# Why is Quinn insurance so much cheaper than VHI



## prestige1964 (14 Apr 2009)

I have plan B options for family of 4, Quinn is coming in much cheaper for similar product, am I missing something, any advantage staying with VHI I have been with them for 20 years


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## colm5 (15 Apr 2009)

VHI is a semi state body - lots of waste and possibly pays alot more to the medical profession than the others ever would.


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## demoivre (15 Apr 2009)

prestige1964 said:


> I have plan B options for family of 4, Quinn is coming in much cheaper for similar product, am I missing something, any advantage staying with VHI I have been with them for 20 years



I Switched to Quinn a few years ago. I would just suggest to you that you should make sure you are comparing like with like when looking at two health policies, which is not always easy imo. The hia site has some information on selecting a private health insurance product if that's any use to you.


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## Latrade (15 Apr 2009)

Also look at the excess on the Quinn policies, it's usually significantly higher than VHI.


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## prestige1964 (15 Apr 2009)

Thanks for replies, I am still a bit nervous about changing did I hear something about tax payed directly to reduce the amount we actually pay, or have I got that wrong


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## scuby (15 Apr 2009)

prestige1964 said:


> I have plan B options for family of 4, Quinn is coming in much cheaper for similar product, am I missing something, any advantage staying with VHI I have been with them for 20 years



having a younger customer base = less claims for ailments more associated with older people



colm5 said:


> VHI is a semi state body - lots of waste and possibly pays alot more to the medical profession than the others ever would.



Can you give examples of " lots of waste" ? 
think it was in the paper about 12 months ago saying it was one of the most cost effective insurance comps

Operating cost ratio was just below 8% of premium income which it is claimed "_makes Vhi Healthcare the most efficient operator in the Irish health insurance market and compares favourably with general insurers and international private health insurers."

taken from :
_http://www.finfacts.ie/irishfinancenews/article_1013936.shtml


"*possibly pays alot more to the medical profession than others* " ! 

how do you know this ? from talking to one medical professional, they actually sit down and negotiate the contracts for procedures, with both Dr's and hospitals.try to keep costs down, where as other's copy their rates and procedures ! 


When deciding what cover is best for you, don't necessarily go on cost, look at what cover you want, whats hospitals are in your area that you want cover for etc. have you lots of Dr visits ? better out-patient cover etc put children on a lower plan


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## Shannon81 (15 Apr 2009)

if you ring VHI and tell them what Quinn plan you were thinking of changing to they can tell you the differences between them.  

There are better plans then the B options plan you are on which you may get more use out of.  With Quinn you need to watch out for the excess's and check with them prior to getting scans as i have heard a number of stories about this


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## bleary (15 Apr 2009)

Quinn have recently dropped cover for St Pats, you could speculate that they are trying to discourage people with long term illnesses joining them. Without risk equalisation it is in companies interests to push costly patients to other companies, Not sure if there are any similar care facilities to Pats i think that I read it was the only provider of treatment for some conditions.


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## Spoofer (15 Apr 2009)

Latrade said:


> Also look at the excess on the Quinn policies, it's usually significantly higher than VHI.



That is not true in regards to the outpatient excess, VHI have the highest outpatient excess of the 3 providers, unless you are on one of their lifestage plans. Quinn are the only provider to have an inpatient excess on some of their plans, most commonly Essential Plus Excess.


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## MichaelBurke (16 Apr 2009)

bleary said:


> Quinn have recently dropped cover for St Pats, you could speculate that they are trying to discourage people with long term illnesses joining them. Without risk equalisation it is in companies interests to push costly patients to other companies, Not sure if there are any similar care facilities to Pats i think that I read it was the only provider of treatment for some conditions.


 
They dropped St Pats and another hospital recently, both provided mental health facilities.


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## demoivre (16 Apr 2009)

Shannon81 said:


> if you ring VHI and tell them what Quinn plan you were thinking of changing to they can tell you the differences between them.



Personally wouldn't rely on the advice one health insurer  gives about another.


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## colm5 (16 Apr 2009)

scuby said:


> having a younger customer base = less claims for ailments more associated with older people
> 
> 
> 
> ...


firstly
I don't know this, thats why it says 'possibly'. I think saying that Quinn is copying VHI is a stretch, at least, from what I see its the other way around. VHI finally has to move its ass to hold customers by introducting new plans, very similar to Quinns already released plans.

I know people and contractors who work for VHI. Over staffed etc... what you would expect from a semi state body.

Of course they sit down with doctors to work out contracts, and they get screwed every time. Do you know how much the pay the medical profession for surgery! and to hospitals etc.. Knee surgery was 6K over 5 years ago, and you were 1 of 8 people that day. They have no problem handing out cash to the medical profession but until very recently their physio and GP subsities were peanuts.

As for the most profitable insurance company etc.. don't you think this has possibly something to do with what they charge? VHI rates have shot through roof in the last ten years. From what I recall, they have gone up nearly 200% over the last 10-12 years.


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## MichaelBurke (16 Apr 2009)

demoivre said:


> Personally wouldn't rely on the advice one health insurer gives about another.


 
But if you ring them both and ask them the same question then compare the answers you get, somewhere in between should be the true answer?!?!


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## scuby (16 Apr 2009)

colm5 said:


> firstly
> I don't know this, thats why it says 'possibly'. I think saying that Quinn is copying VHI is a stretch, at least, from what I see its the other way around. VHI finally has to move its ass to hold customers by introducting new plans, very similar to Quinns already released plans.



it's a fact that a certain insurance company copy the benefits books that vhi have created to pay Dr's for operations.

  VHI has to get governmet approval for each product they try to bring out as they do not have the commercial freedom like Quinn/hibernian ! if they decide to make up a product they can do in the moring and sell it


" *I know people and contractors who work for VHI*."
they might clarify the above points for us ?


"*Over staffed etc... what you would expect from a semi state body*."  well i presume this will change in the current environment !


" *Of course they sit down with doctors to work out contracts, and they get screwed every time. Do you know how much the pay the medical profession for surgery! and to hospitals etc.. Knee surgery was 6K over 5 years ago, and you were 1 of 8 people that day. They have no problem handing out cash to the medical profession but until very recently their physio and GP subsities were peanuts*."

i doubt very much the Dr got 6k for the operation, i rang vhi and asked them the cost to the surgeon for a knee replacement and was told about €1,300. Anaesthesia less than that and depending on the hospital accommodation it could very well add up to more..
Plus if they don't keep the Dr's in agreement, The Dr can balance bill you for the operation, and charge what he likes !! 
By agreeing to the benefit payable by vhi they do not balance bill. 
Again people sign up to get the cost of all operations fully covered, they don't want to be left paying several hundred

" *As for the most profitable insurance company etc.. don't you think this has possibly something to do with what they charge? VHI rates have shot through roof in the last ten years. From what I recall, they have gone up nearly 200% over the last 10-12 years.*"

well the public hospital levy/charges have gone up in the last few years and are not a whole lot behind the likes of some private hospitals, going by claims i have had paid for me..


Back to the OP,ring around and see what suits you cover wise etc if you want more hospital cover or cover for Dr visits..


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## Black Sheep (19 Apr 2009)

Why not make a list of the items that are important to you in a healthcare package and phone each insurer to find out who can supply the best deal for you based on your priorities


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