# Architects Alliance Presentation to Joint Oireachtas Committee on Environment



## onq (14 May 2010)

To whom it may concern,

The Joint Oireachtas Committee on the Environment will meet with the Architects Alliance at 2.30pm, Committee Room 3, Basement, Leinster House 2000, Tuesday 18 May 2010.

I understand that the RIAI will also make a presentation.

The subject matters will be _inter alia_:(i) the recognition of the acquired and established rights of persons with practices of more than 10 years under a Grandfather Clause and 

(ii) the recognition of the acquired and statutory rights of persons who hold formal qualifications.​These matters arise because under the Building Control Act 2007 only Members of the Institute are eligible to be registered automatically, whether or not they have formal qualifications.

I understand that there may be a limited number of places available for members of the  public or members of interested groups not represented before the Committee.

ONQ.

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## RKQ (14 May 2010)

I am very impressed by the fact that Architects Alliance actually got a meeting with a Joint Oireachtas Committee. I understand they have already met a Minister.

IMO No other Irish "organisation" is capable of achieving the same result. 

Well done Architects Alliance & best of luck.


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## onq (14 May 2010)

Thanks on their behalf - nothing to do with me at that stage.
Hopefully there will be a swift resolution and the matter will not  rankle.
You can ignore the comment in the PM I sent you - I hadn't read the above 

ONQ.


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## RKQ (18 May 2010)

I watched the meeting live on the internet.
I was quite impressed by AA, their presentation was excellent.
Well done AA.


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## onq (19 May 2010)

Hi RKQ,

Thanks for your words of support.

Geez! Were we live? I thought it was going to be edited later, LOL!

Initially I thought Brian Montaut  of the AA had gone a little overboard when referring to the RIAI as Royals in his speech.
But I say it hit home with O'Donoghue and it was all I could to to keep from laughing out loud when he made his point.
It ended in some good natured banter about royalty surviving so long - there was no acrimoney.

I felt the most interesting comment was passed by the RIAI just at the end.

I put it to the RIAI during the presentation that the MRIAI standard was not the "Minimum Standard" enshrined in the EU Directives but that Graduate was. The logical inference of this is that many self-taught architects throughout the EU would be capable of reaching this Graduate standard in terms of their built work - many may have already done so.

The position of the RIAI as confirmed yesterday is that MRIAI is the "Minimum Standard" and not the Graduate Degree as written into two EU Directives.

The RIAI stated at the end of the Joint Oireachtas Committee on the Environment Meeting yesterday that the EU will shortly state that that the setting of the bar at Graduate level was erroneous!

The AA will be going back to the RIAI on this later today as this seems like a relatively recent occurrence.

After all, have we seen weekly press releases from the EU, the RIAI or Montague Communications for the past twenty years asserting that this was an error?
Have the heads of the schools of architecture all been asleep?
Where does this leave all previous certificates issued by degree holders?

The MRIAI "qualification" sets the bar at an arbitrary level decided by the RIAI, not an approved level as determined by two schools of architecture - "judgement by peers" as the RIAI like to term it. Well, thanks guys, but I was judged by outside assessors, people not even directly affiliated to Bolton Street - one from France as I recall - all of whom were demonstrably independent of the cliques operating in Ireland.

For the record, I have no problem with rRegistration - its a good thing IMO - but arbitrarily setting the bar higher than the minimum set out for the past twenty years is not good governance. This will make it impossible for respected older practitioners to become registered and will be poor payment for their years of service to their communities.

This may be a Gormley/RIAI agenda, but if there really is some hidden, unaccountable fool in some back room in Brussels interfering with the standing of the Graduate qualification who thinks this won't come back to haunt them, he/she has a big surprise coming.

If you're going to rely on the law to establish you as an authority, then you have to be seen to support the existing law, not undermine it or re-write it retrospectively.

You can tell this one is growing legs - its going to run and run.

ONQ.

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## onq (19 May 2010)

The RIAI today confirmed that their comment at the end of the Joint Oireachtas Committee on the Environment Meeting of 18th May 2010 - _the EU would shortly confirm the Graduate standard was included in the EU directives erroneously_ - was itself "erroneous".

The Architects Alliance welcomed the fact the RIAI responded promptly  and cleared up this matter, which had caused its members some concern.

ONQ.

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