# "Southern Ireland"



## BillK (28 Jan 2007)

Am I the only one to be pissed off when people refer to the Republic of Ireland by the above name?
The latest example was in Niall Ferguson's column in today's Sunday Telegraph - as a Professor of History at Harvard University one would have thought that he would know better.


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## GeneralZod (28 Jan 2007)

I've no problem with the term myself as it's logically derived from the name Northern Ireland as a complementary way for distinguishing the two entities. IMO people that say it generally aren't trying to make a political point.


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## ajapale (28 Jan 2007)

Im from "Western Ireland" myself.


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## MugsGame (28 Jan 2007)

I was born on 'the mainland'!


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## ClubMan (28 Jan 2007)

I don't like _Dublin _being tarred with the same brush as other areas under this "Southern Ireland" sobriquet.


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## lorna (28 Jan 2007)

when i post letters from london to ireland, the PO guy always says "north or south love !"  i have never used "republic".


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## ClubMan (28 Jan 2007)

A friend of mine who use to be a member of _SF _always insisted on addressing his letters to me from _London _with "Irish Free State".


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## micamaca (28 Jan 2007)

Have sometimes used Republic of Ireland. Mainly I just put Ireland on a postcard. Have never even thought of using Southern Ireland.  

Posting to the Irish Free State from London...love it!


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## GeneralZod (28 Jan 2007)

I always use just Ireland. Although when I was a kid it was Ireland, Europe, Planet Earth, Solar System, Milky Way Galaxy..

My sister lives in the "Capital of the Empire" on the "mainland" and stops writing the address after the Irish county.


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## rabbit (29 Jan 2007)

GeneralZod said:


> I've no problem with the term myself as it's logically derived from the name Northern Ireland as a complementary way for distinguishing the two entities. IMO people that say it generally aren't trying to make a political point.


 
agreed and well said..


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## liteweight (29 Jan 2007)

I always put Eire...thought everyone did!


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## almo (29 Jan 2007)

From abroad I always put Ireland, never a problem.  Years ago I was accused of being from the Free State when playing hurling in Armagh.  It was a regular thing, and pretty hard to respond to playfully when there's a couple hundred knuckledraggers howling it behind the goals.  Oh we are such a fabulous brotherhood!


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## Purple (29 Jan 2007)

liteweight said:


> I always put Eire...thought everyone did!


Always find Eire has a derogatory connotation when used by people from Britian. It could just be my insecurity though.
I just write "Ireland" when posting from abroad or gving my address in a hotel etc.


ClubMan said:


> A friend of mine who use to be a member of _SF _always insisted on addressing his letters to me from _London _with "Irish Free State".


 Did anyone ever write "Occupied Ireland" when posting to the Northern Ireland?


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## Newby (29 Jan 2007)

I've noticed in legal documents they refer to some of the legislation as being "of Ireland". I've always written Ireland myself abouthte country and in reference to where I'm from I've always used "the West" 

Have used the Europe, Planet Earth, Milky Way one in the past too!


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## micamaca (29 Jan 2007)

Would like to use Eire more often myself but am worried post would never arrive. I think Eire has a nice oirish ring to it!


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## GeneralZod (29 Jan 2007)

Purple said:


> Did anyone ever write "Occupied Ireland" when posting to the Northern Ireland?



Isn't all of Ireland occupied?


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## redstar (29 Jan 2007)

Must be really confusing for Donegal - being in the north of the Island of Ireland and also in "Southern Ireland" !!      

I usually use "Ireland" or "Republic of Ireland".


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## Purple (29 Jan 2007)

GeneralZod said:


> Isn't all of Ireland occupied?



Yes, your right. Well done


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## annR (29 Jan 2007)

It is confusing for us Donegalians  - foreigners always get confused on this.

I always put Republic of Ireland, just always have done.  I suppose it's the correct term for 'Southern Ireland'.



> Always find Eire has a derogatory connotation when used by people from Britian.


 
I find it irritating as I don't understand why they call it that . . .they're speaking English after all!  Never found it derogatory just annoying.


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## GeneralZod (29 Jan 2007)

annR said:


> I find it irritating as I don't understand why they call it that . . .they're speaking English after all!  Never found it derogatory just annoying.



They still call the EU the EEC half the time.

They're just very slow to change. Lots of them still wouldn't know what the constitutional position with Ireland is. Same as I couldn't speak with certainty on what Monaco's position is. 

The Eire thing is half our fault too isn't it because at one stage "we" wanted them to use it.


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## ubiquitous (29 Jan 2007)

What do we expect when we still print "Eire" on our postage stamps?


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## ClubMan (29 Jan 2007)

Purple said:


> Always find Eire has a derogatory connotation when used by people from Britian. It could just be my insecurity though.


Or your lack of constitutional knowledge... 

Bunreacht na hÉireann:


> *Article 4*
> 
> The name of the State is Éire, or, in the English language, Ireland.
> 
> ...


 So _"Éire"_ would seem to be more correct than _"Ireland"_ or any other variation on the same theme.


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## Newby (29 Jan 2007)

ClubMan said:


> So _"Éire"_ would seem to be more correct than _"Ireland"_ or any other variation on the same theme.


 
So would an www.askaboutmoney.com website in Irish ([broken link removed] perhaps) be more correct than the english language version.


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## Purple (29 Jan 2007)

ClubMan said:


> Or your lack of constitutional knowledge...
> 
> Bunreacht na hÉireann:
> So _"Éire"_ would seem to be more correct than _"Ireland"_ or any other variation on the same theme.


I'm aware of the constitutional position, it's just when it's used by someone from England who is speaking English it sounds wrong... as I said, it's probably me reading something into it, not them meaning offence.


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## ClubMan (29 Jan 2007)

Purple said:


> I'm aware of the constitutional position, it's just when it's used by someone from England who is speaking English it sounds wrong...


No are you sure that you mean _England _and not (_Great) Britain _or _UK_?


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## ClubMan (29 Jan 2007)

Newby said:


> So would an www.askaboutmoney.com website in Irish ([broken link removed] perhaps) be more correct than the english language version.


No idea. I'm only fluent in the second language I'm afraid.


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## ubiquitous (29 Jan 2007)

Newby said:


> So would an www.askaboutmoney.com website in Irish ([broken link removed] perhaps) be more correct than the english language version.



Perhaps, if www.caintfaoiairgead.com was the official name of this site which is patently not the case.


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## almo (29 Jan 2007)

Does anybody remember when Ali G pulled the proverbial out of folks in Northern Ireland?  When, I think it was Paisley Jr, one header said he was "British" Ali asked "So is you here on holidays then?"  Technically he has a point, it is Great Britain and Northen Ireland at the Olympics.  

One, slightly off topic but directionally focussed all the same, point is that has anyone experienced in their travels (I have it all the time) people form certain parts of Europe labelling folks as being from "the west", some ideal notion of people within the EU, but Czechs Slovaks and Hungarians still use this term for Irish, Germans etc, and even Americans.  Yet when I was in the MIddle East, if you had white skin and were from Europe or the Americas, you were a "westerner".  What I'd like to know is, if anyone can help, what are western and eastern values.  For me eastern is China, Japan, India, west are the Americas, Europe, Russia.  Middle East is Middle East, Africa Africa and Oceania best forgotten (joke).  Who are we?


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## Betsy Og (29 Jan 2007)

ubiquitous said:


> Perhaps, if [broken link removed] was the official name of this site which is patently not the case.


 
Wouldnt it be ceistfaoiairgead?


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## Purple (29 Jan 2007)

ClubMan said:


> No are you sure that you mean _England _and not (_Great) Britain _or _UK_?


 I mean England. Somehow it sounds worse with an English accent. 
Northern Ireland is part of the UK but is not British, something I like to remind Unionist friends about when the slagging starts.


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## ajapale (29 Jan 2007)

I dont address letters to Finland "Suomi" and I dont address letters to Germany "Deutschland".


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## rabbit (29 Jan 2007)

GeneralZod said:


> The Eire thing is half our fault too isn't it because at one stage "we" wanted them to use it.


 
It was on our stamps etc.  Even during the war I think " we" painted " Eire" on our few merchant ships to show their neutrality.


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## rabbit (29 Jan 2007)

Purple said:


> Northern Ireland is part of the UK but is not British, something I like to remind Unionist friends about when the slagging starts.


 
Our unionist friends in N. I. could point out that these islands used ( at least ) to be called the British isles, and geographically many around the world still call these islands that.   They can argue that N. Ireland never stopped being part of the British isles, and that they are British.

The Canary islands are under Spanish rule even though they are not in Spain - they are of course much closer to Africa than Spain.

Hawaii is part of the US but it is not in America either, geographically speaking.


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## Guest127 (29 Jan 2007)

in football terms the nothern ireland soccer team are usually referred to as Ireland on british tv and the team from 'eire' are usually called the republick of ireland. if you check your cupboards and look at foodstuff ie kelloggs there will be a phone line in case of complaint and it will always be ROI. same with loads of daily foodstuffs. another one the puzzles me is the 'Czech Replublic' never just Czech. you never hear anybody saying ' italian republic or portugese republic. and agree with almo. depends on where you are. pope Bendict apparantly said once that Turkey was in Asia and not europe but how many would agree with that. geographically its in both of course but where do most of use think it is? I just use ireland on post and when ordering stuff abroad. if they require a post code I just stick in a few xxx's and never had any problem. then again if a mobile number is compulsary I just use 0987654321 and never had any problems either.


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## Gordanus (29 Jan 2007)

Don't Finnish stamps have Suomi on them, and German stamps Deutschland?

(Tried the mulitquote, failed miserably)


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## ClubMan (29 Jan 2007)

cuchulainn said:


> and the team from 'eire' are usually called the republick of ireland.


That's because we are affiliated to _UEFA _and _FIFA _under that name - and not _Ireland _or _Eire_.


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## ClubMan (29 Jan 2007)

Gordanus said:


> (Tried the mulitquote, failed miserably)


Click on the little  image on as many posts as you want to quote and then just click the  button on the last one and you should get a message composition window containing all of the selected messages with quote tags around their contents. You can then edit at will and intersperse the quoted posts with your own comments. Don't blame me if some sensitive souls accuse you of being a pedantic nitpicker in replying to posts in this way though!


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## TarfHead (29 Jan 2007)

redstar said:


> Must be really confusing for Donegal - being in the north of the Island of Ireland and also in "Southern Ireland"



It's not just me so - the use of 'The South' really gets on my nerves.

Last Summer in Culdaff, a village in Donegal that is geographically more northerly (_I made that bit up_) that most of Norn Iron, there were Nordies referring to it as The South. Only that I was their guest I would have rounded on them.

An English colleague who lives in Greystones once received an unsolicited letter from Cablelink addressed to The Occupier. He arrived into work the next day brandishing the letter saying "_Would you people ever get over it !_"


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## rabbit (30 Jan 2007)

TarfHead said:


> Last Summer in Culdaff, a village in Donegal that is geographically more northerly (_I made that bit up_) that most of Norn Iron, there were Nordies referring to it as The South. Only that I was their guest I would have rounded on them.


 
I know of people in central Europe who had the same experiences in the days when more people there refered to "The West"   and "The East".


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## liteweight (30 Jan 2007)

I've never minded the British saying Eire, don't take anything out of it. What I do mind is being asked when I intend visiting the 'mainland' again as they'd all love to see me. One person who constantly says it is the daughter of a very good (British) friend of mine. Despite the fact that I've told her I live on the 'mainland' in my estimation, she continues to say it in almost all phone calls, except now, she laughs and apologises as soon as it's out of her mouth!


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## Purple (30 Jan 2007)

liteweight said:


> What I do mind is being asked when I intend visiting the 'mainland' again as they'd all love to see me.


 Tell them that you will be in France next month and then ask them when they are visiting the mainland next 



TarfHead said:


> An English colleague who lives in Greystones once received an unsolicited letter from Cablelink addressed to The Occupier. He arrived into work the next day brandishing the letter saying "_Would you people ever get over it !_"


 LOL


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## sonnyikea (30 Jan 2007)

Surely with the post you should address it in a way that the local post office of the place you are sending the letter from will understand where it is meant to go. Republic of Ireland from the UK, Irland from Germany etc etc. 

If I was sending a letter to Germany from here I would label it Germany. The German post office knows the rest of the address is in Germany so why should I say Deutschland when the Irish post office need to know which country it's to go to so I tell them in a language they understand. 

Or am I simplifying things?


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## ClubMan (30 Jan 2007)

Every time I head over to work _HQ _in _California _somebody inevitably (and genuinely/innocently) asks _"how are things/the weather/etc. in the UK?"_.


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## Purple (30 Jan 2007)

ClubMan said:


> Every time I head over to work _HQ _in _California _somebody inevitably (and genuinely/innocently) asks _"how are things/the weather/etc. in the UK?"_.


 A few years back I was told by a guy in Boston that I spoke very good English. I thanked him and said that he did too.


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## CCOVICH (30 Jan 2007)

LOL-I was in Cleveland in September and was asked 



			
				dumb_yank said:
			
		

> when did you learn to speak English?


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## Vanilla (30 Jan 2007)

In '91 I was travelling from Austria into Czechoslovakia ( as it was then) and into Poland. At the time you needed a visa to enter, but I didn't know that. So I got on a night train and off I went, only to be horrified when the guards came around ( with rifles slung over their shoulders) looking for Visas. When I was ordered to produce my passport they genuinely thought it was fake as the two guards had never heard of Eire- they thought it was a made up country.  After an interminable wait ( at gun point), eventually another guard came along with a big folder and the three went through it until they found Eire. They were very surprised. Cue much mirth. And I was marched off the train and put on the next train back over the border again. Didn't put me off though. Got a visa the next morning and went back in again. Happy days.


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## Purple (30 Jan 2007)

I was stopped going into Kenya in the 80's with my parents (I'm only a young fella). The immigration guys there didn't know where Eire was either. When we explained it was Ireland they said "Oh, Ireland! IRA!" and made actions and noises as if they were shooting machine guns. After that we were their best friends and they walked us through customs, had our bags collected for us and had a taxi bring us to our hotel for free. I don't think they liked the English.


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## annR (30 Jan 2007)

> Northern Ireland is part of the UK but is not British, something I like to remind Unionist friends about when the slagging starts.


 
Why is it not British?



rabbit said:


> Our unionist friends in N. I. could point out that these islands used ( at least ) to be called the British isles, and geographically many around the world still call these islands that. They can argue that N. Ireland never stopped being part of the British isles, and that they are British.
> The Canary islands are under Spanish rule even though they are not in Spain - they are of course much closer to Africa than Spain.
> Hawaii is part of the US but it is not in America either, geographically speaking.


 
I think all of Ireland is/was also geographically part of the British Isles, doesn't mean we're British because we're Irish.  But Northern Ireland is part of the UK so wouldn't they be called British in a political sense.  BTW I think it's Collins English Dictionary or Reader Digest or something has recently decided that Ireland is not part of the British Isles anymore.


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## Guest127 (30 Jan 2007)

I think that Northern Ireland is not in Great Britain ( hence Great Britan _and_ Northern Ireland)  but is in the UK. thought we were all part of the British Isles though as its only a geographical term.


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## Purple (30 Jan 2007)

cuchulainn said:


> I think that Northern Ireland is not in Great Britain ( hence Great Britan _and_ Northern Ireland)  but is in the UK. thought we were all part of the British Isles though as its only a geographical term.


That's it.
I also like to point out that England is a theocracy where the head of state is also head of the state religion. Other than the Vatican I can't think of another country like that. This I also use to wind up English friends (and I point out that I'm a citizen, equal under the law and they are subjects, unequal under the law). I know in every practical sense England, and Britain, is as democratic as us but it makes great ammunition is a pub slagging match


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## almo (30 Jan 2007)

The official term for our former main trading partner is:  The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.


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## CCOVICH (30 Jan 2007)

Purple said:


> Other than the Vatican I can't think of another country like that.


 
Isn't it somewhat similar in Iran, i.e. ultimate power rests with the Ayatollah?


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## ClubMan (30 Jan 2007)

See here.


> 4 Current states with theocratic aspects
> 4.1 Iran
> 4.2 England
> 4.3 Andorra
> ...


 Whatever about being a theocracy in practice the _UK _is certainly a sectarian and anti-secular state in that it has an official state sanctioned established (probably some tautology there but not to worry...) church. What's interesting is that many of the non established religious groupings are keen that the _CoE _is not removed as the established church in case it leads to secularisation of the state and sidelining of religious groups/churches from matters of state.


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## Marie M (30 Jan 2007)

[broken link removed]


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## ClubMan (30 Jan 2007)

> Folens to wipe 'British Isles' off the map


Just clearing some Lebensraum to the east no doubt?


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## BillK (30 Jan 2007)

Could someone clarify for me please whether there has ever been a political entity entitled "Southern Ireland"?


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## ClubMan (30 Jan 2007)

What precisely do you mean by "political entity"? Nation state/country or something else?


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## Z100 (30 Jan 2007)

Purple said:


> A few years back I was told by a guy in Boston that I spoke very good English. I thanked him and said that he did too.


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## Z100 (30 Jan 2007)

http://alt-usage-english.org/ireland.html

Some confusion surrounds the question of what we should call the independent sovereign state that occupies 80% of the land area of the island of Ireland. That confusion is entirely understandable, and the purpose of this note is to remove it.

The *Irish Constitution* of 1937 says: "The name of the State is Éire, or, in the English language,* Ireland*".

The *Republic of Ireland Act*, 1948, says: "It is hereby declared that the description of the State shall be the *Republic of Ireland*."

Irish *passports* simply bear the name *Ireland*. 

*Irish government* regulations and official statements frequently refer to "the *Republic of Ireland*".


*Comhairle*, a statutory agency responsible for the provision of information, advice and advocacy to members of the public on social service, says on its web site:  
'The names of political entities and other terms can often be quite contentious. The Irish and British governments have agreed to use the official names by which each state describes itself. (This agreement was made at the same time as the British-Irish Agreement). The correct name for this country is Ireland, not the "Republic of Ireland".'

.........so whilst it is strictly true that "Ireland" is the name of the republic, that does not mean that one should avoid the use of the phrase "Republic of Ireland", which frequently appears in directives, press releases and other official documents from the Irish government, as a search of their official web site at http://www.irlgov.ie/ will readily show. 

The advice stands: in many contexts it is safe and uncontentious to refer to the Republic simply as "Ireland". Where the possibility of ambiguity exists, use "the Republic of Ireland".


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## TarfHead (30 Jan 2007)

Purple said:


> .. but it makes great ammunition is a pub slagging match



One ball I've tried (unsuccessfully) to hop with English folk is to ask what is it about them that is British, as distinct from English, i.e. where does their 'Englishness' stop and their 'Britishness' start ?  I also tried to advance a theory, in a pub in Edinburgh, that there was no such thing as Scotland, that they were all English and that Scotland was just a tourism marketing concept.  I was lucky to live that night and they say the Scots have a sense of humour  ?

I also asked a gang of Leicester rugby supporters, on a train to Cardiff, to stop butchering _Molly Malone_ and sing instead some old English songs.  They scratched their heads for a while and then launched into _Swing low sweet chariot _ .


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## ClubMan (31 Jan 2007)

Bushfire said:


> Irish *passports* simply bear the name *Ireland*.


Mine says both _Eire _and _Ireland _ on the front and then carries the name in all official languages of the _EU _inside.


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## Purple (31 Jan 2007)

ClubMan said:


> See here.
> Whatever about being a theocracy in practice the _UK _is certainly a sectarian and anti-secular state in that it has an official state sanctioned established (probably some tautology there but not to worry...) church. What's interesting is that many of the non established religious groupings are keen that the _CoE _is not removed as the established church in case it leads to secularisation of the state and sidelining of religious groups/churches from matters of state.


 Iran is an interesting case, their Supreme leader decides who can run for office but he is appointed by the guardian council who are themselves elected by the people so from a constitutional point of view it is less of a theocracy than the UK. It also has a politically irreconcilable constitution but that's a different matter. There was an excellent article in the New York Times recently about it.
Does anyone know if the head of state (Monarch) in the UK still promises to oppress the evil of Catholicism in his or her coronation oath? 



TarfHead said:


> One ball I've tried (unsuccessfully) to hop with English folk is to ask what is it about them that is British, as distinct from English, i.e. where does their 'Englishness' stop and their 'Britishness' start ?  I also tried to advance a theory, in a pub in Edinburgh, that there was no such thing as Scotland, that they were all English and that Scotland was just a tourism marketing concept.


Most of the myths and legends that are considered English such as the Arthurian legends are in fact Cornish or Welsh so it could be contended that the cultural origins of Britain are in not English at all.


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## dam099 (31 Jan 2007)

If I recall correctly the use of Eire got up the nose of a judge in the past too. I thought I read many years ago that a UK extradition warrant was thrown out for using Eire and that the Judge indicated Eire was only correct if the document was in Irish, for a document in English the correct name of the country was Ireland.

The only supporting link I can find alludes to an (unnamed) Supreme Court judge expressing his annoyance at the practice but no indication if it resulted in the case being chucked out.

http://www.emigrant.ie/article.asp?iCategoryID=200&iArticleID=38184


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## Glenbhoy (31 Jan 2007)

Most of us nordies call ye free staters 'Mexicans' ye know.


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## Purple (31 Jan 2007)

Glenbhoy said:


> Most of us nordies call ye free staters 'Mexicans' ye know.


and yet the USA is to the North of Mexico. If you were looking for a comparative relationship that would mean you guys were in Guatemala.


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## ClubMan (31 Jan 2007)

dam099 said:


> the Judge indicated Eire was only correct if the document was in Irish, for a document in English the correct name of the country was Ireland.


Does this mean that article 4 of the constitution which uses both _Éire _and _Ireland _is incorrect? Or perhaps you are simply mistaken in your recollections?



Purple said:


> Does anyone know if the head of state (Monarch) in the UK still promises to oppress the evil of Catholicism in his or her coronation oath?


For what it's worth there's nothing about it here anyway.


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## Purple (31 Jan 2007)

ClubMan said:


> For what it's worth there's nothing about it here anyway.


Have a look at  PDF. While the oath is not expressly anti Catholic it looks like it is designed with their dpecific exclusion in mind. 
It seems a bit nuts that a constitution that is secular in practice can be built on such bigoted crap.


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## Guest127 (31 Jan 2007)

Glenbhoy said:


> Most of us nordies call ye free staters 'Mexicans' ye know.


 
know  that dundalk was referred to on the bbc as ' el paso' 
but then south armagh is know as bandit country. 
which is where I am going shortly to get some home heating oil.


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## ClubMan (31 Jan 2007)

Purple said:


> Have a look at  PDF. While the oath is not expressly anti Catholic it looks like it is designed with their dpecific exclusion in mind.
> It seems a bit nuts that a constitution that is secular in practice can be built on such bigoted crap.


What constitution? The _UK _doesn't have one - at least in writing whatever about through royal and legislative precedent.


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## Purple (31 Jan 2007)

ClubMan said:


> What constitution? The _UK _doesn't have one - at least in writing whatever about through royal and legislative precedent.


 They don't have a written or sovern constitution but they do have one, as you point out, through  legislative precedent. See here for details.


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## Guest124 (31 Jan 2007)

Back in the 1980's and my C.B. Radio days, despite giving out my address correctly to People in England they would always put N. Ireland on the envelope.


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## BillK (31 Jan 2007)

Hi Clubman,

Either nation or state.


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## Deirdra (31 Jan 2007)

Well, I get a magazine posted from London, with the last line reading 'Irish Republic'. Can an adjective be used to describe a republic?


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## rabbit (1 Feb 2007)

Deirdra said:


> Can an adjective be used to describe a republic?


 
Bob Geldof used a piece of fruit to describe the republic once ( banana republic ).  At least we do not have to call it the Peoples Socialist Republic of Ireland....not yet anyway.


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## dam099 (1 Feb 2007)

ClubMan said:


> Does this mean that article 4 of the constitution which uses both _Éire _and _Ireland _is incorrect? Or perhaps you are simply mistaken in your recollections?


 
Perhaps though the article I quoted does at least back it up partially to the extent that the judge at least had an issue with it (of course the article could be wrong too I'd prefer see the court transcripts for a definitive answer). There was  the same year as the article refers to where the Judge stated a case would be thrown out for using "Republic of Ireland" (this piece does not make it clear what would happen if Eire was used) perhaps this is what the article refers to.

The article of the constitution you quote does indeed use both terms but explicitly says the name of the state is Eire or in the English language Ireland. In the context of the paragraph could that not imply that Eire is therefore the Irish language name and that the use of Eire in the English language translation is for informational purposes? I'm not a constitutional lawyer so maybe I'm reading too much into it.


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## ajapale (1 Feb 2007)

Deirdra said:


> Can an adjective be used to describe a republic?


Sure, an adjective can be used to describe a republic.

from wiki:



> Since the term _republic_ is so vague by itself, many states felt it necessary to add additional qualifiers in order to clarify what kind of republics they claim to be. Here is a list of such qualifiers and variations on the term "republic":
> Constitutional republic - A constitutional republic is a state where the head of state and other officials are elected as representatives of the people and must govern according to existing constitutional law that limits the government's power over citizens. In a constitutional republic, executive, legislative, and judicial powers are separated into distinct branches so that no individual or group has absolute power and the power of the majority of the population is checked by only allowing them to elect representatives. The fact that a constitution exists that limits the government's power, makes the state constitutional. That the head(s) of state and other officials are chosen by election, rather than inheriting their positions, and that their decisions are subject to judicial review makes a state republican.
> Federal republic, confederation or federation - a federal union of states with a republican form of government. Examples include Austria, Brazil, Germany, India, the USA, Russia and Switzerland.
> Islamic Republic - Countries like Afghanistan, Pakistan, Iran are republics governed in accordance with Islamic law. (Note: Turkey is a distinct exception and is _not_ included in this list; while the population is predominantly Muslim, the state is a staunchly secular republic.)
> ...


In particular I like the  Bolivarian Republic of Venezuela!


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## bond-007 (2 Feb 2007)

BillK said:


> Could someone clarify for me please whether there has ever been a political entity entitled "Southern Ireland"?


Yes see, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_Ireland



> _Southern Ireland_ is sometimes used as an unofficial name for the Republic of Ireland or the earlier Irish Free State. However, officially the term has been obsolete since 1922


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## BillK (2 Feb 2007)

Thanks bond-007 - I wonder if Niall Ferguson should be reminded that things changed in 1922. One would have thought that an historian would have kept up to date, unless that is a contradiction in terms!


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## GeneralZod (3 Feb 2007)

There is no Celtic period in Irish history. There was no mass migration of Celts to Ireland, it's a myth.
"Irish" and "Ireland" are also recent inventions. Descendants of those that built Newgrange probably 
have fair claim on being the real native Irish. The more of the original genetic material you have
the more Irish you are, by that measure.

http://vetinarilord.blogspot.com/2005/12/y-chromosome-variation-and-irish.html

If there was anyone here before the Ice age they were presumably driven out by that extended cold snap.


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## Guest127 (3 Feb 2007)

remember at school the teacher banging on about some tribe call the 'tuath na danann' or something like it anyway. maybe they were irish?
or was it the old 'fir bolgs' ? obviously they  died out as there was no 'mna bolgs'


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## brian.mobile (4 Feb 2007)

BillK said:


> Am I the only one to be pissed off when people refer to the Republic of Ireland by the above name?
> The latest example was in Niall Ferguson's column in today's Sunday .


 
Only noticed it now! 

Grrr..

BM


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## mmclo (15 Feb 2007)

ClubMan said:


> Or your lack of constitutional knowledge...
> 
> Bunreacht na hÉireann:
> So _"Éire"_ would seem to be more correct than _"Ireland"_ or any other variation on the same theme.


 
Not at all, if you are speaking in engish the name is Ireland


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## ClubMan (15 Feb 2007)

So why does the _English _language version of the constitution not simply say _"the name of the country is Ireland" _and leave _"Éire" _to the _Irish _language version?


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## jasconius (15 Feb 2007)

From Jan1st 2007 the name of our illustrious country is now changed in EU circles to Eire Ireland.
See Here


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## ClubMan (15 Feb 2007)

With no fada!?


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