# College Fees and Expenses



## Rujib (30 May 2005)

How much can I expect college to cost for my eldest child who are likely to start college next September based on the following.

1 From Clare and likely to go to college in UCD or maybe Trinity and so will live away from home.
I would really appreciate any input I can get from parents who have already been through this type of scenario.
I know I can get a certain amount of information from college websites and students union sources etc, but I would put more faith in an experianced parent.


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## ClubMan (30 May 2005)

Would s/he qualify for any sort of ?


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## Rujib (30 May 2005)

Clubman,

No, she would not qualify for any grant based on the family income.

Basically, we will have one daughter starting college next September and another daughter will start September 2006. We have been saving in a mutual fund with Canada Life for 16 years now and the fund is worth €23k today. We will also have an SSIA maturing next year which should yield circa €19k to €20k.

Question is how much more we would need to cover say eight years of college assuming both did 4 year courses.

We will expect both children to make a contribution to the cost from summer/part time jobs and some savings they have already accumulated.

However, we are pretty clueless at this point as to how much we should budget per year goung forward. 

Thanks


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## stobear (30 May 2005)

Found these
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and .

I know you wanted the 'parents' perspective from your first post, but hopefully this just you a starting point at least


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## ClubMan (30 May 2005)

Good post!



			
				ollyk1 said:
			
		

> This assumes she pays no fees etc. - doesn't have to repeat a year (you hope) etc.



On this point, while tuition fees were abolished aren't capitation fees still payable and not insignificant these days?


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## mts (31 May 2005)

Student Service charge (Capitation) is €750 for 2004/05


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## Rujib (31 May 2005)

Thanks everybody. Phew it's not going to be easy, especially when I consider I have 4 daughters in total. Still I, we go to do what we have to do. Thank God for Charlie McCreevy and his SSIA's. These are a blessing in disguise coming up to a situation like college expenses.

Rujib


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## buzybee (31 May 2005)

What are your children going to study in college ?

I would be concerned about sending them to Dublin regarding the cost, considering you have 4 daughters.

If there are courses they could do in UL, they could live at home and drive there.  You may be too far away to do this.  The cost of accomodation etc would be cheaper in Limerick/Galway than in Dublin.

I finished college in 1994.  A lot of the people who did European Studies/Arts degrees found it hard to get jobs on leaving college.  The problem was:  they were not trained for anything.  A lot of them ended up working in call centres or doing general administration work (You could do these types of work with a good secretarial course).  If your daughters intend studying Arts type courses, bear in mind that they would have to do Masters/postgrad courses in order to get a proper job from their degree.

A lot of parents think that you can walk straight into a good job after college.  I did Business.  I, and most of the other people on this course found it quite hard to get a job on leaving college, despite getting good grades. I had a temping office job for 2 yrs, before I got into a multinational.  Then I had to do accountancy exams and work up.  In contrast, the people who had done office courses were already 4 yrs in work, with good experience, decent money, and an option to study by night.

In hindsight I would have been better off to do an office course and study by night, as I would be getting the experience alongside the education.  

I would not recommend sending a child away from home for college, unless they are studying something like medicine/law/radiography (i.e. something where they are guaranteed a good job and income)


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## RainyDay (31 May 2005)

Rujib said:
			
		

> Thank God for Charlie McCreevy and his SSIA's.


The Blessed Charlie gave with one hand and took it away with his other 3 hands.


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## DrMoriarty (31 May 2005)

> I would not recommend sending a child away from home for college, unless they are studying something like medicine/law/radiography (i.e. something where they are guaranteed a good job and income)


 
busybee, that's the kind of advice I need to hear! 

I've five of the 'small-but-growing-fast' variety, myself, and often find myself wondering what the hell I'll do if they all want/'need' to do courses far from home (also Limerick, as it happens). Judging from what I see around me, the SSIA proceeds will barely cover the first couple of years' costs for the eldest!  

I'm not at all averse to the notion that a 'collidge' education is a long-term investment, but I've seen so many parents pour their hard-earned into funding _'un certain style de_ _vie'_ for their little darlings - post-LC euphoria quite aside...! - only to then find themselves continuing to 'help them out' for another 5-10, while they tread the (even more expensive) postgrad route, or feck off for a year or two to 'find themselves'... 

_(shades of the 'four Yorkshiremen' sketch coming on, but I'll desist..!)_


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## mts (1 Jun 2005)

I do not think that it is a good idea to send kids away to college if there is a similar course within commuting distance which they can attend. I went away to college and partied my way through first year and failed half of my exams. I then reapplied and proceeded to once again fail first year of another course. 

Obviously the folks were not subbing me for another failure and I had to get a job. It took me 5 years and a lot of hard work to get a degree by night. 

On reflection I think that at 17 I was too immature to cope with the responsibility of looking after myself, going to college and not abusing the freedom I found myself with. I was not unique in this, over half my class would have failed in each year. Weeks could go by for some people and they wouldn't have seen the inside of the college.


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## buzybee (2 Jun 2005)

I do not think that people who go to college for years are time wasters.  Often they find it very hard to get a decent job after the degree, so they must do a postgrad (incurring even more expense) to get a decent job.  

My friends sister did a computer degree 3 yrs ago.  She worked in a shop after graduating, and tried to find a proper job.  Then she had to do a postgrad to get a computer job.

I got a full grant to college.  Even though I got 6 hons in the leaving cert, my parents would not pay for college.  They maintained that you would have 4 yrs of work income lost by going to college.  They think that people going to college are lazy, and putting off the world of work.  I think some of the older interviewers might have this view, so sometimes having full time college education might go against people when looking for a job.

I still remember my parents being very upset, and nearly fighting with me, when I only got a general office job after doing the business degree.  They said (quite rightly) that if I had done a general office job for the 4 yrs instead of college, I would have some money saved plus 4 yrs experience.
In the 70s and 80s,  college people could walk straight into a good job, as most people did not go to college.  These days there are too many people going to college, competition to get a good degree is fierce, and the jobs are not there.  

I think a lot of parents believe that college education will set their children up for life, and that they will walk straight into a good job.  Parents would be better off to give some SSIA money to children, when the children are buying a house.  I believe to have a steady job, and to buy a house are far more useful than a full time college education.

I know that some people who want to do engineering or science may have to go to full time college, as some of these courses are not offered by night.

A lot of parents do not know what it is like in the jobs market.  The mother may be a housewife, and the father may have a good job with the same company for years.  The teachers want to say there is X number of pupils from their  school going to college.  The teachers make out that college is the be all and end all.  When I was in school in the late 80s the teachers made out that we would never work and be starving & homeless if we did not go to college.


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## Fintan (6 Jun 2005)

Just to balance the argument out against college. I think the best thing you can do is let your children go to college, away from home if at all possible.

Why I hear you ask? Well its time they learned to fend for themselves. 

If they are doing an arts course, you must remember that arts students have very few lectures and most of the time is meant to be spent reading, thus giving the student enough time to get a part time job. To help pay the 350-450 that ollyk1 seems to think is needed to buy food / clothes / pay the bills every month. 

I did a business degree in DCU and had my pick of jobs two years ago, would I have ended up in the same job with four years work experience under my belt and no degree? NOT A HOPE! degrees are considered minimum qualifications these days, the same way the leaving cert did years ago. In a few years it will be a masters that will be considered the bare minimum.

As for the arts student bashing, saying they will find it hard to get a job, yes that is true, any arts student who doesnt consider a postgrad qualification is dedluding themselves. BUT the whole idea of arts is to give you a much wider knowledge and allow you to find the path you wish to take (also make an essential member of any pub quiz team!).

So all in all, let your kids fly the nest, but sit down and show them how much you can afford to pay and let the kids come up with imagnative ways to get by. 

Hope some of this made sense.

Cheers

Fintan


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## DrMoriarty (7 Jun 2005)

This discussion brings to mind the old joke about how the Engineering graduate looks at a problem and says 'how does that work?', the Science grad says '_why_ does it work?', the Commerce grad says 'how much does it cost?', and the Arts grad says 'do you want fries with that?'... 

_(posted as an Arts grad - with three subsequent postgrad qualifications..! )_

I still believe a 3rd-level education - in whatever area - is an investment likely to pay (financial) dividends in the longer term, for most people. But there have always been and always will be notable exceptions...


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## ClubMan (7 Jun 2005)

DrMoriarty said:
			
		

> I still believe a 3rd-level education - in whatever area - is an investment likely to pay (financial) dividends in the longer term, for most people. But there have always been and always will be notable exceptions...



Do you mean people with a third level qualification who don't "make it" or those without who do - or both?


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## buzybee (7 Jun 2005)

I think that there are not enough quality jobs for everyone going to college. Fintan, you were probably one of the best in the class, that is why you got the job.  We had a learning curve marking in college i.e a certain amount of As were given out, a certain amount of Bs etc.  Even though I had got 6 hons in the leaving cert, and studied hard at college, I was still only placed half way down the class i.e. second class hons degree.

I think that if you had got into a job at a lower level e.g. in a bank or large company, and had studied by night you would be as well off.  In fact financially you would be better off.  A lot of the large companies recruit entry level people at leaving cert level, and train them up themselves.  

I know college is a good learning experience re: budgeting and living away from home.  However the same could be said when people from country areas come to live and work in the city at 18 or 19.  The experience of finding a flat, paying bills, shopping etc can help to make a person more mature.


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## DrMoriarty (7 Jun 2005)

ClubMan said:
			
		

> Do you mean people with a third level qualification who don't "make it" or those without who do - or both?


 
Well, both, if you mean the exceptions?

With all my qualifications, I earn a lot less than some of my 'peers' who went into business straight from school, or after just a primary degree. But most of them have worked a lot harder than me since leaving school...  (if by harder you mean longer hours/more 'face-time'/shorter holidays).

By the same token, I know people with more (or 'better') academic qualifications who've ended up twenty years later with no secure employment prospects in the area for which they've trained...


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## Fintan (7 Jun 2005)

buzybee said:
			
		

> I think that there are not enough quality jobs for everyone going to college. Fintan, you were probably one of the best in the class, that is why you got the job. We had a learning curve marking in college i.e a certain amount of As were given out, a certain amount of Bs etc. Even though I had got 6 hons in the leaving cert, and studied hard at college, I was still only placed half way down the class i.e. second class hons degree.



I can guarantee you I was far from the top of my class, I just managed to get a second class hons degree.



			
				buzybee said:
			
		

> I think that if you had got into a job at a lower level e.g. in a bank or large company, and had studied by night you would be as well off. In fact financially you would be better off. A lot of the large companies recruit entry level people at leaving cert level, and train them up themselves.


 
Yes that is true, but, you say that there are not enough quality jobs for graduates, so using your logic these graduates are going to be competeing with the leaving certificate students, so surely it makes more sense to get a degree? 



			
				buzybee said:
			
		

> I know college is a good learning experience re: budgeting and living away from home. However the same could be said when people from country areas come to live and work in the city at 18 or 19. The experience of finding a flat, paying bills, shopping etc can help to make a person more mature.



yes you are right it can be the same, but most colleges provide things like medical service, pastroal care, counselling, opportunity to join a wide vairety of clubs and socities. Which help ease the transition from family to independent living.


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## Guest127 (10 Jun 2005)

Currently have two in college. 'enrolment' fees around €800 each. one on 'second' spin through college more or less looks after herself but to try and answer your question
campus at dcu last year was around €3300 + €330 for electricity etc and €300 deposit for 'damages' etc. havent seen any of this back yet. the campus authorites came in for a fair bit of stick for their enthusiasm to fine the students for untidiness etc but knowing how the place would look after just a week or two if they didn't doesn't bear to think about. He usually commuted home on fridays and back on monday mornings ( private bus company on M1 just over an hour and costs €5 each way).Dont know if this is feasable for Clare. He took plenty of food etc back with him each week and I gave him €50 pocket money ( mean and tight , so what?) to do him for the week.  This included his weekend spending money.The more you give them the more they will spend on drink anyway. books or college expenses I paid as they arose. overall I would say the year cost approx €7,000/€7500 but there was a noticable savings in electricity at home during this period.


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## shulgin1000 (13 Jun 2005)

With the benefit of hindsight, I think subject choice is very very important.  I ended up  commiting myself to a subject area that I simply lost interest in.  Even if I hadnt, the job prospects - well they were ok - but the money was rubbish.
I studied in England - taking time out to earn cash to get me through by working in Germany.
The going away was what I wanted at the time - and whilst it wasnt without its difficulties - I enjoyed it and i'm better off for the experience.
I think that immaturity and going to college is a problem.  Education is an expensive business in terms of investment of time/money. If your not motivated to succeed or live up to your true potential because of it, maybe its best left till later.

In looking back, I think in my case it would have made much more sense to go out into the workforce early and try different jobs - to see what suited. I think this applies to many.  Remember, whilst it may be expensive, education is more available than ever before.  IF you want it bad enough, you can work and study at the same time. In my case, I havnt given up.  I am working an unskilled job for a multinational (that pays alright money) and am taking up the opportunity to study for a M.Sc - which has a pricetag of €10k - which they will pay for.  Given the rate of change these days, education/skilling up is an ongoing process. Its not simply a case of doing a degree and being setup on the one career track for life.


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## DrMoriarty (13 Jun 2005)

> immaturity and going to college is a problem


 Bingo, imho...

Every year, I see a fair few 1st year students (esp. Arts) who seem to fall into this category. They've filled in their CAO application midway through 6th year, i.e. at age 16-17, usually under the watchful eye of ambitious parents, then failed to get a place on the course of choice and have been packed off to "go-to-college" anyway... [etc.]

By contrast, the 10-15% of "mature" students (>24 <124) are invariably at the top of the class, and imho seem to genuinely enjoy what they're doing and benefit from it.

My own eldest* will only be turning 17 _after_ her LC results come out, i.e. about a month before starting college (presuming she does) and tbh, if she expresses the faintest interest in taking a year out first, I'd be inclined to encourage her.

_[Edit: so far wise, mature and 'responsible' far beyond her 15 years, thank God! ]_


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## Guest127 (15 Jun 2005)

Couldn't agree more with the last two comments. Daughter did leaving cert at 17 and applied usual degree and diploma places. Took up the diploma course ( animation dun laoghaire - now degree course) but after completing the course showed absolutely no interest, took year 'out' doing bits and bobs and has since returned to college, now more focused and settled then when  she was 17. a year out at end of leaving cert would have been a better choice, both for both of us. luckily as it was a diploma course and she completed she was allowed to 'progress' to a degree course with no fees. but it still costs a lot of money to run through college again. and of course her friends all have cars etc now but she's happy enough with her decision. old proverb about young head  on old shoulders still applies. going back to the original poster got the 'bill' from dcu for next years 1semister for campus, (€300 deposit already paid) €2490 - which includes the electricity charge and if not paid by tomorrow incurs an €60 'administration' surcharge. but they still have not refunded last years deposit.
the law profession wouldn't get a look in when it comes to campus residences and their ability to collect and presumably bank deposits long before you are entitled to claim residence. no doubt summer students from overseas were milked earlier in the year for summer residence of the same accommodation.


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## dobsdave (27 Sep 2006)

cuchulainn said:


> Currently have two in college. 'enrolment' fees around €800 each. .........


Just wondering if any of the enrolment fees can be claimed back on tax?Or is it stricly fees only?Thanks


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## ragazza (27 Sep 2006)

Most of the pros and cons listed here for whether to go to college or go straight to paid employment only look at the financials  - but what about the personal development side of it?

Some of the best days of my life were in college - free from school restrictions, meeting people from different backgrounds and nationality, being exposed to new influences, loving the new stuff I was learning and being challenged by the brightest people from other schools.
I would never discourage anyone from going to college - even if you could go straight into full time employment and save some money. You'll probably make it back anyway in the long run due to higher salary.

The only thing I would do differently is take my mother's advice and take a gap year after college, instead of going into paid employment. As she put it "you'll be working enough years - dont rush into a job".


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## ClubMan (27 Sep 2006)

dobsdave said:


> Just wondering if any of the enrolment fees can be claimed back on tax?Or is it stricly fees only?Thanks


I think it's only tuition fees that benefit from tax relief. As far as I remember the old style capitation fees did not and I guess that enrollment fees are the same thing?


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## DrMoriarty (27 Sep 2006)

Yup.


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## dobsdave (27 Sep 2006)

Oh well, thanks for the replies folks.


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## Oilean Beag (29 Sep 2006)

Agree with Ragazza & am suprised at the prevailing attitude to college here on AAM. 

College were the formative years of my life, & I wouldn't change them for anything. 

Though, must be said college is not for everyone. Cannot look at it in terms of pure financials either.


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