# Do you think private health insurance is a necessity?



## Mongola (1 Sep 2011)

I am sure there have been threads on this before but after another heated discussion with a friend of mine last night (again) I am wondering what most people think. 

I am French and have been living here for nearly 10 years. I can't help but comparing the French health system to the system here. We have an incredibly well thought out system in France (with pb but well thought out) where wether or not you see a consultant quickly does not depend on a life/death situation and/or if you have private health insurance. 

My friend believes that health insurance is a complete waste of money and according to her, if anything really serious shoudl happen: she would get transfered abroad for treatment. She views private health insurance as a waste because you are paying for a what if? Well, what if she was to fall ill and require long treatment? the list of what if is long. I was also discussing this topic with another friend of mine who happens to be a leading consultant in her field,  in this country and she nearly fainted when I said that to her. 

Are my views of the system here distorted? Is it that bad? Don't take me wrong, I have been sick (mainly GP) and a few visits to A&E (severe allergies, light things) but in my case, it has always worked that fine as it was either a real emergency or my consultant friend helps me to get to the right people at the right time. What do you all think? 

If in the wrong section, please feel free to move but it felt like a "shooting the breeze" post...


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## callybags (1 Sep 2011)

The whole essence of insurance is that it is to provide for a "what if" situation.

I have had health insurance for probably 25 years now, paying maybe €15,000 over that time. I have claimed maybe €4,000.

However I still think it was and is worth paying as it gives me peace of mind that if a situation arises where I could be faced with a bill of 30 or 40 thousand, I won't have to worry about it.

Having said all that I have, thankfully never been in the position of being on the breadline and having to make a critical choice between health insurance and some other essential bill.


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## One (1 Sep 2011)

I think health insurance is very important, and I will always try to ensure that I have health cover.


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## Firefly (1 Sep 2011)

I've grappled with this question on and off. (put the money aside and go private if and when it's necessary) Private medical insurance is IMO very important if the illness is longterm in nature. Having your own room when you're in pain, or, after surgery when you really need to rest is imperative in my opinion, rather than being in a ward with 5 or 7 others each with their own visitors making a racket.


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## shnaek (1 Sep 2011)

I think we should all come together and agree to stop paying Health Insurance. After all, it promotes a two tier system. If it didn't, there'd be no point in paying it. It's just another tax. The government spends over 20billion per year on our behalf to run our health system. Surely to God that should be enough to run a health system for @4million people?


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## flossie (1 Sep 2011)

I wouldn't go without mine. I have only had it 18 months but i have gotten more than my premiums back already.....I did my back in and i waited for 2 weeks for an MRI, as opposed to somebody i know on teh public system who waited over 18 months. It has allowed me to get treatment and continue as normal a life as possible, by returning to work sooner, allowing further treatment very fast when needed.

The current public waiting lists are very long - I think (correct me if my thinking is wrong) - that if all those who were on private medical insurance joined the public waiting lists the wait would become ridiculous.

I guess i am priviliged in a way to be in a position to afford it, but the reassurance of knowing if i became very ill i could be treated in a quiet area, even in my home, without a big delay, is great.


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## silverwake (1 Sep 2011)

> I've grappled with this question on and off. (put the money aside and  go private if and when it's necessary) Private medical insurance is IMO  very important if the illness is longterm in nature. Having your own  room when you're in pain, or, after surgery when you really need to rest  is imperative in my opinion, rather than being in a ward with 5 or 7  others each with their own visitors making a racket.



Ahhhh... If only that was true... I have private insurance and had a surgery a few weeks ago. I was put in a room with a woman that would turn on her radio at 6 in the morning and turn it off again at about 2am (and that wasn't the worst thing about her).
My husband asked if they wouldn't put me in a private room, as I was going to have a surgery and the recovery wouldn't be nice to share with other 3 people. They said they only keep those rooms for people dying, and I was hopefully not going to die.
We called the insurance and they said they wish they could do something, but it's always up to the hospital to put you in a room or another.

Well... all that besides having to stay over one whole day in real pain in a corridor.


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## anon473 (1 Sep 2011)

there are several issues with paying private healthcare.
Technically you are only paying for the size of the room (ward vs private or semi private room) and/or being treated in a private hospital. In theory you are not paying to jump the queue ahead of public patients with a similar need. 

In reality you/we pay health insurance specifically to jump the queue into the healthcare system. In cancer care (which i work in) once you are in the door you will generally be treated the same - the level of insurance doesnt come into the day-to-day treatment decisions.

If you dont have insurance you *will *still be treated. However there is a day charge of c.60€ up to max of c.€600 (these figures are from the top of my head so they are likely to be a few years out of date - general idea is sound though). You do not run up large bills (larger than c.600) in the public system but you will probably have to wait longer to be treated.
The obvious caveat to this is access to the NTPF. I am not sure quite how important that might be (in my healthcare field = not very)


the other separate issue is one of peace of mind. If you are kept up at night worrying about healtcare bills, then paying insurance to settle your worries seems like a good use of your money. 

As for comparing how much money you pay in premiums to the amount that you have claimed, i am not sure that that is too useful. Do you do the same thing with travel, house or motor insurance (even though it is legally required). Insurance is always a game of risk played against the underwriters (who stack the game in their favour for obvious reasons)


I stand to be corrected on any of the information above...
anon473

ps Its difficult to compare the speed at which you get seen with "friends" since their medical condition may be quite different (even if it appears similar to the untrained eye.


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## STEINER (2 Sep 2011)

I don't think private health insurance is a necessity, but I have it all the same.  I pay about 85euro a month.  The next package higher than mine is about 3,000 euro for one person, now I am not prepared to fork out that level of cash.  I was seriously ill for much of 2010 and it allowed me to have a private room in a public hospital.  I spent about a week in a public ward due to some admin mixup but that particular week I was not terribly sick, was getting chemo and its only a week or two after chemo that you feel bad.  I didn't mind the public ward from the point of sharing with other people, I am not snobby or anything but the main issue was privacy and comfort.

guy beside me snored very loudly day and night.  

most peoples visitors were fine but one person would have about 6 noisy visitors at a time.

lights on at 6am and the nurses seemed to use the ward to base the medicine trolley there to dispense the meds to everyone in the unit.

tv would be on very late.

people using the loo in the ward late at night would wake you up.

sleep deprivation was difficult.

some of my drinks disappeared from the fridge.

if I didnt have private health insurance I would have got the same medical treatment.  also anybody with certain tummy bugs/viruses get rooms anyway for isolation purposes.  if you are really bad you will get a room anyway.  all in all having spent about 5 months as an inpatient in hospital, the 85euro was good value for the comfort, for the room with own loo, tv, fridge.  I had a microwave in one room.

slept much better obviously and wife and family could stay with me most of day.


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## Mongola (2 Sep 2011)

anon473 said:


> there are several issues with paying private healthcare.
> Technically you are only paying for the size of the room (ward vs private or semi private room) and/or being treated in a private hospital. In theory you are not paying to jump the queue ahead of public patients with a similar need.
> 
> In reality you/we pay health insurance specifically to jump the queue into the healthcare system. In cancer care (which i work in) once you are in the door you will generally be treated the same - the level of insurance doesnt come into the day-to-day treatment decisions.
> ...


 

I agree with the fact that it gives you peace of mind. I would, perosnally not go without mine. I have been ok for the last few years but there growing up and up to my mid twenties I have suffered with chronicle bronchitis and other infections. Some years, I do not know what I would have done if I hadn't had cover. This year will actaullay be the first year where all I have to send in is 2 dentists receipts & one receipt for teh VHI Swiftcare clinic: I probably will get back 70 euro max, compared to the 900 euro paid. But then, when I needed it previously: it was there. 

It is very much indeed a what if situation. I believe car insurance was compared to that: I think it is slighlty different as car insurance is required BY LAW, whereas health insurance is not. 

Regarding my friend, I don't think it is relevant here to expand but all I will say is that it does help to have somebody in those places. 

I do have another question though. Preniums are quite high.
I know my 900 euro (although ridiculous is ok compared to the prices of other plans) is still ok but at what stage would you say: I am not paying this, it is too expensive? Woudl you pay a prenium taht is 1500 euro per year? 2000 euro? 3000? 4000? What would your limit be? The point when you say to yourself that you have to look at some alternatives?


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## Sue Ellen (2 Sep 2011)

STEINER said:


> I was seriously ill for much of 2010



Sorry to hear this and I hope things go well for you with your treatment.

Sue Ellen.


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## Sue Ellen (2 Sep 2011)

This post may be relevant and helpful.


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## anon473 (2 Sep 2011)

mongola said:


> regarding my friend, i don't think it is relevant here to expand but all i will say is that it does help to have somebody in those places.



+1


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## hastalavista (3 Sep 2011)

The one area where medical insurance is a must, if possible, is the area of mental health.

If you, or a family member, need to be hospitalized for mental illness and have no insurance then the only options are the psychiatric hospitals. 

If you want to pay for semi-private in one of the non-public hospitals the service is sold in monthly chunks at c euro 20,000 a month. Yes twenty thousand euros a month.

The basic policy for this cover is c 2,000 per annum and has a lifetime limit of 3-6 months depending on insurer.


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## Complainer (4 Sep 2011)

hastalavista said:


> The basic policy for this cover is c 2,000 per annum and has a lifetime limit of 3-6 months depending on insurer.


Are you sure about the lifetime limit? There is no mention of lifetime limit on the VHI site; "We cover your costs, after you spend €75, for 180 days of psychiatric care, in most treatment centres(including semi-private accommodation): that's for things like depression, anxiety and eating disorders."


Mongola said:


> My friend believes that health insurance is a complete waste of money and according to her, if anything really serious shoudl happen: she would get transfered abroad for treatment. She views private health insurance as a waste because you are paying for a what if?


Tell your friend to Google for Susie Long's story.


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## Mongola (5 Sep 2011)

I have googles Susie Long and have read the story: I am speechless ....  I think I knew that but I was not aware that the gap was soooo large.


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## csirl (5 Sep 2011)

Had some surgery earlier this year on a minor injury. Took 2 weeks to get the surgery done privately - covered by health insurance. If I was public, I would still be waiting and would probably be waiting for 12-18 months for surgery. While the injury was not life threatening, it was painful at times and restricted my mobility. Waiting 18 months for the surgery would have been a big deal and required a lot of lifestyle changes while waiting. Glad I have insurance.


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## Mpsox (5 Sep 2011)

OH had to get a small procedure done earlier this year, 18 month waiting list for public, 3 weeks for private. We went private to get it done and out of the way. For that reason alone, and given that waiting lists will probably only go in one direction, insurance is good.


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