# Enterprise Ireland new startup grants



## homeowner (9 Jul 2007)

Has anyone been successful in getting a grant from enterprise ireland for a new startup?  

Assuming you meet their requirements for high potential startups, overseas export potential etc..

I am interested to hear from people who got a grant specifically what was the process they went through, how long did it take to process their application, do they make you jump through hoops, how much help are enterprise ireland in getting your business off the ground asssuming you meet their criteria outlined for a grant etc....


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## Purple (9 Jul 2007)

Contact the [broken link removed] for help.
I have met Dick Kavanagh a few times and he is very open and there's no BS.


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## z103 (9 Jul 2007)

The first grant people generally apply for is a feasibility study grant, supposedly to see if the project you're proposing is feasible.

Enterprise ireland state that they will award you with 50% of costs associated with the study, payable after the study has been completed, and you've spent the money. There is also a bunch of small print to wade through about NDP logos, and ramifications of selling the company etc.

The amount of paperwork, compliance and red tape involved is huge. You'll probably have to hire an accountant at some stage to help you out. You'll need to fill in various application forms, environmental impact reports and submit tax clearance certificates galore.

You may be 'geared up' for this and have someone who is good at filling in all this paperwork and putting down what EI want to hear. If you are not in this position then you have a choice to make, 'grant junkie' or try to get your business off the ground. There aren't enough hours in the day to realistically expect that you can do both yourself.

Good luck, whatever you choose.


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## hhhhhhhhhh (10 Jul 2007)

homeowner said:


> Has anyone been successful in getting a grant from enterprise ireland for a new startup?
> 
> Assuming you meet their requirements for high potential startups, overseas export potential etc..
> 
> I am interested to hear from people who got a grant specifically what was the process they went through, how long did it take to process their application, do they make you jump through hoops, how much help are enterprise ireland in getting your business off the ground asssuming you meet their criteria outlined for a grant etc....



[broken link removed]
Apply for this programme.

If you get accepted, you will be entitled to apply
for the cord grant. Which 50% of your previous years
salary up to 38K.
You will also get a standard grant of €550 per month
but this is substracted from the cord.
This is all tax free.

Grant process was 45 minute meeting, 1 month before starting
getting the cash.

Getting your business off the ground is totaly up to you.
EI will give you a mentor, a DA and make you aware of
events you can attend but they can not do any miracles


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## Purple (10 Jul 2007)

leghorn said:


> The first grant people generally apply for is a feasibility study grant, supposedly to see if the project you're proposing is feasible.
> 
> Enterprise ireland state that they will award you with 50% of costs associated with the study, payable after the study has been completed, and you've spent the money. There is also a bunch of small print to wade through about NDP logos, and ramifications of selling the company etc.
> 
> ...



You don't need an accountant, the IRDG will do 90% of the paperwork for you and as they are a not for profit group their fees are very reasonable. They also know the system and the people involved so will be better than an accountant.



hhhhhhhhhh said:


> [broken link removed]
> Apply for this programme.
> 
> If you get accepted, you will be entitled to apply
> ...



Good post and a good scheme but a major reservation; from my experience DA’s can range from very good to utterly useless.
If what you need is a reasonably large amount of capital and your company has good potential then applying for the HPSU scheme is a better bet.
The High Potential Start Up scheme basically front end loads a number of other grant vehicles so you get a cash injection at the start. This will probably involve EI taking a share in the business but they can only sell that share to the other existing share holders and they take a back seat unless asked for help.


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## homeowner (10 Jul 2007)

Thanks for these replies.  I had heard about the CORD grant but it involves working fulltime on the project which I am not in the situation to do at the moment.  But in another year or so I might be.  Its good to see other people have gone through the process successfully.  For me giving up full time work is the hard part as I have expenses that require a steady income so its a very difficult deciision to make.  If EI or another body thought my business had enough merit and potential to give me a grant I would be really encouraged by that.

For those of you who have been through the process, do you mind me asking how is your business doing?  Or what stage of the process are you in currently.


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## z103 (10 Jul 2007)

> If you get accepted, you will be entitled to apply
> for the cord grant. Which 50% of your previous years
> salary up to 38K.
> You will also get a standard grant of €550 per month
> ...


CORD is not tax free. You have to pay income tax on any portion not related to expenses.

We spent over a year trying to get a response from the PDC. To be fair though, we were real novices at the time and didn't even have a proper business plan. Maybe they've improved now.



> You don't need an accountant, the IRDG will do 90% of the paperwork for you


We never heard of this scheme, and hired an accountant.



> If EI or another body thought my business had enough merit and potential to give me a grant I would be really encouraged by that... ...If EI or another body thought my business had enough merit and potential to give me a grant I would be really encouraged by that...


Claiming the grant is the hard part.

EI Grants obviously must work for some companies, but for us it was nearly the kiss of death. We were so bogged down with paperwork, our business started to suffer. It didn't do too much for our morale either. It was far easier for us to just earn the money, and less risky! Since giving up the grants we've done much better.

I suppose it suits some companies, but didn't suit us.


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## homeowner (10 Jul 2007)

leghorn said:


> EI Grants obviously must work for some companies, but for us it was nearly the kiss of death. We were so bogged down with paperwork, our business started to suffer. It didn't do too much for our morale either. It was far easier for us to just earn the money, and less risky! Since giving up the grants we've done much better.
> 
> I suppose it suits some companies, but didn't suit us.


 
That is an interesting point about taking the grant as a salary payment, I suppose for me I have about 18 months to save money before I can think about quitting my job so I have time to prepare a feasibility report and business plan in the meantime, if for no other reason than to put my idea and thoughts on paper.  I have already done some market research but the next step really is actually doing it.

One thing that I am not clear about, when you prepare a business plan when looking for a grant/investment, do you include yourself in salary and wages on the plan or no?  Surely it is expected that you will pay yourself something. What is the point of a grant if it isnt to help you live while trying to get the business off the ground or am i missing the point?


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## ang1170 (10 Jul 2007)

homeowner said:


> Thanks for these replies. I had heard about the CORD grant but it involves working fulltime on the project which I am not in the situation to do at the moment. But in another year or so I might be. Its good to see other people have gone through the process successfully. For me giving up full time work is the hard part as I have expenses that require a steady income so its a very difficult deciision to make. If EI or another body thought my business had enough merit and potential to give me a grant I would be really encouraged by that.
> 
> For those of you who have been through the process, do you mind me asking how is your business doing? Or what stage of the process are you in currently.


 
My own stage in this process is at the very end. Briefly, a few years ago I stared a company with someone and got BES investment in, along with a small amount of EI support (we were classed as a high-potential start-up). We got some additional support from EI over the years, but for a variety of reasons nothing too major. As an aside, we raised a substantial sum from a VC company subsequently. The company is no longer trading (very long story, not that relevant to this).

Anyway, my own experience is:

-         I’d echo some of the other posts in that there is a lot of red tape involved in dealing with EI. However, it helps if you look at if from their point of view: they’re handing out taxpayer’s money, so you’d hope they’d be careful with how they do it – and they are. If you go with their flow in dealing with them it makes it a lot easier. If you use your contact within EI, they will help get you through the hoops: what they won’t do is bend the rules.
-         You will not start a company on EI funding alone! They won’t do this: any funding is at lost a % of the requirement.
-         At the time, and I believe this is still the case, you get approval for BES investment based on EI support (i.e. the Revenue essentially use EI to certify that you’re an eligible company), so if you do the BES route for funding, you’ll have to deal with EI anyway
-         Do NOT use EI to validate either your technology or business (i.e. say to yourself “if EI are funding me, it must be a good idea”). You need to do this yourself. EI do a certain amount of due diligence, but not sufficient to take a business decision based on it
-         By far the best investment cash you can get for a business is sales revenue. Start selling from day one!
-         EI cash is not free: as others have pointed out, you will spend time and effort getting it (better spent in getting sales?). It’s really up to you to decide if it’s worth it or not.
-   Regardless of whether or not you do get a grant, they are useful and helpful, and will often point you to other places and people who can help.

My advice would be to go and have a talk with them, to get some feel for what they can do and what’s involved.

Best of luck!


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## Purple (10 Jul 2007)

ang1170, good post and good advice.


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## homeowner (10 Jul 2007)

ang1170 said:


> My own stage in this process is at the very end. Briefly, a few years ago I stared a company with someone and got BES investment in, along with a small amount of EI support (we were classed as a high-potential start-up). We got some additional support from EI over the years, but for a variety of reasons nothing too major. As an aside, we raised a substantial sum from a VC company subsequently. The company is no longer trading (very long story, not that relevant to this).
> 
> Anyway, my own experience is:
> 
> ...


 
Really good post ang1170.  Sorry to hear that it didnt work out.  

So would you advise that I call EI soon considering that I would not be in a  position to work on this fulltime for another 18 months or so?  What could/should I do in the meantime to prepare....feasibility study?  Business Plan?  Research the market more?  

If you could do it over again what would you do differently?


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## Purple (10 Jul 2007)

What part of the country are you in homeowner?
When it comes to grants for existing businesses the BMW area gets most, Dublin gets bugger all. Start ups are different but if you are working out of a village on an island off the west coast it will go better for you than if you are in D4


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## z103 (10 Jul 2007)

I would fully agree that it's certainly harder in Dublin.

Excellent post by ang1170 - any chance of making it a key post?


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## homeowner (10 Jul 2007)

Purple said:


> What part of the country are you in homeowner?
> When it comes to grants for existing businesses the BMW area gets most, Dublin gets bugger all. Start ups are different but if you are working out of a village on an island off the west coast it will go better for you than if you are in D4


 
BMW?  I am in Dublin (unfortunately, it would seem!)


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## ang1170 (10 Jul 2007)

homeowner said:


> Really good post ang1170. Sorry to hear that it didnt work out.
> 
> So would you advise that I call EI soon considering that I would not be in a position to work on this fulltime for another 18 months or so? What could/should I do in the meantime to prepare....feasibility study? Business Plan? Research the market more?
> 
> If you could do it over again what would you do differently?


 
Thanks for the comment.

Just to clarify: when I said the company is no longer trading, I meant just that. We sold the main assets of the company (mainly software we'd developed) to our main customer, a  very large multi-national. Basically, we'd had a whole series of setbacks (nearly went under a few times), which together with a lack of enthusiasm for continuing left this as the best option. Luckily all debts were paid off by the deal we did, but equally, nobody made anything either. I learned a huge amount from the whole experience.

As for your questions:

- Absolutely, do as much market research as possible. You can never do too much (unless the time spent on it is stopping you from acting on the results of the research)

- Definitely prepare a business plan. Even if you never show it to anyone, it wil clarify your own thinking and make it obvious where you need to spend more time and effort.

- As for feasibility, EI will fund you 50% for this, which is useful. However: do it for the right reasons not just because you can get this assistance.

What would I do differently?

I'm more or less convinced that the model, which is quite common in technology (where I work), of (a) have a bright idea (b) go build some of it (c) raise some finance based on that prototype (d) use the funding to build and market it and (e) sell it, is completely wrong. 

You need to start selling as soon as possible. Even if you want to build product X, start going out and selling something you do have. If you're out selling you're talking to customers, building relationships, learning about the market. You can use this to refine your ideas about X (maybe even dump it and start to build Z instead).

Funding is a real minefield: VCs have pulled right back, and they're now operating like banks (want virtual guarentees of sucess before they'll fund, and the terms are crazy). There's plenty of private investment out there, but it can be difficult to tap without a track record.

My inclination (for my next venture) is to start really small and build from there before seeking outside investment (if at all).


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## hhhhhhhhhh (11 Jul 2007)

leghorn said:


> CORD is not tax free. You have to pay income tax on any portion not related to expenses.



CORD is tax free I have written confirmation from the revenue.

I also know about 30 other people who also got CORD and they all claimed it tax free. It is classed as a training grant.

Some people where told it was taxable from the revenue, but called a different section and got a different answer.
Once you have the written confirmation you are legit.


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## homeowner (11 Jul 2007)

hhhhhhhhhh said:


> I also know about 30 other people who also got CORD and they all claimed it tax free. It is classed as a training grant.


 
Do you know the experiences any of these peoeple had with getting this grant and how it helped their business? Are they still trading? Appreciate anything you can share with us. I dont know anyone who has been through this process so just trying to get as much feedback from people as possible.


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## hhhhhhhhhh (11 Jul 2007)

homeowner said:


> One thing that I am not clear about, when you prepare a business plan when looking for a grant/investment, do you include yourself in salary and wages on the plan or no?  Surely it is expected that you will pay yourself something. What is the point of a grant if it isnt to help you live while trying to get the business off the ground or am i missing the point?



CORD is the only grant that is cash.

The feasibility grant is 50% of your costs, a small portion can be salary.

EI may invest money in your company in exchange for equity, but this is
rare, they will usually match whatever you can raise from a third party.

The EI grants are not a means of supplementing your income while you
start a business. They help you develop the business, the reward is that
you own a successful company that you can sell.

You need to commit your own funds to getting the business off the groud
be it direct cash or sweat equity. EI will help you a little bit, but as stated
above its all to do with sales.


*My Advise*​ 
Do Lots Of Market Research

* Before you develop a product first call all the potential customers.
* Say I am developing this product, would you be interested in it
* How much would you pay for it
* What features would it need

When you establish a market for your product, then build it.
Go back to the companies you did the market research on and say
remember I call you about product X, well it is now available would
you like a free trial.


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## z103 (11 Jul 2007)

> CORD is tax free I have written confirmation from the revenue.



Well you've certainly made my day! I was informed by a woman from EI that it was taxable.

I'd be most grateful if you could post which section gives the favourable response.


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## Purple (12 Jul 2007)

homeowner said:


> BMW?  I am in Dublin (unfortunately, it would seem!)



BMW - Border Midlands & West


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## Ms X (12 Jul 2007)

The PDC is a great programme for setting up a business. I know someone on it at the mo and they get access to relevant people from solicitors to investment advisors through monthly training days - it requires you to attend 2 days per month for 12 month. They give you a monthly allowance and use of an office and a shared receptionist for the period. So definitely worth applying for.


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## hhhhhhhhhh (13 Jul 2007)

leghorn said:


> Well you've certainly made my day! I was informed by a woman from EI that it was taxable.
> 
> I'd be most grateful if you could post which section gives the favourable response.



I rang up and they didn't know what it was about after talking to 4 people,I
told them it was a training grant and they just send out the confirmation that 
it was tax free.

Other people where told it was taxable by one person and that it wasn't
by another, just call them tell them its a training grant.

I know 3 classes of hothouse and people from each one got confirmation
that it was tax free.


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