# House purchaser discovers planning non compliance and now seeks compensation 8yrs on



## financially (9 Sep 2010)

My parents applied for PP for a house on their own land almost 30yrs ago. They applied for and got permission to build it 65ft from the road. 

After that people advised that they should put it further back as it was a large house so finally they built it 155ft back. It didn't occur to them that they should reapply for planning and nothing was ever done about it. As they say now it was a different time back then. 20yrs later they sold the house and nobody ever seemed to discover this lack of planning compliance during the sale.

At the time of the sale an engineer was employed to check compliance, they presume he was employed by the buyer although they knew him as we live in a small town. Is is correct to think that the buyer would employ the engineer to check this? 

That was 8 yrs ago and the man who bought the house is now trying to sell it and has discovered this lack of planning compliance.

He has sent my parents solicitor a letter from his solicitor saying he wants compensation.

What is the legal view on this?

He's a very unpleasant man, possibly if he were nicer and had not caused so much upset in our area they would be more disposed to feeling bad about this but they do not wish to compensate him at all. 

Thanks


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## onq (9 Sep 2010)

financially said:


> _Apologies at the start for the long post.....
> 
> My parents applied for PP for a house on their own land almost 30yrs ago. They applied for and got permission to build it 65ft from the road. After that people advised that they should put it further back as it was a large house so finally they built it 155ft back. It didn't occur to them that they should reapply for planning and nothing was ever done about it. As they say now it was a different time back then. 20yrs later they sold the house and nobody ever seemed to discover this lack of planning compliance during the sale.
> 
> ...



There are four sub-forums forums here dealing with specific legal issues

Askaboutlaw - For legal issues not covered elsewhere.
Ask about Conveyancing in Mortgages forum.
Ask about Road traffic law in Cars & Motoring.
Ask about Tenant issues in Property Investment.
Even so, its not clear whether this should go in Askaboutlaw or the Mortgages forum.
Please mods could confirm the position.

I'm going to jump in here just to start the ball rolling on the planning  law end.
I hope the legals here will have the time to address the  substantive issues under other headings.

---------------------------------

On the planning law side there are some obvious issues several people here are competent to advise you on this.
Relocating a house 90ft definitely requires permission, as does varying the associated drainage and extending the driveway.
The 1994 regulations gave a five year  period of grace to local authorities in which they could take  enforcement action.

If your parents house was never the subject of an enforcement file,  letter or action, the Council were probably precluded from taking action  against it five years after it was completed.
Even if a file had been opened but no legal action was taken or if  taken, concluded, then its is possible that too much time has elapsed  for the Council to take a successful action to "remedy" matters.
The completion date of "nearly thirty years ago" is also well outside  both the 7 year [if built without permission] and 12 year [it built with  permission but non-compliantly] timeframes for taking enforcement  action under the current planning laws.

The fact that the purchaser has had eight years in which to enjoy/  familiarize himself with the property yet did not raise the matter may  not support any legal claim he might bring.
While he can claim he has only recently discovered the matter, it may be  that any act or omission your parents might be held liable for may  relate to the prevous dealing.

Whether the purchaser can successfully take a legal action against you or your  parents and cost them money mounting a defense is another matter.
Caveat emptor - buyer beware - often applies, but a simple appliction for retention may avoid unnecessary grief.
An alternative could be to ask a competent person to write what's known as as "letter of comfort".

ONQ.

All advice on AAM is remote from the situation and cannot be relied upon                 as a defence or support - in and of itself - should  legal        action    be      taken.
Competent legal and building professionals should be asked to advise in                 Real Life with rights to inspect and issue reports on the         matters    at      hand.


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## mathepac (9 Sep 2010)

onq said:


> ... The 1994 regulations gave a five year  period of grace to local authorities in which they could take  enforcement action. ...


If, by my own calculations, planning was granted and the house completed in the early 80's, would that change anything?


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## financially (10 Sep 2010)

I'm not really wondering about the planning part and it is almost 30yrs ago so there is no way the house can be pulled down. 

But my main question is do my parents have any liability towards paying for retention or compensating the buyer 8 yrs after the sale?  

Thanks


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## Mrs Vimes (10 Sep 2010)

I can't see how your parents could possibly be liable for a house they sold at any stage in the past.
The buyer would surely have checked for himself whether the house was in compliance with planning permission - he would have had a solicitor and engineer to check for him.
If your parents had supplied him with a certificate from their engineer to state that the house was in compliance with planning then it is that engineer's problem.
Unless your parents forged a cert of compliance (which I'm sure you would have mentioned) I really can't see any liability. ONQ or a legal eagle may correct me.
Sybil


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## onq (15 Sep 2010)

mathepac said:


> If, by my own calculations, planning was granted and the house completed in the early 80's, would that change anything?



No, mathepac, not really, AFAICS
It would probably make it less likely action could be taken if it hadn't been taken around that time.
I'm not sure when the Court Case was, but after that there was an ad hoc "5 year limit" until it was written into the 1994 regulations.
I was pointing to a definite point in law about a time by which, if no action had been taken, no future action could occur.
Before 1994, I don't know what written law applied, just that case law precedent.

ONQ.


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## onq (15 Sep 2010)

Mrs Vimes said:


> I can't see how your parents could possibly be liable for a house they sold at any stage in the past.
> The buyer would surely have checked for himself whether the house was in compliance with planning permission - he would have had a solicitor and engineer to check for him.
> If your parents had supplied him with a certificate from their engineer to state that the house was in compliance with planning then it is that engineer's problem.
> Unless your parents forged a cert of compliance (which I'm sure you would have mentioned) I really can't see any liability. ONQ or a legal eagle may correct me.
> Sybil



Without knowing more details of the case, that's my understanding of the matter too Sybil.
Unless the vendors themselves personally misrepresented the position they would appear to have no liability.
Or course, them merely saying that the house "has planning permission" while knowing its built in the wrong place could be a fraud for all I know.
And any professional agents acting on their behalf may attract a liability even if any misrepresentation was inadvertent or unknowing.
Finally there are still other matters of compliance with technical details of the drainage and access requirements.

ONQ.

All advice on AAM is remote from the situation and cannot be relied upon                  as a defence or support - in and of itself - should   legal        action    be      taken.
Competent legal and building professionals should be asked to advise in                  Real Life with rights to inspect and issue reports on  the         matters    at      hand.


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## Mr. C.J.H. (19 Sep 2010)

General condition 36 of the standard Law Society contract for sale provides a full warranty in respect of all planning matters and basically means that the vendor is giving the purchaser a full warranty that all planning issue are kosher. Often the contract will be amended by special condition to limit this full warranty. However, It is possible to sue for breach of this warranty but any such proceedings would have to be brought within the appropriate limitation period, for contract matters proceedings must be instituted within six years, after which they would become statute barred.

However that said there are a number of potential variables and it is impossible to give a conclusive answer without knowing the full details of the original sale. This is definitely a case where your parents should contact a solicitor,  who will be able to give a definitive answer. It won't cost very much  and will probably give them a bit of peace of mind.


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## ajapale (19 Sep 2010)

onq said:


> There are four sub-forums forums here dealing with specific legal issues
> 
> Askaboutlaw - For legal issues not covered elsewhere.
> Ask about Conveyancing in Mortgages forum.
> ...



We'll leave it in AAL.


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## Neg Covenant (5 Oct 2010)

There are a number of variables:

1. If it was 8 years ago then the statute of limitations may have expired. It would be hard to describe non-compliance as a latent defect.

2. The engineer himself may be liable depending on the contents of the cert. It is more likley your parents engaged him but if they didn't then it could put them out of the picture.

3. The terms of the contract and replies to requisitions on title are relevant to any claim. Your parents solicitor, or another solicitor, needs to examine your parents' file from the house sale. Another solicitor might be better as it is always helps if your advisers are removed from the situation.

I think your parents should probably be ok but you won't know until you have taken proper advice. One thing your parents should do is make sure that all correspondence is kept between solicitors.


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