# Conor Cunningham ... hero?



## WicklowMan (17 Nov 2011)

Hi all,

As pretty much everyone has heard, a Corkonian made his way into the grounds in Tallin without paying during the Ireland match: http://www.independent.ie/national-...ame-by-donning-estonia-tracksuit-2937536.html

As I read it, he (by his own admission):

Stole a tracksuit
Lied to the officials
Trespassed 

All over the net the general concensus seems to be "fair play to him" and "Legend" but I have to say I find this reaction entirely depressing. Maybe I'm missing something here, but I see little difference between what Mr. Cunningham did and dressing up as a utility worker, going into a jewellers, and pocketing a watch worth €600 on the way out.

Because this makes what the majority deem an endearing story no one really looks at this. As a nation that suffered, and is going to suffer plenty more due to 'parish pump politics', do we ever learn? There's something really wrong with the way Irish people think. Far from being a hero, this guy makes me mildly embarassed to be Irish.

Apart from myself being labelled a hater (and many other things on boards ... but then again what would you expect on there) few people seem to see past the "sure there was no harm done" line. Well, someone somewhere is out of pocket because of Mr. Cunningham! 

I recall a friend of mine in Germany in the mid '90's. He told me an Irish fella evaded his fare on the train and decided to leg it when the Transport policeman told him to stop. He was gifted a limp for the rest of his life as a reward. Now we can slag off the Germans for being pedantic (along with a bit of racism about WW2 perhaps?) but which country in Europe is calling the shots? Indeed could there be a connection between us having the "sponger is a 'Legend'" attitude and the fact that we're the worst basket case going?


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## Marion (17 Nov 2011)

It's a similar copycat story to the guy who cheated his way into the All Ireland final photo wearing a jersey of a Dublin player.

It's all a bit tabloid! 

In my book, not a Hero!

Marion


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## thedaras (17 Nov 2011)

I admit,I did think it was funny when he handed the ball to the player.
But ,I see where you are coming from.In so far as there were many who struggled to pay for a legitimate ticket,and someone else gets in for nothing and comes home a hero,with an Estonia track suit ..


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## DerKaiser (18 Nov 2011)

WicklowMan said:


> Well, someone somewhere is out of pocket because of Mr. Cunningham!



Yeah, the tout that could have extorted €600 out of him for a €14 ticket is out of pocket and he owes the Estonian FA a tracksuit!


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## MrMan (18 Nov 2011)

So you see people finding a little bit of humour in a guy blagging his way in to a match that should have cost him €14 as a symptom of the ills in Irish society, yet you seem to have some admiration for a German transport official dishing out violence? 
I wouldn't consider you a 'hater' but I do think you are reading far too much into what is a handy news story that piggybacks the feelgood factor of euro qualification.


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## micmclo (18 Nov 2011)

He's a blagger, has the gift of the gab and knows how to extract something for nothing 

Vote Cunningham for the Dáil 
We can send him "up to Dublin" to look after us and get some goodies for the area


Anyway I suppose Wicklowman, maybe a lot of people admire the rogue. See a man be cute and cheat and think shure I'd do the same myself
The whole basis of Irish politics going back to the British times was to extract every goodie you can for your area. And so it carries on


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## zztop (18 Nov 2011)

So by robbing an orchard I am a thief?


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## Superman (18 Nov 2011)

zztop said:


> So by robbing an orchard I am a thief?



Yes.


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## Purple (18 Nov 2011)

zztop said:


> So by robbing an orchard I am a thief?



Yes, of course you are. What else could you be described as for stealing something that doesn't belong to you?


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## dereko1969 (18 Nov 2011)

Purple said:


> Yes, of course you are. What else could you be described as for stealing something that doesn't belong to you?


 
But sure it belongs to "the man" so of course he's not a thief, oh no, it actually belongs to a normal person.

Everyone talks about there being this great sense of community in Ireland with our local/parish pride but it always comes at the expense of someone else. 

I've said it before, we're a nation of children always looking for someone to be against - first the "brits", then the free-staters, then "them" up there in dublin which means the government elected by all of us.

It's "heros" like this guy that would put me off going to the Euros.


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## TarfHead (18 Nov 2011)

It's just more of the hubris of the Irish soccer supporter, a.k.a. event junkie, e.g. how tournaments since 2002 have been devalued by the absence of the self-styled '_best fans in the wurled_'.


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## Deiseblue (18 Nov 2011)

As you say Ireland haven't qualified for a major tournament since 2002 - have the tournaments since that date been devalued - definitely not.

However having travelled to the Euros in 1988 & the subsequent 3 World Cups that we qualified for if I was asked if Ireland's fans added colour , a sense of humour , sportsmanship & an underlying sense that we were privileged to be present at such games - then the answer is an unequivocal yes.

Good behaviour was a matter of course & not something to be praised for.

Caveat - there was an amount of absolute tossers that travelled , a minority though.


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## Shawady (18 Nov 2011)

I travelled to Bari for the Italy game. First time at an away game and the atmosphere was fantastic.
I had thought about the Germany game in the next qualfying group as a possible trip but I see that is not going to happen until the end of 2013 now.

[broken link removed]


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## Purple (18 Nov 2011)

TarfHead said:


> It's just more of the hubris of the Irish soccer supporter, a.k.a. event junkie, e.g. how tournaments since 2002 have been devalued by the absence of the self-styled '_best fans in the wurled_'.



No, that's Munster rugby fans. They are also the most passionate.


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## Firefly (18 Nov 2011)

Purple said:


> No, that's Munster rugby fans. They are also the most passionate.



We have reason to be


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## WicklowMan (18 Nov 2011)

Some interesting responses here, both in agreement and disagreement. I watched the video of this lad approaching the players on the pitch and thought it disrespectful of the team to be honest. We achieve something great and who comes on to the pitch to congratulate the lads? - a chancer. It's just an image of the Irish I can't warm to, sorry. We may as well have had a drunk stagger on to keep the stereotypes going in front of everyone.

A common response I've gotten is along the lines of "You're comparing him to people who bankrupted the country ... are you mad?" Well, no and no  The figures might be different but the culture isn't ... as far as I'm concerned it's exactly the same. If Fianna Fail had arranged to get this guy into the grounds free of charge there'd be uproar, and he'd have become a hate figure. You can't have it both ways. What he did is deemed harmless because of the person, not the action. I find that a bit troubling.

Other 'harmless' fraud that we generally, as a nation, ignore would include employees stealing from Employers ("ah sure, it's only a tin of paint" etc.) and Copyright theft - all visual / audio material is seen as completely free; there to be ripped off. These small individual actions that are generally deemed "harmless" come together to form a whole that's far from harmless, just as a pixel on a monitor means nothing but a group of them form a picture. 

That's my tuppenceworth anyway.


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## MrMan (18 Nov 2011)

WicklowMan said:


> Some interesting responses here, both in agreement and disagreement. I watched the video of this lad approaching the players on the pitch and thought it disrespectful of the team to be honest. We achieve something great and who comes on to the pitch to congratulate the lads? - a chancer. It's just an image of the Irish I can't warm to, sorry. We may as well have had a drunk stagger on to keep the stereotypes going in front of everyone.*A bit like an All final then when the winning fans rush onto the pitch even though they are not allowed? Why do you deem this to be an Irish thing? Fans are passionate all around the world and often run onto pitches, at least this guy was just celebrating and not attacking anyone.*
> 
> Other 'harmless' fraud that we generally, as a nation, ignore would include employees stealing from Employers ("ah sure, it's only a tin of paint" etc.) and Copyright theft - all visual / audio material is seen as completely free; there to be ripped off. These small individual actions that are generally deemed "harmless" come together to form a whole that's far from harmless, just as a pixel on a monitor means nothing but a group of them form a picture.
> *I don't know anyone that thinks taking from their employer isn't stealing and the visual theft is an international problem.*
> ...



From reading posts here there is often an 'only in Ireland' vibe and I think people care a little too much about how the world views us (given that most of them aren't looking at us in the first place).


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## MrMan (18 Nov 2011)

dereko1969 said:


> But sure it belongs to "the man" so of course he's not a thief, oh no, it actually belongs to a normal person.
> 
> Everyone talks about there being this great sense of community in Ireland with our local/parish pride but it always comes at the expense of someone else.
> 
> ...



You would put off going to the euros because a guy gets some coverage off the back of our win? surely that is an attitude as childish as any.


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## WicklowMan (18 Nov 2011)

MrMan said:


> From reading posts here there is often an 'only in Ireland' vibe and I think people care a little too much about how the world views us (given that most of them aren't looking at us in the first place).


 
I think a chill pill is needs to be placed on special order with super fast courier delivery included. With regard to my other points, yes, copyright theft is a problem everywhere ... but that doesn't make it right (and Ireland has a dire repution, on an international level, for it!)

All I'm saying is, embrace a certain culture and no point complaining when it reaches it's 'pinnacle' and you have to pay for it. It often seems to me that in Ireland we abhor Bankers etc. yet if we can take a chance and get away with it on an individual level (whether it be dodging a parking ticket or whatever) we're over the moon. There's a basic contradiction there.

I think my cousin in America hit the nail on head when he opined that the Irish are traditionally bred to get one over on the English system, but haven't realized that for the past nearly 100 years they've been applying this 'logic' against their own state to score own - goals. 

Pun intended.


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## T McGibney (18 Nov 2011)

WicklowMan said:


> I think my cousin in America hit the nail on head when he opined that the Irish are traditionally bred to get one over on the English system, but haven't realized that for the past nearly 100 years they've been applying this 'logic' against their own state to score own - goals.



Another national stereotype - that a guy living 3,000+ miles away on another continent is better placed to judge our failings than someone actually living here.


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## dereko1969 (18 Nov 2011)

MrMan said:


> You would put off going to the euros because a guy gets some coverage off the back of our win? surely that is an attitude as childish as any.


 
Think you should re-read my post. 

It has nothing to do with some chancer getting TV coverage or selling his "story" to the Star or whatever. It's to do with Irish people "having the craic" by being disrespectful of locals abroad - be that going on Trams in Munich and not paying, bunking into stadiums (which lets remember caused Hillsborough) and acting the maggot going around locked out of their heads. This guys antics are symptomatic of that.

I'm still likely to go though!


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## Complainer (18 Nov 2011)

If you blag while wearing wearing a suit, you're a hero entrepreneur (and potential President). If you blag while wearing a tracksuit, you're a scumbag.


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## The_Banker (18 Nov 2011)

Fair play to the guy. He showed initiative.


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## WicklowMan (18 Nov 2011)

T McGibney said:


> Another national stereotype - that a guy living 3,000+ miles away on another continent is better placed to judge our failings than someone actually living here.


 
Given what's come to pass, he probably is!


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## WicklowMan (18 Nov 2011)

Complainer said:


> If you blag while wearing wearing a suit, you're a hero entrepreneur (and potential President). If you blag while wearing a tracksuit, you're a scumbag.


 
I'm not disagreeing with this at all. I see scumbags equally, but it's a good point.


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## Purple (18 Nov 2011)

WicklowMan said:


> I'm not disagreeing with this at all. I see scumbags equally, but it's a good point.



I don't think it was a good point at all. I found it trite and childish.
I do agree with your other point; a scumbad is a scumbag, no matter what they are wearing.

I don't know why Complainer is having a go at David Norris though.


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## The_Banker (18 Nov 2011)

He makes it onto the Late Late Show tonight....

Only right....


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## Leper (19 Nov 2011)

Having read some of the posts on this thread I wonder what kind of pe.ople are around this Forum.  The majority seem to be a laughless lot. Conor Cunningham got into a stadium, saw a match, brought some footballs onto a field, got a terrific seat to view the match, congratulated the winners, waved to fans and made a great story that not only was funny but lifted our nation and gave us all a laugh on a wet morning going to work. I say Good on Ya Conor, you made me laugh.

Everybody sees the humour (except of course, our soi-disant "humourists" on here) - lads please don't invite me to your birthdays, I'd run out of excuses to leave early. 

Compare the good humour of what happened to Conor Cunningham with the arrest of the guy who made it to the England Rugby Dressing room recently.  He was arrested and charged. So guys, off you go and support the England Rugby Team.


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## RMCF (19 Nov 2011)

Agree.

Wish I had thought of it.


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## MrMan (19 Nov 2011)

dereko1969 said:


> Think you should re-read my post.
> 
> It has nothing to do with some chancer getting TV coverage or selling his "story" to the Star or whatever. It's to do with Irish people "having the craic" by being disrespectful of locals abroad - be that going on Trams in Munich and not paying, bunking into stadiums (which lets remember caused Hillsborough) and acting the maggot going around locked out of their heads. This guys antics are symptomatic of that.
> 
> I'm still likely to go though!



I just did and it looks nothing like your response, but anyways enjoy the euros.


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## MrMan (19 Nov 2011)

WicklowMan said:


> I think a chill pill is needs to be placed on special order with super fast courier delivery included.



Really!, from a guy making a social analysis on the back of a light hearted story.


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## Yorrick (19 Nov 2011)

Most people found his antics funny. Of course if he ended up with a few nights in an Estonian police cell we would have thought it very funny too.
But then of course its all part of the "craic" and Irish peoples opinion of they being the best supporters in the world.
Of course the R.T.E. freeloading broadcasters who will travel all expenses paid are encouraging everyone to get behind the boys in green and get into debt travelling to Poland and Ukraine


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## Deiseblue (19 Nov 2011)

Yorrick said:


> Most people found his antics funny. Of course if he ended up with a few nights in an Estonian police cell we would have thought it very funny too.
> But then of course its all part of the "craic" and Irish peoples opinion of they being the best supporters in the world.
> Of course the R.T.E. freeloading broadcasters who will travel all expenses paid are encouraging everyone to get behind the boys in green and get into debt travelling to Poland and Ukraine



I plan to travel to the euros with 4 of my mates & there is absolutely no question of any of us getting into debt to do so ( thank God )

Irish fans travel in numbers to major international sporting events & generally enjoy themselves & behave well - you really can't expect much more.


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## WicklowMan (19 Nov 2011)

MrMan said:


> Really!, from a guy making a social analysis on the back of a light hearted story.


 
Well so far you haven't dealt with the specific issue ... that being why you consider theft and deception to be funny . Of course we have our unique way of looking at things in Ireland ... that's why we survive off pocket money from the rest of world. 

I suppose since I've already been called unpatriotic I might as well go the whole hog and profess a dislike of the other national pastime - 'slagging' -too. I dislike the way that it's usually a license to insult people and that anything approaching actual humour in it, when it rarely arises, is 99% of the time excruciatingly obvious.

If you don't mind me asking, as we're getting personal, does you moral compass kick in when:

1/ Someone robs a tenner off you

2/ Someone robs €1000 off you

3/ You have to pay a few grand per year when someone else robs off you indirectly.

Oh, and one more if you don't mind. Do you admire Seanie Fitzpatrick? If not, why not?


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## The_Banker (19 Nov 2011)

WicklowMan said:


> Well so far you haven't dealt with the specific issue ... that being why you consider* theft* and deception to be funny . Of course we have our unique way of looking at things in Ireland ... that's why we survive off pocket money from the rest of world.
> 
> I suppose since I've already been called unpatriotic I might as well go the whole hog and profess a dislike of the other national pastime - 'slagging' -too. I dislike the way that it's usually a license to insult people and that anything approaching actual humour in it, when it rarely arises, is 99% of the time excruciatingly obvious.
> 
> ...


 
What did he steal? Did he take anyones seat? No, he sat on the sideline. He wore a Estonian tracksuit which was discarded. Generally kit is given away to fans at the end of a campaign anyway.

He did nothing wrong.

Comparing him to Seanie Fitz... Get a grip


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## WicklowMan (19 Nov 2011)

The_Banker said:


> What did he steal? Did he take anyones seat? No, he sat on the sideline. He wore a Estonian tracksuit which was discarded. Generally kit is given away to fans at the end of a campaign anyway.
> 
> He did nothing wrong.
> 
> Comparing him to Seanie Fitz... Get a grip


 
Ah sure, t'was only a small thing! Fitzie: Ah sure, t'was only a big thing!

Same attitude! Yet another responder who can't argue a point, but instead turns on me!


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## blueband (20 Nov 2011)

well what he did was wrong, there is no doubt about that, but if everybody obeyed all the rules all the time to the letter, we would live in the most law abiding country on earth! but also one of the most mind numbingly boring places on earth.


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## Pope John 11 (20 Nov 2011)

blueband said:


> well what he did was wrong, there is no doubt about that, but if everybody obeyed all the rules all the time to the letter, we would live in the most law abiding country on earth! but also one of the most mind numbingly boring places on earth.


 Germany!


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## MrMan (20 Nov 2011)

WicklowMan said:


> Well so far you haven't dealt with the specific issue ... that being why you consider theft and deception to be funny . Of course we have our unique way of looking at things in Ireland ... that's why we survive off pocket money from the rest of world.
> 
> I suppose since I've already been called unpatriotic I might as well go the whole hog and profess a dislike of the other national pastime - 'slagging' -too. I dislike the way that it's usually a license to insult people and that anything approaching actual humour in it, when it rarely arises, is 99% of the time excruciatingly obvious.
> 
> ...


 
I find some of 'dumbest criminals in the world' stories funny too, I find lots of stuff funny, I find your opinion on this matter excruciatingly stuffy.
To the best of my knowledge, people all over the world have a sense of humour, so i'm not alone in that and what we call slagging is also something that happens all over the world.

Regarding my moral compass, questions 1-3 and your bizarre Seanie reference all point to one thing; you really didn't find any humour in seeing Conor Cunningham handing a ball to the Estonian player during the match and then give a little look of aknowledgement to the camera, while I burst out laughing.


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## Leper (20 Nov 2011)

Loosen up Wicklowman, the whole caper here was fun.  Nobody got hurt and nearly the entire country got a lift out of Conor Cunninghams escapade.


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## DerKaiser (20 Nov 2011)

Leper said:


> ....caper..escapade.



spot on, it was a harmless escapade/caper.

Not that it needs explaining, but his alternative options were to pay €600 to a tout or watch the game on TV.  I can't see who is worse off by his escapades, other than the extortionate tout (which for me is a worse moral crime).

The irish team kicked a bag of footballs into the stands on tuesday - Would walking away with one of those (rather than handing it in to the FAI) also be morally reprehensible?

Just as an example of a law most people break, If I drift to 35kph in a 30 kph zone and not get caught, do I say nothing or notify the Gardai in order to pay my fine and get the points? Is doing nothing morally wrong in this situation?


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## WicklowMan (20 Nov 2011)

DerKaiser said:


> The irish team kicked a bag of footballs into the stands on tuesday - Would walking away with one of those (rather than handing it in to the FAI) also be morally reprehensible?


 
Not at all. They were given rather than stolen.



DerKaiser said:


> Just as an example of a law most people break, If I drift to 35kph in a 30 kph zone and not get caught, do I say nothing or notify the Gardai in order to pay my fine and get the points? Is doing nothing morally wrong in this situation?


 
That's a ridiculous, exaggerated comment purely intended to give your disagreement credibility.


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## Complainer (20 Nov 2011)

WicklowMan said:


> Not at all. They were given rather than stolen.


Are the team members who kicked the balls the legal owners of the balls? If not, surely they are responsible for robbing these balls from the FAI.


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