# Jury Service was Paid - Employer is now deducting from pay



## sharshar100 (30 Jun 2013)

Hi

Any advice would be appreciated. I was called into Jury service back in February which i had to attend (couldnt delay as already had defferred once). I informed my employers in advance (early Jan) and verbally asked the head of finance about policy regarding pay. He verbaly informed me it was full paid, and once i had received the loss of earnings from the courts, they would deduct that from one of my pays.

I attended, case lasted three weeks and I was paid as per normal. 
I then get an email on Fri gone ( 28th June) stating he had made a mistake and that the company policy is to actually not pay employers for jury service absence! therefore he would be recovering the three weeks pay from my next salary! He pointed me to an obscure  company handbook on the intranet which states it is not paid. 

I beleive this is extremely unfair! It is their mistake, and if I had known it was not paid, I would have not accepted the case when i was told it was going to be 2-3 weeks long. I have complained to my boss, who has said to put it in writing to the CEO and it will be at his descretion if he pays anything (i know he wont as he is a money scrounger).

Can anybody advise what to do? I cant afford to loose three weeks worth of pay!


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## emeralds (30 Jun 2013)

Your employment rights are protected while you are on jury service - and that includes your right to be paid. The following extract is from the Citizens Advice website

"There is no payment for jury service. Travelling expenses are not allowed. If you are actually serving as a juror, lunch will be provided on the day or days that the trial is at hearing.

If you are self-employed and work alone and where your attendance at jury service may mean you cannot earn a living, you may qualify for excusal from jury service. Contact the jury office of the Court for more information.

If you are signing on for a Jobseeker's payment you will continue to be paid, but you should advise your local Social Welfare Office that you have been called for jury service.

If you are in employment, the Juries Act 1976 (Section 29) places a duty on your employer to allow you attend for jury service. It is further specified in the law that time spent on jury service is to be treated as if the employee were actually employed. In other words, if you are in employment and are attending for jury service, you are entitled to be paid while you are away from work. Anyone with a contract of employment (i.e., temporary workers, contract workers, etc.) is entitled to be paid by their employer while they are on jury service. There should also be no loss of any other employment rights while you serve on a jury. The Jury office will provide a certificate of attendance on request.

If you feel your employment rights have been infringed or you have lost employment rights while serving on a jury, you can make a complaint to Rights Commissioner."


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## sharshar100 (30 Jun 2013)

Thanks emaralds

I am in permanent employment, and they had no problem with me attending jury service, just were not explicit about me not being paid. It seems the head of finance and operations director did not know their own policy about it not being paid.

If they have a stated policy about not paying staff for jury service absence, can i still complain about loosing employment rights?


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## emeralds (30 Jun 2013)

I would certainly take it further - especially given that you were verbally assured you would be paid. I don't know anyone who could take a hit on 3 weeks wages to serve on a jury and that is one of the reasons that income is protected whilst you are on jury service.


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## sharshar100 (30 Jun 2013)

Many thanks, 

I have penned an email to the CEO asking him to retract the recovery of pay instruction based on the verbal assurance. 

I am 100% sure he wont, so most likely will have to take further. 
Many thanks for advice on how to take further.


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## shesells (30 Jun 2013)

sharshar100 said:


> Many thanks,
> 
> I have penned an email to the CEO asking him to retract the recovery of pay instruction based on the verbal assurance.
> 
> ...



You should be including the verbal assurance but your key point is the law. It's not employment law, it's the Juries Act..your employer can't selectively break that law.


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## sharshar100 (1 Jul 2013)

If you know of the specific sections/clauses within the Juries Act, please let me know.

Many thanks


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## markpb (1 Jul 2013)

I think this is the relevant section: Juries Act, 1976



> 29.—(1) For the purposes of any contract of service or apprenticeship or any agreement collateral thereto (including a contract or agreement entered into before the passing of this Act), a person shall be treated as employed or apprenticed during any period when he is absent from his employment or apprenticeship in order to comply with a jury summons.
> 
> 29. —(2) *Any provision contained in any such contract or agreement shall be void in so far as it would have the effect of excluding or limiting any liability of the employer in respect of the payment of salary or wages to the employee or apprentice during any such absence*


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## sharshar100 (1 Jul 2013)

Hi
My CEO had a quick discussion on this with me today post my email. His 'position' is that it was clear in my employment contract that i was not going to be paid, and even though i was given duff information by the finance team, i was still responsible for being aware of my contractual agreements with the company.
His contant point was that if i had been aware of not beng paid what would i have done differently, my point back was i would have considered using holidays and not accepting the case (or at least would have thought and discussed what options I had).
He is not concerned about numbers but the principle of this!
It was left with he is going to speak to the finance team and get back to me with his position.


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## commonsense (1 Jul 2013)

sharshar100 said:


> Hi
> My CEO had a quick discussion on this with me today post my email. His 'position' is that it was clear in my employment contract that i was not going to be paid, and even though i was given duff information by the finance team, i was still responsible for being aware of my contractual agreements with the company.
> His contant point was that if i had been aware of not beng paid what would i have done differently, my point back was i would have considered using holidays and not accepting the case (or at least would have thought and discussed what options I had).
> He is not concerned about numbers but the principle of this!
> It was left with he is going to speak to the finance team and get back to me with his position.



As far as I know your employer cannot refuse to pay you as it's the law, see above where you cna make a complaint if you feel your rights have been infringed. 

"If you are in employment, the Juries Act 1976 (Section 29) places a duty on your employer to allow you attend for jury service. It is further specified in the law that time spent on jury service is to be treated as if the employee were actually employed. In other words, if you are in employment and are attending for jury service, you are entitled to be paid while you are away from work. Anyone with a contract of employment (i.e., temporary workers, contract workers, etc.) is entitled to be paid by their employer while they are on jury service. There should also be no loss of any other employment rights while you serve on a jury. The Jury office will provide a certificate of attendance on request.
  If you feel your employment rights have been infringed or you have lost employment rights while serving on a jury, you can make a complaint to Rights Commissioner. Read more about Employment Appeals here."


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## emeralds (1 Jul 2013)

sharshar100 said:


> Hi
> My CEO had a quick discussion on this with me today post my email. His 'position' is that it was clear in my employment contract that i was not going to be paid, and even though i was given duff information by the finance team, i was still responsible for being aware of my contractual agreements with the company.
> His contant point was that if i had been aware of not beng paid what would i have done differently, my point back was i would have considered using holidays and not accepting the case (or at least would have thought and discussed what options I had).
> He is not concerned about numbers but the principle of this!
> It was left with he is going to speak to the finance team and get back to me with his position.



The law of the land supercedes company policy - it has to...otherwise hundreds of people would avoid jury service at all costs.


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## Sunny (1 Jul 2013)

Listen this is as clear cut as it gets. Your employer must pay you if you are a paid employee. There are no ifs/buts or contractual obligations. You can contact the court service and tell them what the situation is. I know of one employer that did it before and they were called before a High Court Judge. They should have refused you time off so you could recuse yourself at the time or at least explain it to the judge.


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## mathepac (1 Jul 2013)

You should also note that you can claim on your house insurance for time on jury duty. This does not effect your NCB. They will pay out €40/€50 per day based on your attendance certificate from the court's office, up to a maximum of about €600, depending on insurer / policy.

You will need to take your employer to task about non-compliance with the laws of the land.


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## sharshar100 (1 Jul 2013)

Hi all
Thanks all for your responses! Well and truly appreciated.
My boss mentioned that he is not legally obliged to pay me, and he referenced the .gov.uk/jury-service/taking-time-off-work site where it says 'your employer doesnt have to pay you'
Why does the government site not mention the Juries Act????


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## oldnick (1 Jul 2013)

It is increasingly looking like you may also have a case for constructive unfair dismissal if your boss refuses to pay your salary and for putting you in a very embarrassing/difficult/stressful situation.

As a small firm employer for decades I usually tend to err on the side of other employers.
Not in this case.


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## Luternau (1 Jul 2013)

How come your employer is looking at and quoting a UK site to back up his view? If you are employed in Ireland, and served on a jury in Ireland, it's Irish procedure/law that counts. Do you work in the UK? Was it a UK jury or Irish Jury?


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## commonsense (1 Jul 2013)

sharshar100 said:


> Hi all
> Thanks all for your responses! Well and truly appreciated.
> My boss mentioned that he is not legally obliged to pay me, and he referenced the .gov.uk/jury-service/taking-time-off-work site where it says 'your employer doesnt have to pay you'
> Why does the government site not mention the Juries Act????





In the UK if your empoyer doesn't pay then you can apply to the court for loss of earnings. In Ireland the system is different insofar as your employer is legally obligated to pay you for jury service as you are not compensated.

You need to print out the legalities for Irish companies as your employer is obviously confised.


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## seantheman (1 Jul 2013)

sharshar100 said:


> and he referenced the .gov.uk/jury-service/taking-time-off-work site where it says 'your employer doesnt have to pay you'


 
Be aware sharshar,that this is an Irish site and as such you are being referenced Irish law. Are you based in the UK?


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## sharshar100 (1 Jul 2013)

DUH!
I am based in the UK and didnt spot any explicit info that this was an Irish site.
Apologies to allllll for any time wasted
:-(


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## Luternau (1 Jul 2013)

That's what I was thinking. No worries. At least you got some info re being entitled to some money from the court as compensation and perhaps the household insurance too! (I that's applicable in the uk or your policy (if you have household insurance)


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