# Ulster Bank is allowing tracker mortgages to be transferred to a new house



## Brendan Burgess (28 Mar 2012)

If you have an Ulster Bank tracker and you want to trade up, you can now do so. You will keep the tracker rate on the existing mortgage and pay the higher svr on the new mortgage. 

It won't apply to people in arrears.
It won't apply to investment properties - obviously.

I am trying to get the official press release

Brendan


----------



## Greekwife (28 Mar 2012)

Would be interested to know how this would work for people in Negative Equity ?

Also say if someone wanted to sell their house (with a Tracker Mortgage) first and then buy a few months later or would the sell and buy transaction need to be done at the same time ?

How would it work for people trading down - if they did not need to get additional funds  on the Variable Rate ?


----------



## thedaras (28 Mar 2012)

Thats certainly progress and good news for those who have trackers with UB..wonder if PTSB and or others will follow suit..


----------



## plant43 (28 Mar 2012)

Can someone explain how this would work?

I currently have a tracker with UB with ~280k remaining, house probably worth about 150k.


----------



## Brendan Burgess (28 Mar 2012)

plant43 said:


> I currently have a tracker with UB with ~280k remaining, house probably worth about 150k.



I haven't got the press release yet, but I am guessing the following

Let's say you want to buy a house worth €250k...



House |250k
tracker element| 280 
SVR element |100
Total|380
Loan to value |152%
If you meet their lending criteria for a €380k mortgage, they will lend you the money. 

Brendan


----------



## Brendan Burgess (28 Mar 2012)

_OK, here is the press release _

*ULSTER  BANK LAUNCHES NEW PORTABLE OPTION FOR TRACKER MORTGAGE CUSTOMERS*​ - *Ulster Bank Tracker Mortgage Customers will be able to keep their  existing tracker when buying a new home – *​ ​ *28th March 2012:*  Ulster Bank has today announced a new initiative designed to help its customers  move house. The Bank is now offering its existing tracker mortgage customers the  opportunity to take the benefits of their tracker mortgage with them when buying  a new home.
This  initiative is the first of its kind to be offered in Ireland  and Ulster Bank is making the option available to all of its customers seeking  to move, whether upgrading to a larger family home or trading  down.
Commenting, Jim Ryan, Head of Branch Banking at Ulster Bank said: “In  Ulster Bank we recognise that many of our tracker customers will want to move  for a variety of reasons.  We are  pleased to be able to help our customers do this, by offering them a real chance  to move by taking their tracker with them to their new home. Until now these  customers will have been reluctant to move for fear that they would lose their  tracker mortgage.”

“In  2012, we are aiming to double our mortgage lending. Whilst market demand remains  relatively low, Ulster  Bank has seen increased activity from those looking to return to the housing  market. We are keen  to help as many customers as possible and this is just one of a number of  initiatives Ulster Bank is currently offering customers to help them buy a new  home. It will  assist those who are thinking of moving house but who are reluctant to lose the  excellent value they currently have from their Ulster Bank tracker  mortgage,”  he continued.

*How it  works*
If  upgrading and increasing the overall amount of mortgage borrowing, customers  will be able to keep their existing tracker mortgage rate for an amount  equivalent to their existing tracker mortgage balance, with any additional  borrowing being subject to Ulster Bank’s new business rates.  

If  a customer is interested in reducing their overall borrowing by trading down,  the option to port their tracker rate to their new home is also available.  

 
*Eligibility*
This  option is available to all Ulster Bank tracker mortgage customers who are  up-to-date with their existing mortgage payments and seeking a residential  mortgage for use as a principal private residence.  Overall mortgage eligibility remains  subject to Ulster Bank’s standard credit and affordability  criteria.


----------



## LDFerguson (28 Mar 2012)

Hi Brendan, 

I haven't seen the press release - just this piece which presumably was quoting from the release.

My reading of the article would be: - 


Ulster Bank are not saying they're getting into negative equity lending. If you're in negative equity and want to trade up, you'll have to come up with sufficient cash to get yourself out of negative equity.
They may or may not lend to reluctant landlords. This new deal might just be for people who are selling their existing property and getting a new mortgage to buy their new one.


----------



## thedaras (28 Mar 2012)

Its fantastic news for those who have trackers with UB and want to move to a bigger/smaller/more appropriate house and for those with UB who need to move for work reasons..for once the news from a bank is good news.Thanks Brendan for the heads up..(Have to wait and see if PTSB will do the same ).
I have thought about moving but as we have the tracker rate,I wouldn't dare mess with it..but this makes it possible,even if we never get to take advantage of it,it means that people are not so stuck..


----------



## Brendan Burgess (28 Mar 2012)

LDFerguson said:


> Ulster Bank are not saying they're getting into negative equity lending. If you're in negative equity and want to trade up, you'll have to come up with sufficient cash to get yourself out of negative equity.



Hi Liam 

I don't think that this correct. UB wants to do negative equity mortgages in exceptional circumstances. In the case I outlined above, the borrower will have to be able to comfortably meet the stress test borrowing limits on a €350k mortgage. If so, I think that they will be allowed to transfer their negative equity. 

I have no doubt that most people applying for negative equity mortgages will be refused on affordability grounds. 

I would guess that there be two big users of this new product 



People with a cheap tracker and plenty of equity in their home who want to trade up and will still have equity
People who are in negative equity who want to move house but without significantly increasing their borrowings.



> They may or may not lend to reluctant landlords. This new deal might  just be for people who are selling their existing property and getting a  new mortgage to buy their new one.


This is for people who want to move home. 

It is not for investors. 

If a borrower has rented out his home and bought a new one, then the former home is an investment property. 

If they have rented out their former home and are now renting, I would guess that the UB will allow them to sell the home and trade up or down. But I don't know.

Brendan


----------



## Brendan Burgess (28 Mar 2012)

I think it makes things much more difficult for the government.

It will be argued that if a British state owned bank can do this, why can't an Irish state owned bank do this? 

If the tracker mortgages are moved from AIB and PTSB to the IBRC, they will be anxious to run down the mortgage book as quickly as possible and will not be providing additional finance. 

This move creates headaches for the government and for the other banks.

Brendan


----------



## ryaner (28 Mar 2012)

I wonder how the repayments will work on these new split mortgages? Would all the repayments go towards the tracker balance first, or be split based on the balances?


----------



## diceyreilly (28 Mar 2012)

The principal of the lender allowing for the replacement of security on a tracker is important whether the tracker is for PPR or buy to let.

Legal advice to me recently was that the lender could not replace security even though I was told by U.B. H.O. that this was possible. I had not proceeded further with negotiations on this legal advice but will now pursue  on the basis of today's news.


----------



## Brendan Burgess (28 Mar 2012)

ryaner said:


> I wonder how the repayments will work on these new split mortgages? Would all the repayments go towards the tracker balance first, or be split based on the balances?



I had a chat with them and I got the impression that all the details had not been worked out. but it seems reasonable that you will in effect have two mortgages  - Your €200k tracker and your €100k SVR. Each will have a separate repayment. 

I also asked what would happpen if someone goes into arrears but makes some payment.
And what happens if someone wants to pay a lump sum off their mortgage - would it go off the SVR or off the tracker. 

I think we have to wait until we see the actual product launch.

Brendan


----------



## LDFerguson (28 Mar 2012)

Don't know what their source is, but this poster seems to think that Ulster Bank won't be facilitating negative equity mortgages.


----------



## Shakespeare (29 Mar 2012)

*UB New mortgage proposal*

If it's true that they won't facilitate negative equity mortgages, it seeems a bit pointless, most tracker holders are the ones in negative equity due to the timing of when trackers first came out - certainly reduces the pool of people to whom this will make any difference!


----------



## Shakespeare (29 Mar 2012)

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2012/0329/1224314050944.html

According to the above article, it's currently not available for those in negative equity but there are discussions ongoing with the CB on this so that may change (hopefully) 

S


----------



## Brendan Burgess (29 Mar 2012)

This makes no sense to me.

The Central Bank has approved negative equity mortgages. 

Why would they not approve them for people with trackers? 

In reality, someone who has a tracker is actually in less negative equity than someone with an SVR.


----------



## bugler (29 Mar 2012)

Maybe Ulster Bank don't want those in NE availing of this. Are we interpreting too much on Ulster Bank's behalf on the intentions of this move? 

It may be a means to (slightly) offset the unprofitable nature of trackers.

1. They will allow trading down, as it reduces the size of the tracker even if it doesn't remove the tracker mortgage itself.
2. They'll allow trading up for good candidates with impeccable payment records and who are deemed low risk. This means they at least get a profitable variable on top of the unprofitable tracker.

The bank should naturally be reluctant to allow 150% LTVs to arise for people who are a paycut away from struggling to meet their (much increased) mortgage repayments.


----------



## cbyr1983 (29 Mar 2012)

Brendan Burgess said:


> I had a chat with them and I got the impression that all the details had not been worked out. but it seems reasonable that you will in effect have two mortgages - Your €200k tracker and your €100k SVR. Each will have a separate repayment.
> 
> I also asked what would happpen if someone goes into arrears but makes some payment.
> And what happens if someone wants to pay a lump sum off their mortgage - would it go off the SVR or off the tracker.
> ...


 
Seems a bit too good to be true but if they allow the full proceeds from the sale of the house to reduce the new borrowing, as their release suggests, it is very tempting indeed. 

I imagine in reality some of the proceeds will have to be used to reduce the existing tracker/level of borrowing. Maybe it can still work given how far house prices have fallen.


----------



## k123456 (31 Mar 2012)

Hi Looking for some advice please re Uls Tracker

We are in Positive Equity and no arrears

We have a tracker, and want to buy a bigger house, we have savings , which would cover the bigger house, the plan was to sell smaller house (Tracker on this house) and bank the proceeds ,  sale value less outstanding mtg amount

We are thinkng, can we transfer the tracker to new house, without taking out an additional mtg

If it is a stipulation, that an  additional mtg  is taken out, what is the minimum additional mtg, we would need to take out

Can we redeem , pay off the additional mtg, ideealy sooner rather than later, leaving us with our tracker only (on the new house)

Thanks


----------



## LDFerguson (31 Mar 2012)

k123456 said:


> Can we redeem , pay off the additional mtg, ideealy sooner rather than later, leaving us with our tracker only (on the new house)


 
From what I've seen, yes you can.  They mentioned that you can end up with a lower mortgage or a higher mortgage (with the additional borrowing on a Standard Variable Rate) so I'm sure they're not going to object to your having the same mortgage.


----------



## Bronte (2 Apr 2012)

Why are Ulster Bank offering this product?


----------



## venice (2 Apr 2012)

Because I believe it makes sense for them.

So if you are on a low tracker and still in a job the chances are you are in negative equity but have an amount of saving built up. Well if you haven’t then you should not be moving house and the back don’t want to lend to you.

But if you have then the UB are encouraging you to use you saving to buy a dearer house. 

So at the moment you could have a €200,000 house with a mortgage of €250,000 and say maybe €80,000 in savings.

You could now borrow maybe €50,000 at 5% and buy a house for €300,000 allowing for stamp duty and solicitors fees and the bank no longer has a negative equity loan on there books and you proved you can afford it by saving €80,000 in the first place.


That’s the only reason I can think of anyway….


----------



## timmy (2 Apr 2012)

i have a small house with a morgatge of 85,000 still outstanding...id be very lucky to sell it now for 100,000..lets say i did sell it for that price and wanted to buy else where for 150,000...iam at the moment 600 in arrears but working on that...what way does it work?


----------



## Brendan Burgess (2 Apr 2012)

If you are in arrears on an €85,000 mortgage, it's very unlikely that UB would lend you an additional €50,000. 

This option is not for you.

Brendan


----------



## timmy (2 Apr 2012)

ta brenden.

lets say i paid the arrears back in full which i currently am doing and soon will be up to date again , i had to leave my home in the country after 14 years living in my home,and come to dublin to work,,iam now living here staying with family.i am paying the mortgage on what was my 'liveable' home but have not lived in it for the past 18months,bar the odd weekend....do you think that i could work out something with them giving this position...


----------



## Bronte (3 Apr 2012)

Timmy why don't you sell the property and save for a new place in Dublin?


----------



## Brendan Burgess (3 Apr 2012)

timmy said:


> ta brenden.
> 
> lets say i paid the arrears back in full which i currently am doing and soon will be up to date again , i had to leave my home in the country after 14 years living in my home,and come to dublin to work,,iam now living here staying with family.i am paying the mortgage on what was my 'liveable' home but have not lived in it for the past 18months,bar the odd weekend....do you think that i could work out something with them giving this position...



I would say it is unlikely. If you were in arrears on a small  mortgage, why would you not be in arrears on a bigger mortgage? 

What caused the arrears?

Brendan


----------



## timmy (3 Apr 2012)

hi brendan,

remortgaged in 2006 to build on 3 extensions to the cottage which i did,never missed a payment, then lost my job in 2009.got a reduced payment then from ulster paid that back for 1 year still no job,got the job in dublin last october and had to move up,so marginally slipped into arrears but i will have that sorted and back on track in 2 months,it would be an ideal solution for me to go that way seeing as iam not even living in the cottage...pity


----------



## Cooley (3 Apr 2012)

Hi
Just wondering if anyone can advise me about this. I have a tracker with UB and am in neg equity. Hope to move in the next year or 2 as live in a small apt and now have 2 children. We pay 400 euro extra a month into our mortgage. Should we stop paying this extra into the mortgage and save it? If we were able to take the tracker to a new house in 1 or 2 years would it be better to have overpaid mortgage or have more savings. Have about 10,000 savings now. thanks


----------



## timmy (3 Apr 2012)

bronte,

will have to sell unfortunately...loved it down there.but as i mentioned if i did get 100,000 for it id be lucky..pay back the bank ect..85,000 plus id walk away with 10,000...although i am now employed they wont entertain me with a loan,, and 10grand wont get me anywhere...ah well could talk to them nicely...


----------



## Bronte (4 Apr 2012)

So if you sell you would solve the arrears, not have a property to maintain, have more income therefore and what's not to be happy about. What is wrong with renting in Dublin? What's the hurry to buy again so soon.  And if you really want to, you could start saving and buy in the future?


----------



## CreNaCille (13 Feb 2013)

Contacted UB about this.



It's not available to people in neg. equity
Mortgage must not exceed 90% LTV of new home
Can't imagine many will qualify given those conditions.


----------



## picturehouse (12 Nov 2013)

I've heard the tracker transfer facility is no longer available.


----------



## Dinny (13 Nov 2013)

Yes it has been taken of the market. they are launching a new product in the next few weeks.


----------



## finlma (15 Nov 2013)

Dinny said:


> Yes it has been taken of the market. they are launching a new product in the next few weeks.



The new product will hardly include porting a tracker will it? Very disappointed if this option goes.


----------



## divvy (16 Nov 2013)

Yes, does anyone know if they will be offering a similar product as I was hoping to use this service.


----------



## Dinny (18 Nov 2013)

was told they will be offering to port the tracker for a few years only and at a higher rate


----------



## Karl Hungus (19 Nov 2013)

We were in the process of buying a trade-up house based on porting our Ulster Bank Tracker. All UB have told us is that they have changed their policy to not allow tracker porting - they have not mentioned any new products or alternative porting arrangements.


----------



## wbbs (19 Nov 2013)

Bear in mind anyone that has an offset/current account mortgage with UB, a feature of this product which is a tracker is that it can be moved from property to property and they can't change that as it is part of the terms and conditions on that particular product.


----------



## finlma (6 Dec 2013)

Has anyone heard any details about the new product that UB will be offering? Keen to move but don't want to lose tracker.


----------



## picturehouse (7 Jan 2014)

Came across something on Ulster bank site, it might be the new product talked about. Keep tracker for only 5 years after moving.  not allowed post URL but it's under Home Mover Mortgage on their website


----------



## finlma (8 Jan 2014)

Thanks for that picturehouse. Nowhere near as attractive. An increase in tracker rate for 5 years and then it goes completely.


----------



## TheJackal (8 Jan 2014)

[broken link removed]



> If you are an Existing Tracker customer this rate cannot be moved to your new home. However you can choose a new 5 year Tracker rate (on ECB * linked rate plus a margin) for loan amounts up to your current level of Tracker borrowings (see rates tab). This new rate will depend on your existing Tracker rate and your new LTV. The remaining balance (if required) will be based on one of our Fixed/Variable rate options. After the initial 5 year period, the rate reverts to the Banks Standard Variable Rate (currently 4.50% (APR of 4.6%**)) unless an alternative rate is chosen.


----------



## diceyreilly (19 Oct 2016)

Looking back at this offer of 2012. I have a current "similar" query as follows:

Approximately 250k outstanding from original advance 310k tracker ECB+1% 12 years to run with Ulster Bank repayments up to date. 

Approx. Existing Security:
Investment House 300k
Investment Apartment 100k (original purchase price 270k)

Proposal:
I may be able to sell apartment for 100k and replace security of apartment with an Industrial property value 200k. 

Could I request replacement security limited to 100k as this would give the same security of 400k on 250k balance. At worst allow full security(industrial asset + investment house)500k to UB total security .

Has anyone replaced/released the assets of an Ulster tracker mortgage with an asset of same or higher value as above without effecting the rate?


----------



## diceyreilly (20 Aug 2018)

Can anyone confirm if they have released a property leaving security of approx €330k BTL with a balance of €220k and retained their tracker rate or similar. I've enquired previously and am updating now.


----------

