# JB to JA Q's on JA Assesment Form



## Allison1707 (19 May 2011)

Dear All,

My husband has been taken off JB after 15mths on. He works casual but has only gotten 2 days work in the last six weeks. He is now going to be assessed / means tested for JA. Ive a few questions if anyone might be able to advise I would be very grateful.

Capital - We have a few thousand saved, will this be assessed?
Childrens allowance - I have a seperate special saver account with the Post Office is this to be included in the bank account declaration or is Child Benifit exempt?
On the JA form it says he can sign back to JB if he has an additional 13wks paid contributions or something to that affect. This is confusing as he has been casual so does that not mean that every week he works even if its only for one day, his employer should be paying a PRSI contribution on his behalf? Therefore if he has worked on adverage 7 hours a week from wk 1 to wk 19 he would be over this 13wks? 

He has only worked 13.5hrs/2days in the last six weeks but since wk 1 worked 150hrs how is his weekly earnings worked out?

Is he still classed as a casual worker now if he is denied JA? As in does he still have to fill out the sheets every week as he is available to work on the other days he is not employed? He is in an industry that jobs are few and far between so extra days might only happen comming up to xmas and valentines day.

Im in a good job with a modest 30K income so I dont think he will get anything for the days he is unemployed as my earnings, before tax and usc etc.. are going to be taken into consideration for the means test. Why do they ask for gross earnings when the usc and tax substantially reduce take home pay?

We have two babies, mortgage, childcare bills etc... Im lucky so far we have been able to manage but if we now go to only one income i dont know how long it will be before bill start to slide.

Any comments gratefull.


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## Ildánach (19 May 2011)

There's a few issues there.

Firstly there is the re-qualification rules which are quite complex.   The 13 weeks have to be after the claimant has exhausted 156 days of the  Jobseekers Benefit.  If he has the 13 weeks after that time, then he  should requalify.  If this is the case, it may be that they miss  this, so he should contact them and ask them to confirm if they have  done the necessary calculations to determine if he requalifies.

If he doesn't have the necessary contributions, then for means test the  first 20,000 is disregarded.  However there is no exemption for savings  from any particular source, it doesn't matter that the savings came from  child benefit, so these savings will be included in the total amount.   Savings over 20,000 do affect payment, although there is a sliding  scale, as set out here  http://www.citizensinformation.ie/e...ocial_welfare_payments/means_test.html#lba223

As for your income, you may be surprised, with your income of 30,000 he  should still be eligible for a reduced payment.  They do not deduct  income tax or USC when calculating entitlement to Jobseekers, only PRSI,  pension contribs/levy and union dues, but he should still get a payment  even if means tested.

The other thing to look at is Family Income Supplement, which does take  into account income tax and USC.   http://www.welfare.ie/EN/Schemes/BirthChildrenAndFamilies/ChildRelatedPayments/Pages/fis.aspx


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## Allison1707 (20 May 2011)

Ildanach, thank you so much for your reply and links. 
He will ask them about the 13wks so fingers crossed and we are going to look into the FIS. Our total savings including the CB account are under 25k so the means test on the capital as per your link isnt as harsh as I thought. I was under the impression that you had to spend all savings before you would get €1 off the SW. 

Would you have any thoughts on how to calculate his weekly earnings? He is paid hourly and has worked 149 hrs since Jan 1st.

Im sure im not alone but why do we have the mentality of feeling like a beggar and feeling shamefull when enquiring into these things? The thoughts of us having to apply for FIS is sad but needs must.

Thank you again


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## Ildánach (20 May 2011)

Don't feel like a beggar.  You're only having to go to the State for help because employers are not providing a living wage.  There is no shame in asking for help.

As for the income

http://www.welfare.ie/EN/OperationalGuidelines/Pages/fis.aspx
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			Calculation of average family income
		
Click to expand...

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> If a person is paid weekly or fortnightly, his/her weekly income is  based on the weekly average of assessable earnings in the 4 week period  before s/he makes a claim.
> If a person is paid monthly, his/her average weekly income is worked  out using weekly average assessable earnings in the 2 month period  before s/he makes a claim.
> If a person's spouse/civil partner/ cohabitant is self-employed,  his/her income over the 12 month period before the claim is made  (divided by 52) is used to work out his/her average weekly income.
> However, where the above periods would not reflect a true assessment  of income, a Deciding Officer or an Appeals Officer may choose a more  representative period as the basis of calculation. The most recent P60  is often used to calculate the average income from employment.



The key is what is a representative period for your husband's earnings.  For casual work they are likely to start with a 12 month period and look at the average, unless you can persuade them that the past 12 months is not representative, for example if business has slowed down over the past six months.  If there is no sign of things picking up, then you could ask for the past six weeks, or perhaps 2 months to be used.


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## Allison1707 (20 May 2011)

Travon, thanks 

Ildanach,
Im very grateful for all your help. Thank you.

On the income, his main working months are Nov+Dec and he could be in as much as 4-5days per week but come the new year he dosent get much work untill maybe the week or two before valentines day and then nothing much after that, as this year he has been only been in for two days in the last six weeks. On the income side a problem with payslips is that his earnings in Dec are only paid in Jan along will all accumlated Holiday pay from previous year as he dosent take holidays. So it looks like he earned a fortune in Jan even though he didnt get one days work then.
His P60 from last year will show under 7K in earnings and id say we will be the same for this year if not less.
On my side I was on maternity leave and upon return, a 10%pay cut + 3 day week for a few months last year, so my P60 is only at €25k. This year ive been fortunate that im full time so far and earnings are expected to be €30-31k for this year. I will disclose everthing and hope for a P60 review for us both.

Again thank you and how on earth do you know and remember all of this?? Id be like homer and anthing new pushes old stuff out of my brain!!


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