# File Form11 on ROS, refund due of 4k. NoA now states I owe 500e!



## amgd28 (22 Oct 2013)

As per thread title, I filed my Form 11 on ROS on Monday. The calculation resulted in a refund of approx 4k due. (This is due to the fact that my wife was made redundant in 2012 and had over-paid her taxes).

Imagine my surprise to log in the next day and see a Notice of Assessment stating that the Revenue now say that I owe 478 euro! I opted for short-form of assessment so there is no details

Is this common? I am abroad at the moment so may not be able to call them until next week, but it seems bizarre when their own system calculated that a refund was due?


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## Joe_90 (22 Oct 2013)

Not sure how much help you will get as you don't have a notice of assessment to advise where the issue may have been.

Have you always been jointly assessed filing form 11, was your wife in receipt of any social welfare?


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## amgd28 (23 Oct 2013)

Yes wife was in receipt briefly of social welfare - all fully declared on Form 11. Have been jointly assessed for a number of years, never had this issue. Whilst I am class S as a company director and we also have a rental property there is no change in declarations. 
So if everything fully declared on ROS and ROS calculates a significant refund can't understand how they assume a liability. 
Hope to call them tomorrow to get a long form assessment and get to the bottom of it.
Now I think about it about 8 years ago I got a NoA that was quite in variance with my filing. A brief call and they admitted they had made a mistake. I don't think they realise what fear a notice with the harp on it inspires in us lowly citizens!


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## Joe_90 (23 Oct 2013)

Getting a long notice of assessment is a good start.


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## amgd28 (7 Nov 2013)

Okay Finally got the long notice of assessment. 
Unbelievably they have added the following to the bottom of the calculation:

"SURCHARGE DUE FOR NON-COMPLIANCE WITH YOUR LPT REQUIREMENTS": 4875.22

Unbelievable - of course no detail....

Note that all nppr charges and LPT fully paid up. Even the one for a house sold in May which I had to pay for the balance of 2013..
Now my wife would have processed some of these but as we are jointly assessed this her PPS is fully linked to mine....


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## amgd28 (7 Nov 2013)

I have to say that on this and many company-related filings I am finding the Revenue far more aggressive and bullish than in previous years.
Very much the case of having to fight your corner for your anything that is due to you but very aggressive in capturing your cash as early as possible.
I believe the approach to LPT is a symptom of same.

For example - my company bills some clients for professional services. Withholding tax of 20% is applied. I can not claim back withholding tax due for reimbursement until October of any year. The withholding tax accrued by this time is well over 100k. The company is fully tax compliant

From a cashflow perspective, the professional services are cashflow negative as a result (the margin is not near 20%).
So the net result is that I cannot scale this element of the business...

In previous years we used to get our withholding tax reimbursement pretty soon after filing Corporation Tax in October as all F45 certs would have been filed with Revenue all year.

As of yet this year we are still owed approx. 70k in withholding tax reimbursement, even though we filed weeks ago.

They are now saying they are "holding on to it" as a hedge against potential CT liability for 2013 (which won't be filed until Sept/Oct 2014). This is despite the fact that we have no CT liability for 2013 and will not have one for 2014 (due to significant losses carried forward)

I was depending on that cash for year end, now I have to fight tooth and nail to get it.

So much for growing the SME sector!!


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## Clarkey (7 Nov 2013)

amgd28 said:


> I have to say that on this and many company-related filings I am finding the Revenue far more aggressive and bullish than in previous years.
> Very much the case of having to fight your corner for your anything that is due to you but very aggressive in capturing your cash as early as possible.
> I believe the approach to LPT is a symptom of same.
> 
> ...



*Any help?*

Interim refunds of PSWT

General
A specified person may claim an interim refund of PSWT for a tax year or accounting period instead of waiting to claim it, when submitting a tax return, against the amount of tax chargeable for the year or period. Applications for interim refunds should be made to the Revenue office that deals with the tax affairs of the specified person. Application is made on Form F50 (available from the Revenue Forms " Leaflets Service at LoCall 1890 306 706 and from the Revenue website www.revenue.ie or by using the following link:  pdfForm F50 - Claim for an Interim Refund (PDF, 51KB).

The following three conditions must be satisfied before an interim refund of PSWT can be made for an accounting period or tax year:

The profits of the previous accounting period or of the basis period for the previous tax year must have been finalised,
The tax payable for the previous accounting period or previous tax year must have been paid in full, and
Forms F45 for the PSWT included in the claim must be provided to the taxpayer's Revenue office.


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## amgd28 (7 Nov 2013)

We meet those conditions - in previous years we actually used to get interim refunds during the year, but in more recent years we have been told to wait until October (even if we filed our accounts in July etc).
However this year, they are now saying that they are "holding back" a sum to cover any potential CT liability for next year... 
It seems we now need to get an auditors report to show that there will not be a CT liability for the 2013 fiscal year before they release the monies. 

I'm getting a taste of what an autocracy would look like....


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## amgd28 (7 Nov 2013)

Anyway back on topic 
Has anybody else received their Notification of Assessment with a spurious surcharge as below?

"SURCHARGE DUE FOR NON-COMPLIANCE WITH YOUR LPT REQUIREMENTS": 4875.22

As highlighted above, I am fully compliant with NPPR and LPT charges....


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## Clarkey (7 Nov 2013)

amgd28 said:


> Anyway back on topic
> Has anybody else received their Notification of Assessment with a spurious surcharge as below?
> 
> "SURCHARGE DUE FOR NON-COMPLIANCE WITH YOUR LPT REQUIREMENTS": 4875.22
> ...



I received one today for a client who had set up to pay by salary deduction. Haven't contacted Revenue yet.


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## DB74 (8 Nov 2013)

Just on the withholding tax etc, you are not obliged to wait until Sep/Oct to file your CT return, or indeed your income tax return. If you are due a significant sum of money back from Revenue, you should file these returns in Jan/Feb 2014 and the refund will process soon afterwards

Re the LPT surcharge, this was highlighted previously when the LPT was announced (I'm sure there is mention of it in the LPT section of this forum)


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## Clarkey (8 Nov 2013)

DB74 said:


> Just on the withholding tax etc, you are not obliged to wait until Sep/Oct to file your CT return, or indeed your income tax return. If you are due a significant sum of money back from Revenue, you should file these returns in Jan/Feb 2014 and the refund will process soon afterwards
> 
> *Re the LPT surcharge, this was highlighted previously when the LPT was announced (I'm sure there is mention of it in the LPT section of this forum*)



He has stated he is fully compliant with LPT


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## Clarkey (8 Nov 2013)

Clarkey said:


> I received one today for a client who had set up to pay by salary deduction. Haven't contacted Revenue yet.



Spoke to Revenue and surcharge is due to a property he sold seven years ago


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## T McGibney (8 Nov 2013)

That's absolutely crazy. A surcharge applied in error and now an allegation by Revenue to a third party that the present owner of the property (who is readily identifiable by accessing public records) hasn't paid a tax liability.


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## amgd28 (21 Nov 2013)

Revenue eventually accepted the I was fully compliant with LPT and re-issued notification of assessment with the correct number in for overpayment.
Of course, not a word or apology... but at least I got my money...


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## amgd28 (21 Nov 2013)

Interestingly RE PSWT they are holding onto approx. 68k due to the company "in case" we have a corporation tax liability for next year. We had no liability this year and will not have next year.
We have had our independent tax advisors advise them of this and all to no avail. How can the system work like this where one bureaucrat can hold back substantial sums "on the offchance" that we may owe a sum to them next year when the absolute reality is that this money is due to the company (some of the PSWT arose at the start of this year)

Revenue have point blank refused to put down in writing why they are withholding the money. What sort of a state is this?


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