# Sky v Free to Air



## Brenda2 (17 Jan 2010)

Could someone help with the pros and cons as to which of these to go for please? Am in Co Galway near coast if that's relevant.
Thanks


----------



## gipimann (17 Jan 2010)

Once you've paid for the equipment and set up there are no further costs with free to air.   However, you don't have as wide a range of channels available as you would if you subscribe to Sky.   

For example, you won't get RTE (unless you have a separate aerial), nor will you get any of the Sky channels (except Sky News).


----------



## pudds (17 Jan 2010)

here's a full list of what you get on free to air.

[broken link removed]

If its your first time going digital, you will need a STB (set top box) for each tv if you want to be able to watch a different channels at the same time.

I'm moving from Choras  shortly but am holding off to see if DTT is launched here this year as promised.


----------



## zag (17 Jan 2010)

DTT is up and running.  I have a STB which receives it and a Samsung TV with a built-in tuner that receives it. DTT is not officially launched yet, but that seems to be a technicality (or laziness, or some other official-Irish mess up).  The transmitters are in the locations beaming away, but they just forgot to tell anyone.  All I use is a pair of rabbits ears, the same ones I used to receive 'old-skool' analog transmissions 10 years ago.

I did write to the Minister pointing out that the lack of an official launch (regardless of the fact that it's up and running) means that people are putting off buying TVs or think they may need different TVs, or being sold a pup by TV salsemen (one grade up from second hand car salesmen) or otherwise being messed up.  He replied saying something along the lines of "Ain't my job, it's RTEs, or is it RTE Networks, or is it that quango we set up in 2002 to help us go digital.  I don't know, but it's not my job."

I have just ditched Sky after my 1 year contract was up and replaced it with a cheapo Lidl STB on one room and a combo sat & DTT box with recording functions in the other room.  If you are old fashioned like me then this does everything I need - the RTEs, the Ts (TG4 & TV3), the BBCs, the ITVs, Film4, (oh, and loads of childrens stuff during the day) etc . . . . more than enough to turn my brain to mush.  If you really, really, really need to know how to drive a truck at 24 degrees below, or dig an oil well or find out how the rich & famous live or do any of the other vacuous things that most of the subscription channels require then you will (may) need Sky, but if you just want to watch 'normal' TV there's more than enough on FTA.

z


----------



## Brenda2 (18 Jan 2010)

Thanks for the replies, guys.
Zag you describe our ideal situation - do you know if DTT (what's that by the way?) has adequate reception nationwide? We'll be buying new TV so any  additional advice for this greenhorn would be appreciated.
B2


----------



## SparkRite (18 Jan 2010)

Brenda2 said:


> do you know if DTT (what's that by the way?)


 
DTT = Digital Terrestrial Television


----------



## Leo (18 Jan 2010)

Brenda2 said:


> We'll be buying new TV so any additional advice for this greenhorn would be appreciated.


 
Make sure the new TV supports MPEG4, many are labeled as Irish Digital TV Ready in the stores.
Leo


----------



## zag (18 Jan 2010)

Brenda2 said:


> Thanks for the replies, guys.
> Zag you describe our ideal situation - do you know if DTT (what's that by the way?) has adequate reception nationwide? We'll be buying new TV so any  additional advice for this greenhorn would be appreciated.
> B2



As far as I know it's nationwide, but the people here - http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f=56 - should be able to confirm if you give them your location.

In fact check here - http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055420793&page=37 - for detail of TVs which tick all the boxes.
z


----------



## hopalong (18 Jan 2010)

if a have an mpeg4 tv,do i use a rabbits ear aerial then i get dtt rte ?and if i dont have a mpeg4 tv,do i need to buy a mpeg4 receiver box and a indoor aerial.dublin viewer.


----------



## pator (18 Jan 2010)

zag said:


> As far as I know it's nationwide, but the people here - http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/forumdisplay.php?f=56 - should be able to confirm if you give them your location.
> 
> In fact check here - http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055420793&page=37 - for detail of TVs which tick all the boxes.
> z


 
Zag would you have any more details - I found the boards site confusing, doesn't seem to be for newbies to dtt, in particular 
- is there set top boxes to get the irish channels on dtt? Do you need an outdoor aerial with these or just plug in the set top box thanks.


----------



## venice (18 Jan 2010)

Just reading this thread this evening and have a few months old TV so plugged in cats ears type aerial and scan or digital channels. I picked up RTE1, RTE2, TV3 and TG4 also 4 radio station. I must say very impressed. The picture is crystal clear.

So with this and a freeview box there is no need to pay for TV unless you want the movies or Sports


----------



## pudds (19 Jan 2010)

venice said:


> Just reading this thread this evening and have a few months old TV so plugged in cats ears type aerial and scan or digital channels. I picked up RTE1, RTE2, TV3 and TG4 also 4 radio station. I must say very impressed. The picture is crystal clear.
> 
> So with this and a freeview box there is no need to pay for TV unless you want the movies or Sports



afaik you can only receive RTE DTT if you have an mpeg4 STP (or Sky subscription) and these yokes are very hard to come by at present, but I did hear that Power City are selling one now.


----------



## zag (19 Jan 2010)

pudds - venice (and me) are saying that we are receiving RTE DTT with a digital tuner in our new TVs - most come with them these days since the rest of Europe has gone digital.  No set top box required.  You *can* use a set top box if you want, but there's no point if your TV can pick it up natively.

The digital tuners in *many/most* TVs sold these days are just like the analog tuners that came in tellies for the previous 40 years.  Only they're digital.  Some TVs come without a digital tuner - just beware that if the relevant people ever pull the finger out and turn off analog broadcast you *will* require a set top box since this TV doesn't have a digital tuner.

You don't need a Sky sub to get your national broadcaster.  You do need a Sky sub to get it from a satellite, but that's not the only way RTE is transmitted.

And just in case anyone is over-sold on the whole Sky/NTL thingie - you can still get RTE analog (same picture, only not as clear) using a rabbits ears or other ariel on any TV you have bought since, oh, 1960 or so.

Due to clever marketing from Sky and crap marketing from RTE (and everyone else) people seem to think they must pay Sky to get RTE now but, trust me, they don't.

One thing to be aware of is that UK DTT is a different spec than Irish (and most of the rest of Europe).  A TV sold in the UK market (say, like in Belfast . .  .) as being ready for DTT won't work with Irish transmissions.  If you are buying a TV today, ask the guy if it will work right here, right now with Irish DTT - it's either a yes or a no - if he tells the truth you know what you're getting, if he tells a lie you can come back and whack him (and more importantly get a refund) if it doesn't.  As far as I know Power City mark their TVs as "Irish DTT" compatible, so you should be able to trust them.

z


----------



## Leo (20 Jan 2010)

zag said:


> A TV sold in the UK market (say, like in Belfast . . .) as being ready for DTT won't work with Irish transmissions.


 
Not true, a lot of TVs sold in the UK market have both MPEG2 & MPEG4 decoders. As mentioned above, you need MPEG4 for Irish DTT.
Leo


----------



## zag (20 Jan 2010)

Leo said:


> Not true, a lot of TVs sold in the UK market have both MPEG2 & MPEG4 decoders. As mentioned above, you need MPEG4 for Irish DTT.
> Leo



I stand corrected.  How about this -

*Many* TVs sold in the UK market (say, like in Belfast . . .) as being ready for DTT won't work with Irish transmissions.

That is to say that TVs which are sold specifically for the UK market may or may not be capable of receiving Irish DTT because Irish & UK DTT standards are different.

z


----------



## venice (21 Jan 2010)

i got mine on Amazon so i suppose thats UK


----------



## pudds (21 Jan 2010)

Leo said:


> Not true, a lot of TVs sold in the UK market have both MPEG2 & MPEG4 decoders. As mentioned above, you need MPEG4 for Irish DTT.
> Leo




Also MPEG4 is backwards compliant with MPEG2


----------



## zag (21 Jan 2010)

Ah janey lads, you're great with your MPEG2s and your MPEG4s.

The point I made still stands with a little clarification - if you get a TV in the UK which only has an MPEG2 decoder then you won't be picking up RTE on it.

Since the original posts indicated that people didn't know what DTT stood for (or that it was even in operation) I didn't think it would be beneficial to start introducing the finer details of MPEG2 and the MPEG4.

And before you come in with the STB bit, I know you can do that.  My point was about the tuners built into the TV.

z


----------



## pudds (24 Jan 2010)

hopalong said:


> if a have an mpeg4 tv,do i use a rabbits ear aerial then i get dtt rte ?and if i dont have a mpeg4 tv,do i need to buy a mpeg4 receiver box and a indoor aerial.dublin viewer.



If you can currently receive all the 4 irish channels with an indoor  or outdoor aerial then all you have to do is connect this aerial to your MPEG4 receiver and way you go!




If your thinking of getting a new tv make sure its MPEG4 compliant.


----------



## zag (25 Jan 2010)

pator said:


> Zag would you have any more details - I found the boards site confusing, doesn't seem to be for newbies to dtt, in particular
> - is there set top boxes to get the irish channels on dtt? Do you need an outdoor aerial with these or just plug in the set top box thanks.



Just last week, someone somewhere got one of their fingers out and launched a brand - saorview.  This means that when you go into your retailler in a few years all you should have to ask them is "Does this telly (or set top box) do saorview ?" and if they answer "yes" then you can be sure it will pick up Irish DTT channels.

Right here, right now, there is nothing in the shops with this branding but there are plenty of TVs & set top boxes that meet the specifications.

Regarding the boards discussion - the whole problem with this area is that *because of the lack of a working information campaign* from the Government or anyone else there is no clear set of information.  The saorview branding will help this situation in the future.

At the moment there are three levels of understanding of Irish DTT -
1) expert, someone who works in the industry and knows all the nitty gritty - very few of these.  They can explain to you how yer MPEG4 is different from yer MPEG2.
2) enthusiast, someone who has some technical knowledge, has read some stuff, knows that when Irish DTT gets going they won't be able to use a certain type of technology.  Couldn't tell you exactly what MPEG4 is but knows that you will need a decoder for it.
3) the vast majority of the population, most people don't pick up knowledge about this stuff from the ether and so don't know anything about it at all.  These are the people that will unfortunately walk into some big retailer and see that the telly does MPEG<something> and reckon it's probbaly going to work for them.  Once they can see that it does saorview it will help an awful lot.

[broken link removed] - for discussion of the branding.  Bear in mind that this will be written mostly by expert/enthusiast level but it's the only place you're going to get anything approaching a clear explanation.

Regarding ariels - in general you can take it that if you get reasonable analog reception with a pair of rabbits ears (or whatever ariel you currently use) you will get reasonable digital reception with the same ariel.  As long as you have a digital receiver of course . . .  The transmission masts aren't changing 'direction' just because they've gone digital - the people who watch TV are still in the same areas so the masts still cover the same areas.

z


----------



## z104 (25 Jan 2010)

I picked up dtt with a coax cable and a metal hanger.TV is MPEG4. It's available alright. Not officially launched. Still being tested apparently. 

Between the rte aerial and free to air there is plenty to watch. The differnce between free to air and sky is the channel choice and cost.

What channels do you need? You could just get the basic sky package for 22 euro a month and after one year you can cancel and just used the equipment to pick up free sat channels.


----------



## georged3rd (19 Feb 2010)

*Greenhorn with Freesat question(s)*

My friend's conundrum...

Info:
- Living in Ashtown (Royal Canal Park to be specific) with an appartment facing towards the royal canal. 
- Onsite Sky engineer today said the tree across the road was obstructing the Sky dish's view/sight. 
- Her only other paid-TV solution where she lives is Cablewatch & they offer a poor & limited service at best.
- she currently has a 10ish year old CRT Phillips TV with analogue tuner/aerial on the back (considering upgrading to a Full HD TV with built in digital Freesat tuner)

Questions:
- Can she get Freesat in her area without having to fit a dish? (apologies if this is a stupid question, the thread so far implies yes but want to be sure)
- Will she be able to tune in all of the stations listed on the wikipedia URL mentioned earlier in this thread?
- What equipment (STB, digital tuner box, mpeg4 decoder etc...I'm not TV tech savvy sorry) specifically will she need to buy? Any recommended makes, models etc?
- If she did need to fit a dish (e.g. because of a poor non-dish-based Freesat signal in her area); are Freesat dishes pointed in a different direction than Sky TV dishes (considering the tree).

Or am I over-complicating things & would all the above be irrelevant by simply buying a TV with a built in digital freesat tuner?


----------

