# Rugby World Cup: Ireland selection questions.



## Purple (21 Sep 2011)

I’m a big fan of Sexton. I think he’s a great all-round player who kicks at a consistently high level for Leinster.
I’m also a big fan of O’Gara whose record for Ireland and Munster is unquestionable. 
It’s hard to be definitive about who should start for Ireland at number 10 but on balance I’d go for Sexton. The main reason for that is despite his superior kicking ability O’Gara can’t tackle and so leaves Ireland open to attack down the 10 channel when he’s playing. Sexton is streets ahead of him in the tackling and ball carrying department, offering a running threat off the ruck when Ireland have ball going forward.  When O’Gara is playing opposing teams can defend closer to the line and so limit our ability to attack. 
Where O’Gara has the edge is when we are under pressure; his game management is better, or maybe it’s the case that he’s more inclined to (correctly) ignore the game plan when he thinks it isn’t working whereas Sexton lacks the experience to do so. 

It is now being suggested that Sexton should start in the centre beside O’Driscoll. I think that’s a daft idea. The obvious replacement for D’Arcy is McFadden. He’s been playing out of his skin for Leinster and he’s also a good kicker of the ball with a good understanding of game management. I’d probably start him ahead of D’Arcy at the moment given D’Arcy’s form.

It’s also a hard call at number 9. Conor Murray is an outstanding young player who has a physicality that Eoin Reddan doesn’t offer but Reddan offers faster delivery and is better under pressure. On balance I’d probably go for Murray.

The one area that I just don’t understand is why Earls is getting in ahead of Trimble on the wing. Earls is off form and Trimble is playing the best rugby of his life. He’s also bigger and stronger and is less inclined to get himself isolated with ball in hand.


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## TarfHead (21 Sep 2011)

Suggestions to start Sexton at #12 are ridiculous. They make as much sense as "_'Richard Dunne had a great game against Russia. Let's play him as centre forward_".

Boss may be the best bet at #9 against Italy. That one's going to be trench warfare, hand to hand combat, <_insert inappropriate military cliche here_>.

Hopefully McFadden will get a run at #12 against Russia, with Earls at #13 and Trimble at #11. If D'Arcy is fit for selection against Italy, he should play.


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## Purple (21 Sep 2011)

Boss might be a good idea alright. 
I wouldn't play Earls in the centre. Ever. It's best on the wing and ok at fullback but he’s no centre. 
I don’t understand the hype around him; he’s good but he’s not the best player to come out of Munster in the last few years, not by a long shot.

It will be interesting to see what happens when Rob Kearney gets back from the World Cup and can’t get his place in Leinster. He’s clearly the best Irish fullback but he’s not the best fullback in Ireland.


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## Sunny (21 Sep 2011)

Sexton at 12 isn't a crazy idea. He has the game for it. Especially since O'Gara probably deserves the 10 jersey at the moment. I just wouldn't choose the World Cup as the occasion to try it out on a permanent basis.


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## TarfHead (21 Sep 2011)

Purple said:


> I wouldn't play Earls in the centre. Ever.


 
Even when it's Russia and you want to keep O'Driscoll fit for the Italy game ? If not Earls at #13, then who ? Bowe ? Not when he needs more game time at #14.

I believe any consideration of starting Sexton at #12 is ridiculous because he doesn't have the game to be the principal defender, nor the game to make the 'hard yards', in a crowded area. Plus, if he's at #12, then O'Gara is at #10 and Sexton would have his hands full protecting him, in the way that D'Arcy and David Wallace do.

It's a grand idea when you're on attack and you would have 2 world-class kickers to keep the opposition back three on the toes and Sexton's greater range of passing. But attack is only one aspect of the #12 role.


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## Purple (21 Sep 2011)

Sunny said:


> Sexton at 12 isn't a crazy idea. He has the game for it. Especially since O'Gara probably deserves the 10 jersey at the moment. I just wouldn't choose the World Cup as the occasion to try it out on a permanent basis.



If O’Gara is the best number 10 then he should be picked. If it’s Sexton then he should be picked. Sexton may well have the game for it at centre but there’s other players better suited to it and he shouldn’t keep them out just to keep him happy. 
I don’t think O’Gara has done himself any favours throwing his toys out of the pram so often about this. I don’t like the way he subtly (and not so subtly) undermines Sexton in public. He comes across as a would-be Roy Keane with a sense of entitlement bourn of a very high opinion of himself. Basically he’s the opposite of Paul O’Connell on the humility and personality stakes. 

None of that matters though; it’s all about who the best guy to have on the pitch on the day is. What annoys me is that the discussion seems to limit the role of the number 10 to kicking penalties.


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## Purple (21 Sep 2011)

TarfHead said:


> Even when it's Russia and you want to keep O'Driscoll fit for the Italy game ? If not Earls at #13, then who ?



Centres:

McFadden. I'd start him ahead of D'Arcy at the moment on form, even if D'Arcy was 100% fit. I'

Trimble. Not a natural centre but better than Earls.
If it came to it against Russia then I'd go for McFadden and Trimble. There's no way I'd risk Sexton as a centre against Russia.


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## csirl (21 Sep 2011)

Doesnt really matter who is selected against Russia, Ireland should still win easily. Therefore all the reserves should play to give them a run out in case they are needed later in the tournament. Would be madness to risk important players in such a fixture.


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## Sunny (21 Sep 2011)

Purple said:


> If O’Gara is the best number 10 then he should be picked. If it’s Sexton then he should be picked. Sexton may well have the game for it but there’s other players better suited to it and he shouldn’t keep them out just to keep him happy.
> I don’t think O’Gara has done himself any favours throwing his toys out of the pram so often about this. I don’t like the way he subtly (and not so subtly) undermines Sexton in public. He comes across as a would-be Roy Keane with a sense of entitlement bourn of a very high opinion of himself. Basically he’s the opposite of Paul O’Connell on the humility and personality stakes.
> 
> None of that matters though; it’s all about who the best guy to have on the pitch on the day is. What annoys me is that the discussion seems to limit the role of the number 10 to kicking penalties.



I agree that O'Gara should be picked. However sometimes it is desirable to have your best players on the pitch especially if we are chasing a game. We used to have Paddy Wallace on the bench to cover out half and centre. We don't need that anymore because Sexton can now fill the centre role if needs be. Frees up a space on the bench for a better player than Wallace.  People say is crazy to play O'Brien at 7 and he isn't a natural 7 but I still want him on the pitch even if that means playing him in that position. 

Anyway, I couldn't care less who plays where as long as we batter Russia and Italy!


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## Purple (21 Sep 2011)

Sunny said:


> I agree that O'Gara should be picked. However sometimes it is desirable to have your best players on the pitch especially if we are chasing a game. We used to have Paddy Wallace on the bench to cover out half and centre. We don't need that anymore because Sexton can now fill the centre role if needs be. Frees up a space on the bench for a better player than Wallace.  People say is crazy to play O'Brien at 7 and he isn't a natural 7 but I still want him on the pitch even if that means playing him in that position.
> 
> Anyway, I couldn't care less who plays where as long as we batter Russia and Italy!



Good points but I didn't say that O'Gara should play.


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## Firefly (22 Sep 2011)

Purple said:


> It is now being suggested that Sexton should start in the centre beside O’Driscoll. I think that’s a daft idea.



Crazy idea IMO. Apart from messing with his confidence (who am I?) it exposes him to injury then leaving no one should O'Gara get injured. I'd prefer to have my number 10s wrapped in cotton wool. 

I agree with the other points you have raised. I'd add that I don't think O'Gara would have 80 minutes in him against a top side but I could be wrong. Having said that he is a proven closer of games so he'd come on for the last 20 minutes for me. Sexton has a certain amount of pressure on him to perform but in all fairness, he will only really be needed for the next WC when O'Gara is gone. All in all for a small country we are blessed to have the pair of them...it seems to be a thing in Irish rugby with Ward/Campbell too...


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## Teatime (22 Sep 2011)

Earls is not an international #13 - I think it's pointless trying him there. I would put Bowe in at #13 against Russia. He would see more ball and do more damage. I definitely think Trimble should be playing the big tests. McFadden deserves a crack at #12.

Sexton over O'Gara every time. O'Gara cant manage 80 minutes defensively but is a great impact sub. And the future is Sexton.


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## Sunny (22 Sep 2011)

This thing about O'Gara and his defence is one of those things that seems to have got a life of it's own. Sexton is a better defender because of his strength but you don't have a career at the top level for this long if you are a poor defender. I don't remember too many teams getting much joy down his channel over the years. Seems to mainly come from that lions test in SA when they went through him for the try. People tend to forget that he had taken a huge hit just moments before.


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## Purple (22 Sep 2011)

Sunny said:


> This thing about O'Gara and his defence is one of those things that seems to have got a life of it's own. Sexton is a better defender because of his strength but you don't have a career at the top level for this long if you are a poor defender. I don't remember too many teams getting much joy down his channel over the years. Seems to mainly come from that lions test in SA when they went through him for the try. People tend to forget that he had taken a huge hit just moments before.



I think it wasn’t an issue at Munster when they had a strong pack and he was relatively protected. As the Munster pack has deteriorated (relative to how strong it was) and O’Gara has gotten a bit older his defensive weaknesses have been more exposed. I think it was always an issue when he played for Ireland but until Sexton came on the scene there was no other option. At the start of O’Gara’s career David Humphries was the “other man” but he was a weak tackler as well and O’Gara was a more consistent kicker.

The Lions tour incident was due to concussion.


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## Firefly (22 Sep 2011)

Purple said:


> At the start of O’Gara’s career David Humphries was the “other man” but he was a weak tackler as well and O’Gara was a more consistent kicker.



Good ole Humpy!


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## Godfather (22 Sep 2011)

Well done Ireland for beating Australia... Really incredible match...


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## MrMan (23 Sep 2011)

Teatime said:


> Earls is not an international #13 - I think it's pointless trying him there. I would put Bowe in at #13 against Russia. He would see more ball and do more damage. I definitely think Trimble should be playing the big tests. McFadden deserves a crack at #12.
> 
> Sexton over O'Gara every time. O'Gara cant manage 80 minutes defensively but is a great impact sub. And the future is Sexton.


 
I've heard on the grapevine that Mcfaddden has been suffering with nerves and they are keeping him under wraps.
As for Sexton being the future, surely we judge world cup selection on the present.


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## TarfHead (23 Sep 2011)

MrMan said:


> I've heard on the grapevine that Mcfaddden has been suffering with nerves and they are keeping him under wraps.


 
Gotta love that grapevine  ! Any more 'inside news'  ?


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## MrMan (23 Sep 2011)

sorry I didn't mean to hit a nerve


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## Teatime (23 Sep 2011)

MrMan said:


> As for Sexton being the future, surely we judge world cup selection on the present.



Yep and Sexton was on the pitch for 80 mins against Australia and we beat them  And in the last match of the Six Nations he was outstanding against England.

I think O'Gara has been perceived as a weak tackler since the 2001 Lions Tour. I believe NSW tested his face out a few times too. How many times have we seen back row moves from the tail of the lineout that involved walking over O'Gara. I remember Parisse and Harinordiquay (?) doing just that in recent years. He does tackle he's just not very good at it and it takes its toll. Its not a bad thing, the Aussie out half sinks back into full back for defensive lines. And you could say Wilkinson tackles too much or too hard hence the injuries

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MkS5a3RsXRE

FYI - I think we are lucky to have both and I am a Connacht supporter, we are going to win the H-Cup this year!


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## MrMan (24 Sep 2011)

Teatime said:


> Yep and Sexton was on the pitch for 80 mins against Australia and we beat them  And in the last match of the Six Nations he was outstanding against England.


 

I wasn't having a dig at Sexton, just the notion that we should be looking at anything other than the form shown at the world cup.


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## Purple (24 Sep 2011)

Teatime said:


> Yep and Sexton was on the pitch for 80 mins against Australia and we beat them  And in the last match of the Six Nations he was outstanding against England.
> 
> I think O'Gara has been perceived as a weak tackler since the 2001 Lions Tour. I believe NSW tested his face out a few times too. How many times have we seen back row moves from the tail of the lineout that involved walking over O'Gara. I remember Parisse and Harinordiquay (?) doing just that in recent years. He does tackle he's just not very good at it and it takes its toll. Its not a bad thing, the Aussie out half sinks back into full back for defensive lines. And you could say Wilkinson tackles too much or too hard hence the injuries
> 
> ...


You forgot about Sexton winning the H-Cup final on his own 
I agree about O'Gara and the 2001 tour


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## Firefly (26 Sep 2011)

I'd rather have an excellent kicker with poor defensive skills if I had a choice. ROG has IMO rarely left in a try - they might run him down somewhere in the middle of the pitch, but if he kicks 15 points who cares? They can each have good and bad games and as I said we're lucky to have them both. The only thing I'd add though is that when O'Gara comes on for Sexton he generally makes an impact. Sexton was terrible when he came on against Russia. Terrible first pass inside his own 22 and an aweful penalty. I think O'G has played his way onto the starting 15 against Italy, but it's still up in the air after that.


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## Purple (26 Sep 2011)

Firefly said:


> I think O'G has played his way onto the starting 15 against Italy, but it's still up in the air after that.



I agree.


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