# Asking bank for copies of our file



## apple (5 Jan 2012)

Hi Guys

Has any one asked the bank for a complete copy of their file under the freedom of Information act. If so how much do you have to pay to get it.

Cheers
A.


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## NovaFlare77 (5 Jan 2012)

I haven't asked, but the Data Protection Commissioner's website says you can only be charged a maximum of €6.35. See here - [broken link removed].

FYI, any request would be under the Data Protection Acts. The Freedom of Information Acts primarily apply to Government departments, local authorities and public bodies like the HSE and so on.


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## apple (5 Jan 2012)

*Thanks*

Thanks a million for that. Really appreciate it.


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## Jim2007 (5 Jan 2012)

You have no right to get a copy of the file, unless perhaps as part of a legal case that you are involved in with the bank.

Under the DPA, you have a right to a description of what data they hold on you and what the data is used for, but again not a copy of the file.

And the FOI Act applies to certain public bodies, but not private companies like the banks.


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## apple (5 Jan 2012)

*thanks*

your joking, I was told buy a financial advisor that I can write a letter to the bank and mortgage broker and ask them for copies of all the paper work sent out to us and on file. As we were never offered a tracker mortgage and we believe we should have been.


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## Alwyn (5 Jan 2012)

Jim2007, your post has been an eye opener for me.  I am for once stuck for words.  I thought you got a copy of every piece of paper work they held on file belonging to you.


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## Wishes (5 Jan 2012)

For what it's worth I recently saw an advert for a position in a bank, for a person to put together requested files to be sent out.  I am alll most certain the job description also mentioned something along the lines of the interested party should have experience in knowing what info should be sent out.  This obviously indicates that not all the information is being sent out to the customer.


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## NovaFlare77 (5 Jan 2012)

Jim2007 said:


> You have no right to get a copy of the file, unless perhaps as part of a legal case that you are involved in with the bank.
> 
> Under the DPA, you have a right to a description of what data they hold on you and what the data is used for, but again not a copy of the file.
> 
> And the FOI Act applies to certain public bodies, but not private companies like the banks.



I'm not sure where you're getting your information, but according to the Data Protection Commissioner's website (link in my previous post):



> Under Section 4 of the Data Protection Acts, you also have a right to get a copy of your personal information.  This  applies to all types of information -for example, written details about you  held electronically or on paper, photographs and CCTV images.   You are also entitled to know where the information was obtained, how it has  been  used and if it has been passed on to anyone else.



There are some exceptions ([broken link removed]), but nothing that indicates a person has to be involved in a legal case to gain access to information.


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## mercman (5 Jan 2012)

Jim2007 said:


> And the FOI Act applies to certain public bodies, but not private companies like the banks.



Without being a smartie, but are the main Banks not in the Government / Public ownership now ?? I think you are entitled to the files, but I doubt they will be sent out to you. Banking in this country works on the basis of Chinese Whispers.

I had a number of cases with the FSO and the papers requested by the Ombudsman's office were only part of the file, and for which a number of important papers I held on file, but were never sent to he FSO and became inadmissible in the cases.

OP please advise on how you get on as I have a case where I was told trackers mortgages had stopped, but after drawdown of the variable mortgage, and a number of months later whilst refurbishing the property, I applied for a refinance / top-up and was offered a tracker then. (in very clear writing on Bank headed notepaper)


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## Jim2007 (5 Jan 2012)

NovaFlare77 said:


> I'm not sure where you're getting your information, but according to the Data Protection Commissioner's website (link in my previous post):



OK, I've been involved in helping clients comply with the DPA and similar legislation in other EU countries for over 20 years.

The first thing to remember is that banks are well ware of the DPA and their files are sanitized accordingly.  Remember the DPA is about what data the bank holds on you, so the obvious thing is not to hold the data!  There is no obligation on the banks or other businesses for that matter to tell you about every document they ever created and destroyed, just the ones they currently hold.  This means that in practice all that remains is your basic details, plus any contracts that were signed and perhaps a selection of significant letters (most of which you will have either sent or received) and that is about it.

Most people are disappointed and surprised at how little data companies, be the banks or not, actually hold on them.  Most companies hold the absolute minimum that is needed to operate and that is all.


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## Jim2007 (5 Jan 2012)

mercman said:


> Without being a smartie, but are the main Banks not in the Government / Public ownership now ?? I think you are entitled to the files, but I doubt they will be sent out to you. Banking in this country works on the basis of Chinese Whispers.



First of at the FOI act does not even apply to all public institutions never mind to talk about something as newly acquired as the banks....

And of course in this day and age everyone involved in generating documentation is well schooled in compliance with the various data related laws and act accordingly.  This usually means only record what you absolutely have to and destroy it as soon as possible!

Future historians covering our generation will have lean pickings when compared to the type of records kept a 100 years earlier.


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## Mrs Vimes (5 Jan 2012)

Jim2007 said:


> Most people are disappointed and surprised at how little data companies, be the banks or not, actually hold on them.  Most companies hold the absolute minimum that is needed to operate and that is all.




Isn't the whole point of data protection legislation to ensure that companies keep only the bare minimum of information on people?


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## Jim2007 (5 Jan 2012)

NovaFlare77 said:


> There are some exceptions ([broken link removed]), but nothing that indicates a person has to be involved in a legal case to gain access to information.



The exceptions under the DPA are actually extensive, first of all banks and financial institutions are major players in fraud detection, so any data needed to support that activity need not be reported.  Then there is option 8 on the list - if I create a document today and delete it tomorrow, it will be on my employer's backup but not in production anymore, so it is out of scope, yet I could actually retrieve it again if I needed it for some reason!

In a court case, depending on it's nature, you may be able to get a court order requiring the bank to go beyond what is needed to meet their legal requirements under the DPA, that is what I mean.


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## NovaFlare77 (5 Jan 2012)

Jim2007 said:


> OK, I've been involved in helping clients comply with the DPA and similar legislation in other EU countries for over 20 years.
> 
> The first thing to remember is that banks are well ware of the DPA and their files are sanitized accordingly.  Remember the DPA is about what data the bank holds on you, so the obvious thing is not to hold the data!  There is no obligation on the banks or other businesses for that matter to tell you about every document they ever created and destroyed, just the ones they currently hold.  This means that in practice all that remains is your basic details, plus any contracts that were signed and perhaps a selection of significant letters (most of which you will have either sent or received) and that is about it.
> 
> Most people are disappointed and surprised at how little data companies, be the banks or not, actually hold on them.  Most companies hold the absolute minimum that is needed to operate and that is all.



Respectfully, that's a far cry from saying that the OP has _no right_ to get a copy of the file, as you originally stated. It's a different matter if there's actually nothing IN the file.


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## mercman (5 Jan 2012)

NovaFlare77 said:


> Respectfully, that's a far cry from saying that the OP has _no right_ to get a copy of the file, as you originally stated. It's a different matter if there's actually nothing IN the file.



+1. Plus it doesn't give the Banks the right to lie or to fraudulently act against any borrower to protect their own nest. 

Will people ever learn that the Bankers have turned people over to satisfy their own means. They collectively and individually deserve the respect offered to a RAT. Nothing more or nothing less.


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## Jim2007 (6 Jan 2012)

Mrs Vimes said:


> Isn't the whole point of data protection legislation to ensure that companies keep only the bare minimum of information on people?



Of course, but most people have expectations of finding all kinds of interesting stuff in there - we all love secrets!


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## Jim2007 (6 Jan 2012)

NovaFlare77 said:


> Respectfully, that's a far cry from saying that the OP has _no right_ to get a copy of the file, as you originally stated. It's a different matter if there's actually nothing IN the file.



You have a right to see what is covered by the act, but that may not be all - go back and see what can be excluded!


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## Jim2007 (6 Jan 2012)

mercman said:


> +1. Plus it doesn't give the Banks the right to lie or to fraudulently act against any borrower to protect their own nest.
> 
> Will people ever learn that the Bankers have turned people over to satisfy their own means. They collectively and individually deserve the respect offered to a RAT. Nothing more or nothing less.



First of all the act is not bank specific, it applies to any company or person who collects personal data, including for instance your local GAA club. And second every company will receive more or less the same legal council - don't hold on to documents that are not necessary for the operation of your business or required by law.


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## wbbs (6 Jan 2012)

Totally agree with this last post, I used to work in a bank, packed up 2,000+ mortgage files to go to storage before I left.   Not a lot of huge interest in those files, copies of application, id stuff, loan agreements etc.   The loan offer copy you would have got yourself should match what was applied for, this is the only place you might find an error but to be fair that should have been checked when you got it and by your solicitor before you signed.


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## peteb (18 Jan 2012)

So OP did you get a copy of the letter of approval/advance from the bank successfully?


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