# Dublin Bus



## Iano (8 Mar 2004)

I'm sure that many of you saw the newspaper articles over t'weekend about Dublin Bus having more than €9m in its coffers in unreturned change. This arises because, if you don't have the correct change to pay your fare, the driver will (or should) give you a receipt for the change due to you. But so many people seem to bin these receipts or just not bother collecting...and I am one of them.

On a related matter, twice in the past six weeks I have given bus drivers a €2 coin for a sub-€2 fare and they have  'hesitated' in issuing me with a receipt for my change, until I reminded them to do so. If it happened once, I would have said it was a genuine mistake. But to happen twice is a little less genuine. And I only take the bus once a fortnight. 

So be wise, as I now am, when you are due a refund receipt. It's bad enough that Dublin Bus is making extra change. Let's not line the driver's pockets as well. 

And don't forget that there are many charities that will accept your unwanted change receipts. They will cash them in.


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## Joe Nonety (8 Mar 2004)

I remember 3 or 4 years ago when they said it was worth £50,000 a year. I can't believe its gone up so much. I remember lots of shops had charity boxes that accepted bus receipts, but I don't see them too much anymore.
Trocaire should launch a campaign "Bus Receipts For Trocaire" and they'd make a packet.

I still have receipts that are in £ and p. Are these still valid?


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## Flake (8 Mar 2004)

*Who pockets the excess?*

Last week myself and hubby jumped on a bus to go 3 stops.  We only had €2 coin - asked for min fare which was 85 cent.  It was only when we got off the bus we noticed that we had been given 2 no. 85 cent tickets and no receipt for the excess paid. Very cheeky.


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## Tommy (8 Mar 2004)

*Re: Who pockets the excess?*

This is theft by another name and i can't see how Dublin Bus get away with it. Imagine the fuss if the likes of Ryanair or taxi firms dreamed up a similar scheme


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## daltonr (8 Mar 2004)

*Re: Who pockets the excess?*

It's a great scam in some ways.  It only affects bus users.
How do bus users get to town?  They take the bus.
So they have to pay to get to town to get back their own money.

But sure if you had a system that was bringing in this much cash, would you try to fix it?

-Rd


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## Ham Slicer (8 Mar 2004)

*Re: Who pockets the excess?*

I don't see a problem with getting the refund tickets.

It has undoubtedly cut back on the number of crimes against bus drivers - this alone makes it worthwhile.

Obviously some drivers are too lazy or cunning to issue refunds all the time.  Just ask and you shall receive.

With regards to claiming your refund - everyone passes through town at some stage and if not just stick them in the post.


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## Tommy (8 Mar 2004)

*Re: Who pockets the excess?*



> It has undoubtedly cut back on the number of crimes against bus drivers - this alone makes it worthwhile.



If security were the key issue, how come DB have yet to introduce a proper prepaid ticketing scheme as applies in every civilised city in Europe?


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## Joe Nonety (9 Mar 2004)

*Re: Who pockets the excess?*

Busdrivers often don't count the change. I don't think they're trying to rip anyone off as they certainly don't get the excess, its just that they're busy looking to see the traffic, etc. I've often been short of change and they've never spotted it. Likewise how are they going to spot that need to give 10c change to someone paying e.g. €1.90 instead of €1.80.


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## Laoise (9 Mar 2004)

*bus receipts*

Might be an idea to post  a bunch of receipts to a charity of your choice ?
Laoise


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## una (9 Mar 2004)

With regards to claiming your refund - everyone passes through town at some stage and if not just stick them in the post. 

I have to say the chances of me getting into the Dublin Bus head office in O'Connell Street, Monday - Friday, between 9 and 5 are very remote. I work in Dublin 8 it is just not possible, and I think this is why D.B have so much in unclaimed receipts. They are not making it easy for people to get their money back. 

I do not use the bus very often, only jumping on if it is wet on the way in or out of work, therefor none of the prepay tickets are suitable. The weekly monthly etc are no good.


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## Breeze (9 Mar 2004)

This DB scam has really being going on long enough. First it should be possible to redeem at local newsagent, post office. Second I don't think the drivers can pocket it unless they print off alot of refunds at the end of their shift. unlikely. I thought the change went automatically to charties and therefore didn't take the receipt. next time I'll take it and give it to any of the abundant homeless people/beggers who should have the time to cash them in. 
I think a letter to Seamus Brennan is in order.


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## <A HREF=http://pub145.ezboard.com/baskaboutmoney.s (9 Mar 2004)

> If security were the key issue, how come DB have yet to introduce a proper prepaid ticketing scheme as applies in every civilised city in Europe?



Not defending the retention of unclaimed change by Dublin Bus but how exactly do the existing prepaid ticketing systems (available from most newsagents etc.) not fit the bill in this context? I've never found them any more hassle than the sytems used in continental European cities. More expensive all right - but that's a different issue altogether...

[broken link removed]


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## rainyday (9 Mar 2004)

> First it should be possible to redeem at local newsagent, post office.


Do you expect newsagents to do this for free? I'd expect them to take a cut - who do expect to fund their fee?


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## Tommy (10 Mar 2004)

> I've never found them any more hassle than the sytems used in continental European cities.



On the continent, you can buy your bus tram or metro ticket from a tobacco or newspaper stall - not on the transport itself. This applies to all tickets, not just daily or weekly tickets. You validate the ticket once your journey begin. No need for conductors, no need to distract or delay the driver. Why not the same here?


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## <A HREF=http://pub145.ezboard.com/baskaboutmoney.s (10 Mar 2004)

OK - I get you now. Although, to be fair, they do sell some single journey/time limited tickets through ticket agents:

[broken link removed]
[broken link removed] (Travel 90 Handy Pack)

I've always believed that they should just get rid of cash on the buses altogether and go with prepaid tickets completely. There would be smoking ban style uproar for a while but they we'd all just get on with it.


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## Marie (12 Mar 2004)

*Dublin Bus ticket system*

The "Exact Fare" rule came in at the same time as the driver-only system, when conductors "got the bullet"!

It is eminently sensible that the driver not have to fiddle around with change.  As a public-transport user who does not own a car on ecological grounds I find it infuriating when someone gets onto a crowded bus with a twenty note for a 50p ticket!  It is antisocial to the n'th degree!  There is an excellent system of pre-pay tickets, even for occasional users, in the flexible Rambler ticket scheme.  It also costs a great deal less than buying individual fares.

Dublin Bus drivers I've chatted with about this told me the refund of change scheme was DESIGNED to encourage prepaid ticket purchase or people making sure they had the exact fare for their journey.

Bellyaching about a few cents change seems to me to be storming-in-a-teacup when the REAL issue is the devastation of what was becoming a reliable and reasonably-priced public transport system in Dublin, when the "partial privatisation" rubbish kicks in! People in Dublin won't know what they've had till it's gone (Joni Mitchell sang  that in the 60's about paving paradise and it's still true!)


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## Westbound (12 Mar 2004)

*Dublin Bus Privatisation*

Indeed - one suspects that Mr Brennan will screw this up royally. I am no fan of the unions and their protectionist stance, but at the same time I cannot see the point of taking 25% of Dub Bus and making it private, it doesn't actually solve a damn thing, we still have the same number of buses and routes.

Mr B, I think, should identify new routes (e.g. an orbital route bases in the inner and outer rings in the new traffic plan) and those routes that require more capacity, then invite the private companies (and Dublin Bus) to come in to operate these routes. At some point other Dublin Bus routes should come up for franchise - where the winner supplies thier own buses and drivers, as opposed to Mr B saying. OK First Choice, you win the 15A route. Here are all Dublin Buses used on that route, off you go. There is no point robbing from Peter to pay Paul.....


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## Sludge (12 Mar 2004)

*You shouldn't have to ask.*

My own sons often comment on the fact that the driver does not print, that there is a refund due, on the ticket. Maybe we should start reporting the individual drivers that do this to their bosses.


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## Delboy (12 Mar 2004)

*DB*

I have seen some drivers over the years run off tickets on a quiet part of the journey, and put it in their pockets. I always assumed that this was the 'change' that they had'nt given out and they were pocketing for themselves. (note - this is just my assumption and i have only ever seen a small few drivers do this).

I'd be guessing that there is a tolerance level (plus or minus) on each cash take on a journey, as some people will pay over/under every time. And I've never heard of any procedure in Dublin Bus where the driver makes up/receives the difference.

I think it was Marie that said, there's nothing more annoying than someone trying to pay for a 50c journey with a €20 note......... I myself find nothing more annoying than a passenger, who's been standing at a stop for God knows how long, who probably takes the same bus every day, who then gets on the bus and proceeds to search in a bag for their purse and then starts to finger through it for change. ( i've posted a clue in their as to the gender of the passengers that mostly seem to inflict this infuriating ritual on me whenever i get a bus/q in a shop etc !!!!!!!) .


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## <A HREF=http://pub145.ezboard.com/baskaboutmoney.s (12 Mar 2004)

*Re: DB*



> My own sons often comment on the fact that the driver does not print, that there is a refund due, on the ticket. Maybe we should start reporting the individual drivers that do this to their bosses.



Or better still just ask for the change ticket there and then.



> I always assumed that this was the 'change' that they had'nt given out and they were pocketing for themselves. (note - this is just my assumption and i have only ever seen a small few drivers do this).



I've seen drivers printing something off when finishing a shift and assumed that it was some sort of tally for when they handed the ticket machine back in at the depot.


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## Statler (12 Mar 2004)

*Re: DB*



> I've seen drivers printing something off when finishing a shift and assumed that it was some sort of tally for when they handed the ticket machine back in at the depot.


I assumed the same, especially since drivers seem to print off the same thing to hand to an inspector when they get on to check tickets.


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## Marie (13 Mar 2004)

*DB*

afaik they print off starting-time and a code and all the other bumph about the vehicle when they start the shift, and a list of tickets issued between that and "sign-off".

Must say posters here have a low opinion of DB drivers as cunning thieving work-shy fiends     My experience is they're "diamonds":tallchappy     I've seen DB drivers go to extraordinary lengths to help passengers with problems/directions/lost property. On one occasion a driver wrote me out a "free pass" after my purse containing Rambler ticket, credit cards money, the aul'Ryanair ticket etc. was stolen, so I could get home quickly to cancel everything.

On the wider subject of DB "partial privatisation" I don't think the city will find some favourite routes go to privileged parts of the network.  Much more likely all servers will end up serving all routes........but badly!  Here (Colchester) there are four servers; tickets from one cannot be used on any of the others.  All operate the "Elderly" ticket discount differently (probably something the gvt. haven't even THOUGHT about as far as OAP pass/multiple servers in Dublin is concerned); no schedule recognises the existence of the others - so a convoy of one-of-each (server) arrives at a rural bus-stop all together, with nothing for another hour.  Conditions for drivers are worse, most working clapped-out vehicles with filthy windows, non-functioning windscreen-wipers, poor pay and conditions.  Maintenance quality for vehicles drops and safety issues are skimped - of course!  The whole thing ends up in poor morale, poor services.........and perforce - more cars on the road as people have to get to work somehow!

Hope someone gets wise before the event as it is the old and the less-well-off who will suffer from the selling-off of the transport system.......which is what this is!


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## Not Frequent user (13 Mar 2004)

*Angels!*

I've seen DB drivers go to extraordinary lengths to help passengers with problems/directions/lost property.


Marie

I've seen a 35+ woman, well dressed getting on bus (seen her pay for tickets) with two young children (baby and 3yr old) fold up push chair, shopping bags.  Inspector gets on and she starts searching bags, pockets etc while juggling children, can't find tickets, inspector stopps bus to throw her off. I mention seen her buy ticket, she drops baby on floor (really), no tickets to be found, and he put her and kids off bus.

It happened.


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## <A HREF=http://pub145.ezboard.com/baskaboutmoney.s (13 Mar 2004)

*Re: Angels!*



> My experience is they're "diamonds"



My experience is that there are good ones and bad ones. Just like people in all walks of life really.


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## Marie (13 Mar 2004)

I agree 0!  Dublin bus-drivers' employment includes encountering all manner of problems - from "difficult" sometimes abusive passengers to keeping to timetables despite chaotic traffic conditions which have been a feature of  the city for a decade.

Like any walk of life, some do it with more patience and courtesy than others.  In the case of such public roles, when they perform them well that's taken for granted; if they ever, ever, slip up, they're reviled!  They're not angels.......but the "perfect" public voicing itself here demand that they be!

Regarding the inspector throwing a woman with children off the bus because she couldn't produce her ticket, whilst that appears inflexible and heartless the explicit role of  inspectors is to ensure the company by-laws are observed.  The by-laws are that you retain your ticket for inspection.  This bye-law is posted in all buses,  printed on every single ticket issued.  Either there's a rule or every case is to be treated differently on merit or whim.  If every case is treated on merit or whim you don't have  "public transport" you have personal service; you don't have a system with bye-laws......you have chaos.  An earlier posting bemoaned the fact Dublin didn't have a system comparable to other European capitals.  Be assured if an inspector on an Amsterdam tram, or on the French metro or on the tube in the UK(or anywhere you care to name!) encounters a passenger without a valid ticket they have a hefty on-the-spot fine as well as being introduced to the notion of "shanks mare". Perhaps if bye-laws had been strictly adhered to sooner D.B. would not currently be scheduled for dismantling.


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## jdwex (13 Mar 2004)

*changes on  buses*

TBH, I think they should get rid of the change receipts. I remember getting the trams/buses in Boston 15 years ago-you made suere you had the correct change-if you didn't-tough-no change was give.


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## shortchanged (12 Apr 2004)

*change on buses*

was on bus yesterday, paid €2 for a €1.45 fare. got upstairs, no change ticket. went back for it and he told me he couldn't issue it once he'd issued a ticket to next passenger. is this true?


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## rainyday (12 Apr 2004)

*Re: change on buses*

I can't see how he could possibly remember the change due to a passenger after dealing with 4-5 subsequent passengers.


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## shortchanged (13 Apr 2004)

*Re: change on buses*

it wasn't a question of remembering rainyday. there was only one other passenger (not 4-5), the driver accepted i'd put €2 in but said he "couldn't" issue the ticket once he'd issued a ticket to another passenger. i've emailed dublin bus and will post the reply


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## Iano (25 Apr 2004)

*UPDATE*

Just had another incident today to prove my original point when I started this thread.

I got onto the 10 at UCD to go into town with my 3 year old. I think this was the first time that I had taken my young lad on the bus, so when I gave the driver €2.50 for the €2.25 fare (for the two of us) and heard the machine turn twice, I inadvertently assumed that he had issued me with a receipt for the change due.  But when I got home and checked the receipt, there were the two fare receipts but no receipt for the change - the thieving driver now has it, along with the change from anyone else he conned today. 

And another thing - the journey into town cost €2.25, but the journey back was only €2! Why??

Anyone know who, apart from Dublin Bus, that I can lodge a formal complaint with??
:>


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## zag (25 Apr 2004)

*Re: UPDATE*

Iano, to be honest I would have thought you would have got used to checking by now.

It depends on where you were going to in town, but if it was around St Stephens Green then the inbound and outbound fares can be different because of the different route the buses take inbound and outbound.

My fare in the morning is lower than my fare home in the evening for this reason.

Hmm, the fare home was €2 - this means that you were charged the 1-7 stage fare for the child and the 8-13 fare for you.  Driver (or you, if you asked for the fare by amount) may have made an error.

Incidentally, I had always assumed that children under X were free of charge, where X is always one year older than my eldest, but all I see on the Dublin Bus fare page is that the fare is charged for children under 16.  *Surely* they have some lower limit ?

z


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## elderdog (25 Apr 2004)

*Re: UPDATE - not all bad.*

I have to do a lot of town driving and encounter No. 10 bendibuses frequently. 

Bendibus drivers may be pants at counting but they are damn good at driving.

As for fares of Euro 2+ to go to UCD - its far to much. When are the city council going to be made hand over a considerable part of the parking fund to Dublin Bus ?


eDog


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## Unreg (26 Apr 2004)

*.*

Iano
be fair to the driver
You don't get a change receipt unless you ask for one - that is just the way it works.
The driver doesnt get to keep any excess money - dublin bus just get the surplus.


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## Iano (26 Apr 2004)

Zag, I have to ackknowledge 'mea culpa' for not checking - but I was reared to be a little more trusting of people.

Unreg, I assume there is a large hint of sarcasm in your statement about "that is just the way it works". Otherwise why should we get change from any retailer - I never ask for change, because it is due to me - THAT'S the way it works. 

And I would not share your confidence about Dublin Bus getting the surplus. The driver has to balance his float at the end of the shift. So, what do you think he does when he finds that his float has a surplus? Do you thinki he says to his boss every day "I have more money than I should have here"? I think not!


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## rainyday (26 Apr 2004)

I find it hard to believe that you have to ask for your receipt as a policy. A simple call to Dublin Bus should confirm that this is NOT correct.

Iano - I doubt if the driver has access to the cash at all. The big benefit of the 'no change' policy (along with the improved loading time) is to ensure that all the cash goes into a sealed container which is handed over complete at the end of the shift.


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## busdriver (26 Apr 2004)

For Unreg to say:

"You don't get a change receipt unless you ask for one - that is just the way it works."

is pure nonsense. Dublin Bus drivers are trained to automatically issue change receipts.


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## badzae (26 Apr 2004)

Havn't been on a bus for years myself so can't really offer much on this debate but am wondering why the change reciepts have to be redeemed in town. Can they not be used as fare on another bus journey? ie Fare is Euro 1.80, so instead of handing the driver 1.80 hand him 1.60 and a change reciept from a previous journey for 20 cents. Still amounts to exact fare.


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## unreg (26 Apr 2004)

*.*

lano

no i wasnt being sarcastic. 

fair enough you might not get the bus that often. however i do. and I know that i will have to ask for a change receipt if i want one. The bus driver has enough to be doing without counting all the coins that go in. 

I didnt know that drivers were trained to automatically iisue change receipts. If that is the case, then it is something (like opening the centre doors) that doesnt get done in practice.

I think you are being overly harsh on drivers. In my experience bus drivers are some of the best drivers on the roads - they have to be when they are driving something so big and dangerous. 

I couldnt say the same for taxi drivers,


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## zag (26 Apr 2004)

*Re: .*

unreg - maybe it's the bus routes you use or something.  I get the bus twice a day every weekday, and a good bit at weekends and I almost always get a refund ticket when warranted.  I have maybe had to point out two or three times over a period of years when I didn't get a refund ticket.

I don't know what the official policy about the centre doors is, but again they are often (but less than maybe 40% of the time) opened when needed on the routes I take.

I would doubt very much that there is an official policy not to issue change receipts unless requested.

I even made money on my journey this morning when someone (who got on the stop before mine) left a refund ticket in the machine ahead of me.

z


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## Iano (28 Apr 2004)

*Counting the coins*

"The bus driver has enough to be doing without counting all the coins that go in"

Thanks for the advice Unreg - next time I will leave HIM short!!!   :lol


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## tell me this and tell me no more (24 May 2004)

*Re: DB*

Let the refund tickets mount up in a drawer and every 8/9 weeks or whenever you get a chance, go into town (that office is open Saturday mornings until lunchtime) and reclaim your money.

Easy.


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## Iano (27 May 2004)

*Yes but*

tell me this and tell me no more  
It's only easy if the driver actually GIVES you the refund ticket - that's the whole crux of this thread.


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## MoodyToo (1 Jul 2004)

*Re: Yes but*

This morning I experienced a new slant on this. Woke up, found I had no change for my bus to work, no time to get change so I grabbed my jar full of coppers and counted out 1.45 in 5, 2 and 1 cent coins. Put it in an empty pocket and went for the bus. The driver got really narked, said that there were too many coins. I assured him it was all there and he said that he "had to be able to count it". Big pause while he stared at me presumably waiting for me to crack and admit it might only be 1.41. Eventually he gave me my ticket. They introduced the coin only system but apparently they only want the bigs ones now. For God sakes, why cant you just buy a 10, 20 or 30 journey ticket anymore?
MoodyToo.


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## davido (1 Jul 2004)

*Change*

I was recently on an Aer Lingus flight and I had great difficulty getting them to take a few 5c coins off me as part payment for a sandwich.  I was told that they were not allowed to take copper coins and only after I spent a couple of minutes explaining to the attendant that copper coins were in fact legal tender did she grudgingly take them.  Why is this an issue?  Why won't tolls (i.e. M50, Eastlink etc) take copper coins?  This is all a little bit off topic..........


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## Dowee (1 Jul 2004)

*Re: Change*



> For God sakes, why cant you just buy a 10, 20 or 30 journey ticket anymore?



I'd love to know the answer to this, I went to buy one a few weeks ago and I was met with blank stares. What ever happened to these tickets, you used to be able to get them.


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## mollser (1 Jul 2004)

*travel 10's*

Hi read on here a while ago that these were scrapped because they had so many chancers saying 'the ticket wouldn't swipe' etc etc. Dunno why they couldn't just tell them that if it doesn't work, its not a valid ticket. In any other city i've been in, if you damage your ticket, its your tough sh!te. 

Those tickets work extremely well everywhere else, and also usually they are a sold at a good discount to 10 single fares to encourage their use. 

BTW, looks like Luas have it just about right with there tix - hefty discount for buying the weekly tickets, in line with good international practice. Weekly tix €14, only 5 return journeys are €19/€20 paying singly.


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## mytwocents (2 Jul 2004)

*Driver, refund ticket, etc.*

A couple of years ago I was getting on no. 39 bus early about 8:30am on a quiet morning near the beginning of the route.  

Tendered IEP1.50 for a IEP1.35 route, driver hit the buttons and the machine just spat out the first stream of tape, i.e. no second spurt to indicate the 0.15 refund section.  With me so far?  

I said nothing, just waited, he got aggravated, I (too meekly) said "Aren't you supposed to give me some more ticket?" etc. etc.  Anyway, he got reasonably abusive - not the worst I've seen from DB drivers though - but I got my full ticket and took my seat.  

That very day I wrote a letter of complaint to Dublin Bus giving time, stop and bus route and exact dialogue.  A week or so later I got a letter of apology and two multi-trip tickets (can't remember how many, but I do recall that they were worth IEP6 each, ie IEP12 altogether).

Then, a month later, I received ANOTHER letter of apology and another two tickets! 

Moral of the story?  Ummm, a rolling stone gathers no moss.  Or something.


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## N0elC (5 Jul 2004)

*Re: Driver, refund ticket, etc.*



> Anyway, he got reasonably abusive - not the worst I've seen from DB drivers though



Why is it that so many DB drivers are so churlish ?

I appreciate that it's a busy and stressful job, but many of us work in busy and stressful jobs, but don't feel the need to bark and snarl at customers. Is it just the unionised environment, that drivers feel they can act with impugnity ?

Once proper competition comes to the Dublin area bus network, with multiple suppliers on each routes, hopefully we will see some sort of improvement in customer service, and bus drivers' manners.


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## Guest (5 Jul 2004)

*Re: Driver, refund ticket, etc.*

> Why is it that so many DB drivers are so churlish ?

As a reasonably regular public transport user I haven't had a bad experience with a bus driver in ages now. Quite the opposite in fact. Same on Bus Éireann. Very helpful and friendly.


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## N0elC (5 Jul 2004)

*Re: Driver, refund ticket, etc.*

You've obviously been lucky. 

I've seen all sorts of things on the buses recently, between drivers shouting at a tourist who produced a five euro note, and physically throwing off an obviously elderly and confused person who couldn't find their bus pass. On both occasions, when I remonstrated to the driver, I was told that it wasn't any of my business.


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## Bust (5 Jul 2004)

*Alternatives*

I wonder if competition really will improve matters. As a user of some of the recently licenced routes in Dublin I find their drivers can be just as bad as the worst of Dublin Bus and, unlike DB who will at least chuck you a few tickets when you complain, customer service departments don't seem to exist.

And what about breakdowns? The smaller operators don't seem to have adequate fleets to provide a replacement bus. The best I was offered was directions to the nearest DB stop and a phone number for refund of fare.


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## N0elC (5 Jul 2004)

*Re: Alternatives*

The problem in Dublin is that there's little head to head competition on these privatised routes: that's when you'll see differences in terms of service and value.

Replacing a State monopoly on a route, with a private one is, as you point out, of limited benefit.

Irrespective of who runs the route, though, such bad manners is inexcusable.


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## Guest (5 Jul 2004)

*Re: Alternatives*

> I've seen all sorts of things on the buses recently, between drivers shouting at a tourist who produced a five euro note, and physically throwing off an obviously elderly and confused person who couldn't find their bus pass. On both occasions, when I remonstrated to the driver, I was told that it wasn't any of my business.

Fair enough. Did you or the other people involved consider making a formal complaint to Dublin Bus on foot of incidents by any chance?


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## RevJamesFlynn (8 Jul 2004)

*Re: Alternatives*

> Why is it that so many DB drivers are so churlish ?

A friend of mine is a driver for Dublin Bus.  From several conversations with him, he'd say himself that they've got absolutely no reason to be polite, or focused on customer service, or on time, or reliable - they're guaranteed their job no matter what they do.  The union guarantees that they'll never lose their job.  If a driver even accumulates enough driving license penalty points to be banned from driving, Dublin Bus have to just transfer them into an office job until the ban has expired.

The simple fact is that Dublin Bus is run for the benefit of its employees, not for the benefit of commuters.

One of his routes goes from the DART station out to local estates - its timetable is synchronized with the DART timetable.  I've observed him drive off from the station with an empty bus because the DART arrived in 1 minute late, leaving the DART commuters with a long wait for the next bus.  He could have had a full bus, and saved them waiting around for a half hour if he'd just waited for 60 seconds longer.  I asked him about it and he just shrugged and said something about it not being his problem!

 -- James


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## RevJamesFlynn (8 Jul 2004)

*Re: Alternatives*

And remember that these same drivers are going to strike and bring the city's transport system to its knees, cause untold hassle and inconvenience for hundreds of thousands of people, even though:

 Their Jobs are guaranteed
 Their Salaries are guaranteed
 Their Benefits and Conditions are guaranteed

 -- James


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## N0elC (8 Jul 2004)

*Re: Alternatives*



> The simple fact is that Dublin Bus is run for the benefit of its employees, not for the benefit of commuters.



Like most other semi-states !

Roll on a bit of competition, which amounts to more than replacing a public monopoly with a private one


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