# inherited house but no deeds registered



## siobhra (12 Aug 2009)

My father passed away recently and left me the house in his will.  We have both been living here since he bought it over 20 years ago.  I have checked with his solicitor, bank, land registry and register of deeds but there is nothing.  What do I do. His solicitor insists he hasn't got the deeds although my father thought he had.  I know the person that he bought the house from and wonder should I contact him.  He may have proof of the transaction and also the name of the solicitor, or should I just hand the mess over to the solicitor and is it expensive to sort out.  any advice would be helpful.


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## onq (12 Aug 2009)

Firstly I'm sorry for your loss.
The death of a close relative can be a trying time, especially a parent.
Has your mother also passed away or else is otherwise not in a position to clarify this matter?

Regardless, while your father may have been mistaken you have to take on board his comments about his solicitor.
Given that the solicitor does not have the deeds which your father understood he had, he may not be the best person to seek advice from.
If he has lost the deeds or failed to register them if he was involved in the transaction and if he was required to do so, then he could be liable in any action you might take to seek redress.

In what sense therefore did your Dad by the lands?
There must have been some sort of contract and exchange of monies.

You could start by following the money, but the records may be old or lost.
You could approach the vendor, but he may have no obligation to help you.

I'd start the ball rolling by writing to your father's solicitor, setting out what you know and get a reply.
If you get teh same denial I'd then be tempted to retain your own solicitor to correspond with your father's solicitor.
There are too many tales of solicitors playing fast and loose with the trust of clients these days to simply allow his denial stand.
At the very least, assuming he was your father's solicitor at the time the transaction took place, he should show why he wasn't involved in it.

HTH

ONQ.


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## siobhra (12 Aug 2009)

When my mother passed away, my father and I moved house. I would be hopeful that the vendor would could give me some information, but should I seek advice before getting him involved as I am worried that he may still have some claim on the house (I'm probably just being paranoid!)  Is there an obligation on solicitors to register deeds?


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## j26 (13 Aug 2009)

Sorry to hear about your loss.

It's not too uncommon for this to happen.  If deeds are lost, title can be reconstructed from the best secondary evidence available (copies, memorials in the Registry of Deeds etc) and with an affidavit setting all of this out and an indemnity indemnifying the state against loss and/or defective title insurance the property can be registered in the Land Registry.  That cures the problem of not having the original deeds.  However, there will be quite a bit of searching involved to get to that level.

Are all deeds missing?  If they are, did you father by any chance have a mortgage?  It's possible another bank has them.  Were there any extensions built where your father might have had to borrow money?


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## Kate10 (13 Aug 2009)

Hi Siobhra,

Did you get help with the Registry of Deeds search?  They can be a bit tricky to get right.  You need to search against the Vendor's name, not against your Dad's.  Your Dad's name won't show up for the property unless he mortgaged/leased/sold it.  If you search against the vendor you will see any acts carried out by him in relation to the sale/lease/mortgage of the property including possible the sale to your Dad.  If you get lucky and a Deed was registered, then you will be able to get a copy of the memorial from the Registry of Deeds which is a starting point at least.

If you have already done this, then my best advice would be to start with the old property.  When you and your Dad moved house did you sell the house you used to live in?  If so what solicitor was used?  The solicitor should be able to review that file and see where the proceeds of the sale went.  If they went to the vendor of the new house then you have something to work with.

If that is not an option, then you could ask the vendor which solicitor he used when he sold the house to your Dad.  I would then hire your own solicitor and get them to contact the solicitor for the vendor to start full enquiries.  I think you are going to need to get a solicitor to help you with this problem as it won't be an easy one to fix.  I think it probably would be best to go with someone new that you trust.

You cannot legally transfer ownership of property in Ireland without a written document of some description.  If your Dad bought the house then a Deed must have been created by someone at the time.  It may just be sitting on a file somewhere.

As to whether solicitors have a duty to complete registration - yes they do, if the client hired them to do it and paid their legal and registration fees.  

Best of luck,

Kate.


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## siobhra (13 Aug 2009)

Thanks for that.  I will ring the vendor and hopefully they might have some documentation that might give the name of my dads solicitor (which may be different from the solicitor I presumed it was).  I think my dad's original solicitor has files relating to the sale of the previous property.


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## Kate10 (13 Aug 2009)

The vendor's own solicitor will be able to check his file and see who he dealt with when selling the property to your Dad - he may even have a copy of the Deed on his file and will certainly have a note of the completion of the sale etc. Your Dad's original solicitor may also be able to help but you may have to wait a little while for files to come out of storage.  Best of luck with it.

Kate.


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## siobhra (13 Aug 2009)

Thanks Kate10.  As far as I know the family have always used the same solicitor, and I cant see why we would have used a different one.  It would be great if the vendors solicitor had a copy of the Deed (fingers crossed).  When I phoned the solicitor he had some record of the sale of the previous house (not sure of exactly what).  If he had given my father the deeds would be expected to have recorded same in his files to protect himself against a situation like this?  When I contact the vendor, should I be worried about telling them anything, i.e.  could it be possible that they could still have some connection with this property.


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## siobhra (13 Aug 2009)

I didnt get help with the deeds search, but did look under the vendors name. It may be possible the the house we bought was left to several people (I dont' know), this would mean that I may not have been looking under the correct name.


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## Kate10 (13 Aug 2009)

Hi Siobhra,

Did you find anything at all when you searched against the vendor's name for the property in the land reg or reg of deeds?  If nothing at all appeared its possible that the address used in the Deed might be slightly different - could you go back and widen the search a bit?  

Re the vendor - I would be a bit careful in what I say, just in case.  Why not tell him/her you are missing a document and you need to contact the solicitor who acted at the time?  I wouldn't say that you have no deeds at all - not that I think the vendor would cause problems but you never know!

Re. your other query - if a solicitor releases deeds to a client directly we usually have the client sign a receipt for the deeds and we keep that receipt on the file.  However, it is possible that 20 years ago people were less careful or the receipt could have been lost over the years.  If I recall correctly we are obliged to keep copies of docs for 25 years but I'm not sure from your post if it is that long since your Dad bought.

Kate.


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## siobhra (1 Sep 2009)

Hi Kate10,

Sorry I didn't reply sooner but I was away.  I found a document which gave the history of the house and showed that it was bought by my father and was signed by him and also his solicitor etc.  This enabled the solicitor to track down the original file and he found the deeds, so happy days!!!

Many thanks for your help

siobhra


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## Ceader (16 May 2018)

I have a  similar issue and I need help I’m confused should I start a new form or do you want to hear


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