# Buying BMW, what to look out for?



## lyonsa3 (20 May 2011)

Hi,
I'm looking at purchasing a 3 or 5 series in the uk soon.
Both would be 08 year to avail of lower tax bands.
The cars i'm looking at would be 08 320D SE with 67000 miles on the clock 177 BHP and,
08 520D SE with 80000 miles and 177 BHP.

Car will mainly be used to get to work.  Kids will be in it the odd time (not much if I can help it).  Second car is a people carrier to ferry around the kids.
Though to myself about time I got a nice car for myself. 

If purchasing such cars what should I be looking out for?

What are peoples options on the milage?

Looking for any other info that people might think I need to know to make a better informed decision.

Cheers.


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## horusd (20 May 2011)

You probably know all this, but whatever you do, make sure you do a full vehicle check, including ownership, finance, clocking,vehicle history etc. There have been various horror stories about all of this, so exercise extreme caution.


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## -Gal1 (20 May 2011)

[broken link removed]

Having bought recently in Scotland would have a look at the attached.


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## turtle77 (20 May 2011)

I bought a 08 car via the UK in Feb; it has 100k miles on it.

Mine was a compnay/fleet car. Welll looked after, with a detailed service history.
The number of miles didn't bother me. 
I'd be more suspicious if it had 25,000 miles on it!

My buddy sold his 2006 520 last month; felt it was too low powered for a 5 series (2 litre engine) and thereby resulting in lower miles-per-gallon.
You'll prob get better fuel economy in the 3 series..but I'm most certainly not a BMW expert/fan/critic


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## Billo (20 May 2011)

AFAIK all BMW's are still rear wheel drives, so they are very poor in slippy conditions, A neighbour of mine has a 520 series, and he could not use the car at all last December due to snow and ice. He had to use his wife's ford fiesta.


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## Firefly (20 May 2011)

I have a 320i petrol (new model) and it's a lovely car to drive. One thing to consider is that both models come with Runflat Tires as standard. Whilst these are not meant to puncture/blow-out then can cost upto a grand for a set. You can switch back to "normal" tires but this requires you to buy a spare wheel....there is no place for this in the 3 series, but the 5 series has a small hole that would probably fit one of those skinny (orange) spare wheels that you see around the place. I'd also get confirmation that all the warning lights are enabled..there are probably threads on this worth looking up. When I looked to buy mine I had a look in the UK too but found the difference wasn't worth it...I was able to buy from a local BMW mean dealer with a full 12 month warranty. I have had 2 calls from BMW Ireland in the past 3 months enquiring was I happy with my car. I also heard an ad on the radio yesterday saying that main BMW dealers are now upping the warranty to 2 years to perhaps you should look to buy here.

Just to add...the reason I went for the 3 series over the 5 series is that the 3 series is meant to be safer (5 stars as opposed to 4 stars)...see the euroncap reports.

Finally, you should test drive both cars...the 5 series has that iDrive system which I think is a bit fiddly...


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## Mpsox (20 May 2011)

Given the issues BMWs faced in the bad weather earlier in the year and which seemed far worse then other makes (especially their issues handling icy hills) would you really want to buy one?


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## johnnygman (20 May 2011)

Would have to report same on issues on icy conditions, neighbour could not even get out of drive on small incline due to rear wheel drive. Nice cars to drive and I have considered them myself in the past but they are in my opinion actually dangerous in icy - snowy conditions so I would not consider after the last few winters we have experienced. Audi A6 would be my pick if i was buying a prestiege motor like that, they are very reliable, lots of space and good image, cheap enough to pick up used also.


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## callybags (20 May 2011)

johnnygman said:


> Would have to report same on issues on icy conditions, neighbour could not even get out of drive on small incline due to rear wheel drive. Nice cars to drive and I have considered them myself in the past but they are in my opinion actually dangerous in icy - snowy conditions so I would not consider after the last few winters we have experienced. Audi A6 would be my pick if i was buying a prestiege motor like that, they are very reliable, lots of space and good image, cheap enough to pick up used also.


 
After my very tongue in cheek post earlier, a serious response to above.

I would never be swayed in my choice of car by the few days of ice and snow we get. I drive a rear wheel drive car and, while it was awkward last winter, I was able to get round as well as the next man. Four 25KG bags of salt in the boot helped!


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## becky (20 May 2011)

callybags said:


> After my very tongue in cheek post earlier, a serious response to above.
> 
> I would never be swayed in my choice of car by the few days of ice and snow we get. I drive a rear wheel drive car and, while it was awkward last winter, I was able to get round as well as the next man. Four 25KG bags of salt in the boot helped!


 
I have a 2002 BMW 318i and that's what I did as well.  That said I didn't really choose to drive a BMW.  My brother was selling his and wasn't getting any takers so I took pity on him and bought it off him as he needed the cash.

It's a nice car to drive other than the problems with the ice.


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## johnnygman (20 May 2011)

I know what you mean and they are nice enough cars but let's be honest we had near 2 months of it solid ice and snow in parts and anyone who has kids also will understand that it's an unnecessary risk if you had to drive them to school and the like.

Dragging around bags of salt is hardly practical or economical and another winter like the one just gone would make in my opinion a rear wheel drive car a poor choice. I met 2 BMW's on the main road on seperate occasions which had just lost control and gone off, places where a front wheel drive or even better all wheel drive would never go off on. Perhaps a good choice for a younger driver who wants a "sporty" image/drive but I think that another winter like this gone and most people would agree that they are far from ideal winter cars. The sound of my neighbour continuosly spinning his wheels at 7am every morning and the racket that went with it may have clouded my judgement though.


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## jhegarty (20 May 2011)

I drive a 2001 3 series and wouldn't swop it for anything (except a 5 series !).

Made it to work every day during the snow , just had to be a little more careful then on a FWD.  For the other 360 days of the team the RWD gives you a better drive.


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## lyonsa3 (20 May 2011)

Thanks for all the advice on 3 and 5 series.
I didn't think the bad weather over the last couple of winters would have that sort of effect on BMW (RWD).
As I travel 50 miles round trip to work each day including weekends when the roads aren't gritted as much (or at all where I'm from, going by last year) I'll have to take this into consideration.
Would still like a 3 or 5 series but could not afford to be without car if weather gets bad. Do people think I letting the fear of potential bad weather get to me?

If so I'm also consider a 09 mondeo or 09 insignia. What do people thing of these cars or would it be still worth it to go for a BMW?

Thanks for all advice.

Great to have a forum like this to get vital information.


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## Firefly (21 May 2011)

Hi, I haven't driven a Mondeo but I've driven an Insignia. It's a nice car alright, but the feel and build quality are nothing compared to a BMW. The plastics felt a bit cheap and it's not as sure on the road IMO. The 3 series is constantly rated as best in its class for the last 20 years by the likes of WhatCar etc and also scores well in the JDPower owners satisfaction survey (as does the 5 series). On the road they're excellent. I wasn't too troubled during the snow, but then live in the city and have a short commute on good roads. You can get winter tyres and also winter socks (??) to put round your tyres. The A6 was the other car I was considering...a fine solid motor and built like a cage. The diesel would be the one here. Best of luck anyway and happy motoring.


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## Gekko (21 May 2011)

callybags said:


> I would never be swayed in my choice of car by the few days of ice and snow we get.


 
The performance of BMWs during the recent prolonged periods of bad weather should influence buying habits.  They became close to useless.


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## jhegarty (21 May 2011)

Gekko said:


> They became close to useless.




That's just an exaggeration.

I made it to work every day last winter. 

Missed 1 day the winter before, but there wasn't a car on the road that day.


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## Gekko (21 May 2011)

jhegarty said:


> That's just an exaggeration.
> 
> I made it to work every day last winter.
> 
> Missed 1 day the winter before, but there wasn't a car on the road that day.


 
It's not an exaggeration.

It was a major talking point in our office.  A lot of my colleagues drive BMWs and virtually all of them had massive problems.  Some couldn't get out of their drives.  Some couldn't get into their drives.

It is not an exaggeration or an inaccuracy to say that BMWs were dodgy during the bad weather.


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## Nige (21 May 2011)

becky said:


> I have a 2002 BMW 318i and that's what I did as well.



Snap.

I've a 30 mile each way trip to work and didn't encounter any problems over the cold snap. Now, I'm lucky that all of my journey is on a national route but the RWD didn't cause any issues at all.


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## dahamsta (23 May 2011)

I drove from Killeagh in east Cork to the top of Hollyhill in the city on several days during the cold snap, including the very worst days, and the closest I had to out-of-the-ordinary was a slight crab up the hill after Midleton, and having to avoid the idiots in the outside lane on the way home.

People having trouble should switch back to FWD. If they can't drive a RWD, they shouldn't have them.


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## nediaaa (23 May 2011)

If someone cannot drive a RWD on the snow then maybe they should not be driving. My wife has a 2004 BMW 3series and never slipped off the road. When in snow yuo have to be extra careful as in any car.
a FWD my be 5% better but thats all.


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## johnnygman (23 May 2011)

nediaaa said:


> If someone cannot drive a RWD on the snow then maybe they should not be driving. My wife has a 2004 BMW 3series and never slipped off the road. When in snow yuo have to be extra careful as in any car.
> a FWD my be 5% better but thats all.


 
That has no basis in fact whatsover and is purely based on personal preference for the car you own, it is clearly a massive disadvantage to have a rear wheel drive in snowy icy condions. This is a well known and accepted problem. The debate on this is pointless but the pro's and cons have to be weighed up and this is a con for BMW's but they have of course plenty of pro's as in they are nice drivers car and are fairly decent on reliability. Serviceing costs are very expensive on the other hand from main BMW dealers.


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## BK0001 (23 May 2011)

If the budget can stretch a wee bit more go for the 330d or 530d. The performance gains are massive and both are still cheep as chips to tax. 520d is underpowered IMO. Both are great cars to drive, but for me there is just way too many of them on Irish roads. 43% of all BMW sales in Ireland at the moment are the 520d. I'd have a Citroen C6 2.7hdi as it has the some style.


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## dahamsta (23 May 2011)

johnnygman said:


> This is a well known and accepted problem.



Please provide evidence for this statement. Your opinion isn't a fact.


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## lyonsa3 (23 May 2011)

Ok everybody has their option on the BWM and RWD.
What do people think of a Audi A4 2.0 TDi 143 SE. Again this would be a 08 model.


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## Firefly (24 May 2011)

lyonsa3 said:


> Ok everybody has their option on the BWM and RWD.
> What do people think of a Audi A4 2.0 TDi 143 SE. Again this would be a 08 model.



Nicest car Skoda ever produced


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## johnnygman (24 May 2011)

dahamsta said:


> Please provide evidence for this statement. Your opinion isn't a fact.


 
It is a simple FACT that in a front wheel drive due to the engine of the car being at the front there is greater weight bearing on the front wheels which results in a much higher degree of grip in icy or snowing conditions, this has it's draw back in very powerful cars in that it does lend itself to torque steer when accelerating hard in normal/wet condition but for the average powered car, it is not an issue and has a major advantage over RWD in snow or ice when both cars are fitted with normal tyres.
Why do you think other BMW drivers earlier have said they drive around with heavy weights in the boot? Thought it was pretty obvious, to help the car achieve traction.

I have driven a vast number of cars over the years BMW's included and they have many pro's, and as I said they are good cars, but please do not let your personal affection/ownership cloud the issue as your quote above is both insulting & shows a complete lack of understanding of the car you proudly and somewhat childishly/foolishly profess to be something of an expert in driving and of course the people who went off the road in BMW's just could not drive them funny enough.
But then many studies have shown that when questioned the majority of drivers believe their level of skill behind the wheel to be significantly above average so your statement is not surprising.

I did not come on to bash BMW so don't be overly defensive of 4 wheels and some metal, try and be objective and point out some of the pro's that you feel they offer, i have already suggested some of them earlier and if I could pick a nice oil burner if would be 530d as that engine is a good as anything around and has bags of torque.


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## johnnygman (24 May 2011)

lyonsa3 said:


> Ok everybody has their option on the BWM and RWD.
> What do people think of a Audi A4 2.0 TDi 143 SE. Again this would be a 08 model.


 
Fine car, very nicely finished interior, alot of them on the road it has to be said again but that is a good sign I guess.
For the price difference would you not consider a Passat say as they are a little bigger, same engine and build quality, though I appreciate the name is not quite as prestiege as the Audi  but worth considering if your in that market.


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## Firefly (25 May 2011)

From personal experience the BMWs are not good in the ice. As I said, it didn't affect me too much as I drive on good city roads. However I had to go out home once during the snap and couldn't make it up a certain hill. I rang my mother (sad I know) and she came to collect me. In her FWD car we sailed up the hill. A neighbour of my parents (with a steep enough driveway) had to leave their car at the end of their driveway for the period. Having said that there are options as mentioned - winter tyres and these tyre socks that can be placed over the wheels. Although a con in my book  it wouldn't be enough to stop me buying another BMW (unless the cold snaps were to continue on an annual basis and lenghten in duration).


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## Brendan Burgess (25 May 2011)

thread closed for moderator review


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## Brendan Burgess (25 May 2011)

Folks

Please read the Posting Guidelines as going off topic and being offensive to other posters ruins a thread and wastes the moderators' time. I have deleted 16 posts.

If you want to Let Off Steam, do so in the right forum

If someone is abusive to you,  don't respond in kind. If you are offended, report the post. 

Brendan


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## xertpo (25 May 2011)

I agree that BMW RWD are useless in the snow, as are any RWD in similar conditions. However, the simple solution is winter tires which the Germans and Dutch all use. Problem solved.


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## dahamsta (25 May 2011)

Both I and other BMW drivers have already stated that we have used our cars in the ice and snow and they were very specifically not "useless". My car was on standard summer tires at the time and I had no issues.

I accept the moderator's points absolutely, but these blanket statements are 100% incorrect and should be refuted to prevent other working under this ridiculous misapprehension.


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## lyonsa3 (25 May 2011)

I've narrowed it down to the BMW 3 and 5 series.  I'm willing to accept the potential problems with the bad weather in the future with RWD.

Just one last question, do people think it is worth spending an extra £1000 to reduce mileage to 54,0000 miles on the 320D SE, likewise reduce the 520D to 68,000 miles?
Or do people think the mileage on a BMW diesel isn't an issue as they should last 200,000 + miles over their life span.


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## dahamsta (25 May 2011)

If the cars are of the the same era, they're likely the same engines. Generally speaking the bigger the engine the better the longevity, and 2l is about average, but on those kinds of mileages you're unlikely to see problems for quite some time to come on a well looked-after diesel. Your focus should really be on service history and general condition.

My dad just retired his 2l Carina at 300k and it was only just starting to act up; and the wife sold her 180k 1.9l Passat recently, still going strong on the roads out there.


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## Pique318 (26 May 2011)

Modern diesels are not as reliable or long-lasting as their older counterparts.
Improved power, reduced emissions and better driveability have all had their effects on the complexity and therefore fragility of modern diesel engines.

I't more or less accepted that you need to run about 20k a year to keep them in top order or you may well encounter a big bill.
Failed injectors (800 ea), Turbos (800), Clutch (1000+) can all occur around the 100k miles mark in cars that aren't pampered (full service history with correct oil) and that are driven nice and hard regularly.
Popping out for a 2 mile spin for a pint of milk doesn't count for much unless you drive it hard for 50 miles every week to get the engine up to working temp and blow out the cobwebs, so to speak.

6-10000 mile service intervals are generally accepted to be the limit.

Old non-direct injection diesels, with no dual-mass flywheel or diesel particulate filter and a simple turbo (or none at all) would easily do 3-400k miles with just a simple oil change every 5k miles.
Things have changed.

If you do high mileage, go for it, if not, ensure that the tax is cheap and drive the thing.

BMW make good ones, but look after it or it will cost you. 
The VAG 1.9l Diesel is antiguated now.
The 2L is nice and refined.
The 2.2 Honda is one of the best out there. reliability wise, it's prob the best of the bunch.
Peugeot (PSA) diesels are easily the market leaders in experience, so that has to count for a lot. The new 508 looks gorgeous too !!
I'd personally look at the Subaru Boxer diesels too. The Legacy is a lovely car and you get 4wd so all this handbags at dawn over RWD being rubbish in snow (which they are, btw, compared to FWD) is a moot point.


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