# Mortgage Payment Protection Insurance



## jimmyd

I have my mortgage for nearly 3 years and never took out Mortgage Payment Protection Insurance but with the country going downhill and along with my mortage repayments lowering I am considering taking it out.
Should I stick with my bank and take it out with them or go online?
I have looked at 

http://www.paymentprotection.ie/
and 

With them all around the same price It's so hard to know whom to go with.

Would people recommending staying with the known bigger names for taking out cover?


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## Dave Vanian

How much is unemployment-only cover?


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## serotoninsid

@keano1:  Generally, how long is the exclusion period after taking out one of these policies?


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## Lollyflash

I am also looking into this as a safety backup but please read all details of policies carefully before choosing one.

i rang www.insure.ie and it sounded ok until they said that if you have had your mortgage for more than 3 months then there is a 6 MONTH WAITING PERIOD for any benefits in case of redundancy. a few months seems reasonable as they have to make sure people are not trying to screw them but 6 months is excessive and they could not explain to me why someone who has only had a mortgage for 3 months gets a shorter waiting period? no one has been able to explain this to me? surely as someone paying a mortgage on time every month for 1 year i should certainly not be a worse candidate in any way?

also i asked my bank where we got our mortgage and they will not offer it to us now. they said it would have to have been taken out at the time of our mortgage so we can only seem to get quotes from these online agencies. have you not experienced this?


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## NorfBank

Lollyflash said:


> they could not explain to me why someone who has only had a mortgage for 3 months gets a shorter waiting period? no one has been able to explain this to me?
> 
> also i asked my bank where we got our mortgage and they will not offer it to us now. they said it would have to have been taken out at the time of our mortgage so we can only seem to get quotes from these online agencies. have you not experienced this?



I guess they have analysed their claims history and have found that there are more claims from people who take out a policy 6 months into their mortgage than someone who takes out the policy in the first three months of the mortgage.
As far as I know the lenders will only offer repayment protection at the start of the policy presumably for the same reason as above.


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## MrKeane

Lollyflash said:


> I am also looking into this as a safety backup but please read all details of policies carefully before choosing one.
> 
> i rang  and it sounded ok until they said that if you have had your mortgage for more than 3 months then there is a *6 MONTH WAITING PERIOD* for any benefits in case of redundancy. a few months seems reasonable as they have to make sure people are not trying to screw them but 6 months is excessive and they could not explain to me why someone who has only had a mortgage for 3 months gets a shorter waiting period? no one has been able to explain this to me? surely as someone paying a mortgage on time every month for 1 year i should certainly not be a worse candidate in any way?
> 
> also i asked my bank where we got our mortgage and they will not offer it to us now. they said it would have to have been taken out at the time of our mortgage so we can only seem to get quotes from these online agencies. have you not experienced this?


 
I priced around a few policies recently and the price of the policy seemed to go down the longer the exclusion period which makes sense.


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## Dee99

How much a month would the cover cost ?

Regards,Dee


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## Jimbobp

I know we deal with Cardiff pinnacle through our broker representative group PIBA. Their redundancy exclusion period is 120 days and the cost is €4.75 per €100 covered. So if your mortgage is €900pm for example, than the monthly premium would be €42.75pm. I do insure that whoever is looking at taking out this policy reads the terms & conditions as their are restrictions on the cover granted.


www.powerinsurances.ie


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## Sumatra

Before you waste your money on this product give the Financial Regulator a call. They have a consumer helpline 1890 777777 or 01 4104000 which is open from 8am to 8pm Monday to Friday. 

At this stage they might be able to offer you unbiased guidance on the product.

Their communications and marketing unit is currently working on some additional information for consumers in this regard which they hope to publish on their web site (itsyourmoney.ie) and publicly promote early in March 2009.

Regards,

Sumatra


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## Derville

I work for a law firm. I took out mortgage protection insurance in November of 2008. I took it out with Cardiff Pinacle.

At the time I felt reasonably safe in my job, I had lots of work coming in, got a decent Christmas bonus, and felt fairly secure. My husband's job was insecure so I took out the insurance. We could'nt afford to have two of us not able to pay the mortgage.

I have to wait until March until the insurance becomes effective. With all the job losses recently in law firms, I am wondering if the insurers will just try to wriggle out of the policy and use the 'reasonable belief that you might be made redundant...' clause to deny a claim.

Should I just cancel the policy and stop wasting my money?


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## Sober Lark

Derville, working for a law firm how confident are you that you could argue reasonable belief successfully?

If these Mortgage Repayment Protection policies were underwritten at the time of taking out the policy rather than when a claim is submitted it would offer greater confidence to the consumer than the present state of affairs?


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## serotoninsid

Looked into this and I wouldnt touch with a barge pole. I understand the exclusion period - I think thats fair. However, theres a part in there that says if the insured had 'reasonable knowledge' of whether redundancy was likely... Its far too general a term to have any faith in the product.  A company could be performing badly but theres no indication that they will be downsizing or shutting down either. In the case of manufacturing sector, virtually all of them are certainly under pressure at the moment. That doesnt mean to say that they will ALL be closing down.
I would be fearful as to the wooly terminology used and the agressiveness that an insurance co. legal team would capitalise on this. Others here have confirmed my fears by stating that the payout on this type of insurance is particularly poor.
So bottom line...I didnt and wont be going for his type of insurance.


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## Gerry Canning

suggest ,avoid them all , see issues around ALL payment protection policies , see any UK website on mis-selling ppi or mrpi


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## Sumatra

Funny how with all the regulation, all the experience of other countries we have to make the same mistakes. Even when alarm bells were ringing you could still go out and purchase one of these products and because you did you can utilise the safety net called compensation. 

Regulation / compliance is costing firms a small fortune yet if you really want to be crooked just go ahead, you'll probably get away with it.

In the world of Finance what is going on today that we could be a part of and get compensated tomorrow.


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## Gerry Canning

Sumatra said:


> Funny how with all the regulation, all the experience of other countries we have to make the same mistakes. Even when alarm bells were ringing you could still go out and purchase one of these products and because you did you can utilise the safety net called compensation.
> 
> Regulation / compliance is costing firms a small fortune yet if you really want to be crooked just go ahead, you'll probably get away with it.
> 
> In the world of Finance what is going on today that we could be a part of and get compensated tomorrow.


 I believe you are saying buy today and if it does not work out you can get compensated to-morrow.
................................
This PPI mis-sell was deliberately sold to people who TRUSTED their lender, with that LENDER knowing they were conning a naiive and trusting customer. IT HAS LITTLE TO DO WITH COMPENSATION , more of THIEVERY BY PEOPLE WHO WERE SUPPOSEDLY REGULATED !!!!ie Banks .


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## Sumatra

But..... the scandal was uncovered in 2008/ 09 and was well aired in the media with copious and repeated warnings. Yet, between 2008 and 2011 _after_ the warnings had been issued still more than 300,000 people still bought the product! 

As a population we are constantly demonstrating unsophisticated naivety and financial illiteracy but this can be improved with education and needs to start early in life.


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## Gerry Canning

Sumatra said:


> But..... the scandal was uncovered in 2008/ 09 and was well aired in the media with copious and repeated warnings. Yet, between 2008 and 2011 _after_ the warnings had been issued still more than 300,000 people still bought the product!
> 
> As a population we are constantly demonstrating unsophisticated naivety and financial illiteracy but this can be improved with education and needs to start early in life.


Indeed I hear you; but in life we all have to trust someone and one of these en- {trusted} were Banks. They are {regulated?}by Central Bank and {watched?} over by Ombudsman.JInsurance is like mothers and apple pie, sounds good , speaks of safety and comfort.(That NICE bank man knows better than me }!!!
LIFE WOULD BE TERRIBLE IF WE COULDN,T TRUST REGULATED PEOPLE, AND BELIEVE CENTRAL BANK AND OMBUDSMEN WOULD SORT OUT THE COWBOYS.. that said Central bank and Ombudsman have FAILED US..
SO ENDS MY SERMON !!!!


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## Sumatra

But I thought consumers always distrusted banks and financial services more than any other industry? With that in mind it is not credible that holders of 300,000 policies suddenly became devoid of personal responsibility and judgement and put their hand into the fire where they remained for some years waiting for someone to tell them to move it.


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## unsub

sumatra said:


> but i thought consumers always distrusted banks and financial services more than any other industry? With that in mind it is not credible that holders of 300,000 policies suddenly became devoid of personal responsibility and judgement and put their hand into the fire where they remained for some years waiting for someone to tell them to move it.


.............................................................................................................
But we {stupidly} did trust banks & worse still we trusted our regulators/ombudsmen to keep an eye on the banks !!!
How do you think pensioners share holdings got wiped out.
Do you not remember our (esteemed)(trusted) (leaders) (regulators) assuring us our money was safe as banks !!!
Shouldn,t be credible ,etc etc , but it happened to a lot of good people.... The ppi was but another manifestation, except it was perpetrated on the (little) people.


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## Gerry Canning

unsub said:


> .............................................................................................................
> But we {stupidly} did trust banks & worse still we trusted our regulators/ombudsmen to keep an eye on the banks !!!
> How do you think pensioners share holdings got wiped out.
> Do you not remember our (esteemed)(trusted) (leaders) (regulators) assuring us our money was safe as banks !!!
> Shouldn,t be credible ,etc etc , but it happened to a lot of good people.... The ppi was but another manifestation, except it was perpetrated on the (little) people.


........................................................................................
Obviously we cannot operate without trust, it would be a sad world if we had to check every workman etc. it is just we trusted Banks too much.


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## Sumatra

'we trusted the banks too much'

Before mortgage payment protection insurance we had bundled products and before that endownment mortgages and before that unit linked whole of life policies. Did we trust them in the 80's then again in the 90's and again to present date? 

Just how many times do so many people have to be bitten to be shy? Just how many times do they fail to make a thorough examination of a finacial proposition which involves parting with their hard earned money? 

Is it too sensitive an issue to state as a population we keep reinforcing the view that we are financially incompetent. As a population we lack an understanding of basic personal finance issues and because of that we are easy prey. From primary school up we need to be educating our children to enhance their future financial capability.


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## harryd

very interesting


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## Gerry Canning

test


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## StevieC

Sumatra said:


> Is it too sensitive an issue to state as a population we keep reinforcing the view that we are financially incompetent. As a population we lack an understanding of basic personal finance issues and because of that we are easy prey. From primary school up we need to be educating our children to enhance their future financial capability.


 
Sumatra raises a very valid issue but in the general publics defense, I know from talking to customers that severe hard selling of life assurance/mortgage protection products is being done by the banks. Customers have told me of some of the techniques being used to put pressure on customers to buy more expensive products. While the banks can no longer "bundle the mortgage protection policy" they make every effort to ensure that the client puts the business with them regardless of the customers best interests.

As long as bank sales people have monthly/quarterly sales targets to reach, in my opinion there will be hard selling of products not necessarily suitable to the individual customers involved. The whole of area of hard selling by bank staff with targets to be met needs to be looked at by the Central Bank because target based selling can run contrary to the best interests of the customer.


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## Gerry Canning

Sumatra,s issue has some validity, but consider this.

You buy a Car , it turns out to be a Lemon. Since both you and the Garage Know you have good Consumer Protection the problem does not even get as far as a real issue.

Banks are Not only supposed to be under Consumer Legislation , they are in under REGULATED ENTITIES Codes.
This should mean Consumers are further protected from any thieving or cuteness that Banks might get up to.

As Sumatra said , this isn,t the first time Banks have been @ best unfair !
StevieC, mentions Central Bank.

Stevie, This is the same Central Bank who was/is supposed to Regulate.

I ask you, Mr Customer V Mr Bank , Mr Bank will win , particularly since MR Central Bank does not enforce.

It ishard to accept that our Central Bank/Ombudsman are being just ?


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## Jimbobp

I think banks should be stripped of the ability to cross sell insurance & Investment products. In nearly 20 years of being involved in insurance I have constantly witnessed banks miss sell various products. Not to say that agent's or brokers are squeaky clean regarding this issue, so why not bring in a fee based system which could only have a positive effect for consumers.


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## Gerry Canning

Jimbobp said:


> I think banks should be stripped of the ability to cross sell insurance & Investment products. In nearly 20 years of being involved in insurance I have constantly witnessed banks miss sell various products. Not to say that agent's or brokers are squeaky clean regarding this issue, so why not bring in a fee based system which could only have a positive effect for consumers.


...........................................................................................

On PPI & Mortgage ppi , I have some sympathy for Professional Insurance people.

By & Large the miss-selling was by target Driven Bank people not insurance people.
The Banks have sullied the Name of Insurance.
It means people are Very Untrusting of Insurance even when they are properly advised .


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## Sumatra

In the UK there is less chance of the banks mis-selling financial products as they have learnt from their experience. Here banks continue and now with more vigour than previous, to sell someone a product even though they know it is not suitable for them. They bring customers in for a financial check up and their sales persons are still in the sell, sell, sell mode with little respect or regard for the best interests of the consumer. Now more than ever when the consumer wishes to exercise their right to effect business elsewhere obstacles and unnecessary hoops are placed in their way as a deterrent. Nothing learnt and nothing protecting the consumer.


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## Gerry Canning

Sumatra said:


> In the UK there is less chance of the banks mis-selling financial products as they have learnt from their experience. Here banks continue and now with more vigour than previous, to sell someone a product even though they know it is not suitable for them. They bring customers in for a financial check up and their sales persons are still in the sell, sell, sell mode with little respect or regard for the best interests of the consumer. Now more than ever when the consumer wishes to exercise their right to effect business elsewhere obstacles and unnecessary hoops are placed in their way as a deterrent. Nothing learnt and nothing protecting the consumer.


.............................................................................................

Sumatra .Largely agree with you.
It is in Banks Nature to steal under the guise of advice.

Not so sure Uk Bank have or will learn . Lloyds got heavily fined for still messing on ppi (my pet hate) 3 weeks ago . 


As the saying goes {you can paint a leopard white, it still has spots}


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## Gerry Canning

Banks are still permitting Bad practice and still permitting stealing.
Case.

Customer in 2011 asked to go on interest only.It was agreed PROVIDED she increased insurance. Customer then aged 31 and healthy was being charged 44 per month.

NOTWITHSTANDING she was in money difficulty insurance now 86 per month.
Would someone in Insurance on AAM get me a price for GOOD mortgage protection on 24 years on mortgage k105 and say k150 straight life cover.

I may be wrong but looks like our Banks even in 2011 just can,t stop stealing!


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## Gerry Canning

Listened to UTV last night;
Car sales are up 26% , 0ne of the reasons quoted was people using their PPI refunds to make deposits.

How come people in N Ire can have valid claims processed on ppi , yet our Central Bank/Ombudsman allow us to be robbed ?


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