# Cheap extension -too good to be true ?



## laois1 (7 Feb 2014)

Hi. A family member has recently gotten a quotation for an extension onto the back of her house. She has a 4 bed semi and wants to build an extra room onto the dining area of her existing kitchen /diner for the kids as a living room space for them. It will only extend out 16 feet and be 12 feet wide. She is not planning on extending her kitchen. Anyway a neighbour has recently had a larger extension done by a builder and she got a quote of 10 k for this room.  It sounds very cheap ? There was no drawing or spec provided but she is thinking of going ahead. I am worried that he may use very cheap materials and poor insulation to achieve such a low cost. It is a cash price, I believe. Is it advisable to proceed without even a drawing or list of specs ? Any advice welcome.


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## emeralds (7 Feb 2014)

No it is totally unadvisable in my opinion.


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## peno (7 Feb 2014)

16 * 12 = 192 square foot.
I recently got various quotes on extensions and the guide is about 100 per sq ft so in this case 19k. Now I think you obviously can get better deals but this strikes me as too good especially as no drawings or specs etc. 
You get what you pay for.


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## laois1 (7 Feb 2014)

Thanks. Should she first go to an architect even for something so straightforward ? She doesn't see the point as its only a box shaped room. The same builder has recently completed an extension across the full width of the house ie extending kitchen and diner probably double what was quoted for above for 17 k. Again a cash price. She plans to go look at the job this week. Surely it will be hard to pick faults at this stage when you haven't seen the block work etc. any advice on what to look out for ? Or do next eg architect etc and how much would architect drawings cost ?


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## Dr.Debt (7 Feb 2014)

I think 10K is an ok price for this job especially if its  a cash price.

She will need to pay attention to the foundations, the insulation and the roof.
In my opinion she should hire an engineer to discuss the job with the builder in advance and then hire the engineer to supervise the job to ensure that it is built properly and complies with building regulations.


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## Gerry Canning (7 Feb 2014)

Laois1. 

If Mr Builder is ok , he will be delighted to give you referrals from satisfied customers.Preferably from work that has been done a couple of years ,ie any issues will have shown.
On the subject of (cheap) , a straight square type room without anything fancy can be done at a good price.


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## monagt (7 Feb 2014)

> referrals from satisfied customers.


+1


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## Guns N Roses (7 Feb 2014)

Stay away from anyone quoting cash prices for major house renovations as you will have absolutely no comeback if there is a problem after the work is completed.

Also don't forget about your responsilbilities as a Home owner having Construction work done in your home under the Safety, Health & Welfare at Work (Construction) Regulations 2013.

http://www.hsa.ie/eng/Publications_and_Forms/Publications/Construction/Guide_for_Homeowners.html


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## laois1 (7 Feb 2014)

Thank you for the helpful points. I had no idea that the hsa has guidelines for this type of work. The job is in the kildare area. I note the suggestion of an engineer. I had only thought of an architect but as you said maybe an architect is not necessary for such a simple extension. Is it a structural engineer that we should be looking for ? I will take on board the comments about cash work and no comeback.


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## MM3 (10 Feb 2014)

FYI we recently got quotes for a 28m2 extension with a flat roof (fibreglass) including steel RSJ and 3 large velux windows.  The cheapest quote was 40K inc VAT but excluding glazing, kitchen,flooring and decoration.

M


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## PaddyBloggit (10 Feb 2014)

Have a read (from Revenue): 
Home Renovation Incentive (HRI) scheme

And another read (from HSA):
Safety Health and Welfare at Work (Construction) Regulations 2013 (SI 291)

Read the HSA Guidelines - lots of new regulations re. building works at home now. 

The Revenue link is to the Home Improvement Scheme where you can get some tax/VAT refunded.


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## Bronte (11 Feb 2014)

I'm not going to comment on the price, and I don't think you need an architect, but you do need to see what work this builder has done for others and that's how you judge him.  You also need to know what he is going to do for the price and if what it includes.


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## laois1 (11 Feb 2014)

Thank you for all the comments. They intend to get a drawing done and a detailed list of what's included. The neighbour using the same builder is happy with the work so far but they will be looking at other jobs before they give the go ahead.


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## Centaur (11 Feb 2014)

An architect or engineer is essential.  We put on an extension last year and the architect was brilliant and saved us a lot of money as well as coming up with a much more practical solution than we had in mind (and gave us a very good price for his own work on top of that - its a buyers market).  He did a spec and got quotes from three builders for us and helped us compare like with like - we got to know all about "PC" sums!


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## laois1 (14 Feb 2014)

How can I convince her that an architect/engineer is essential. Initially the builder could not do it until the summer, now suddenly he is available in 3 weeks. She says I'm daft to suggest a drawing? I know at this price this guy is cutting corners somewhere. I know a drawing is essential here, otherwise no comebacks. the fact that there will be no receipt is also dodgy in my opinion. They seem intent on letting him go ahead. What are the very basics to ask with respect to floor, walls and roof ??  I presume they dont need planning as its only 16 x 12 feet. who certifies the building afterwards ? Many thanks.


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## emeralds (14 Feb 2014)

laois1 said:


> How can I convince her that an architect/engineer is essential. Initially the builder could not do it until the summer, now suddenly he is available in 3 weeks. She says I'm daft to suggest a drawing? I know at this price this guy is cutting corners somewhere. I know a drawing is essential here, otherwise no comebacks. the fact that there will be no receipt is also dodgy in my opinion. They seem intent on letting him go ahead. What are the very basics to ask with respect to floor, walls and roof ??  I presume they dont need planning as its only 16 x 12 feet. who certifies the building afterwards ? Many thanks.



An engineer/architect with current Professional Indemnity Insurance will be needed if she wants it certified. Which means that the engineer/architect will have to have some involvement during the planning/building.


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## laois1 (14 Feb 2014)

Excuse my ignorance but is it the architect that definitely issues the cert. I assume the builder definitely cannot do this ? Another suggestion I heard was to get a QS to do the drawing ? A good suggestion or not ??


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## emeralds (14 Feb 2014)

Have a read of this.
http://blog.tradesmen.ie/2012/04/certifying-my-building-or-renovation/


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## niceoneted (14 Feb 2014)

I would say at this stage just don't discuss the extension with her. If or when things go wrong don't be around to listen to the fallout. You have obtained very good advice here and I'm sure passed it on, it's not being taken on board. If its a sister I have one the same so I make. Point of not advising her any more. If she asks for any I just say do wha you feel or believe to be best!


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## Docarch (15 Feb 2014)

laois1 said:


> I assume the builder definitely cannot do this?


 
Correct.  A builder is not qualified to sign off.


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## laois1 (15 Feb 2014)

Many thanks folks. Have passed on all advice received. Will also take advice to shut up now and walk away as I don't think I'm being listened to ! Thanks again


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## BoscoTalking (25 Feb 2014)

I know I'm coming in late here however i'ed like to leave yet another warning. We went with the cheapest quote, got contract and drawings and yes building turned out to be too good to be true and the job has been completed but there are snags left untied up, sub contractors knocking on our door looking for payment and our builder looking for outrageous extras which he says we agreed to when we didn't. its a nightmare that you can do without. Get your contract even for something like a 10/20k build and pay an engineer if you are doing anything that if it goes wrong will render your house damaged.


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