# Complicated question re mortgage and bankruptcy



## BlueMoon2 (26 Jan 2012)

My 1st time posting, so I hope this is the appropriate forum and appreciate all responses to a complicated situation.

In 2004 my ex and I bought a house as 1st time buyers. We split up before moving in. I moved in with 2 children and paid the mortgage alone. 

In 2007 we went to court and the result was ex's name came off the deeds. His name is still on the mortgage.

In 2009 I got married to new partner. He has never had a mortgage or owned a property.

Today mortgage is still in mine and my ex's name. His name was meant to come off it following removal from the deeds but each of us presumed the other would approach the lender to remove it. I feel it was his job to follow up. But thats neither here nor there. We are not on speaking or even contacting terms.

Without going into the ins and outs of everything, it is getting increasingly difficult to pay the mortgage. It's 2 months in arrears. Not subsequent months. There is 1 more child now, so 3 children.

I am not working or receiving any social welfare. I have no option to work as only qualified to JC level and don't earn enough to pay child care for 3 kids, let alone a mortgage.

The bank cannot go into any reduced payment agreement as my ex will not fill out the form for the process to take place. They are very firm they won't deal with anything without both of us filling out the form.

At this stage, legally, can I declare myself bankrupt and hand back the house to the bank? The house is approx €80k in negative equity, but of course it's so hard to know exactly.

What happens if I just stop paying? Ie how long can we expect to stay in the house before repossession would occur? 1 more month? 6 months? 
In the meantime can they take possessions from the house? Basic interior and decor. I'm thinking of the knockon effect to the 3 children.

Does my husbands income effect my ability to declare myself bankrupt, or is it not taken into account?

Legally can they say my husband has to pay the mortgage, my debt in my name and not his?

I don't care about my credit rating at this stage.

We would like to be rid of the house, the stress etc, and just rent somewhere we can afford. We do not want to emigrate.

Please if anyone can offer step by step advice I'd really appreciate it.


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## BlueMoon2 (27 Jan 2012)

If there are any questions that I could answer to make my original post clearer or to help me get advice I would be more than happy to answer them. 
Thank you.


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## PiedPiper (27 Jan 2012)

Can not and will not are two totally different things.


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## Swyper (27 Jan 2012)

BlueMoon2 said:


> The bank cannot go into any reduced payment agreement as my ex will not fill out the form for the process to take place. They are very firm they won't deal with anything without both of us filling out the form.



Perhaps he can be motivated to care if he knew that the bank would go after him also if you defaulted on your debts.



BlueMoon2 said:


> At this stage, legally, can I declare myself bankrupt and hand back the house to the bank?



You cannot just declare yourself bankrupt. Either you or a creditor can apply to make you bankrupt through the High Court.



BlueMoon2 said:


> What happens if I just stop paying? Ie how long can we expect to stay in the house before repossession would occur? 1 more month? 6 months?



You will eventually be evicted, but I would suspect that you'd get a lot more than 6 months, but you and your ex's debt would continue to accumulate.



BlueMoon2 said:


> In the meantime can they take possessions from the house? Basic interior and decor. I'm thinking of the knockon effect to the 3 children.



I would doubt it.



BlueMoon2 said:


> Does my husbands income effect my ability to declare myself bankrupt, or is it not taken into account?



Very unlikely as he is not a party to the mortgage.



BlueMoon2 said:


> Legally can they say my husband has to pay the mortgage, my debt in my name and not his?



Doubt it.


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## BlueMoon2 (29 Jan 2012)

Thank you kindly for your replies. I really appreciate it.
PiedPiper, I was told by the bank they absolutely cannot proceed with anything without ex filling in the form too. It was said as in it's not their choice, and there is no way around it. Thanks.

Swyper, thank you too. I should have made it clearer that I understand I need to go bankrupt through the court. I was just wondering if it's an option for me as my husband does have an income. I wasn't sure if it would be taken into account or not.


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## wbbs (29 Jan 2012)

The bank are pretty much right about not being able to do anything to alter the mortgage without the other party consent.   They cannot change the repayments or term or anything without signatures from both account holders.   Are you talking at all?   Would he even attend the bank separately to you to sign whatever was required?


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## BlueMoon2 (29 Jan 2012)

He has refused to do so so far. It relates back to his name not being on the deeds any longer and he's angry he's still on the mortgage. I don't expect him to pay anything. It's very frustrating as he has me over a barrell. I can't even go interest only unless he fills out the forms. It's causing huge stress. I really need to find a way out of it and was hoping bankruptcy might be an option.


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## Bronte (30 Jan 2012)

BlueMoon2 said:


> I don't expect him to pay anything. It's very frustrating as he has me over a barrell. .


 
No he doesn't, you both didn't sort it out when you separated.  

Your current husband doesn't seem to be liable for anything based on what you've posed.  Would he be willing to take over the mortgage with you and get your ex off the mortgage and would the bank agree?  Ask your husband and then ask the bank.  He'd have to go on the deeds though and would he be willing to agree to the negative equity?  He must be paying something to the mortgage?

As it's the family home the bank have to deal with you under the Marp scheme, have they told you this?  Have you been told by the bank in writing that they will not agree to reduced payments?  Only correspond with the bank in writing.  

For the sake of sorting out this can you meet and discuss this with your ex, with a neutral party (mutual friend or relation of his/yours that you'd both be ok with )  Does he understand that he is still liable for the mortgage so that it is in his interest to get it sorted out, preferably with him coming off the mortgage, that carrot might work on him.  I you can't meet with him than try writing to him setting out the situation (calmly and politely)

You cannot go bankrupt.


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## 44brendan (30 Jan 2012)

As per Bronte's post, have you written to the Bank advising them of your financial position? If not, you should do so now. Assuming that the house is in negative equity, you should consider moving from this property to rented accomodation. You are currently in receipt of no income. The current position is a mess and would be very difficult to sort out without full co-operation from all parties. While the Bank might huff and puff about taking legal proceedings agianst you they are unlikely to do so given your financial position. They are not entitled to take any posessions from you or your property. I would recommend going to a "Good" solicitor on this. The solicitor can then advise the Bank that you are prepared to co-operate with them in handing back posession of the property, provided no legal proceedings are instigated against you. You are in a strong negotiating position here. 
1st decision to be made is whether you should leave this property.


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## BlueMoon2 (30 Jan 2012)

Thank you Bronte. My husband is unable to get a mortgage. We have tried this. He is working on a building site and his job isn't considered to be safe enough is my understanding. Also he wouldn't qualify for enough of a mortgage to cover the existing mortgage. He is though supporting us all on his income. That includes the mortgage which we have paid consistently over the years, apart from the 2 months where we literally couldn't afford it.

As far as I know the form my ex is unwilling to complete is the standard Marp form, detailing all income/expenditure. My ex and I were never married if that makes a difference.

I have tried communicating through letter with my ex but he's failed to respond. He is not inclined to worry about being liable or the mortgage as he walked away from it the month after it was drawn down and hasn't paid it all these years. (That's why his name was ordered to be removed from the deeds by the judge. His solicitor was meant to ensure his name also came off the mortgage. I rang the mortgage company after the court case and they needed his solicitor to write a letter with the judgement. I informed my ex. He didn't inform his solicitor and thinks I should have contacted his solicitor to tell him. I thought telling my ex was sufficient. So therefore we both hold the other at fault).

I haven't got it in writing that they refuse reduced payments, but I have over the phone and also in person when I attended a meeting in the bank recently.

Is the reason I can't go bankrupt because my husband is employed? Is his income seen as mine by the court?

44Brendan, thank you also. You think I'm in a strong negotiating position? Could it possibly be negotiated without the involvement and cost of a solicitor? I just wish the stress could end as its causing so many worries and sleepless nights.


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