# Rent a room scheme - chasing up a former lodger for €s



## serotoninsid (27 Jun 2011)

I have been renting rooms in my house for over 5 years now.  

I guess I got a bit complacent and for the last couple of lads I didn't take a deposit (yeah, I know!  ).  

Anyways, guy left and had been on to him for the past year to get a window fixed/replaced (he broke the  outer pane in a double glazed window).  Have been ringing him - and the usual ...no answer (although I can find him if I have to?).

Question is this - can I file a case with small claims or district court with regard to this?


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## DrMoriarty (27 Jun 2011)

Small claims court is only for claiming against businesses, not individuals. 

I'd suggest you write him a letter and indicate that you don't want to take him to court but are prepared to if he doesn't reimburse you. Spell out the precise dates of the breakage and of subsequent attempts at contact. Give him a reasonable timeframe to reply/make payment, after which you'll instruct your solicitor. Might be worth paying €2 to register the letter.


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## SPUDZ (27 Jun 2011)

Is it really worth your time and trouble? Just get it fixed, learn from the experience and let it go.Life is too short...don't sweat the small stuff.


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## serotoninsid (28 Jun 2011)

DrMoriarty said:


> Small claims court is only for claiming against businesses, not individuals.


I thought I'd read something to that effect on aam before -thanks.



DrMoriarty said:


> I'd suggest you write him a letter and indicate that you don't want to take him to court but are prepared to if he doesn't reimburse you. Spell out the precise dates of the breakage and of subsequent attempts at contact. Give him a reasonable timeframe to reply/make payment, after which you'll instruct your solicitor. Might be worth paying €2 to register the letter.


Will do.  He's the type not to sign for registered post - but I guess in the grand scheme of things, it doesn't matter?
If he claims that he has no knowledge of it (I don't have any witnesses), where would that scenario be likely to leave me? (just thinking of potential pitfalls).


			
				SPUDZ said:
			
		

> Is it really worth your time and trouble? Just get it fixed, learn from the experience and let it go.Life is too short...don't sweat the small stuff.


Your taking the pragmatic view and I suppose that's the intelligent way of looking at it.  However, I'm sorry but I can't let it go.  I decided to be more flexible than I ever had been with any previous lodgers and I paid the price accordingly (not just with this - but in general).  It's frustrating when  you go out of your way to accommodate people - and all they see that as is a weakness to be exploited.  
I will learn from the experience - but by having to go to this trouble - that will be my lesson.  His lesson will be to have taken me as a soft touch in the first instance.


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## Bronte (28 Jun 2011)

How much did this window pane cost to get fixed.  Think you should move on and learn to always have a deposit and put it down to experience, it is not worth the hassle.


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## dereko1969 (28 Jun 2011)

serotoninsid said:


> I thought I'd read something to that effect on aam before -thanks.
> 
> 
> Will do. He's the type not to sign for registered post - but I guess in the grand scheme of things, it doesn't matter?
> ...


 
Sorry but perhaps I'm mis-reading this but how can you be certain he was the one that caused the damage? Was it mentioned at the time of the incident? If it hadn't been pointed out to him before he left, he's quite entitled to think that you might be pulling a fast one.

I'd agree with others and let it go.


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## nigey (28 Jun 2011)

I agree with the other posters. It may be annoying but i'm assuming it wasn't a huge amount of money. Just make sure with any new lodgers you do take a deposit so you don't end up ion the same position again.


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## serotoninsid (28 Jun 2011)

Bronte said:


> How much did this window pane cost to get fixed.


It wasn't fixed.  It's still as is.



			
				dereko1969 said:
			
		

> Sorry but perhaps I'm mis-reading this but how can you be certain he was the one that caused the damage?


I came home - and he drew it to my attention immediately.  He had been horse-playing around with some friends of his that he had round - and that was the result.



			
				dereko1969 said:
			
		

> If it hadn't been pointed out to him before he left, he's quite entitled to think that you might be pulling a fast one.


As above - and he had immediately said he would get it sorted - that he knew someone in a local window co....etc. etc.   It came up in conversation a couple of times - and he said he would get it sorted.



			
				dereko1969 said:
			
		

> I'd agree with others and let it go.





			
				nigey said:
			
		

> I agree with the other posters. It may be annoying but i'm assuming it wasn't a huge amount of money.





			
				Bronte said:
			
		

> put it down to experience, it is not worth the hassle.


I don't know what it cost lads and I see where your coming from.  However, If I can establish that I can squeeze the cash out of him via the court system - then I will do it.  It may prevent some other innocent bystander from being tested with the same pathetic behaviour (ie. I'm no millionaire but it's only 50% motivated by the money - the rest on principal).

My only concern now is that he claims that he didn't do it and what implications that would have....


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## tvman (28 Jun 2011)

Even getting legal advice, not to mind going to court, will cost you a multiple of the value of the window and with no guarantee of success.


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## serotoninsid (28 Jun 2011)

tvman said:


> Even getting legal advice, not to mind going to court, will cost you a multiple of the value of the window and with no guarantee of success.


Well, I don't mind the former - if I can establish that I stand to get a result.  That's the only thing that I'm concerned about (and it may well be that the fact that I am serious about persuing that option will bring him to his senses).


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## oldnick (28 Jun 2011)

Is this a fair summary of this thread ?

1. A tenant broke a window pane.
2. He broke it a year ago and you still have not had it replaced.
3. You have not even found out the cost of having it replaced.
4. You cannot prove in a court of law that it was the tenant.
5. All the comments received so far are telling you to drop the matter and move on.

Is there something that you may have overlooked to tell us that makes you still think that everyone is wrong ?


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## serotoninsid (28 Jun 2011)

oldnick said:


> Is this a fair summary of this thread ?


Eh - with your spin on it, NO!



oldnick said:


> 1. A tenant broke a window pane.


The outer pane of a double glazed window has a crack running through it.  The inner pane is intact.


oldnick said:


> He broke it a year ago and you still have not had it replaced.


He broke it 9-10 months ago. It wasn't replaced as when he told me about it, he said he would get it sorted.  He was reminded of it every now and again between then and now (and he only moved out recently).


oldnick said:


> 3. You have not even found out the cost of having it replaced.


relevance?? See above.


oldnick said:


> 4. You cannot prove in a court of law that it was the tenant.


I am trying to establish whether this is the case - and if it is legally as black and white as that.  The guy admitted to breaking it.  On another occasion, the guy retold the story - the only time the story was retold in front of a witness - but then that was his best mate.


oldnick said:


> 4. You cannot prove in a court of law that it was the tenant.


This is the point that I was looking for constructive input on ie. as to whether it's as clearcut as that - and that the above is the case.


oldnick said:


> All the comments received so far are telling you to drop the matter and move on.


My reading of the comments of others was that it 'wasn't worth the time and effort required'.  As I have outlined, I'm prepared to go through whatever hoops need to be gone through in order for the right thing to come about.  The only thing that I am pondering is No.4.


oldnick said:


> Is there something that you may have overlooked to tell us that makes you still think that everyone is wrong ?


Clearly there is.  At what point did I say 'everyone is wrong'? In fact if you go back and read what I posted, you will see that I recognised the point that one of the first posters made as the pragmatic approach.  I also explained why I was motivated enough to do whatever has to be done to get this "person" to do the right thing.

If anyone has any opinions as to whether point 4 stands then, I would be very grateful for your opinions.


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## SPUDZ (28 Jun 2011)

It seems you have made your decison already...you are going after this guy at all costs.While my own personal opinion is to just forget about it...I understand your feelings regarding chasing it on principal.It seems to me from your posts...it is not about the money....you are motivated by the principal of the thing and making sure the guy does what is right...particularly as he said he would get it fixed...a man is only as good as his word and all that. So with that in mind...I would advise tracking him down first...you said you can find him if needed? Go and find him...tell him you will not let it go...and if he doesn't cough up...he will be hearing from your solicitor.If necessary follow up with a solicitor letter...but the threat of the letter will possibly be enough..unless it is a very unsavory character you are dealing with.Why did he move out?...how was your relationship while living with him?...Was he usually a decent bloke...but maybe is avoiding you as he just does not have the cash and cannot afford to pay?The answers to these questions will give you a good indication of how far you will have to go to resolve this.Good Luck...but bear in mind...he knows where you live...so depending on the character you are dealing with....you mite end up with more than one broken window once you get the law involved.


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## serotoninsid (28 Jun 2011)

SPUDZ said:


> It seems you have made your decison already...you are going after this guy at all costs.While my own personal opinion is to just forget about it...I understand your feelings regarding chasing it on principal.It seems to me from your posts...it is not about the money....you are motivated by the principal of the thing and making sure the guy does what is right...particularly as he said he would get it fixed...a man is only as good as his word and all that. So with that in mind...I would advise tracking him down first...you said you can find him if needed? Go and find him...tell him you will not let it go...and if he doesn't cough up...he will be hearing from your solicitor.


Yes, this is what I had in mind.  On first instance, he's avoiding me and not answering my calls but I guess the next step will be go find him (which isn't that difficult).


SPUDZ said:


> How was your relationship while living with him?...Was he usually a decent bloke...but maybe is avoiding you as he just does not have the cash and cannot afford to pay?


Got on with him fine and left on (otherwise) good terms.  Well it's possible that he's bad with cash (he's no millionaire but he's earning regularly...but might not be great with managing his money). I suppose this was the reason I allowed it to linger so long ( a mistake in hindsight).  Then again, that's never stopped him from cutting his entertainment budget (and i'd wager he wouldn't mind if I 'forgot' about it permanently)


SPUDZ said:


> Good Luck...but bear in mind...he knows where you live...so depending on the character you are dealing with....you mite end up with more than one broken window once you get the law involved.


Meh...i'm not bothered about that (albeit the point is well made...if I was dealing with a proper scumbag, then I guess I'd leave well enough alone!).


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## oldnick (29 Jun 2011)

Other than everyone's advice to drop the matter the next best advice was the immediate reply from Dr Moriarty post 2, which basically suggested.....

... if you really want to pursue someone who ( you claim without legal proof) cracked a window pane a year ago then the only legal recourse is a letter accompanied by an invoice and ,if you are really that serious, a promise of  legal action. 

The contents and tone of your comments thus far are slightly worrying, especially 
any suggestion that "you'll go find this person" . 
You've already asked him.  Turning up at his home/place of work or wherever, may be construed as harrasment.


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## serotoninsid (29 Jun 2011)

oldnick said:


> Other than everyone's advice to drop the matter the next best advice was the immediate reply from Dr Moriarty post 2, which basically suggested.....
> 
> ... if you really want to pursue someone who ( you claim without legal proof) cracked a window pane a year ago then the only legal recourse is a letter accompanied by an invoice and ,if you are really that serious, a promise of  legal action.


Sure - 'Dr. Moriarty' made a _constructive_ point on how the problem could be tackled.  I'm appreciative for it and intend to follow it in the first instance - although I might meet the individual first and give them one more chance to do the right thing.  As regards 'you claim without legal proof..' - I recognise an issue here - but it may not be.  Are you a legal expert on these matters?


oldnick said:


> The contents and tone of your comments thus far are slightly worrying, especially any suggestion that "you'll go find this person".


Your reading into something that's not there. If you go back and re-read - we _otherwise_ got on quite well and there was another specific reason for his leaving - nothing related to me or the house he shared with me and others.  I don't think it unreasonable to give him every opportunity to do what he should.




oldnick said:


> You've already asked him.  Turning up at his home/place of work or wherever, may be construed as harrasment.


Harrassment?  Are you for real?  According to your logic, I could get someone in to fit said window and have them present me with an invoice, follow up with calls for payment, call round to me requesting payment - and me ignoring my responsibilities in this regard would be fine?

The difference between your viewpoint and that of others is that others have given their opinion - a pragmatic view - that its not worth the hassle.  Your's seems to be quite different.  Ironically, I'm not one that goes looking for the moral highground, but not paying bills I find morally reprehensible and this is a micro-example of what happens with small companies throughout the country.


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## DB74 (29 Jun 2011)

serotoninsid said:


> ... but not paying bills I find morally reprehensible and this is a micro-example of what happens with small companies throughout the country.



Why is your location set to "burn the bondholders" then?


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## serotoninsid (29 Jun 2011)

DB74 said:


> Why is your location set to "burn the bondholders" then?


Talk about going off topic!! - but if you must ask - I don't feel that we - as tax payers have any responsibility when it comes to ANY privately owned bank (of which they all were).  I believe that we should have followed Iceland (although I accept I have only a laymans understanding of the whole thing and that things have got a hell of a lot more complicated since...but way back then - that's the position that should have been taken).
If you want to dispute that, please open up another thread (but while we're here, if you held a referendum in the morning on it, what do you think the resounding answer would be?  Bank debt is not your debt or my debt.   Furthermore, bondholders are not the same as deposit holders! And I didn't have any shareholding in any of those companies (like most irish people) so it's not our debt!!


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## AlbacoreA (29 Jun 2011)

A deposit covers these breakages, and also is your leverage to get someone to pay. Without that, your snookered. Unless you go the legal routes, which isn't economically viable. Though a legal letter might be all the nudging the tenant needs. If not considering some Landlords lose thousands if not tens of thousands to tenant, I'd consider it a sharp lesson to do things properly in the future.


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## polarbear (30 Jun 2011)

Jumping in with my two cents worth. You could repair the window and send  the invoice on with a letter appealing to your ex tenant's better  nature. Perhaps even a suggestion of small payments until it was paid  off? If you were happy to have him your house as a tenant once upon a  time, he can't be that bad? Without witnesses to attest to seeing the  tenant damage your window and promise to carry out repairs, I think it  might be thrown out of court and you might even be charged for wasting  their time? As frustrated as I understand you must feel, personally if  this happened to me, I would put it down to experience, learn from it  and move on if I failed to resolve it amicably. The cost to me  personally in terms of time, ongoing conflict dealing with solicitors  and courts etc., would far outweigh the cost of repairing the window.  Life's too short.


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## serotoninsid (30 Jun 2011)

@polarbear - thanks.  I have started to look at the cost of replacement now.  Think I will do that first and see what the (financial) damage is in the first instance.


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