# Teacher in Republic since 97, but in UK before that, Contributory Old Age Pension etc



## Jano (28 Mar 2009)

If anyone can help? 

I have 9 years of NI contributions 1986 - 1995 and then moved home to Ireland. 

Have been teacher since 1997 paying full PRSI (6.5%) but can't get an OAP contributory pension as is the case with all public sector workers. 

I have the option to buy vol UK NI  contributions at the rates in the previous post up to current date but would I be wasting my money because in DSFA website it says:

"Under EU legislation it not possible for a person to be subject to the social insurance systems of two or more member states at the same time. This means that you cannot pay Voluntary Contributions in Ireland at the same time as you are in insurable employment, self-employment, receiving credited contributions or paying Voluntary Contributions in another EU member state."

UK rules (which you would think are also EU rules) state that you cannot pay voluntary contributions in the UK if you are paying voluntary contributions in another EU state. Nothing about working? Help? I don't want to waste my hard-earned pension-levied cash!


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## Black Sheep (28 Mar 2009)

*Re: UK State Pension Contributions*

I'm a bit confused as to why you would not be entitled to a contributory State Pension (perhaps not a full one) in Ireland if you are paying an A1 contribution.

Since when can you not pay voluntary cons. in the UK while working and paying in Ireland


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## Jano (29 Mar 2009)

*Re: UK State Pension Contributions*

For teachers, our Dept Education of Education Science pension is 40/80ths of our salary at retirement if you have the full 40 years service. You cannot also get a state contributory OAP for the same period despite paying full contributions- the dept claw that back on their own behalf. This is the case across the public service if you joined during the mid 90s. 

According to the UK pensions info you can pay voluntary contributions only IF you aren't paying voluntary contributions in another EU state but according to the DFSA website, you can't pay voluntary contributions in another state (UK in my case) if you are working or getting any kind of PRSI credit in Ireland? Seems contradictory?


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## ajapale (29 Mar 2009)

*Re: UK State Pension Contributions*

Jano,

If its ok with you Ill split your rather complicated question (involving as it does UK Teachers occupational pension and UK social welfare pension) from the original question. Is that ok with you?

If you are a teacher in the Republic starting in 97 your teachers pension will be coordinated/integrated with social welfare. This means that you will pay a full A1 stamp and a reduced superannuation contribution. When it comes to retiring you pension will be made up of two components 1)The contributory OAP and 2)an amount from the superannuation scheme which will bring you up to your entitlemnent based on your years service.

aj
moderator


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## Jano (29 Mar 2009)

*Re: UK State Pension Contributions*

Thanks Ajapale. 

Do you think that if I paid vol NI contributions in the UK for the years I have been teaching here, that I could claim UK state contributory pension for the same period or would it be also be integrated into the contributory OAP element of my pension and therefore be a waste of cash?


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## Black Sheep (30 Mar 2009)

*Re: Teacher in Republic since 97, but in UK before that, Contributory Old Age Pension*

UK contributory pension is awarded to people who have made sufficient NI payments and or voluntary contributions. It has no connection with any other pension you receive from another country.

As regards your Irish State Pension you will also be awarded your pension based on the contributions made. However the fact that you have a public service pension means that your State pension becomes part of the public pension due to you.

This pension operates is the same as most Defined Benefit pensions in private emp[loyment. Effictively your employment pension becomes the top-up to the State (Old age)pension


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## macbri (10 Jul 2009)

*Re: Teacher in Republic since 97, but in UK before that, Contributory Old Age Pension*

Hi there,
            I worked in the UK for 3 years 1989-1991 returned to Ireland late 91.

Can I pay voluntary UK NI/pension contributions from 91 onwards or is there a contact website/number I can contact to obtain further information.

Thanks for any help in this matter


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## Protocol (10 Jul 2009)

*Re: Teacher in Republic since 97, but in UK before that, Contributory Old Age Pension*



Jano said:


> If anyone can help?
> 
> 
> Have been teacher since 1997 paying full PRSI (6.5%) but can't get an OAP contributory pension as is the case with all public sector workers.
> ...


 

The 6.5% is not PRSI - it is your occupational pension contribution.

PRSI at class A is 4%, although it is merged with the Health levy on your payslip.

Public sector works hired before April 1995 can't get a State pension.

If you started after April 1995, and are paying class A PRSI, then you will get a State pension.


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## Jano (10 Jul 2009)

*Re: Teacher in Republic since 97, but in UK before that, Contributory Old Age Pension*

Macbri, 
After much research I have discovered that you *can* pay voluntary NI contributions in the UK because those you are paying in Ireland are compulsory, not voluntary. You would think common EU rules apply to both states but this is not the case. You need 30 years for a full state pension in the UK but only need to have "earned" contributions for a minimum of 1 year to qualify for any form of payment. As 1 year is the minimum, if that is all you have in contributions, then you get 1/30th of a UK contributory state old age pension etc. You can buy years which you should enquire into asap as the rate for certain years is still lower (£405.60 v £626.60 for Apr 2005/Apr 2006 for example if bought by 5 Apr 2010. You have missed the deadline to buy back some earlier years since Apr 5 just gone which were offered on a one-off basis due to changes in the system. You cannot buy years before Apr 5 2003 at all now.

With reference to Protocol's reply, public sector workers in Ireland do not get the state pension on top of the public service pension. PRSI has to be paid for at the full rate and your full rate of public service pension quoted, eg 40/80s of final salary for a teacher with the full 40 years service (of which there are very few!) includes the OAP rate.

Look up www.hmrc.gov.uk/leaflets/nic.htm or www.thepensionservice.gov.uk/ipc/home/asp or ring 00441912254869. Good luck!


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## Protocol (11 Jul 2009)

*Re: Teacher in Republic since 97, but in UK before that, Contributory Old Age Pension*

Yes, what I mean is that for those hired after April 1995, the State pension is integrated with the occupational pension.

If post 95, you will get a State pension, and a reduced occupational pension.


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## macbri (11 Jul 2009)

*Re: Teacher in Republic since 97, but in UK before that, Contributory Old Age Pension*

Thanks Jano,
                  I will ring the number next week.

I'm paying voluntary contributions in Ireland at moment as based in Australia but if I can get full pension in UK as well will pay additional contributions.

Going by your answer may not be able to do this although it would be great to have an Irish & UK pension + an Aussie 1.


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