# Diesel now more expensive than petrol - why?



## Ceist Beag (5 Feb 2008)

I'm curious as to how diesel is now more expensive than petrol when traditionally it has been around 10% (or more) cheaper than petrol. Is there a valid reason for this or could it be because diesel cars are suddenly much more popular? I'm speaking as someone who doesn't really understand the technicalities of how oil converts to petrol/diesel so is there anyone with better knowledge of this who might be able to explain how the rising cost of oil has a bigger impact on diesel prices or will the cynic in me be closer to the truth in that more SUVs on the road are contributing to this?


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## teachai (5 Feb 2008)

Its the garages profiteering because more people are switching to Diesel cars. 
Prices do seem to have converged a little bit, but I notice that my local Tesco 's Diesel is always cheaper than unleaded petrol. 

In general, if  I see a  garage charging more for diesel than unleaded, I will avoid it.


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## collieb (5 Feb 2008)

teachai said:


> Its the garages profiteering because more people are switching to Diesel cars.
> Prices do seem to have converged a little bit, but I notice that my local Tesco 's Diesel is always cheaper than unleaded petrol.
> 
> In general, if I see a garage charging more for diesel than unleaded, I will avoid it.


 
Tesco is now doing exactly that - Diesel 1.16 in Tesco Finglas over wkend and petrol was 1.15. Both had been the same price for previous few weeks.


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## werner (5 Feb 2008)

collieb said:


> Tesco is now doing exactly that - Diesel 1.16 in Tesco Finglas over wkend and petrol was 1.15. Both had been the same price for previous few weeks.


 
And to rub things in further, is it true that the excise duty? tax rate? on diesel is less that on petrol, if so the garages are are trousering even more of your money


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## manus (5 Feb 2008)

werner said:


> And to rub things in further, is it true that the excise duty? tax rate? on diesel is less that on petrol, if so the garages are are trousering even more of your money


diesel are made from the same product, crude oil. diesel and petrol are the same thing, the only difference is that petrol is refined more than diesel and therefore should be more expensive


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## ajapale (5 Feb 2008)

I remember reading that demand for home heating oil in the North American/European winter season drove up the price of diesel/gas oil relative to pertoleum. And that this effect was reversed in the summer months.


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## teachai (6 Feb 2008)

collieb said:


> Tesco is now doing exactly that - Diesel 1.16 in Tesco Finglas over wkend and petrol was 1.15. Both had been the same price for previous few weeks.



interesting. tesco in arklow , diesel was 1 cent per litre cheaper than petrol last time I filled up.


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## rgfuller (6 Feb 2008)

An interesting article on diesel vs petrol pricing from a uk point of view:
http://www.petrolprices.com/why-diesel-costs-more-than-petrol.html


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## Frank (6 Feb 2008)

A few years ago charlie Mcgreedy put ectra duty on diesel and not on petrol. There is different duty on the 2 fuels.

Not just the oil companies profiteering the government are well ahead of the game here.


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## werner (7 Feb 2008)

If its of any interest on the 7/2/2008

Sundrive Service Station 
Petrol euro1.11.9 a litre (Would they not just round it up and charge 1.12! 
Diesel euro1.15.9 a litre

50 yards up the road
Discount Service station
Both Petrol and Diesel euro 1.11.9


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## Jim1000 (26 May 2008)

Tesco dundrum Yesterday
Petrol - 1.27
Dielsel - 1.39


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## gocall01 (26 May 2008)

Bandon this morning:
Petrol - 1.37.9
Dielsel - 1.41.9

Looks like I'm going to have to find my bike in the garden shed...


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## Mad_Lad (26 May 2008)

Would it be fair to say that part of it is demand and the other Muppets in the stock exchange over pricing oil out of fear? Probably a lot of reasons. All I know is that oil will get a lot more expensive before it gets cheaper. It's getting more expensive week by week. That's why we need to cut back on the amount of wasted journeys we do. Hop on the bus, take the bike to the local shop. Stop going to these shopping centres every week so unnecessarily just to browse around for lack of something better to do. We all do it! Drive the lowest consuming diesel car will also help. If  we all did this all over the world, Oil would be a lot cheaper. + we WILL see tax increases on fuel as part of carbon tax and Ireland's failure to meet the kyoto protocol.


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## teachai (26 May 2008)

Petrol Tesco Arklow 125.9
Diesel Tesco Arklow 132.9  

Note how the price of diesel is increasing disproportionately for Diesel. 

Time to order a rip-off Diesel T-Shirt and where it in Tesco everytime I fill up. 
They're still the cheapest around.


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## colin79ie (26 May 2008)

> Time to order a rip-off Diesel T-Shirt and where it in Tesco everytime I fill up.
> They're still the cheapest around.


 
There's a reason for that. HINT: It's not because they are nicer people!

For example, what is the reason that Tesco sausages are cheaper than say, Shaw's sausages. It is because they are of an inferior quality!


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## aircobra19 (26 May 2008)

colin79ie said:


> There's a reason for that. HINT: It's not because they are nicer people!
> 
> For example, what is the reason that Tesco sausages are cheaper than say, Shaw's sausages. It is because they are of an inferior quality!


 
Its also different product. Its not unknown for a more expensive product to be resold/marketed as a cheaper product, as it will sell in great volume.


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## builder ed (26 May 2008)

May be time to consider the bio diesel option.  Then again the government will seize their opportunity and increase the duty and the manufacturers will increase in line with ordinary diesel.


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## contemporary (26 May 2008)

builder ed said:


> May be time to consider the bio diesel option.  Then again the government will seize their opportunity and increase the duty and the manufacturers will increase in line with ordinary diesel.



or the argi diesel option


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## Mad_Lad (27 May 2008)

Ireland does not have the land required to produce sufficent amounts of biodiesel. And farmers would moan like they usually do poor things. And demand more money so we will be back to square 1. look at the price of E85 and you will burn it faster making it cost as much as petrol. Biodiesel is not suppose to be far off regular diesel as far as mpg goes. But it's the land required I don't think it's possible??? where as e85 is produced mostly from waste from making dairy products. And then the energy required to make it. Green diesel it is then lol only problem is how would you get it without getting noticed and is it much different from regular diesel? apart from colour of course. modern diesels don't like bad quality fuel!


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## teachai (27 May 2008)

colin79ie said:


> There's a reason for that. HINT: It's not because they are nicer people!
> 
> For example, what is the reason that Tesco sausages are cheaper than say, Shaw's sausages. It is because they are of an inferior quality!



As far as diesel goes, I'm saving a minimum of 5c per litre by filling up there. 
I don't think the diesel is inferior by this amount. 

Also, remember its not just about quality. Its about economies of scale as well as purchasing muscle.  Tesco also use their own drivers. Also, petrol is cheaper in tesco Arklow than Tesco Dundrum.   I also assume that the overheads are bigger in Dundrum.    Also, at least one garage in arklow is matching Tesco's prices so that helps as well.


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## UpTheBanner (28 May 2008)

just back from Holland and France and diesel is on average 5 cents *cheaper* than petrol, however on average petrol/diesel is 10cents more expensive than Ireland.


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## mell61 (29 May 2008)

I believe that france and Holland both include the equivalent of road tax into the tax on fuel, which may be why its more expensive than here.  To me that sounds like a nice fair way of taxing, as higher users of the roads pay proportionally more!


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## UpTheBanner (29 May 2008)

one point I was making is that garages in Ireland have been quick to capitalise on the popularity of diesel and raise the prices, market forces people will say, greed is what I say.


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## dieselhead (30 May 2008)

teachai said:


> As far as diesel goes, I'm saving a minimum of 5c per litre by filling up there.
> I don't think the diesel is inferior by this amount.
> 
> Also, remember its not just about quality. Its about economies of scale as well as purchasing muscle. Tesco also use their own drivers. Also, petrol is cheaper in tesco Arklow than Tesco Dundrum. I also assume that the overheads are bigger in Dundrum. Also, at least one garage in arklow is matching Tesco's prices so that helps as well.


 

Lots of the garages with so called cheap diesel is cheap cause it slightly watered down which means the diesel you buy IS INFERIOR as the mpg is comprimised and bad diesel can also cause black smoke to come out your exhaust. The best place to buy diesel is SHELL and in the old filling stations where the tank are old and the walls are lined with the diesel from 5 or 10 years ago when they made good diesel.


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## Luckycharm (30 May 2008)

UpTheBanner said:


> one point I was making is that garages in Ireland have been quick to capitalise on the popularity of diesel and raise the prices, market forces people will say, greed is what I say.


 
You are misguided - garages make tiny margins on Petrol/diesel e.g. they make the same amount of money from you putting €50 of petrol in your carthen if you were to buy a coffee in the shop. 5 years ago there were around 2500 garages in the country now there are little over 1100 because if you don't have a decent shop you are not going to make any money.


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## UpTheBanner (30 May 2008)

A major oil company made 1.2 billion profit in Q1 2008 and many garages are owned by oil companies....misguided...the facts speak for themselves


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## ubiquitous (30 May 2008)

UpTheBanner said:


> A major oil company made 1.2 billion profit in Q1 2008 and many garages are owned by oil companies....misguided...the facts speak for themselves



The fact remains that retailer margins on petrol & diesel are tiny, hence the fact that filling stations tend to charge comparatively high prices for groceries, confectionery, deli etc. It is also true that many smaller filling stations have gone out of business in the past decade or so, and the only ones that survive are those who can depend on sufficient shop trade.

In this context it is a nonsense to suggest that the billions made by the major multinational oil companies are down to overcharging in the Irish market. You might as well try to cite the billions made internationally by the likes of Coca Cola as "evidence" that Irish supermarkets charge too much.


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## UpTheBanner (31 May 2008)

ubiquitous,

Can I ask where then do the profits made from sale of diesel in Ireland go? I did not explicitly say 1.2 billion was made from overcharging in the Irish market but the Irish market has contributed to that profit in an un-proportional manner relative to prices charged in other European contries where Governments place an even higher tax than our Government.

I suggest you familiarise yourself with the primary financial statements from Statoil and Topaz, check their fixed assets section and you will see the link I talk about.


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## seanfmo (9 Jun 2008)

Simple

Diesel is cheaper to refine.
However the reason it's got so much dearer is because there is a greater demand on diesel now than ever before because of the emmisions, global effect etc and as such there is not as much of it in storage as there is petrol. Therefore there is a bigger need and demand for the refining of it at prsent much more so than petrol


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