# Unmarried Fathers Entitlements



## MrsRockstar (24 Sep 2010)

Hi there, 

My Partner and I are curious about his entitlements, basically, he has three children to his ex, and she had one child before there relationship.  We have the children every monday and every wednesday, followed by every second Friday and saturday and the opposite sunday.  

He isn't paying her maintaince, she isn't giving him any maintaince and not giving him any support for the child that isn't his, never mind the three that are. 

What is he entitled to? Or is he entitled to anything, from whta we can see, he isn't entitled to anything at all. 

Thanks, 
Mrs Rockstar


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## pinkyBear (24 Sep 2010)

> He isn't paying her maintaince, she isn't giving him any maintaince


 
He should be giving her maintenance, you have the children 2 days out of 7, what can I ask makes you think that his ex should be paying him maintenance???


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## MrsRockstar (24 Sep 2010)

*Read Correctly*



pinkyBear said:


> you have the children 2 days out of 7


 
If you read my post correctly, each parent has the children 3 days one week and 4 days the alternative week. Its fair, its even and the children are very much a part of each parents life. 

Why shouldn't she be paying maintaince or spliting the Child Benfit/Lone Parents and every other benefit she is on?  Considering the guardianship is split and its split for the child we have no legal responsibility for.  

PinkyBear, why do you think he should be giving her maintaince???


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## pinkyBear (24 Sep 2010)

Hi there,

your partner and ex, appear to have a good relationship re the kids, but see


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## MrsRockstar (24 Sep 2010)

They actually don't have a good relationship at all. But she enjoys her free time, so she is happy to oblige.


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## chasm (24 Sep 2010)

To qualify for a One-Parent Family Payment you must:  

Be the parent, step-parent, adoptive parent  or legal guardian of a qualified child. A qualified child is a  child under 18 years of age or aged 18-22 and in full-time education.
Be the main carer of at least one qualified child and that child must live with you. One-Parent Family Payment is not payable if a couple has joint equal custody of a child or children.
Have earnings of €425 or less per week
Satisfy a means test
Be habitually resident
Not be cohabiting (that is, living with someone as husband and wife).

So SW must class her as the main carer for SW purposes. I do not think she would be  obliged to pay your partner anything in maintainence tbh.
You would probably be better off talking to CIC or a solicitor.


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## MrsRockstar (24 Sep 2010)

We are heading to a solicitor in a couple of weeks, i was just looking to see if anyone had managed to get anything. 

I knew the law was unfair to fathers, but its ridicioius for a man who has his names on birth certs, and still has no guardianship/legal rights to his kids.  And can claim for nothing, considering the guardianship is equal.  

We  have asked her to sign visitation agreements, informally without the courts, and we have asked her to signed the Joint Guardianship Deeds in the courts and she will not give us the time of day in relation to either.  Which basically mean we are in no-mans land in relation to his kids and are acting as babysitters to her eldest child.  

This issue isn't around really her giving him money, because its not something we want, its more about just understanding whether or not there is anything that can be claimed for him.


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## pinkyBear (24 Sep 2010)

"Under Irish Law unmarried fathers do not have an automatic right to the day to day care of their children (known as custody) nor do they have an automatic right to a say in the upbringing of their children (known as Guardianship).

Nor do unmarried fathers have a right to joint custody. Rather they have a statutory right to apply for Guardianship, Custody or Joint Custody which will be determined according to the nature of the relationship between the child and the unmarried father."

That came from this [broken link removed], he is very lucky to have as much access to the kids as he does, given that fathers do not have much rights here in Ireland..


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## chasm (24 Sep 2010)

Yes unfortunately what Pinkybear says is correct.
Also im sorry to say this but their guardianship is not equal, as his ex has not signed any papers.


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## Bright (24 Sep 2010)

Word of waning Mrs Rockstar....if you go to through the courts, she will likley make a claim for maintenance, and more than likley be awarded same....I agree it seems unfair that she would get it, given the have the children for equal periods, but judges just seem to favour giving the mother maintenance for the children regardless....


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## MrsRockstar (24 Sep 2010)

Well these are all the things we are trying to tidy up without courts. We drafted copies of the visitation and provided them to her to sign which she did not, we asked her to jointly work the guardianship application and she has ignored the request. Yet she is happy to leave her kids in their fathers custody, its makes no sense.  

We are concerned about the eldest though because we have no legal rights at all over her, and no guardianship or anything we need to find out the best way to work with that issue.  Obviuously, we can't keep looking after the child, financing her, and being responsible for her, if we have no legal right to.  For things like travelling etc, it makes more sense. 

The one thing we do want to make clear is that we are happy with the arrangement and we would take them full time if we could.  The kids love living in their home, the ex is just being very difficult and refusing to comply with the simple things like guardianship and other arrangements as she won't speak or meet with us. 

The whole situation with unmarried fathers is so so so unfair, i never felt so strongly about it till i was in the situation and looking at a father who is broken over how backwards the legality of everything is.


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## Bright (24 Sep 2010)

MrsRockstar said:


> The whole situation with unmarried fathers is so so so unfair.


 
I agree, but that is our constitution for ya.  It only gives protection to the 'married' family!  Having said that, its not much better for married fathers, but at least they have automatic guardianship.


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## MrsRockstar (24 Sep 2010)

It makes you wonder at what point will things improve and at what point will the government realise that it would be more effective to protect the children and less costly on the state in paying out benefits if they were more open with the whole law.


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## babygirl (29 Sep 2010)

mrs rockstar maintenance isnt just assesed on the fact the kids spend equal amounts of time with both parents, it is based on who pays what for clothes, shoes, medical bills and all the other expense that comes with kids. since she has custody she is entilted to maintenance full stop!!

if you kick up a fuss you will be sorry, if she is as bad as you say she can easily just give your husband access 1 day a week and bring him to court and get maintenance. at the moment ye have an extremly cushy deal and what dose abit of paper about guardianship or access mean?? if you husband is denied access just bring her to court for it.

these children are your husbands and his exs not yours, you may love them like they are your own but i think you need to butt out and let your husband come to some kind of agreement with his ex without your involvment. 
alot of single mothers feel threatened when their kids have another 'mother figure' in their lives so maybe if you take a step back she may be more willing to agree to what your husband wants. i strongly suggest you do not contact her personaly


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## mrt (7 Oct 2010)

If hes not paying maintenance and is getting rights and access to the kids you should be very carefull some judge doesnt end up asking for years of back payments. It all comes across as very petty to me, and asking a judge to spilt state benefits from the mother of the children can only come across in one way.

If you go to a solitor here, so will she and her solitor will advise maintenance should be getting paid and should of been and she will seek it in court.


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## alaskaonline (7 Oct 2010)

MrsRockstar - my heart goes out to you. I agree on pretty much everything you stated here but I have to agree with mrt - take your distance when it comes to the communication between him & her. it won't give him any plus points and he might end up worse.

I know what you're going through and if it's any consolation, married fathers who separated aren't much better off than your partner. On paper it looks like it but in practice it isn't so. Enjoy the time you guys have the kids without any fuss.

Regarding maintenance, although it looks like you have the kids on equal amount of times, a judge would literally count down the hours to make a point that the mother minds the kids more often. It's unfair but you can't change the system (I think)


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## txirimiri (7 Oct 2010)

You are apparently happy with the arrangement and would take the children full time if you could yet you state in relation to the eldest _'obviously, we can't keep looking after the child, financing her, and being responsible for her, if we have no legal right to.'_

Are you suggesting that if you can't sort out a 'legal right' in respect of this child (which clearly you won't, as neither of you are biologically related to her), that you will stop having her live with you and her two siblings for half the week? Or that, if the children's mother doesn't give you some of her SW benefits (which are, after all, allocated to her by SW, not to you or your partner), you will try to fight this through the courts?

I would imagine that, theoretically, your partner should be entitled to part of the child benefit received for the two children that are his - let's say to half (although that really depends who pays school, health, clothing costs et al). That is 300 a month divided in half so 150

For 150 a month, you are prepared to enter a protracted legal battle with your partner's X? Using a solicitor (whose fees I imagine would be at least that per hour - plus VAT of course)? Potentially causing huge disruption, unhappiness and division to the children involved?

Why? Why? Why?

If your partner has his children's interests at heart, I can not imagine why he would do this.


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