# Judgement Mortgage on inherited house



## BGC (11 Jun 2012)

Hi, first time poster!

I've inherited a house and land (there is more land on the original portfolio inherited by my brother) and would like to get a mortgage to do up the house. After speaking to BOI they said an equity release mortgage is the way to go. 
Anyhow, there is a judgement mortgage (circa 35k) on the original portfolio ( ie.  house and land).  The JM is finished in October 2012. Should I wait until then to get the JM removed from my share or is it possible (or worth the hassle) to get the JM removed from my share now? 

Any advice would be greatly appreciated


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## Brendan Burgess (11 Jun 2012)

Should the executor of the estate not have paid the mortgage? It sounds as if it was a liability of the estate? 

Brendan


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## BGC (11 Jun 2012)

There was no will & by law the portfolio was divided divided between us. 
The JM was forced by my mams debt. She offered settlement but was refused & her solicitor told her to sit tight until the 12years have passed. Almost there. Could anything happen at this late stage?


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## BGC (11 Jun 2012)

Brendan, thanks for your quick response. Regarding the ins and outs of the JM, I'm not properly informed of the exact dealings with the original JM. I'd appreciate if anyone could respond to my original question ie should I wait until the 12 years are up (October) or remove the JM from my share now?


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## Brendan Burgess (11 Jun 2012)

Hi BGC

Surely your mother owed this money, whether it's to the bank or whomever, whether it's 12 years old or not?  The executor should have paid off her debts before distributing the assets. 

Am I missing something?


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## BGC (11 Jun 2012)

Apologie Brendan, I haven't been clear enough! 
The original portfolio was spilt between my mam, my brother and I. She is still alive! I wasn't clear about this! Sorry.
Hence, my question about removing JM!


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## Padraigb (11 Jun 2012)

You are missing one thing, Brendan: no will, therefore no executor. But that is relatively unimportant, because there has to be an administrator, and the administrator has to accept responsibility for discharging debts.

It looks to me as if BGC and his or her brother are undertaking a DIY operation without going through all the proper procedures. If that is a correct read, then there are greater impediments to getting a mortgage than an outstanding JM.

What financial institution would lend money to somebody who seems to be attempting to avoid paying an existing loan?

[Post overtaken by BGC's latest clarification: but it still looks like a very messy situation.]


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## BGC (11 Jun 2012)

The previous loan has nothing to do with me, so I'm just trying to clarify what I can do going forward? I've been left a house & I'd like to do it up, the only particulars I know is that there is a JM on all the property and it expires in October. Can I remove the JM from my share? That ultimately is what I'm trying to find out! 
 My mam was given legal advice regarding JM & to see out the 12years.


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## Brendan Burgess (11 Jun 2012)

I am more confused that ever?  Is this correct? 

You and your mother and brother are the joint owners of a house. All three of you own the same house.  It was left to you many years ago and at the time there was no mortgage on it. 

Your mother didn't pay her debts, so the bank got a judgement order against her and registered it against her interest in the house. 

So if you sell the house, your mother's share of the money would first have to be used to pay off her debts.

Brendan


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## BGC (11 Jun 2012)

No, When the land & house was divided, we all got our share each.  It worked out that I got the house & small bit of land. Now this was only done recently (approx 2years ago.). Im 30 now. It was left until then because no-one had wanted to divide the portfolio until then. 
 Should the JM have been forced when the portfolio was divided? I'm now wondering has my Mams solicitor not divided the portfolio yet.


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## BGC (11 Jun 2012)

To clarify, my Dad died 25years ago (no will)


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## Padraigb (11 Jun 2012)

This seems to get messier with each post. You now seem to be telling us that your mother's personal debt was attached to an undistributed asset of your father's estate, and that the distribution seems to involve transferring that asset, burdened with that debt, to you.

I presume that your mother did not discharge the debt.


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## BGC (11 Jun 2012)

No definitely that would not have been her intention. I think we are going to have to speak to her solicitor to clarify this matter. Basically when the estate was divided (if the solicitor has done this at all) the debt should have been kept with my Mams share and not transferred to my share. Is that correct? 

Thank you for your replies, I get the growing sense that my Mams solicitor has not been transparent and I don't have the full details.


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## Padraigb (11 Jun 2012)

If the JM is attached to the house, I can't see how it can be transferred to a different asset (but I have no expertise in the area).

Yes, it does sound as if you need a conversation with the solicitor, including getting an explanation of how the JM was attached to an undistributed asset of your father's estate.


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## BGC (11 Jun 2012)

Thanks for your help. Seems a bit of a mess alright. I just wanna get on with my life & do up the house. 
Regardless of all the issues regarding the distribution of the estate (which will have to sorted properly once and for all), once the JM expires in October can the charge over the house/land be removed?


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## Brendan Burgess (11 Jun 2012)

Hi BGC


> I just wanna get on with my life & do up the house.



You will have to sort out the mess first. Or, at least, clarify it.  

I don't think that anyone can advise you given your description of what happened. If there is a judgement mortgage on this property, it is very unlikely that it is in your name. It must be in your mother's name.

Talk to the solicitor. If you don't understand what they tell you, then go to another solicitor to check that this was all done correctly. 

Brendan


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## BGC (11 Jun 2012)

I've an appointment booked with the solicitor for Wednesday. We'll see where that takes us! Padraig & Brendan thanks for your help!


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## coleman (12 Jun 2012)

MrDerp;1268373 If you have a solicitor that usually rubber stamps conveyance said:
			
		

> Not being sarcastic at all, as it is very messy, but that is very funny....


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## Brendan Burgess (13 Jun 2012)

MrDerp said:


> If this appointment is with a solicitor with whom you consulted on any of the above, then I'd suggest you find a better solicitor.
> 
> You need an expert, as this all sounds very messy. .




It does seem that you need a new solicitor. 

I don't agree that you need an expert. Most competent solicitors should be able to resolve this for you.

The fundamental issue is that the bank was able to put a judgment mortgage on "your" house. This suggests to me that the property is not in your legal name but in your mother's name. She is just telling you that it's yours.  From your description it sounds as if you have misunderstood the story, so the solicitor may well be doing a good job. Even so, it may be advisable for you to get your own solicitor as your interests are different from those of your mother and siblings.

Brendan


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## BGC (13 Jun 2012)

Ok, had the meeting this morning. The house/land is registered in my name now. 
The JM is still registered on it. I saw the document, so it wasn't just what he was telling me.
Following this, the fundamental question I had was how did the JM go on the entire asset. The solicitor informed me that the JM went on the house/land in which my mother had an interest in. As the asset wasn't divided at that stage, the JM was drawn down on all the asset. Is this correct? 
I guess the JM wasnt removed when the asset was divided as this would have been an acknowledgement of the debt, thus prolonging the JM? (The solicitor would have been working in my mothers interests)


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## Padraigb (13 Jun 2012)

I'm curious about one thing: did your brother get his share of the asset unencumbered by the JM, or does it apply severally to all shares of the house and lands?

If your share of the property is burdened, and your brother's is not, I'd be dissatisfied.

Did your mother also get something from the division of the assets?


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## Brendan Burgess (13 Jun 2012)

> As the asset wasn't divided at that stage, the JM was drawn down on all the asset. Is this correct?



It's very strange. Were you left the house years ago when your dad died? 

Or did your mother just transfer the house over to you recently? 

In December the Judgment mortgage should expire. You will need to apply to the Land Registry (?) to have it removed which I understand is a simple enough process.

Brendan


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## BGC (13 Jun 2012)

No all shares are burdened. 
My father died intestate so the law ensures my mother received 2/3, while my brother and I divided 1/3. We decided one person to have the house rather than taking appropriate shares in it. In our view that rendered it worthless to all unless sold or bought out by one person. Hence, I received less land and inherited he house. 
The solicitor implied an affidavit would be signed when the JM expired to remove it from the assets.


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## Padraigb (13 Jun 2012)

It's making more sense to me now. It's all a bit untidy, but if your mother got into a bad financial situation some years ago, some of the messiness is attributable to her.

Given the time frame, it probably makes sense to wait it out until the JM expires. Make sure that the solicitor looks after the removal of the charge at the earliest possible date.


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## BGC (13 Jun 2012)

Once again thanks for your replies. 
Sit tight would seem to be the best course of action at the moment. Hopefully it can be sorted ASAO


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## Bronte (14 Jun 2012)

When your father died he owned a house and land, as there was no will your mother was entitled to 2/3rd and the two children 1/3.  Meanwhile your mother's bank slapped a judgment mortgage on the property/portfolio.  Then a couple of years ago your solicitor divied up the house and land into 3 different 'properties' giving 3 different titles but the judgement mortgage continues on all 3.  Never heard of this, so that would mean that 3 different properties need to wait until the time is up.


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## BGC (14 Jun 2012)

That's correct. As I said I can only assume the JM wasn't removed from any property at the time of division as it would have been an acknowledgement of the debt and could have been enforced when the portfolio was divided.


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## Bronte (15 Jun 2012)

Did you ask your solicitor at the meeting the other day was it an easy process in 4 months time to remove the judgement mortgage?  Also don't see why you cannot wait 4 months to have clear title before investing.


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