# Concerned about GAA run local lotteries



## mercman (1 Nov 2008)

There have been and there are some serious questions being asked about some of the GAA Lottos around the country.

Who is running same? Who is administering them? Are accounts ever kept and shown? Personally I would prefer to play Russian Roulette.


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## ubiquitous (1 Nov 2008)

*Re: Local Lotto's Prices*



mercman said:


> There have been and there are some serious questions being asked about some of the GAA Lottos around the country. Who is running same ? who is administering them ? Are accounts ever kept and shown ??



Why pick on the GAA? At least, all GAA clubs must compile annual accounts and submit them to their county boards, who in turn must submit them to the central authorities in Croke Park. The accounts of all county boards and of the various Croke Park-based organisations are each subject to annual audit by independent auditors. The same cannot be said for many of the other voluntary bodies, charities, community councils, etc that run lottos up and down the country.


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## birdy (2 Nov 2008)

*Re: Local Lotto's Prices*



mercman said:


> There have been and there are some serious questions being asked about some of the GAA Lottos around the country. Who is running same ? who is administering them ? Are accounts ever kept and shown ?? Personally I would prefer to play Russian Roulette


 
Just from observing the amount of work my brother puts in, there seems to be a hugh amount of accountability. The lotto account is seperate to main club account, and the accounts are available for all at the AGM. It was set up for floodlights, and they have arrived, now the club are aiming for something else, new dressing rooms i think


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## bond-007 (2 Nov 2008)

*Re: Local Lotto's Prices*



ubiquitous said:


> Why pick on the GAA? At least, all GAA clubs must compile annual accounts and submit them to their county boards, who in turn must submit them to the central authorities in Croke Park. The accounts of all county boards and of the various Croke Park-based organisations are each subject to annual audit by independent auditors. The same cannot be said for many of the other voluntary bodies, charities, community councils, etc that run lottos up and down the country.


Can these accounts be inspected?


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## bond-007 (2 Nov 2008)

*Re: Local Lotto's Prices*



mercman said:


> There have been and there are some serious questions being asked about some of the GAA Lottos around the country. Who is running same ? who is administering them ? Are accounts ever kept and shown ?? Personally I would prefer to play Russian Roulette


The problem there is no set way in law laid down about how these things should be conducted and run. Should a member of the Gardaí be in attendance. I know of one local lotto where the numbers are drawn in secret.


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## mercman (2 Nov 2008)

*Re: Local Lotto's Prices*

Who is accountable in the GAA for this. I know of at least one GAA Lotto where the accounts were never evident. When questions were asked the records were destroyed and after the complaints been passed up the line they were buried.


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## bond-007 (2 Nov 2008)

*Re: Local Lotto's Prices*



> Who is accountable in the GAA for this.


Who knows?
The GAA has to be one of the most secretive organisations in the country. I don't think they publish accounts.


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## mercman (2 Nov 2008)

*Re: Local Lotto's Prices*

And even if they did who would or could believe them. The Top levels are a real case of 'jobs for the boys'.


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## mercman (3 Nov 2008)

*Re: Local Lotto's Prices*

Good point Flexible. I wonder do the GAA go through the same procedure of applying nationally for their local Lottos ?? Heaven forbid somebody or anybody should question this. And don't get me wrong I enjoy GAA (hurling and football), but am aware of what might be called financial inadequacies in Local areas for which nothing has been done although the Powers to be are fully aware.


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## ubiquitous (3 Nov 2008)

*Re: Local Lotto's Prices*



ajapale said:


> OK,
> 
> If posters want to discuss the GAA they can open a thread in LOS or better still over on boards.ie!
> 
> Keep this thread to discuss the relative value and operation of Local Lottos.



Problem is that maybe half of all local lottos operated in Ireland are run by GAA clubs. Its impossible to discuss them in isolation without discussing the GAA. A bit like trying to discuss the phenomenon of chugging without discussing charities.

Fwiw, local club accounts are accessible to all members, and by rule, must be presented to members at AGM. Ditto County Board accounts. Central accounts for the national organisation and its affiliates are on the public record and are normally accessible on gaa.ie

Contrary to one allegation above, there is indeed a legal framework "set way in law laid down about how these things should be conducted and run". All lottos must have an up-to-date court permit, signed by a Garda of a certain senior rank. Permits are renewable annually and may be withdrawn in the event of objections or complaints arising.

Btw, locallotto.ie is merely a marketing system that small sports clubs and other organisations can use to sell their lotto tickets to members online.



mercman said:


> Who is accountable in the GAA for this. I know of at least one GAA Lotto where the accounts were never evident. When questions were asked the records were destroyed and after the complaints been passed up the line they were buried.


There have been Garda investigations and indeed successful criminal prosecutions arising from such cases. If you have evidence that any complaints of this nature "were buried" you should notify both the Gardai and the authorities in Croke Park.


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## mercman (3 Nov 2008)

*Re: Local Lotto's Prices*

I would dearly love to. Problem is that I do not have time for my own funeral at the moment.


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## ubiquitous (3 Nov 2008)

*Re: Local Lotto's Prices*

I am sure a delay of few weeks shouldn't make much difference. Where there is financial impropriety or fraud, its important that it is addressed.


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## mercman (3 Nov 2008)

*Re: Local Lotto's Prices*

This is the GAA we're talking about.


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## ajapale (3 Nov 2008)

This thread is split from another about about Local Lotteries.


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## nai (4 Nov 2008)

so mercman - you're making some veiled allegations about the GAA, lottos, financial irregularities and a Wink Wink mentality on a public forum where it's easy to make allegations without proof but you won't take time to report any irregularities to either the Gardai or the GAA - well done you.  

I'm sure all the members of the GAA clubs that run these lottos at members own time and expense as well as the people that support them are very thankful for people like you. Don't you think they would prefer that any misappropriation or whatever is investigated and stopped rather than supplementing whatever dodgy practice you're aware of ?


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## mercman (4 Nov 2008)

It's not the dodgy practice I am aware of. It is common knowledge in the area concerned. Whilst the Lotto has been taken away from the person concerned there were never any records kept for years - common knowledge again. Its not make believe, it is that I am not involved with the GAA and have no intention of becoming involved.


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## ubiquitous (4 Nov 2008)

The term "put up or..." never seemed so apt.


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## jhegarty (4 Nov 2008)

who fiddle a lotto , it's a license to print money anyway....


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## Henny Penny (5 Nov 2008)

As far as I'm aware the club must apply for a lottery licence to operate this type of lottery. There was a case in my neck of the woods recently where a club (not GAA) was applying for a licence - the case was adjourned because somebody objected - the objector claimed he should have won the lotto when his numbers came up$ but was not given prize. His objection was to the lack of paper trail ... envelopes going missing etc.


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## ubiquitous (5 Nov 2008)

bond-007 said:


> Who knows?
> The GAA has to be one of the most secretive organisations in the country. I don't think they publish accounts.





mercman said:


> And even if they did who would or could believe them.



[broken link removed]



> Published Accounts Award nominees named
> 
> 10:42:39 AM
> 
> ...




GAA Annual Report for 2008, including full, audited accounts for 2007, can be accessed here: http://www.gaa.ie/page/official_reports.html


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## Ron Burgundy (5 Nov 2008)

Henny Penny said:


> As far as I'm aware the club must apply for a lottery licence to operate this type of lottery. There was a case in my neck of the woods recently where a club (not GAA) was applying for a licence - the case was adjourned because somebody objected - the objector claimed he should have won the lotto when his numbers came up$ but was not given prize. His objection was to the lack of paper trail ... envelopes going missing etc.


 
Henny will you be going to a certain match on Nov 21 by any chance ???


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## DeclanP (8 Nov 2008)

Have to share the suspicions of mercman. The GAA club lotto is so fraught with danger that it is unreal. There are people going around every Friday and Saturday night selling club lotto envelopes, pocketing the money, not giving receipts of the numbers chosen and basically catching people out when they are most vulnerable — when they have drink taken. It is going on all over the country and there is no accountability and no paper trail. If you win, it is pot luck; if you don't, you don't know the difference anyway. Not saying all clubs are scamming but I know those acting on behalf of clubs who are more than dubious.


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## ubiquitous (9 Nov 2008)

DeclanP said:


> there is no accountability and no paper trail.



This is patently untrue, as demonstrated clearly above. Don't bother posting on discussion threads if you're not going to bother reading the actual discussion.


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## Complainer (9 Nov 2008)

mercman said:


> It's not the dodgy practice I am aware of. It is common knowledge in the area concerned. Whilst the Lotto has been taken away from the person concerned there were never any records kept for years - common knowledge again. Its not make believe, it is that I am not involved with the GAA and have no intention of becoming involved.


If you're not involved, perhaps there is accountability at meetings/AGMs that you are not aware of?


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## mercman (9 Nov 2008)

Complainer said:


> If you're not involved, perhaps there is accountability at meetings/AGMs that you are not aware of?



The particular instance I was quoting was a few years ago. At the time many questions were asked but answered with threats. In the same club the Lotto Jackpot was held but was depicted as no winner, when a certain individual came forward the following day with a winning ticket. After much foray he was given his prize but to date has not been invited to buy another ticket. Can or could do nothing about it as one of the big wigs of the GAA is involved. The GAA have done enormous work for the youth of Ireland, but fail miserably outside these parameters.


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## ubiquitous (9 Nov 2008)

mercman said:


> to date has not been invited to buy another ticket. Can or could do nothing about it


Is this a problem for him? If so, surely he can buy a ticket in a local pub or shop, where such tickets are generally sold.

I don't see the point of your reference to "one of the big wigs of the GAA". Nobody is above the law, least of all those with a duty of care towards other people's money. Remember the case of the senior Waterford GAA official who was subjected to Garda investigation last year amidst allegations of a financial shortfall - a case that ended tragically.


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