# Form 12 query



## tz1981 (16 Oct 2011)

i've never submitted one of these before - it's for rental income for 2010. Do i need to send in a payment with the form and do I need to calculate and pay prelim tax for 2011? Thanks


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## ClubMan (20 Oct 2011)

Does this guide clarify things at all?

http://www.revenue.ie/en/tax/it/leaflets/it70.html


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## M K Brazil (21 Oct 2011)

Generally you don't need to submit a payment with a Form 12 and if a liability is due then the Revenue may collect it via the reduction of tax credits in the future. However you may not be entitled to use a Form 12 and the Revenue may reject it and ask for a Form 11 instead - which means you will fall into the self-assessment system and pay taxes in October like everyone else.


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## shaking (27 Oct 2011)

Is a Form 12 like a tax return in that it can be submitted online up until 15th November, or does it have to be by post at the end of October?


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## kennyb3 (27 Oct 2011)

shaking said:


> Is a Form 12 like a tax return in that it can be submitted online up until 15th November, or does it have to be by post at the end of October?


 
31 October

On what MK Brazil says - if the surplus is above €3,174 a form 11 and not a form 12 is required


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## ClubMan (27 Oct 2011)

kennyb3 said:


> 31 October
> 
> On what MK Brazil says - if the surplus is above €3,174 a form 11 and not a form 12 is required


What surplus? If you mean non _PAYE _income then even less than that can cause you to be self assessed. (Yeah - I'm moaning about my own situation yet again... ).


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## Ham Slicer (27 Oct 2011)

Although technically you could be hit with a penalty for late filing - very unlikely.  If there is no liability when filing the F12 then no surcharge will apply and the 31 Oct' deadline makes no difference.





kennyb3 said:


> 31 October
> 
> On what MK Brazil says - if the surplus is above €3,174 a form 11 and not a form 12 is required


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## kennyb3 (27 Oct 2011)

ClubMan said:


> What surplus? If you mean non _PAYE _income then even less than that can cause you to be self assessed. (Yeah - I'm moaning about my own situation yet again... ).


 
[broken link removed]


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## kennyb3 (27 Oct 2011)

Ham Slicer said:


> If there is no liability when filing the F12 then no surcharge will apply and the 31 Oct' deadline makes no difference.


 
Unlikely given a) it rental income and b) he/she is asking about sending a payment


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## Ham Slicer (27 Oct 2011)

kennyb3 said:


> Unlikely given a) it rental income and b) he/she is asking about sending a payment




It was more of an FYI response than a reply to the OP.


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## ClubMan (27 Oct 2011)

kennyb3 said:


> [broken link removed]


 


> *Assessable non-PAYE income of €3,174 or more*


My figure was below this but they have insisted that I be self assessed for several years now and  no amount of arguing the above with them helped!


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## mandelbrot (27 Oct 2011)

ClubMan said:


> My figure was below this but they have insisted that I be self assessed for several years now and  no amount of arguing the above with them helped!


_
"Persons in receipt of share options which arise by virtue of their being directors or employees of a company are chargeable persons for the purposes of Part 41 (Self Assessment) other than where the person is exempted from the requirement to make a tax return under Self Assessment."_
([broken link removed])


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## tz1981 (27 Oct 2011)

Thanks all. Better go fill out that Form 11 so.


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## ClubMan (28 Oct 2011)

mandelbrot said:


> _
> "Persons in receipt of share options which arise by virtue of their being directors or employees of a company are chargeable persons for the purposes of Part 41 (Self Assessment) other than where the person is exempted from the requirement to make a tax return under Self Assessment."_
> ([broken link removed])


Ah - OK - thanks....


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## M K Brazil (28 Oct 2011)

Just to clarify, if you are a chargeable person on foot of share options etc, then happy days. But if all you have is rental income and its < the €3k limit, then you should be able to tweak your tax credits and stay outside of the Form 11 regime.


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