# Disciplinary hearing - asked to witness



## ney001 (31 Jul 2007)

Hi guys

Just a quick one, a good friend of mine is having a disciplinary hearing in work two weeks from now - basically she has not agreed to some new requests in her contract (new management have taken over) and following a lot of letters between her and new management they have asked her to attend a disciplinary hearing.  She has asked me to come along as a witness to the hearing -  first of all what should I/we expect at the hearing?, is it necessary for me to take notes?.   I am told there will be three of her superiors there, should I try to sit in the background of the office or should I sit with my friend?


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## ClubMan (31 Jul 2007)

Surely the company can outline the disciplinary hearing process and format for you?


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## nelly (31 Jul 2007)

I would not take notes, let her take her own. but thats just me. Why do you think she picked you to witness? I would be loath to attend one of these to be perfectly honest, as you could be seen as a trouble maker or get caught up in something which is not your business.


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## ClubMan (31 Jul 2007)

nelly said:


> as you could be seen as a trouble maker or get caught up in something which is not your business.


You mean if the witness is also an employee of the company in question? It's not clear whether or not this is the case from the original post and I was curious about that myself.


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## ney001 (31 Jul 2007)

I have no connection to the company whatsoever - just asked to attend as a witness so I don't have any outline of the procedure  - I only know that three superiors will be dealing with it.


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## ClubMan (31 Jul 2007)

So ask your friend to get some information from the company about the hearing process/format?


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## onekeano (31 Jul 2007)

ney001 said:


> Hi guys
> 
> Just a quick one, a good friend of mine is having a disciplinary hearing in work two weeks from now - basically she has not agreed to some new requests in her contract (new management have taken over) and following a lot of letters between her and new management they have asked her to attend a disciplinary hearing.  She has asked me to come along as a witness to the hearing -  first of all what should I/we expect at the hearing?, is it necessary for me to take notes?.   I am told there will be three of her superiors there, should I try to sit in the background of the office or should I sit with my friend?



The very first thing to do is to ask for a copy of their disciplinary procedure. You should make sure that you have plenty of time to review this (word by word) in advance of the hearing. If you are not happy with the amount of time to prepare then request more time - in writing.

You should definitely take written notes at this meeting and at the start you should clarify exactly who the superiors are and their titles. When taking notes if the conversation is racing ahead and you are under pressure, ask them to repeat where necessary for the purposes of clarification.

At the end of the meeting you or your friend should ask the panel exactly what the process will be going forward ie. when will you be advised of their decision? In the event of any disciplinary action being taken what is the process of appeal etc etc.

Finally before you leave make sure to ask them to provide you with a copy of the minutes as soon as possible. Almost certainly one of them will be taking minutes and these could very extremely important if this ends up at a 3rd party. The thing is that regardless of what is said their "minutes" will almost certainly end up having the company slant on them. It's really important that if the minutes do not accurately reflect the tone and content of the meeting then this should be challenged IN WRITING immediately to demonstrate that you do not agree the accuracy of the minutes.

Bets of luck 
Roy


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## Pique318 (31 Jul 2007)

I'd record it if I was you. Use your mobile (discreetly if you must) but at least you have record of what was said if you need to challenge something.


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## ClubMan (31 Jul 2007)

Whatever about the ethics of recording such a meeting surreptitiously it may also be questionable legally.


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## aonfocaleile (31 Jul 2007)

ClubMan said:


> Whatever about the ethics of recording such a meeting surreptitiously it may also be questionable legally.


 
Such a record would not stand up in the event of a legal challenge i.e. you couldn't use it to refute the other side's version of events. However, it may prove useful if you wanted to transcribe your own minutes afterwards. 
B
ut back to the OP - you should definitely take notes yourself. Your friend will need your objective view of what exactly was said afterwards. Even if you yourself are not fully informed of the procedure, make sure your friend is.


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## ney001 (1 Aug 2007)

Thanks for that guys - I'll definitely take notes now, my friend does not expect it to go to well - particularly with her immediate supervisor.  Would you recommend that I just bring a chair to the back of the room i.e sit behind my friend or should I sit side by side?, I don't want to distract anyone.


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## Gordanus (1 Aug 2007)

If they agree to a recording being made, you should be ok.


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## cinders (1 Aug 2007)

Also, don't be afraid to (diplomatically) request a break in the proceedings, if your friend is getting upset or needs a time out.


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## Seagull (1 Aug 2007)

Try to establish before the hearing whether there are any objections to a recording being made. If there are no objections, use the best recording equipment you can get hold of easily. You need something better than a mobile phone or dictaphone.


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## paddyodoors (1 Aug 2007)

I would suggest sitting alongside her and not off in the background somewhere, not only for the moral support, she would feel more isolated were you not close I imagine. Plus it will be clearer to the company that you are focussed on the issues rather than sitting quetly in the background.

I don't see how this is a disciplinary dispute though - negotiating new contracts should not cause an employee to be brought in to be disciplined?

I would have thought that it is a hr issue of Either providing the option of redundancy or the 2 parties coming to an agreement on a mutually agreeable contract.

depending on the detail - I would get legal advice BEFORE entering any such official meeting


Paddy


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## onekeano (2 Aug 2007)

cinders said:


> Also, don't be afraid to (diplomatically) request a break in the proceedings, if your friend is getting upset or needs a time out.




This is great advice and you should prep you friend in advance that you  might do this so there are no surprises. To be honest I'd forget about the whole recording thing. I did this for someone about a year ago and was asked for my name address and occupation - in case you are asked this just say your name and state that you are a "professional manager" and as such have some experience in these matters but that you are there as a friend. They are not entitled to your address or details of where you work. In my situation they said they wanted to check that I was not a solicitor 

Bets of luck (and maybe let's know how you get on.....)
Roy


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## dodo (2 Aug 2007)

Switch on your recorder on your mobile phone just as you go in, then mentioned it to them on the way out,


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## Seagull (3 Aug 2007)

The recorder on most mobile phones will not be good enough for this. All you'll hear is a load of static and mumbles. People could be anything up to 3 metres from the phone, with no guarantee they'll speak loudly or clearly. There would also be issues with the legality of recording the meeting without giving notice at the start of the meeting.


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## aircobra19 (3 Aug 2007)

A minidisc recorder with a cheap mic is perfect for meetings. I doubt they'd agree to being recorded though.


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## shipibo (3 Aug 2007)

Sweet This post will be deleted if not edited immediately,


     If the company allows external witness in a meeting, your role is to sit and listen, you ask no questions, and offer no advice.

     If shes gets a written warning / dismissed, and this goes to LRC / Labour Court, and their are differences in versions of meeting, you may be asked for your opinon (very rare)

     Was considering suggesting wearing a hoodie, and hidin, a midget with a camera/tape recorder in it, but the problem is ....


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## ClubMan (3 Aug 2007)

crumdub12 said:


> Was considering suggesting wearing a hoodie, and hidin, a midget with a camera/tape recorder in it, but the problem is ....




But seriously - doesn't the precise nature, format and rights/obligations in this context really depend on the specific policies of the company in question governing this process? At this stage the original poster must surely have obtained more detailed information on these from the person in question?


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## shipibo (3 Aug 2007)

Clubman,

             Generally witnesses ( I have been one) just sit there, usually to make sure people do not make outlandish statements, threating behaviour or state something and deny it later.

             Strange that company has OK,ed external individual (Union, Solicitor excluded) to sit in meeting. Normally it is a member of staff.


Companies should not see this as trouble making, as his job is to witness the meeting, not present a skewed view in favour of friend / work colleague.


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## Woodstock (1 Oct 2007)

paddyodoors said:


> I don't see how this is a disciplinary dispute though - negotiating new contracts should not cause an employee to be brought in to be disciplined?
> 
> I would have thought that it is a hr issue of Either providing the option of redundancy or the 2 parties coming to an agreement on a mutually agreeable contract.
> 
> ...


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## Woodstock (1 Oct 2007)

Sorry - just noticed date of original posting.  By now I presume it's all over. Please let us know how it went?


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## shipibo (3 Oct 2007)

This was,nt negotiating, this was being told. the person refused, and was called to disiplinary meeting.


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