# 'e' mark on tyres - money back?



## Brik (20 Apr 2010)

I know there have been a few posts/threads on this,  but I have yet to come across anyone that has got their money back or tyres changes for not having an e mark.

My wife's car got two new tyres 3 weeks ago and one does not have an e mark and my car got 4 last summer and two do not have an e mark.  Believe it or not, they are all the same tyres (make etc) but some had an e mark and others didn't.

I want to go to the garage to demand they change them but need some back up.  The RSA state that as of 2007 (s.i. 375) it is illegal to fit non-e marked tyres, but I cannot find that statement anywhere else to back me up when I go to the garage.

Has anyone been successful in getting the tyres changed?

Thanks,
Brik


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## Towger (20 Apr 2010)

Check both walls of the tyres I had a look at mine and the spare which is a different make has the 'e' mark on only one side.


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## bobalong (20 Apr 2010)

Towger said:


> Check both walls of the tyres I had a look at mine and the spare which is a different make has the 'e' mark on only one side.



Sorry if I misinterpreted what you said Towger, but are you saying this E mark might only be on one side of the tyre? In order to see this missing mark you need to take your wheel off?

If this the case I reckon the NCT crowd will say all tyres have to have the E mark in a visible place I imagine? 

I just traded in a car it had 3 tyres with the E Mark, one without. The one without was the same as the other 3 but no E Mark.

Tyres need to be put on a specific way to do with rotation direction??

Bob


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## mathepac (20 Apr 2010)

bobalong said:


> ,,, Tyres need to be put on a specific way to do with rotation direction?? ...


Some tyres do; they will be marked with an arrow type symbol  --> to be pointed to the front of the car.


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## Towger (20 Apr 2010)

Yes, the 'E' mark was only on one side.


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## foxylady (20 Apr 2010)

If i remember correctly an earlier post somewhere said that these regulations were in the EU since 1997. Which is this is the case means most cars should have these tyres


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## Brik (20 Apr 2010)

Absolutely!  But the garages are still putting on tyres without the mark, so I am hoping that someone out can advise me on how to approach the garage to get them swapped over.  one of the tyres without an e mark was bought only a few weeks ago, so surely they should not have fitted it to the car!


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## PaddyBloggit (20 Apr 2010)

Did you rule out the mark being on the other side of the tyre?


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## Brik (20 Apr 2010)

No as I am not at home, but I will look when I get back.

However, the spare tyre (a Pirelli something or other) which is the same as one of the rear tyres does not have an e on it on either side as I had it out to pump it up a few days ago.


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## bobalong (20 Apr 2010)

PaddyBloggit said:


> Did you rule out the mark being on the other side of the tyre?



You see, I think that is going to be useless. IF the E Mark is on the INSIDE of the tyre ( on the side facing in toward the wheel housing area ) then its not visible to the NCT crowd either. They certainly will not take the wheel off to look.

A seat belt buried in the back seats will result in a fail. Not having your hub caps taken off will fail?

Most tyres are tubeless and go on one way?? So taking them off and "turning them around" isnt possible?? Also the steel wheel itself OR alloy are not double sided, they go on one way??

Bob


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## PaddyBloggit (20 Apr 2010)

Surely the mark should be on both sides of the tyre?


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## bobalong (20 Apr 2010)

http://www.rsa.ie/RSA/Vehicles-and-Legislation/Vehicle-Standards/E-mark-on-tyres/

*Can I check for an e-mark when I am replacing my tyres *

We recommend that purchasers check new tyres for a visible e-mark.  Your seller / fitter should be able to show you the e-mark.  Vehicle owners should be aware that it is illegal to purchase non E-marked tyres for use on Irish roads.


*What should I do if I have recently purchased tyres which are not e-marked*

 If you have recently had tyres fitted to your vehicle which do not have an e-mark you should return to the place of purchase and request that they be replaced with the appropriate e-marked tyres for your vehicle.  It is illegal to fit non-e-marked tyres.  

The Irish Tyre Industry Association (ITIA) is advising that any motorist who has purchased a non e-marked tyre from one of their members should go back to the vendor with proof of purchase.

When returning non e-marked tyres the  National Consumer Agency advise that you consult the information provided on their website on the Sale of Goods Acts 1893 and 1980

http://www.consumerconnect.ie/eng/Hot_Topics/Our-booklets/NCA-Sale-of-goods.pdf

Bob


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## foxylady (20 Apr 2010)

bobalong said:


> You see, I think that is going to be useless. IF the E Mark is on the INSIDE of the tyre ( on the side facing in toward the wheel housing area ) then its not visible to the NCT crowd either. They certainly will not take the wheel off to look.
> 
> A seat belt buried in the back seats will result in a fail. Not having your hub caps taken off will fail?
> 
> ...


 
When they are checking under the car they would be able to see the other side


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## Caveat (20 Apr 2010)

Even if they could though why would they bother? 

As mentioned, it's a fail if you don't remove your hubcaps or even if the underside isn't clean.  Whatever they stipulate, you do. 

Very few NCT mechanics will do you any favours - if the E mark is supposed to be on the outside and it's not, I doubt they will go looking for it.


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## bobalong (20 Apr 2010)

foxylady said:


> When they are checking under the car they would be able to see the other side



Hi Foxylady,

In a normal helpful environment one might get this done. BUT where the NCT crowd are concerned this E mark would have to be CLEARLY visible, nothing more nor less I reckon.

[broken link removed]

Check further down under TYRES:

"A vehicle will fail if an "E" or "e" mark IS NOT VISIBLE"

With these guys their is no GREY, if it isnt marked on the visible side of the tyre it will fail ...

My two Cents
Bob


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## Brik (20 Apr 2010)

Well, therefore, given the fact that there is no e mark on the outside wall of the tyres in question, I will demand that the garage changes them.  I have the proof of purchase etc so whether it is under my consumer rights or the fact that it is supposedly illegal to fit tyres without the e, I will try to get them swapped.

Thanks for the input and I will keep you posted on my progress!


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## foxylady (20 Apr 2010)

bobalong said:


> Hi Foxylady,
> 
> In a normal helpful environment one might get this done. BUT where the NCT crowd are concerned this E mark would have to be CLEARLY visible, nothing more nor less I reckon.
> 
> ...


 

In a normal environment these tyres would not still be incirculation if they were supposed to be on all cars since 1997


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## foxylady (20 Apr 2010)

On another note , has anyone passed since this without the e-mark


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## bobalong (20 Apr 2010)

foxylady said:


> In a normal environment these tyres would not still be in circulation if they were supposed to be on all cars since 1997



FL,

You are spot on. I was only being official sounding as that is what one would get from the likes of the NCT crowd.

I find it interesting that non E Marked tyres are still in circulation seeming it is illegal AND that it has not been picked up. Again this is more of this Gov rubbish. Set down a law and then do not police it properly. Making laws is one thing but if they are not policed, it is totally pointless. Again I am being officious .. and that is usually not my nature, just "method acting" with this kind of mindset 

Bob


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## Digger (22 Apr 2010)

Any update on this, I have just purchased 4 new pirelli P6000 's and I can only find 1 tyre that has the E mark, i think E3 to be precise. Surely a top brand like Pirelli 
would have this marking and it was a well known Irish tyre fitter installed them.


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## bobalong (23 Apr 2010)

Digger said:


> Any update on this, I have just purchased 4 new pirelli P6000 's and I can only find 1 tyre that has the E mark, i think E3 to be precise. Surely a top brand like Pirelli
> would have this marking and it was a well known Irish tyre fitter installed them.



Forget any updates, no need for them. You need this E Mark .. end of. I would go straight back now to your well known Irish tyre fitter and hand them back. Particularly if your NCT is due up any time soon ...

Bob


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## killacam (23 Apr 2010)

i work at the Nct but im not repersenting them here (im just a lowly inspector). The E mark can be on the inner or outer sidewall, in fact on some tyres with the "outside" part facing correctly towords the outside, you will find the e mark on the inner sidewall. So this is not a major issue, as us "Nct crowd"  do inspect all sides of your tyre to ensure its structure is sound and complies to the rules.

I have found very few tyres without an e mark, with the Chineese rubbish such as Sunny,Wanlai ect theese seem to mostly have an e mark but its a lottery tbh...there are also a few Goodyear Eagle NCT, and F1's going around that have "made in china" on them and theese have presented without the mark, however the ones made elsewhere such as Thailand/Poland do have the mark....also some Bridgestones have made their way here without the mark....but basicaly, why not leave it up to the NCT to inspect them, thats our job, and please bear in mind that a re-inspection on your tyres is free if its found that they dont have the mark, even despite the rubbish you will hear on Joe Duffy ect ect..


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## Leo (23 Apr 2010)

killacam said:


> ....but basicaly, why not leave it up to the NCT to inspect them, thats our job


 
Thanks for your input Killacam. However, the issue a number of people here have is that they have recently paid good money for tyres which do not bear this mark. In these cases, it would be best to return to the source and address the problem sooner rather than later.
Leo


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## bobalong (23 Apr 2010)

Hi Killacam,

Good to hear that its both sides that are checked. 

_"but basicaly, why not leave it up to the NCT to inspect them, thats our job, and please bear in mind that a re-inspection on your tyres is free if its found that they dont have the mark ... "_

The re inspection might be free but in the meantime the cost of new tyres to replace the non E mark ones aint free as Leo says! 

If the Tyre Sales companies were being properly checked by the authorities this would not be an issue here AT ALL. I am told it is illegal to stock non E Marked tyres here in Ireland since 1997? It should not be up to the buyer to be watching out for this E Mark when buying, should it? In fact I would say most people only became aware of this E mark thing in recent months even though non E marked tyres have apparently been illegal here for many years.

Bob


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## mathepac (23 Apr 2010)

bobalong said:


> ... I am told it is illegal to stock non E  Marked tyres here in Ireland since 1997 ...


It is illegal to  purchase them for use on Irish roads and it is illegal to fit them; the onus seems to be on the car-owner to police this, unless we ask Biffo to create new tyre-fitting and stocking quangos.


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## JoeB (22 Jul 2010)

Would it not be possible to go to the Small Claims Court if your tyre seller refuses to take back the non-e-marked tyres?

I think this is a disgrace, and reflects very badly on the motor industry, and on the government. It has been illegal since 1997.. so why is it an issue 13 years later?

There are plenty of other EU laws being ignored in this country... our government is a joke.


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## callybags (22 Jul 2010)

What's it got to do with the government?


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## JoeB (22 Jul 2010)

Everything... they are supposed to ensure that EU Directives are correctly transcribed into Irish Law, and that the new Irish laws are implemented and enforced. They often fail to do this. So they come across as liars and as incompentent, in my opinion.

Who else is going to ensure compliance with the law if not the government?

Can the police not take action against the companies selling illegal tyres? Have they collected evidence and sent it to the DPP? Has he chosen not to prosecute?

Or has everybody sat on their hands ignoring this issue for 13 years?


I'm happy though, I just found an E mark on all of my tyres.. saving me about 400 Euro in replacing them.

Incidentally, to correct another poster.. the arrow should show the rotational direction, not simply point to the front.. as the arrow will point in both directions according to whether you view it at the top of the tyre, or after half a turn when it's at the bottom.


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