probably be reduced in the next budget anyways.


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## woodbine (16 Apr 2009)

You might also be entitled to Family Income Supplement (FIS), but i'm not familiar with the limits/entitlements.


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## Smashbox (16 Apr 2009)

Surely you'd rather be working? If I were you/your missus, I would have snapped the job up.


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## Welfarite (16 Apr 2009)

You can't look on this on monetary terms alone, as the other posters say. Essentially, you are asking whether you should become welfare dependant for the rest of your lives or not. You don't say if your wife is also claiming JB at present. What are her feelings about signing on unitl the 'right' job comes up? What is the 'right' job? What about mental health, staying in the loop, social lives? What about bulding up contributoins towards a State pension (at prsent you nedd ten years padi contributions and this could change in the future).


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## Smashbox (16 Apr 2009)

Have to agree with you there Welfarite, I was cracking up when I was unemployed, I didnt claim any benifits but I thought I was gonna go mad.


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## Welfarite (16 Apr 2009)

Smashbox said:


> Have to agree with you there Welfarite, I was cracking up when I was unemployed, I didnt claim any benifits but I thought I was gonna go mad.


 
Yeah, I have seen many people soul-destroyed as they cannot get out of the 'system'. I think there is a huge need out there for 'counselling' when on state benefits. Some chance of that now, it should have been introduced in the good old days.


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## Guest116 (16 Apr 2009)

There is something not right with the "system" when someone is considering turning down a 25k pa job because they think they will be less well off.


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## Deiseblue (16 Apr 2009)

If it does'nt make sense from a monetary point of view I would be tempted to turn down the job , the benefits you currently receive are entitlements not handouts.


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## fitzg (16 Apr 2009)

nomorejob, am i reading your post correctly?

you say that yourself and your wife are unemployed and get €391 per week - is this for both of you?  If it is, then if your wife takes the job for €25k (€461pw), you will be better off to the tune of €70pw?


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## Cayne (16 Apr 2009)

Deiseblue said:


> .... the benefits you currently receive are entitlements not handouts.


 
Correct they are entitlements once you are looking for work or when no work exists. 

However they become handouts once you actively decide to reject work and go on social welfare.


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## nomorejob (16 Apr 2009)

aristotle25 said:


> There is something not right with the "system" when someone is considering turning down a 25k pa job because they think they will be less well off.



Yes, you hit the nail on the head. We also think so, but we did not make the rules, we are living with them.
As mentioned by previous posters, being unemployed is soul destroying. I fully agree with that, we are unfortunately going through this ourselves. 
So, in the other hand, taking a very boring unchallenging job, seeing/talking to nobody all day is also not good for the mind, probably worse than currently and even worse if there is no financial gain.
My wife is way over qualified for this job. It would be like a senior manager in a multi-national becoming a kitchen porter. This brings mental challenges in itself. And once you get stuck in this, it may even be more difficult to get out of this than betting out of SW when the opportunity is right.


Welfarite,
My wife is not claiming JB. I am claiming JB (€204pw) and she is a dependant (€137pw) + 2 kids @ €24, hence €391pw in my original post.


Coming back to my OP, it is correct that if she takes a €25kpa job, I would not get JA?


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## Guest116 (16 Apr 2009)

Cayne said:


> However they become handouts once you actively decide to reject work and go on social welfare.


 
Agree with that.


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## Guest116 (16 Apr 2009)

nomorejob said:


> So, in the other hand, taking a very boring unchallenging job, seeing/talking to nobody all day is also not good for the mind, probably worse than currently and even worse if there is no financial gain.


 
What kind of job is on offer?


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## nomorejob (16 Apr 2009)

fitzg said:


> you say that yourself and your wife are unemployed and get €391 per week - is this for both of you?  If it is, then if your wife takes the job for €25k (€461pw), you will be better off to the tune of €70pw?



Unfortunately not, once we take travel expenses into account.


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## redstar (16 Apr 2009)

> Because my wife is getting €461 per week, i don't think i will be entitled to anything from JA. So, effectively, the house income drops to just €461 pw.



Not correct.

Your wifes income is assessed as 60% of (461pw - 20 per day worked up to a max of 3  days). (Don't ask me why !)

In your case, her assessed means p/w, assuming 5 days worked p/w, is (461 - 3x20) x 0.6 = 241.
Subtract this from your maximum JA entitlement ie 391 - 241 = 150.

So you will get 150 JA and your wife gets 461.

Total income with wife working: 150 + 461 = 611.
Total income from JA only: 391

So you gain 611 - 391 =  220 per week.

I have not accounted for any levies or prsi deductions. This would reduce the figure used to calculate your wifes income and so increase your JA, so your gain might be higher than 220.

In addition you will still have Child Benefit of 332 per month (83 p/w).

Refer to this to calculate your JA income if your wife is working.
http://www.citizensinformation.ie/R...et-jobseeker-s-allowance-and-income-from-work

You could still get a medical card or GP visit card.


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## moneygrower (16 Apr 2009)

If a higher vacancy occurs in the job as she is so over qualified, presuming they like the cut of her jib, she'd be practically a shoe in.


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## nomorejob (16 Apr 2009)

Thanks, redstar, this is very interesting.


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## Welfarite (16 Apr 2009)

This may help your calculations?


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## Smashbox (16 Apr 2009)

Cayne said:


> Correct they are entitlements once you are looking for work or when no work exists.
> 
> However they become handouts once you actively decide to reject work and go on social welfare.


 
I have to agree with you there, I would have jumped through hoops to get a job like that


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## briancbyrne (16 Apr 2009)

here is a case in point for a stringent examination of the Irish Welfare System that someone can profit from staying on benefits rather than take a job for €25,000 - more than most people coming out of a degree course would get when finishing college....Ridiculous

I dont mean this as a slight at the OP but rather at the system that is in place.


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## Welfarite (16 Apr 2009)

briancbyrne said:


> here is a case in point for a stringent examination of the Irish Welfare System that someone can profit from staying on benefits rather than take a job for €25,000 - more than most people coming out of a degree course would get when finishing college....Ridiculous
> 
> I dont mean this as a slight at the OP but rather at the system that is in place.


 

But is this the case here? One must first prove that there is an actual drop in income. From the thread, it does not appear that they would be financially better off not working. There are a lot of incentives in place for people to go back to work already, such as the Back to Work Scheme, FIS, retention of scondary benefits such as medical cards.


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## nomorejob (16 Apr 2009)

Welfarite said:


> But is this the case here? One must first prove that there is an actual drop in income. From the thread, it does not appear that they would be financially better off not working.



Correct. If redstar's detailed post is correct, then there is actually no drop of income, but a rise of €150pw (well, €80pw at most considering travel expenses). 
I am glad to admit that i misunderstood (by ref to my OP) how the JA calculations were done.
Thanks to all contributors.


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## nomorejob (16 Apr 2009)

Cayne said:


> Correct they are entitlements once you are looking for work or when no work exists.
> However they become handouts once you actively decide to reject work and go on social welfare.



I think i will have to half agree with that. Being a jobseeker does not mean you have to accept any job at any cost.


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## thesimpsons (17 Apr 2009)

when your already in a job its usually easier to get another one, plus your children would also see that its important to go out and make the effort.  Whos to say that maybe if she takes this job, there could be another job  just around the corner with better financial stakes, but then she could then leave the first job for the second.


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## MandaC (17 Apr 2009)

nomorejob said:


> I think i will have to half agree with that. Being a jobseeker does not mean you have to accept any job at any cost.



Agree with you there.  

I have seen both sides of it.  Both my friend and I were made redundant at the same time last year. I got a job straight away and she didnt.  I hated where I went and it seriously had an effect on my overall health and well being. However, I started looking after 2 months and had a job after 4 months.  I hated the place so much though that I was ready to give it up and go on unemployement until I found something that suited.  I do think that it is easier to get a job from a job though.

My friend was the opposite - she was out of work from June to end February and at the end said she was prepared to work for a low wage - €24K, just to keep sane.  Luck prevailed at the end of the day and she got something in her salary bracket.


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