# WRC



## Firefly (17 Sep 2015)

Well,

How far to people think we'll get? I have a wager on a buddy that we will NOT make the semi's. I hope we do and we should, but I just can't help think we'll run out of steam.....

Firefly.


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## Purple (18 Sep 2015)

I hope you are wrong. As long as New Zealand don't win I'll be happy... but they probably will.


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## Firefly (18 Sep 2015)

As a kid I used to love the All Blacks - they just had this mistique about them and they seem to always bring something new to the games. Now, really, they are just a corporate. I hope we get to the semis and even further, but I wouldn't rule out England either. 6 or 7 weeks of rugby....bliss!


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## Purple (18 Sep 2015)

I'd take England over New Zealand... that's how much I don't want them to win!
It's not the corporate stuff that gets me, it's the arrogance and the cheating and general stinking bad sportsmanship.


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## Jazz01 (18 Sep 2015)

All Blacks always play "on the line"... they have a huge weight behind them & that always seems to plays on ref's mind (thinking of the way France were robbed in last WC). 

Wondering with the level of expectation, on England, hamper them - there is HUGE pressure on them to not only do well, but to go all the way... 

Whatever happens, just hoping it'll be an exciting few weeks & Ireland do themselves proud...


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## Firefly (18 Sep 2015)

interesting (long) article about NZ here...

http://www.theguardian.com/sport/bl...ks-how-new-zealand-sustains-its-rugby-dynasty


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## Firefly (18 Sep 2015)

Daniell is an affable man, intelligent, with a thick French streak in his soul. He likes to live well. We drink far too much wine and my notes from the evening do not amount to much. A few things stick. Daniell explains that in New Zealand, “catch” and “pass” have almost come to be conflated into one word: “catchpass”. This is the fundamental skill, the first thing learned by kids, and still practised hard by the professionals. Daniell says a conspicuous difference between the teams he played with in Europe and those in New Zealand was the time spent drilling catching and passing.

My mind turns back to the conversation with Henry. We were discussing New Zealand’s famous win against Ireland in 2013, 24-22, sealed with an impossible try in injury time. “That great try,” Henry says. “I don’t know how many passes it took to make it. 25? Catch-pass. Catch-pass. Catch-pass.” If one pass had been misplaced, if one catch had been fumbled, the ball would have gone dead and the game would have been over. A simple skill, perfected.

Don't we all remember the pain, knowing that their composure with the ball would get them over the line!


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## Seagull (18 Sep 2015)

I hadn't realised there was an Irish driver in the WRC.


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## Purple (18 Sep 2015)

Seagull said:


> I hadn't realised there was an Irish driver in the WRC.


What are you talking about man; this isn't golf!


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## Duke of Marmalade (20 Sep 2015)

We don't meet Japan until the semis


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## Firefly (20 Sep 2015)

Put on the SA / Japan game yest after 20 mins or so just to check out SA and see what they were upto. WHAT A GAME. The whole lot of us were screaming for Japan at the end. The small one started jumping up and down "I know where Japan is on the map of the world"! 

Like Munster v All Blacks but on the biggest stage of all. So great for the game and hope Japan get the WRC now after coming so close against NZ before!


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## Firefly (20 Sep 2015)

South African coach [broken link removed] apologised to his country....

Speaking to reporters after the Pool B match at Brighton Community Stadium, Meyer said: “*I have to apologise to the nation*. It was just not good enough. It was unacceptable and I take full responsibility.”

It must be some sport in SA!!


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## mathepac (21 Sep 2015)

Could we clean this thread up please? The topic seems to be the Rugby World Cup (RWC) and not the FIA World Rally Championship (WRC) where by the way we have Chris Meeke from Dungannon driving for Citroen with co-driver Paul Nagle from Kerry.


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## Leper (21 Sep 2015)

While I'm not a fan of rugby, I have joined the rest of the population in hoping Ireland will perform well.  Listening to the Paul O'Connell interview after the match on Saturday I reckon the Irish players know of the weight of support for them.  Great to see underdogs Japan beating South Africa.  I saw nothing in Argentina V New Zealand to have us fear the All Blacks.  I saw enough though for us to fear Argentina (I understand if we qualify from our group we should be playing one or the other).

As for yer man above offering apologies to the people of SA for the defeat; it's pass-the-bucket stuff, afterall it's only a game. If we lose sight of this we might as well not participate.  But for "investment" I backed Scotland at 7/1 to win their group and I backed Wales at 25/1 to win the competition.


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## Purple (21 Sep 2015)

Japan's victory was the biggest upset in international Rugby history.
It was a fantastic match and it's worth noting that Japan won it, South Africa didn't lose it. The Springboks didn't play that badly. Japan just showed great intensity, handling skills, decision making and line speed.
Edit; I was also delighted to see a Referee handling New Zealand correctly. They richly reserved their two yellow cards. McCaw probably should have got one earlier. The best team in the world should not have to play off side and be so cynical and deliberate in now they fowl.


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## Jazz01 (21 Sep 2015)

Anyone feel that the TMO consultations were a bit much, ref's assistants on the side lines seemed to be afraid to make decisions at times - although I thought Barnes used it very efficiently yesterday (hurts to say it, I'm not a big fan of his). 



Purple said:


> They richly reserved their two yellow cards. McCaw probably should have got one earlier


so true - hopefully other refs won't be afraid to make the tough decisions...


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## Purple (21 Sep 2015)

Jazz01 said:


> Anyone feel that the TMO consultations were a bit much, ref's assistants on the side lines seemed to be afraid to make decisions at times - although I thought Barnes used it very efficiently yesterday (hurts to say it, I'm not a big fan of his).


Good strong Refs are fine. The problem is when the TMO thinks they are the ref. They should not interrupt play.


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## Firefly (21 Sep 2015)

It's a fine line with the TMO. To be honest, I think that unless it's used excessively then I think it's a good thing. Generally so far the TMO has been right and the stakes are so high with it being a world cup.

Japan were great - never say die. I was screaming for them to take the 3 points at the end, but fair play, they backed themselves. Also fair play to Stewart Barnes for standing up to NZ. Was watching it on ITV as the picture was better and they mentioned that with Conrad Smith and Ritchie McCaw both out for 10 mins, it was the most-capped Sin Bin of all time!


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## Firefly (21 Sep 2015)

I'd be worried about the Argies too - they were outplayed by NZ for sure, but they stuck it out to the end. Clear message for Ireland will be to not concede penalties, on ITV they were saying Sanchez had a higher conversion rate than Carter at something like 86%....


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## Jazz01 (21 Sep 2015)

Argentina were never pushovers & there is never any love lost between themselves & Ireland in rugby terms. Since they joined the old tri-nations, they are getting stronger & stronger.

Whoever Ireland get in the knock outs (_of course we'll get out of our group_!), it'll be tough games all the way! But before we get there, some exciting games ahead...


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## Purple (21 Sep 2015)

Firefly said:


> I'd be worried about the Argies too - they were outplayed by NZ for sure, but they stuck it out to the end. Clear message for Ireland will be to not concede penalties, on ITV they were saying Sanchez had a higher conversion rate than Carter at something like 86%....





Jazz01 said:


> Argentina were never pushovers & there is never any love lost between themselves & Ireland in rugby terms. Since they joined the old tri-nations, they are getting stronger & stronger.
> 
> Whoever Ireland get in the knock outs (_of course we'll get out of our group_!), it'll be tough games all the way! But before we get there, some exciting games ahead...


Argentina were never pushovers and now that they have someone who can kick the ball they can convert their strong pack performance into points.


The coverage on TV3 is crap and ITV is worse.

I miss RTE and the BBC. Even Sky would be better.


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## Firefly (21 Sep 2015)

Jazz01 said:


> Whoever Ireland get in the knock outs (_of course we'll get out of our group_!), it'll be tough games all the way! But before we get there, some exciting games ahead...



We'll have some nice, designer Italian kitchen sink thrown at us first!!


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## Firefly (21 Sep 2015)

Purple said:


> I miss RTE and the BBC. Even Sky would be better.



I don't mind TV3 to be honest. I find the analysis a lot better than what George Blabbering Hook & Co come out with (except Conor O'Shea).  It's the picture quality that gets me - can barely see the ball!


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## Purple (21 Sep 2015)

Firefly said:


> I don't mind TV3 to be honest. I find the analysis a lot better than what George Blabbering Hook & Co come out with (except Conor O'Shea).  It's the picture quality that gets me - can barely see the ball!


I agree on the picture quality and on George Hook but the rest of the panel/panels RTE use are good.


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## Firefly (21 Sep 2015)

Japan were 100/1 against SA....that would have been a LOVELY 20 spot!


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## Duke of Marmalade (11 Oct 2015)

Today's game was fought with the intensity of a knock out match when all that was at stake was to avoid NZ and play Argentina.  The organisers were taking a risk.  Imagine Argentina had finished on top of its group - we would have had one hell of a strange game today.  FIFA avoid this by ensuring final games in groups be played simultaneously.


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## Jazz01 (12 Oct 2015)

Yes, but getting a perceived "weaker" team to play against in the knock out stages, then there is that extra motivation to top your group. Everything & anything to progress  Wales V Australia was the same, look at the intensity at that match & the desire to top the group, option of playing Scotland... 

Some mighty weekend of ruggers all the same ... & hopefully more to follow this coming w'end... some fantastic atmosphere in Cardiff ...


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## Duke of Marmalade (12 Oct 2015)

My point is that the organisers were taking a chance with the scheduling.  Obviously not much of a chance - but Scotland could have topped that group (if _Leper_ hadn't backed them to do so).  I don't think I have ever seen any game played in any code were both teams wanted to lose but that is what would have happened if either Scotland or Argentina had topped their groups.  A game with both teams wanting to lose would have brought rugby into serious disrepute.


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## so-crates (13 Oct 2015)

I dunno, I suspect Schmidt is not as fearful of NZ as some other people would be. They have to be faced by someone and they are neither indomitable or unbeatable. I think he would have prioritised rest for the physical benefit and topping the group for the psychological benefit. One place it would have made a difference is I think the butcher's bill. If winning had meant facing NZ I think France and Saint-André would have been less inclined to risk their own players in injuring ours.


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## Leper (13 Oct 2015)

Duke of Marmalade said:


> My point is that the organisers were taking a chance with the scheduling.  Obviously not much of a chance - but Scotland could have topped that group (if _Leper_ hadn't backed them to do so).



I know I put the hex on Scotland.  But, my 25/1 bet on Wales (to win)is still alive albeit hanging by a thread.  So having seen Paddy Power's odd for a draw in each of the (quarter finals) Ireland game  (18/1)and Wales game (18/1) I think I'll have a little bet on both.  Well, we haven't had a draw in this tournament yet!


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## Sophrosyne (14 Oct 2015)

Great game on Sunday; unbelievable second half!

But I am gutted for Paul O'Connell.


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## Firefly (15 Oct 2015)

This morning's Gift Grub was, I think, the funniest one I have ever heard! Really cracked me up & well worth a listen.


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## Firefly (16 Oct 2015)

Anyone else find the lack of build-up re the Argentina match a bit weird? Almost as if it's a done deal. We could be in for a longer day at the office than we think. Argentina put it up against NZ and they must surely be gunning for a semi-final spot themselves....


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## Jazz01 (16 Oct 2015)

wondering if there is a lack of build up as there are no mid week games? 

Far from a done deal against Argentina, who look impressive in their overall play so far... it will be a very tough game and no doubt they aren't taking us lightly either... it'll be another savage battle, expecting more injuries after this one though. Wondering what's up with Cronin & his lack of game time - would think his ball carrying & running would be needed with O'Brien, O'mahony out...


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## Leper (17 Oct 2015)

I don't know too much about rugby (as can be seen from my failing small wagers in Paddy Power).  However, I am caught up in the managers of different teams.  I read in today's newspaper that Joe Schmidt is a teacher; Stuart Lancaster is a teacher also.  Then Cheika etc all have tales to tell. Then I read that when Joe Schmidt was at Leinster and informed his team that there would be no wearing of jeans going to Away matches (track suits only) and blazers and neat dress were required after the game. In the current campaign some Irish player(s) lost their hotel room keys (which were found by staff) and nicely Schmidt informed them that if you are sloppy off the field you are sloppy on the field.  No big deal, but our Joe pays a lot of attention to detail.  Where there is friction between players he matches them during training sessions.  He is big on discipline too. Stupid mistakes are pointed out in a matter-of-fact way.  He informs his players of their weaknesses and strengths. The week starts on the negative aspects of the team and incrementally ends on all things positive.  His management team compile five strengths and five weaknesses of each player of the opposition.  Joe Schmidt appears to be an ordinary decent guy who gets the best out of his players. I must say I have got caught up with the tournament and look forward to today's and tomorrow's games.

I looked at Stuart Lancaster too.  How can he remain almost motionless and expressionless at each of England's games.  It appears he has no support from England's Rugby Body.  The England supporters thought they would win the Rugby World Cup.  The money poured into the England set-up was greater than any other team.  England has the greatest choice of players. They have talent also. They beat Ireland in the warm-ups, lost to France and although performed well against Wales in the WC but for some reason stole defeat from the jaws of victory.

I think Joe Schmidt is right - Being sloppy off the field means being sloppy on the field.  We all could learn valuable lessons from the Irish Coach.


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## Delboy (18 Oct 2015)

Irish rugby....all hype and no substance. A triumph of Marketing, with the help of the Irish media.

So much talk, so much noise for the past few months. Rinse and repeat in 3yrs, 6months from now


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## Firefly (18 Oct 2015)

Delboy said:


> Irish rugby....all hype and no substance. A triumph of Marketing, with the help of the Irish media.
> 
> So much talk, so much noise for the past few months. Rinse and repeat in 3yrs, 6months from now



A bit harsh I think. Any team losing their talisman captain, one of the top 3 out halves and a worker-bee would have struggled against that side. Credit due to Argentina, they were great today, but I've always felt that 1-15 we are great, but the dept isn't quite there. 

Going mad for Scotland too. 

Seems like a big gulf has opened up (again) between North & South hemispheres too.


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## Leper (19 Oct 2015)

Fair Dues to Argentina; they went into the game as underdogs while Ireland were 1/2 and still won handsomely with lots more in the tank.  I hope they go on more and send more fancied teams home.

Would I condone decisions to allow my grandchildren play rugby?  From what happened to O'Connell, O'Mahony and Sexton (and let's throw in O'Brien) in the same match versus France I would have to say "No" - Sport is Sport, what those four suffered could not be even remotely called Sport.


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## Ceist Beag (19 Oct 2015)

Very harsh Delboy. We badly missed O'Mahony, O'Brien and Sexton out there today. We probably coped ok without Paulie on the day but who knows what difference his leadership on the pitch might have made as well. We don't have the depth to cope with those losses.
However all that said, I think what this weekend showed is that the Six Nations teams need to rethink their style of rugby. This idea of slamming into each other for 80 minutes can't really be sustained, especially against teams who can not only match the physicality but who then have players who can play a bit as well! Fair play to Argentina, their ball carrying yesterday was brilliant. They had runners all over the pitch. I do think if we have O'Brien and O'Mahony in there we would have won more ball and with Sexton we could have controlled play better but ultimately I think we were always going to struggle to contain Argentina yesterday.


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## DB74 (19 Oct 2015)

Duke of Marmalade said:


> Today's game was fought with the intensity of a knock out match when all that was at stake was to avoid NZ and play Argentina.  The organisers were taking a risk.  Imagine Argentina had finished on top of its group - we would have had one hell of a strange game today.  FIFA avoid this by ensuring final games in groups be played simultaneously.



Few days late with this but there's nothing that could be done about this. FIFA play the final group matches in each group simultaneously, not the final group matches of every group so the exact same scenario could just as easily happen in a FIFA World Cup


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## Purple (21 Oct 2015)

I watched the France New Zealand game on Saturday night and I knew afterwards that we were going to be stuffed by Argentina. We struggles to beat France for long periods of the game and New Zealand blew them away. In their pool games the only team that challenged them was Argentina. The speed over the ball of both teams and ability to break the line and offload in the tackle is vastly superior to anything we could cope with. I really don’t think we could have won that game, even with a full strength team. Maybe on another day with a different Argentine performance but against that team playing as they did we would be beaten every day of the  week and twice on Sunday.


I think Joe is a great coach, possibly the best in the world, but it is disappointing to see how Ireland play in comparison to how his Leinster team played. Leinster played an expansive offloading game where they ran at space and did the basics superbly well. They played like a New Zealand team. The only player who did that against Argentina was Luke Fitzgerald and he stood out in an otherwise underwhelming Irish performance.


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