# break up with a baby



## manryann (12 Sep 2009)

Just wondering iv recently split from my partner of 5 years we have a small baby, the house in which we lived in for the past two years was built on his family land and with his money (we lived together for five years in total), i paid half the mortgage bills etc for the time i lived in the house,we were engaged for three years ,i ended the relationship, are we classed as common law man and wife or does this even exist ? am i entitled to anything from the house (i moved out )


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## Thirsty (13 Sep 2009)

There is no concept in Irish law of 'common-law' spouse though the expression is often used.

You will be able to claim maintenance for your child, but will not be entitled to spousal maintenance as you were not married.

The property is not considered to be the Family Home, again as you weren't married.

However in view of the fact that you paid 50% of the mortgage, you may be entitled to claim a share of the equity of the property.  Bearing in mind that the land on which the house was built was his in the first place, its difficult to say how much that might be.

You can try opening negotiations with your former partner, but I strongly suspect you will have to engage a Soltr and potentially seek a court order.


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## manryann (13 Sep 2009)

negotiations are gone out the window im afraid tried that for last 7 months but just got more grief from him ..off to the solictor tomorrow to sort out custody and get a maintenance so il mention the house .thanks so much for the advice..


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## MandaC (14 Sep 2009)

Because you were engaged to be married, as far as I know you will have the same rights as a married couple.

Someone more legal may be able to explain the background, but I have seen this happen in a case where a couple split up(no children).  There was a row over how much each of the people put into the kitty and they were looking for it back pro rata.  

When it came to a meeting in the law library, it emerged that they had been engaged years and put a differenet slant on it.


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## Bronte (14 Sep 2009)

I believe the thinking on this is it's best not to leave the house.  You are not married plain and simple.  I believe you will be entitled to maintenance and some of the mortgage you have paid.  

There are some things you ought to think about though.  If the house is in negative equity and your ex doesn't have any money would it be wise to pursue him for the mortgage payments.  Can you both come to an amicable arangement rather than going to a solicitor.  It's far far better if you can both agree to how to go forward as the child is going to tie you both forever.  Whatever the reason for the split - think about the child and how it will impact on his life going forward.


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## huskerdu (14 Sep 2009)

One question which has not been answered clearly by the OP is who legally owns the house ? Is it jointly owned, or owned outright by her ex-partner ?

If it owned outright by her partner but she paid the mortgage, she can fight her case for a share of the equity. As was explained by my solicitor,  being engaged does have  bearing on this. The example he gave was an engaged couple who were saving for a house, and he pays the rent/bills and she saves most of her salary. In the event of a breakup, he can clam half of the savings, as they were effectively joint savings even
though they were in one name only. Verbal contracts like this will be upheld by the courts. 

However, in the OPs case, I agree with previous posters, she needs to see a solicitor and get her case clear.


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## MandaC (14 Sep 2009)

jaybird said:


> I'm afraid thats not true. It may have some bearing on negotiations, but bein engaged is simply not the same as being married, legally speaking.



I am going from personal experience on this one. It happened to me 9 years ago.   Talks collapsed from the other side once the engagement was mentioned and a 50/50 split was on the cards.  However situation was different in that both parties purchased the house, it was just the ratios that were up for debate.  

The barrister from the other side was quite annoyed that it had not been mentioned until the last minute and threw a whole different slant on things.

I kept meaning to follow up afterwards and confirm that engaged couple were entitled to 50/50 but once it got sorted, I did not bother.   This is the bit, which I think was relevant to me because that is how it panned out, no children involved.  There was a considerable amount of equity in the property.

_Property 
The Family Home Protection Act 1976 does 
not apply to unmarried couples. However, 
engaged couples who have terminated their 
agreement to marry may have property rights 
decided as if they were married under the 
Family Law Act 1981._

Actually here is an interesting leaflet that might help the op.

www.flac.ie/download/pdf/cohabiting_couples_09.pdf

OP, is your name on the deeds?  Echo the above posts that you need to see a solicitor asap.


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## MandaC (14 Sep 2009)

I am not sure she moved out some time ago.   Reading the post it seemed to me that this has happened quite recently.  What happened to me was exactly what huskerdu said.  I also moved out of the home because I could not stay there and it was 8 months later that the case came up.

Good luck OP, it is a most difficult time.  Seek legal advice as soon as possible.


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## Nige (14 Sep 2009)

the relevant bit from the 1981 Family Law Act



> Property of *engaged* couples.
> 5.—(1) Where an agreement to marry is terminated, the rules of law relating to the rights of spouses in relation to property in which either or both of them has or have a beneficial interest shall apply in relation to any property in which either or both of the parties to the agreement had a beneficial interest while the agreement was in force as they apply in relation to property in which either or both spouses has or have a beneficial interest.
> (2) Where an agreement to marry is terminated, section 12 of the Married Women's Status Act, 1957 (which relates to the determination of questions between husband and wife as to property) shall apply, as if the parties to the agreement were married, to any dispute between them, or claim by one of them, in relation to property in which either or both had a beneficial interest while the agreement was in force.


 
and  more on same from citizensinformation.ie.


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## manryann (15 Sep 2009)

no im afraid my name is not on the deeds, thanks so much guys you have really helped me im applying for legal aid at the moment as was also made redundant recently so happy days altogether,could be a while trying to get a solictor assigned but feel very optimistic as to what im entitled not asking for half house or huge lump sum just what iv paid to date,tried to keep things away from solictors  but he started gettin nasty nobody deserves abuse this day and age.thanks again


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## donee (15 Sep 2009)

as a man myself, try not to use YOUR child as a bargaining  chip in any future negotiations for any short term monetary gain , as so often happens in these cases its usually the man who ends up the loser in the long run . financially emotionally and as society sometimes views it ,morally. its an awkward one to give advice on, but tread carefully and good luck .


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## MandaC (17 Sep 2009)

Donee, I disagree with you there.   I think it is more down to the Individual. There are many women who just want what they are entitled to.  In my case, my ex partner had paid a larger sum of the house deposit and i made sure that was returned to him even though my Solicitor said I did not have to and his Solicitor was expecting 50% to.  Even though he did horrible things like hiding the dog and pretending she was stolen for months(I was heartbroken) and saying some money we had was a loan (it was not and I proved it), so it is not always the man who ends up worse off.

I think the OP as well only wants a fair settlement.

OP, it is all very well and good saying you do not want to go to a Solicitor, but it is so important for you to do things properly.  Good Luck.


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## manryann (18 Sep 2009)

the last thing i wanted to do was go down this road at all but at the end of the day im still being treated like i took the whole house off him amongst other things im not trying to get revenge or anything that but i dont se the point after i put my fair share into the running and the upkeep of the house while i was there and he is now living in a huge house no money worried he has a very good job and me and his daughter are livin in a tiny two bed flat i cant stress how tiny and he's paying 90 euro a week to me for mainteance, i have tried on so man occasions to sit down and talk to my ex and things are fine for a few days and he gets nasty with smart comments turning up two hours late etc etc. I think iv been way to soft for too long, i dont want my daughter growing up listening to her parents fight every time they see each other so i think solictor is the only way. thanks so much for all your advice its very much appreciated .


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## banbha (19 Sep 2009)

Hi there,
I'm sorry you are in this bad situation. First get all your facts together and straight in your mind - bills paid, monies earned, who paid what and when and so on for the course of your relationship. This will get clear in your mind where you and your ex stand, and will help any solicitor you get to figure out where you stand. Second, remember that your baby knows nothing of this and, if you can, you should try to involve the father in raising him or her. I know it is hard (I had all sorts fantasies for how to get my ex back), but time is a great healer, and hopefully in the future you can get to a situation where you can be, if not friends, then good co-parents. Good luck.


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## irishmoss (19 Sep 2009)

Hi 
Sorry to hear of your situation but before going to a solicitor is there any possibility you could both attend mediation, it's not to reconcile but to sort out your affairs? 
[broken link removed]


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