# Form 12:



## BlueSpud (25 Oct 2005)

I am struggling with my form 12 at the moment.  There is an item "Interest received or credited on deposits arising in the state from which irish tax was deducted".  Does this mean my piddly little bank deposit account, on which I got almost no interest and which inflation in is killing the true value.  As it stands they get the dirt anyway.  Is this the type of thing this panel means? 

I also still have those lovely vodafone shares, i.e. post Eircom.  Again is this what they are looking for under "Foreign Income, GB & NI dividends".

Are these small amounts an issue?


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## geri (25 Oct 2005)

*Re: Form 12*

I asked a representative from the revenue who came to our company last week the question on the deposit accounts aswell. I have an EBS account that earns interest.  I mentioned that it was practically pence and that DIRT was already paid on it.  He advised that I put the figure in anyway.  It won't effect your tax position, so to keep things square its probably best to put it in.  Maybe someone else can answer the question on the shares.
I'm submitting the Form 12 for the first time this year aswell, hope it all goes ok for you.


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## GeneralZod (25 Oct 2005)

*Re: Form 12*

I think they can charge you income tax on it with a credit for the DIRT you already paid. I always fill it in but haven't actually been charged for it yet. They send out a balancing statement saying something like "we aren't collecting the amount due at this time."


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## Karangka (26 Oct 2005)

*Re: Form 12*

Just fill in the amount of interest received. It won't affect your tax position as the DIRT took care of the tax already. But, do feel it in even though the amount is minimal.


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## suzie (26 Oct 2005)

*Re: Form 12*

Is it Ok to send in photo-copies of RACs/P60s etc, or do they need the real thing when returning the form 12?


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## emc (27 Oct 2005)

*Re: Form 12*

No photo copies are fine, the only reason they would look for the original is if you were picked for audit


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## hullabaloo (27 Oct 2005)

*Re: Form 12*

Hello,

I've just been filling out this form 12 too. There's a section on PRSA's which should only be filled out if you made PRSA contributions. I participate in my employer's contributory pension scheme. That scheme has been around a lot longer than PRSA's so I'm not sure if I should fill it out? Does anyone know?

Thanks.


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## geri (27 Oct 2005)

*Re: Form 12*

EMC
Is this true?  I delivered Form 12 to revenue yesterday with original P60, after being advised to do so on another thread on AAM.  The poster said that the revenue send them back when they have reviewed your form.  Can't remember who this was from.  I can't find the thread.  It was about this time last year.


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## brigade (28 Oct 2005)

*Re: Form 12*

I have never given the revenue an original P60 or accompanying documentation, if needed, and have had no problem with the originals being looked for.
It has happened on 2 or 3 occasions over the years where my correspondence has gone missing. Thats why I always keep a copy of the Form 12 I submit just in case.


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## suzie (28 Oct 2005)

*Re: Form 12*

Thanks for that. Sent in the original form 12/med1 and copies of my documents. Also copied everything for me benefit....

As this is my first form12 submission, how long do revenue take to process it (considering they are bound to be busy this time of year)?

Cheers

S.


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## xeresod (28 Oct 2005)

*Re: Form 12*



			
				suzie said:
			
		

> As this is my first form12 submission, how long do revenue take to process it (considering they are bound to be busy this time of year)?/QUOTE]
> 
> Shouldn't take too long, maybe just a couple of weeks. It is a busy time for the Income Tax sections but not really for the PAYE sections as most people send their From 12s in at the begining of the year to get their refunds sooner rather than waiting until now.


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## pat127 (13 Oct 2006)

*Re: Form 12*



suzie said:


> Is it Ok to send in photo-copies of RACs/P60s etc, or do they need the real thing when returning the form 12?


 
Tried a search on my question without success. It's stated on Med-1 that documentation isn't required ("Receipts.....should not be submitted with this claim but should be retained by you...").

What's the corresponding situation with Form 12?

Many thanks.


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## Paul J (24 Oct 2006)

*Re: Form 12*

On the issue of deposit interest mentioned above, does this include interest on SSIA accounts. The interest paid on my SSIA account in 2005 was not exactly small (approx e50).

My understanding is that dirt of 20% is deducted at source, and if you are a 42% tax payer, who will be required to pay an additional 22% in tax. In most cases this probably doesn't happen given the low interest rates currently in existance on deposit accounts.

Also on the SSIA's has dirt tax been applied to the interest paid on the SSIA account.

One other thing I noticed when completing my Form 12 is that I was a tax credit for bin tags of e39 (195 x 20%) in 2005, but since I didn't use 195 worth of bin tags in 2005, I assume there should be a claw back on my 2005 tax credits. 

I'm going to fill in everything correctly on my form, and I'm assuming that they should be coming looking for a few additional quid from me.


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## pat127 (25 Oct 2006)

*Re: Form 12*

I rang Revenue this morning about my 2005 Return having seen your post, Paul. They say that the SSIA deposit interest should be returned, i.e. to get an Interest Cert from the Bank and send in a copy (I've already sent in my form 12). 

I don't think that a higher-rate taxpayer will be hit for more tax on the interest but may in certain circumstamces be liable for the Health Levy or PRSI. 

The subject is discussed in detail in a thread called "*Is additional tax due on deposit account" *in* Taxation.*


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## jimmyw (11 Oct 2007)

*Re: Form 12*

FORM12 queries:
Has anybody any idea what needs to go into column: 
"*Excess Case V Capital Allowances*" of the Form12 Section 13 - Rental Income from Land and Property in the State.

Also, has anybody noticed that in Form12 Section 26 - Other Foreign Income ... that there is no place to fill in the associated expenses for foreign rents received. On the equivalent form (Form11) for non PAYE employees they have an additional two columns for section 411 Foreign Rents:
 (b) *Expenses on this income*
 (c) *Net profit on Foreign Rental property
* 
... these two columns are not available on the equivalent Form12 (PAYE). So my obvious question is: how do PAYE folks cater for this.


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## extopia (11 Oct 2007)

*Re: Form 12*

AFAIK PAYE folks can fill in a form 11 if the form 12 doesn't cover all the necessary sources of income.

Don't forget to "gross up" any deposit interest from which DIRT was deducted. E.g. If you received €80 in interest you enter the gross amount of 100. You'll notice that your standard rate (20%) band is increased by €20 (the amount of DIRT deducted) as a result. If you enter the net amount (€80) your standard band would only go up by €16, meaning that the other €4 would actually be taxed at 42%...


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## webtax (14 Oct 2007)

*Re: Form 12*



jimmyw said:


> FORM12 queries:
> Also, has anybody noticed that in Form12 Section 26 - Other Foreign Income ... that there is no place to fill in the associated expenses for foreign rents received. On the equivalent form (Form11) for non PAYE employees they have an additional two columns for section 411 Foreign Rents:
> (b) *Expenses on this income*
> (c) *Net profit on Foreign Rental property
> ...



If you have rental income from outside Ireland & UK you need to submit a form 11 (even if a paye worker).


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## paddyb (14 Oct 2007)

*Re: Form 12*

The reason that the revenue want you to include deposit interest in the tax return (form 11 or 12) is so that prsi & health contribution charges can be applied.  Deposit interest is only taxed at the standard rate so when you enter the gross amount on your tax return you will notice that it only changes the amount of prsi & health contribution due. Practicaly this is achieved by changing the point at where the top rate is applied.

Its important to gross up the interest received and to enter the gross amount in the tax return.  Its equally important to include details of DIRT paid to avoid a double payment of tax.


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## SuilAmhain (17 Oct 2007)

*Re: Form 12*

Can i ask a presumably simple question re form12? When the form asks for gross tax, should this include PRSI + health levy?

Many thanks
S


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## PubMan (17 Oct 2007)

*Re: Form 12*

Some more silly questions: 
1. If I am a PAYE employee, with just some bank accounts (paying DIRT), a pension and no other income apart from my main employment do I need to fill out a form12?

2. Now if the same case applies but I earned 120Euro in dividends on some shares, do I need to file a return (I guess yes). If I do, then do I need to document all my bank accounts + DIRT, tax paid, pension contributions etc... on the form12. Seems a lot of paperwork (for me and the revenue) for 120E?

3.If you dispose of an asset and do not make gains about the CGT allowance, do you still need to declare the sale/gains?

As you have probably guessed I have never filled a form12.


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## rodger (21 Oct 2007)

*Re: Form 12*



SuilAmhain said:


> Can i ask a presumably simple question re form12? When the form asks for gross tax, should this include PRSI + health levy?
> 
> Many thanks
> S


 
I am currently completing my Form12 and would like to know the answer
to this question also.

I mean the P60 refers to tax as "total net tax"
Therefore should I add PRSI and the Tax Credit to arrive at "Gross Tax" ?


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## webtax (21 Oct 2007)

*Re: Form 12*

PubMan,

to answer your questions:
1. no need for form 12
2. you should contact your tax office and see if you can get the tax deducted through the paye system (thereby avoiding the need for a form 12). remember you have already paid dividend witholding tax on them when calculating gross amt.
3. yes, need to make a cgt return


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## webtax (21 Oct 2007)

*Re: Form 12*



rodger said:


> I am currently completing my Form12 and would like to know the answer
> to this question also.
> 
> I mean the P60 refers to tax as "total net tax"
> Therefore should I add PRSI and the Tax Credit to arrive at "Gross Tax" ?



take the figures straight from your p60 (no adjustment needed):
gross tax = total net tax


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## rodger (21 Oct 2007)

*Re: Form 12*



webtax said:


> take the figures straight from your p60 (no adjustment needed):
> gross tax = total net tax


 
Thanks WebTax.
Another question:
Where, if anywhere, does the figure for PRSI go on the Form12 ?


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