# December Tracker Update - Central Bank et al



## SaySomething (12 Dec 2017)

According to a report on RTÉ website, the Central Bank is due to submit their requested December update to Paschal Donohoe early next week.

The Minister for Finance is then to issue a press release on Wednesday (20th December) with this information. 

It is also expected that the top five main banks (KBC, AIB, BOI, PTSB, UB) will issue their own statements before or on this day. 

https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2017/1212/926819-tracker-mortgages/

If you were to ask my predictions...

BOI will state that due to the size of the investigation they are doing all they can for the newly identified 6,000 customers but that their refunds will extend into early 2018.

UB will state that 1,000 customers will receive redress before the end of the year - omitting the fact that a large number of letters won't arrive until the first or second week of January. 

AIB will state that the vast majority of identified accounts have received redress already.

PTSB will state that all identified customers have been redressed.

KBC will state that they have contacted their identified customers and redress will occur in Q1 2018. 

The Central Bank will state that it's actively challenging lenders on tracker customers and that more numbers are yet to be identified, but not as many as the BOI 6,000 in the last few months.


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## peemac (12 Dec 2017)

So you work in financial pr and you are writing all the statements   

I feel your statements may be horrendously accurate.

But it will be interesting what the central bank itself says - i get the feeling they have lost patience with some of the banks.

At this stage the very least should be that the banks make some down payment to all affected accounts within 14 days.


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## PFS7979 (12 Dec 2017)

Hi SaySomething,

Am curious on your prediction re: PTSB.. 

Do you believe such a statement from them would be accurate? I would contend that they have many more effected customers than they would admit to....


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## Kellym (12 Dec 2017)

Can I ask where did you hear it could be the first or second week of January for UB? Is there a website with this detail thanks


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## Leighlinboy (12 Dec 2017)

KBC havent contacted anyone on any of the threads here since the October statements, or begun redress to anyone on these threads , its a reasonable barometer to say they havent met any of the commitments . Thats not to say they will state exactly what you have predicted


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## SaySomething (12 Dec 2017)

First of all I don’t work in financial PR I assure you. My line of work can be PR related though. These are slightly qualified predictions based upon my experiences over the past years in dealing with the bank. 

Read what I’ve said above about “identified customers”. The language the banks use will be interesting. Identified customers nicely skirts over the accounts being challenged by customers and the Central Bank themselves. 

In relation to the UB query, I’m basing this prediction on a phone call with TME team. They are now referring to adjustments being made in December, as opposed to By Christmas. This will be similar to the promised March letters which arrived in April.


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## Kellym (12 Dec 2017)

I see, thanks this was helpful


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## PFS7979 (12 Dec 2017)

SaySomething,

I can see your point.. all "identifed" customers being the cases they themselves identified...

It will all pan out in the coming months...


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## Lightening (12 Dec 2017)

Re Kbc. Sounds bang on!

Mr Verbraeken in a statement early in the year regarding the central bank tracker examination stated  "we have reached out to a number of customers" we now know those numbers to be in the region of 5 people.

Niamh Richardson of the tracker team sounds like a recorded message herself. Maybe they do just push some buttom to give this response quote "we have already commenced contacting affected customers and redress has begun.  Most customers will be contacted by end of year" unquote this response being given even this week!

Yet No one has heard of any letters being sent by KBC.


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## Mauritius (12 Dec 2017)

KBC will state that they have contacted their identified customers and redress will occur in Q1 2018.

KBC will try to spin this propaganda but without anyone having been contacted yet, who could they be referring to.....?


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## maunie (13 Dec 2017)

Pascal O Donoghue will receive an update from Central Bank next week but there is no mention so far of a press release from him


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## SaySomething (13 Dec 2017)

maunie said:


> Pascal O Donoghue will receive an update from Central Bank next week but there is no mention so far of a press release from him


Did you read the report from RTÉ linked above?


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## maunie (13 Dec 2017)

Yes, I have read it, just saying that i have it in from pascal o donoghue directly that he hopes to have report next week and he will need to review report before he decides what to do next .. no mention of press release to date


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## Winter Miles (14 Dec 2017)

I went to sell an investment property that is on a restructured ,mortgage with KBC two weeks ago.  I was told i could not sell the property as it and another mortgage i have with KBC was under review.  I asked for this in writing and was told that they would pass my request onto the tracker Team. This is the first i heard that both mortgages are under review and was very surprised that they would not let me sell the property.....My guess is that KBC will have very little to show....

Still no correspondence.  Surprise surprise.

The Bank of You....must be taking the Pi**



Mauritius said:


> KBC will state that they have contacted their identified customers and redress will occur in Q1 2018.
> 
> KBC will try to spin this propaganda but without anyone having been contacted yet, who could they be referring to.....?


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## Editiono (14 Dec 2017)

Winter Miles said:


> I went to sell an investment property that is on a restructured ,mortgage with KBC two weeks ago.  I was told i could not sell the property as it and another mortgage i have with KBC was under review.  I asked for this in writing and was told that they would pass my request onto the tracker Team. This is the first i heard that both mortgages are under review and was very surprised that they would not let me sell the property.....My guess is that KBC will have very little to show....
> 
> Still no correspondence.  Surprise surprise.
> 
> The Bank of You....must be taking the Pi**


Can they really stop you selling?  I am thinking of putting my properties up for sale which are both under review too?  Can anyone give a clear view on this>


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## Mauritius (14 Dec 2017)

Just thought I'd let all you KBC-ers know that I had a voice message from Niamh Richardson today. "Hi there, just phoning to let you know that I've no up date for you. I'm made a note in my diary to call you again next week."  Really guys, this is not going to happen before Christmas. That is very evident. Howe they will get away with missing another promised deadline, I don't know.


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## peemac (14 Dec 2017)

SaySomething said:


> First of all I don’t work in financial PR I assure you. .


 I was being tongue in cheek, just in case anyone thinks I was being serious   - At this stage even a monkey in central africa could write the statements by just reading/rehashing the last 3 or 4 and be fairly accurate.

Possibly the banks and in particular kbc are waiting to see what the CB can/will actually do and only if that is so onerous and potentially more expensive than redress are they actually going to act.


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## Cushcam (14 Dec 2017)

Patience! Not following other banks as close, but in the case of KBC, when you look at their last statement, I think they have completed the following;

“KBC expects to book an impairment (in net other income) in the range of 40 to 60 million EUR in 3Q17.
KBC expects to have concluded the identification of the vast majority of customers impacted by the Tracker Examination by year end.
Payment of redress and compensation for customers identified so far will commence in early November”
KBC may have been guilty in underestimating the volume of complex cases in scope, but they did stress back in Oct, that complex cases could carry into 2018.

“For straight forward cases, which we expect to be the majority, we expect to complete payment by year end. For more complex cases involving manual calculations for every individual case, payments will continue into 2018”


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## Cushcam (15 Dec 2017)

As I said in a previous post / thread, the overall programme of work involved to redress & compensate 100’s / 1000s of cases, is not a 6 week activity. No way! The contract checking / initial sign offs / legal approvals / compliance approvals / & resource constraints this time of year, Are just a few tasks & dependencies, & I really believe KBC only “commenced” this in Nov, on the back of the apologies that other banks decided to make, & the corrective action that other banks decided to take! An update will be welcome next week, but it’ll happen. Good progress has been made, however this time of year is silly season, & very unproductive in my experience, in account of annual leave, parties. While it’s easy to mobilize a team to handle inbound calls, it’s less easy to mobilize additional legal eagles


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## Wardy7 (15 Dec 2017)

Waiting patiently for this Central Bank update......it is due today, yeah?


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## SaySomething (15 Dec 2017)

No Wednesday next week @Wardy7


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## Wardy7 (15 Dec 2017)

Thought it was 15th! Need to get a life!

I read your post above (20th) but for some reason at the moment, my brain distorts information!!!

Starting to think that being off work is turning my brain to mush!


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## peemac (15 Dec 2017)

Cushcam said:


> As I said in a previous post / thread, the overall programme of work involved to redress & compensate 100’s / 1000s of cases, is not a 6 week activity. No way! The contract checking / initial sign offs / legal approvals / compliance approvals / & resource constraints this time of year, Are just a few tasks & dependencies, & I really believe KBC only “commenced” this in Nov, on the back of the apologies that other banks decided to make, & the corrective action that other banks decided to take! An update will be welcome next week, but it’ll happen. Good progress has been made, however this time of year is silly season, & very unproductive in my experience, in account of annual leave, parties. While it’s easy to mobilize a team to handle inbound calls, it’s less easy to mobilize additional legal eagles


It not as if Christmas suddenly arrived without them knowing - its the same date every year.

What irks me and other KBC customer is the utter BS they have spouted in their statements which  they know damn well to be utter bs.

Padraig Kissane has many many KBC clients, on AAM there are dozes too.

Yet KBC say that they started contacting affected customers since early NOV, but NOT ONE aam member or kissane client has been contacted - what odds would Paddy Power offer on that!


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## SaySomething (19 Dec 2017)

There are conflicting reports as to what is due to happen tomorrow. I've had a chat with a couple of journalists about this, plus going on the information freely available online.

*December 20th*
Central Bank will release statement on the progress of redress and compensation for identified customers since their statement on 25th of October. There is unlikely to be many additional affected customers disclosed tomorrow simply because that's not the purpose of the report. They'll release the statement online and distribute it across their social media.
Note. BOI customers who were in the additional 6,000 identified in early November are not expected to receive redress/compensation before year end. BOI may issue a timeline under which this is to happen. 

*December 31st*
I'm told that this is a deadline for all customers to be identified by the banks. This means there will be a further release early in the New Year on the numbers affected. As the Central Bank continues to challenge 'cohorts' extra numbers may appear well into March 2018.


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## Banking17 (19 Dec 2017)

Hope your right on Dec deadline to identify all customers. I see no evidence of this currently from my contact with CB or Ulster Bank. Central Bank just reaffirm UB line on no info be patient and I must wait etc etc. Wearing very thin after 2 years of this


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## SaySomething (19 Dec 2017)

Banking17 said:


> Hope your right on Dec deadline to identify all customers. I see no evidence of this currently from my contact with CB or Ulster Bank. Central Bank just reaffirm UB line on no info be patient and I must wait etc etc. Wearing very thin after 2 years of this


Totally agree. Patience is all gone at this stage. Stress levels through the roof waiting on the promised redress.


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## Sligolive (20 Dec 2017)

Charlie Weston has an update at link below

https://www.independent.ie/business...und-by-banks-in-tracker-scandal-36423600.html


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## Ninibopp (20 Dec 2017)

I guess we are one of those receiving a small refund. Checked my mortgage account yesterday and spotted an interest refund of €317 with a reference 2009-2016. If this is the extent of it we are not impressed. We have clause 3.2 in our T&Cs stating that we should have been offered a tracker at the prevailing rate when our fixed rate ended. The bank (AIB) must be getting away with retrospectively setting this prevailing rate at ECB + 3.67. Gutted is not the word!!!!


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## SaySomething (20 Dec 2017)

Tune into Séan O'Rourke on RTÉ1 at around 11am this morning.


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## Lightening (20 Dec 2017)

Pat kenny now


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## ragdal (20 Dec 2017)

Well done again @SaySomething 
And thanks for giving us First Active customers a mention.


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## Milo4444 (20 Dec 2017)

I'm at work and couldn't listen in, is there any more detail on what was said? Many thanks to all


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## SaySomething (20 Dec 2017)

Full update will be released at 2pm. No more news until then.


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## TrackerThieves (20 Dec 2017)

Milo4444 said:


> I'm at work and couldn't listen in, is there any more detail on what was said? Many thanks to all


I havent listened yet and i can't post the links but if you google "Rte sean o'rouke" his show is broken up into each small segment if you scroll down there's a 10 min clip on tracker mortgages. Pat kenny would be available on podcast if intrested


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## TrackerThieves (20 Dec 2017)

Sean O'rouke was Catriona Redmond (@SaySomething) speaking about her case and Charlie Weston speaking a little on catriona's case and a bit more in general on numbers affected and compensation.

@SaySomething I find it amazing 1 year on from being told your getting your tracker back you have got nothing and still in the dark. My case is totally different and with a different lender but an awful lot of similarities in how they have treated us. Been with Padraic for over 3 years and no idea if we will get anything, as banks are still refusing to acknowledge we are affected. The not knowing but always hoping is so frustrating and drives you crazy


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## SaySomething (20 Dec 2017)

Trying to put as many statements as I can in the one place. As I find more I'll add them in here: 

AIB: https://group.aib.ie/content/dam/ai...pdate-on-the-tracker-mortgage-examination.pdf

UB: https://digital.ulsterbank.ie/perso...lster_banks_tracker_mortgage_examination.html

KBC: [broken link removed]


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## Foxy007 (20 Dec 2017)

So all this still means is “cheques in the post”..... maybe but you’ll just have to wait it out.


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## Foxy007 (20 Dec 2017)

Post removed... couldnt see delete


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## Aidan.obrien (20 Dec 2017)

Does the AIB statement include EBS customers? They aren’t mentioned at all!!


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## pguyo (20 Dec 2017)

It looks like EBS are covered under the AIB "Group". EBS freephone number in the AIB statement


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