# Being frozen out at work



## toni_mrphy (30 Jul 2014)

Hi 
I work for a very large multinational in Cork , been here over 8 years .

I moved dept internally three months ago , 2 other people joined the dept the week after me . 
Before we arrived there were just two people in the dept and they both reported to the director . 
As the group was expanding one of them was promoted to manager ( no previous managerial experience ) . 

From the start I found the training hit and miss , I was hired along with one of the new hires for a specific project - it was to be spit between the two of us. 

One of the  2 hires was working on an unrelated project and was trained in by one of the original two people in the dept ( not the one that was promoted ) 
Anyway I have asked my manger a few times about more detailed training and the last time I asked she got very aggressive with me, she told me “ she had enough of my lip “ &  basically said I should know it by now and hinted my intelligence was below par . 

This caused me a great deal of stress I stopped eating and sleeping and after a few days I eventually went to a doctor who diagnosed me with depression ( I do believe the depression was there before I started this job but it has been heightened considerable in the past fe months ) ,anyway the doctor put me on anti depressants and gave me a note to stay out of work for 10 days . 
The note did not mention depression but stated I was out with a medical illness . 

I came back to work this week as I am not really one to stay out and thought things would get better .
In the three days since i have been back my manger has said two words to me “ Better now”?
I have been excluded from 90% of the meetings related to the project I was working on & the other person is now doing the part that I was originally working on . 

I know the first thing asked will be “ Did you go to HR “ the answer is no , HR here is very very poor and will always support the managers position. 
Nor did I speak to my manager again - I know it sounds childish but I am scared and just do not feel I have the strength .

I am just looking for advice being excluded seems hard to prove . 
I am at my wits end . 

Thanks for reading the long note …..


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## noproblem (30 Jul 2014)

I take it that you're in the funds industry and if so, it's one where you've got to be on the ball, otherwise others in the team will have to continually pick up the slack. If I'm correct about it being the funds industry, I would advise you to look at a different career choice because there's lots of pressure and time limits, etc, etc, in this profession and I don't think this pressure suits you. Others seem to have spotted this and it won't get any better.


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## toni_mrphy (30 Jul 2014)

Thanks for the reply but it is not in the funds industry .


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## Sunny (30 Jul 2014)

noproblem said:


> I take it that you're in the funds industry and if so, it's one where you've got to be on the ball, otherwise others in the team will have to continually pick up the slack. If I'm correct about it being the funds industry, I would advise you to look at a different career choice because there's lots of pressure and time limits, etc, etc, in this profession and I don't think this pressure suits you. Others seem to have spotted this and it won't get any better.



That is a ridiculous post. What in the OP's post suggested it was funds and even if it was, your 'advice' was rude and ignorant. And before you ask, I know all about the funds industry. 

OP, you will get plenty of helpful advice from others. I don't have experience of it so can't tell you what to do.  I know you don't feel like dealing with it but these things tend not to go away by themselves. You will need to deal with in a constructive way. Have a search. There are plenty of threads with people having similar problems. Just mind your health. That's the main thing.


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## Orga (30 Jul 2014)

Toni, I sense from your post how difficult and upsetting the situation is for you, and I can empathise with you. You deserve respect and to be included is part of that, something that's brought you to post here. I've often seen how advice in situations similar to yours can be focused on the work issues, but it's important, vital really, to also remember that what is happening at work affects you as a person. So, keeping your own well-being as part of the resolution your seeking is very important. I wish I could offer more in-depth comments but given that I can't know the details of the situation, because we can't talk, I can only say that in situations similar to yours I have found that people focused on keeping high-quality notes of what happened at work, they sought advice from employee assistance officers/HR department/external advisors/friends/family, and they also worked to ensure that the emotional side of their well-being was supported, through working with their GP or counsellor.


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## toni_mrphy (30 Jul 2014)

Orga, Sunny 

Thank you so much for taking the time to reply .
I have spoken to family & friends and indeed another friend of mine who is a manager and has advised me to keep notes of everything that happens . 
My GP has also been a great help . 
Thanks again


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## Leper (30 Jul 2014)

Hi Toni, Some credit is due to you for coming on here and explaining how you feel.  From the information you supplied I do not know if you are in the right or in the wrong or somewhere in between (no offence!).

But, I think you feel you have a case to be answered and you deserve an answer.  Whoever gave you advice to record what's happening is a true friend and a shrewd observer.  

From your post you appear to be a skilled eloquent person.  Therefore, I am advising that at every opportunity you feel at any kind of disadvantage (and/or bullied etc) send an email to your private email address.  List what is happening and what was said or done or even intimated.  List also how you felt at the time.  Also, no harm in listing any witnesses.  Your email will keep a log of the time, date things were said.  

If you are in the right and being treated unfairly a few pages of your emails will confirm whether you have a case.

And to Mr No-Problem above you get my weekly award for the fastest conclusion jumper on the board this week.  You must be very fit!


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## ang1170 (31 Jul 2014)

Leper said:


> Therefore, I am advising that at every opportunity you feel at any kind of disadvantage (and/or bullied etc) send an email to your private email address. List what is happening and what was said or done or even intimated. List also how you felt at the time. Also, no harm in listing any witnesses. Your email will keep a log of the time, date things were said.


 
Just to note that if you follow this advice, on no account should you use any system or infrastructure provided by your employer: it is almost certainly not secure.


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## Steven Barrett (31 Jul 2014)

To resolve these issues you need to follow procedure. 

The first thing is to ask for a meeting with your manager to discuss how you feel and to look for answers. Take notes at the meeting, don't feel that you can't write them there and then at the meeting. 

If you don't get a satisfactory outcome from the meeting, you have to report it to HR for no other reason than there is an official record of your issues with them. 

If you are still not happy, lodge an official grievance complaint against your manager. 

Treating an employee different to others is bullying, pure and simple and it should not be put up with. It is going to be very difficult and cause you a lot of distress and worry but you have to stand up to them. 

Best of luck. 

Steven
www.bluewaterfp.ie


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## toni_mrphy (31 Jul 2014)

Thanks Guys for taking the time to reply . 
I am continuing to take notes and a trend is certainly appearing. 
I am on holidays in a few days so I just want to get to my last day enjoy my holiday and if things are the same when I come back I will raise my concerns with my manager . 
Thanks again


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## Gerry Canning (31 Jul 2014)

Toni; 
Since you are in situ 8 years , I must assume you are a competent employee, if you were not you would be long gone!.
,
1.Try very hard to kill the emotion on this ( not easy to do).
2. Try to stay on the business facts.
a.Specific project, that you feel requires add on training.
b. Identify the training needs and present them to your line manager and get managers opinion.

Am with SBarrett on this; bullying is nasty and very hard to pin down,.Whatever else you do , do not lose your cool. 
It is very sad that after 8 years you had to go to your GP. 
As Sbarrett says , you have to stand up.
You will find when you do, that things improve in your own head!.


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## geri (31 Jul 2014)

Hi Toni,
I hope everythng works out for you.  I just wanted to say, that going by your user name and the fact that you give some details about where you work, you would be fairly easily identified.  You might want to remove a bit of detail from your first post, and possible change your user name to something more random.  Other people at your work place may use this site too.  I'm sure you want to remain anonomous.
Good luck in getting this sorted.
Geri


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## toni_mrphy (31 Jul 2014)

Thanks Geri 

The user name bears no resemblance to my "real name " 

Thanks


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## STEINER (31 Jul 2014)

Sunny said:


> I know all about the funds industry.



As an outsider, I am exploring potential career options in same.  Any advice?


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## noproblem (31 Jul 2014)

I suggest you read my post again. When you do this, do so again and then tell me what "conclusion" you are talking about?


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## Leper (31 Jul 2014)

noproblem said:


> I take it that you're in the funds industry and if so, it's one where you've got to be on the ball, otherwise others in the team will have to continually pick up the slack. If I'm correct about it being the funds industry, I would advise you to look at a different career choice because there's lots of pressure and time limits, etc, etc, in this profession and I don't think this pressure suits you. Others seem to have spotted this and it won't get any better.



1.The poster is not in the funds industry for a start. First jump to conclusion.
2. In any job you must be "on the ball." You are assuming that she is not on the ball. 2nd leap.
3. Who says others  in the team are picking up any slack? 3rd jump
4. Then you play God advising to look at a different career. 4th jump
5. How do you know pressure does not suit? How do you know she is not reaching time limits etc etc? 5th and 6th jump.
6. What reason have you to believe that things won't get any better? - playing God again! 7th jump.

I don't even know why I am answering your post but congratulations on your fitness level at jumping to conclusions.


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## noproblem (31 Jul 2014)

1) I never said the person was in the funds industry. That's your "conclusion".
2) Your "conclusion" once again.
3) Ditto.
4) I never mentioned religion.
5)The poster mentions the stress being caused.
6) Religion again.

I did ask you to read my post, then I asked you to read it again. I see you did neither. As for you not knowing why you answered my post, what can one say?  I think that sums you up quite adequately.
By the way, I was simply responding to the writers original request, for which they thanked me. Now, to conclude, this post is not about you or indeed me. Suffice to say, enough of the tut tutting.


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## Leo (5 Aug 2014)

noproblem said:


> 1) I never said the person was in the funds industry. That's your "conclusion".



In fairness, 'I take it you are in the funds industry' actually means you are assuming they are in the funds industry. 

Anyway, you're now taking the thread off-topic, so let's leave it there and get back to the OP's query.


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## toni_mrphy (22 Mar 2018)

Hi All,
Not sure if I should have started a new thread or just reply to this one - so I did the latter  
Its been almost four years since the above post and in the interim period nothing improved in fact things got progressively worse .
In the 24 months after this thread I went to HR twice with issues , opened a grievance procedure with HR ( this was useless as my manger basically lied in her reply ) 
Also in the 24 months months two people left the group saying only the team ( not manager ) that they were unhappy with how they are treated .
Last year another team member was out for 6 months in meeting the had with HR they specifically called out the manger as an issue .
Not long after his ( August last year ) all the team had a meeting with HR where all the team were vocal about the poor management - favouritism , uneven workload , aggressive manner , ignoring some people in the group ( specifically me )etc  .
We then had a meeting with the team , our manager ( and his manager ) and HR to talk through the grievances - basically there was a lot of waffle but nothing was really addressed.
Within two months of these meetings  I was advised by my mangers manger  that I would be moving to a different dept as they "needed a person of my experience " . It was not a job I wanted but felt I had no choice . 
It was just after I started this new job that I raised another grievance detailing the issues I encountered over the previous 3 1/2 years . HR interviewed all my team members  as part of the procedure and after 10 weeks HR arranged a meeting with me to tell me my complaint was upheld . 
That was two weeks and I have heard nothing else .
My old manager is going around laughing and joking without a care .
 Though I no longer report to the manger in question we do still have the same senior manager and I would have expected some sort of acknowledgement of the upheld complaint from her .
Its like it never happened .
Sorry for the long email but I am looking for some perspective am I being over sensitive ?
Should there not be some remedial steps ?
Thanks


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## jim (22 Mar 2018)

Hi Toni,

Thanks for coming back with the update on your situation. It sounds like a difficult place to work or at least for you to work. I think there is something called "constructive dismissal" that might apply to your scenario if it were the case that you could no longer work there due to the grievances that you have noted and complained of. So if it were the case that you were effectively bullied into leaving your job and the bullying or intimidation resulted in a GP diagnosing an illness then perhaps your employer (or former employer if you were to leave) would be liable for some remediation. Or the Workplace Relations Commissions, would they have jurisdiction here? If I were you I would peruse this.

Jim


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## Easeler (22 Mar 2018)

4 years is a long time to be suffering in a job you hate. Sounds like your not appeciated there time to move on.  You done well to stick it out your a better man than me .I am a firm believer  in the saying one door closes and another door opens , good luck to you.


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## toni_mrphy (22 Mar 2018)

Thanks for the replies . It does look like I have to leave but I do want leave with the process complete as it were .
Do HR have to do anything beyond telling me my complaint was upheld ?


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## gnf_ireland (22 Mar 2018)

Hi Toni
It’s worth keeping in mind that from 25th May this year, GDPR rules come into force. On this date submit an Employee Access Request for all data on your file, and all email/other correspondence where you are mentioned in it - including from your manager, management team or HR. They have 30 days to respond with the detail or will be in breech of Data Protection Regulations

This should show you the case files for the original complaints and the upheld one. Based on what actions are taken from the upheld one - I would consider taking legal action for bullying and constructive dismissal as @jim has noted. 

If a number of previous complaints were rejected and a subsequent complaint for the same issue is upheld, then there needs to be an explanation as to why the original complaints produced false negatives. There should also be some sort of redress put in place. They cannot simply sweep it under the carpet.

I would give it two weeks - then contact HR to confirm what the next steps are etc? 

But you do need to decide if you really want to continue working in the company or want to get out for your own well-being !


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## DeeKie (22 Mar 2018)

A complaint is different to a claim. They’re hoping that’s the end of it. Go to a solicitor.


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## bleary (22 Mar 2018)

I don't really understand. After 4 years you no longer report to the manager and hr have upheld your complaint  why would you leave now. What do you want out of the process?
Old boss to apologise? 
To be fired? 
To get your old job back? 
Or something else?


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## Clamball (22 Mar 2018)

What is the outcome you want here?   Do you want you old boss sanctioned?  Do you want an apology from her?  Do you want to see her change her ways. Do you want your senior boss to acknowledge the wrong done to you?  Do you want the company to work with you to give you back your reputation and to make sure the work you have is fulfilling?

As a consequence of you complaint being upheld you can say to HR, “Thank you for finding in my favour, as redress it is important to me that I see.....  This is important because otherwise I feel my boss has gotten away with her treatment of me and will carry on the same for some other new employee”. Just be really clear to HR what you want, otherwise they might think they have fully dealt with your complaint.   Best of luck


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## delfio (22 Mar 2018)

Just read this post Toni, all I can say is you must be a very strong person to put up with this 'This post will be deleted if not edited to remove bad language' for the past four years. Pursue this case, others would have given up a long time ago.  Cork has loads of work now, start looking for somewhere new and where your talents and abilities will be well appreciated. Good luck to you


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## toni_mrphy (5 Apr 2018)

Hi All, 

Many Thanks for your replies .

I met with HR again last week to ask again for them to put in writing that the complaint is upheld.
He told me to look elsewhere if I want a new job 
They ( HR & senior manager) are dealing with the "issues" that I raised in my complaint 
And that was it ( over one week on from that meeting I still have not received anything in writing )

For those that say I should get out and look for another job you are right - only issue is my confidence is shot , I am scared - of everything .

As for what I want out of this process its a mix of what bleary and clamball have asked 
Ideally I want the following 

I want my reputation back .
I want my senior boss to acknowledge the wrong done to me.

There is a very subtle undertone from senior management of anger towards me .


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## DeeKie (5 Apr 2018)

Go speak to a solicitor. That last meeting telling you to find another job is arguably constructive dismissal.


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## John Sipos (12 Apr 2018)

Hi Toni,
This sounds really hard. You've worked there so long, it's a shame they don't have a higher value on you. I don't think you're being overly sensitive.


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## jim (14 Dec 2020)

What was the outcome @toni_mrphy


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## Paul O Mahoney (15 Dec 2020)

Just my tuppence, what you endured is appalling and I understand why you want your reputation upheld and as someone who worked in Cork at a fairly senior level and for a major employer, speaking out or standing up for yourself is difficult. 
Cork is a very small place and the grapevine especially the work/career grapevine is a very real thing and it does effect you and your chances of being able to move on .
Cork isn't unique in this but as all HR people know each other and recruiting people are known to be buying drinks for them ,and the Cork Chamber is akin to a masonic lodge its understandable that you felt trapped.

Your last post was 11 years since you started and no doubt you have worked hard, Hold your head up high, and .... the begrudgers, I worked for 18 years in Cork and its my home town but working with some of the people from there tested my patience and realised just how nepotism and bullying was such feature in the workplace. 

I hope you have resolved the issues,  I can almost guess what/ where you were working.....


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