# Trade Union (IBOA) ignoring my correspondence.



## SlurrySlump

I am a member of a trade union. 

I wrote to them some time ago about a work related issue and they completely ignored my correspondence. I wrote again and also sent some emails but all were ignored. Would it be worthwhile making a complaint to ICTU or similar?

The union that I am in produces a glossy magazine, has a fancy website, is constantly looking for new members but won't even acknowledge my correspondence. 

Having paid my membership fees for years I feel really let down by them.


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## europhile

*Re: Trade Union ignoring my correspondence.*

I'd write right away to:

David Begg
General Secretary
31-32 Parnell Square
Dublin 1


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## geld

*Re: Trade Union ignoring my correspondence.*

Speak to your local trade union rep....


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## bonzos

*Re: Trade Union ignoring my correspondence.*

had the same problem with the TEEU , great at demanding money,sending letters and mags but totally USELESS when when called upon for advice.total money making operation!


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## olddoll

*Re: Trade Union ignoring my correspondence.*

Unfortunately, Unions have become money making (and spending) machines.  Their glossy magazines pass on handy titbits of information on fashion, films and recipes!!

I don't think it is easy to get them to deal with a one off problem.  If a number of people are affected then they may be inclined to listen.


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## shipibo

*Re: Trade Union ignoring my correspondence.*

Slurry,


    Take it you are not a Dub, so ...

     If the Union is SIPTU (I assume it is,  do not understand why you did not mention union involved), send a call you your regional rep.

   Dublin is Patricia King, or Jack O Connor.

    Send previous letter to them and demand explanation.


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## Complainer

*Re: Trade Union ignoring my correspondence.*



SlurrySlump said:


> I am a member of a trade union. I wrote to them some time ago about a work related issue and they completely ignored my correspondence. I wrote again and also sent some emails but all were ignored. Would it be worthwhile making a complaint to ICTU or similar?
> The union that I am in produces a glossy magazine, has a fancy website, is constantly looking for new members but won't even acknowledge my correspondence. Having paid my membership fees for years I feel really let down by them.


Have you considered giving them a call?


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## ajapale

*Re: Trade Union ignoring my correspondence.*

In my experience Unions are kind of old fashioned/traditional interms of how they operate.

They dont regard themselves as a business or service provider so efforts to engage them on that basis may not work out. They regard themselves as a movement representing the membership as a whole. They tend to do things a verbally and face-to-face or through meetings and committees.

They tend to react with phrases like " a union is only as good as its members" and "why not become a union rep yourself?"


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## europhile

*Re: Trade Union ignoring my correspondence.*

Is it Unite by any chance (former Amicus/T&GWU)?


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## SlurrySlump

*Re: Trade Union ignoring my correspondence.*



Complainer said:


> Have you considered giving them a call?


 
Yes,and I asked to speak to a particular individual who was my designated contact. I was told that he was at a meeting and would get the message. The phone call was never returned.

I sent an email and got a response to say that he was out of the office until..... One month after that date and I still have not received a response.

It is not any of the Trade Unions listed above.


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## ubiquitous

*Re: Trade Union ignoring my correspondence.*



ajapale said:


> In my experience Unions are kind of old fashioned/traditional interms of how they operate.
> 
> They dont regard themselves as a business or service provider so efforts to engage them on that basis may not work out. They regard themselves as a movement representing the membership as a whole. They tend to do things a verbally and face-to-face or through meetings and committees.
> 
> They tend to react with phrases like " a union is only as good as its members" and "why not become a union rep yourself?"



They are not so slow when it comes to making accusations of law-breaking and financial impropriety on the part of employers, nor in demanding speedy replies from said employers in order to "prove their innocence".


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## shipibo

*Re: Trade Union ignoring my correspondence.*

One call and one e-mail ..... maybe ring again ???


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## ajapale

*Re: Trade Union ignoring my correspondence.*



ubiquitous said:


> They are not so slow when it comes to making accusations of law-breaking and financial impropriety on the part of employers, nor in demanding speedy replies from said employers in order to "prove their innocence".



Agreed ubi, They can be tough, aggressive and adversarial but still rather old fasioned in the way they operate.


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## SlurrySlump

*Re: Trade Union ignoring my correspondence.*



crumdub12 said:


> One call and one e-mail ..... maybe ring again ???


 
Maybe read my opening thread?


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## shipibo

*Re: Trade Union ignoring my correspondence.*



SlurrySlump said:


> Yes,and I asked to speak to a particular individual who was my designated contact. I was told that he was at a meeting and would get the message. The phone call was never returned.
> 
> I sent an email and got a response to say that he was out of the office until..... One month after that date and I still have not received a response.



I read this mail, have ya rang yet ??


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## ajapale

*Re: Trade Union ignoring my correspondence.*

You you spoken face to face with your union rep?

What is the nature of your issue?


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## SlurrySlump

*Re: Trade Union ignoring my correspondence.*

Having paid monthly union subs for over 8 years does anyone think it strange that my post, my emails and my phone calls are being ignored.

They advertise that they will help people with individual problems with their employer. I can't even get off the starting blocks by getting them to respond to my letter.

I have personal reasons for not discussing anything with the office rep so I went direct to the person who is our nominated rep and based in the union headquarters. 

Has anyone ever sought or been given a refund of union subs as I feel I have been paying for a service that did not supply the service?


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## ajapale

*Re: Trade Union ignoring my correspondence.*



ajapale said:


> In my experience Unions are kind of old fashioned/traditional interms of how they operate.
> 
> They dont regard themselves as a business or service provider so efforts to engage them on that basis may not work out. They regard themselves as a movement representing the membership as a whole. They tend to do things a verbally and face-to-face or through meetings and committees.
> 
> They tend to react with phrases like " a union is only as good as its members" and "why not become a union rep yourself?"



I dont you will have much success trying to get your union dues back.

As I said earlier Trade Unions regard themselves more of a "movement" than a service provider. The tend to do a lot of their business on a "face to face basis" and at committee meetings.

Many years ago when I was unhappy with a particular union I simply resigned. Do you have this option? Are there competing unions in your industry? Have you tried contacting them?

On a related issue what is the broad nature of your issue? Is is the kind of issue this union has taken up in the past (at your work place or elsewhere). It is possible that they regard you as a tiresome crank and that by ignoring you that you will go away? What do your work colleagues think? What do other members of the TU think?

Finally if you are unhappy with your union you could always attempt to set up a breakaway union or association like Brendan Ogle in Irish Rail a few years ago?

aj


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## shipibo

*Re: Trade Union ignoring my correspondence.*



SlurrySlump said:


> Having paid monthly union subs for over 8 years does anyone think it strange that my post, my emails and my phone calls are being ignored.
> 
> They advertise that they will help people with individual problems with their employer. I can't even get off the starting blocks by getting them to respond to my letter.
> 
> I have personal reasons for not discussing anything with the office rep so I went direct to the person who is our nominated rep and based in the union headquarters.
> 
> Has anyone ever sought or been given a refund of union subs as I feel I have been paying for a service that did not supply the service?



You have no chance of a refund....

Unions are slack with dealing with individual issues, maybe ring his secetary and ask for his/ her mobile, or ask to speak to his boss if he is uncontactable, if you work close to their offices, drop down and kick up hell !!!


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## SlurrySlump

*Re: Trade Union ignoring my correspondence.*



europhile said:


> Is it Unite by any chance (former Amicus/T&GWU)?


 
No, it's the IBOA.  Has anyone else had any problems dealing with them?


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## ajapale

*Re: Trade Union ignoring my correspondence.*

SP,

Would it help if you looked at the Union as a Club or Society (rather than as a service provider)? I know analogy is the lowest form of reason but to extend the analogy would you demand service from your local GAA club or Lyons Club?

If you are not happy with your union why don't you put yourself forward and get elected and make changes from the inside?

aj


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## Mpsox

I'm not a member of the IBOA but deal with them as a manager from the other side of the negotiation table. My experience is that they have had a significant turnover of full time union reps with their staff leaving/being headhunted by othe unions. I've had to deal with 4 reps in 4 years and each time it involves going right back to the start and explaining issues from scratch

Why not write direct to Larry Broderick who is head of the union?


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## Money Bags7

Agree with MPSOX - send the letter directly to the head man Larry Broderick (by registered post). Hope everything works out OK for you.


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## Bank Manager

Not a member of the IBOA - any I'm not about to try and undermine them - if you are a member I would have thought they owe it to you to at least listen to you and thereafter give you best advice.

My question: have you or could you talk with your own manager in your branch/unit to air whatever issue is causing you concern?  Sometimes we're not as bad as we are sometimes painted.

Regards,

BM


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## SlurrySlump

Bank Manager said:


> Sometimes we're not as bad as we are sometimes painted.
> BM


 
I agree.....sometimes.


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## SlurrySlump

Mpsox said:


> I'm not a member of the IBOA but deal with them as a manager from the other side of the negotiation table. My experience is that they have had a significant turnover of full time union reps with their staff leaving/being headhunted by othe unions. I've had to deal with 4 reps in 4 years and each time it involves going right back to the start and explaining issues from scratch
> 
> Why not write direct to Larry Broderick who is head of the union?


 
Well I did as you suggested and wrote a personal email to Larry Broderick followed by a hard copy in the post of the same email to Larry Broderick.

To date both have been completely ignored by the man.


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## Mpsox

their web site contains a list of most of their full time reps per each bank. you may be able to get a contact their

Failing that the only other option may be to go down to their offices in person in St Stephens Green and kick up a fuss


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## SlurrySlump

Mpsox said:


> their web site contains a list of most of their full time reps per each bank. you may be able to get a contact their
> 
> Failing that the only other option may be to go down to their offices in person in St Stephens Green and kick up a fuss


 
Their offices are now in Stephens Street Upper. I called to their new offices one weekend to hand deliver a letter only to find that they had no letter box!!

I also contacted the rep some months back directly involved with my bank with my original correspondence.......no response either.

What an organisation!


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## shipibo

Ring offices asking to speak directly to Broderick, maybe threaten to go on Joe Duffy , talk to media about him ....


Seem like a gang of jokers alright ..


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## Complainer

I think it is a fairly safe bet that this is not a customer service issue (i.e. not bothering to respond). It seems likely that the lack of response is intentional. 

Perhaps the OP should be taking a different tack - maybe submitting a related motion at your branch AGM? Or seeking support from colleagues?


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## Mpsox

Complainer said:


> I think it is a fairly safe bet that this is not a customer service issue (i.e. not bothering to respond). It seems likely that the lack of response is intentional.
> 
> Perhaps the OP should be taking a different tack - maybe submitting a related motion at your branch AGM? Or seeking support from colleagues?


 
quite possible, if the OP was to post the what the actual issue is, I'm sure someone on here would have some advice


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## Misjudged

Stop your sub and they will come running....


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## SlurrySlump

*Re: Trade Union ignoring my correspondence.*



europhile said:


> I'd write right away to:
> 
> David Begg
> General Secretary
> 31-32 Parnell Square
> Dublin 1


 
Well I did this via their web page email over two weeks ago. To date not even an acknowledgement either.

It would appear that trade unions are too busy doing bigger things than having to deal with little old me.


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## InReality

*Re: Trade Union ignoring my correspondence.*

Email and phone calls are easy to ignore in any organisation.
To be honest i'd be surprised if you would have faired better trying to contact any organisation so little.


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## shipibo

*Re: Trade Union ignoring my correspondence.*



SlurrySlump said:


> Well I did this via their web page email over two weeks ago. To date not even an acknowledgement either.
> 
> It would appear that trade unions are too busy doing bigger things than having to deal with little old me.




I assume this is not serious, this thread is getting old ...

If you really want access, rather than e-mailing, ring his secetary and request an appointment.


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## SlurrySlump

*Re: Trade Union ignoring my correspondence.*



crumdub12 said:


> I assume this is not serious, this thread is getting old ...
> 
> If you really want access, rather than e-mailing, ring his secetary and request an appointment.


 
I have phoned, calls were not returned.
I have emailed, these were not replied to.
I have written, these letters were ignored.


I contacted ICTU, no response.

I believe that I have been paying my monthly subscription to the IBOA under false pretences.  This is an extract from their webpage.

_"The Union pursues this wide agenda through collective engagement with employers on behalf of large numbers of staff. IBOA also pursues this agenda on an *individual basis* – where a member feels that they have been unfairly treated in a particular situation – by *taking personal cases with due respect to confidentiality"*_

The pictures on their website suggests that there is someone waiting on the end of a phone line to help you. [broken link removed]

This is definitely not the case. 

Has anyone ever issued legal proceedings against a trade union for false representation or similar?


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## InReality

So you think taking legal proceedings against IBOA will make them represent you better ?


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## ajapale

Hi SlurryPump,

I figure from the tone and content of your posts that the union consider you to be a vexatious nuisance.

The relationship between you and your trade union has clearly broken down. Why dont you just resign and save yourself the sub and all the aggravation!

You should look at the union as a more of a club for the mutual benefit of its members rather than a "service provider" business.

aj


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## SlurrySlump

ajapale said:


> Hi SlurryPump,
> 
> I figure from the tone and content of your posts that the union consider you to be a vexatious nuisance.
> 
> The relationship between you and your trade union has clearly broken down.
> 
> aj


 
Believe it or not I have never raised one issue with the IBOA in my life before this request for assistance. I have never complained to them, written to them, spoken to them. I have never had a relationship with the IBOA other than paying my sub and turning up for the occasional IBOA meeting that might be held after office hours. 

I simply wrote to them looking for help in dealing with my employer.

If they didn't want to help or if it was outside their remit all as they had to do was ring me, drop me a note, send me an email. 

I was simply looking for a response to an enquiry.


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## dewdrop

Ring Joe Duffy


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## micmclo

Cancel your sub and tell them why.
Then tell them you are encouraging your union comrades in your branch to leave.

Someone from union HQ will take notice


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## Complainer

ajapale said:


> Hi SlurryPump,


Freudian?


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## shipibo

SlurrySlump said:


> Believe it or not I have never raised one issue with the IBOA in my life before this request for assistance. I have never complained to them, written to them, spoken to them. I have never had a relationship with the IBOA other than paying my sub and turning up for the occasional IBOA meeting that might be held after office hours.
> 
> I simply wrote to them looking for help in dealing with my employer.
> 
> If they didn't want to help or if it was outside their remit all as they had to do was ring me, drop me a note, send me an email.
> 
> I was simply looking for a response to an enquiry.



Its sounds like you have been treated very badly, I deal with SIPTU as a company rep., and have to say most of them need a good shake.

All I can say is ring Brodericks secetary, and arrange a time for a phonecall / meeting, get back with results


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## dewdrop

Usually IBOA have local reps..have you tried this route. I must say I find your problem very strange.


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## Deiseblue

I was an IBOA member for all my working life , if ever there was a problem all I ever had to do was contact my branch rep or failing that my district secretary ( all numbers were given in the annual IBOA diary , equally the numbers were carried on the IBOA website [broken link removed] ).
You will never be ignored if you have a valid complaint .


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## Grizzly

crumdub12 said:


> Ring offices asking to speak directly to Broderick, maybe threaten to go on Joe Duffy , talk to media about him ....
> 
> 
> Seem like a gang of jokers alright ..


 
When you consider the amount of dues that the IBOA collects from it's members on a monthly/annual basis, it must be huge. From memory the IBOA never paid "strike money" back in the 1970 and 1976 bank strikes. What do they really do for their subscriptions? Is it just jobs for the boys?

Certainly the OP seems to have been badly treated by this organisation especially when they offer an individual service to their members. I would have thought that answering a letter would be the least that they could do for a member and perhaps a "follow up".


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## ajapale

Grizzly said:


> ....especially when they offer an individual service to their members......



I dont think this or any other trade union offers _"an individual service to their members". _No more than a GAA club or Tennis Club offers individual service to their members.


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## Deiseblue

Grizzly said:


> When you consider the amount of dues that the IBOA collects from it's members on a monthly/annual basis, it must be huge. From memory the IBOA never paid "strike money" back in the 1970 and 1976 bank strikes. What do they really do for their subscriptions? Is it just jobs for the boys?
> 
> Certainly the OP seems to have been badly treated by this organisation especially when they offer an individual service to their members. I would have thought that answering a letter would be the least that they could do for a member and perhaps a "follow up".


Never had a problem with the IBOA , in actual fact given the ways the Banks operated during the Celtic Tiger period with an undue emphasis on selling products to customers whether they needed them or not and then rewarding staff with result based bonuses and pay for performance contracts those of us who insisted on remaining on IBOA negotiated contracts would have been walked on if not for IBOA support.


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## Grizzly

ajapale said:


> I dont think this or any other trade union offers _"an individual service to their members". _No more than a GAA club or Tennis Club offers individual service to their members.


 
This is from their own website.


_The Union pursues this wide agenda through collective engagement with employers on behalf of large numbers of staff. IBOA also pursues this agenda on an individual basis – where a member feels that they have been unfairly treated in a particular situation – by taking personal cases with due respect to confidentiality_.


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## Complainer

Grizzly said:


> When you consider the amount of dues that the IBOA collects from it's members on a monthly/annual basis, it must be huge. From memory the IBOA never paid "strike money" back in the 1970 and 1976 bank strikes. What do they really do for their subscriptions? Is it just jobs for the boys?


Do you think that the majority of members who pay their subs from every paycheque  are too dumb to have noticed this?


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## Purple

Complainer said:


> Freudian?


Are you insinuating that the poster is lying?
Just because their post may offend your socialist dogma it is no reason to question their integrity.


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## Deiseblue

Purple said:


> Are you insinuating that the poster is lying?
> Just because their post may offend your socialist dogma it is no reason to question their integrity.


My own personal experience with the IBOA is that they have always been helpful if member's have valid compaints.
I would certainly not question the poster's integrity but I would suggest that they pursue the matter firstly through the correct channels , firstly through their office rep and then if required through their district secretary whose details are on [broken link removed] .
I feel that most members are more than happy to pay their dues particularly since the IBOA ensured that the Bank of Ireland paid the recent 3.5% increase due under the National Wage Agreement.


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## Grizzly

Deiseblue said:


> My own personal experience with the IBOA is that they have always been helpful if member's have valid compaints.


 
The OP is still entitled to a response from the IBOA, whether it be "Yea or Nay".  My understanding is that the OP wasn't even given the courtesy of an acknowledgement of correspondence.


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## IsleOfMan

micmclo said:


> Cancel your sub and tell them why.
> Then tell them you are encouraging your union comrades in your branch to leave.
> 
> Someone from union HQ will take notice


 
I am not sure if anyone in the IBOA is interested in the small things, only the headline grabbing things.

For example. If you are a member in Ireland your monthly dues are €25.16 but if you are in the U.K. your monthly dues are £18.45. Their website says that the Euro/Sterling rates are calculated using the rate .73335

When was the last time the Sterling/Euro rate was at .73335?

Maybe someone should get on to their UNION to complain about preferential treatment being given to U.K. members.

If the IBOA cannot deal with this on their own website what chance did the OP have in having a letter answered or a phone call returned!


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## Purple

In fairness they are bankers; what would they know about exchange rates?


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## Deiseblue

Purple said:


> In fairness they are bankers; what would they know about exchange rates?


Actually they are trade unionists whose wages are paid by the members who represent the majority of Bank Officials , the membership fees are based on what's paid by Irish Members so it appears that the IBOA are being very good to UK members but then that's typical of them !
It's extremely heartening to see the huge increase in membership but I suppose that's always the way - when trouble is in the offing membership always increases !


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## IsleOfMan

Deiseblue said:


> Actually they are trade unionists whose wages are paid by the members who represent the majority of Bank Officials , the membership fees are based on what's paid by Irish Members so it appears that the IBOA are being very good to UK members but then that's typical of them !
> It's extremely heartening to see the huge increase in membership but I suppose that's always the way - when trouble is in the offing membership always increases !


 
That is not correct. If you calculate £18.45 @ .73335 you get €25.15. They are not offering their U.K. members a preferential rate of membership dues rather they are using an incorrect rate of exchange to calculate membership fees.

This is what the subscriptions page on their website says.

_The euro figure is derived from the original rate with the appropriate CPI increase of 4.9% applied. The sterling rate is derived from applying the appropriate rate of exchange (€-£) of 0.73335 as listed on xe.com._


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## mick1960

The IBOA trade union seems to be well suited to the banking world,very quick to contact people when they want money but constantly out of the office when you have a genuine problem.The only thing to do is change Union and they might give you new customer preferential treatment and do something.


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## Deiseblue

mick1960 said:


> The IBOA trade union seems to be well suited to the banking world,very quick to contact people when they want money but constantly out of the office when you have a genuine problem.The only thing to do is change Union and they might give you new customer preferential treatment and do something.


And of course the great benefit that they successfully negotiated the 3.5% increase for all Bank of Ireland staff on Union negotiated contracts payable under the National Wage Agreement towards 2016 and also wage increases for Ulster Bank staff and are currently in negotiations with AIB , they have also concluded an agreement that there will be no further job losses in Ulster Bank after the matter of the 750 voluntary redundancies vis-a-vis the First Active rationalisations are concluded
If members have problems the usual course of action is to raise the matter with their local rep who will then raise the matter with either the district secretary or directly with the area IBOA employee.
Quite honestly given the rapacious greed practiced by Irish Banks in recent years we are blessed to have a strong union.


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## Mpsox

Deiseblue said:


> they have also concluded an agreement that there will be no further job losses in Ulster Bank after the matter of the 750 voluntary redundancies vis-a-vis the First Active rationalisations are concluded


 
Let's not get carried away with the power of the IBOA here, they didn't negotiate anything with Ulster Bank on further job losses, RBS announced they were laying off 9000 people globally and 50% of those would be outside the UK, all the IBOA got was a confirmation that it would not apply in Ireland and that is because UB had already taken action around headcount reductions

Having said that, and speaking as someone who has sat opposite IBOA union reps on many occassions, I have always found them sensible and understanding that managers have businesses to run. If a members request/issue is unrealistic/over the top, they will often quite quickly tell the member that that is the case.

I'd be curious as to what the OP's issue is and whether or not the issue was, in the unions view, fair and reasonable?


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## Deiseblue

Mpsox said:


> Let's not get carried away with the power of the IBOA here, they didn't negotiate anything with Ulster Bank on further job losses, RBS announced they were laying off 9000 people globally and 50% of those would be outside the UK, all the IBOA got was a confirmation that it would not apply in Ireland and that is because UB had already taken action around headcount reductions
> 
> Having said that, and speaking as someone who has sat opposite IBOA union reps on many occassions, I have always found them sensible and understanding that managers have businesses to run. If a members request/issue is unrealistic/over the top, they will often quite quickly tell the member that that is the case.
> 
> I'd be curious as to what the OP's issue is and whether or not the issue was, in the unions view, fair and reasonable?


I sat opposite Bank representatives on many occassions as well , generally HR people , and found them quite amenable to reasoned argument particularly those who previously were IBOA members but who had to resign when representing the Bank in Bank/IBOA discussions.
I also would be interested in the OP's case !
Have to disagree with you about the level of the IBOA's power which I think is going to increase if times get more difficult and membership continues to grow apace.
Apparently a lot of very fed up people in Bank of Ireland with the freezing of pay and bonuses for those on pay for performance contracts contrasted with the increase for those on union negotiated contacts.


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## IsleOfMan

Mpsox said:


> .
> 
> I'd be curious as to what the OP's issue is and whether or not the issue was, in the unions view, fair and reasonable?


 
You are missing the point.  The OP is complaining that he/she never received a response to letters. phone calls, emails. The issues are not part of the problem.  It is being ignored 100%.


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## Deiseblue

IsleOfMan said:


> You are missing the point. The OP is complaining that he/she never received a response to letters. phone calls, emails. The issues are not part of the problem. It is being ignored 100%.


Well we don't know if the issue has been dealt with or not as the OP last posted on this topic over a month ago.
Maybe the advise given by respondents has proved beneficial ?


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## Bill Struth

Any problems with your union then ring UnionConnect. It's a new service set up by ICTU in the last few weeks. They will deal with your complaint regarding IBOA.

 Here is the number:

0818 300 900


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## IsleOfMan

Complainer said:


> Do you think that the majority of members who pay their subs from every paycheque are too dumb to have noticed this?


 
Well they didn't notice that their U.K. brethern were getting a lower monthly sub than their Irish members.


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## Complainer

IsleOfMan said:


> Well they didn't notice that their U.K. brethern were getting a lower monthly sub than their Irish members.


Why would you think that they didn't notice?


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## Bronco Lane

Complainer said:


> Do you think that the majority of members who pay their subs from every paycheque are too dumb to have noticed this?


 
Why would you think that they did notice?


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## Deiseblue

IsleOfMan said:


> Well they didn't notice that their U.K. brethern were getting a lower monthly sub than their Irish members.


The subs when reviewed are set at a figure at a specific point of time and are not adjusted for UK members to reflect currency differentials , logistically it would be a nightmare.


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## Complainer

Bronco Lane said:


> Why would you think that they did notice?


Notice what?


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## IsleOfMan

I was an IBOA member for 16 years and part of a group that was taking a group action against the BOI, AIB and others. At the time our group were no longer members of the IBOA but the outcome of our case if successful would have had benefits for existing members. We approached the IBOA and looked for financial support in our case. They weren't in the slightest bit interested and offered no help.

Maybe back in the early 1970's when John Titterington and Job Stott were running the organisation it deserved respect.

Now. It's all about flashy websites, new premises , glossy magazine.

The OP was abandoned by the union that should have been there to support him/her.

Shame on you.


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## Deiseblue

ParkLane said:


> I was an IBOA member for 16 years and part of a group that was taking a group action against the BOI, AIB and others. At the time our group were no longer members of the IBOA but the outcome of our case if successful would have had benefits for existing members. We approached the IBOA and looked for financial support in our case. They weren't in the slightest bit interested and offered no help.
> 
> Maybe back in the early 1970's when John Titterington and Job Stott were running the organisation it deserved respect.
> 
> Now. It's all about flashy websites, new premises , glossy magazine.
> 
> The OP was abandoned by the union that should have been there to support him/her.
> 
> Shame on you.


The OP has not raised the query again for over a month , perhaps the advise given has resolved the problem ?
Why on earth would the IBOA have underwritten a class action by non members against Banks with whom they have to negotiate on an ongoing basis - will you give me a break !
Presumably you are of the opinion that information should be relayed to members by pigeon post rather than "flashy websites,glossy magazines"
Instead of new premises perhaps members should settle for a bunker under Liberty Hall !


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## IsleOfMan

Deiseblue said:


> Presumably you are of the opinion that information should be relayed to members by pigeon post rather than "flashy websites,glossy magazines"
> Instead of new premises perhaps members should settle for a bunker under Liberty Hall !


 
Well as we have seen with the OP the flashy website, glossy magazine were of no benefit. In fact pigeon post would have been acceptable but unfortunately the pigeons weren't even available.


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## Deiseblue

ParkLane said:


> Well as we have seen with the OP the flashy website, glossy magazine were of no benefit. In fact pigeon post would have been acceptable but unfortunately the pigeons weren't even available.


And as I have pointed out the OP has not raised the query for over 5 weeks so hopefully the matter has been sorted


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## IsleOfMan

Deiseblue said:


> Why on earth would the IBOA have underwritten a class action by non members against Banks with whom they have to negotiate on an ongoing basis - will you give me a break !


 
There were about 60 in the group all of whom had been IBOA members for the best part of 16 years or so. All fully paid up members. 
As I said, but you chose to ignore, the outcome of the case would have been beneficial for existing members.
The case was settled out of court. 
Because the IBOA showed no interest in the case they were not given details of the settlements. 
For all you know Deiseblue you might have been one of those people who might have benefited if the IBOA had shown interest on behalf of their existing members.


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## Deiseblue

ParkLane said:


> There were about 60 in the group all of whom had been IBOA members for the best part of 16 years or so. All fully paid up members.
> As I said, but you chose to ignore, the outcome of the case would have been beneficial for existing members.
> The case was settled out of court.
> Because the IBOA showed no interest in the case they were not given details of the settlements.
> For all you know Deiseblue you might have been one of those people who might have benefited if the IBOA had shown interest on behalf of their existing members.


No , what you actually said was that the outcome of the case would have been beneficial for existing members if the outcome was " SUCCESSFUL" - big difference.
Guess I'll just have to live with the fact that I'll never know the result of the case , can't see myself having too many sleepless nights !
Why were all 60 ex-members - nothing to do with the aftermath of 1992 I hope ?


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## IsleOfMan

Well the outcome was successful in so far as each member received between Ir£10k and Ir£20k with some getting considerably more. It was a pity that it was settled out of court, some people wanted the case to go the full way but a vote was taken and the settlement went ahead.
If the IBOA had shown interest and offered their backing, either legal or financial or both then maybe the case would have gone the full course. Some existing IBOA members would have received a similar pay off and those with longer service considerably more.
Anyhow thats my story about the IBOA. Just like the OP they weren't their for me either.


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## Deiseblue

ParkLane said:


> Well the outcome was successful in so far as each member received between Ir£10k and Ir£20k with some getting considerably more. It was a pity that it was settled out of court, some people wanted the case to go the full way but a vote was taken and the settlement went ahead.
> If the IBOA had shown interest and offered their backing, either legal or financial or both then maybe the case would have gone the full course. Some existing IBOA members would have received a similar pay off and those with longer service considerably more.
> Anyhow thats my story about the IBOA. Just like the OP they weren't their for me either.


As I pointed out the IBOA were never going to underwrite a class action by non members against the Banks with whom they engage on a dad to day basis.
Strange that none of my colleagues in the various Banks have ever heard a whisper of this settlement or indeed the putative court action !


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## Complainer

ParkLane said:


> There were about 60 in the group all of whom had been IBOA members for the best part of 16 years or so. All fully paid up members.
> .





ParkLane said:


> I was an IBOA member for 16 years and part of a group that was taking a group action against the BOI, AIB and others. At the time our group were no longer members of the IBOA


I'm confused. Were they members or not at the time of the action?


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## Bronco Lane

Deiseblue said:


> I feel that most members are more than happy to pay their dues particularly since the IBOA ensured that the Bank of Ireland paid the recent 3.5% increase due under the National Wage Agreement.


 
In fairness, what did you think that the Bank of Ireland were going to do on this one?

And as for the IBOA taking credit for this give me a break. It was a win win situation.

It seems that dealing with one individuals problems is too much like small fry for them.


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## SlurrySlump

Deiseblue said:


> Well we don't know if the issue has been dealt with or not as the OP last posted on this topic over a month ago.
> Maybe the advise given by respondents has proved beneficial ?


 
Absolutely not. The IBOA has done absolutely nothing for me. They didn't deal with one issue that I raised. They offered no help, advice or any correspondence on the issues that I raised.

Yet another letter that I addressed to Larry Broderick some weeks ago has not been responded to.


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## Mpsox

SlurrySlump said:


> Absolutely not. The IBOA has done absolutely nothing for me. They didn't deal with one issue that I raised. They offered no help, advice or any correspondence on the issues that I raised.
> 
> Yet another letter that I addressed to Larry Broderick some weeks ago has not been responded to.


 

Out of curiosity and perhaps because people on here may be able to assist you, what is the issue?


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## SlurrySlump

Mpsox said:


> Out of curiosity and perhaps because people on here may be able to assist you, what is the issue?


 
I am not sure that the issues that I raised with the IBOA is relevant, maybe it is, I'm not sure.  My main issue is that the IBOA ignored my correspondence, my phone calls, my emails. 

I had been on sick leave from my job. I was on full pay for 6 months and supposed to go on half pay but I had to fight to get this paid. I was also having difficulties getting pay slips posted to me. Each month I sent in to my employer details of my social welfare payments. They would let these amounts build up and then deduct them all at once so some months I received almost nil pay. The realtionship with my employer was one of total frustration. During this time I continued to pay my IBOA sub in full even during the months when I had practically nothing to live on. I did not contact the IBOA about any of the above but tried to deal with this direct with my employer.

However things began to get worse that's when I contacted the IBOA after trying to deal directly with my employer myself.


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## dewdrop

As a retired Bank Manager i feel for you. You say the IBOA are ignoring you and your Manager is not of much help either. Is there anyone else in the Branch/Dept who could help? From memory banks had a written policy re pay on sick leave. It is sad this is dragging on since Oct last with no improvement. As i said maybe a colleague could beof help in sorting out your problem


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## WaterWater

SlurrySlump said:


> Each month I sent in to my employer details of my social welfare payments. They would let these amounts build up and then deduct them all at once so some months I received almost nil pay.


 
Why do payroll units do this sort of thing?  It can interfere with direct debits, standing orders, pension contributions, trade union subscriptions. If an employee sends in details of their social welfare payments on a monthly basis then surely the company can also deduct these payments on a monthly basis and not let them build up.


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## Deiseblue

SlurrySlump said:


> I am not sure that the issues that I raised with the IBOA is relevant, maybe it is, I'm not sure. My main issue is that the IBOA ignored my correspondence, my phone calls, my emails.
> 
> I had been on sick leave from my job. I was on full pay for 6 months and supposed to go on half pay but I had to fight to get this paid. I was also having difficulties getting pay slips posted to me. Each month I sent in to my employer details of my social welfare payments. They would let these amounts build up and then deduct them all at once so some months I received almost nil pay. The realtionship with my employer was one of total frustration. During this time I continued to pay my IBOA sub in full even during the months when I had practically nothing to live on. I did not contact the IBOA about any of the above but tried to deal with this direct with my employer.
> 
> However things began to get worse that's when I contacted the IBOA after trying to deal directly with my employer myself.


So let me get this right , the Bank have fulfilled all their obligations to you in that you received full pay for the first 6 months and are currently on half pay ( albeit after after a fight in which the IBOA were not involved ).
Notwithstanding the fact that the payroll section of the Bank deducted the amounts reclaimable in one fell swoop rather than on a monthly basis you still received the correct amounts due so the only real matter outstanding is the question of payslips being forwarded to you ?
I quite agree however that your query should not have been ignored but really what do you expect the IBOA to do as you are basically receiving all you are entitled to ?


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## Mpsox

SlurrySlump said:


> I am not sure that the issues that I raised with the IBOA is relevant, maybe it is, I'm not sure. My main issue is that the IBOA ignored my correspondence, my phone calls, my emails.
> 
> I had been on sick leave from my job. I was on full pay for 6 months and supposed to go on half pay but I had to fight to get this paid. I was also having difficulties getting pay slips posted to me. Each month I sent in to my employer details of my social welfare payments. They would let these amounts build up and then deduct them all at once so some months I received almost nil pay. The realtionship with my employer was one of total frustration. During this time I continued to pay my IBOA sub in full even during the months when I had practically nothing to live on. I did not contact the IBOA about any of the above but tried to deal with this direct with my employer.
> 
> 
> 
> However things began to get worse that's when I contacted the IBOA after trying to deal directly with my employer myself.


 

Aside from the bank's HR department being bureaucratically incompetent, I'm struggling to see what your complaint is. If you were not happy with the behaviour of your manager or HR, you should be entitled to raise a grievance against them if necessary.

As for the IBOA, their full time union staff mobile numbers tend to be in circulation across any bank or on their circulars, could you just not ring them?


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## WaterWater

Mpsox said:


> As for the IBOA, their full time union staff mobile numbers tend to be in circulation across any bank or on their circulars, could you just not ring them?


 
I thought that the OP had written to, emailed and phoned the IBOA but got no response? What more can they do?


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## Mpsox

WaterWater said:


> I thought that the OP had written to, emailed and phoned the IBOA but got no response? What more can they do?


 
My understanding is he rang the office, I was suggesting he rings the full time reps mobile phone.


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## Deiseblue

If a member has a complaint their first reference point should be their local rep who if they are not in a position to deal with the query may refer the matter on to the district secretary or professional IBOA staff member who deals with the area concerned - was this process followed ?
It also appears that the poster may not have a valid complaint.


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## WaterWater

Deiseblue said:


> It also appears that the poster may not have a valid complaint.


 
Why are you making assumptions that this is the case?

Either way they should have had the courtesy of a reply from the IBOA.


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## Deiseblue

WaterWater said:


> Why are you making assumptions that this is the case?
> 
> Either way they should have had the courtesy of a reply from the IBOA.


Based on the information provided by the poster he is receiving his correct entitlements from the Bank.
What exactly therefore is there to complain about ?


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## WaterWater

Deiseblue said:


> Based on the information provided by the poster he is receiving his correct entitlements from the Bank.
> What exactly therefore is there to complain about ?


 
What information did the poster give about his entitlements? It seems to me that you might have more information about the OP than you are letting on?  Are you associated with the IBOA or the complaint in any way?

You also seem to constantly ignore the one fact in your replies. The OP never received the courtesy of a reply from the IBOA. 

Do you think that this is acceptable?


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## Deiseblue

WaterWater said:


> What information did the poster give about his entitlements? It seems to me that you might have more information about the OP than you are letting on? Are you associated with the IBOA or the complaint in any way?
> 
> You also seem to constantly ignore the one fact in your replies. The OP never received the courtesy of a reply from the IBOA.
> 
> Do you think that this is acceptable?


Let me refer you to the poster's post of the 29th May at 10.34 am where he outlined that he was on sick leave and received full pay for the first 6 months and half pay thereafter - also known as his entitlements , in that post he also readily admitted that the queries he raised with the IBOA may not be relevant !
I would submit that as he is receiving all he is entitled to then what does he expect the IBOA to do ?
I am not associated with the complaint in any way.
I was an IBOA member all my working life as I've already stated on this thread , happily now retired from the Bank on a package negotiated by the IBOA to whom I will always be grateful to !
You refer to the fact that I constantly ignore the fact that the OP never received the courtesy of a reply from the IBOA and ask do I find that accepatable - I would refer you to my post yesterday at 12.31 pm when I stated " I quite agree that your query should not have been ignored " - fairly unequivocal I would have thought ?
In an effort to assist the OP I also set out the preferred process to initiate a complaint.


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## WaterWater

Deiseblue said:


> Let me refer you to the poster's post of the 29th May at 10.34 am where he outlined that he was on sick leave and received full pay for the first 6 months and half pay thereafter - also known as his entitlements , in that post he also readily admitted that the queries he raised with the IBOA may not be relevant !


 
You have completly misread what the OP was saying.

The OP was saying in response to another poster who was trying to find out what his "work" issues were, that as far as this discussion was concerned these issues were not relevant. His main issue with the IBOA was that they didn't answer his correspondence.

He also said that he did *not* raise the issues of the pay slips and sick pay deductions etc with the IBOA that these were *not* part of his complaint to the IBOA. There can be lots of issues other than pay that can cause problems between an employee and an employer.

The OP indicates that it was something else entirely that formed part of his complaint to the IBOA. The OP's original complaint is about the IBOA not answering his correspondence. Why should the OP have to outline what was in his letter to the IBOA.

Re-read the OP's opening complaint and the title of this thread.


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## IsleOfMan

Deiseblue said:


> Based on the information provided by the poster he is receiving his correct entitlements from the Bank.
> What exactly therefore is there to complain about ?


 
I think Deiseblue that you are trying to change the OP's opening thread in to something else.

This is not about the content of the OP's letter to the IBOA but about the fact that it was ignored.

Also the OP said 

*"However things began to get worse that's when I contacted the IBOA after trying to deal directly with my employer myself".* It appears to have nothing to do with what you see as "entitlements" but something else that happened later on in the saga.

It is up to the OP if he/she wishes to tell us what these things are.


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## Deiseblue

IsleOfMan said:


> I think Deiseblue that you are trying to change the OP's opening thread in to something else.
> 
> This is not about the content of the OP's letter to the IBOA but about the fact that it was ignored.
> 
> Also the OP said
> 
> *"However things began to get worse that's when I contacted the IBOA after trying to deal directly with my employer myself".* It appears to have nothing to do with what you see as "entitlements" but something else that happened later on in the saga.
> 
> It is up to the OP if he/she wishes to tell us what these things are.


 How can things possibly have gotten worse after the OP contacted the IBOA if as he contends  he never received any contact from the IBOA - it just does'nt make any sense !
The only facts the OP has given us is that he has received all that he is entitled to from the Bank on foot of his illness albeit in a rather off the cuff fashion with social welfare deductions being made en bloc rather than on a monthly basis and has readily admitted that his complaint may not be relevant.
In my experience I would say that the IBOA always replies promptly to members queries/complaints , in the OP's position I would certainly have physically presented myself at IBOA house by this time


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## IsleOfMan

Deiseblue said:


> How can things possibly have gotten worse after the OP contacted the IBOA if as he contends he never received any contact from the IBOA - it just does'nt make any sense !


 
He is talking about with his *employer *not with the IBOA!


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## IsleOfMan

Deiseblue said:


> in the OP's position I would certainly have physically presented myself at IBOA house by this time


 
So you know what the nature of his illness is then?


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## ajapale

This topic has run its course.

Thread Closed


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