# Converting old farm shed to 1 Bed apartment



## random2011 (14 Jun 2017)

Hi all

We have a stone shed sitting idle (lawnmower and other bits kept inside) on our grounds in the countryside. It has a type of galvanized roof which is damp free. Im told its a good roof in terms of material related to keeping water back.  Its relatively large with decent roof space. Can get more specific if needed to answer query but I would like some thoughts on how much a project like this would cost to turn this into a 1 bed apartment.

Some additional information:


Building has 4 doorways existing without actual doors. Simply left open. 2 front/2 back. Think one of these doors would need to be used as a window so would need some modification.
No electrics, no plumbing
Floors are concrete
Building has 1 internal wall turning into a 2 room type building

Building has its own front garden

Building has its own entrance.
Building is close to existing well supply but is not connected

Some questions:


Would a 15k budget simply not be enough to convert this.
Is it best to get a single contractor to do the works or can I save money by getting different contractors to do different works
Any planning permission required?
Any grants available?
Where to start - contact local builder perhaps?


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## Leo (15 Jun 2017)

15k doesn't sound even close to the right ballpark to bring a shed up to the necessary standards to comply with building regs. 
Converting a shed to residential use will required planning. So talk to your LA to get an indication of whether this has any chance of getting approval before spending too much. Depending on location, even if it is permissible, restrictions may be applied that would mean you would not be allowed to rent this out or sell it as a separate dwelling.


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## random2011 (15 Jun 2017)

Thanks Leo for your feedback. Also intention would be to rent it out as a summer home (AIRBNB style) more so than a permanent living residency all year round.


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## newirishman (15 Jun 2017)

random2011 said:


> Thanks Leo for your feedback. Also intention would be to rent it out as a summer home (AIRBNB style) more so than a permanent living residency all year round.



Agreeing with Leo - 15K is not even close to do all this to bring it to a level that you can rent it out, even more so as a holiday home. The intended use as a holiday home requires even more so planning permission than just a granny-flat type use.


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## PaddyBloggit (15 Jun 2017)

I reckon you'd need more like €30k rather than €15k.

You'd be surprised how costs add up. I've done up a 2 bed farmhouse and it swallowed up €100k.


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## Leo (16 Jun 2017)

newirishman said:


> Agreeing with Leo - 15K is not even close to do all this to bring it to a level that you can rent it out, even more so as a holiday home. The intended use as a holiday home requires even more so planning permission than just a granny-flat type use.



The planning restrictions applied to many developments that restrict use to direct family members would mean Airbnb would not be allowed.


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## galway_blow_in (16 Jun 2017)

with the location likely to be inconvenient , you would need to have it especially well finished in order to draw the punters in 

maybe im wrong , is it near a major town ?


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## kceire (17 Jun 2017)

You will not get planning for this as an extension unless it's connected to the main dwelling. 

If you go for planning as a standalone 1 bed unit, it needs to meet all the requirements of a new dwelling, access, parking, private open space, waste water treatment etc

Could cost 100k or more to bring it up to current building regulations.


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## corco2000 (9 Nov 2017)

Random. Did you ever go ahead with this out of intetrst.


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## random2011 (21 May 2019)

Been awhile since posting here but the conversion is back on the agenda. In the meantime we have installed doors and windows and a floor in one of the two rooms. I have a quote from a builder and due a visit from another builder to get a second quote. Does anyone have any opinions on going with single builder versus direct labor. I think it may be cheaper to go direct labour but then I have to source good builders for each piece - plumbing, electrics, plasterers and so on. At the moment I'm seriously considering the single builder approach but our budget will mean it will not be 100% complete - no first/second fix (carpentry), no kitchen, few more additional items. Budget approx 20k-23k


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## Leo (21 May 2019)

If you go with direct labour, the certifications will require a little more thought and planning, make sure you have someone competent in the role of safety officer. 

Direct labour usually works out cheaper, sometimes by quite a margin, where you know enough to foresee potential issues and address them in advance. There are lots of stories on here and elsewhere where issues arise between the different trades, and the client ends up picking up the tab. 

Have you addressed the planning aspects yet? It'd be interesting to hear the LA's response to the proposal.


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## guernseyguy (21 May 2019)

Reading your original post, you asked if there were any grants available? I came across the following which might be of interest:








						GLAS Traditional Farm Buildings Grant Scheme | The Heritage Council
					

Annual grants scheme for the conservation and repair of traditional farm buildings and related structures.




					www.heritagecouncil.ie


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## random2011 (21 May 2019)

guernseyguy said:


> Reading your original post, you asked if there were any grants available? I came across the following which might be of interest:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Thanks, I did look into this previously but I think you have to be a farmer and part of GLAS to qualify.


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## random2011 (21 May 2019)

guernseyguy said:


> Reading your original post, you asked if there were any grants available? I came across the following which might be of interest:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



The builder is saying not to apply for PP as it would be expensive and may not be granted. It would also mean the building has to comply with the highest level of compliance. For what we want his advice is to do the work and the only cert we would get is a C1 BER. This may appear crazy to some but would it suffice. we don't plan on treating this building as a separate property which we could later sell. This will be a modest 1 bed apartment on the existing folio for the purpose of air bnb. I would imagine many have done similar in the past and not gone down the road of PP.


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## dereko1969 (21 May 2019)

Many may have done so but it is illegal and may end up with you being required to demolish it. There may be issues with insurance also.


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## random2011 (21 May 2019)

dereko1969 said:


> Many may have done so but it is illegal and may end up with you being required to demolish it. There may be issues with insurance also.



Does it make a difference that we did not build this from the outset. The walls and roof were in place when we bought the property. This building would have previously been a shed to store cattle. Seems ridiculous that one would have to demolish the building because they made it habitable.


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## dereko1969 (22 May 2019)

Well perhaps not demolish but remove the items - plumbing/wiring/windows that changed its use.


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## Leo (22 May 2019)

random2011 said:


> Does it make a difference that we did not build this from the outset. The walls and roof were in place when we bought the property.



No, what you are doing is 100% illegal. The builder is advising you very badly and I would suspect their motives in doing so. Are they not capable of building to the current standards?


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## Bronte (22 May 2019)

dereko1969 said:


> Many may have done so but it is illegal and may end up with you being required to demolish it. There may be issues with insurance also.


Insurance companies do not require you to have planning permission.  The OP however should inform the insurance company in writiing that he is letting out his 'AirB&B Shed'


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## Bronte (22 May 2019)

random2011 said:


> Does it make a difference that we did not build this from the outset. The walls and roof were in place when we bought the property. This building would have previously been a shed to store cattle. Seems ridiculous that one would have to demolish the building because they made it habitable.


They can't make you demolish an existing structure.  If they discover you in the next decade they could make you convert it back in a shed rather than a dwelling.  And I'd say at a guess pigs will fly faster than your likelyhood of getting PP.


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## Leo (22 May 2019)

Bronte said:


> If they discover you in the next decade they could make you convert it back in a shed rather than a dwelling.



And in the case of a derelict structure even make you remove the roof, doors, windows, etc.


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## Bronte (22 May 2019)

Leo said:


> And in the case of a derelict structure even make you remove the roof, doors, windows, etc.


Not if it's replacement windows, doors and roofs.  And not if they can't prove those weren't replacements of existing decrepid ones.... 

Of course if Google maps have you, then one ought to thread carefully.  It's amazing the detail on Google maps. I can see our entire back garden on it that's not visible from any road.

What's the odds on the OP getting PP?


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## random2011 (22 May 2019)

Bronte said:


> They can't make you demolish an existing structure.  If they discover you in the next decade they could make you convert it back in a shed rather than a dwelling.  And I'd say at a guess pigs will fly faster than your likelyhood of getting PP.


Thanks Bronte, I won't be applying for PP.


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## Leo (22 May 2019)

Bronte said:


> Not if it's replacement windows, doors and roofs.  And not if they can't prove those weren't replacements of existing decrepid ones....



It'd depend on how dilapidated the structure is, it may be obvious on inspection. Given it has a garden, it may even have been used as a dwelling in the past, if that's the case and such use is considered lapsed by the LA, a change of use would also be required to revert back to habitable space.



Bronte said:


> Of course if Google maps have you, then one ought to thread carefully.  It's amazing the detail on Google maps. I can see our entire back garden on it that's not visible from any road.



Yep, and there are other services such as LandViewer which allow you look at satellite imagery and track changes over time.



Bronte said:


> What's the odds on the OP getting PP?



All depends on location and available space, but given the building has its own garden there's every chance it would.


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## Leo (22 May 2019)

random2011 said:


> Thanks Bronte, I won't be applying for PP.



Thread closed - we don't facilitate illegal activity.


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