# Why does Guinness vary from pub to pub?



## Marie (5 May 2005)

Ah....Guinness!  When I was a nipper we lived over Dwyers Public House in Bow Lane (beside what is now the Museum of Modern Art) and my grandmother who lived above us used to send me down to the 'snug' with her tankard to get her "stout", which as reward I got a "drag" from........so a bit of an expert here!

As we were within spitting distance of St.James' Brewery that 'stout' from the tap was, I think the 'benchmark'.

When I came to live in UK in the early 70's I didn't know why the stuff sold in pubs could be called by the same name, for Guinness it was not!  The explanation given me then was that (a) it does not travel well and the sea-crossing + the new metal drums being used upset the taste and composition.

During spells in Ireland two experiences out of hundreds came close to my memory of 'real Guinness'; the pint served in a pub in Dingle Co.Kerry, and the pints pulled in some of the 'bona-fide' pubs along the Quays in Dublin, where you can step off the ferry and go and have a Guinness with a whisky chaser at 7.30am.


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## Unregistered (5 May 2005)

Try a pint of Guinness in the Tuning Fork in Rathfarnhan, Heaven


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## Brouhahaha (5 May 2005)

You know the way some pubs have better tasting Guinness than others - this seems to not make sense as the pipes etc. are now maintained for every pub by Guinness themselves. I recently was told that some pubs buy older, less fresh barrells of Guinness at a knocked down price to boost their profits. Has anyone else heard this theory?


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## ubiquitous (5 May 2005)

The bloody stuff is served so cold in most pubs nowadays that it has no taste, good bad or indifferent.


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## Unregistered (5 May 2005)

Why do we get so hung up on drinking in this country ?


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## stobear (5 May 2005)

Have not heard that theory but I do notice a difference in different pubs, comparing Meath to Tipperary , the Guinness in Tipp is much creamier and not always freezing cold, but nicely chilled. Why the quality /taste is so different  I am not sure..............


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## Unregistered (5 May 2005)

Is it something to do with the cellars being different temperatures?  Suposedly the guinness in the Gravediggers in Glasnevin is the best in Dublin because they don't have any artificial heating/refridgeration in their cellar.  The Guinness is just served at the temp it is stored at.


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## cullenswood (5 May 2005)

Unregistered said:
			
		

> Suposedly the guinness in the Gravediggers in Glasnevin is the best in Dublin



Love myths like these.   Some bar owners spreads around a rumour about their Guinness being the best and it catches on, and everyone goes in there and drinks their pint, and then say (while rubbing the froth from their lips!) "Aaaaah that's a lovely pint" even though it tastes the exact same as in about a hundred other pubs


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## Unregistered (5 May 2005)

cullenswood said:
			
		

> Love myths like these .... "Aaaaah that's a lovely pint" even though it tastes the exact same as in about a hundred other pubs



Dunno about that, in galway, guinness is far nicer in some "small" local pubs rather than the bigger, trendy ones. I remember hearing before about the storage conditions and the length of the pipe making a difference.


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## demoivre (5 May 2005)

I think you can say there is taste variation for tapped beer / stout /ale in most pubs. The distance from keg to tap, the frequency of pipe cleaning , the frequency of pulled pints , amount of gas and the temperature are all influencing factors. I'm no expert though,this is what people tell me -  honest!    : )


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## cuchulainn (8 May 2005)

its very hard to find a bad  pint of guinness now though, compared to say 20 years ago. Guinness have effectively stopped this . Maybe it has to do with how the glasses are washed or how the pint is actually pulled. Most pubs have the 'new' cooling system in now but even in the ones that dont the pint is pretty consistant.


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## shnaek (8 May 2005)

Try the Porter House in Dublin for a really fine stout. It tastes as good as the best Guinness.


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## Unregistered (9 May 2005)

Going on memory from decades back, Guinness should be stored at 55 degrees (Centigrade, I think).Its delivered to pub not quite conditioned so publican has to make sure its in stock for a few days...number of days depends on weather/temperature.A good cellar/coolroom is important.Its a living drink (live yeast) and needs careful handling.
Don`t know what new technologies are used nowadays but they are unlikely to improve its flavour.
Was also impressed by The Porterhouse...good beer.


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## Miner (10 May 2005)

There's a lot of factors involved in the taste.
- The cleanliness of the glass and also whether a detergent was used or not.
- Cleanliness of the lines (pipes)
- Level of gas used.
- Type of cooler used.  Some have an actual cooler which the beer passes through before reaching the actual tap.  Some beers go straight from keg to tap with an outer water pipe cooling the beer.
- Length of the draw (pipe from barrel to tap) - a short draw is the best which is why the smaller pubs with the cold room closer to the taps generally serve the best pints.
- The frequency of the draw on the tap.  If you're the only person in the pub drinking guinness then its sitting in the lines idle till you get your next pint.
- The movement on the barrell.  If when changing a keg the bar staff have a lot of movement on a barrell it unsettles the beer.

Last but not least... the skill of the barstaff.


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## Unregistered (10 May 2005)

Unregistered said:
			
		

> Dunno about that, in galway, guinness is far nicer in some "small" local pubs rather than the bigger, trendy ones. I remember hearing before about the storage conditions and the length of the pipe making a difference.




I'll second that. Its very true.


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## 2 Hot (10 May 2005)

Guinness should be stored at 55 degrees (Centigrade, I think).

55 F I would think, that is 12 C

55 F is getting up to be too hot to handle


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## Leper (14 Jun 2011)

Speaking as a veteran of pulling the perfect pint, there is an urban myth about Guinness, Murphy's, Beamish tasting better at so-and-so's.  Most of this is in peoples' mind.  I dont know how often I've heard that 'Padser' uses wet sacks only to cool his pub's stout. More publicans suggest that they store theirs in unmoved kegs for several weeks before selling.  One publican even suggested that storing his kegs on wooden pallets and being unmoved again for weeks was causing the air to circulate better around the keg. The glass has a lot to do with the taste of stout also.

The vast majority of barmen/publicans pour draught stout wrongly.  Like stupid drivers who still think that everything they do is right most publicans are the same believeing theirs is perfect.

The truth is that most pints are far from being perfect.  Ever see a barman/publican washing their hands after coming from the toilet? How often do you see bar-staff shaking hands with some filthy moron and then handling glasses. I wont even mention having a cigarette.  I have even seen several bar staff scratching themselves with their filthy fingernails before serving a pint.

Now, if you can tell me of a place where all of the above are sorted, then you have the pub with the perfect pint.


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## Deiseblue (14 Jun 2011)

Draught Guinness - bah !

The large bottle is your only man.


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## Lex Foutish (14 Jun 2011)

Deiseblue said:


> Draught Guinness - bah !
> 
> The large bottle is your only man.


 
You wouldn't be talking about something other than a large bottle of Guinness, now would you, Deise?


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## ringledman (14 Jun 2011)

Why is Guinness so rubbish in the UK and so great in Ireland? 

I was told once that it is unpasturised in Ireland and has to be pasturised under UK law? 

Is this true? or is it the fact that Guinness come out and clean the pipes as opposed to some barman in the UK?


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## Lex Foutish (14 Jun 2011)

ringledman said:


> Why is Guinness so rubbish in the UK and so great in Ireland?
> 
> I was told once that it is unpasturised in Ireland and has to be pasturised under UK law?
> 
> Is this true? or is it the fact that Guinness come out and clean the pipes as opposed to some barman in the UK?


 
Is it to do with the way it's pulled by the barman? I've seen some real hatchet jobs done on pints of Guinness in England and the USA.


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## Marion (14 Jun 2011)

Lex said:
			
		

> Is it to do with the way it's pulled by the barman?



Yes, some people haven't a clue how to pour it properly. But of course temperature and cleanliness have a bearing!

Like leper, I was a dab hand at pulling the perfect pint in a previous life.

Shamrocks were my speciality. I played up to the tourist market big time. 

Deiseblue, we used to call call those large bottles  "Sergeants". 

Marion


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## Deiseblue (14 Jun 2011)

Lex Foutish said:


> You wouldn't be talking about something other than a large bottle of Guinness, now would you, Deise?



You brought a tear to my eye there Lex.

The late lamented large bottle of Phoenix - R I P.

We used to be able to get large Harp as well , now it's just Bass , Carling & Guiness.

Marion , I've also sergeants & dannos as well.


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## Lex Foutish (14 Jun 2011)

Deiseblue said:


> You brought a tear to my eye there Lex.
> 
> *The late lamented large bottle of Phoenix - R I P.*
> 
> ...


 
I went to all Cork City's home matches for years. The Horse Shoe Bar beside Turner's Cross pitch used to stock up with the pint bottles of Phoenix when your fellow travellers used to come to town. We got a great kick out of hearing them ordering in their best Deise accents! No trouble. No messing. Great days out!


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## Lex Foutish (14 Jun 2011)

Marion said:


> Yes, some people haven't a clue how to pour it properly. But of course temperature and cleanliness have a bearing!
> 
> Like leper, I was a dab hand at pulling the perfect pint in a previous life.
> 
> ...


The first time I got a shamrock on a pint of Guinness was in the Shamrock Bar in Gran Canaria. For some reason I thought the barman was from Millstreet but when I spoke to him, he had perfect native Spanish but little or no English! I'm still trying to figure that one out!


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## BOXtheFOX (15 Jun 2011)

Sometimes I wonder does the first Pint taste nicer than the second Pint. When I have my first Pint there is a "thirst" a "hunger" that is satisfied. On my second Pint the creamy smooth taste seems to have disappeared. I also have noticed that in some pubs the pints are smooth and in others a metallic taste.


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## Crugers (15 Jun 2011)

Deiseblue said:


> Draught Guinness - bah !
> 
> The large bottle is your only man.


 
Is that not just half "the order"?

I thought it was always:
Large bottle, small glass!


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## Deiseblue (15 Jun 2011)

Crugers said:


> Is that not just half "the order"?
> 
> I thought it was always:
> Large bottle, small glass!


 
Only a third of the order really as you also had to specify whether you wanted the bottle from the shelf or the cooler                            There was a time when a number of autonomous waterford distributors bottled the stout which only added to the order - some punters swore by the Kiely's bottle whilst others were Sullivan's men.


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## dereko1969 (15 Jun 2011)

ringledman said:


> Why is Guinness so rubbish in the UK and so great in Ireland?
> 
> I was told once that it is unpasturised in Ireland and has to be pasturised under UK law?
> 
> Is this true? or is it the fact that Guinness come out and clean the pipes as opposed to some barman in the UK?


 
All draught Guinness is brewed in Ireland now. It's rubbish most places, too cold leading to little or no flavour. I got a large bottle off the shelf in Grogans last week (well I got a few bottles) and it's much nicer though still not brilliant.

Porterhouse Wrasslers XXXX is (for me) the best pint of Stout available, though I do like O'Hara's and Dungarvan Black Rock also (the latter mostly available in bottles though it is on Cask in some pubs).


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## z107 (15 Jun 2011)

Guinness is like the McDonalds of stout.
I would not regard myself as a beer expert, but Guinness is pretty bland. Almost as bad as carlesburg/hineken/budweiser (which are all the same).

It's designed for people that just want to either:
- Drink loads easily and get drunk.
or
- a very light drink, flavoured water.

Some variety in Irish pubs would be fantastic.


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## micmclo (15 Jun 2011)

Bit offtopic and possibly a bit offensive

Back before the recession and possibly even now you'd find unemployed people in the pubs all day, at least the day they collected their dole or maybe when they got monthly child benefit "mickey money day".
And the cheapest drink was Beamish

So a lot of people and one publican closest to us started calling it "a pint of social welfare"
They don't use that so much these days.


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## thedaras (15 Jun 2011)

umop3p!sdn said:


> > Guinness is like the McDonalds of stout.
> > I would not regard myself as a beer expert, but Guinness is pretty bland. Almost as bad as carlesburg/hineken/budweiser (which are all the same).
> 
> 
> ...


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## z107 (15 Jun 2011)

> Funny that you say that as I always thought it was a "premium " product..no?


It's certainly marketed as a premium product.



> Id imagine Guinness wouldn't be too happy to hear that ! How do you make out its designed for those reasons?


Observation.
To be fair though, I do enjoy bottles of Guinness.



> I dont get that either..my locals have everything..inc alcopops,blue wicked,cider,wine,etc etc


What other draft beers do they do? How many types of alcohol free beer to they offer?


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## thedaras (15 Jun 2011)

umop3p!sdn  


> What other draft beers do they do? How many types of alcohol free beer to they offer?[/QUOTE)
> 
> They do bottles of cider and I think its now on draft,to be honest ive no idea about the alchohol free beer,waste of a good hop
> 
> ...


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## Sunny (16 Jun 2011)

Guinness does taste differently in different pubs but part of that is psychological. I am convinced a pint tastes better in a dingy old mans rather than a super pub like Cafe En Seine.

I was in London recently and asked for a pint of guinness. The bargirl poured the pint to the top and proceeded to stir it. Needless to say I changed my order.


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## Deiseblue (16 Jun 2011)

Reminds me of a character played by the late Lloyd Bridges in the film " Blown Away " about a Boston bomb disposal squad.

Lloyd enters a Boston bar & orders a pint of Guinness , whips it from the counter before it's settled , lashes into it & declares in the most hideous Oirish accent " Shure 'tis the nectar of the Gods " 

The entire cinema audience fell around the place laughing.


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## micmclo (16 Jun 2011)

I watched Blown Away last night.
Hoped it would be a good Irish mob film and Tommy Lee Jones and Forest Whitaker are usually good

Jaysus, the Irish accents 
Fiddley i di i, begarrah aren't we having fun.......


And I thought Tom Cruise or Gerard Butler were bad, 

Is this how Americans view us?


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