# KBC tells Central Bank it's time to move on from their tracker focus



## Brendan Burgess (14 Nov 2019)

KBC boss on tracker focus: ‘Come on, guys, turn the page’
					

Belgian banking boss says focus on ‘nitty gritty stuff’ is holding back Irish banks




					www.irishtimes.com
				





The head of KBC Bank Ireland’s Belgian parent has rounded on the Central Bank of Ireland for its continued focus on the tracker mortgage scandal and lenders’ other past sins, saying this “nitty-gritty stuff” is holding back the industry.


“What is still an annoying thing is all tracker mortgage stuff and, honestly, we would recommend to Central Bank of Ireland: come on, guys, turn the page,” KBC Group chief executive Johan Thijs told analysts on a call on Thursday (). “We’re focused on doing business, we’ve learned our lessons, we know what to do.”


----------



## Leighlinboy (14 Nov 2019)

“Of course we expect a fine. It goes without saying, given the extent to what happened with trackers,” Mr Roebben said. “But we’ve no indication when the investigation will be concluded.”
Is this anticipation of any action coming from further FSPO investigations, or are the CB still tying up some items from Investigation in the background .


----------



## Sunny (14 Nov 2019)

Ah ok then. Sorry about that. A long as you know what to do, we will leave you alone then.....We trust you


----------



## Brendan Burgess (14 Nov 2019)

Leighlinboy said:


> are the CB still tying up some items from Investigation in the background .



The CB takes months or years on any issue to do with enforcement proceedings. 

It's supposed to be relatively non legal, but they go very legal about it. 

So the delay means nothing for the people who are still hoping to get trackers back.

Brendan


----------



## demoivre (14 Nov 2019)

Similar to a predatory paedophile telling Tusla he's ok to work in a creche.


----------



## Foxy007 (14 Nov 2019)

Speaks volumes! Move on indeed!


----------



## PadKiss (14 Nov 2019)

Hi all I wanted to put forward my absolute disgust at the comments of the KBC chief today regarding the Central Bank and what it should do in regards the Tracker Issues, which are appalling. People are living with the consequences of what this lender (and the others) has done and many are only now going through the appeals process to have their cases heard. There are many accounts that were deemed not impacted by the CBI investigation, that will now have to progress to the FSPO process of complaint.
I write this having finished two Oral Hearings today and the effects this had on families and there are wounds that remain infected and untreated and these comments pour salt onto these families.
It is not a matter that can be simply brushed off and forgotten much and all as Mr. Thijs would like that to be the case and I for one will keep reminding him that what occurred has left many with fall out affects that will last for years.
Utter disgraceful what he stated.
Padraic Kissane


----------



## Ice Berg (14 Nov 2019)

Very well said Padraic. Shameful and disrespectful to all those that have suffered and continue to suffer at what the banks did. Needless to say he wasn't 1 of them.


----------



## Brendan Burgess (14 Nov 2019)

PadKiss said:


> Utter disgraceful what he stated.



Disgraceful and stupid.  As you say it rubs salt into the wounds and prolongs the problem.

When all the Ombudsman cases and when all the High Court cases are finished, we can all then move on.

Brendan


----------



## MugsGame (14 Nov 2019)

move on ... to the next scandal.


----------



## Zebedee (14 Nov 2019)

If the CBI wants to look at the issues with culture in banking, they can start here. Reminds me of Bob Diamond (then head of Barclays) who said in 2012 that the “time for contrition is over”. Coming a day after Ed Sibley’s speech goes to show how out of touch Mr Thijs is. Does he ever talk to somebody in his own Irish subsidiary? Or do any of them read the papers.


----------



## Johnc6 (14 Nov 2019)

I read this thread, thought it was a joke, you couldn't make this stuff up. When the FSPO start finding in our favor and roll out to others in these cohorts we'll see what he has to say then. No mention of the heavies doing their bidding at evictions either I see.


----------



## Gimmestrength (15 Nov 2019)

PadKiss said:


> Hi all I wanted to put forward my absolute disgust at the comments of the KBC chief today regarding the Central Bank and what it should do in regards the Tracker Issues, which are appalling. People are living with the consequences of what this lender (and the others) has done and many are only now going through the appeals process to have their cases heard. There are many accounts that were deemed not impacted by the CBI investigation, that will now have to progress to the FSPO process of complaint.
> I write this having finished two Oral Hearings today and the effects this had on families and there are wounds that remain infected and untreated and these comments pour salt onto these families.
> It is not a matter that can be simply brushed off and forgotten much and all as Mr. Thijs would like that to be the case and I for one will keep reminding him that what occurred has left many with fall out affects that will last for years.
> Utter disgraceful what he stated.
> Padraic Kissane


Well said Padraic you need to keep saying this and saying it publicly (outside of this forum).... we know that KBC and their ilk will only do the right thing when pressured into it


----------



## Brendan Burgess (15 Nov 2019)

This will be covered by Seán O'Rourke in the next half an hour or so.

Brendan


----------



## Sarenco (15 Nov 2019)

Karl Deeter making the very valid point on SO'R that the Central Bank has taken _way_ too long to bring this issue to a resolution.


----------



## Johnc6 (15 Nov 2019)

Sarenco said:


> Karl Deeter making the very valid point on SO'R that the Central Bank has taken _way_ too long to bring this issue to a resolution.


It was the Banks who prolonged this sorry saga, firstly with denial of the issue, then delay and procrastination on the various cohorts and it still goes on.


----------



## demoivre (15 Nov 2019)

This guy doesn't even appear to believe in due process. As alluded to above above by PadKiss and Brendan, as of August 2019 the FSPO had over 1100 tracker appeals to deal with and who knows what tracker cases will be brought to the High court. This could drag on for years.


----------



## Brendan Burgess (15 Nov 2019)

It would be good for everyone if the outstanding issues could be resolved as quickly as possible. 

It's a pity that the Ombudsman can't make a "cohort" ruling which would apply to all cases.  

Even if the Ombudsman rejects a KBC "flyer" complaint, there is nothing to stop someone else making the same complaint for years.

And if he upholds the flyer complaint, there is no obligation on KBC to apply it to all affected customers. 

The lenders are right to say that we need to restore trust in banking. But they must get their own house in order. And they must start charging mortgage rates closer to the eurozone norms.  Having said that, KBC has very low rates and does not indulge in the cash back nonsense and other nonsense of the likes of BoI and ptsb.

Brendan


----------



## SaySomething (15 Nov 2019)

Brendan Burgess said:


> And if he upholds the flyer complaint, there is no obligation on KBC to apply it to all affected customers.


Did the Central Bank not say at the last Oireachtas hearing that if the Ombudsman rules on a cohort that was previously excluded they expect the bank to review all impacted cases?


----------



## Brendan Burgess (15 Nov 2019)

Hi SS 

They did.  And the lenders may do it.

But I suspect that the bank will argue that each case is separate and the general cases are different for some reason.

It would be great if there were a mechanism whereby, for example, the ptsb discounted tracker could be brought on behalf of all those affected. 

If the Ombudsman upholds the complaint, they would set out the principles to be followed by ptsb in all cases.

Brendan


----------



## LadyHB (15 Nov 2019)

Has anyone an email address for the Johan Thijs? I think he needs a strongly worded email highlighting exactly what pages need to be turned! What an idiot.  So out of touch. So arrogant.


----------



## ClubMan (15 Nov 2019)

Print it off and send it in the post for his attention?
Talk about hubris.
Bizarre and depressing comments from this guy...


----------



## Brendan Burgess (15 Nov 2019)

*Apology on behalf of KBC Group CEO Johan Thijs *​ 

KBC Group CEO has today offered a sincere apology for comments made yesterday during an analyst call following the announcement of the bank’s third quarter results.

“I would like to personally and sincerely apologise to our customers and to the Irish public for the offence caused by my words yesterday in relation to the tracker mortgage examination and investigation.

I want to acknowledge the insensitivity of what I said and the manner in which it was delivered. It was unintentional and I am truly sorry for the offence caused. 

KBC has previously apologised for the way we handled tracker mortgages on behalf of our customers, many of whom were directly impacted and I would like, also personally, to formally reiterate that apology again today.

I would also like to acknowledge the crucial role played by the Central Bank of Ireland (CBI) in all regulatory matters, including the tracker mortgage examination. I want to express my support and respect on behalf of KBC for the role that the CBI plays in the regulation of banking in Ireland. We have fully cooperated with this investigation and will continue to do so until all matters in relation to tracker mortgages are dealt with. 

KBC are determined to act as a positive force for choice in the Irish banking sector. We are committed to the process of cultural change in banking in Ireland. While my words yesterday do not reflect that, I want to assure people that KBC and myself will do everything in its power to regain public  trust.  We are fully committed to further supporting the Irish economy and the Irish people.  My commitment is that we do so through actions and not just words.”





*Viviane Huybrecht*
General Manager Corporate Communication / spokesperson KBC Group


----------



## ClubMan (15 Nov 2019)

The manner in which his comments were delivered was unintentional?
Seems legit...


----------



## A1iron (15 Nov 2019)

Bankers display utter contempt for their victims. Central bank and FSPO operate at snails pace which works to their advantage..


----------



## MugsGame (16 Nov 2019)

Doubling down on him being a right banker.


----------



## notabene (16 Nov 2019)

Brendan Burgess said:


> *Apology on behalf of KBC Group CEO Johan Thijs *​
> 
> KBC Group CEO has today offered a sincere apology for comments made yesterday during an analyst call following the announcement of the bank’s third quarter results.
> 
> ...


Yet another apology, rings hollow tbh and from my own experience of dealing with bankers winging about the lack of bonuses at my dining room table, I’d say it’s what they’re all thinking, an utter disgrace  

If they dealt with things properly, didn’t evade customers, prevaricate and obfuscate it would go a long way to having it all sorted in a proper timeline which would benefit everyone


----------



## zxcvbnm (16 Nov 2019)

His lack of judgement was incredible with this statement. Completely tone deaf. The apology counts for nothing. He clearly has little empathy with customers.


----------



## Stitcher (16 Nov 2019)

But it actually helps our fight to show just how disconnected and un customer focused the banks are.


----------



## Trackman (16 Nov 2019)

An alternative view. 

Maybe he is right, we all need to move on.

The Central Bank should put a time limit on banks to mop up this mess. 

Any Bank that fails to comply should have debilitating penalties imposed.


----------



## NoRegretsCoyote (16 Nov 2019)

Most people see banking as a kind of necessary industry along with waste collection and sewage treatment.

They are probably right.

Maybe Belgium is a country where people love their bankers but I suspect not.

Retail bankers in Ireland will just have to act penitent in public forever more. It's not that hard. They make a good living in return.


----------



## Brendan Burgess (16 Nov 2019)

Trackman said:


> Maybe he is right, we all need to move on.



We absolutely must move on. 

But the banks have to  get a move on first. 

Banks and mortgage lending are essential to a successful economy and society.  

Brendan


----------



## Dpdp01050842 (17 Nov 2019)

Maybe I’m wrong but I agree with him somewhat. Central bank should never have allowed the “independent” appeals to be such a protracted process. It should have been quick and then on to Ombudsman or legal but that wasn’t the case. If banks were slow with responses or dragging things it should have been punitive. It wasn’t .


----------



## john_mcm (17 Nov 2019)

PadKiss said:


> Hi all I wanted to put forward my absolute disgust at the comments of the KBC chief today regarding the Central Bank and what it should do in regards the Tracker Issues, which are appalling. People are living with the consequences of what this lender (and the others) has done and many are only now going through the appeals process to have their cases heard. There are many accounts that were deemed not impacted by the CBI investigation, that will now have to progress to the FSPO process of complaint.
> I write this having finished two Oral Hearings today and the effects this had on families and there are wounds that remain infected and untreated and these comments pour salt onto these families.
> It is not a matter that can be simply brushed off and forgotten much and all as Mr. Thijs would like that to be the case and I for one will keep reminding him that what occurred has left many with fall out affects that will last for years.
> Utter disgraceful what he stated.
> Padraic Kissane



Well said Padraic, It is an absolute disgrace that someone in his position knowing the impact this has had on people to make a statement like that and the hollow apology afterwards that was forced by the backlash means nothing. I myself have been overpaying on my mortgage since 2009 which has had massive financial implications on myself and my family which continues to this day. As one example I have not paid into my pension since 2010 due to these overpayments and because of this I have also lost out on what my employer would have paid in if I was able to continue my contributions. This basically means I will not have a sufficient retirement fund when I need it and this is just one of the things that has been affected. The bank is a joke to deal with and don't care what the affects have been, currently are or will be in the future. I am only hoping that the ombudsman makes a decision in our favour but who knows how long that will take.


----------



## Babog007 (27 Nov 2019)

PadKiss said:


> Hi all I wanted to put forward my absolute disgust at the comments of the KBC chief today regarding the Central Bank and what it should do in regards the Tracker Issues, which are appalling. People are living with the consequences of what this lender (and the others) has done and many are only now going through the appeals process to have their cases heard. There are many accounts that were deemed not impacted by the CBI investigation, that will now have to progress to the FSPO process of complaint.
> I write this having finished two Oral Hearings today and the effects this had on families and there are wounds that remain infected and untreated and these comments pour salt onto these families.
> It is not a matter that can be simply brushed off and forgotten much and all as Mr. Thijs would like that to be the case and I for one will keep reminding him that what occurred has left many with fall out affects that will last for years.
> Utter disgraceful what he stated.
> Padraic Kissane



We too are disgusted. We'd met with you Padraic June 2018 and you gave us great guidance (ps kids had chickenpox). We've been asked if we want to have an oral hearing. 

I'd like this opportunity but should we have someone attending an oral hearing with us? I've asked a member of the Joint Fiance Committee who's been supporting our case but I'm not sure if they'd be free.

Thanking you


----------



## Brendan Burgess (27 Nov 2019)

Babog007 said:


> I've asked a member of the Joint Fiance Committee



I wouldn't think that is appropriate. Bringing a politician with you to an oral hearing? 

If I were on the Panel I would probably go out of  my way to make sure I was not influenced.  I would make a decision on its merits but in grey areas, I would probably tilt against the customer.  It's like when people apply for a job and then get a politician to put in a word for them.

Brendan


----------



## Babog007 (27 Nov 2019)

Brendan Burgess said:


> I wouldn't think that is appropriate. Bringing a politician with you to an oral hearing?
> 
> If I were on the Panel I would probably go out of  my way to make sure I was not influenced.  I would make a decision on its merits but in grey areas, I would probably tilt against the customer.  It's like when people apply for a job and then get a politician to put in a word for them.
> 
> Brendan


Thanks for that Brendan. We couldn't get help from anyone else.  Padraic cannot help either due to CBI restrictions.

And the Bank are still predujicing our appeal. They've redacted notes and withheld audio along with telling lies. I've reported each time to CBI. However CBI can't intervene but requested to use our case in their wider examination stating that the Bank should be fully cooperating and giving all.

I just feel we are on our own but I now see your point that it could be seen as influencing.


----------

