# Can management company stop a Landlord from letting to problem tenants?



## L_earner (3 Jul 2009)

We have a small quiet apartment development.

Our management company has a problem with one landlord who never sets foot in the place. 

After three problem tenants in a row we were all weary of what might be coming next. So we offered to help the landlord to find tenants whose behaviour was likely to be more acceptable. He considered our offer but went ahead himself and let to the first people who came along. Their behaviour is so extreme that some of the other tenants in other apartments have decided to leave.

The anti-social behaviour of the problem tenants is so visible that as apartments fall vacant, no new tenants are moving in, despite the fact that the rents demanded have been lowered to ridiculous levels.

It is a really nice development by the way, where demand is usually fairly high.

Do we (the management company) have a way of restraining the problem landlord?

For example, is there any legal or administrative route we could follow that allows us to veto a landlord's letting decisions?

Any advice welcomed as we are really bothered about this.


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## round1 (3 Jul 2009)

A landlord is legally responsible for a tenants anti social behavior.

You are entitled as a third party to take a case against him through the PRTB. (see PRTB.ie). Perhaps a warning about this to him might be sufficient. 

It  would be esssential to document all examples of the tenants behavior and to document all contact with the landlord to show that he is ignoring your complaints and not taking any action to control tenant behavior. 

The web site has details of some of those third party cases from 2007 and 2008 that  might be of interest to you.


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## shesells (3 Jul 2009)

You can't stop him letting to whoever he wants HOWEVER there should be a clause in the original purchase documents that says the landlord is responsible for ensuring that their tenants comply with the development rules.

We have had one or two issues like this over the years and we pursue them. Letter to tenant and landlord after first offence then if necessary solicitors letter to landlord for being in breach of their lease agreement. We have found that to work.

The other option is to bring in "monetary sanctions" (note, do not use the word fine) which can be applied to unit accounts for breaches of development rules. Hit the landlord in his pocket.

Finally, is the unit registered with the PRTB? Are the tenants likely to be receiving rent allowance? Both of these can be followed up


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## round1 (3 Jul 2009)

A landlord is legally responsible for a tenant's anti social behavior. You are entitled as a third party to take a case against him through the PRTB. (see PRTB.ie). Perhaps a warning about this to him might be sufficient. It  would be esssential to document all examples of the tenants behavior and to document all contact with the landlord to show that he is ignoring your complaints and not taking any action to control tenant behavior. The web site has details of some of those third party cases from 2007 and 2008 that  might be of interest to you.


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## Trustmeh (3 Jul 2009)

Id like to offer a translation of this post, maybe you call it a read between the lines.
_


L_earner said:



			We have a small quiet apartment development. Our management company has a problem with one landlord who never sets foot in the place. After three problem tenants in a row we were all weary of what might be coming next. So we offered to help the landlord to find tenants whose behaviour was likely to be more acceptable.
		
Click to expand...

_Ive had "concerned" neighbors offer this before - what it means is that they didnt want ANY rent allowance tenants - even though that was the only people to answer any of the ads.  It means they wanted a "professional couple" to move or no one else (ie no students, no RA, no other races, travelers, etc etc)

_He considered our offer but went ahead himself and let to the first people who came along. Their behaviour is so extreme that some of the other tenants in other apartments have decided to leave.
The anti-social behaviour of the problem tenants is so visible that as apartments fall vacant, no new tenants are moving in, despite the fact that the rents demanded have been lowered to ridiculous levels._
So the rents were to high, some people have moved out as a result - and you have interpreted that to be because of anti-social behaviour.  How do new tenants know abotu the anti-social behaviour before they move in? are you standing outside with placards?

It is a really nice development by the way, where demand is usually fairly high.
_Do we (the management company) have a way of restraining the problem landlord? For example, is there any legal or administrative route we could follow that allows us to veto a landlord's letting decisions?
_Thankfully no.If its such a great place, and the rent is priced correctly_, _and the landlord lets the tenant do whatever he likes...why has he had 3 different tenants in a row?Are you renting or owning?


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## L_earner (3 Jul 2009)

yankinlk said:


> Id like to offer a translation of this post, maybe you call it a read between the lines.
> Ive had "concerned" neighbors offer this before - what it means is that they didnt want ANY rent allowance tenants - even though that was the only people to answer any of the ads. It means they wanted a "professional couple" to move or no one else (ie no students, no RA, no other races, travelers, etc etc)


You are presuming a lot here. As far as I am aware, all of the tenants fall into at least one of those categories.





yankinlk said:


> So the rents were to high, some people have moved out as a result - and you have interpreted that to be because of anti-social behaviour. How do new tenants know abotu the anti-social behaviour before they move in? are you standing outside with placards?


It is a small community. There has been some fighting, one attack, a few arrests, and one extremely violent incident. Word gets around.


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## Frasier (10 Jul 2009)

As was mentioned earlier, each apartment owner has, as part of their lease, accepted the 'house rules' of the development.  A landlord should attach these house rules to any letting agreement.  Whether he does of not is not your concern however.

At a recent AGM we had our house rules amended and agreed that an administration charge will be applied to any notification of breach of the house rules.  The charge will be applied to the apartment owners account and will be collected with the annual maintenance fee.


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## L_earner (11 Jul 2009)

Frasier said:


> At a recent AGM we had our house rules amended and agreed that an administration charge will be applied to any notification of breach of the house rules. The charge will be applied to the apartment owners account and will be collected with the annual maintenance fee.


Now, that is the type of clever, workable answer I was looking for. Thank you so much!


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## Complainer (11 Jul 2009)

Frasier said:


> At a recent AGM we had our house rules amended and agreed that an administration charge will be applied to any notification of breach of the house rules.  The charge will be applied to the apartment owners account and will be collected with the annual maintenance fee.


Who notifies who? Who validates whether the alleged breach is real, or imagined?


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## L_earner (11 Jul 2009)

Complainer said:


> Who notifies who? Who validates whether the alleged breach is real, or imagined?


We had a meeting last night and discussed this. We plan to use the definition of anti-social behaviour used by the PRTB, we would act only when there was a complaint from two or more people who were themselves directly affected, and where there is no doubt as to the address of the person alleged to have behaved in an anti-social manner. We will circulate the contact details of the management agency, who will document each complaint and verify them before forwarding details of the allegations. We plan that each verified incident will be reported separately to the landlord, who will incur one administration charge per incident. We plan to keep the administration charge quite low so that we are seen to be reasonable about this.


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## round1 (11 Jul 2009)

Looking at some of the anti-social behavior cases documented on the PRTB web site, it also seems important to formally notify the tenant as well with regard to concerns about their behavior.


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## longsightm13 (27 Jul 2009)

we have a similar problem to the OP in respect of anti-social behaviour. Our management company is still controlled by the developers (with an agent acting on their behalf) and there is a standard set of house rules in place. As a member of the management company what immediate powers (legal or otherwise) do I have to compel the directors and/or managing agent to enforce the house rules (with specific regard to anti-social begaviour)?
All advice appreciated.


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## 10amwalker (28 Jul 2009)

Our management company also had problems with anti-social behaviour and particularly with landlords not interested in how their tenants impacted on the rest of the residents. One of the first things to do find out is what representation is in place in the complex. If the developer is still in control you most likely have a residents committee; if the developer has handed over you most likely you will have a Board of Directors made up of members. Either way, approach the applicable one and request that they give strict instructions to the managing agent that the terms of the lease or if you have your own house rules, be enforced. 

A Board of Directors is entitled to determine that a monetary sanction can be applied to the service charge account for breaches of the house rules. The role of the Directors is effectively manage the company and if it is felt that a monetary sanction for breaches of house rules is in order they are entitled to enforce this decision.
In our case, we determined that a monetary sanction of €175 would be applied to landlord account. The breach of the house rules is notified by the Board and or Committee and a letter is sent to the landlord notifying of the breach by the managing agent.
In the majority of cases, the landlord then ensures that the behaviour of the tenants improve and for some tenants they don't like the strict enforcement of the house rules and they move on....
We are two years on now and the quality of our living environment has improved and I must add too the calibre of the tenant. The landlords are notified for such breaches as, noise after hours or the holding of a party, dumping of non domestic waste in bin bays, deliberate activation of fire alarm, advertising being erected, satellite dishes being erected. 
It is also useful to have the house rules displayed in the lobbies. We also send a copy of the house rules with the service charge invoices each year.

I hope this helps...


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## Yenjai (31 Dec 2010)

*Yes*, you can ask for the landlord's help in quieting the neighbor.* Standard rental and lease agreements contain a clause entitled "Quiet Enjoyment."* This clause gives tenants the right to occupy their apartments in peace and also imposes upon them the responsibility not to disturb their neighbors. *It's the landlord's job to enforce both sides of this bargain.*


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