# Accountancy fees



## Unregistered (3 May 2005)

Can anyone tell me, what accountancy fees could be expected for an accountant who is the nominated agent preparing and sending in straight forward property tax returns for the revenue commissioners? 

Owner is the home owner and is normally non resident but does all of the preparation of receipts etc. From talking to friends who are knowledible about how long it takes to prepare these type documents, it has been suggested that it would take a competent person at max, 30-45 minutes to do this.


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## Unregistered (3 May 2005)

about €150 -200 fair price as theire still will be some correspondence with revenue.


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## Unregistered (3 May 2005)

My thanks for your answer, 

Do you know are accountants working in this area charging per hour or part thereof, for their work irrespective of how much actual work they have done on the case? 

The costs of submitting stuff etc to the Rev. Comm, have added more to the usual fee in my case and have not been included in the getting together /preperation of the case. 

I feel that the person I have being using to deal with my tax stuff has given me what I consider a second class service for a first class fee, and not knowing any other accountants dealing in this area to approach (with a view to moving my business elsewhere),  hence this query.


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## Unregistered (3 May 2005)

It would be normal to charge per hour.

What part of the country are you in this will make probably make a difference?
Are you using a big 4 firm?


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## Brendan Burgess (3 May 2005)

If the tax returns are straightforward, you should do them yourself. Why do you use an accountant at all? 

There is a downside to using an accountant. There are big compliance issues and the accountant must open a file, send out letters of engagement,etc. He can't do all this in 35 minutes. You simply would not be a priority for any accountant and, as a result, the service you get might suffer. Most accountants don't like telling potential clients that they are not worth taking on. 

I would recommend that you do all the work yourself and get an accountant to check them out for you. It will still cost you  a few hundred euro, but you should give yourself a better service.

Brendan


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## Unregistered (6 May 2005)

Hi Brendan and friends. I live in Dublin and have been using the same person who was recommended to me initally when I was thinking of buying out family interests in the family home and as knew of nobody else to ask as was living in the UK, stayed with them. 

Brendan, if you mean by letters of engagement, a letter to R/C telling them that he was now acting in the capasity of agent, that was done years ago ( I was never even given a copy of it and found out later that it contained inaccuracies!) That was paid for years ago and I dont think enters into this issue at present re just the basic cost of preparing the stuff. The agent is charging me seperately for sending in the stuff to the Commissioners, a fact I think should be included in the full price,not just as an add on.

Yes , could do most of the figures as I currently do, but think I might have hassle sorting out depreciation of assets and current liability as am not very mathematically minded.


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## Unregistered (7 May 2005)

I would love to follow Brendan's advice to the original poster and complete the return myself, but find the tax information in IT70 vague and not sufficiently detailed to do so.

For example:  I posted here  a query on travelling expenses to collect rent, as I was informed by revenue that I could use the civil service mileage rates, but other AAM users/administrators don't believe this information to be correct, with good reason, even though it came direct from revenue who are supposed to know the details.

I sought advice from an independent financial adviser who was also vague on exactly what could be deducted from the rental income.  All he really did was hand me IT70, say 'it's all in there' and charge me E180 for the pleasure.  I could have downloaded this myself from the revenue site.


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## extopia (7 May 2005)

You shouldn't have paid that idiot who charged you €180 for public domain info.

As to whether AAM users or admins think you are right or wrong about your deductible expenses, they are only human and could be wrong. The person in revenue could be wrong too (did you get this in writing or was it from someone over the phone?) Bad advice from the Revenue does not cover you as the law is the law.


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## delgirl (7 May 2005)

The 'idiot' I paid the E180 to was consulted last year before the investment property was purchased and, it being the first one, I thought it best to  contact an independent adviser, who was recommended by a friend.

I thought the advice he was giving at the time was probably adequate.  It's only now as various things crop up during the tenancy that I'm realising that the info was in fact vague and some of it freely available on the net.

I've spoken to revenue a few times on the phone - the answers are always different - and I'm grateful for Clubman's warning about his pension deadline incident, as I thought what they said was gospel.

I think I'll go back to the adviser and ask for more information based on specific questions.


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## extopia (8 May 2005)

From what you have said about this advisor I'd steer clear and seek a better one.


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## Unregistered (8 May 2005)

Folks, I think we are digressing a bit from the last question which I asked which was:
What is a letter of engagement? also does anyone know is he by law , professional or statuatory, bound to do do this letter ( I understand he is a memer of the MIAVI) Where can I get further information on thsi subject please folks?


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## ubiquitous (9 May 2005)

The purpose of a letter of engagement is to outline the terms and conditions under which a professional agrees to act on behalf of a client. It is usually required or recommended by regulators that such a letter is agreed by service provider and client in advance of each engagement. The "terms of business" letter that you get from your insurance company or broker at renewal time is a good example of the genre.

By the way, if you don't mind me saying so, I think you were foolish in looking for tax advice from an auctioneer (MIAVI or otherwise) as auctioneers as a profession have no specific expertise or training in tax matters. As such they are not accountable for any mistakes made or misleading advice given in this regard.


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## Unregistered (9 May 2005)

Oops, sorry about that readers,  it should have read MIATI not MIAVI. 

Can anyone tell me which regulatory body covers the members of the MIATI and what do these stand for so maybe it would be worth my time to chat to their registrar ?? What do you folks think would be the best way forward?? Many thanks thus far.


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## delgirl (9 May 2005)

Hi Unregistered Guest / Original Poster

Sorry, didn't mean to hijack your thread - was just disappointed at the level  of 'professional' financial advice I received.  

Hope you manage to sort our your problem.


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## Unregistered (9 May 2005)

Hi Delgirl, no that isnt a problem at all. I can sympatise with u cause I'm having similar issues with the person I've been dealing with , This really is Rip off Ireland ++ isnt it! I have lived overseas and its like comparing chalk and cheese with accountants I used overseas with the boyoh I've used here, in my perticular case at least.

I know that there are excellent accountants out there, just wish I knew at least one of them so I could rest easy knowing that my tax affairs were been competently handled.  

Hope u 2 have better luck next time.


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## Unregistered (9 May 2005)

It's a minefield out there all right. To be fair to the accountants though I think they are overworked in the present business climate and perhaps have not kept up their education as much as they should.


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## Unregistered (11 May 2005)

This may indeed be true but what gets me very angry is the fact that my lad didnt bother giving me any copies of anything he had sent into revenue on my behalf. Did several years work bunched into one lot despite the fact they had been given to him on a yearly basis and last but not least,still gave wrong info to the revenue!! 

Didnt have such lousy , what I consider unprofessional service, when I lived overseas!!


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## ubiquitous (11 May 2005)

Unregistered said:
			
		

> . Did several years work bunched into one lot despite the fact they had been given to him on a yearly basis



Revenue do not accept rental income tax returns unless they are completed on a single-year tax-year basis. It is not possible to bunch together 2 or 3 figures together.


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## Unregistered (11 May 2005)

I think he means that he filed seperate returns for each year, all at the same time


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## Unregistered (12 May 2005)

Hi Ubiquitous and last guest, yes he did several year's work and handed in the lot in together only after I demanded copies of everything he had received back from the Revenue Commissioners. 

I am extremely angry about it especially , as I know he had access to ROS and didnt bother making use of it! After all, if Revenue didnt aggree with his assessments, guess who would have possably had to pay a hefty fine, not the accountant to be sure!!!!!


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## Lemurz (17 May 2005)

> Can anyone tell me which regulatory body covers the members of the MIATI and what do these stand for so maybe it would be worth my time to chat to their registrar ?? What do you folks think would be the best way forward?? Many thanks thus far.



Are we talking about Accountants or Tax Advisors?

MIATI refers to a member of the Institute of Taxation, and somebody who isn't necessarily an accountant!


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## stuart (17 May 2005)

(M)IATI

(Member) Institute of Accounting Technicians in Ireland



AITI

Associate of the Irish Taxation Institute



Two different organisations both giving differring levels of competence in different fields

Do not confuse one with the other

stuart@buyingtolet.ie


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