# Vet bills for a pug



## moneygrower (7 Apr 2012)

We are thinking of getting a pug, would anyone have a rough idea of the annual vet bill for a dog like this, besides the usual vaccines etc. I'm a little concerned about the health issues associated with the breed, but we think the personality could be worth it.
Actually any information on the breed would be welcome.


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## dmos87 (7 Apr 2012)

Don't know about this particular breed, however I do have two small pure-breeds of around the same size. The risk with most pure-breed's is their Immune systems, for example, King Charles are prone to cancerous growths later in life, and Maltese are know for having to be kept on a strict diet - so no scraps from the table for my two! 

My first bit of advice is to do a ring around to Vet's that you can get recommendations for, and enquire if they have experience with Pug's as a breed. You would be surprised how many will say No, as I was. I've been fortunate to find an incredible vet for my two who knows the breed inside out, and is just as besotted with my two as I am. I would trust him with my babies, and for me thats a big thing - when it comes to them I'm fiercely protective. Yes, I'm one of those animal owners who thinks of their dogs as kids! If you're in the Cork area PM me and I can provide my recommendation for you to call and get some advice. 

Second bit of advice is to go to your local library, see what books you can find on Pugs, and read read read! Its great that you're already doing your research on the breed and you'll be surprised by what you find out. I'm also sure there are forums for animal lovers and there'll no doubt be some online information you can find. 

Thirdly, watch their diet - and be careful of the quality of the food. When it comes to dog food, you need to pay for the quality. Fortunately with small dogs they don't eat much and so even though it costs a little more, its still cheaper than what you'd pay for a big dog. And I promise you this - look after their health and you'll save on Vet fee's over the years. You'll need to choose a good solid brand of dog food so as not to cause tummy upset, especially as a pup before he/she is housetrained. The last thing you want to be doing is cleaning up diarrhea and vomit from your floors!

In terms of Vet fees, if you are fortunate to have a well-bred pup they will be the same as other dogs. Yearly vaccinations, Kennel cough (even if you never put them in kennels, get this - they can pick it up from anywhere) usually comes to about 100 euro mark. Definitely micro-chip the pup if its not already done before you take them home - this is about 25-40 depending on different places. Each Vet visit can vary, so its hard to know. But the annual stuff isn't too much.

I would also recommend getting pet insurance for the pup, given that its a pure-breed, and likely to have some issues at any stage throughout their life span. Allianz do great pet insurance cover for my two, but do a ring around for some good deals. And be sure they are insured in the first few years as if not, you can't insure them in later life when the Vet visits become more frequent (I think around 7 years is the cut off if you haven't insured them before that, but this might have changed).

Lastly, and this is the biggest thing - please ensure you know the commitement you're taking on. I know we hear it all the time that a dog is for life, but its easy to say it and harder to live it. I love my two and would never ever give them up, but there are somw odd times where I do think things would be easier if we didnt have the responsibility - I mean in terms of our freedom. Anytime we want to go away for a night, we need to find a sitter or book the kennels, which is about 12-15 euros a day. Not too much for the odd day, but go on a holiday and it all adds up. And I have two! Even little things like going out with friends for a full day - your mind is constantly brought back to "are they ok, have they destroyed the place, I better get home". It is like having kids at times, especially smaller breeds as they are mostly indoor dogs. A dog ties you down and you need to have stability - dogs like routine and get upset at changes. 

They'll bring a lot of happiness to your household if the commitment is there, I can promise you that


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## moneygrower (7 Apr 2012)

Thanks for the useful and thoughtful reply, I hadn't thought of the library, was just gonna splash out on amazon! And finding a vet who has experience of the breed is a great idea I hadn't thought of at all, I guess I just assumed they would. I have read that they are over eaters so I know they'll need good dog food and no scraps : (
I'm carefully considering the commitment, I have two small kids and sometimes I think of putting them up for sale on donedeal but mostly they're great. Seriously if we go ahead we won't be changing our mind, I can't understand that mentality. 
I think I need to find on honest breeder and take it from there. Thanks very much for the help.


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## Sue Ellen (7 Apr 2012)

I don't have any experience of pugs but just wondering why you are going for that breed in particular?  It does pay to do your homework for both you and the dog.  Dogs Trust give this description of pugs.  

Everyone to their own but I'm big into rescuing dogs and pugs do become available at time in the shelters.

To dmos87, excellent post, very well put especially on the commitment aspect.  I find its usually when I'm tired after a long day and the two are getting on my nerves that I argue with myself about having one never mind two   The unconditional love aspect of the whole thing is what makes up for those tired moments.


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## moneygrower (7 Apr 2012)

Hi Sue Elllen, 
I grew up with collies and I love collies so I wanted an intelligent responsive dog but Collies and dogs like that (also fancied a springer spaniel) love to work and I don't want to a: torture a dog with boredom or b: spend my day thinking up new frisbee games. So I started looking up which are the best companion dogs. To be honest and shallow I don't like the look of the super fluffy things so I guess that's how I ended up looking up pugs, apart from the health issues they sound perfect, attention seeking and cute, a bit like my kids. 
I do check the dog rescue sites but I don't really want an adult dog as I'm not sure i fully trust it and most of the pups on offer are collie/German Shepard/spaniels. Finally I don't want a dog who has been abused as I have very young children so I'm not taking any chances! 
Having said all that, I'm open to suggestions! Though I'm not taken with labs or golden retreivers.


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## Sue Ellen (8 Apr 2012)

Hi,

To me personality is the most important aspect of any breed of dog.

I know where you are coming from on the work ethic scenario with the collies and the springers but would have to say, that IMHO, generally speaking, the springers are very suited to families.  Ours is a dote and he like most dogs would need an hour long walk per day.

Also love the labs and golden retrievers as they usually have a nice nature.  

I don't think I would have the energy to have a pup as they are hard work, on a par with having a newborn baby in the house.   A 1 or 2 year old dog would suit me best but then I'm probably at a different stage in life, age wise 

I know people don't like the look of them and usually run a mile when they see them but SBTs are recommended for families and in any dealings I have had with them they are absolute dotes who just lick the face off people.

The JRTs are sometimes not recommended for households with children under 8 are they are inclined to nip.  This is usually only through play or possibly children pulling/tugging at them.

Lurchers who most people consider to be too big, height wise especially, make great pets as they are recognised as couch potatoes.  A smaller version of them is the whippet.

Some things that you need to bear in mind when getting a dog is that it is very important that they are not left alone for too long especially during the day.  Boredom or separation anxiety can cause the dog to do damage or bark too much.  4 hours is quoted regularly as the max alone time and I agree with organisations that say dogs should be kept in at night.

Some organisations that could give you some advice are the DSPCA, Dogs Trust, ISPCA, ASH or Kildare Animal Foundation.

Sorry if I've rambled on too much but its my favourite topic


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## truthseeker (8 Apr 2012)

Sue Ellen said:


> Lurchers who most people consider to be too big, height wise especially, make great pets as they are recognised as couch potatoes.  A smaller version of them is the whippet.



Big vote from me on the lurchers, brilliant with children, known as couch rockets as they will run madly for 30 minutes then spend the other 23 and a half hours on the couch!! They can be large but you can come across smaller versions depending on the breed crossed. I support both Homes for Unwanted Greyhounds (formerly Kerry Greyhound Connection) and Whippet Rescue Ireland - check out their websites or facebook pages, you will see a lot of lovely faces.

One of the most beautiful dogs I ever saw was a whippet/chihuahau cross, he had marking like a skull on his face, just beautiful.

Im also fond of King Charles Spaniels, and of course the mighty Jack Russell terrier, if youre looking for intelligence the JRTs are smart dogs, but can be very stubborn and they can need quite a lot of mental stimulation.

+1 on the route of rescuing a dog also. It interesting that you say you do not want an adult dog - think about what you are saying here - behaviour can always be changed, but temperment cannot. You will never see true temperment til adulthood. Most of the rescues will know their dogs well so you would be getting a tried and tested older animal, compared to a breeder selling a potentially badly bred pup that no one knows anything about.

In saying all that - I do love pugs, Id like one, but I dont think I could buy a dog when so many need homes.


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## Sue Ellen (8 Apr 2012)

truthseeker said:


> Im also fond of King Charles Spaniels



I love these dogs but do believe that they are one of the overbred ones and know so many people who have had terrible problems with their dogs ears, eyes and sometimes heart problems.  It has cost them a lot of money going backwards and forwards to the vets.

This previous thread might give some advice Choosing a new dog.


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## truthseeker (8 Apr 2012)

Sue Ellen said:


> I love these dogs but do believe that they are one of the overbred ones and know so many people who have had terrible problems with their dogs ears, eyes and sometimes heart problems.  It has cost them a lot of money going backwards and forwards to the vets.



Not to mention the hardship on the dog itself. I know one with heart problems and he is only allowed moderate exercise - but he wants to exercise more! You are right, they do seem to have been overbred, no doubt because of their popularity in recent years.

Same can be said of a lot of the popular small breeds, pugs can have dreadful breathing issues from overbreeding and irresponsible back yard breeding also.


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## Hillsalt (8 Apr 2012)

Here is my cents:

I own a Pugalier which is a cross between a Pug and a King Charles. I bought it from www.donedeal.ie and there are always a few of them for sale. My experience of dogs is that cross breeds are healthier than thoroughbreds. That has been my personal experience 

Google 'Pugalier' .They are as affectionate and loyal as any dog but easily disciplined and trained. It took little effort to house train her, at lesat compared to the Westy we had a few years ago!

Anyway, we had her wormed, vaccinated, electronically tagged and  eventually spayed. That cost around €400. She doesn't shed a lot and she was easily trained. 

Good luck.


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## truthseeker (9 Apr 2012)

Hillsalt - there is no such breed as a Pugalier. You have a mongrel that someone irresponsible has given a fancy name to make money from.

Buying from donedeal would be considered a big no no as its riddled with puppy farmers and backyard breeders.

Someone who actually breeds two known breeds to create a cross breed they are calling a made up name is breeding irresponsibly. There would be no concern for the health of the line on either side genetically, no attention paid to good breeding practice etc..

Its would be irresponsible to suggest that someone buys a cross breed dog like this as it only encourages puppy farming. There are thousands of mongrels waiting to be adopted in shelters.

I feel very strongly about this subject, back yard breeding and puppy farming are rife in this country and are a form of animal abuse.


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## Sue Ellen (9 Apr 2012)

truthseeker said:


> i feel very strongly about this subject, back yard breeding and puppy farming are rife in this country and are a form of animal abuse.



+1.


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## moneygrower (9 Apr 2012)

Hi thanks again for all the input. 
Obviously no one thinks puppy farms are a good idea, I'd hope that by recommendation and meeting the owner that they could be avoided. 
Probably unfair to label anyone who cross breeds a dog as irresponsible, isn't that how recognised breeds came into existence? 
I really wouldn't have thought a pig and a king Charles would result in a healthy dog given they are both weak on the health front but maybe this one got the best from both sides.  King Charles are beautiful but not a huge amount going on between those gorgeous ears is there?
I've been reading too much negative things on the web about the health of pugs and am starting to reconsider. I'm over coming my fluff prejudices and looking into the Bichon   Apparently a few small walks a day would suit so that would suit us perfectly. My image of walking the springer involves living in the country, sniffing ditches, wearing wellies, all good stuff but I live in the city centre and need a dog can fit in with our lives as is. the bichon is apparently healthy and long lived and a fun character. 
I'm at home full-time and we have a long back garden so the dog won't get lonely. Might up it to two all going well. 
Loving the process of just thinking about getting a dog, YouTube - ing the different breeds (lurchers going a big mental!). I love looking at and discussing dogs!


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## truthseeker (10 Apr 2012)

moneygrower said:


> Probably unfair to label anyone who cross breeds a dog as irresponsible, isn't that how recognised breeds came into existence?



No. Its a scientific process, is agreed by a large group of breeders - not an individual, it takes decades, maybe a century to breed true. Very important factors to consider, genetics, health, breed standard, etc. Most breeds you see were bred centuries ago for specific purposes, springer spaniels for hunting dogs, some terriers for ratting, etc.. Its a very expensive process to do properly and in modern times its supposedly regulated. Its not a money making venture, although you will get the unscrupulous types who do it for cash hence the issues talked about above regarding heart problems in king charles spaniels etc..

People who just cross breed dogs to sell a fancy named animal are just doing it for money, have no interest in the bloodline or standard of either breed and are not following good breeding practices. They are basically forcing a female dog to produce and produce. They will be destroying pups that look too much like one breed or the other and only selling on the ones who look cute with no regard to health. Its a cash driven practice.



moneygrower said:


> Loving the process of just thinking about getting a dog, YouTube - ing the different breeds (lurchers going a big mental!). I love looking at and discussing dogs!



If youre in Dublin why dont you take a visit to the DSPCA in Rathfarnham or Dogs Trust out near Finglas where you can actually visit with and interact with different dogs. Ive taken dogs for short walks up at the DSPCA, and played with them in the fenced off area behind the dog kennels - it can really change your mind about different types of dogs to go and interact with them. 

Another fun activity is to go to a local dog park (there is one in Marlay Park) and just hang about and observe, chat to owners, meet different types of dogs.

The fluff prejudices can be overcome with a good groomer - dont you know everyone is getting their Bichon done in a teddy bear trim these days lol


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## moneygrower (10 Apr 2012)

Thanks truth seeker I didn't know you could interact with the rescue dogs like that, very useful. I thought you'd need your mind made up. Didn't know there were any dog parks in Ireland either so that's great to know. 
On the cross breeding designer puppy thing, of course what you are describing is disgusting, I guess I'm thinking that it's not always nasty a d you know sometimes a pug and a king charles just cross the purebred lines and fall in love : )


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## truthseeker (10 Apr 2012)

moneygrower said:


> Thanks truth seeker I didn't know you could interact with the rescue dogs like that, very useful. I thought you'd need your mind made up. Didn't know there were any dog parks in Ireland either so that's great to know.



Oh yeah, its great fun interacting with them - its not suitable for us to have a dog right now, small apartment etc so we go get our fill of dog love in the rescues 
Plus, its really good for the dogs, the more people they get to socialise with the better, it mentally stimulates them and gets them out of the kennel for some positive interaction. They love it. It changed my view of lurchers after I played with a few of them, I didnt realise they were so loving, they just wanted cuddles!
I havent actually gone to Dogs Trust but I donate to them and they send me newsletters and I get the impression you can go and do it there too.



moneygrower said:


> ......of course what you are describing is disgusting



I think a big part of the problem is that people actually dont think any further than the cute face they are handing over money for. Id like to see public campaigns in this area to educate people tbh.

If you like boxers or boxer crosses Dogs Trust have 8 boxer cross pups to rehome in two weeks time, they were from a rescue called Rosie who has been badly overbred  - so much so that some of her nipples were too badly damaged to feed the pups so they have been hand fed by the staff. They are seriously cute - not sure how big they will get though as dont know the cross.


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## OliviaReilly (10 Apr 2012)

Vet bills can be up to $1,000 a year. You might want to consider getting pet insurance (VPI, Trupanion, etc. or a vet discount program, like United Pet Care or Pet Assure. Maybe look into your options.


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## moneygrower (11 Apr 2012)

€1000 a year? I think insurance is a no brainer. Is this Personal experience? I've read a few things on line to this effect. 
I must go and visit a lurcher, just to make up my own mind. Dunno about the boxer with unknown cross, with two small kids charity isn't my priority. Having said that ill probably end up with a total mutt I get a good vibe from. Total closet hippy!


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## truthseeker (11 Apr 2012)

moneygrower said:


> I must go and visit a lurcher, just to make up my own mind.



Definitely go and visit a lurcher - they are AMAZING!!! So cuddly! Theyre totally my favorites in terms of good vibes. When I am in a position to home a dog itll be 2 lurchers for me, I even have names ready 



moneygrower said:


> Dunno about the boxer with unknown cross, with two small kids charity isn't my priority.



Just with boxers being so good with children I thought it might interest you. Im not sure if theyre crossed at all - but they look it.


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## moneygrower (11 Apr 2012)

Well I'll just have to go see, the wee people are spending a few hours with grandparents in rathfarnham on Friday so may go and meet the lurchers and boxers then.


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## Sue Ellen (12 Apr 2012)

moneygrower said:


> Well I'll just have to go see, the wee people are spending a few hours with grandparents in rathfarnham on Friday so may go and meet the lurchers and boxers then.



These are some of the ones in rehoming at the moment although the website can sometimes be a little behind.

[broken link removed]  The important issues are:

1.  Fee €135.
2.  Someone there during the day and the dog not left alone for too long as they get stressed and may possibly do damage or start barking and maybe upset neighbours. 
3.  Walled or fenced garden.
4.  Keep the dog in at night.

Hope you get to meet your forever friend


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## Leo (13 Apr 2012)

OliviaReilly said:


> Vet bills can be up to $1,000 a year. You might want to consider getting pet insurance (VPI, Trupanion, etc. or a vet discount program, like United Pet Care or Pet Assure. Maybe look into your options.


 
Please note AAM is an Irish site. Those providers do not operate in the Irish market.


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## moneygrower (23 Sep 2012)

Just want to tell everyone who took the time to give us advice, we finally got our dog!
It's been a real education, and a surprising one. After many months of soul searching and pound tramping we finally booked a wee girl today. After all our talk about pugs and bichons, all dogs with relatively low exercise needs, we borrowed our friend's young lab a few times while they went on holiday and discovered we absolutely loved his high energy, talking him out walking, running, throwing balls etc. It was one of our favourite things about him! Very little you read about dog ownership says anything about how a dog that NEEDS exercise is like having a really sweet excited personal fitness coach in the house!
  Borrowing our friend's dog I couldn't recommend it enough to anyone thinking of getting a dog.
 We were worried our son who is slightly asthmatic son would be allergic, turned out he improved! Meant there was no need to consider the less shedding dogs.
My husband, who never had a dog, discovered he really loved dogs, big surprise to him, though not to anyone who knows him.
 The dog was delightfully confident and playful.  He was also extremely hard to walk, very strong and pulling constantly, and generally a brat about the house. We could only motivate him with food. I prefer a dog with a bigger eager to please streak, having grown up with collies my expectation of dog responsiveness and eager to please-ness is very high! 
We  nearly gave up on the pound route. The dogs availalbe were very often unsuitable for young families. There were staffies but I'd have zero confidence with the breed. We decided to try a lurcher,  took a beautiful young girl for a walk and she had less than no interest in who was holding the lead. Felt like we'd be adopting a high maintenance cat.  
Filled out long forms and got our landlord to sign and scan a pdf (he's very nice!) of a letter saying we could keep a dog. Only to get told me could not adopt a dog, but we could foster puppies?!? Like I'm going to put my kids through bonding with a puppy just to hand it back. (dogs in distress)
Other places just won't give dogs to people who are renting. 
Only puppies we did see were psychologically damaged,  or the only one left in the litter was the one who wouldn't make eye contact.
Finally decided to head for the hills! Rang lovely people in Cavan SPCA (Tina) and Carrick Dog Shelter who take dogs from Monaghan dog pound. Didn't get as far as Tina as we got a 12 week old collie (!!!!) puppy from Carrick Dog Shelter. She is calm and confident and rolling over for tummy rubs, a really sweet dog. We know she's a big commitment but we're confident we can keep her occupied and happy. We'll be doing dog training classes with her straight away.
This is her http://www.donedeal.ie/for-sale/dogs/3936322
Although her name is offically Sasha it doesn't mean much to her (she's not in the shelter very long) so we can change it without too much stress on her. All suggestions welcome! 
We've ended up with the polar opposite of a pug and we're very excited about it!


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## joanod (23 Sep 2012)

Moneygrower - Well done you are giving your children a very good lesson in life.....& showing very good example ........you will find this very rewarding...

I did similar 6+ years ago got an 8 wk old puppy within 3 days after he left the shelter he got parvo virus which is deadly for dogs but i nursed him through on the instructions of my vet he was in ICU for a couple of days but since then i had hinm neutered and he get his annual vac#s  and that is the only expense.....I had troublesome times with him...discipline mostly...play biting.......but now i have a beautifull animal......that I love dearly......One has to remember that you can never trust a dog 100% espically with children but I am sure you know that.......he will go through all the stages like a child does you just persevere and in time you will have a gem as I have...........

For what its worth I would never pay for a dog (except to a rescue/shelter) as I think too many beautifull animals out there looking for good homes.....

Well done you.....


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## Sue Ellen (23 Sep 2012)

Best of luck with your new doggie, she looks absolutely beautiful and hope that she has found her forever home.  You did your homework and hopefully it has paid off.  Delighted that you took a shelter dog 



moneygrower said:


> There were staffies but I'd have zero confidence with the breed. We decided to try a lurcher,  took a beautiful young girl for a walk and she had less than no interest in who was holding the lead



My exprience with both of these breeds has led me to have the exact opposite view to yours.  Staffies who have not been trained for the wrong purpose are generally speaking 'lick monsters' and lurchers are known as 'couch potatoes'.  Like humans they all have personalities of their own.  Staffies in particular just like pit bulls have been given a very bad press over the years and a lot of it has been unwarranted.

Dogs who have landed up in a pound or shelter are most likely traumatised and with due love and care they will generally come out of their shells.  Shelter life can be hard on them with a constant stream of different volunteers and possible adopters coming and going.


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## truthseeker (23 Sep 2012)

Sue Ellen said:


> Dogs who have landed up in a pound or shelter are most likely traumatised and with due love and care they will generally come out of their shells.  Shelter life can be hard on them with a constant stream of different volunteers and possible adopters coming and going.



I often wonder why shelters dont do 'overnights' with potential adopters. Its next to impossible to get to know a dog in such a stressful environment, but maybe a quiet evening in someones home would help? 
Although perhaps there are insurance or other issues.


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## Sue Ellen (23 Sep 2012)

truthseeker said:


> I often wonder why shelters dont do 'overnights' with potential adopters. Its next to impossible to get to know a dog in such a stressful environment, but maybe a quiet evening in someones home would help?
> Although perhaps there are insurance or other issues.



Overnight would not be enough to allow both to get to know each other properly.  I feel that dogs take a few months to settle down and feel that they are not going to be moved on/thrown aside again.  I think its the reason why so many people foster animals and why so many of them are classed as 'failed fosterers' when they admit defeat  and keep the animal.


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## truthseeker (23 Sep 2012)

Sue Ellen said:


> Overnight would not be enough to allow both to get to know each other properly.  I feel that dogs take a few months to settle down and feel that they are not going to be moved on/thrown aside again.  I think its the reason why so many people foster animals and why so many of them are classed as 'failed fosterers' when they admit defeat  and keep the animal.



The ideal would be a few weeks/months of course, but love can blossom overnight (it constantly does when I mind a neighbours pet!!). I agree that longer would be better, but overnight would still be better than a few minutes in a  stressful environment imo. I understand that weeks and months are not practical in a shelter situation where they need to know if someone wants the dog or not to free up a kennel space.


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## moneygrower (24 Sep 2012)

I think with young kids it's not a good idea to take on a dog who is obviously damaged, unless you are an extremely experienced and confident dog owner. Our wee girl in only in the shelter a few days, and although handed in as a stray she was in too good condition for that to be really the case. 
By the way, I'm not knocking staffies, it's just personally I have no confidence or experience with them and I think it's important to go with a dog you feel confident with. Just as some people think Collies are nuts, I know that's rubbish but I wouldn't push one on someone who needs a more low energy dog. 
There are a couple of stafffies in Dog's Trust if anyone's interested, they look really sweet.


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## Sue Ellen (24 Sep 2012)

All dogs should be supervised near children.  Collies are lovely but as  you say they are lively and I don't think I'd have enough energy for  some of the ones that I've met.  In an ideal world they are meant to be working  herding sheep.  My springer was very lively when younger but he was  meant to be out hunting.  

I totally agree with you that people are comfortable with a breed that they are familiar with.  When I initially did not have contact with dogs on a regular basis, I was wary of staffies and pit bulls, but over time have come to know and appreciate them and hate the bad press that they get.

Don't want to take the thread off-topic but as so many people class staffies and pit bulls in the same category this quote sums it up for me:

"My kids are around pit bulls every day. In the '70s they blamed  Dobermans, in the '80s they blamed German Shepherds, in the '90s they  blamed the Rottweiler. Now they blame the Pit Bull." - Cesar Millan (The  Dog Whisperer).

Came across this lovely video to-day about Diamond the pit bull hero:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CAzPY5f-_Vc&feature=share


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