# Where would you emigrate to and why?



## truthseeker (15 Nov 2010)

Over the weekend, OH and I were discussing the possibility of emigration.

Both professionals, no kids, there is a mortgage but could rent that out for a while and make up the shortfall for a few years anyway.

We just dont see there being anything left for us in Ireland. He isnt working right now, I am but my pay has been cut, levies etc...
I cant see the country pulling itself up by the bootstraps and offering anything in the way of a good lifestyle in the future. Im sick of waiting for the budget hammer to drop each year. I just dont see much of a reason to stay here.

But where would be good to go? Im not looking to live a millionaires lifestyle but would like a reasonable ecomony, a good climate and a chance to actually build towards a good quality of life with hard work.

Where would you go - and why?


----------



## Caveat (15 Nov 2010)

Economic circumstances being more normal I would go with Spain or maybe France.

Have often thought of Australia. How bad can it be?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/nov/08/australia-trundle-new-south-wales

Canada appeals to me too.


----------



## RMCF (15 Nov 2010)

Can you speak any language other than English?

I'd say that would immediately rule out a lot of places for sheer convenience.


----------



## PaddyW (15 Nov 2010)

Down Under or Canada I reckon.


----------



## truthseeker (15 Nov 2010)

RMCF said:


> Can you speak any language other than English?


 
No - but we would be willing to stick things out long enough here to become reasonably proficient in another language - although that would probably only apply to a European language - I cant imagine my Japanese would get up to scratch too quickly 

But I agree - obviously an English speaking country would make a transition easier.


----------



## RonanC (15 Nov 2010)

Alot of people say Canada, but you would need to remember that temperatures drop down as low as -40c (minus) in winter and winter lasts Oct to April/May in some parts, and its not unusual to have snow in June and July in other parts.


----------



## becky (15 Nov 2010)

I have said Canada as well. 

It being colder makes it more attractive to me. I could never live in a country like Spain.


----------



## huskerdu (15 Nov 2010)

I think the criteria would have to be (In order of importance)

Where will I get a job immediately, hopefully in my chosen field ( This does rule out anywhere where you dont speak the first language)

What is the education system like, if you have kids (Language also an issue here)

How far away from home am I prepared to go ? ( Many of us have elderly/sick parents and you cant rule out homesickness)

What climate would I like to be living in ?

If you find anywhere that meets all 4 criteria, great.  Probably doing well to have 3.


----------



## truthseeker (15 Nov 2010)

Interesting huskerdu.



huskerdu said:


> Where will I get a job immediately, hopefully in my chosen field ( This does rule out anywhere where you dont speak the first language)


 
I wouldnt mind working in something other than my chosen field if I liked the work and it paid the bills and allowed me to save - initially at least.



huskerdu said:


> What is the education system like, if you have kids (Language also an issue here)


 
Not an issue for us.



huskerdu said:


> How far away from home am I prepared to go ? ( Many of us have elderly/sick parents and you cant rule out homesickness)


 
Yes I agree with this. Its a tough call.



huskerdu said:


> What climate would I like to be living in ?


 
A warm one. And a safe country - Id like a slow paced life


----------



## Purple (15 Nov 2010)

The one place that I have visited that I could easily live is Connecticut and up-state New York. 
The climate is great (hot in the summer and cold in the winter). The people are very friendly, the infrastructure is great and culturally it is a million miles away from the soulless blandness of Florida and much of the Midwest (nice restaurants, cafe culture, art galleries etc).


----------



## thedaras (15 Nov 2010)

I think there are a lot of people in the same position, thinking of getting out of here.So if you have the chance Truthseeker,go for it.

Its a bit more difficult when you have children at different stages,however, when I get the chance ,I will go.

Thats not an if I get the chance ,its when,as there have been opportunity's in the past but we didn't take up the offer,now we will.

Top choice would be Canada.
Then USA, Australia.

The loss to this country due to the incompetence of the government will make those who can go, go.. that's a shame really,as these are usually the high earners/high tax payers/well educated,its a great loss on so many levels,but would /could blame them.

In the 80s it was much easier to leave,as most hadn't got massive mortgages and or negative equity.

I feel sorry for those who have no choice but to stay..I thank my lucky stars every day that at the very least I have a choice..

And Bertie walks away into the sunlight and he lives happily ever after...will we ever learn...


----------



## Teatime (15 Nov 2010)

New Zealand. Gorgeous country, relaxed way of life. Weather is nice (I like rain too). Rugby. 
It is where I plan to retire.


----------



## orka (15 Nov 2010)

If we had no kids... New Zealand would get my vote if we had no family here – but it’s too far away to be as parents get older. I think we would move to Switzerland if it was going to be a permanent move but if we just wanted to bail out for a few years, I think the Isle of Man would be an option.


----------



## dmos87 (16 Nov 2010)

Canada is definitely the top spot for us, but thats mainly because OH has just qualified as a Mech Engineer and theres plenty of job opportunities for him there. I would do anything there at all, doesn't bother me once I'm busy. The temperature in most places is very very cold, and particularly the areas we need to be looking at for his job - Alberta, Fort McMurray, Edmonton, etc. 

If I had a choice I think I would be looking more at Vancouver.


----------



## Firefly (16 Nov 2010)

*La France!*


----------



## shnaek (16 Nov 2010)

Switzerland, Germany or Denmark. There are plenty of jobs available, and they are civilised well run countries. Handy to travel around Europe too from any of them. And not too far from home. I lived in Australia for a while and I loved it-but it's just too far away. Until someone invents teleportation.


----------



## bullbars (16 Nov 2010)

I have emigrated. Living and working in the middle east. Tax free salary and good standard of living. Noticeable climate change to say the least!


----------



## Thirsty (16 Nov 2010)

Of all the countries I've lived/worked in New Zealand would be my No. 1 choice other than Ireland.

To be honest though the thought of starting all over again in a new country fills me with dread; I just don't think I could do it all again and I hope to God I don't have to.


----------



## Caveat (16 Nov 2010)

Thirsty said:


> To be honest though the thought of starting all over again in a new country fills me with dread; I just don't think I could do it all again and I hope to God I don't have to.


 
In a bizarre way it would almost be a better thing from my perspective in that "having to" would probably be the only circumstances under which I would make such a decision. Would probably just continue to live out my life in disgruntled inertia otherwise.


----------



## levelpar (16 Nov 2010)

How about China, nice people, great economy and loads of work for the educated or skilled.  Lovely Lapsong tea as well


----------



## thedaras (16 Nov 2010)

Bermuda looks nice...


----------



## Caveat (16 Nov 2010)

thedaras said:


> Bermuda looks nice...


 Well as I'm assuming you're not Bermudian, very little chance of an Irish induced property bubble anyway - you won't be allowed to own any! 

Be prepared for a slow pace of life - literally: speed limit on all roads 35 kph!

Better have a pretty unique career or skill too or you won't have a job either - preference given to islanders.


----------



## Ancutza (16 Nov 2010)

How about Romania!?  Excellent standard of living for little money.  Quality of life second to none.  Super-relaxed, virtually crime-free, very good public education system and private healthcare which would shame Ireland.  Language is easy to learn (very similar to Italian) and a population who are incredibly welcoming. You'll have to nearly come to  blows with them to be allowed to stay at home and cook your own meals!

Climate is fabulous too.  Spend all Summer in T-shirt and shorts BBQ-ing and Winter skiing, sledging and sitting up-to-your neck in hot springs.

Not your usual image of Romania eh?


----------



## thedaras (16 Nov 2010)

Caveat said:


> Well as I'm assuming you're not Bermudian, very little chance of an Irish induced property bubble anyway - you won't be allowed to own any!
> 
> Be prepared for a slow pace of life - literally: speed limit on all roads 35 kph!
> 
> Better have a pretty unique career or skill too or you won't have a job either - preference given to islanders.



Afraid I have none of the above.
This just came to mind,even though its way before my time..

The imperial leather commercial which Joanna Lumley plays the mother who, peering out of the window, tells the father "Simon, Bermuda looks nice."..


----------



## burger1979 (17 Nov 2010)

I'd go back to NZ, wellington to be exact, lot of good memories from there. not got the best weather in the world, but its a small city, outdoor lifestyle right on the door step, relaxed lifestyle...........and when the sun does shine walking down to the sea front along the boardwalk, jandels and shorts on, pick up an ice cream on oriental bay, chill out on the sea front for a few hours ( dont forget to slap on the sun cream, sun is strong). The gentle breeze picks up a bit, time to head off. Back down the board walk, past Te Papa museum, stop off at Macs Brewery bar for a nice cold one and some excellent sea food, sit outside enjoying the last of the rays at the sun slips behind the hills for the night....................bliss...


----------



## Odea (17 Nov 2010)

Ancutza said:


> How about Romania!? Excellent standard of living for little money. Quality of life second to none. Super-relaxed, virtually crime-free, very good public education system and private healthcare which would shame Ireland. Language is easy to learn (very similar to Italian) and a population who are incredibly welcoming. You'll have to nearly come to blows with them to be allowed to stay at home and cook your own meals!
> 
> Climate is fabulous too. Spend all Summer in T-shirt and shorts BBQ-ing and Winter skiing, sledging and sitting up-to-your neck in hot springs.
> 
> Not your usual image of Romania eh?


 
No, not at all.  The stereo type image is clouding everything. What parts would suggest visiting?


----------



## Ancutza (17 Nov 2010)

If you are just visiting then the northern bit along the border with the Ukraine is an absolute must.  It's called Maramures and stretches right across to the romanian bit of moldova.  There you will find the beautiful painted monasteries and other natural wonders like Cheia Bicazului (Romanias answer to Cheddar Gorge in the UK).

The Danube Delta is also magnificent as is Transylvania (all of it) and it's castelated medieval citadels such as Sighisoara (birthplace of Vlad Tepes inspiration for Dracula) and Brasov both of which are Saxon in origin.

If you're going to be all boring and settled (like me) and just live here, run a business and raise a family then, outside of Bucharest, you will probably gravitate more towards the centre and west.  Cities such as Timisoara, Cluj and Oradea (where I live) would provide you with every mod-con you'd be familiar with in Ireland, all the services and infrastructure (International airports and only a few hours drive from Vienna, Budapest, Bratislava, Milan etc).

Should you ever wish to have a look around please PM me and I'll try and be of as much assistance as possible.  I'm passionate about trying to change some of the very ignorant preconceptions that exist about this amazing country particularly in Ireland and the UK.


----------



## RonanC (17 Nov 2010)

@ Ancutza, Jeremy Clarkson & co managed to twist my arm ever so slightly with their and these two quotes



> Romania thank you for having us and ...........can we stay.........forever!!





> the best road in the world


----------



## Ancutza (17 Nov 2010)

I think that what would appeal to someone like Clarkson in Romania is it's overt 'honesty'.  It doesn't, as a country, have any airs or graces.  Romanians are well aware of the negative image their country has abroad.  I remeber once when a container-load of gypsies were found in Rosslare one of my business accquaintances phoning me up to apologise!

Why it should be of interest to very many irish is the fact that, over the last decade or so, the irish have become world experts in so many areas which, in Romania, simply are either under-developed or not developed at all.  If you have a business in food-processing, particularly without additives, preservatives etc. then Romania is a booming marketplace.  If you are a farmer then it's a fabulous place (cheap land, endless EU grants access to EU markets etc.).  If you are in IT then the well-educated workforce is there to support you.  Two of my childhood friends ran very successful web-based learning businesses with most of the content programmed and hosted out here.  Now things are different at home they are looking to relocate here and explore other markets.  If you have experience in HVAC (as my irish brother-in-law does) then there are consulting jobs a plenty here, particularly in Bucharest.  Another friend of mine is teaching ACCA accredited modules to romanian banks (BCR and Banca Transilvania).  There is a world of opportunity out here for precisely the reason that Romania IS underdeveloped in so many sectors.


----------



## Caveat (18 Nov 2010)

How important is knowledge of the language Ancutza?

Obviously it would be sector dependent to a large extent and it goes without saying that one should learn the language anyway but how critical is it - is English widely spoken?


----------



## MissRibena (18 Nov 2010)

Buna Ziua Ancutza - oh, you're making me so lonely for my Romanian dream! 

Whatever about living there, I can totally attest to Ancutza's assertions about the culture, landscape and people ... fab, fab country.  Our misconceptions about Romania are our loss.


----------



## BillK (18 Nov 2010)

Many of the Caribbean islands have English as a first language and, certainly in the case of Trinidad & Tobago, are relatively cheap places in which to live.


----------



## Ancutza (18 Nov 2010)

> Obviously it would be sector dependent to a large extent and it goes without saying that one should learn the language anyway but how critical is it - is English widely spoken?


 
English is very widely spoken.  Basically anyone with a leaving certificate obtained since the '89 revolution speaks some english.  Very many of those will speak excellent english.  Anyone who has a university education will speak better english than you!! If you are working in IT, Financial services or, indeed, many manufacturing or service industries then you will not really need to speak romanian at all although obviously it is a distinct advantage to do so.

I did 2 hours per day 2 days per week 'grinds' with a romanian highschool teacher of english for 3 months when I first came out here 10 years ago.  That was enough to get a very good grounding (and I'm *not* a natural polyglot!!) then, because of the industry I worked in at the time, I got better by talking to the shopfloor workforce although we spoke only english in the office.  6 months of a bit of graft will see you right but in the meantime you'll speak english.

Even today I only speak english with the wife and kids (although herself is prone to swearing at me in romanian when I'm naughty).  We speak 50:50 in the office out of deference to our super-dooper bookeeper who is in her late 40's and doesn't speak english.  Romanian when she is in the room so she understands what the craic is and english otherwise.

They're all mad keen to try out their english on you here anyway which can be a pain when you speak better romanian than they do english.  Like "Please lets stick to romanian and we'll get this done faster! Please, please!!!'  They are very forgiving if you stumble over pronounciations (although they will have a good giggle!) They are nothing like the very obtuse french for example.


----------



## Ancutza (19 Nov 2010)

> Many of the Caribbean islands have English as a first language and, certainly in the case of Trinidad & Tobago, are relatively cheap places in which to live.


 
It's also EXTREMELY difficult and complicated to get working visas on many of the islands.  I've worked in Barbados & St. Vincent and the Grenadines doing consultancy and watched an english colleague of mine get arrested in the street in Bridgetown for 'irregularities' in his working visa.  Kept him for 3 days which was most amusing.

My best friend (irish) is married to a girl from T&T and they now live in Dublin.  Trinidad is by all accounts a tough place to live.  Very densely populated, quite expensive and with a fairly high crime rate.


----------



## thedaras (19 Nov 2010)

Ancutza;





> Trinidad is by all accounts a tough place to live. Very densely populated, quite expensive and with a fairly high crime rate



That sounds very familiar ,all that's missing is an incompetent government and it  would feel like home


----------

