# Sign of Peace at mass



## liaconn (14 Jul 2008)

Just a question for other mass goers. Does anyone else wish they'd cease the sign of peace bit. I don't know how many times I've sat beside someone biting their nails, repeatedly blowing their nose into a grubby hanky etc, dreading the fact that I'm going to have to shake their  hand shortly. I think its really unhygienic and have heard other people complaining about it as well.


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## Caveat (14 Jul 2008)

Presumably there is the same potential for lack of hygiene etc, in an everyday situation, when shaking hands too though?


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## Guest117 (14 Jul 2008)

Why not wear disposable gloves


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## liaconn (14 Jul 2008)

Caveat said:


> Presumably there is the same potential for lack of hygiene etc, in an everyday situation, when shaking hands too though?


 Agreed. But its not just the hygiene, its the cringe factor when you've actually seen them with their fingers in their mouth (or somewhere worse!) and have to knowingly shake their hand. A bit like when you don't know what's going on in someone's kitchen you'll happily eat your meal, but if you actually see  them  tasting something and putting the spoon back in the pot or dropping something on the floor and putting it back on the plate you just lose your appetite.


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## michaelm (14 Jul 2008)

badge55 said:


> Why not wear disposable gloves


Good idea.  Or wash your hands five times with very hot water and, of course, with different bars of soap, when you get home.


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## Ash 22 (14 Jul 2008)

Its not done every Sunday in our Church.  Have some wipes in the car. The thought behind it is lovely but as you say when you see what people are doing prior to it, certainly offputting.


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## Pique318 (14 Jul 2008)

lol I think you worry too much !!!

How about the door handles of shops, or even...shock.... toilet doors when people don't wash their hands !!!

How exactly does biting ones nails make their hands unhygenic ? How hygenic are the pews in your church ? Or the seats on the bus/Luas the last time you took one ?

If you were to worry about all this level of thing, you'd never leave the house (although that would probably be more unhygenic...oh you just can't win)

Besides, I'm sure god will protect you from the nasty germs picked up during worship.


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## liaconn (14 Jul 2008)

Pique318 said:


> lol I think you worry too much !!!
> 
> 
> Besides, I'm sure god will protect you from the nasty germs picked up during worship.


 
A bit inappropriate! I wasn't seeking smark alek comments about my religion.


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## Pique318 (14 Jul 2008)

don't go taking offence now, none was intended...hence the


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## Brianne (14 Jul 2008)

I know what you mean and if I thought too much about it , it could be a problem. But then again, handling money, touching door handles in toilet cubicles and even eating and drinking out are all potential hazards. The good news is that it is only by doing all these things that we build up immunity.
I saw a BBC programme last year in which they checked the bacterial count on people's desks at work and found that the toilets in the latrines at Glastonbury were cleaner. People rarely clean their phones, keyboards etc and spend a lot of time there , eating , drinking , sniffling etc. 
I also read an article on the free peanuts left out on bar tops. Now that was interesting.......lots of E Coli . So I buy my own peanuts.
Truth is the bacteria are eveywhere and I still think the sign of peace is a lovely gesture even though I sometimes have misgivings.


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## Caveat (14 Jul 2008)

Brianne said:


> I also read an article on the free peanuts left out on bar tops.


 
I'm not a hygiene freak by any means, but I honestly can't understand how anyone in their right mind would go near these.


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## cole (14 Jul 2008)

I heard a microbiologist on Newstalk a few weeks back talking about the obsession with cleanliness around the home. He advocated allowing children to go play in the garden soil and then eat their lunch without washing their hands to encourage their immune systems to develop. Obviously there are caveats to this.


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## Brianne (14 Jul 2008)

Well, yes I have been known to come in early with the anti-bacterial spray and attack common area desks and phones and even bleach all the cups. Oh , sorry , I forgot, I attack door handles on occasion. As, I work in an all male office, they just raise their eyes and carry on!!!
Most of the time my compulsive obsessive behaviour is controlled!!!


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## michaelm (14 Jul 2008)

Brianne said:


> Most of the time my compulsive obsessive behaviour is controlled!!!


But not your dyslexia?


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## Brianne (14 Jul 2008)

Sorry??


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## Guest114 (14 Jul 2008)

I have so many rows with my wife about the sign of peace. She reckons it is worthwhile. I remember a time before it used to happen. I don't know who introduced it. I consider it akin to charismatics or OTT religious stuff like that. I don't think it's hygenic either. Where I go to Mass, one of the priests says it but the other doesn't. I prefer to get the one who doesn't.


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## DavyJones (14 Jul 2008)

liaconn said:


> A bit inappropriate! I wasn't seeking smark alek comments about my religion.



"your religion" teaches ,love thy neighbour and all that jazz, not very christian of you to not want to shake hands with people at mass.  Also if you don't want smark alec comments, save your complaints for confession and not a public forum.


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## Guest114 (14 Jul 2008)

DavyJones said:


> "your religion" teaches ,love thy neighbour and all that jazz, not very christian of you to not want to shake hands with people at mass. Also if you don't want smark alec comments, save your complaints for confession and not a public forum.


 
The vital question is - WHO came up with the handshake ? It wasn't a part of Mass in the 70s. It seemed to come in for the 80s. I would be curious to know. I don't agree with it. Maybe I'm an a-la-carte Christian. If I am, so be it


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## shesells (14 Jul 2008)

Unless it's a wedding or an occasion when I know the people around me I will only shake with OH/family. It doesn't really bother me if people think I'm rude.


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## DavyJones (14 Jul 2008)

AlistairDick said:


> The vital question is - WHO came up with the handshake ? It wasn't a part of Mass in the 70s. It seemed to come in for the 80s. I would be curious to know. I don't agree with it. Maybe I'm an a-la-carte Christian. If I am, so be it




The same could be said for celebacy for Priests, the RC church along with many others have man made rules.


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## Purple (14 Jul 2008)

liaconn said:


> A bit inappropriate! I wasn't seeking smark alek comments about my religion.


What's a smark alek?


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## Purple (14 Jul 2008)

Do the people who have a problem with this know that it's quite difficult to pick up diseases through your hands? If the person next to you is coughing into their hand etc then after you shake their hand don't lick your own one or suck your fingers, pick your nose/ ear and you should survive 'till you get home and cleans yourself in you hermetically sealed home.


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## Brianne (14 Jul 2008)

Purple said:


> Do the people who have a problem with this know that it's quite difficult to pick up diseases through your hands? If the person next to you is coughing into their hand etc then after you shake their hand don't lick your own one or suck your fingers, pick your nose/ ear and you should survive 'till you get home and cleans yourself in you hermetically sealed home.


Ha!! Ha!


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## Ash 22 (14 Jul 2008)

Seemingly you can pick up warts by shaking hands according to my doc.
There was an item on American news channel one night saying every family should have a dog, it will help children build their immunity. I must say I thoroughly agree with this and it makes lots of sense. What did people do long ago when they had no running water etc so they would'nt be able to wash their hands every 5 minutes.


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## justsally (14 Jul 2008)

Purple said:


> Do the people who have a problem with this know that it's quite difficult to pick up diseases through your hands? If the person next to you is coughing into their hand etc then after you shake their hand don't lick your own one or suck your fingers, pick your nose/ ear and you should survive 'till you get home and cleans yourself in you hermetically sealed home.


 
Communion is usually distributed after the "sign of peace" so anyone who chooses to receive the host in their hands should not do so until the above instructions have been carried out!!!!.

Doctor, Doctor, did you wash your hands!!!

not all immune compromised people are hospital patients!!!


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## Sue Ellen (14 Jul 2008)

Purple said:


> What's a smark alek?


 
Someone who asks this question


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## michaelm (14 Jul 2008)

During last years election I shook hands with my local TD, and he'd been scratching his This post will be deleted if not edited to remove bad language for five years .


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## cole (14 Jul 2008)

michaelm said:


> During last years election I shook hands with my local TD, and he'd been scratching his This post will be deleted if not edited to remove bad language for five years .


 
LOL best reply yet!


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## Ash 22 (14 Jul 2008)

His fingernails must have been pretty grubby or his This post will be deleted if not edited to remove bad language very sore!


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## Madangan (14 Jul 2008)

Ash 22 said:


> Seemingly you can pick up warts by shaking hands according to my doc.
> There was an item on American news channel one night saying every family should have a dog, it will help children build their immunity. I must say I thoroughly agree with this and it makes lots of sense. What did people do long ago when they had no running water etc so they would'nt be able to wash their hands every 5 minutes.


 
My sister ( now in her forties) went missing when about four ...she was eventually found hiding under the kitchen table sharing every second lick of the sugar bowl with Spot our mongrel working cow dog. It did not harm her (or more surprisingly the dog), neither of my parents considered bringing either of them to the doctor (or the vet) for shots... if this has happened now..tetanus shots and god knows what else would have been almost mandatory... I dont advocate dirty homes or not cleaning ones hands etc... but we have become hysterical about cleanliness in last 20 Years.... and yet are we healthier do we catch less bugs etc..


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## ClubMan (14 Jul 2008)

liaconn said:


> Just a question for other mass goers. Does anyone else wish they'd cease the sign of peace bit. I don't know how many times I've sat beside someone biting their nails, repeatedly blowing their nose into a grubby hanky etc, dreading the fact that I'm going to have to shake their  hand shortly. I think its really unhygienic and have heard other people complaining about it as well.


Didn't _This post will be deleted if not edited immediately _wash a few blokes' dirty feet without moaning about it? Maybe you should take a leaf out of your leader's book?


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## Ash 22 (15 Jul 2008)

I know we're slightly getting away from the main topic but I can remember my late dad sitting in the kitchen wearing his warm jacket in the winter time, no central heating, just open fire and both front and back door opened directly from outside into kitchen. Way healthier than too much heating.


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## ClubMan (15 Jul 2008)

DavyJones said:


> "your religion" teaches ,love thy neighbour and all that jazz, not very christian of you to not want to shake hands with people at mass.  Also if you don't want smark alec comments, save your complaints for confession and not a public forum.


As an atheist the sign of peace is my favourite part of the mass. Sort of quaint and at least it's a form of engagement (however minimal) with one's fellow man which is a nice antidote to what goes on otherwise.


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## MandaC (15 Jul 2008)

Madangan said:


> My sister ( now in her forties) went missing when about four ...she was eventually found hiding under the kitchen table sharing every second lick of the sugar bowl with Spot our mongrel working cow dog. It did not harm her (or more surprisingly the dog), neither of my parents considered bringing either of them to the doctor (or the vet) for shots... if this has happened now..tetanus shots and god knows what else would have been almost mandatory... I dont advocate dirty homes or not cleaning ones hands etc... but we have become hysterical about cleanliness in last 20 Years.... and yet are we healthier do we catch less bugs etc..



Agree with this.  When we were small, we used to pick used chewing gum off the road, and if you blessed it(!) it became safe to eat. We also used to put money (coins) in our mouth.  Absolutely disgusting.  

Yet, if you were to think of all the things,sign of the peace,  door handles, tongs in salad bars in supermarkets(one I thought of recently), you could easily become paranoid.

What about putting money in the Colcannon?  Did anybody else do that?


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## Ash 22 (15 Jul 2008)

Madangan said:


> My sister ( now in her forties) went missing when about four ...she was eventually found hiding under the kitchen table sharing every second lick of the sugar bowl with Spot our mongrel working cow dog. It did not harm her (or more surprisingly the dog), neither of my parents considered bringing either of them to the doctor (or the vet) for shots... if this has happened now..tetanus shots and god knows what else would have been almost mandatory... I dont advocate dirty homes or not cleaning ones hands etc... but we have become hysterical about cleanliness in last 20 Years.... and yet are we healthier do we catch less bugs etc..


 
There are way more bugs now than years back. Think we never heard of a 'virus' back then. Now everything is put down as a virus.


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## justsally (15 Jul 2008)

*What about putting money in the Colcannon? Did anybody else do that*?


Yes, but not any more, now I put it in Northern Rock


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## Ash 22 (15 Jul 2008)

Or maybe lodge it in the Big Apple for Halloween!!


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## oysterman (15 Jul 2008)

I recall reading a newspaper report some years ago of a study which had found a significantly lower incidence of infectious disease among regular churchgoers  The authors of the study posited the notion it was down to the beneficial impact on the immune system of encountering all those bacteria and viruses on a weekly basis. If that's correct, then the sign of peace may have a significant prophylactic effect and the bishops should make it mandatory in all their churches.


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## MandaC (15 Jul 2008)

justsally said:


> *What about putting money in the Colcannon? Did anybody else do that*?
> 
> 
> Yes, but not any more, now I put it in Northern Rock



Just a tip.  It's actually safer in the Colcannon!


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## Purple (15 Jul 2008)

michaelm said:


> During last years election I shook hands with my local TD, and he'd been scratching his This post will be deleted if not edited to remove bad language for five years .


LOL    Excellent


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## DeeFox (15 Jul 2008)

It was common practice to eat chewing gum off the footpath when I was young (eighties).... disgusting I know but it never made me sick.  We ate crab apples and strange berries from bushes; any animal we saw was fair game for petting (be it a stray dog or a white mouse). I reckon I didn't wash my hands for days at a time when I was young and there would have been only one bath a week on a Saturday night.  Most primary school years I got a Cert at the end of saying I had missed no days and I didn't take an antibiotic until I was 21 (and only then because I was in an accident, and none since).  How times have changed!  My nieces and nephews seem to have all sorts of ailments (eczema, asthma, etc.)  I have no scientific proof of this but I think there is a lot to be said for not obsessing about hygiene.


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## ClubMan (15 Jul 2008)

MandaC said:


> Just a tip.  It's actually safer in the Colcannon!


No - it's 100% guaranteed in _NR _and you don't get any interest on it from _Colcannon_.


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## MandaC (15 Jul 2008)

DeeFox said:


> It was common practice to eat chewing gum off the footpath when I was young (eighties).... disgusting I know but it never made me sick.  We ate crab apples and strange berries from bushes; any animal we saw was fair game for petting (be it a stray dog or a white mouse). I reckon I didn't wash my hands for days at a time when I was young and there would have been only one bath a week on a Saturday night.  Most primary school years I got a Cert at the end of saying I had missed no days and I didn't take an antibiotic until I was 21 (and only then because I was in an accident, and none since).  How times have changed!  My nieces and nephews seem to have all sorts of ailments (eczema, asthma, etc.)  I have no scientific proof of this but I think there is a lot to be said for not obsessing about hygiene.




Just laughing....chewing gum well walked into the road, manky berries from bushes, petting animals. Hands not washed for days on end!  Exactly what we used to do!  I suppose kids don't think of hygiene when 10 of them are drinking from the same bottle of coke!!

Semi derelict industrial estate behind our housing estate. Valley ice cream had a storage faciliity in the industrial estate.  If their fridges went off, they would just dump boxes of half melted ice pops willy nilly around the industrial estate.  Rats the size of small dogs would be running over them.  Despite being told not to go in there, the lure of a semi melted JR icepop was too much and most (probably all) of the kids ate a load of them, with no ill effects. 

But I am wondering, is there more bacteria around today than there was, or are peoples immune systems just weaker.

Back to the subject of sign of the peace and mass,  I often used to wonder did the priest not mind putting communion directly into peoples open mouths and touching all those tongues.  Yuk!


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## DavyJones (15 Jul 2008)

ClubMan said:


> As an atheist the sign of peace is my favourite part of the mass. Sort of quaint and at least it's a form of engagement (however minimal) with one's fellow man which is a nice antidote to what goes on otherwise.



As an atheist, why do you go to mass? Anyhow my grandma says that atheist's melt when they are on hallow ground. you must be a RC posing as an atheist


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## ClubMan (15 Jul 2008)

DavyJones said:


> As an atheist, why do you go to mass?


Just christenings, weddings, funerals etc. of family, friends etc. which I attend out of respect for the individuals involved if invited.


DavyJones said:


> you must be a RC posing as an atheist


I usually attend the annual ecumenical service around _Rememberance Day _in the _CoI _church in whose graveyard my father is buried. They do the sign of peace thing too as it happens.


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## Betsy Og (15 Jul 2008)

A far nastier one - dont wear sandals when standing at a urinal, particularly a crowded one. Apart from your own contributions theres also spray from all directions. Yuck

As for the sign of peace - all for it. Why are we so averse to a bit of "community" ? - bring on the robes, the gospel choir and the people swaying in the rows. No wonder mass is so deadpan when people cant even bring themselves to shake hands with those around them.


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## ClubMan (15 Jul 2008)

Betsy Og said:


> A far nastier one - dont wear sandals when standing at a urinal, particularly a crowded one.


Wonder what _This post will be deleted if not edited immediately _would have done?  Then again he could walk on water so I presume the same applied to nitrogenous waste?


> As for the sign of peace - all for it. Why are we so averse to a bit of "community" ? - bring on the robes, the gospel choir and the people swaying in the rows.


Don't stop there. How about ... cheerleaders, ice hockey/basketball style organ accompaniment (building to a crescendo at the moment of transubstantiation), Tifo style flags and fireworks etc.?


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## ninsaga (15 Jul 2008)

When we were playing in local GAA matches when I was younger - everyone used to pass around the water bottle (& twice if it was club orange).... if you had an ice cream or ice lolly then be prepared for about 5 other people to take a bite or a lick. I don't recall anyone dying from that at the time by the way!

The body needs to be exposed to everyday germs do that it can build up a level of resistance.


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## ClubMan (15 Jul 2008)

On the odd occasion that I attend a religious service it's not the germs that I worry about but the memes.


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## Ash 22 (15 Jul 2008)

Nice choir etc, is lovely. Saying that even if there is no music at Mass, we only have to attend Church once a week for 3/4 hour approx. How can people find this boring?
Maybe if the people who are bored thought of the real reason they are there and got involved in the ceremony they would'nt be so bored atall.


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## Cheeus (15 Jul 2008)

There are more germs in the money at the collection than at the sign of peace... maybe the priests could think about giving up the collection??

Seriously though, I think it would be sad to do away with the sign of peace - it's the most active, community orientated part of the mass. I do have awful childhood memories of being made shake hands with a scary woman from up the road though. Ughhh.

...and eating chewing gum off the road, ah yes, the stones were the best bit!


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## Teabag (15 Jul 2008)

Ash 22 said:


> Nice choir etc, is lovely. Saying that even if there is no music at Mass, we only have to attend Church once a week for 3/4 hour approx. How can people find this boring?
> Maybe if the people who are bored thought of the real reason they are there and got involved in the ceremony they would'nt be so bored atall.




Maybe that why they are bored - they are losing their faith. Maybe they are seeing all the mass rituals as pointless and wondering if the 2000 story is true etc...


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## Ash 22 (15 Jul 2008)

I suppose everybody has to decide for themselves whether they believe or they don't but lets say for those that believe it should'nt be impossible to get through the Mass without boredom setting in.


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## ninsaga (15 Jul 2008)

To the OP.... if this bothers you then arrive late & stand or sit at a part of the church where no one is within 10ft of you.


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## liaconn (15 Jul 2008)

DavyJones said:


> "your religion" teaches ,love thy neighbour and all that jazz, not very christian of you to not want to shake hands with people at mass. Also if you don't want smark alec comments, save your complaints for confession and not a public forum.


 
Eh, I don't think the purpose of a public forum is to make smart alec comments and put downs. However, that was  discussed recently on another thread.


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## ClubMan (16 Jul 2008)

ninsaga said:


> To the OP.... if this bothers you then arrive late & stand or sit at a part of the church where no one is within 10ft of you.


If I recall correctly they'd have to be *VERY *late to miss the sign of peace bit! Wouldn't they also miss the most important bit for believers (sacrament of the _Eucharist_/transubstantiation if _RC_?)?


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## jackswift (16 Jul 2008)

Ash 22 said:


> There are way more bugs now than years back. Think we never heard of a 'virus' back then. Now everything is put down as a virus.


 Same bugs, only problem now is that people are less immune to them because they are forever scrubbing themselves and everything around them.


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## A.Partridge (16 Jul 2008)

liaconn said:


> Just a question for other mass goers. Does anyone else wish they'd cease the sign of peace bit. I don't know how many times I've sat beside someone biting their nails, repeatedly blowing their nose into a grubby hanky etc, dreading the fact that I'm going to have to shake their hand shortly. I think its really unhygienic and have heard other people complaining about it as well.


 

Here's a picture of someone else who thinks like you...


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## Teabag (16 Jul 2008)

Ash 22 said:


> I suppose everybody has to decide for themselves whether they believe or they don't but lets say for those that believe it should'nt be impossible to get through the Mass without boredom setting in.



I suppose its down to the level of belief. Some people with have blind faith in the whole Catholic dogma. Others may have belief in a supreme being or Christian God but may not go along with Mary being a virgin, This post will be deleted if not edited immediately rising from the dead, the Holy Trinity etc....they might find a lot of the mass boring....I am beginning to sound like Dougal now.....I dont go to mass much anymore but when I did, I found the mass very repetitive and boring and the sermons were usually dire....I could sing the prayers and jump down, turn around, pick a bale of cotton with the best of them...

then again......
"I useta see her up the chapel when when she went to Sunday mass
And when she'd go up to receive, I'd kneel down there 
And watch her pass ....The glory of her ass" 

...that wasn't boring...

where are my XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX ?


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