# NPPR Fee due again in March



## WaterSprite (14 Jan 2010)

Considering there was much furore here and elsewhere about the lack of publicity about the obligation to pay the NPPR fee last September, [broken link removed]'s fair warning that the next installment is due on March 31st, 2010.  It's also mentioned on the front page of the NPPR site.

Sprite


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## shootingstar (14 Jan 2010)

I didnt pay the first 200. They sent me a letter and i emailed them moaning about it & basically i was told pay it!! Well I didnt and they havent chased me for it either. Kinda hoping they might forget about me. 

Now theres another 200 due in March??? Is that what your saying?


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## sam h (14 Jan 2010)

How greedy can they be?  The raised 50% more than they expected and now they are back for another bite just 5 months later.  

It it unfair to expect people to have to fork out again so quickly.


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## PaddyBloggit (14 Jan 2010)

What's the story if somebody buys a second property between now and March?

Does that mean one fee? two fees? 2009 & 2010 or 2010 with two/three months arrears? or is paying in March for a full 2010 calendar year?


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## sam h (14 Jan 2010)

Shootingstar - you will owe it + €20 per month for late payment.  The fact the wrote means they already know about the property.  

I know it's money for nothing, but you won't be able to sell the property without it.  Say you go to sell in 5 years, not only will you owe €1000, you will also owe €1200 late fees (assuming they don't put it up in the meantime).


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## WaterSprite (14 Jan 2010)

PaddyBloggit said:


> What's the story if somebody buys a second property between now and March?
> 
> Does that mean one fee? two fees? 2009 & 2010 or 2010 with two/three months arrears? or is paying in March for a full 2010 calendar year?



Paddy - there was a date on which you had to own the property for the 2009 fee to be due - that's the liability date & for 2009 was 31st July.  If you didn't own a second property on that date, then the 2009 fee did not apply.

The liability date for 2010 is March 31st so if you own a second property (or, rather an NPPR) at that date then the fee is payable.  It is not pro-rated.

In theory, if you bought a property on August 1st, 2009 and sold it on February 28th 2010, then you don't have to pay any fee.

All this information is clearly available on the NPPR site that I linked to above.


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## PaddyBloggit (14 Jan 2010)

Thanks WaterSprite .... so if I get the keys to a second property on the 20th of January 2010 then I'm only liable for €200 for the 2010 calendar year ...

and based on the nppr site that fee can't be paid prior to the 31st of March ... 

the only concern I had was that of having to double pay with the changeover etc.


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## WaterSprite (14 Jan 2010)

PaddyBloggit said:


> Thanks WaterSprite .... so if I get the keys to a second property on the 20th of January 2010 then I'm only liable for €200 for the 2010 calendar year ...
> 
> and based on the nppr site that fee can't be paid prior to the 31st of March ...
> 
> the only concern I had was that of having to double pay with the changeover etc.



Yep, exactly.  If you buy on 20th Jan, then the fee due will be the 2010 fee only, not any portion of the 2009 fee.


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## czechmate (17 Jan 2010)

I'm doing a round the world trip at the mo and place is rented out at home.  I think this means I have to pay the EUR200, even though it is my only 'home'. Is that right?  Is there a right to appeal this? thanks


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## JoeB (17 Jan 2010)

Well, on the NPPR site it says the liability date is 31st March, 2010, and it CANNOT be paid before that date, however the deadline for 2010 must be sometime after 31st March, perhaps the deadline will be end of April or May... doesn't seem to mention it on the NPPR site.


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## shootingstar (17 Jan 2010)

sam h said:


> Shootingstar - you will owe it + €20 per month for late payment.  The fact the wrote means they already know about the property.
> 
> I know it's money for nothing, but you won't be able to sell the property without it.  Say you go to sell in 5 years, not only will you owe €1000, you will also owe €1200 late fees (assuming they don't put it up in the meantime).



Aww crap!    how would they know if I sell it? Say I do sell it in 5 years & they go looking for 5 years NPPR - could i not say that I was living in it myself for the last 3 years blah blah blah? No? (please say yes)  

My house is rented out, i didnt even tell the council, the tenant did!!  I honestly cant pay it. I actually moved out because i cant pay the mortgage so i let it out. I hope to move back in there some day, maybe....


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## sam h (18 Jan 2010)

SS....please tell me you are registered with the PRTB, cos if not you will not be able to claim the interest as tax decutible.  The fact they have written to you means they have a good idea it is rented - the NPPR is actually allocated (AFAIK) directly to the council, so if the tenant has contacted them then they know it's not your private residence.  

The NPPR is a self regulated tax (in that it is your responsibility to ensure it is paid).  They are not obliged to contact you at all. In order to sell the property, I believe you have to prove all taxes are up to date (no idea how they check up on this).  I would assume it would be up to you to prove you were living there, but if you have been filing tax returns or the utilites aren't in you name etc, 

Anyway, the €200 NPPR is going to be the least of your problems if you haven't paid the PRTB, due to the mortgage interest.


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## Bronte (18 Jan 2010)

There is no point in not paying it as the penalty is too high.  If you don't pay for say a year you owe the 200 still plus a find of 240 for the 12 months, so 5 years down the line you're going to owe 200 plus 20 X 60 months a penalty of 1200.  

It is in the councils/corporations best interest not to chase it up as they will recoop a lot more money with the penalties and I'm sure they are well aware of this.

In any case when one sells the purchaser's solicitor will no doubt be looking for proof that it was paid as my understanding it that this bill runs with the property, same as rates/water but not like ESB, gas etc.  

The liability date for 2010 is 31st March as a previous poster stated but you cannot pay it before the 31st March, the website does not say what the deadline actually is yet.


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## WaterSprite (18 Jan 2010)

Bronte said:


> The liability date for 2010 is 31st March as a previous poster stated but you cannot pay it before the 31st March, the website does not say what the deadline actually is yet.



Although it doesn't mention the payment date, I'm going on the assumption that it will be payable within 2 months of 31st March, like last year.  Just also to note (although people probably already know), the late payment charge didn't kick in last year until 3 months after the liability date.


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## shootingstar (18 Jan 2010)

Sam_h - Im registered with PRTB. I have no problem with council knowing its now a rental property as I contacted them anyway when they wrote to me. I just dont have the 200 to pay it and now im going to be liable for another 200 in march... Ugh! 

Because the tenant is on the council waiting list for a house she had to contact them anyway to let them know where shes living. She also gets RA. 

If I had non RA tenants I dont think I'd have this problem??? you know, my money goes in 1 hand & straight out the other. Being penalised for renting out your home!! Ugh again!!!!


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## Taxi Driver (18 Jan 2010)

If you do not pay the NPPR charge for the next five years (i.e. need to pay in 2014)you will actually owe €4,600!

FOR YEAR 2009: €200 + (60 months x €20 penalty) = €1,400
FOR YEAR 2010: €200 + (48 months x €20 penalty) = €1,160
FOR YEAR 2011: €200 + (36 months x €20 penalty) = €920
FOR YEAR 2012: €200 + (24 months x €20 penalty) = €680
FOR YEAR 2013: €200 = (12 months x €20 penalty) = €440
FOR YEAR 2014: €200 = €200

The actual penalty amount will depend on what month you pay (or are forced to pay) in 2014.  Seems far better to pay now.


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## Bronte (19 Jan 2010)

Taxi Driver said:


> . Seems far better to pay now.


 
Quite right taxi driver.


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## shootingstar (19 Jan 2010)

I know... I know.... its gona cost me in the long run 

Why are Landlords/Ladys not means-tested for this NPPR fee? If a landlord is in receipt of SW & the rent does NOT cover the full mortgage, then surely there should be some system in place to assist the Landlord? 

SS


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## Bronte (19 Jan 2010)

shootingstar said:


> ? If a landlord is in receipt of SW & the rent does NOT cover the full mortgage, then surely there should be some system in place to assist the Landlord?


 
Why don't you do the money makeover section, just on the rented property if you prefer, to see where savings can be made?  If you are unable to pay 200 Euro then really hard choices may have to be made.


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## z104 (29 Jan 2010)

Why is it not due 12 months from when it was last due.

This is such a racket.


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