# Cat catching baby birds



## Concert (2 Jun 2010)

I know it's instinct for all cats to go after birds but our young cat is catching at least one, if not two tiny birds a day.  As out garden is a haven for birds there is little I can do to deter them but I'm wondering if anyone has any ideas on how we could stop this.  I hate coming home finding these little birds, dazed and half dead on the patio.


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## Brendan Burgess (2 Jun 2010)

Get rid of the cat?  cats and birds do not mix.

Alternatively, put a bell around its neck. It won't help nestlings, but older birds will hear it coming.


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## Crugers (3 Jun 2010)

Had a little fledgling breath his last in my hands on Monday after our cat brought him home! Sad, but nature is cruel. Survival of the fittest and all that!

Keep the cat in for a few days (or maybe weeks!). Once the fledglings get the hang of flying they should be OK (well as safe as any other bird...).


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## Darthvadar (3 Jun 2010)

I'd second the bell on the collar suggestion...

My dog is a holy terror for catching birds... I don't think he intends to harm them... He wants to play, but the poor birds die of fright when they find themselves in his mouth...

I have a small bell on his collar, and it has sorted out the problem....


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## Sherman (3 Jun 2010)

flahers2 said:


> I know it's instinct for all cats to go after birds but our young cat is catching at least one, if not two tiny birds a day. As out garden is a haven for birds there is little I can do to deter them but I'm wondering if anyone has any ideas on how we could stop this. I hate coming home finding these little birds, dazed and half dead on the patio.


 
Try being a responsible cat owner and keep the cat indoors for the next few weeks. Yes the cat will whine and moan but it'll get over it. Unfortunately, most (not all) cats are excellent instinctive hunters - it's up to you to be responsible and not afford your cat the opportunity to damage local wildlife. Part of being a responsible pet owner is not letting it harm other wildlife - you wouldn't let your dog go around attacking lambs.

Edit - note I'm not criticising but you do have to take responsibility for your animal (and yes I own cats and practice what I preach!).


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## AlbacoreA (3 Jun 2010)

Is that what cats do?


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## ivor james (3 Jun 2010)

Strange as it may seem, your cat is actually trying to please you with its hunting skills, literally when it leaves its prey on you patio or at you front or back door,what it is saying to you in its own way is "look what I got for you, I brought this bird to you!" You may notice that your cat never eats the bird but just plays with it and even tortures it,so its not like the cat needs it for food. Unfortunately this is a very deep inctinct and short of keeping your cat inside,there is really not a lot you can do. The bell around the neck is a very good suggestion,but try as you might you will not stop it entirely. My personal view is if you do try to stop your cat from being a cat,you will make it into a very unhappy cat! Its a natural act for yout cat.


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## Brendan Burgess (3 Jun 2010)

Crugers said:


> Sad, but nature is cruel. Survival of the fittest and all that!



Only to a point. The domestic cat is not a native species. We are disturbing the balance of nature by bringing in these hunters into an environment where they don't belong. So we should take extra measures to protect our wildlife - such as putting a bell on the cat, keeping it indoors, or chaining the cat to a post if you really want to have it in your back garden.


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## haminka1 (3 Jun 2010)

Sherman said:


> Try being a responsible cat owner and keep the cat indoors for the next few weeks. Yes the cat will whine and moan but it'll get over it. Unfortunately, most (not all) cats are excellent instinctive hunters - it's up to you to be responsible and not afford your cat the opportunity to damage local wildlife. Part of being a responsible pet owner is not letting it harm other wildlife - you wouldn't let your dog go around attacking lambs.
> 
> Edit - note I'm not criticising but you do have to take responsibility for your animal (and yes I own cats and practice what I preach!).



Sherman, I'm rather puzzled about the cat being a threat to the local wildlife. Imho, domestic cats roaming free are actually a part of the ecosystem, because there would be normally a rather stable number of them in an area. As such, they will serve to control the wildlife population /and as all of us know, Ireland's wildlife is rather understaffed in the category of predators/ and birds will adjust accordingly /i.e. having more youngsters etc/. 
I have a cat and before that I used to have hamsters - while these do not mix, I love both of these species and understand their needs. A cat's need is to roam free and hunt. I would definitely not keep my cat indoors if not absolutely necessary because he is so much used to being outside, keeping him in would be unnecessary torture. He is bringing birds and mice and leaving them in our garden but I'd never punish him because he'll never understand why. He used to have a bell on his collar but I removed it because it not only warned off birds it also put his "friends" who were fighting for his territory in advantage as they knew where he was and he could neither attack them properly if necessary nor run away when needed.


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## ivor james (3 Jun 2010)

Brendan Burgess said:


> Only to a point. The domestic cat is not a native species. We are disturbing the balance of nature by bringing in these hunters into an environment where they don't belong. So we should take extra measures to protect our wildlife - such as putting a bell on the cat, keeping it indoors, *or chaining the cat to a post if you really* want to have it in your back garden.


 

Brendan I know you are the moderator here,but really I have to say OH MY GOD! That would be a case for the DSPCA,make no mistake!!


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## Teknon (3 Jun 2010)

Many of our native irish birds are under threat because of the introduction of cats.  Be responsible, do what you can to prevent your cat from giving you little gifts of dead birds.


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## Scotsgirl (3 Jun 2010)

Cats have only be domesticated for 200 years.  It's still their instinct to hunt.  My cats often catch birds and sometimes leave them on the floor beside where I usually sit, which is their gift to me.  Much as I don't like birds being killed (and I've managed to rescue the odd one from the cat's mouth) I know my cat is just doing what comes naturally, and there is no point in punishing it in any way or locking it indoors (also another punishment).  I have tried collars with bells, but they always manage to lose them within a few days.

I doubt they kill enough birds to threaten our native wildlife.


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## mathepac (3 Jun 2010)

Scotsgirl said:


> Cats have only be domesticated for 200 years...


Cats have been domesticated for at least 5,000 years, but, as pointed out above, not in Ireland. As a non-native species they do need to be controlled when parent birds are rearing as killing the young birds will devastate some species which are already under intense pressure.

I'm lucky in that the bells my cats wear at this time of year seem to work and I've had no mis-fortunate "presents" left for me.


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## shopgirl (3 Jun 2010)

I spoke to the vet about putting a collar & bell on the cat however he said that you should never put a collar on a cat as they climb a lot and can end up hanging themselves on a tree/hedge.


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## xeresod (3 Jun 2010)

shopgirl said:


> I spoke to the vet about putting a collar & bell on the cat however he said that you should never put a collar on a cat as they climb a lot and can end up hanging themselves on a tree/hedge.


 

You could use a harness (like these) instead of a collar and attach bells to that for when you let the cat go out.

Although I had a cat that even with 4 very loud bells still managed to catch everything that moved!


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## Sherman (3 Jun 2010)

shopgirl said:


> I spoke to the vet about putting a collar & bell on the cat however he said that you should never put a collar on a cat as they climb a lot and can end up hanging themselves on a tree/hedge.


 
You can get collars now that have a release mechanism so that if the cat gets stuck the collar automatically releases.


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## levelpar (3 Jun 2010)

How about a cow bell?. That should slow the cat down.


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## mathepac (3 Jun 2010)

In my experience though, even with bells, hunting cats are very creative - http://archive.autocarindia.com/autocar_forum/uploads/avatars/20090202_061949_crazy-cat.png


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## Sue Ellen (3 Jun 2010)

Its the *female* sparrow hawk that causes this problem in our garden - that's vicious women for ya


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## Marietta (3 Jun 2010)

I awoke at the unearthly hour of 4.30 this morning to hear my  dog howling in the shed, I had to haul myself out of bed to investigate and  I found him chasing the tails off two terrified swallows around the shed. I think it is a time of the year thing.  I am going to put a muzzle on him tonight becuase I can't put up with this racket for the next number of months and besides these little birds deserve a chance in life.


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## levelpar (3 Jun 2010)

> I awoke at the unearthly hour of 4.30 this morning to hear my dog howling in the shed, I had to haul myself out of bed to investigate and I found him chasing the tails off two terrified swallows around the shed.


 
Why keep birds in the shed  .I'm sure that they must have kept the poor dog awake chipping all night


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## Marietta (3 Jun 2010)

levelpar said:


> Why keep birds in the shed .I'm sure that they must have kept the poor dog awake chipping all night


 

Because they have their nest are in there silly


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## MandaC (3 Jun 2010)

Last year Blackbirds built a nest in the hedging on top of the wall only about 4 feet from mams back door.

When the babies were flushed out of the nest, the dog must have got one and mam came out to dog in the shed with dead baby bird.  She said she could not look at the murderer for a few days.  

Lo and behold, birds came back this year.  First attempt she scuppered the nest, said it was too stressful, but when the birds built a second nest in the exact same spot she had not got the heart to remove it having watched mother bird tirelessly building it.  This year three little blue speckled eggs, but only one hatched.  

Dog had to be kept indoors and only let out the back on a leash when it came near the time for the fledgling to be evicted from nest.  Happened this week, bird fluttered around the garden for I think best part of a couple of days and then flew away successfully.

Result.  It has been brilliant watching the parents come and feed the bird.  They were so close to the house you could see the eggs(then baby bird) from about 2 foot away.


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## Rois (3 Jun 2010)

Had a similar problem last summer with dogs playing with a young bird. 
See thread below:

http://www.askaboutmoney.com/showthread.php?t=114896&highlight=injured+bird


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## ACA (4 Jun 2010)

> dog howling in the shed





> chaining the cat to a post



Whilst I don't want to hijack this thread, in light of the two parts of posts above, it's beyond me why some people decide to have pets at all


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## Bluebells (4 Jun 2010)

MandaC said:


> Last year Blackbirds built a nest in the hedging on top of the wall only about 4 feet from mams back door.
> 
> When the babies were flushed out of the nest, the dog must have got one and mam came out to dog in the shed with dead baby bird.  She said she could not look at the murderer for a few days.
> 
> ...



Sometimes when we start messing about with nature, we do more harm than good. 
I know your mother was well intentioned, but what she actually did was cause a lot of stress to the birds. Birds use a tremendous amount of energy building a nest - to then have that nest destroyed means that they have to do it all over again, and it is exhausting for them.

The best thing to do is prevent them from building the nest, and they will nest elsewhere.


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## annR (4 Jun 2010)

My parents went the other direction and constructed an elaborate screen to hide the nest from magpies and put an old mattress on the ground for the fledgings.  They don't have pets and God help any cats that come near that garden . . . .


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## Caveat (4 Jun 2010)

I would never put bells on our cats. For me, the occasional dead bird or rabbit is a small price to pay for having a rodent free house.



> God help any cats that come near that garden . . . .


 
 What's that supposed to mean?

Ah the poor wee birdie wirdies but yet all out war on the cats apparently?!

The sentiment reminds me of the militant anti-abortionists who in their zeal for the right to life will go as far as to murder doctors who carry out abortions. 

All this bird stuff is often based purely on emotion and usually has very little to do with a concern for the balance of nature or dwindling species etc - as I said, if the rat or mouse population was in decline due to the antics of cats I don't think too many people would complain - why not?


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## hfp (4 Jun 2010)

my cats four years old now and had never shown much desire for hunting, but have had 3 birds left for me in the last fortnight.  wouldn't be so disturbing if they hadn't all been decapitated  bell won't work as he's like houdini with collars, and can't keep him in as he has been known to pee on the furniture instead of the litter tray if he can't go outside!!


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## Crugers (4 Jun 2010)

Brendan Burgess said:


> ...So we should take extra measures to protect our wildlife - such as putting a bell on the cat, keeping it indoors...


Yes and yes...




Brendan Burgess said:


> ...or chaining the cat to a post if you really want to have it in your back garden...


Eh... No...
I hope that was said tongue in cheek...
It is possible to adapt gardens to keep cats within its confines... without the use of chains...


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## levelpar (4 Jun 2010)

> have had 3 birds left for me in the last fortnight. wouldn't be so disturbing if they hadn't all been decapitated


 
Was wondering where all the small birds were this year. Looks like your cats have an open season on the poor little creatures.



> I am going to put a muzzle on him tonight


I dont agree with that. Imagine if you were locked up in a shed listening to two people ranting on all night and you were muzzled and could'nt tell them to shut up.


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## Purple (6 Jun 2010)

brendan burgess said:


> only to a point. The domestic cat is not a native species. We are disturbing the balance of nature by bringing in these hunters into an environment where they don't belong. So we should take extra measures to protect our wildlife


+1


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## haminka1 (6 Jun 2010)

Brendan Burgess said:


> Only to a point. The domestic cat is not a native species. We are disturbing the balance of nature by bringing in these hunters into an environment where they don't belong. So we should take extra measures to protect our wildlife - such as putting a bell on the cat, keeping it indoors, or chaining the cat to a post if you really want to have it in your back garden.


imho, blaming cats for endangering the wildlife in Ireland is rather lame - you'd see more animals hit by cars or chased away by destroying their natural habitat by humans than killed by cats 
in fact, one of the arguments for cats is, that by hunting the rodents such as mice and rats cats in fact help protect the nests because rats and mice rather enjoy snacking on eggs and young 
the biggest damage ever done to Ireland was by people - culling the forests and extermination of predators domestic to Ireland to create pastures for sheep and cows and to protect them caused more mess and imbalance in the ecosystem than a small cat could ever do.
furthermore, you've got the use of insecticides, extensive housing developments - killing off of one or two fledglings or birds by cats pales in comparison with what humans do every day to nature


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## Purple (6 Jun 2010)

Cats killing birds; what to do.


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## roytheboyo (6 Jun 2010)

I am blown away by the opinion that anyone should be allowed to keep a cat and so what if it kills the 'occasional' bird.


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## haminka1 (6 Jun 2010)

guys, again, can we please put the whole discussion into perspective. one would assume this country is riddled with cats who are after the poor birds who are slowly disappearing because our pets are chasing them non-stop and won't allow their offspring to grow up. 
this is not true. while cats are occasionally chasing birds, they are also hunting rodents, who are the real plague of the country. while my cat may come home with the occasional bird, he is also going after the mice and other rodents and i bet he is doing more useful job doing it than us, who can only use pesticides and other poisons to get rid of the vermin - and thus endangering other species /including birds - what was the story with the white-tailed eagle?/ more than our kitties could ever do. 
we discuss the cats like they are the biggest threat to our nature while in reality it is really us.


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## Caveat (6 Jun 2010)

roytheboyo said:


> I am blown away by the opinion that anyone should be allowed to keep a cat and so what if it kills the 'occasional' bird.



Really? you are 'blown away' ? 

Why exactly? 

And once again, I ask:



> All this bird stuff is often based purely on emotion and usually has very little to do with a concern for the balance of nature or dwindling species etc - as I said, if the rat or mouse population was in decline due to the antics of cats I don't think too many people would complain - why not?


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## haminka1 (6 Jun 2010)

Caveat said:


> All this bird stuff is often based purely on emotion and usually has very little to do with a concern for the balance of nature or dwindling species etc - as I said, if the rat or mouse population was in decline due to the antics of cats I don't think too many people would complain - why not?



it's like people refusing to eat the deer because of the cute little bambi but tucking into a huge blue steak with pleasure - our hypocritical values


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## roytheboyo (6 Jun 2010)

I am blown away because this is another example of the impact people have on other species, in many cases without even realising it, similar to putting out poison and the thousands of other ways we are destroying the environment.

I set up a bird table which used to attract lots of different types of birds, i have seen the total amount, as well as the amount of different types dwindle as the number of neighbours increased, and therefore the number of cats increase.  Cats dont always bring killed birds home, they kill serious amounts of birds, which are already under pressure from other sources.

Regarding your mouse/rat question my reply would be that humans should take every step possible to limit the damage that introduced species do to any other animals, including rats/mice.  I for one would be concerned if numbers of rats/mice were dwindling, as they have their place too, but i dont see that happening, while i do see bird numbers dwindling, because of cats and other reasons.


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## levelpar (6 Jun 2010)

> so what if it kills the 'occasional' bird.


 
Cats killing birds; what to do

According to "what to do"  55 million birds are killed by cats every year in the UK


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## Purple (7 Jun 2010)

Roy, we've been screwing around with our environment for thousands of years. Most of our wildlife was introduced. I'm no cat fan (and yes I do play that up here a little bit) but they aren't laying waste to the countryside.


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## moneysaver1 (17 Jun 2010)

The bell is probably the best instant solution. Bottom line is "Tis the Season".
No matter how you look at it, it is nature and they will continue to catch them. All you can do it keep an eye on them as much as pos and bang the window as much as pos when you see them down feeding and the cats are in stalking mode. Mostly anyway its an evening time activity for cats as in summer days are too hot for thier fur coats. Between 5-8pm is "hunting time" for them it seems.


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