# UK Reg'd Car loaned to Irish resident



## PetrolHead (25 Jun 2012)

Hi All

To put this question in context, I’m a UK citizen living in Ireland and all my family are still in the UK. 

Due to personal circumstances I need a car for 6 – 12 months and my father has offered to lend me his car for the duration. It is taxed and MOT’d (i.e. road legal) in the UK and I am a named driver on the insurance (although I am already pricing my own cover as named driver isn’t strictly for extended periods such as this). 

My question is related to the view the revenue might take of this situation. 

I’ve read a number of stories of people having their cars confiscated due to not re-registering them here and therefore, not paying the VRT and I’d be a bit concerned they might rock up and demand the keys. 

Where would I stand? Any ideas?


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## lucozade (25 Jun 2012)

I'd reckon without contacting customs that it probably should be re-registered with a Irish plate. Could you get away with it.. Probably yes... My brother did for about 18 months before a Garda pulled him over on the M50 and called his bluff. Been English and with the accent you'd probably get away with it if asked at a checkpoint...


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## peteb (25 Jun 2012)

You may have a problem with your UK insurer.  They may only offer third party cover.


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## Ann1 (25 Jun 2012)

peteb said:


> You may have a problem with your UK insurer.  They may only offer third party cover.


Also I'm not sure you can insure a car you do not own...


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## Slim (26 Jun 2012)

PetrolHead said:


> I’ve read a number of stories of people having their cars confiscated due to not re-registering them here and therefore, not paying the VRT and I’d be a bit concerned they might rock up and demand the keys.
> 
> Where would I stand? Any ideas?


 
I think if you hold a UK driving licence you will get away with it. If you hold an Irish licence, you will be playing Russian roulette but may well get away with it for a few months.


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## mathepac (26 Jun 2012)

The clear issue is that OP is an Irish resident, not a visitor.

As a visitor, Dad's generous offer could work for OP - UK resident with permanent UK address, UK licence, register temporarily as "registered keeper" with DVLA, UK insurance (3rd party is enough) UK registered car with current UK tax & MOT, clean as a whistle once insurer agrees to insure car in Ireland for an extended period (otherwise take the ferry every few weeks if needed).

As OP is Irish resident with Irish job (?) and address, it all falls apart IMHO. I mean falls apart big-time with serious repercussions - none of the "sure chance it, you'll be grand" nonsense; it's breaking the law.


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## ang1170 (26 Jun 2012)

According to Revenue:  

"VRT law provides for a limited relief from the payment of the tax in certain specified circumstances. Examples of such circumstances are-

an EC Member State resident living/working in Ireland is entitled to bring their unregistered vehicle into Ireland for a maximum period of 12 months (which may be extended on application to the Revenue Commissioners),
a State resident employed by an employer based outside the State (e.g. Northern Ireland) may, on application to Revenue, be entitled to drive (in the State) a foreign registered company vehicle provided as part of a contract of employment,
tourists are entitled to drive their vehicles here without incurring any VRT liability"
It sounds like the OP may fall into the 1st category.

If this is the case, I'd advise them to contact Revenue and get them to confirm in writing that it is OK for them not to re-register, and keep this with the car in case they are stopped.


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## mathepac (26 Jun 2012)

ang1170 said:


> ... It sounds like the OP may fall into the 1st category.
> 
> If this is the case, I'd advise them to contact Revenue and get them to confirm in writing that it is OK for them not to re-register, and keep this with the car in case they are stopped.


OP does clearly *not* fall into this category. To qualify the car must have been in the OP's owner-ship for at least 6 months (IIRC) *prior* to relocating to Ireland.

OP wants to import/insure/use a car s/he does not currently own, or whose V5c details are only changed into his/her name *after* moving, meaning VRT etc falls due on importation.

Can't work I'm afraid.


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## ang1170 (27 Jun 2012)

mathepac said:


> OP does clearly *not* fall into this category. To qualify the car must have been in the OP's owner-ship for at least 6 months (IIRC) *prior* to relocating to Ireland.


 
Er, which part of "an EC Member State resident living/working in Ireland is entitled to bring their unregistered vehicle into Ireland for a maximum period of 12 months (which may be extended on application to the Revenue Commissioners)" does the OP not meet? It is likely they may have to transfer ownership ("their...vehicle") but that's about it. They'd probably have to do this to arrange insurance in any case. The 6 month ownership criteria only applies to people actually importing the car permanently, which isn't the case here.

As I said, best to contact Revenue and get their opinion, but from what the OP says, they should fall into the category of a temporary import rather than an exemption of VRT for change of residence: the two are quite different with different criteria. In more detail:


"Any imported vehicle which is owned by or registered in the name of a non-resident person is not required to be registered in Ireland subject to the following conditions:

The vehicle must have been acquired with all the appropriate taxes paid and these must not have been exempted or refunded in any way. The standard registration plates in use in the domestic market of a country are normally accepted as evidence of this.
The vehicle may not in any circumstances be driven by a State resident.
The vehicle may not be disposed of or hired out in the State or lent to a State resident.
The period of time that the vehicle is in the State does not exceed 12 months.
A longer period may apply where a person is on a task of definite duration in the State"


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## jhegarty (27 Jun 2012)

ang1170 said:


> Er, which part of "an EC Member State resident living/working in Ireland is entitled to bring their unregistered vehicle into Ireland for a maximum period of 12 months




The op is an Irish resident.


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## mathepac (27 Jun 2012)

ang1170 said:


> ...
> "Any imported vehicle which is owned by or registered in the name of a non-resident person is not required to be registered in Ireland subject to the following conditions:
> 
> The vehicle must have been acquired with all the appropriate taxes paid and these must not have been exempted or refunded in any way. The standard registration plates in use in the domestic market of a country are normally accepted as evidence of this.
> ...


As @jhegarty above. Your quoted document is very clear.


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## PetrolHead (27 Jun 2012)

Thanks for all the replies… nice to see I’ve generated a bit of debate… 

Just to clarify a few points. 

First, insurance isn’t an issue. The registered owner makes no difference when it comes to taking out a policy as it’s the driver that’s covered rather than the car. Also, the use of the vehicle in Ireland isn’t an issue with a UK policy as most now cover use in ROI as part of a standard policy (some even cover whole of EU).

I know this point hasn’t been raised but just in case it’s crossed anybody’s mind… I’m not looking to evade VRT, rather, I’m looking to avoid purchasing a car. There’s a perfectly good one sitting (relatively) idle in the UK but it would need to go back there when I’m done with it. As such, re-reg’ing here is not really an option. 

To answer one point that has been raised… Although I’m a UK citizen, I am an Irish resident and not just here for a ‘definite task’. 

I did wonder should I just chance it but the significant drop in foreign reg cars on the roads suggests this to be folly. I might write to the revenue and ask for clarification but I think I know the standard answer I would get. 

If anyone else has any advice on possible ‘loopholes’ (and unfortunate term I know, but I couldn’t think of better) I’d really appreciate it.


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## mathepac (27 Jun 2012)

The bottom line IMHO seems to be  that using you Dad's  car here without re-registering it , puts you in pretty much the same position as any other Irish resident who bought a car at auction in the UK and didn't do all the re-reg stuff.

Sorry, but yes I've noticed the steep decline in UK-registered cars on the roads, so breaking the law is not worth the risk.


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## ang1170 (27 Jun 2012)

PetrolHead said:


> To answer one point that has been raised… Although I’m a UK citizen, I am an Irish resident and not just here for a ‘definite task’.
> 
> I did wonder should I just chance it but the significant drop in foreign reg cars on the roads suggests this to be folly. I might write to the revenue and ask for clarification but I think I know the standard answer I would get.
> 
> If anyone else has any advice on possible ‘loopholes’ (and unfortunate term I know, but I couldn’t think of better) I’d really appreciate it.


 
I don't think there is. I took your original comments "I’m a UK citizen living in Ireland" and "all my family are still in the UK" that you were here temporarily. If you’ve been here a while and intend to stay, then you can hardly claim that exemption from having to re-register.

If you do re-register, you have to pay VRT unless you are changing residence, when you must have owned the car for 6 months prior to moving.

In short, I don’t think there is any option that doesn’t involve re-registering and paying the VRT. As there’s currently no refund for a re-export (there has been talk of this), this doesn’t seem to make sense.

If you choose to just drive the car regardless, you stand a good chance of having it confiscated.


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## PetrolHead (27 Jun 2012)

Thanks for all the responses... 

Looks like I'll be digging through the bangers section on donedeal then...


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## lilyglen (28 Feb 2013)

Depending on the value of the car. it maybe cheaper for you to check out the vrt calculator see how much it will cost you to vrt it. then at the end of its time here simply return it to the uk you will still use the same uk reg when you return it. the uk do not charge you vrt to reimport your car to the uk.


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## Leo (28 Feb 2013)

lilyglen said:


> Depending on the value of the car. it maybe cheaper for you to check out the vrt calculator see how much it will cost you to vrt it. then at the end of its time here simply return it to the uk you will still use the same uk reg when you return it. the uk do not charge you vrt to reimport your car to the uk.


 
8 months on, I hope they're sorted by now. 

Won't there be paperwork involved in bringing it back to the UK?


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