# Are my esb bills very big (With geothermal) ?



## celine26 (20 Mar 2012)

Hi we moved into our house last August. It was gutted, extended and refurbished. We put in tons of insulation and scored a B1 rating on the BER. We also put in a geothermal heat pump and night rate meter. The house is around 1800 square feet and a bungalow. We have the temp set at about 21 C. 

We got a few tiny bills last year. Before Christmas we got one for about €350. Then after Christmas one came for €600 and our latest one is €400. I know that they were estimating for a while so I can understand the big one for €600 but I think the latest one is a bit steep. I need to start monitoring units etc to try to work out where we're going wrong. I have turned down the heat in the past few weeks because we're finding the bills hard to pay. 

We have all new appliances mostly with A ratings. We run the dishwasher and washing machine at night and try to keep windows closed etc. I dont have a dryer or any other really greedy appliances, we dont even have out outside lights installed yet. The only other change I can think of that I have to make is to change all the bulbs to the energy saving ones. 

Are these bills normal? Am I expecting too much from the heat pump? Any help would be most welcome. 

Many thanks


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## PolkaDot (20 Mar 2012)

Seems quite big. My wife and I live in a 3 bed semi-d, just the two of us. Our last ESB bill was €120 for two months (Jan + Feb).


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## rgfuller (20 Mar 2012)

There was a huge thread on this which you can find here : http://www.askaboutmoney.com/showthread.php?t=34579

Bear in mind that electricity costs are much higher (approx 61%) than when that thread was started too.

I couldn't open the source page of the 61% stat - but from here: [broken link removed]

(Electricity prices to industry in Ireland were *43%* higher in real terms in the fourth quarter (Q4) of *2010* than in the
year *2005*. Real prices are where the effects of inflation have been removed, essentially a constant price. *Electricity*​*prices to households in Ireland were 2% higher in real terms in Q4 of 2010 than in the year 2005*.)


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## Cents&Sense (20 Mar 2012)

I also have Geothermal in a 2,800sq.ft house - from Sept '09 to Sept '11 the total cost (paid) of Electricity was c.€6,000 incl. Vat and standing charges. The electrical pumps to circulate the heating are the biggest cost together with using an immersion heater to boost the heat-pump heated water from 40deg to 60deg. 

I have just today completed an in-depth check (based on my photo records of meter readings) of charges made by my supplier V's amounts paid and a difference of c. +€1,200 has come to light. I did the check as I received a bill last week for €800 for Jan-Feb - 100% increase on the average!! Worth checking.


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## Fiskar (20 Mar 2012)

You need to put an energy monitor on to the items that you think are the large drawers of elctricity. Have to say those geo thermals appear to be savage energy users. 
Am in C2 BER house after piling in a stove, attic insulation and pumping the walls. 

As a comparison, in our detached bungalow we spend 150€ bi-monthly on electric and 70€ on oil heating monthly. Stove is a wood and coal burner and probably costs 20€ per month. 

Reckon all round I am coming out better than the geothermal.


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## bluemac (20 Mar 2012)

I have geothermal 4500sqft and thought my bills were high I checked the electric for a year, taking readings and worked out the machine only costs me €500 of my bill for the year, just lights in winter add a good bit and the oven on a Sunday uses 13 units a days extra electricity, electric showers and old fridge freezer can add a good bit.

I run my machine for 4 hours 4-8am to make use of night saver and found that 1 hour at about 4-5pm on cold days is more than enough to heat the house. The year before i let it come on and off when need and it costs a lot more for the year.


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## celine26 (21 Mar 2012)

Thank you for all the help and advice it is great to hear other situations. Bluemac I didnt know that the heat pump can be put on a timer I thought it had to work on a thermostat so I'll definitely be having a look at that. I also need to change my bulbs which are just normal ones. I've had a look at the meter and figured out how to calculate it so hopefully I can get a better handle on these bills.


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## STEINER (21 Mar 2012)

Just an aside on the energy saving bulbs, I bought my parents 3 CFLs back in 1994/95.  They are still working, I don't know whether current offerings would beat that!


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## lowCO2design (22 Mar 2012)

celine26 said:


> Hi we moved into our house last August. It was gutted, extended and refurbished. We put in tons of insulation and scored a B1 rating on the BER. We also put in a geothermal heat pump and night rate meter. The house is around 1800 square feet and a bungalow. We have the temp set at about 21 C.
> 
> We got a few tiny bills last year. Before Christmas we got one for about €350. Then after Christmas one came for €600 and our latest one is €400. I know that they were estimating for a while so I can understand the big one for €600 but I think the latest one is a bit steep. I need to start monitoring units etc to try to work out where we're going wrong. I have turned down the heat in the past few weeks because we're finding the bills hard to pay.
> 
> ...


Hi celine, I presume this is running with Underfloor heating? 
these bills do seem high but and leads me to recommend:


employ an UFH & GSHP specialist to assess the system
presuming thats OK, get a heat loss assessment (thermal imagining) and possibly an air-tightness test also (really al of the above should have done while you were refurbishing)
unfortunately the BER system is merely a rough energy rating system and is not a good design tool - particularly where 'deep' retro-fit is being carried out along with GSHP. there is a chance that your homes thermal bridging/ heat loss and air-leakage may be part of this problem - it may also just be the case that the systems needs to be Serviced/checked/troubleshooted.


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## bartbridge (10 Apr 2012)

We have a 3,000sq ft house with geothermal, new build and we're in it a year. Just checked our bills from April 2011 to February 2012 and it works out as €82 per month including all appliances and lighting.


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## heavydawson (30 Apr 2012)

bartbridge said:


> We have a 3,000sq ft house with geothermal, new build and we're in it a year. Just checked our bills from April 2011 to February 2012 and it works out as €82 per month including all appliances and lighting.



Hey Bartbridge, I'm looking at installing GSHP in a new build. Can you tell me the make/model of the pump in use, and who supplied and installed it for you?


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## shoestring (30 Apr 2012)

Sounds very similar to our bills and we have a air to heat pump system


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## bluemac (30 Apr 2012)

heavydawson said:


> Hey Bartbridge, I'm looking at installing GSHP in a new build. Can you tell me the make/model of the pump in use, and who supplied and installed it for you?



Mine is a Heliotherm GSHP installed by Heatsource in Meath


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## Bazg2020 (23 Apr 2020)

Hi, has anyone installed PV solar to use the power to help keep down the electricity bill where geothermal is used


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## Laughahalla (25 Apr 2020)

OP, For all your energy heating/water heating and all appliances over winter and at 21 degrees is high but doesn't seem excessively high.

21 degrees for me would be way too hot. Could you try 20 degrees. That would reduce your bill .

With the shutdown maybe you and your family is at home more using more energy.


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## Mrs Vimes (25 Apr 2020)

Wow, just imagining a mention of "shutdown" in 2012!


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