# judgment on property so can't sell



## OUTONALIMB (20 Apr 2014)

I am about to apply for bankruptcy and have been trying to sell my house (in neg eq.) Bank has agreed to the sale but the judgment is stopping it. What are my options, just hand back keys?


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## itsallwrong (21 Apr 2014)

So there is a judgement on the title of your house for a debt?

The condition of the judgement cannot be satisfied when you sell the house 
because there is no profit - negative equity.

It appears the only way to release the condition of the judgement is to pay the debt and cancel it, which you obviously cannot.

How much is the judgement for ?


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## Brendan Burgess (21 Apr 2014)

> Bank has agreed to the sale but the judgment is stopping it.



What is "the judgment"?


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## Steve Thatcher (21 Apr 2014)

why is this stopping the bankruptcy, I don't understand. You go bankrupt and the property vests in the OA/OR. You don't own it any more. He either sells it or releases it back to the bank who take it as mortgagee in possession.

They can dispose of it and the additional charge holder will have to release its charge. Not your worry at all if you go bankrupt. This is a problem for the bank only.

SteveThatcher
www.stevethatcher.ie


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## itsallwrong (22 Apr 2014)

The judgement is where the creditor takes a court action and gets a 'judgement/lien/charge' against the title of the house.

This must be satisfied when the house gets sold to allow the title to be free for transfer of ownership.

A lot of creditors have gone down this road to secure their debt.


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## Time (22 Apr 2014)

And? Your point is?

Bankruptcy ignores such measures and it does not affect the bankrupt.


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## OUTONALIMB (11 May 2014)

Hi, and thanks for the responce guys. My only concern is that I have been told the bank can hold the property through the bankruptcy period and not sell. The dept is then still ongoing after bankruptcy and can then be chased.......


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## OUTONALIMB (11 May 2014)

Hi itsallwrong and others. The judgment hanging over the property is for around 60k, my understanding is that if the house is reposessed and the bank sells the property they would have to pay the dept to allow the courts to lift the judgment, thus the banks reluctance to sell.


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## Bronte (12 May 2014)

OUTONALIMB said:


> Hi, and thanks for the responce guys. My only concern is that I have been told the bank can hold the property through the bankruptcy period and not sell. The dept is then still ongoing after bankruptcy and can then be chased.......


 
You're not making any sense.  Why are you selling the house if you are going for bankruptcy?  You don't have to do anything with the house. 

Are you going bankrupty with a professional or just yourself?

You mention negative equity.  The organisation with the JM would rank second to the mortgage company so they will not be getting one penny out of the sale of this property. The bank's charge ranks first.


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## OUTONALIMB (12 May 2014)

HI Bronte, hope to go with a professional but depends on costs


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## Bronte (13 May 2014)

Where are you going bankrupt?  How much can you afford to pay?  Have you approached someone?  

How about posting up some actual figures.  Are you sure you're eligible for bankruptcy?


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## concept (24 May 2014)

*Can an Irish mortgage company/bank stymie a UK bankruptcy prior to the applicatiob*

I intend to establish COMI in UK soon in relation to liabilities in Ireland principally a mortgage. Is there any action that my Irish mortgage company/bank could take that would stymie the bankruptcy application. I will not be informing them of my (future/imminent) action but obviously if they visit my house and see it bare of furniture, it wouldn't be too difficult to conclude that. The house is about c. 50k in negative equity at current values for an outstanding mortgage balance of c. 250k e.g.


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## Steve Thatcher (27 May 2014)

concept said:


> I intend to establish COMI in UK soon in relation to liabilities in Ireland principally a mortgage. Is there any action that my Irish mortgage company/bank could take that would stymie the bankruptcy application. I will not be informing them of my (future/imminent) action but obviously if they visit my house and see it bare of furniture, it wouldn't be too difficult to conclude that. The house is about c. 50k in negative equity at current values for an outstanding mortgage balance of c. 250k e.g.



There is nothing they can do, or more importantly will do to stop you. You need at some point to tell them your new address and get them to acknowledge that letter, but I promise you they will not interfere, primarily as they won't know you are doing it.

I have had 50 hearings where the court adjourned it to let creditors turn up if they wished and in every case none did. That includes the time when NAMA were owed €100m

Steve Thatcher
www.stevethatcher.ie


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## concept (27 May 2014)

As usual very helpful Steve. Thanks very much and it is re-assuring


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## suarez (27 May 2014)

[qu?


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## Steve Thatcher (27 May 2014)

suarez said:


> I would strongly recommend contacting an Irish insolvency / solicitor. They can arrange the sale of your house while you establish your COMI. It is ALWAYS preferable to translate your loan from secured to unsecured (house sold) when applying for UK bankruptcy - as it makes the process more straightforward. The bank may be willing to pay solicitor fees plus auctioneer fees to ensure property is sold. Write to your bank as soon as you arrive in UK and register the letter. The Official Receiver appreciates when you've been upfront with your creditors. You've no reason to withhold any info. - so why bother?




I wouldn't bother, if you haven't already sold it you can waste months trying to get a sale through. It is completely unnecessary. Simply voluntarily surrender it. 

Steve Thatcher
www.stevethatcher.ie


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## suarez (28 May 2014)

Hh


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## concept (28 May 2014)

I agree Steve; best to let the OR do his work when the time comes.


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## suarez (28 May 2014)

Hhh


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## suarez (28 May 2014)

Hhn


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## Nobizere (28 May 2014)

suarez said:


> As I've already stated - it's ALWAYS preferable to have the house sold. The Irish company can arrange a Short-Sale of the property with the bank - which expedites the whole process.



Suarez, you seem to be ignoring the judgement against the property.
I tried to sell a house with 3 judgements against it. All 3 also have judgements on my family home. 1 judgement was held by a private company for 60 k. On the basis they had a judgement on my family home they approved the release and allowed the sale after I furnished them with proof that I wouldn't make a penny from the sale.
The other 2 JM holders were divisions of the same bank that wrote the mortgage. They both refused to release and so the sale fell through. The house will be surrendered next week.

In my opinion the OP should just surrender the house. The judgement holder is unlikely to give it up as they know they'll definitely get nothing. Also, my experience is that some solicitors won't even bother dealing with a property that has judgements against it as the hassle is immense and usually leads to nothing.


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## suarez (28 May 2014)

Apologies, I made a mistake. I was answering 'concept's' question - who doesn't appear to have a judgement against him. Didn't realise the particular thread I was on. Yeah - just surrender it if judgements against it.


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