# Flight Cancellations is this Common?



## roker (3 Jul 2009)

We were in the check- in queue this evening for BMI Baby Cork to Manchester 1 ½ hrs before the departure and was told that the flight was cancelled. 
They blamed the fog and said that the flight had not departed Manchester to Cork so could not return.
I suspect this was cancelled for commercial reason, possible there was not enough people booked on to the flight both ways. The reason I suspect this is, that it was the only flight cancelled. It was foggy, but 2 miles from the airport it was clear, and when did a bit of fog stop an aircraft, they take off through it all of the time. 

Has this happened to anyone else? This could be a worrying trend if airlines are cancelling for some simple excuse to save money at the expense of the customer. We had a hotel booked and will lose this money because of the short notice. Others stood to lose a lot more because they had connections to catch, one couple had a connection to Cuba.
BMI did not offer any compensation only to book us on the same flight the following day.


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## joanboot (3 Jul 2009)

The same happened us with BMI Baby, they changed our flights from Cork /Birmingham to Cork/ Manchester. I lost my connecting flights , my prepaid hotel and  my weekend away. I wrote to customer service in BMI Baby. They had not replied in 5 weeks and I rang them and five weeks later they wrote and told me that they could not do anything to compensate me and that I should contact my travel insurance which I did and my travel insurance company told me that I was not eligible for compensation. On the whole I was really annoyed and will never book with BMI Baby again.


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## Sylvester3 (3 Jul 2009)

I think the airlines are trying to fob you off - there are recent changes to legislation in Europe which guarantees you some compensation. I remember reading about it a while back.

Guardian Article


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## dockingtrade (3 Jul 2009)

3 times this year i know off. The Dublin & shannon flight were merged in Boston stating there was a technical issue with one of the planes. Seems too frequent to have technical issues with planes. I was on one of them and I was told about the other 2 from friends. actaually one out of New York

Amazingly everyone from both flights fitted on to one plane.


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## roker (3 Jul 2009)

I have sent my complaint to Commission for Aviation Regulation, I suggest that you do the same. You can do a complaint form on line.
www.aviationreg.ie under Complaint Procedure.
I have already stopped using Ryanair, I hope Aerlingus is better or it looks like we will be back to using the ferry next.
Same thing as "dockingtrade"  Interesting that they had enough seats on the next days plane to take the cancelled flights .


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## dohouch (3 Jul 2009)

Looking for compensation , try here:   


P.S. I have no connection with the site.


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## g1g (3 Jul 2009)

happened to me with Aerlingus on a chartered flight a few years ago. There was a problem with the London Heathrow plane so they took our plane and delayed us 24 hours. There was almighty war!

Aer lingus and British airways are renowed for over booking flights as they believe there is always a percentage of people who won't turn up.  This is particularly the case for weekends where premiership matches are on - have often been asked if i'd take a later flight once I reached the airport (before the days of online check in).  They also once told me I was late checking in for a flight (when I was well within the time) as they had overbooked.


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## annet (3 Jul 2009)

EU law governing airlines and flight cancellations is Regulation (EC) No. 261/2004.  Article 14 (1) airlines have to have a clearly legible notice  setting out consumer right and under Article 14 (2) affected passengers are to be provided with a written notice setting out the rules for assistance and compensation (although compensation doesnt arise in respect to bad weather).  Article 9 - establishes that airlines have a duty of assistance to affected passengers.  In cases of flight cancellations, the right to assistance includes hotel accomodation if cancellation involves an overnight stay, transport to and from the hotel and the provision of refreshments.  If the airline fails in their duty of care - affected passengers have the right to book into any hotel and apply for and receive monetary reimbursement from the airline of all these costs.  If the departure airport is in Ireland - you make a formal complaint to the Commission for Aviation Regulation.  If the departure airport is in the Uk - you make a complaint to the Air Transport Users Council.  You must first complain and seek reimbursement however from the airline.


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## roker (5 Jul 2009)

What about if bad weather is used as an excuse? as I said this was the only flight cancelled that evening. They are covered under EU  261/2004. by saying it was exceptional circumstances.


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## Bumblecat (5 Jul 2009)

Happened to me with BA to London from Nice. They announced a 3 or 4 hour delay due to fog. I had to attend an urgent meeting that evening and so wanted to get back to London on time. The 4 hour delay was going to mean I missed the whole meeting and might as well have stayed in Nice overnight. 
They said I would not be entitled to go on an empty seat the next day and that I wouldn't be compensated if I left the airport. 
In the end the flight was called with just two hours delay. But then they made us sit on the plane for an hour without taking off! So they even took away by choice, and I missed the meeting. 
I know these things happen, but if we can't fly, surely we can take an empty seat if available on another flight. 
Think BA need to think a little more about customer service. But that's nothing new!


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## Galwaygirl (5 Jul 2009)

It happened me going from Galway to Dublin with aerarann in March, there were 2 flights to Dublin within an hour of each other and we were told there would be a short delay with first flight, lo and behold it was delayed until past the departure time of the second plane and we were all sent on the same flight... people missed connections to Europe/S America. Official reason was plane iced up and de icing equipment not working so had to wait for sun to thaw (things you don't want to hear the captain saying before take off!!). Funnily enough flights to London/Manchester departed no problem and had also overnighted at Galway.


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## annet (5 Jul 2009)

roker said:


> What about if bad weather is used as an excuse? as I said this was the only flight cancelled that evening. They are covered under EU 261/2004. by saying it was exceptional circumstances.


 
Yes, if your flight is cancelled due to bad weather while it is exceptional circumstance it is covered under EU Reg 261/2004.  You are still entitled to assistance from the airline - and if the cancellation involves an overnight stay you are entitled to receive refreshments (meals), hotel accommodation and transport to and from the place of accommodation.  If the airline did not offer assistance or refused to acknowledge that they had a responsibility to do so, the right then exists to make your own arrangements and claim these expenses from the airline.  The only thing you are not entitled to claim in cases of bad weather ie. exceptional circumstances is financial compensation.  Also, you are entitled to receive a refund or re-routing.  If you choose a refund, the airline is not liable for any expenses that you might incur in getting home.... including accommodation.  If you choose re-routing, the airline has to provide affected passengers with means of transport if the arrival airport is different from the originally booked destination.  

I'd make the complaint in writing first to the airline and give them 4 weeks to provide you with the refund... and inform them that you'll be taking them through the small claims process if they dont provide you with this monies in the timeframe.  If they still don’t give you the refund your options are to report them to the commission for aviation regulation and definately take them to the small claims court.  The link for the EU Regulation is http://www.aviationreg.ie/_fileupload/Image/Regulation%20EC261%202004.pdf.

Back in February, I got stuck in London Heathrow - Dublin Airport shut down due to the snow.  The airline failed to provide us with any assistance in Heathrow and the person behind the desk used the excuse of "exceptional circumstance".  She tried to make out that because bad weather is an exceptional circumstance affected passengers weren’t entitled to any assistance from the airline… she got it wrong. I booked into a hotel and kept all the receipts.  I was lucky to back early the next day before all flights got totally cancelled.  I put in the claim to the airline.  I made sure that I quoted the specific sections of the Regulation and the refund wasn’t too long about coming in the post.


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## roker (30 Jul 2009)

As an update to this. BMI have informed me by letter that they will not pay because the adverse weather conditions are “Extraordinary Circumstance” and as we travelled on the same flight next day, no refund is due. They are unable to compensate customers for expenses and consequential loses arising from flight delays and cancellation and to claim off travel insurance. This they say is drawn up under new EU legislations.
As I said previously, all other flights before and after this flight were not cancelled, so is BMI less reliable than other airlines? are they missing some vital equipment that cannot navigate through fog?
No amount of money can replace a lost holiday.


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## jhegarty (30 Jul 2009)

roker said:


> As an update to this. BMI have informed me by letter that they will not pay because the adverse weather conditions are “Extraordinary Circumstance” and as we travelled on the same flight next day, no refund is due. They are unable to compensate customers for expenses and consequential loses arising from flight delays and cancellation and to claim off travel insurance. This they say is drawn up under new EU legislations.
> As I said previously, all other flights before and after this flight were not cancelled, so is BMI less reliable than other airlines? are they missing some vital equipment that cannot navigate through fog?



Ask the airport for written confirmation if the runway was open or closed at the time.


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