# Need serious help and Im only 22



## InDeep (28 Sep 2006)

Hey some advise needed here people if possilbe.


I am 22 and working in finance(you think i would have more sense) I earn 33k per year. Below is my current debt levels

BOI PL: 27K
GE PL: 7K
MBNA CC: 5K
BOI CC: 1K

I am starting to use my parents cards though to try win money on horses to pay off my debt ,I know this is a terrible idea and I wont do it again.

This month I have 80 euro to last me until next pay day which is the 18th October, I will get paid 2238, Out of that I need to pay 550 BOI Loan(mised payment from last month,this is the only time I have ever missed a payment on anything and hopefully since I will pay it back within a week I wont get a 1 on my ICB) I also have to pay my 2 loans which amounts to 800 euro and also pay 700 euro off my mams credit card along with 120 to my dads,100 euro to my sister and 60 to another friend. It is going to give me around 120 eurpo to live off for the month. I simply cant go on like this. Its all my own fauly but I need help to get out of it.

I want to buy a house but wont be able to with these two loans in place. Here is my plan below


At present i earn 2238,Loan and Credit Card Payments amount to 1000 euro leaving me 1238 surplus per month.From January onwards I intend to save 800 euro per month in the Credit Union leaving me 538 for social life per month. I need to save 10k with the Credit Union which should take me 8 months as I will have a lump sum of 4k to save in July next year. Once I have this 10k in the Credit Union I intend to borrow 30k(three times my savings) to pay off my loans. This will mean they will be off the ICB and as far as the Mortgage Lenders are aware I have no debt anymore as My bank statments will show no dd's or so's and my ICB will show no debt in place as Credit Union does not show up on ICB


Does anyone here think this is doable,can I live on 538 per month Social Life from now until November next year????

Well wether I can or not it looks like I will just have to.


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## CCOVICH (28 Sep 2006)

*Re: In serious help and Im only 22!!!*

€538 for 'social life' is this for boozing and the like, or for necessities?

Do your parents know you are using their credit cards?

You may want to contact MABS for a chat.

There are also many existing threads on dealing with debt, some may be relevant to your situation.

Here
Here
Here

Have you approached any other cc companies to see if you can do a 0% ballance transfer (I suspect you will be rejected), so that you have a bit of breathing space on the cc debt.


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## momomo (28 Sep 2006)

*Re: In serious help and Im only 22!!!*

538euro a month for a social life, 135euro a week for socialising!?


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## InDeep (28 Sep 2006)

*Re: In serious help and Im only 22!!!*

When I say socialising I mean food,transport to work,basically living costs

538 per month. Around 140 per week.

It will mean struggling for 9 months but I suppose worth it when I get my house.

By the way I work for a mortgage institution and dont feel there will be any problem in approving me along with my partner for 350k.

The main thing is I need to get sufficient savings with the CU so I can get a loan off them to pay my two PL'S this will mean that I have a clear ICB in terms of current debt.

In terms of credit rating. I have "0" on all my accounts bare last month but as I said I am paying that this month which will mean I will have a "1" but that will revert to a "0" within the next month so thats not too bad. Trust me everyone has a "1" somehwere in their lives.


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## InDeep (28 Sep 2006)

*Re: Need serious help and Im only 22!!!*

It means that basically I will be living a very boring life for the next year but will be literally so carefull as I will be keeping excel spreadsheet of everything I spend and I mean everything. I will be so carefull in monitoring everything I spend that there is no chance I will ever go over 538 per month.No way at all


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## Eurofan (28 Sep 2006)

*Re: Need serious help and Im only 22!!!*

It's not more debt advice you need it's a sound kick up the This post will be deleted if not edited to remove bad language to help you cop yourself on.

You've amassed approx 40k worth of debt by the age of 22, resorted to using your parents cards to try and gamble your way out of trouble and now you reckon by going via the credit union you'll be able to get a mortgage of 350k with your partner since "as far as the mortgage lenders are aware i have no debt anymore"!!!

Christ man i'm sorry for being harsh but you need a long hard look at yourself and your spending habits. Can i gather from your post that you still live at home? Other than the debt you've already run up what are your actual monthly commitments? (i.e. rent, bills, car etc.)

Mabs isn't a bad idea at all. Get that under control and get your spending under control long before entertaining the notion of undertaking a mortgage. Forget about 'hiding' debt in the credit union you're just kidding yourself there and you know it.


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## InDeep (28 Sep 2006)

*Re: Need serious help and Im only 22!!!*

I agree with you that I need to take a long hard  look at myself in terms of spending habbits.Agreed and I am doing so.By creating this Excel Spreadsheet I am doing that.

An I have used my parents cards once which I am paying off on the 18th October.


I do however disagree in that hiding debt with CU is a bad idea.

I work in finance and it is no secret that the property market will slow next October/November and when it does I want to get on it. I deal with First Time Buyers a lot and can safely say that 85% of them hide their loans with the CU when applying.


I am looking at my spending habbits and they WERE terrible. I AM getting back in control now and am taking responibility for my own actions.


I have admitted that all this is my own fault and have stated that I have now started to turn it around so why Do i still need kick up that ass?


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## InDeep (28 Sep 2006)

*Re: Need serious help and Im only 22!!!*

By the way. I could approve 350k for myself now but feel that it would be terrible decision.,I need to save 800/900 next year to see is it a possibilty to live off 538 per month.

Once I buy the house I intend to top up to pay off my debt with the CU a year later as there should be enough in my house to release equity,so rather than pay PL interest rates I can avail of mortgage interest rates and a term of 8/10 years.


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## ClubMan (28 Sep 2006)

*Re: Need serious help and Im only 22!!!*



InDeep said:


> I work in finance and it is no secret that the property market will slow next October/November and when it does I want to get on it.


Can you tell me who has finally discovered how to predict the future with such confidence because I'd like to talk to them about some bets that I'm planning to lay. Yes - I am being facetious.


> I deal with First Time Buyers a lot and can safely say that 85% of them hide their loans with the CU when applying.


If they hide their debts then how do you know!?


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## ClubMan (28 Sep 2006)

*Re: Need serious help and Im only 22!!!*



InDeep said:


> Once I buy the house I intend to top up to pay off my debt with the CU a year later as there should be enough in my house to release equity,so rather than pay PL interest rates I can avail of mortgage interest rates and a term of 8/10 years.


Sounds dodgy to me - you seem to be banking on (a) house price deflation to get into the market and (b) subsequent house price inflation to ensure that you can rack up some equity quickly and then use this to cover your debts. It doesn't sound to me like you have really faced up to your debt situation and recognised that you need to deal with it and the budgeting/spending habits that lead to it but are looking for some easy way out.


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## InDeep (28 Sep 2006)

So you are telling me that with Valuation of 350k that between time of drawdown and time of top up applcait on that the house in question will not have risen by 6.5% (This is all it would nee dto rise by to qualify by LTV). It is a 2 bedroomed townhouse in Swords..


The rate of house price inflation is enormous and as stated that house prices they will continue however to increase.

I intend to buy the house in question for 350k
Avail of 20k Top Up a year later (At which stage I will have reducted my mortgage balance to 342,capital from payments)

I will then be left with a mortgage balance of 362

I intend however to travel when I am 26 at which stage I predict that inflation will have risen at a level that will allow me to sell my house.Pay off my mortgage and make profit of around 40k before travelling.


This is achievable especially when you consider that I will be selling 6/9 months anticipated finish of Luas project to Swords.(House is located 1 min walk away from planned station)


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## InDeep (28 Sep 2006)

By the way I Dont think that inflation of 6-7% over a year is quick


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## redchariot (28 Sep 2006)

Unfortunately the only way is to really cut back on expenditures until debt is clear.


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## gearoidmm (28 Sep 2006)

You say that you see the housing market slowing down in October/November thus allowing you to buy (do you mean that prices will fall to a more affordable level for you?) and then within 6 months after you buying, prices will have started to rise again so you can release equity.  There is an inherent contradiction in this.


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## Howitzer (28 Sep 2006)

Funniest thread in a long long time.


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## nlgbbbblth (28 Sep 2006)

*Re: Need serious help and Im only 22!!!*



InDeep said:


> By the way. I could approve 350k for myself now but feel that it would be terrible decision


 
Bank / building society staff approving their own mortgage applications?

That's a new one on me.


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## Eurofan (28 Sep 2006)

Indeep, seriously with the greatest of respect the scenario you are painting is pie in the sky denial.

You still haven't answered my question about your current monthly commitments before debt. If, as i suspect, these are negligble then your spending has been way way out of control for some time now and use of a spreadsheet and hoping for future home price appreciation (gambling again?) is not a good idea no matter how you look at it.

Give mabs a call and sort out your debt first, prove to yourself by *doing it* not by banging some numbers into excel.


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## SteelBlue05 (28 Sep 2006)

Out of interest what have you done with the 40k loans? Travelled? College?


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## ncs (28 Sep 2006)

Second that... Betting on house prices following some sort of idealistic pattern to suit your needs alone ain't gonna work. This sounds like the kind of hare-brained scheme I'd associate with Ministers for Finance.


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## InDeep (28 Sep 2006)

To answer questions


I am expecting slowdown in rate of inflation but inflation will never cease and if it does the country will fall into resecion in which case good luck to us all. What I predict is that house prices will always rise but will slow down by October,even if they then stay at that level there will still be a sufficient level of inflation to build equity in the house.


In answer to another question I do not have any commitments apart from 2 PL's and Credit Card.

I am here to prove all of you wrong,I know what Mabs do and I don't think going to them will help as deep down they only tell people what they already know but dont want to admit to.


I admit my spending habbits have to change and I know what I have to do. I will report back here in March to let you know how I am doing and I guarantee I will be well on my way. With expected bonus in work I hope to be in a position next March whereby my GE PL is cleared leaving me with just a BOI PL and credit card.

I am commiting to a 12 month plan here. It will be hard because I have to cut back on spending a lot but I am willing to do it to be in a better possition this time next year.

In my opinion most peoples problem here is that they don't really want to change spending habbits


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## InDeep (28 Sep 2006)

40k is due to Bond which I invested in 6 months ago.

I invested 40 in a European investment bond which is spread into Equities/Shares/Property/and Retial Property


The cost of the credit if I was to pay the 40k over 5 years amounts to €7,250

SO far after 6 months the bond stands at 167% which means I have €60,800. Why not just take the bond and pay off the loan? Well I cant as the bond has a term of 5 years. Now it has performed extrremely well so far but that was to be expected as the bond in questions ploughed 65% of the funds into Retail property in Birmingham which is reason for success so far. I fully expect this bond to return at least 200% prior to tax on return.

I am under pressure at the moment and dont want to use this bond to fall back on to bail myself out of debt. I want to clear the debt myself as this bond is intended to put me in good stead in 5 years time.

It has put me under pressure intitially but I am prepared to undergo this for a better future.

I must stress again that I want to try and leave the bond to one side as I dont want to be using it to bail me out of the situation. Obviously the return I get will more than cover cost of credit plus repayment when I get the return.


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## Eurofan (28 Sep 2006)

InDeep said:


> I admit my spending habbits have to change and I know what I have to do. I will report back here in March to let you know how I am doing and I guarantee I will be well on my way.



The truth may hurt but i guarantee you won't. Debt can be a very depressing experience and you are currently in the 'euphoria' stage of imagining a way out that will cause you only short term pain on the gamble that buying a property that will appreciate your way out of difficulties.

Spending problems don't disappear overnight the way you imagine and while you appear to have faced up to admiting that was the source of your problems you obviously haven't faced up to the face that this will be a massively difficult task to turnaround.

With, as you have now admitted, no real monthly commitments you have still managed to spend over 2 grand a month and still amass debt of 40k. You do need help with this and it extends far beyond simple maths. 

If you seriously want to turn your life around then forget about buying property and face upto a long term plan to pay down your debt first and then start saving regularly.


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## Eurofan (28 Sep 2006)

InDeep said:


> 40k is due to Bond which I invested in 6 months ago.



Please...  You expect us to believe your debt is the result of a bond investment which you paid for via two bank loans and two credit cards.


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## InDeep (28 Sep 2006)

Yes Bond was funded by PL's but NOT credit cards,that was by travelling year ago.

Believe if you want,wether someone on the internet believes or not really is up to you.


Patheon fund with Friends First by the way.

Would definitely recommend


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## landers1603 (28 Sep 2006)

Cash in the bond, pay the early encashment fee, and reduce the majority of your debt .... these funds have an escape clause but you pay a penalty to get out. Get back in the real world and stop crystal ball gazing with your opinions on house price deflation in the short term, house price inflation in the mid-term, 200% return in five years in a non capital guarantee bond which is geared (in fact it is doubly geared as you have borrowed to invest, so you are not discounting the cost of your debt against the potential growth) & I wont mention the exchange rate risks!! You need to pay heed to good advice and stop throwing excuses and half cocked ideas at everything....you are looking for help but appear to be ignoring everyone but yourself


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## ClubMan (28 Sep 2006)

gearoidmm said:


> You say that you see the housing market slowing down in October/November thus allowing you to buy (do you mean that prices will fall to a more affordable level for you?) and then within 6 months after you buying, prices will have started to rise again so you can release equity.  There is an inherent contradiction in this.


My point exactly. Gambling on housing market performance (down then up) in order to get onto the property ladder and be in a position to do an equity release to cover debts is crazy in my opinion.

No offence but you don't really seem open to the prudent advice that people are giving here so I for one might call it a day in this thread.


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## InDeep (28 Sep 2006)

Thank you,


I cannot cash in the bond,well I can but will only get 40k back and loose out on any gain,no thank you.


I am open to opinion believe me


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## gearoid (28 Sep 2006)

Correct me if I am wrong here... but you have an investment of 40k in a relatively low risk bond fund therefore yielding relatively low returns.

Meanwhile you have financed this using very high interest loans to the tune of 40k, as well as gambling.

Cash in the fund, pay off your high interest loans and stop annoying people on the forum as it seems the means of your salvation is at hand.

G.


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## purplealien (28 Sep 2006)

Nice to see such optimism!


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## exile (28 Sep 2006)

InDeep said:


> I am open to opinion believe me



Then here is one.

You have a gambling problem.  Even if you hadn't explicitly revealed this in the first post, it becomes evident in the subsequent ones.  You are counting on each of your investments paying out exactly as you have predicted and in your required timescale.

I'm not trying to lecture or be smart here.  I appreciate that you know this and want to face up to it.  You (correctly) titled the thread "Need serious help" but barely two and a half hours later you declared you were "here to prove all of you wrong."

You have nothing to prove to anyone here.  No one wants to see you "lose" - in fact there are a lot of people here giving good advice to people in trouble purely to help out.

I don't work in finance, however it seems to me that you're not in serious debt when everything has been taken into account - and that you could clear it in a reasonable timeframe.  The problem is that you are still trying to make some kind of 'killing.'


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## z107 (28 Sep 2006)

> The problem is that you are still trying to make some kind of 'killing.'



...and of you want to do it with Irish property, then you're about 10 years too late.


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## CharlieMcC (29 Sep 2006)

exile said:


> You have a gambling problem. Even if you hadn't explicitly revealed this in the first post, it becomes evident in the subsequent ones.......The problem is that you are still trying to make some kind of 'killing.'


 
Brilliantly observed, these were precisely my thoughts when I first read Indeep's opening post.

I posted here recently and owned up to huge credit card debts that were almost completely due to a gambling problem. 

When I read Indeep talking about "starting to use my parents cards to try win money on horses to pay off my debt" it was a painful reminder. It was the night I considered using my mother's credit card to lodge money on a gambling website, after I had maxed out on my card, that I knew I was in serious trouble and it was time to do something about it. 

I stopped right there, didn't 'steal' her card (and *theft* is what it would have been, there is no other word) and started trying to sort it all out.

So far so good, I haven't gambled in about 3 months now and have begun to eat in to my debts - there is a long, long way to go but it feels exhilarating to see those debts slowly reducing. Light at the end of the tunnel, and all that.

Indeep? For your own good face up to it: you are in *SERIOUS* trouble. Your debts are as frightening as mine, and I earn almost twice what you do. You *CAN* get out of it, but only if you face realities and acknowledge that you *ARE* in trouble. You are kidding yourself with all this talk of making a killing in the next year or two, the post I quoted above is spot on, "the problem is that you are still trying to make some kind of killing". 

The only way you will sort this out is if you first accept that you are in much more serious trouble than you think you are, if you acknowledge that you have a serious gambling problem (which you most certainly *DO* if you used your parents cards to continue your habit), and if you stop living in dreamland, relying on potential financial 'killings' to get you out of the mess.

Deal with your financial situation as it is *now*, absolutely nobody can be certain how the housing market will go, we can all have a good hunch, but that's not enough on which to stake your financial future.

Go to MABS - now. Make an appointment today, you are not committing yourself to anything, but they will give you good advice and help you come up with a plan to fix this mess.

Most of the advice you have received on this board has been of the 'cruel to be kind' variety, which is what you need. Honestly, every word you have written proves that you just have no idea how serious your situation is.

Take heed of the advice, if you do things will slowly improve and you'll get your life back together again. At 22 you are much too young to be weighed down by chronic debt like this, but if you don't cop on it will follow you forever. Best of luck.


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## InDeep (29 Sep 2006)

Ok first off I have one bond-it is divided into several sectors but is still one bond of 40k.


This bond is not going to make a killing over 2 years. It is invested over 5 years no less,so I am not banking on making a killing until then and it is 114% guaranteed now as there is lock in feature after 6 months so it is performing very very well.

Secondly I dont see myself as having a gambling problem as I gambled on credit cards last month for the first time ever really, I lost and have not gambled or intend to again.In my opinion no one makes money on gambling. I was given three tips,1 of them one but the other 2 lost,Hands up my fault.


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## NiallA (29 Sep 2006)

You should change you name from Indeep to In Fairytale, because that's were you're living.

don't borrow money to pay off other debts, because this will only increase the amount you owe.

Get rid of your credit cards now, to stop yourself borrowing more.

pay off the loans with the largest interest rate first (usually the credit card).

as soon as you get paid, pay off you bills and withdraw the cash you have set aside for yourself.  then if you run out off money, you can't overspend anymore.


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## nelly (29 Sep 2006)

*Re: Need serious help and Im only 22!!!*



Eurofan said:


> It's not more debt advice you need it's a sound kick up the This post will be deleted if not edited to remove bad language to help you cop yourself on.



here here

you know what you SHOULD do, - chop up the credit cards and keep up with your repayments that you agreed to.give your parents back their credit cards you cheeky fecker, and yeah for the next year stay on the bread line and keep your word to the institutions who gave you the money by paying them back. Or maybe Daddy and Mammy can bail you out with a 99 year loan. 

Most folks live on €100pw while saving deposits for houses, but in your job you should prob know that.


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## elefantfresh (29 Sep 2006)

Slightly off course, but I'm still curious as to what you did with all that loan money. It certainly wasn't for dental treatment or an exotic holiday. What does somebody do with 30 odd grand 'cept buy a car or house deposit? Madness, 22 and that much debt....


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## thewatcher (29 Sep 2006)

Howitzer said:


> Funniest thread in a long long time.


 
Definitely,op blinded by their own self confidence.


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## momomo (29 Sep 2006)

InDeep said:


> I must stress again that I want to try and leave the bond to one side as I dont want to be using it to bail me out of the situation. Obviously the return I get will more than cover cost of credit plus repayment when I get the return.


Em so your willing to have five years of debt and stress at 22, for a better future in 5 years.  Im only young too and in five years time I have no idea what the future will hold. Id rather be debt free and enjoy my life at your age.


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## r2d2 (29 Sep 2006)

InDeep....

The best thing you can do for yourself is to stop the denial....The help you need in my opinion is for the gambling that you have done to get yourself into this debt....I'm sorry but I just don't buy the borrowed to invest crap. If I'm correct and you have had a gambling issue for some time then I can point you in the right direction for proper help and support. 

r2d2


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## Thrifty (29 Sep 2006)

CharlieMcC, really admire your post. Even if Indeep does not feel it applies to him it may very well help somebody else deal with their problem and i'm really pleased things are working well for you. 

Indeep like others on this thread you posts and your language strike me as that of somebody who is willing to gamble and take high risks. For somebody who says they never gambled before a month or two ago it sounds like you gambled alot of money on 3 tips received - this strikes me as extremely risky for somebody who has never gambled before. I'm sure at the time you thought you couldn't lose rather like you do now with the house purchase suggestion you have but you are gambling again - in that you have fixed in your own mind a strategy that you feel can't lose. You don't appear to want to hear anything to the contrary. 

I really don't feel that anybody is going to be able to convince you differently at the moment because i don't think you really want to hear it - if fact thats why you probably don't want to take up the suggestion of MABS because as you said in your own words ‘I don't think going to them will help as deep down they only tell people what they already know but dont want to admit to’


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## Bosshog (29 Sep 2006)

InDeep said:


> I am here to prove all of you wrong



and he named his thread "Need serious help..."

so which is it Indeep? help or to prove us all wrong?

this sounds like a wind up to me.


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## ClubMan (29 Sep 2006)

InDeep said:


> I work in finance and it is no secret that the property market will slow next October/November and when it does I want to get on it. I deal with First Time Buyers a lot and can safely say that 85% of them hide their loans with the CU when applying.





InDeep said:


> I am 22 and working in finance(you think i would have more sense) I earn 33k per year.





InDeep said:


> By the way. I could approve 350k for myself now but feel that it would be terrible decision.


I am curious as to precisely _InDeep's _job in "finance" entails. I certainly hope it doesn't involve influencing other peoples' decisions on financial products!


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## mell61 (29 Sep 2006)

Indeep, re-reading your original mail, and the follow up mails you've posted, I've noticed that you seem to work in 2 separate financial arenas... you worry about repaying 80 to a friend, yet are blasee about carrying €40k of debt.
I think you need to take a step back and re-evaluate what you want from your financial future.    You are anticipating buying a house with a view of making a killing, yet worry about getting through the coming month...
Your debt is huge for for your income level and having no security...
Cash in that bond, take the hit and clear a lot of your debt.... so you won't make that killing, at least you'll be in a position to plan accurately your future.
I know there have been a lot of strong comments made in this forum, but please re-read your own posting and see what we seem to see, someone so deep in denial about his debt levels and his potential future wealth that he hasn't realised he's out of his depth!


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## ney001 (29 Sep 2006)

Nobody gambles large amounts of money on the internet when they have never gambled before, very desperate if you ask me - sounds like you were making a last effort to bail yourself out of trouble before posting here. 

By coming on here you wanted reassurance - you believe that you have this great idea to get out of debt and you wanted other people to agree with you and tell you how wonderful an idea it is!.  The reality is that people are offering real, honest and very good advice but now you have decided to prove everybody wrong because you didn't hear any praise as you had expected.  Start with mabs and take it from there! - Then you might looking into your gambling problem (and yes you do have one, not just with the horses either) Then I would look very seriously into the reasons why you felt that at 22 it was okay to use your parents credit card to gamble.  

I really do hope that someone like you isn't giving advice to the public on financial products - 22yrs old, living with mammy and daddy and still 40K in debt - Grow up mate cut your losses and stop trying to be some kind of financial whizz kid when you obviously aren't coping


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## ClubMan (29 Sep 2006)

InDeep said:


> This month I have 80 euro to last me until next pay day which is the 18th October, I will get paid 2238, Out of that I need to pay 550 BOI Loan(mised payment from last month,this is the only time I have ever missed a payment on anything and hopefully since I will pay it back within a week I wont get a 1 on my ICB) I also have to pay my 2 loans which amounts to 800 euro and also pay 700 euro off my mams credit card along with 120 to my dads,100 euro to my sister and 60 to another friend. It is going to give me around 120 eurpo to live off for the month. I simply cant go on like this. Its all my own fauly but I need help to get out of it.


Does not compute. 

€2,238 - (€550 + €800 + €700 + €120 + €100 + €60) = -€92. 


InDeep said:


> By the way. I could approve 350k for myself now but feel that it would be terrible decision.


What does this mean? Do you mean that you could approve a loan for yourself in your own job? Is that really true? Scary if it is...


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## ney001 (29 Sep 2006)

Just wondering do you have a car?
Do you pay rent?
Do you hand up money for phone/electricity/food bills?

or are you too busy planning your own house and future travelling arrangements to hand up money?


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## ney001 (29 Sep 2006)

*Re: Need serious help and Im only 22!!!*



InDeep said:


> By the way. I could approve 350k for myself now but feel that it would be terrible decision.


Sounds like you want a pat on the back for this one - who do you work for - my god sounds like a dream job - 22, bad at finances and still able to get himself 350K - give us some credit


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## demoivre (29 Sep 2006)

Bosshog said:


> and he named his thread "Need serious help..."
> 
> so which is it Indeep? help or to prove us all wrong?
> 
> this sounds like a wind up to me.



Yep, I thought this was a wind up too but  lately I have had my doubts about the genuine nature of some of the recent threads on AAM. I was going to contribute to  this thread  the other day and when I went to do so it had been moved to the stb section and I was soooooooooo glad I hadn't wasted my time offering my tuppence worth. Fair play to the mod ajapale for spotting it was a joke 'cause it had me fooled.


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## HotdogsFolks (29 Sep 2006)

ney001 said:


> By coming on here you wanted reassurance - you believe that you have this great idea to get out of debt and you wanted other people to agree with you and tell you how wonderful an idea it is!. The reality is that people are offering real, honest and very good advice but now you have decided to prove everybody wrong because you didn't hear any praise as you had expected.


 
Spot on!

This guy is too immature to be dealing with money. He clearly doesn't understand it.

OP - Get rid of the bond and start over again. You've screwed up. Accept defeat, clear your debts, clear your stress, and go from there...


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## Trent (29 Sep 2006)

InDeep, you might let us know how exactly you can "approve €350k" for yourself if you're earning €33k a year?

I earn more than twice what you do and am a qualified accountant (banks take a different view of professionals) and struggled to get that kind of approval without a guarantee. 

The rest of your posts sounds like you're a habitual gambler and think that leveraging yourself to the hilt is the only way to get rich. At 22 you should forget about taking a gamble on the property market for a few years. Rent for half of what you'd pay in a mortgage and cut out the effect of any interest rate hikes and/or potential property downturn. Get yourself debt free before throwing yourself into more debt.


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## ClubMan (29 Sep 2006)

demoivre said:


> I was going to contribute to  this thread  the other day and when I went to do so it had been moved to the stb section and I was soooooooooo glad I hadn't wasted my time offering my tuppence worth. Fair play to the mod ajapale for spotting it was a joke 'cause it had me fooled.


I don't see that the thread in question was a joke/wind-up.


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## Thrifty (29 Sep 2006)

I don't either in relation to that particular thread but have to admit have felt in some threads (particularly house price related) that some posters like playing devils advocate. I think it's hard to call it sometimes so i try and give the person the benefit of the doubt that its genuine. Hard to swallow though when some one seeks advice and then seems to be wanting to make a point and argue/ debate against all advice given. Makes me doubt whether the advice was really wanted and if it was just a device to air own views


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## ClubMan (29 Sep 2006)

Thrifty said:


> have to admit have felt in some threads (particularly house price related) that some posters like playing devils advocate.


I have no problem in saying that I often like playing devil's advocate. It's a legitimate strategy for help people who look for information to think about their situation especially when it balances biases that they or others have about some topic.


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## lff12 (29 Sep 2006)

*Re: Need serious help and Im only 22!!!*



InDeep said:


> I work in finance and _it is no secret that the property market will slow next October/November and when it does_ I want to get on it. I deal with First Time Buyers a lot and can safely say that 85% of them hide their loans with the CU when applying.


 
This statement alone suggests you are incredibly immature.

1. There is absolutely no definitive evidence to believe that the housing market is going to slow down or speed up, all ideas are purely speculation and opinion right now as at the moment the general gist on the economy from the CSO is extremely bright - which suggests that growth is likely to continue (much as non-home owners like myself and yourself would like to believe otherwise).
To suggest that its "definitely" going to happen, and on a particular date, is naive to put it nicely.

2. Secondly, Credit Unions are joining the ICB in efforts to stop themselves being labelled a "soft touch" by people like yourselves.
(A letter arrived at my best friend's house last week - was a last warning for a former tenant of the previous owner, who owed a local CU 12k before she skiddadled - do you really think CU's are going to continue to tolerate this situation?)

3. 40k is nearly 2 years net income for you. In order to clear all of this with a 30k loan at a reasonable rate will cost you 500 a month not counting interest over 5 years. A 350k mortgage will add 850 a month (assuming your partner pays half). Thats still leaving you will only 900-1000 a month which is still a crippling amount of repayments.
And thats over 30 years. Again not taking into account interest rate changes which could add huge amounts when they go up.

4. What really alarmed me, though, was the comment about gambling on your parents credit card. Firstly isn't 22 a bit old to still have a card on your mum's account? And secondly, doesn't gambling on a credit card under the illusion that you'll earn money pretty much suggest that you've got either a) a big attitude problem or b) a big debt problem.

If I were your employer reading this, I'd be very worried about your maturity and ability to understand financial issues, particularly since you are clearly having big problems managing your own.

My suggestion is to forget about the house until every penny of your debts are paid.
To answer your original question, yes, it is possible to enjoy life on a tiny income - people on social welfare have to live on little more than the figure you mention, and for many that includes a contribution to rent and bills. I was problem debts once myself, partially due to circumstances that I did initiate myself, but really more due to spending habits that evolved over years and one or two circumstances outside my control (a key figure in my case was a 3 year pay freeze).

Now everybody owes something but it does sound to me that you do (at least) realise that things are getting out of control.
Most people have debts, some people even big ones, but the difference between a debt problem and a debt is when you can't afford your repayments - which is exactly what you're facing. What you need to do is gain control again - and forget about the house for now. Get a grip on the reality of the situation and the house will eventually be yours - but be warned it may be years.

I'd suggest putting up with the 75 euros a month and then start throwing money at the debt with the biggest interest rate. Once thats cleared, continue with the next most expensive and so on until its paid off in full.
But talk to MABS if you can.

I think you probably realise at this stage that you're not going to keep a squeaky clean ICB record without hairshirt living, but look on the bright side, if you can put away 1000 a month it'll be all paid off within 3.5 years.

As for getting a 350k loan, surely you do realise that interest rates are going up and that the amount that you can borrow is failling with every rise?  My friend with nearly 40k a year needed both a bond from her folks and her Dad as a guarantour to get 220k.  Do you not realise that interest rates are probably going to be 0.5-1% higher this time next year?


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## PMU (29 Sep 2006)

InDeep: I was about to make a detailed response but the post of Iff12 of today is as good as you will get.  But I’m beginning to wonder if this is a wind up or possibly the most self-centred and selfish poster on AAM. 

You have received free advice of a very high quality on how to deal with your problems and all you can say is: “I am here to prove all of you wrong”.

Then you should not be here.  This is a forum where those with more experience of debt management (and it is management of your money that gets you out of debt – not gambling) voluntarily make their knowledge and experience available to people with genuine concerns.  Rather than accept this advice, you simply argue.  After re-reading your posts, I’m reminded of the line in the Smith’s song ‘This Charming Man’ about “a jumped-up pantry boy who doesn't know his place”. 

You should follow the advice given, go to MABS and it wouldn’t hurt to read some of Alvin Hall’s books on debt problems.


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## ClubMan (29 Sep 2006)

PMU said:


> After re-reading your posts, I’m reminded of the line in the Smith’s song ‘This Charming Man’ about “a jumped-up pantry boy who doesn't know his place”.



Ah - I always thought it was "country boy"!


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## demoivre (29 Sep 2006)

ClubMan said:


> I don't see that the thread in question was a joke/wind-up.



When I first saw this thread there was only a few posts in it which  I read and thought the thread was genuine. I returned to the thread the next day ( I think) , with the intention of adding my own thoughts but saw that it had been moved to the stb section which is "for jokes, stories, and other non serious stuff ", to quote from Brendan's guidelines. I therefore assumed that the thread was in some way a joke and didn't bother reading the additional posts in the thread since my previous visit, nor did I bother contributing - I don't spend much time at all reading or contributing to  the stb section.  I have just read the entire thread now and I agree with your view above - obviously ajapale  spotted something that eludes us.  I see the Pit Bull thread is also now in stb - is that right or are there gremlins at work .


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## liteweight (29 Sep 2006)

I don't understand why that thread is STB either, unless it became more like a discussion than a reply to a specific question.


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## casiopea (29 Sep 2006)

I assume both threads got moved as the conversation moved from the OP's question to other things. In the case of the work/stressed one it became a discussion on meds and the dog thing became a quiz.


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## CCOVICH (29 Sep 2006)

Okay, on topic please-this is not the place to discuss why other threads were moved.


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## casiopea (29 Sep 2006)

Indeep,
Why dont you just cash this bond/investment for 40k?
Clear your debts, start again?
It doesnt make sense having such an investment and at the same time repaying high interest on debts.


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## shelflife (29 Sep 2006)

ok i think that your attutude is very typical of the under 30s at the moment. i want it all and i want it now. there is no idea of saving for anything or not been able to afford something.
1. forget about buying a house until ALL your debts are cleared.
2. clear the cc debts first then the pls
3. reduce your spending and start saving, when the bond matures in a few years you should have a nice nestegg to fund your house purchase.

i noticed that when you spoke about buying the house there was no mention of legal or surveyors fees.no mention of the cost of furnishing the house or how all the house bills ,insurance, esb,water,heat were going to be paid.
also when selling the house again no mention of legal fees estate agents fees.
you need to wake up and smell the coffee, theres another rate rise on the way and soon people who have extended themselves financially will find themselves in a lot of trouble.


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## ClubMan (29 Sep 2006)

shelflife said:


> ok i think that your attutude is very typical of the under 30s at the moment.


To be fair I think that's a bit of a gross generalisation and it's unfair to tar all under 30s with the same brush.


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## nlgbbbblth (29 Sep 2006)

ClubMan said:


> Do you mean that you could approve a loan for yourself in your own job? Is that really true? Scary if it is...


 
Staff in financial institutions do not approve their own mortgage applications.


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## ClubMan (29 Sep 2006)

nlgbbbblth said:


> Staff in financial institutions do not approve their own mortgage applications.


So does this mean that _InDeep _was lying?


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## nlgbbbblth (30 Sep 2006)

ClubMan said:


> So does this mean that _InDeep _was lying?


 
In my opinion - yes.

You can _prepare_ the mortgage application yourself i.e. present the case as best you can. Usually would need to be signed off by somebody else (usually a manager) and the decision would definitely not be made by the applicant - usually a central lending department.

Think about it - the system would be open to serious abuse if staff could sanction what they wanted for themselves. You would have people being hopelessly optimistic about their future repayment capacity and ignoring a potential rise in interest rates just so they could borrow the amount they wanted.

Plus the Central Bank would blow a fuse.


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## liteweight (30 Sep 2006)

I think 'lying' is a bit strong. Perhaps he meant that he can approve himself in principal, i.e. he knows the amount he would be approved for.


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## shelflife (30 Sep 2006)

yes it is a generalisation but i come accross it every week, that age group havnt seen unemployment or "hard times". of course it doesnt apply to all under 30s but it does imho apply to most.


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## liteweight (30 Sep 2006)

shelflife said:


> yes it is a generalisation but i come accross it every week, that age group havnt seen unemployment or "hard times". of course it doesnt apply to all under 30s but it does imho apply to most.



Wish I could dispute it but I agree with you.


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## asterix (30 Sep 2006)

I think there is a very good chance this is wind up. And if it is, I don't think it is particularly funny.
If it is not, I'm afraid to say that at least two friends come to mind who resemble the personality that emerges from InDeep's comments. 
I'm in my mid 20s, as are the two people in question. Both are male and live at home with their parents in Dublin. One has a stable job with a large multinational. The other is professional who is only starting to make money after years of study.
Although I like both very much, there is this weird delusional/fantasist aspect to both of their personalities when it comes to money. They both spend money as if it was water.And it's not as if they have a lot to show for it - the large part of it goes on socialising. 
Having what I regard as a sensible attitude to money (I've rented since moving out of home a couple of years ago and in recent months and have recently managed to buy), I try to impart simple advice to them in a subtle and informal way when money issues crop up. I only do this because I can see that neither of them are anywhere near buying the property they want, let alone rent somewhere decent, and, more particularly, because their spending habits scare the life out of me. However, my boring tips rarely get heard above the brags about the latest bonus or fast buck they have made (one of the two has started to get involved in day trading on the net- v. scary).
Back to the point about under 30s, I have thought about it for a while now, and I'm afraid I'm going to have to come out as a traitor to my age group. 
There really is something blase and complacent about the attitude of many of my contemporaries to money, my two friends being the two that come most readily to mind. 
Maybe I just have a longer memory than many of my age group but, despite the fact that I wasn't even a teenager at the time, I can remember the down-town Tirana that was Dublin in the late 80s and the extremely modest lifestlye of my family (bog standard middle class). 
I love the choice that money brings and I never want to go back to 80s Dublin but the benefit of the memory of it is that I have a healthy vigilance around and respect for money. I think too many of my peer group are in a comfort zone around money such that they treat it as something to play with.. sure there will always be more of it. 
I wouldn't urge anyone to become a miser but the lack of regard my friends have for money means that it falls between their fingers such that I know there is a good chance that they will end up as debt-ridden chumps who are still living in their parents' homes in their early 30s. And how sad would that be.


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## Billo (30 Sep 2006)

IMHO also this is definitely a wind up.
Billo


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## liteweight (1 Oct 2006)

Whether it's a wind up or not InDeep has obviously abandoned ship. Obviously didn't like the replies.


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## Blinder (1 Oct 2006)

Maybe he's just gone incognito

_<__>_
Another 22 year old working in the financial services living at home with parents and looking to buy a house next year .... hmmmmm

_[Edited by DrMoriarty to remove link. There's no evidence — IP or e-mail address — to suggest that the two posters are the same. There must be lots of 22-year-olds working in the financial services, living at home with their parents and looking to buy a house next year...]_


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## liteweight (1 Oct 2006)

Blinder said:


> Maybe he's just gone incognito
> 
> _<__>_
> Another 22 year old working in the financial services living at home with parents and looking to buy a house next year .... hmmmmm
> ...



It's not possible to go incognito with vbulletin is it? The IP no. is the same even if email is different? Even then....one of my daughters has started to read this site and intends to post eventually. She'll be using my computer!! So if you start seeing posts with this IP about drinking, carousing, looking to purchase in the Himalayas etc. ...........it's not me, I swear......it's the KIPPER!!


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## purplealien (1 Oct 2006)

shelflife said:


> ok i think that your attutude is very typical of the under 30s at the moment. i want it all and i want it now.


Couldnt agree more with you and i'm 27. I'm also one of those people but at least i can admit to it.


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## liteweight (1 Oct 2006)

There's nothing wrong with wanting it all, as long as you don't get yourself into debt doing it.


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## Dipole (1 Oct 2006)

The OPs strategy was that he'd buy a house when the market slows but didn't seem to factor in that his job in Financial Services would be very precarious at that stage.  
Lending Institutions must deliver profit to shareholders and in a falling market the only way they can do that is to cut costs; working on principle of last in first out I'm guessing OP as a 22 year old would be the first to get the boot.

OP needed to rethink his gameplan.


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## Guest127 (2 Oct 2006)

definitely wind up. invested €40k in European bond equity/property etc which in turn invested 65% in retail in Birmingham and is showing a profit of 67% after 6 months. give us a break


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## HelenQ (2 Oct 2006)

Indeep I think you need a major kick in the This post will be deleted if not edited to remove bad language and a big reality check.

I


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## nelly (2 Oct 2006)

Asterix - i agree that the generalisation is becoming more and more accurate. I am in your age group and think maybe it has more to do with growing up with siblings heading to London in the 80's and my parents never getting loans except for cars, if they didn't have it you didn't get it. 
Parents willing to go in hock for their kids and show them its ok to live beyond your means are the issue now. There were always folks who had loads and went on foreign holidays when i was young too but others were not compeled to go out and borrow to keep up with the Jones.


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## purplealien (2 Oct 2006)

> Parents willing to go in hock for their kids and show them its ok to live beyond your means are the issue now. There were always folks who had loads and went on foreign holidays when i was young too but others were not compeled to go out and borrow to keep up with the Jones.


It appalls my mother the way i spend money - credit card debts etc. She is constantly going on at me about it. I think that because i had to grow up in an environment where we weren't able to buy nice things whenever we wanted and go on nice holidays. Driving around in a banger of a car and not having as much money as my friends to do things.This has pushed me to the other extreme now that i am married and have my own life. If i want something i'll stick it on the credit card and if that card maxs out, i'll get another one. Foolish i know but i can't help myself.My brother then is the oosite to me - he has savings and if hw wants anything he'll save up for it.
I need a good kick up the This post will be deleted if not edited to remove bad language myself


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## CCOVICH (2 Oct 2006)

Pointless to let this continue.

If the OP is serious about there problems there are plenty of other threads on AAM they can turn to for advice.


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