# Secondary school teaching:can't seem to get a job as a sub, even for a day.Any advice



## dweller (5 Feb 2006)

Hi there,
can't seem to get a job as a sub, even for a day.Any advice? Only have a degree by the way, no hdip.
Dweller


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## DrMoriarty (6 Feb 2006)

*Re: secondary school teaching*



			
				dweller said:
			
		

> Only have a degree by the way, no hdip.


That there might be your problem. There are lots of qualified teachers available for subbing. What are your degree subjects?


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## kazbah (6 Feb 2006)

*Re: secondary school teaching*

Where are you based?


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## Cati76 (6 Feb 2006)

*Re: secondary school teaching*

Instead of starting a new thread, I will ask here, as my situation is similar. I have a degree in Maths, but didn't get a place to do the Hdip, (my degree is not from Ireland, although I have a Msc from UCC), and I've been told to do some sub to get experience and get some points before applying again. Where should I look? Thanks.


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## kazbah (6 Feb 2006)

*Re: secondary school teaching*

Write to all the schools you could reach by 9am and outline your availability and experience.  I can't see that working long term though.  Eventually you will probably displaced by qualified teachers.  Does it have to be teaching hours in a secondary school to count for points?  Or could you use teaching hours in primary school/evening class.

Have you considered giving Maths grinds to make ends meet?
If you declared and documented this income maybe it would count as teaching hours?

Have you requested that your course be considered for eligibility?


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## Cati76 (6 Feb 2006)

*Re: secondary school teaching*

My course was recognised to access the Hdip, but because grading is so different in my home country, didn't reach the minimum, was short of a point!!!! (and I have a 1st Honours in my MSC here). And yes, it has to be secondary school teaching, I did some tutoring while studying but they won't take it into account. I might try again next year, but it's difficult to get the experience when in a FT job.


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## Chamar (6 Feb 2006)

*Re: secondary school teaching*

Contact schools directly. Outside of Dubin, there is a lot of subbing available - at a good hourly rate.


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## kazbah (6 Feb 2006)

*Re: secondary school teaching*

I think it is €37.50 unqualified.


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## dweller (6 Feb 2006)

*Re: secondary school teaching*

Hi there,
I live in Kerry.My subjects are biology and science.I've applied for the hdip alright but I know I won't get it.By the way they do take hours clocked up in primary schools as teaching hours for the hdip.I rang them and asked them, so that's a fact.All I need is a start, a bit of experience , and I would feel more confident.At the moment the whole thing seems a bit daunting but I know if I just got in the door I'd be ok.By the way can anyone tell me why teachers seem so stuck up or do they have to be like that.


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## Gordanus (13 Feb 2006)

*Re: secondary school teaching*

Have you tried the local Vocational Schools?  (name might have changed)  I was on a list with them once and eventually 10 months later got a phone call asking if I would step in and run a course.  I told him I was 8 months pregnant, but he still insisted!  I did refuse quite adamantly in the end.   Anyway, always put yourself on a list!


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## Judybaby73 (12 Mar 2006)

*Re: secondary school teaching*

[.By the way can anyone tell me why teachers seem so stuck up or do they have to be like that.[/quote]


Ha ha !!! remember that generailised statements are generally wrong!! and not all of us are "stuck up" but yes .... some are ....but let me stress again....NOT ALL....

Advice here to all wanting to teach ...don't do it! The pay is crap, the work is hard and everyone thinks you've great holidays! Nobody thinks of the endless correcting and planning of classes. I'm serious. Im never in bed early and that's not because I'm crap it'c because you have to plan for each individual group -individually all the time!

The  three best things about teaching:

JUNE
JULY and 
AUGUST ....

worst thing is the money! but if you love children ...then go for it ...after that everything is easy !


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## killeoin (13 Mar 2006)

*Re: secondary school teaching*



			
				Judybaby73 said:
			
		

> Advice here to all wanting to teach ...don't do it! The pay is crap, the work is hard and everyone thinks you've great holidays! Nobody thinks of the endless correcting and planning of classes. I'm serious. Im never in bed early and that's not because I'm crap it'c because you have to plan for each individual group -individually all the time!
> 
> worst thing is the money!


 

ummm.....you must be in your first year. Generally teachers use the same notes year in year out and have classes planned the same way year on year. You seem to be talking jibberish. 
And if the worst thing is the money can you tell me what teachers actually get paid per hour?...I have a feeling your views may be a bit bias...


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## irishlinks (13 Mar 2006)

*Re: secondary school teaching*

The teachers at my kids school don't seem to spend much time correcting homework at all - they hardly ever take the books in! Is that normal practice in many schools. They might get a few kids to read out their answers and then take the books in once a half term!!


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## killeoin (13 Mar 2006)

*Re: secondary school teaching*



			
				irishlinks said:
			
		

> The teachers at my kids school don't seem to spend much time correcting homework at all - they hardly ever take the books in! Is that normal practice in many schools. They might get a few kids to read out their answers and then take the books in once a half term!!


 

Or of course the old favourite, get the kids to correct each others homework!


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## Judybaby73 (3 Apr 2006)

*Re: secondary school teaching*



			
				killeoin said:
			
		

> ummm.....you must be in your first year. Generally teachers use the same notes year in year out and have classes planned the same way year on year. You seem to be talking jibberish.
> And if the worst thing is the money can you tell me what teachers actually get paid per hour?...I have a feeling your views may be a bit bias...


 

Me in my first year of teaching? I qualified in 1994! While some notes/overheads etc can be used year in year out others can't. It is fundamental that lession plans meet the needs of each group you have. Groups, abilities and individual needs vary for heavens sake. Surely you can understand that. It isn't as easy as taking your folder out everyday and filling them with info. I have to stress that the traditional method of curriculum implemtation is (galdly) gone! NO longer are our students passively sitting in classes. We now encourage them to engage in hueristic learning. (that means discovery)
All classes should meet the groups individualised needs! Therefore we no longer have one edcuational diet to be administered to the students in the fastest possible way. All student of all abilities must be accepted,welcomed and valued and in order to do this class...notes...overheads...assignments etc CONSTANTLY need updating....if you don't do this then its not the child-centred approach which the department of ed and science now advocate. 

I spend hours working with and on behalf of my students. Alot of which is in my own time. I don't mind because I get outstanding results. I am not bias but I do think that the money is pathetic for teachers like me who work damn hard and get superb results! Bring back the payment by results i say (JOKING before Im slated!) 

Teachers get paid something like 27euro ph. I'm on a salary and earned something like 36K basic last year! (That's point 6 of the scale, its also brought up by 5k as I have a PhD)

I wasn't talking "jibberish" and am praying that you *ARE NOT* a teacher because if you are then I would have question the quality of your teaching if you are "recycling notes year in year out! 

As Pat Conroy the great American writer stated:

_*"Once can do anything ...anything at all if provided with a passionate and gifted teacher"*_

If I was working in the private sector with my qualifications I 'd be getting triple what I earn in teaching. Yup I choose this route and the reason I'm still in it is because I know I make a difference (however corny it sounds) and the holidays actually suit me.

What comes to mind however is "If you pay peanuts your get monkeys"!!! 



(Obviously not me of course!)


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## gel (3 Apr 2006)

*Re: secondary school teaching*

If every one of the professions (and other workers too) got into a rant about how hard they work then AAM would be swamped with wingers. You would think that teachers have a monoploy in the hard work department and are poorly paid. If you could get three times your present salary in the private sector then you are silly for not doing so. The reality is that you probably couldn't. Sorry but teachers do not get my sympathy. You do have potential to earn extra with grinds, exam correcting etc. Secondly you did make a choice to become one and I am sure you knew of it's pros & cons.

Gel


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## Judybaby73 (3 Apr 2006)

*Re: secondary school teaching*



			
				gel said:
			
		

> If every one of the professions (and other workers too) got into a rant about how hard they work then AAM would be swamped with whingers. You would think that teachers have a monoply in the hard work department and are poorly paid. If you could get three times your present salary in the private sector then you are silly for not doing so. The reality is that you probably couldn't. Sorry but teachers do not get my sympathy. You do have potential to earn extra with grinds, exam correcting etc. Secondly you did make a choice to become one and I am sure you knew of it's pros & cons.
> 
> Gel


 
It wasn't a rant....maybe you need a good teacher to explain what I've just said!


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## DrMoriarty (3 Apr 2006)

*Re: secondary school teaching*

...and/or correct your spelling and punctuation mistakes? There's quite 'alot' of them!


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## Purple (3 Apr 2006)

*Re: Secondary school teaching*

Judybaby73, I thought that secondary teachers did about 18 hours a week plus prep work 33 weeks a year. Are you saying that there is 20 hours plus prep work a week? Even if there should be, are you suggesting that the average teacher does this? I fully accept that the best teachers do this and more but your unions are against rewarding those who work hard so that cannot be taken into account when teachers’ pay is assessed.
18 hours a week 33 weeks a year is about 600 hours a year or just over 15 39-hour weeks. That's about €2'300 per week for each standard week worked. Not bad.


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## gel (3 Apr 2006)

*Re: Secondary school teaching*

DrMoriarty

Look at Judybaby73’s post above and you will see that she has many more spelling mistakes than I. I can only assume that she is does not teach English. 
Maybe she is the one that needs a good teacher. You did pick on me unfairly because there are other posts here which do not qualify for your high standards of prose.

In fairness to her I do see where she is coming from. She is obviously someone who puts the effort into her work and takes pride in it. I wish she was teaching my children. My point in return is that no matter what profession you are in you need to work hard to succeed. Teaching is no different. Other workers in my opinion work longer hours and don’t have the luxury of the long holidays. On a general note non teachers in my opinion do not seem to complain as much as teachers.

Gel

ps how many spelling mistakes did I have?


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## DrMoriarty (3 Apr 2006)

*Re: secondary school teaching*



			
				DrMoriarty said:
			
		

> ...and/or correct your spelling and punctuation mistakes? There's quite 'alot' of them!


Gel, sorry about the confusion — this was addressed to _Judybaby73_, not you!

I agree with what's been said here about good/bad, lazy/hardworking, committed/cynical teachers. My own guesstimate is that the 40:40:20 rule applies — 20% of teachers are extremely committed and hardworking, and do an excellent job for precious little thanks. 40% of them are just average/reasonably competent, _sans plus_. 40% of them range from slightly below average/a bit on the lazy side through to downright incompetent/unfit/should be removed.

The problem is that they/we all draw basically the same paycheck...


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## Judybaby73 (3 Apr 2006)

*Re: Secondary school teaching*



			
				gel said:
			
		

> DrMoriarty
> 
> Look at Judybaby73’s post above and you will see that she has many more spelling mistakes than I. I can only assume that she is does not teach English.
> 
> ...


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## Judybaby73 (3 Apr 2006)

*Re: Secondary school teaching*



			
				Purple said:
			
		

> Judybaby73, I thought that secondary teachers did about 18 hours a week plus prep work 33 weeks a year. Are you saying that there is 20 hours plus prep work a week? Even if there should be, are you suggesting that the average teacher does this? I fully accept that the best teachers do this and more but your unions are against rewarding those who work hard so that cannot be taken into account when teachers’ pay is assessed.
> 18 hours a week 33 weeks a year is about 600 hours a year or just over 15 39-hour weeks. That's about €2'300 per week for each standard week worked. Not bad.


 

22 hours a week in a secondary school! Could be up till 3 or 4am correcting and setting work! I'm a fantastic Teacher (now Lecturer) though so well worth it...I guess.....


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## Judybaby73 (3 Apr 2006)

*Re: secondary school teaching*



			
				DrMoriarty said:
			
		

> Gel, sorry about the confusion — this was addressed to _Judybaby73_, not you!


 
a lot/alot whatever ....my spelling has nothing to do with this thread. It's a pity that you are going off the point. Sit up straight and pay attention DrMoriarty! 
Please refer to previous post on my inability to spell! Not an excuse but a good explanation for my poor spelling. Its a pity though that I have to do it all the time.

If people want clarification on any disability (and not just dyslexia) please PM me! I'm an expert.


 DrMoriarty?  Doctor??? really? PhD?


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## DrMoriarty (3 Apr 2006)

*Re: Secondary school teaching*

Oh, come on now, Judybaby, let's not get too touchy! I only threw in that little '' comment because for someone so fond of the , confidence-boosting, character-developing line, it seemed to me you were being a little judgemental/condescending towards the other views being expressed...


			
				Judybaby73 said:
			
		

> Surely you can understand that. [...]
> ....maybe you need a good teacher to explain what I've just said!


But hey, you're the 'expert'. With a PhD in cherishing all abilities equally...  


			
				Judybaby73 said:
			
		

> I'm a fantastic Teacher (now Lecturer) though so well worth it [...]
> I get outstanding results. I am not bias but I do think that the money is pathetic for teachers like me who work damn hard and get superb results! [...]
> If people want clarification on any disability (and not just dyslexia) please PM me! I'm an expert.


And you have heuristically established that all your students' (and now student teachers') superb results are and always will be down to your own fantastic methods? I must try some of that research you mention.

I don't want to drag this any further off-topic, so — as you say — whatever...
_(and yes, since you ask — really!  )_


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## Janet (3 Apr 2006)

*Re: Secondary school teaching*



			
				gel said:
			
		

> DrMoriarty
> 
> Look at Judybaby73’s post above and you will see that she has many more spelling mistakes than I. I can only assume that she is does not teach English.
> Maybe she is the one that needs a good teacher. You did pick on me unfairly because there are other posts here which do not qualify for your high standards of prose.
> ...



As always everything is open to interpretation - I assumed DrM's post was referring to Judy's post not yours!  Perhaps he'll verify for us?


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## Judybaby73 (3 Apr 2006)

*Re: Secondary school teaching*



			
				DrMoriarty said:
			
		

> Oh, come on now, Judybaby, let's not get too touchy! I only threw in that little '' comment because for someone so fond of the , confidence-boosting, character-developing line, it seemed to me you were being a little judgemental/condescending towards the other views being expressed...
> 
> But hey, you're the 'expert'. With a PhD in cherishing all abilities equally...
> And you have heuristically established that all your students' (and now student teachers') superb results are and always will be down to your own fantastic methods? I must try some of that research you mention.
> ...


 
Not touchy at all Dr!You missed the point actually! What's the PhD in? I have one too but I don't feel the need to use my title! Lmao! They seem to be giving them to anyone?...even dyslexics and .... ohhhh.....whatever!


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## DrMoriarty (3 Apr 2006)

*Re: Secondary school teaching*



			
				Judybaby73 said:
			
		

> They seem to be giving them to anyone?...even dyslexics and .... ohhhh.....whatever!


Whatever, indeed... (I'd much prefer to use my true title, but it's deemed anachronistic!)

Peace, dear Learned Colleague?


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## DrMoriarty (3 Apr 2006)

*Re: Secondary school teaching*

In an effort to make amends for sidetracking the thread, can I refer the OP to this useful (ASTI) [broken link removed]?


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## Judybaby73 (3 Apr 2006)

*Re: Secondary school teaching*



			
				DrMoriarty said:
			
		

> Whatever, indeed... (I'd much prefer to use my true title, but it's deemed anachronistic!)
> .
> Peace, dear Learned Colleague?


 

 

_War makes good history but peace is poor reading."_
_ 
Thomas Hardy
 
Peace...absolutley. I guess you should be forgiven as you haven't a clue what you are talking about especially in relation to our ecuation system!

The best way to destroy an enemy is to make him a friend." 
-- Abraham Lincoln 
 

​_


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## Judybaby73 (3 Apr 2006)

*Re: Secondary school teaching*

www.postgrad.ie 
good info and can download a brochure on the H.Dip


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## Purple (3 Apr 2006)

*Re: Secondary school teaching*

Jb73, You really have to chill out. You are taking a few jocular remarks from DrM WAY to seriously.


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## Judybaby73 (3 Apr 2006)

*Re: Secondary school teaching*



			
				Purple said:
			
		

> Jb73, You really have to chill out. You are taking a few jocular remarks from DrM WAY to seriously.


 
nah ...I'm not really! if you only knew me!!!! It's called p*** t*****. My PhD is in that! But what I did say above is true!


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## Fran75 (3 Apr 2006)

*Re: Secondary school teaching*

I am new to this site as it was recommended to me by a friend.  I am a teacher in the plc area and I was immediately drawn to this link, however I am shocked at the badgering that is taking place during this discussion.  I feel that Judybaby gave an honest and intelligent answer to a question which was posed at the onset of this discussion.  Personally speaking, I am approaching my 9th year as a teacher in the Performing Arts sector.  I would never dream of recycling my notes year after year as this would provide a less than satisfactory response to students individual needs.  It is indeed very easy to give the typical response 'teachers are overpaid'.  I feel judy has been creative and uncomplaining in her response.  Feel free to proof read my response.  I'm sure you will find many typing errors.


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## Judybaby73 (4 Apr 2006)

*Re: Secondary school teaching*



			
				Fran75 said:
			
		

> I am new to this site as it was recommended to me by a friend. I am a teacher in the plc area and I was immediately drawn to this link, however I am shocked at the badgering that is taking place during this discussion. I feel that Judybaby gave an honest and intelligent answer to a question which was posed at the onset of this discussion. Personally speaking, I am approaching my 9th year as a teacher in the Performing Arts sector. I would never dream of recycling my notes year after year as this would provide a less than satisfactory response to students individual needs. It is indeed very easy to give the typical response 'teachers are overpaid'. I feel judy has been creative and uncomplaining in her response. Feel free to proof read my response. I'm sure you will find many typing errors.


 
Hello Fran75 and welcome to AAM. It is great to be joined on here by someone who understands! So Fran75....are you permanant yet? I mean you can't be ...you are only teaching 9 years?

 Also Fran75 what do you think of the financial gains from teaching?? Are you as "rich" as me? Do you have your mortgage and shiny new car? People on here seem to think that us teachers have an easy life. What you think?

Finally Fran75 ...would you recommend it ....teaching that is ...??


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## Fran75 (4 Apr 2006)

*Re: Secondary school teaching*

Thank you for your welcome Judy.  To answer some of your questions, no, I am not permanent, I drive a 98 reg car and I am certainly not rich!!!  It is very difficult to become a permanent teacher and I would not recommend it as a career path.  I do enjoy my job and I can tell from your passionate response that you feel the same.  It is very satisfying, however if I could go back in time to nine years ago and I posed the question on this site, I would hope that someone like you would talk me out of it!  Why?  It requires long hours (over 18 hours per week!!) and there are alot of extra curricular activities!!  My working day starts at 8.50 am and as of yet this term I have not returned home before 7pm.  Then, I start correcting!  Do you have a B post yet judy?  I don't know how many years servitude you have completed?


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## Judybaby73 (4 Apr 2006)

*Re: Secondary school teaching*

I have a temp B post Fran75. It will be going in June! I am teaching since 1994. Employed in current position since 2000. Have you a contract of indefinite duration?

Do you teach FETAC modules too?


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## extopia (4 Apr 2006)

*Re: Secondary school teaching*



			
				Judybaby73 said:
			
		

> its having the ability to be creative too which is a far more important attribute.



It's "it's," not "its."  (Sorry, one of my pet hates.)

On the other hand, I commend you for preparing for each class, day after day, rather than recycling the same old stuff like some of the lifers out there.


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## MugsGame (4 Apr 2006)

*Re: Secondary school teaching*



> It requires long hours (over 18 hours per week!!)


Yes, I sympathise with those "long" hours! Did you really mean eighty hours? 
If this is common-place, surely the teachers unions could take a case to Europe under the working time directive?


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## ajapale (4 Apr 2006)

*Re: Secondary school teaching:can't seem to get a job as a sub, even for a day.Any ad*

Dwellers OP was as follows:



> can't seem to get a job as a sub, even for a day.Any advice? Only have a degree by the way, no hdip.
> Dweller



Has dwellers original question been answered?

aj


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## Judybaby73 (4 Apr 2006)

*Re: Secondary school teaching:can't seem to get a job as a sub, even for a day.Any ad*



			
				ajapale said:
			
		

> Dwellers OP was as follows:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Yes...get a different job


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## Judybaby73 (4 Apr 2006)

*Re: Secondary school teaching*



			
				extopia said:
			
		

> It's "it's," not "its."  (Sorry, one of my pet hates.)
> 
> I hope you really are dyslexic, because illiteracy is not a good sign, whether one teaches English or P.E. - or does any other knowledge-based job. Literacy sends its own message about your standards of excellence.
> 
> On the other hand, I commend you for preparing for each class, day after day, rather than recycling the same old stuff like some of the lifers out there.



You know this is a forum....not a spelling test and some of us are not trained  to type. Seriously what a ridiculous thing to say and YES I'm dyslexic. PrObLeM??? Now if you  have nothing to say regarding the initial question why pipe in just be negative??


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## DrMoriarty (4 Apr 2006)

As the teachers said to the Minitster, *Dr *Woods, a [broken link removed]..?  

[broken link removed]


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## Judybaby73 (4 Apr 2006)

*Re: Secondary school teaching*



			
				extopia said:
			
		

> I hope you really are dyslexic, because illiteracy is not a good sign, whether one teaches English or P.E. - or does any other knowledge-based job. Literacy sends its own message about your standards of excellence.


 
I'm illiterate am I? Answers on a tape to ....


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## buzybee (4 Apr 2006)

Some of the teachers think they can get 3 times their salary in the private sector.  However, I am in the private sector and I am still not well paid.

I think in order to get well paid, it is a combination of hard work, getting into a good company, the right experience early on in your career, and everything falling into place careerwise.

If a teacher left their job in the morning, they would probably not get a senior position in e.g. chemistry or accountancy.  The companies would take them on at a junior/mid level, as they would not have industry experience.  They would probably not get 3 times their salary, or at least not until they have 10 yrs useful experience with big companies.

If teachers would REALLY get 3 times their salary in the private sector, why not just walk out of their job!!  They will not walk out of their jobs, especially if they are permanent.  A permanent job is nothing to be sniffed at. It means you will never be made redundant or have to take a lower level job.  It means a pension as well.  I think the permanency, pension benefits and the shorter hours more than compensate for the 'lower' pay as a teacher.


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## Judybaby73 (4 Apr 2006)

buzybee said:
			
		

> Some of the teachers think they can get 3 times their salary in the private sector. However, I am in the private sector and I am still not well paid.
> 
> I think in order to get well paid, it is a combination of hard work, getting into a good company, the right experience early on in your career, and everything falling into place careerwise.
> 
> ...


 

Lots of "probabilities"there Buzybee. Obviously teachers are not in this career for the money.....Well not since the marriage bar  was removed in 1973.


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## Purple (5 Apr 2006)

Judybaby73 said:
			
		

> Obviously teachers are not in this career for the money.....Well not since the marriage bar  was removed in 1973.


So are they all in it for the love of the job or are some in it for the short hours, long holidays, pension and the probability of a permanent job that it is virtually impossible to loose, even through gross incompetence?

Teachers are not well paid by industry standard but hour for hour over the year they are on a huge salary. I would not like to be a teacher as I would not like the job but we can all complain about what's wrong in our jobs and why we should have more. IMHO taking a holistic view of life teachers do quite well. But since I have never worked as one I cannot offer a fully informed opinion.
Have you ever had a job where you are shouted at by your boss, have no union, no job security and work 60 hours over a 6 or 7 day week and never get your full 20 days holidays? That's reality for some people out there in the private sector, the "real world" as some might say, so the grass is not always greener. 
For most of us the lack of job security, long hours and inability to take all of out meagre holidays is or has been a reality in our job.


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## Judybaby73 (5 Apr 2006)

*Re: Secondary school teaching:can't seem to get a job as a sub, even for a day.Any ad*



			
				Purple said:
			
		

> Have you ever had a job where you are shouted at by your boss, have no union, no job security and work 60 hours over a 6 or 7 day week and never get your full 20 days holidays? That's reality for some people out there in the private sector, the "real world" as some might say, so the grass is not always greener.
> For most of us the lack of job security, long hours and inability to take all of out meagre holidays is or has been a reality in our job.


 
I choose to stay in my job because I love it....not for the money. Why are you still in a job that ..lacks security...has long hours and all the rest you mentioned! 


[FONT=georgia, bookman old style, palatino linotype, book antiqua, palatino, trebuchet ms, helvetica, garamond, sans-serif, arial, verdana, avante garde, century gothic, comic sans ms, times, times new roman, serif]"_*Lots of folks confuse bad management with destiny*_" ~Kin Hubbard[/FONT]

[FONT=georgia, bookman old style, palatino linotype, book antiqua, palatino, trebuchet ms, helvetica, garamond, sans-serif, arial, verdana, avante garde, century gothic, comic sans ms, times, times new roman, serif]I just think we determine our own possibilities[/FONT]


[FONT=georgia, bookman old style, palatino linotype, book antiqua, palatino, trebuchet ms, helvetica, garamond, sans-serif, arial, verdana, avante garde, century gothic, comic sans ms, times, times new roman, serif]Oh Judybaby73 ...have you opened a new can of worms?


[/FONT]


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## Purple (5 Apr 2006)

I stay in my job because I get to be creative, am my own boss and am rewarded for success. The lack of job security is the way it should be; if you are not good enough you should be sacked, or in my case I would go out of business. 
Long hours are a reality for most people in the private sector, and many in the public sector as well. I don't moan about it, if I didn't like it I would do something else.


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## ClubMan (5 Apr 2006)

I think this thread is heading over to _Letting Off Steam _soon - especially since the original poster seems to be no longer around.


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## Purple (5 Apr 2006)

I agree


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## patspost (8 Apr 2006)

I did  a bit of subbing a long time ago, I went around a few schools and asked for the VP, gave them my CV and told them what subjects was interested in etc. Said I was going to do the dip and wanted a bit of experience first!!
1 school did advise that due to their system they were not the fastest of payers, I told them it was not a porb.
In the end between the 2 schools got enough work to keep me going while (on and off for 4 months). Also enough work to decide teaching was not the career for me.


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## Guest127 (10 Apr 2006)

some teachers are great. some are crap. I have a son who sat the leaving cert two years ago. I knew from a long time back that his french and maths teachers were crap. encouraged him to take grinds but he refused. anyway with 2 months to the leaving he realised, belatedly, and not wanting to resit the leaving, that he needed points from somewhere, anywhere to get him his target of 420. So he borrowed geography books from one of his mates and started reading them and took advice/help from others who were studying geography for the previous two years. Result: His geography marks were higher than either his french or maths and counted towards his points tally. I know I am partially to blame for not forcing him to take the grinds etc, and he did achieve his target. His school ( they call themselves a college) needless to say doesn't feature in the top 400 in Ireland. and with some teachers of the calibre they have this is no surprise. Good teachers should be rewarded and bad teachers should also also receive their reward. This will never happen of course. Rant over.


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## Purple (10 Apr 2006)

cuchulainn said:
			
		

> some teachers are great. some are crap. I have a son who sat the leaving cert two years ago. I knew from a long time back that his french and maths teachers were crap. encouraged him to take grinds but he refused. anyway with 2 months to the leaving he realised, belatedly, and not wanting to resit the leaving, that he needed points from somewhere, anywhere to get him his target of 420. So he borrowed geography books from one of his mates and started reading them and took advice/help from others who were studying geography for the previous two years. Result: His geography marks were higher than either his french or maths and counted towards his points tally. I know I am partially to blame for not forcing him to take the grinds etc, and he did achieve his target. His school ( they call themselves a college) needless to say doesn't feature in the top 400 in Ireland. and with some teachers of the calibre they have this is no surprise. Good teachers should be rewarded and bad teachers should also also receive their reward. This will never happen of course. Rant over.


Not trying to be smart, and I agree with the general point that you are making, but should your son not have dropped maths or French and taken geography from day one? 
Do you agree that teachers should get a fixed term contract (5-7 years) which would be open to review after that time? This would reduce the abuse of temporary teachers by schools.

To the teachers reading this thread, do you think that in the context of the chronic shortage of qualified teachers it’s right that career breaks should be allowed at the moment?


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## Guest127 (10 Apr 2006)

Purple: think he required the maths. totally agree about the French. Daughter attended different all girls secondary school. French teacher was very good. had a great vocabulary in first year. I suppose thats how we judged his French teacher. He did German up to junior cert and was was pretty ok with it but this 'college' splits the different subjects up so if you wanted to  study biology or science etc you could get lumbered with a subject you didnt want. thats what happened in his case. he needed a science subject but they were all tied in with French. some system. for what its worth he got a b3 in honours in geography, which was ok considering he started at Easter, and only got sitting in on a couple of lesson in total. georgraphy teacher was very understanding but as I said above he couldnt get to her classes as he had other classes during the geography ones.


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## dam099 (10 Apr 2006)

cuchulainn said:
			
		

> Purple: think he required the maths. totally agree about the French.


 
Isn't a foreign language a requirement for the NUI colleges as well? It might not have been what he was going for at the time but better not to restrict your options. Generally I would say it is advisable to do English/Maths/One foreign language/probably Irish for the Leaving to keep options open with regard to meeting as many of the minimum entrance requirements for the various third level institutions. For a limited number of certain other courses you might even need more specific subjects.


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## Purple (11 Apr 2006)

To clarify, I was talking about honours maths and French, which I presumed he was doing in order to get the points.


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## Guest127 (11 Apr 2006)

yes. But he didn't particularly want French. it was 'tied' into whatever way this college ran the subjects. ie in June you had to pick you chosen subjects from the number on offer. if you wanted say biology you couldn't get it 'teamed' with German. Dam099.he never appreciated the chance to learn French. Not that he would have with this particular teacher anyway. but even now he literally doesn't care.
got his points/subject in college. as far as he is concerned French is a foreign language. Pity. but a good teacher could have instilled at least a liking for the language and maybe the promise of the required points at the end of the journey. anyway he copped on himself and went about getting the points his way. Suppose something could be said for that. so he actually sat 8 subjects for his leaving. which is exactly the reverse of daughter who sat the min. Stopped studying for one subject with about 3 months  to go ( against teachers and schools advice) and put all eggs into the six baskets. Again got her choice of subject/college. cheers


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