# Fancy an ice cream-is it safe if the vendor doesn't wash their hands?



## super mam (9 Jun 2007)

hi all, 
the kids were waiting for the icecream van to come around... thought i'd google soft ice cream and found this......The hazzards of icecream... hope the link works... we got pizza instead...

[broken link removed]



> A survey carried out by the Food Safety Authority of Ireland (FSAI) on the
> microbiological quality of soft ice-cream, found that considerable improvements
> are required during the handling and serving of soft ice-cream in retail premises.
> Poor practices by the food handler can result in the ice-cream becoming unsafe
> ...


----------



## ClubMan (9 Jun 2007)

*Re: fancy an icecream?*

Do you suspect that your ice cream vendor does not adhere to correct handling procedures or something?


----------



## super mam (9 Jun 2007)

*Re: fancy an icecream?*

club man,could you open the link?  did you read the hazzards of the incorrect handling and possible contamination etc?
When the ice-cream van comes around to our road, it's like a treat for the kids...we que at the van, pay for the ice-cream and run back into the house before the it all melts and runs onto our hands, but I really never looked to see if  the ice cream man washes his hands after handling money?
It's just not something i really thought about before reading about it..( not food and hygene but ice-cream dangers)
thanks


----------



## ClubMan (10 Jun 2007)

*Re: fancy an icecream?*

Generations of kids have eaten ice cream from such vans - I wonder how many got sick afterwards?


----------



## woods (10 Jun 2007)

*Re: fancy an icecream?*

My suggestion
Tell your local store that you will buy any bananas that they want to sell off cheap at the end of the day.
Peel them and put them in plastic bags in the freezer.
When the kids want ice cream just put some in the food processer and you have lovely soft whip banana ice cream.
Add other flavoring if you want. My favourite is wallnut and chocolate.


----------



## ClubMan (11 Jun 2007)

*Re: fancy an icecream?*



woods said:


> When the kids want ice cream just put some in the food processer and you have lovely soft whip banana ice cream.


Surely you have frozen banana mush? It's certainly not ice cream as we know it, _Jim_...


----------



## Thrifty1 (11 Jun 2007)

*Re: fancy an icecream?*

Soft icecreams (Mr Whippy and 99's) are unpasteurised and therefore unsafe for pregnant women.


----------



## bacchus (11 Jun 2007)

*Re: fancy an icecream?*

If you read all the information on the FSAI web-site, you will stop eating and drinking ... and eventually die of thirst and hunger.


----------



## setemupjoe (11 Jun 2007)

I agree bacchus pity they aren't so stringent in the hospital wards with mrsa etc. where people are dieing daily


----------



## ronny78 (11 Jun 2007)

Thrifty1...."_Soft icecreams (Mr Whippy and 99's) are unpasteurised and therefore unsafe for pregnant women."_

Can you back this statement up please ? Looking at that FSAI article listed above it suggests that the products in question are either sterilised or pasteurised or not required to be. Surely if they were unsafe for pregnant women they would also be detrimental to young children ?


----------



## hansov (11 Jun 2007)

*Re: fancy an icecream?*



ClubMan said:


> Generations of kids have eaten ice cream from such vans - I wonder how many got sick afterwards?


 I would have used that argument as well. However I remember Pat Wall, then as CEO of the Food Safety Authority explaining that the bugs around then are not as same as the bugs around now. And the modern bugs have more potential to kill. I also once heard that whipped ice-cream, not kept well or in accordance with food safety procedure's is a potential source of listeria which apparently is very dangerous for pregnant women.


----------



## ClubMan (11 Jun 2007)

*Re: fancy an icecream?*



hansov said:


> I would have used that argument as well. However I remember Pat Wall, then as CEO of the Food Safety Authority explaining that the bugs around then are not as same as the bugs around now. And the modern bugs have more potential to kill. I also once heard that whipped ice-cream, not kept well or in accordance with food safety procedure's is a potential source of listeria which apparently is very dangerous for pregnant women.


Are you sure that he didn't say "hysteria"?


----------



## Dowee (11 Jun 2007)

ronny78 said:


> Thrifty1...."_Soft icecreams (Mr Whippy and 99's) are unpasteurised and therefore unsafe for pregnant women."_
> 
> Can you back this statement up please ? Looking at that FSAI article listed above it suggests that the products in question are either sterilised or pasteurised or not required to be. Surely if they were unsafe for pregnant women they would also be detrimental to young children ?



[broken link removed]


----------



## Trish2006 (11 Jun 2007)

Dowee, 

That link just explains the risks of consuming unpasteurised milk, it doesn't say that your local ice cream van uses unpasteruised milk products.  In fact these days the majority of products that traditionally were made with unpasteurised milk are now made with pasteurised milk.  If you read the labels of many cheeses, e.g. brie, you will see that most of them now say made with pasteurised milk.  Most restaurants now even use pasteurised eggs in their uncooked egg dishes because of the risks.  I'm sure if you asked you'd probably be told that the ice cream mix is pasteurised.
However, as a pregnant woman I'm avoiding mr whippy but only because of the higher risk of contamination of soft whipped ice cream which is, as far as I know, more to do with the difficulty in getting the machines completely clean at the end of every day.


----------



## Alias (11 Jun 2007)

There is a lot of information on the survey that the FSAI did in 2001 on ice cream machines around the country. 
[broken link removed]



> Samples of soft ice cream were tested for levels of aerobic bacteria (aerobic colony count - ACC) and Enterobacteriaceae. These bacteria were chosen as indicators of i) the cleanliness of the machine and ii) the pasteurisation processes in the case of self pasteurising machines.
> A total of 552 samples were examined and of these 51.1% and 6.5% were insatisfactory for ACC and Enterobacteriaceae respecitively.


----------



## ClubMan (11 Jun 2007)

Having so far avoided any adverse impact from _HIV/AIDS, SARS, Ebola, Avian Flu/H5N1, Mad Cow Disease_ etc. I think that, on balance, I'd be happy to take my chances with a 99 from the local ice cream van...


----------



## therave (11 Jun 2007)

don't the vans have to display a current  licence for health and safety to say they are up to date  an been checked over


----------



## Welfarite (11 Jun 2007)

Of course, no matter how clean adn up to scratch(!) the van and man are, there is no guarentee the child's hands are the same. They could run straight from the sand pit in the garden to the ice-cream van......


----------



## glan03 (11 Jun 2007)

_don't the vans have to display a current licence for health and safety to say they are up to date an been checked over_

Unfortunately the Dept. of Health -with the agreement of the FSAI, decided it was a bad idea to have an annual licence for food vans and abolished them. This is apparently a big step forward for food hygiene!!


----------



## Dowee (11 Jun 2007)

Trish2006,
             I was responding to a query about why unpasteurised products are unsafe for pregnant women and children. I didn't mention anything about whether ice cream van (or other) products are pasteurised or not. If you read the quote above my post that should be clear.

and for the record I've often enjoyed a cone from an ice cream van.


----------



## ronny78 (12 Jun 2007)

Actually Dowee, I thought it was fairly clear that I was referencing the products in question, as I did refer to their pasteurised status of the products on the FSAI website link.

Anyway, without specifically checking the product that the local ice cream shop are using then I guess there is room for speculation on their status as pasteurised or not. It just strikes me as very odd that they would be unpasteurised, as I mentioned the risk to young children (who generally seem quite fond of this product) would be similar to that of pregnant women. Anyway perhaps this is off the subject that the OP intended.


----------



## Trish2006 (12 Jun 2007)

apologies Dowee, when I read the quote asking for a link to back up the statement, I assumed it was your statement, didn't notice the reference to thrifty.


----------



## Dowee (12 Jun 2007)

No worries


----------



## Gordanus (12 Jun 2007)

Hysteria or Listeria?

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Mass-Listeria-Theodore-Dalrymple/dp/0233991379


----------



## super mam (12 Jun 2007)

Well theres nothing like a _Healthy_ debate, very intresting reading y'all.
The Ice cream man came around again this evening so I put on my Super Mam's Hat and went out to investigate... had a few questions lined up, but first had a good look inside the van... seemed very clean.. I asked about daily cleaning routines and he was actually very forthcoming. He told me that hygene standards are stringent with all thier vans and staff are reminded daily of them. He said that all remainding ice cream was discarded every evening and the machines were cleaned, something about self cleaning cycle and then  scrubbed and rinsed and filled with a sanitiser solution is to disenfect the machine and then they are rinsed with clean water... sounded good enough for me.. and he was serving at the same time too..( ice cream men can multi-task)..... so we got our 99's and screwballs....
That was a couple of hours ago......so far so good....
feeling ok....
Really....


----------

