# Confused on public service pension



## j4vier (6 Jan 2016)

I am really confused on a series of points about the public service pension and hope someone here with more experience can help.

I worked in a university for slightly less than 2 years so I understand I have the option of claiming back my own contributions. However I also understand that the employer's contributions will be lost if i do so and these were at 20% so I would prefer to avoid this.


1: is there a time limit for claiming back my own contributions?

2: the university did not inform me of the options upon leaving and 1 year has passed from when i ceased employment. If I simply do nothing what will happen to this fund?

3: I was told that if I claim back my contributions and join back the public service within 24 months, the previous contributions will be re-instated, is that correct? when do the 24 months period start from though, would it start from when i ceased employment or from when i claim back my contributions?

if anyone could shed some light on these points that would be great

thank you


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## Protocol (6 Jan 2016)

A few points:

there are no employer cash conts to most PS pension schemes

there is no PS pension fund

Q2 - If you do nothing, you may receive a very small pension based on your very short service


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## j4vier (6 Jan 2016)

Protocol said:


> A few points:
> 
> there are no employer cash conts to most PS pension schemes
> 
> ...



Hi 

apologies I'm a bit confused, what do you mean that there are no employer cash contributions?

In my job the employer contribution was 20% as you can see here from the table if you google sfi salary scale (sorry can't post links)


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## Steven Barrett (6 Jan 2016)

It sounds as if you are in a defined contribution pension scheme and not a public service pension scheme. 

What Protcol is saying is that the public service scheme isn't funded at all. The pensions paid out every year is taken directly from the exchequer. 

If your employer was contributing 20%, you have a fund. 

There is no time limit in claiming back your contributions. 
If you do nothing, it forms part of your pension (your own contributions, so probably worth very little. 
I don't know the answer to part 3. 


Steven
www.bluewaterfp.ie


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## j4vier (6 Jan 2016)

Hi Steven

thanks for this info.

So it sounds to me that, if i don't do anything, I can claim back my contributions at any time but my employer's contribution (the 20%) will be returned if I don't re-join the public service within 24 months, although I would need to find out when does this 24 months periods starts from.

Bit of a scam considering that I was under 2 different contracts which lasted less than 1 year each.


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## Leper (6 Jan 2016)

j4vier said:


> I am really confused on a series of points about the public service pension and hope someone here with more experience can help.
> 
> I worked in a university for slightly less than 2 years so I understand I have the option of claiming back my own contributions. However I also understand that the employer's contributions will be lost if i do so and these were at 20% so I would prefer to avoid this.
> 
> ...


1.  (a) There is no time limit to claim back your contributions.
     (b) It might work in your favour not to claim or accept refund (see below).
2. If you even go one payment over two years of contributions you will not get any refund whatsoever.  But, you would be entitled to a pension from the university when you are 65 years of age.  The pension would be very small though.
3. If you claim back your contributions and you work in the public service at some future date you will be asked to pay back all that you claimed and @ compound interest (very expensive) and mandatory.
4. If you are sure you will never work in the Public Service or in a University again, it would be common sense to claim your contributions.
5. If you think that at some future date you will work in the Public Service again and have accumulated more than 2 years service you would be wise to leave your contributions that you have paid.


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## Protocol (6 Jan 2016)

[broken link removed]

SFI salary scales.

Researchers in unis may actually be full PS, I'm not sure.

The 20% mentioned might be a charge on the research grant, rather than an actual contribution to an actual fund.


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## Leper (6 Jan 2016)

Protocol and S Barrett are off the mark on this subject.  I know they meant well and please do not take offence.  But, we're talking Public Service Pension Contributions here solely. Incidentally, the universities, health boards, county councils, Coillte, Telecom Eireann, government depts,  all count as public service and service shared between them is counted.  

If anybody works for any branch of the public service and had service in another public service area they should immediately liaise with their Personnel Depts for securing total service which will affect your eventual pension entitlement.

For the record, If you work only two years in the public service during your lifetime your pension will be calculated at 2/80ths of the identical grade salary when you reach 65 years of age.


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## Steven Barrett (7 Jan 2016)

Leper

I'm shooting in the dark here.  If it's a public service benefit, it's a defined benefit scheme and it isn't a value you'd lose, it's a benefit. The poster claims 20% employer contribution which would indicate a defined contribution scheme. 

But you are correct, contacting the HR dept is the best way to get information. There are so many different rules applying to the different public sector schemes, it's impossible to know all of them.

Steven
www.bluewaterfp.ie


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## Slim (7 Jan 2016)

I believe Protocol is correct and the 'employer pension' is a charge on the funding. OP, I believe you are part of a defined benefit scheme and there is no fund. You can claim back your contributions but you will pay tax on the refund. If you rejoin the PS in future, you can count that period of time but you will have to pay superannuation in respect of same and that will be time and salary adjusted and will cost much more. Unless you are sure you will not rejoin and could really use the money, maybe to start a private pension, I would leave it and maybe take advantage of it in later years.


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## oysterman (7 Jan 2016)

j4vier said:


> ...I can claim back my contributions at any time but my employer's contribution (the 20%) will be returned if I don't re-join the public service within 24 months, although I would need to find out when does this 24 months periods starts from.
> 
> Bit of a scam considering that I was under 2 different contracts which lasted less than 1 year each.


Scam? How exactly?

In what circumstances do you you think rendering 2 pensionable years of your working life unpensionable could be characterised as a smart financial move?


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## j4vier (7 Jan 2016)

thank you all for your responses

I can confirm that I was getting indeed the 20% mentioned from the grant, it was showing every month in my payslip. However seems pretty clear that this amount will be returned to the uni.

Considering that there is a possibility that I might rejoin the public service at a later date, it seems that the best thing to do would be to leave it as is, as Leper mentioned, I would need to repay everything with interest which does not seem to be worth my while.



oysterman said:


> Scam? How exactly?
> 
> In what circumstances do you you think rendering 2 pensionable years of your working life unpensionable could be characterised as a smart financial move?



Well the contract duration was less than the minimum time required in order to retain the employer contribution.

Of course it will be returned to them since you'll end up being out of contract.


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## Leper (7 Jan 2016)

Right J4vier, you seem to be going along the lines I have suggested.  Good move.  But, there is a possibility that somebody within the University might decide to refund your contributions and in time you could decide whether to decline or accept.  Ensure the University has an address for you for any future correspondence.  If you will be repaying the scheme or even "buying years" towards your pension later you will pay a hefty amount at compound interest.  Best of Luck.


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## j4vier (9 Jan 2016)

I have to sign a form apparently for the refund to go through so I won't be signing that, i just asked hr to confirm whether it is true  that if I rejoin later on I would have to pay back everything with interest and to clarify when would the 24 months period would start from but i got no answer yet. thanks for your help


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## Leper (9 Jan 2016)

j4vier said:


> I have to sign a form apparently for the refund to go through so I won't be signing that, i just asked hr to confirm whether it is true  that if I rejoin later on I would have to pay back everything with interest and to clarify when would the 24 months period would start from but i got no answer yet. thanks for your help



You will find that everything I said on the subject is true.  Your only outstanding issue is at what rate of compound interest you would be liable if you accept the refund.  I cannot remember the rate.


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