# Motor Accident- Fake invoice by third party



## greencl (14 Sep 2008)

Dear All:
Just need some practical advise from experienced members & Legal practitioners.Involved in very minor accident 18 months ago, third party hit from behind. No witnesses. both denied liability, As usual thridparty first claimed i am at fault doing wrong turns etc etc and scores of solicitor letters went frm both sides.No one are injured, except back bumper in my car is bit'tucked in'.

Thirdparty is adamant that there are 'life threatening injuires and sever e damage to car' which are all fake. There is 'friendly' medical report. i & my solicitor are banging heads  how to prove third party is at fault & lying as there are no witnesses. Actually nothing happened but how to prove, once the medical report is 'made out' that after accident thirdparty started getting "night mares", "head aches", vomitings, back pains, neck pains and all settled suddenly in 5 days,. when third -party hit from me from behind how can a claim be made for nexk pain and back pain. Third-party need some money to settle off or i should face expensive court process. third-party solicitor asked if i have a proposal. My solicitor asked for invoice for the "so-called" damage to car. we got the invoice and fell down from couch seeing the bill of €1800/- including car hire. third-party's car market value at that time is only €2800/- 97 model. Invoice is total fake.

how do i prove that invoice is fake, accident happend on 24-Mar-2007. Invoice is dated 11-Mar-2007. and it is a VAT invoice with VAT charged 13.5 % to it. The hand written invoice is obtained from a friendly local garage, it is written amount is paid by cash. Is it an offence by Garage to give a fake invoice? can i write to revenue and ask them to check their  revenue records if garage actually collected that VAT amount as per the invoice number and paid to them on that date? how can an invoice be issued prior to accident? can the garage claim it is a typo error or say instead of April they mention this as March? 

Can my insurance company and accident investigator force thirdparty to withdraw complete claim and pay me legal charges so far as "counterfiet" doumentation is produced. I just want to go a head with my life and want, Garda and other persons do their job on this rather i spent time and energy on this, will i automatically get discharged from all claims of "sever damage to car and life threatening injuries", as this is counter fiet. what else i need to do to prove the invoice is total fake.

Please help- i see here quite a few judgemental notes, please avoid them, No body is on trial, i am an individual despately fighting to hold on to my hard earned money from persons like this with "claims culture" and save my future insurance premiums. i am looking as to how insurance company and law will treat such documents and how they pursue or suggest me how i should pursue with the fake invoice.


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## dazza21ie (14 Sep 2008)

It is up to your insurance company to defend the case if they wish to do so. The personal injury claim would have to be made to PIAB not court. Why are you so sure the invoice is fake. Regardless of the value of the car it could have worked out to be expensive to repair.


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## greencl (14 Sep 2008)

invoice is fake:
please read details, accident happened on 24-Mar-2007. VAT Invoice prepared on 11-mar-2007. how can garage book a car for repair before accident?
there are no details which car is taken on hire and if insurance is transfered during those car hire days, can that prove substantially that invoice is fake.
PIAB wont award as there is a dispute on liability.


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## dazza21ie (14 Sep 2008)

If it came to a court case and the garage man went on the stand and said he repaired the car and it cost €1,800 how are you going to disprove that?

Your insurance company will decide as how to proceed as it is them that will have to pick up the tab.


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## greencl (14 Sep 2008)

Thanks Dazza:
you mean to say that invoice dates and date tracking, vat payments on invoices have no relvance at all, what if some one in garage picked up an invoice paper and scribbled numbers. what i need to understand , is it evident from dates on invoice that it is fake and my insurance company can use this to fight-off third-party and pursue the fake angle..

accident happened on 24-Mar, how can invoice be issued on 11-mar?


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## susie1 (14 Sep 2008)

could it be a type and should read 11 may??


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## jhegarty (14 Sep 2008)

Sorry, if I have it correct he hit you from behind ?

why does it matter what invoice he had , you should be claiming off him surely.


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## dub1 (14 Sep 2008)

Hi. I work as a motor insurance claims handler and in my experience it is near impossible for someone who has rearended you to claim from you(unless there are independent witnesses to back up the tp claim). It all comes down to the fact that the tp should have been travelling a safe distance behind you and should have been able to stop, no matter what thw eventuality(I always use the example of what happens if a child runs out in front of your car and you have to break hard suddenly, the car behind MUST be a safe distance behind). Do you mind me asking what insurance company you are with. If its Quinn Direct then I would not be surprised if they dont take the "correct" stance and defend you in this instance.


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## greencl (15 Sep 2008)

Not claiming & not suing tp is my first mistake- i just suffered a jolt from me-which was gone after a day -nothing happened to me except to my car back bumper, some one advised me to higheten my injuries as 'whip-lash' , but i just want to get on with life as i am a young driver and only 5 years driving experience.( full License holder). i have no time to go through the solicitors letters and counter statements. my solicitior just denied liability but did not put any claim on my injuires.

i cannot give my insurance company on public forum, they are just collecting documents & no help except that any case of settlement that i have to re-pay them what ever is paid out & sufferon  no-claims bonus. what i am looking is how do i expose the 'cheat' using the invoice submitted. i work in finance company, we pay VAT regularly, so i just want to know if i can prove that Garage did not report that invoice & vat to revenue, will that open the gates of serious fraud investigation? because the invoice did not have chassis number, did not have mileage reported which led me to believe that it is made up with 'colluison' of garage. the invoice is submitted only 5 days back. any other ideas as to how to expose?


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## ney001 (15 Sep 2008)

Is there a vat number on the invoice - first of all check this number out and see if the company is registered to charge vat.


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## csirl (15 Sep 2008)

> invoice is fake:
> please read details, accident happened on 24-Mar-2007. VAT Invoice prepared on 11-mar-2007. how can garage book a car for repair before accident?
> there are no details


 
Invoice may not be fake. Its quite possible that the car was damaged several weeks before your accident in another incident and was indeed repaired by the garage on 11th March 2007. 

However, their claim that this invoice relates to damage due to your incident is fraudulent. 

I'd find it hard to believe that they would win a case against you. Firstly, they rear ended you, which means they are in the wrong according to the rules of the road. Secondly, if they produce an 11th March invoice as evidence, then you'll have no problem proving that their evidence is unreliable AND you'll also have proof that they were involved in another incident just prior to your one which could possibly have caused their "medical problems". In the end of the day, the burden of proof is on them not you, so based on what you've said, it looks like a near impossible case for them to prove liability on your part. 

You're still well within the statute of limitations, so nothing to prevent you from suing them.


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## teachai (15 Sep 2008)

Tell them you'll go to court and want to contest it.
(Obviously don't advise them of the discrepancies in the dates)
You can insist that your insurance company contests this. 

Once a judge sees these discrepancies , there claim will be thrown out and more than likely you'll be awarded costs.

P.S. Have you advised your insurer of these discrepancies?


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## Vanilla (15 Sep 2008)

Can I just point out that in real life, IF this went to court either the invoice would have to be agreed beforehand or someone would have to come from the garage to prove the invoice in evidence. So it is not as simple as waiting until this person produces this invoice in court and then, hey presto, getting their case thrown out because of it.

Maybe someone just wrote the wrong date on it?


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## teachai (15 Sep 2008)

These people are obviously taking the ****.  They rely on the fact that you don't want the hassle of going to court. 

Its unlikely that an established reputable dealer will issue a receipt with the wrong date on it. 

Is the work carried out detailed on the receipt or is it just for an amount. 

They don't have a leg to stand on.   

Contest this all the way.


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## JamesGG (20 Sep 2008)

If someone in front of you in traffic reverses into you they can claim you rear ended them, so how they are trying to claim off you is ridiculous. Surely your insurance company are aware of this?

and bad as it is and all if they are trying to screw you for sore back etc, then why don't you do the same? you have a better leg to stand on as you were the one hit.


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