# Never mind the banks. Who is going to bail out Ireland?



## Sunny (17 Feb 2009)

This topic is fast coming into mainstream thinking. Judging by the chatting on the wires and the movement of Irelands CDS spreads, there is no doubt anymore that members of the Euro are now seriously having to consider ways to help countries like Ireland. It won't be in the form of an IMF rescue but once again we will have to depend on our bigger European Countries for our economic survival. Anyone brave enough to vote no in the Lisbon Treaty???

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=aGwRmgq6Tz7w&refer=home


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## lemur (17 Feb 2009)

The usual crazies Sinn Fein etc will vote no.


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## Towger (17 Feb 2009)

Sunny said:


> Anyone brave enough to vote no in the Lisbon Treaty???


 
Nope, I for one have lost competence in our own politicians to run the country.


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## scallywag (17 Feb 2009)

Sunny said:


> Anyone brave enough to vote no in the Lisbon Treaty???



My very reason for voting Yes first time round was because European politicians know how to run a country far better than ours do.


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## Ethan 1 (17 Feb 2009)

scallywag said:


> European politicians know how to run a country far better than ours do.



Probably, but what will it cost us and I don't mean financially.


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## ninsaga (17 Feb 2009)

Lisbon treaty! Bring it on & lets get bankrolled by the EU. Perhaps at least they will force resolution to issues such as bank robbers (the white collar variety), their regulators & their auditors to explain or get jailed. Our own are just not up to the job of forcing the issues.......'sure 'twil all be forgotten about next week when we have some other scandal to contend with!'


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## z109 (17 Feb 2009)

I suspect we will get the Hungary treatment. The IMF will come in and prescribe the course of treatment, but the EU will actually pay for it. The treatment? A purgative and an emetic, I suspect. Higher taxes, slash and burn in the public sector, abandonment of the NDP. Many people have a lot to lose. I do wish they would pay attention and prevent this, but I don't see it happening.


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## Westy29 (18 Feb 2009)

yoganmahew said:


> I suspect we will get the Hungary treatment. The IMF will come in and prescribe the course of treatment, but the EU will actually pay for it. The treatment? A purgative and an emetic, I suspect. Higher taxes, slash and burn in the public sector, abandonment of the NDP. Many people have a lot to lose. I do wish they would pay attention and prevent this, but I don't see it happening.


 
Bear with me while I ask this question.....im thick.....

Lets say we continue down this seemingly never ending road of banking scandals, or credit rating as a country gets cut and investors stop lending to Ireland. If the worst case scenario happens and the bad debts of the banks turn out to be at the top end of the scale and the goverment bascically cant cover them aswell as its huge debt it will run up borrowing to pay for day to day expenses. Then the IMF/EU step in?

Lets say other eurozone countries recover at a much faster pace than ourselves and the ECB decide to bring interest rates up again cippling even more Irish borrowers. Can interest rates within a particular country within the zone be 'frozen' to avoid massive repossesions etc??????? or does my question make absolutely no sense?


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## thespecialon (18 Feb 2009)

yoganmahew said:


> I suspect we will get the Hungary treatment. The IMF will come in and prescribe the course of treatment, but the EU will actually pay for it. The treatment? A purgative and an emetic, I suspect. Higher taxes, slash and burn in the public sector, abandonment of the NDP. Many people have a lot to lose. I do wish they would pay attention and prevent this, but I don't see it happening.



Yoganmahew,

Is there a report somewhere that you could link me to that shows what the IMF/EU enforced? Not that I dont believe you I would just like to read more of the details..If what you quote is correct then I would like more detail so I can try to plan for the future should this happen.

Thanks,
T.


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## Towger (18 Feb 2009)

Westy29 said:


> the goverment bascically cant cover them aswell as its huge debt it will run up borrowing to pay for day to day expenses. Then the IMF/EU step in?


 
It will reach a stage that the goverment can't borrow. The IMF has no money, but the EU may give the goverment somesort of digout!
The end result is that the Goverment can only giveout what it takes in. So taxes will rise and public spending will be cut, *massively. *



Westy29 said:


> Can interest rates within a particular country within the zone be 'frozen' to avoid massive repossesions etc???????


 
No, not unless they bring in a second tier euro currency, or we drop out of the euro. The goverment (if it could affort it!) could bring in higher interest relief to compensate for the high interest. Also in old days of high interest some companies gave their employees (with mortages) an extra payment to help cover their mortage interest. Where I worked it was about a 1000 IEP per year, in the days then that was a lot of money


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## lemur (18 Feb 2009)

Towger said:


> It will reach a stage that the goverment can't borrow. The IMF has no money, but the EU may give the goverment somesort of digout!
> The end result is that the Goverment can only giveout what it takes in. So taxes will rise and public spending will be cut, *massively. *



Will somebody tell the bozo politicians and social partners this. 

Rome is burning and they are still talking about their perks and stuff.


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## Westy29 (18 Feb 2009)

Things are getting increasingly depressing.............people better start getting their fingers out and fast. It just seems to be day after day or revelation.


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## askalot (18 Feb 2009)

scallywag said:


> My very reason for voting Yes first time round was because European politicians know how to run a country far better than ours do.



So you and Libertas both agree that the Lisbon was all about conceding more power to Europe. Interesting.


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## UptheDeise (18 Feb 2009)

It's not only Irish politicians that have backbones of marshmallow. The British politicians are just as bad. 

We need massive cuts now in our public sector. We need an increase in taxation and we need an increase in our interest rate. (Yes I know we are tied in with the ECB).


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## Sunny (18 Feb 2009)

UptheDeise said:


> It's not only Irish politicians that have backbones of marshmallow. The British politicians are just as bad.
> 
> We need massive cuts now in our public sector. We need an increase in taxation and we need an increase in our interest rate. (Yes I know we are tied in with the ECB).


 
Why do we need an increase in our interest rate? Needed that years ago. Most certainly don't need it now.


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## PaddyW (18 Feb 2009)

Yes, I don't get that either. Why would you increase the interest rate and cause more people to lose their homes?


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## RMCF (18 Feb 2009)

Wondering if someone on this subforum could answer a question I posed on another in here without reply.

If you have a large amount of savings in an Irish bank, is it truly safe? Especially if the worst was to happen and the IMF/ECB have to get involved in Ireland's finances?

I know probably getting scared when I don't need to be, but want to know that my life savings are safe.


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## soy (19 Feb 2009)

http://bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601068&refer=home&sid=aGwRmgq6Tz7w

The EU would probably have to bail us out if worst comes to worst (see link). If this happens expect IMF style pay cuts and significant tax increases. They would also force us to bring our company taxes into line with the major EU econimies, thus ensuring we are finished as a base for the US multinationals.


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## Ruam (19 Feb 2009)

If anyone thinks the IMF is the answer have a read of this.

[broken link removed]

Makes for sober reading

Ruam


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## Shawady (19 Feb 2009)

yoganmahew said:


> The IMF will come in and prescribe the course of treatment, but the EU will actually pay for it. The treatment? A purgative and an emetic, I suspect. Higher taxes, slash and burn in the public sector, abandonment of the NDP.


 
If this is possible (and I'm not suggesting it isn't), why on earth are the government not reinforcing this point when they are trying to make changes?
I am probably being very niave but if the IMF's medicine is going to be a lot worse than the 'pension levy', why are the unions protesting instead of accepting some cuts will be needed?
I work in the civil service and I would have prefered a direct pay cut than the 'pension levy' but either way would much prefer to take a bit of pain now rather than something worse in a couple of years.


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## z103 (19 Feb 2009)

Getting rid of our own government should save us a fortune. If voting Yes to lisbon meant boarding up the Dail, that would very tempting indeed!


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