# How long should it that any bank to trace a bank draft.



## Rightly dun (10 Sep 2008)

Anybody know how long it takes to trace a crossed STG bank draft and what info should you get back.


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## Rightly dun (10 Sep 2008)

Well you my be surprised that I requested this information back in January 2006 and I got the following information in September 2007. I am enclosing copies of the Bank Drafts which appear to have been lodged to the AIB Bank 54, Lombard Street.
There is no AIB Bank in Lombard Street.


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## Rightly dun (10 Sep 2008)

The drafts were for STG150,000 and STG 140,000. Anybody need any wall knocked down cause i'm almost finished banging my head off the ones at my house.


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## Rightly dun (10 Sep 2008)

I have been away for a few weeks, have I been Blacklisted or is everyone watching the game. any comments


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## sooty (10 Sep 2008)

Exactly what information are you looking for?....do you know the dates you purchased the drafts?


Sooty.


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## Rightly dun (10 Sep 2008)

I want to know what bank theses drafts were logded or cashed, as they were made out to a Limited Company they should be able to tell me this. Not trying to be smart, I know the time place date and I have photocopies of them.


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## Ravima (10 Sep 2008)

if you already know the time date and place, what more do you need?


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## sooty (10 Sep 2008)

If you have photocopies it should show you the Bank that they were lodged to because they would be branded either on the front or back....your bank should then be able to get clarification from that Bank as to what account they were lodged to....it shouldn't be that hard...


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## Rightly dun (10 Sep 2008)

Sorry I keep losing my connection .
The problem is that the Drafts were drawn on my Solicitors Client Account, if it had been my own, my bank would tell me over the phone. My solicitor has requested this information several times and still we know nothing. I have given both my solicitor and the bank until lunch time tomorrow to tell me or I will make one hell of a demonstration in the bank tomorrow, will probably get arrested but I have had enough of them. As I said I am looking for this information since January 2006.


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## Rightly dun (10 Sep 2008)

They are branded so many times one over the other it makes no sense


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## Rightly dun (10 Sep 2008)

I should also say the bank has had a vist from the Fraud Squad.


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## Rightly dun (10 Sep 2008)

The reason I don’t care about getting arrested is I can go no further with this, I have two judgements against the company and they have no assets and in the last three years have moved any personal assets into some many different companies I can not sue all these different entities.

So Iam looking for the bank that cashed the drafts to go after them.


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## Rightly dun (10 Sep 2008)

One of my judgements was highlighted in a couple of papers and in stubbs but if I say when it identifies me and the Company.


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## Rightly dun (10 Sep 2008)

Sorry have to go somewhere will answer any comments tomorrow if I don’t get locked up or worse.


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## Gulliver (10 Sep 2008)

It's not by any means obvious from the above that you have a right against the bank which you say "cashed" the drafts.  A UK bank never in my experience cashes drafts.  And it always ensures (should ensure!!) that a cheque payable to a limited company is paid into an account of that company.  If the bank credited the drafts in good faith to an account of a Limited company named by you as the payee on the draft, then I cannot see any negligence on the part of that bank.


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## Bank Manager (10 Sep 2008)

Rightly dun said:


> Sorry I keep losing my connection .
> The problem is that the Drafts were drawn on my Solicitors Client Account, if it had been my own, my bank would tell me over the phone. My solicitor has requested this information several times and still we know nothing. I have given both my solicitor and the bank until lunch time tomorrow to tell me or I will make one hell of a demonstration in the bank tomorrow, will probably get arrested but I have had enough of them. As I said I am looking for this information since January 2006.



You state that the drafts were drawn on your Solicitor Clients Account - that can't be the case - either its a draft drawn on a bank or are they cheques drawn on your Solicitors Clients Account?

Either way I'd suspect your Solicitor (and their bank) are at the mercy of the bank that the Ltd Co actually lodged the items in, in terms of confirming to what account they were actually lodged. It's not clear from your post how long ago the actual transactions took place - could it be that they go back beyond the timeframe for keeping such information?

Hope you get to the bottom of it.

Regards,


BM


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## Crunchie (10 Sep 2008)

Rightly dun said:


> Well you my be surprised that I requested this information back in January 2006 and I got the following information in September 2007. I am enclosing copies of the Bank Drafts which appear to have been lodged to the AIB Bank 54, Lombard Street.
> There is no AIB Bank in Lombard Street.



Probably Lombard Street London


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## Towger (11 Sep 2008)

Crunchie said:


> Probably Lombard Street London


 
A quick Google comes up with:

*Barclays
*54 Lombard Street London EC3P 3AH
*T:* 02076995000
http://www.barclays.co.uk/


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## Rightly dun (11 Sep 2008)

Gulliver Thank you for your comment.
That’s exactly what I am trying to find out, that the Drafts were lodged to the account that they were payable too and if they were then there is no problem. But the withholding of this information only leads me to believe that they did not .


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## Rightly dun (11 Sep 2008)

Bank Manager
A mortgage broker arranged a loan for me and my solicitor drew down the loan. On my instructions he went to his bank and arranged to get two Bank Drafts, and they were paid for with the money he had drawn down. Theses draft would have had to come back to the Bank and they would have to know where they were lodged, its as simple as that. 
The date on the drafts is the 30th of July 2004.Does that answer your point.


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## Rightly dun (11 Sep 2008)

Towger and Crunchie I did see that but Thank you for your comment.

One of the only things legible on the back of the Drafts is : Re AIB Bank Dublin


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## Gulliver (11 Sep 2008)

Bank drafts are notoriously unsatisfactory as a means of transferring money, but are greatly favoured by the legal profession, who like the idea of a physical paper trail.  As you can see, a satisfactory end-to-end paper trail is difficult to establish in such situations.

The sooner that we all move to electronic systems for completion of conveyancing, the better.

I am at an advanced stage of a definitive book on payment systems and technologies - which I hope to publish in the new year - will highlight issues such as yours, Rightly


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## Rightly dun (11 Sep 2008)

Gulliver they are not the only thing that is unsatisfactory in the legal and Banking profession.
Isn’t it about time we brought ourselves into the 21st century . I wish you luck.
Cheers 
Rightly Dun


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## Rightly dun (11 Sep 2008)

Gulliver I was told by the Auditors of this company ( after several letters ) that this money was lodge into a Sterling account in the name of the company and that this account was not disclosed to them at the time of their audit. On further inquiries made by them they say that this account was treated as the account of another company and that all the transactions in this account were in the *Draft *accounts of that company. Because they were in the Draft accounts of this other Company they accept this as true. They then go on to say that this company was Dissolved by the CRO for not fling theses *Draft accounts as they were not Signed* . Do you smell that Rat I know I do.


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## Gulliver (11 Sep 2008)

Rightly dun said:


> Gulliver I was told by the Auditors of this company ( after several letters ) that this money was lodge into a Sterling account in the name of the company


 
If you have caused a draft to be issued with the payee name "Rat & Rat Ltd", and the draft has been lodged to an account of "Rat & Rat Ltd" then it is unlikely that you have any claim against the bank in which it was lodged.  Subsequent events including disillusion of the company will not change this.

Ref your earlier statement.  "So Iam looking for the bank that cashed the drafts to go after them"


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## Rightly dun (11 Sep 2008)

Gulliver it’s long and complicated, I agree if they were lodged to the account that they were made payable then there is no problem. But if they weren’t then that’s a different story. Now let me make a few points.
1. I cannot accept as true anything in a draft account that has not been signed.

2 The auditor of company A is a fellow Director with one of the Directors of company A, and they both do not list this Directorship in any of their returns.

3 The auditor of company B was also a fellow Director in two companies ( resigned from one)with one of the Directors of company A (not the same company as the Auditor of company A) so much for an independent Audit.

4. My first question is about how long it should take to trace a bank draft. I have only been asking this for two and a half years. That not that long is it. Sorry for being smart.

5 The reason I want to know this is twofold . 
(a) If there is a problem with where the drafts were lodged well then I can go after the bank that accepted them.
(b) If there is no problem then I can give that bank several documents which once they are aware of they would have a duty to make a STR. The reason for this is I want someone to back up my own as I trust no one at this stage. I would not try to force them to do this, I would only pass on the documents.

Do you see where I am coming from. I need to know where this account is held that’s all.
This thread is getting very close to being pulled if I am to post to much more than that.


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## Rightly dun (11 Sep 2008)

My solicitor is talking to the Bank now, hope to hear from him as soon as he is finished. They still have not told him where the Drafts were lodged. He said he was on to them this morrning and they said that they were lodged in an international bank. But did not tell him the name of the Bank. I told him that was not good enough that I wanted to know the name of the Bank and the account number. Hope to hear from him soon.


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## Rightly dun (11 Sep 2008)

Same old story, there was nothing wrong. But they still wont tell him the name of the Bank or the account number that Drafts to. He is going back again tomorrow.


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## Bank Manager (11 Sep 2008)

Rightly dun said:


> Bank Manager
> A mortgage broker arranged a loan for me and my solicitor drew down the loan. On my instructions he went to his bank and arranged to get two Bank Drafts, and they were paid for with the money he had drawn down. Theses draft would have had to come back to the Bank and they would have to know where they were lodged, its as simple as that.
> The date on the drafts is the 30th of July 2004.Does that answer your point.



Absolutely you've answered my queries ...

a) they were drafts ...

b) 2004 means that there should be no problem tracing where they were lodged (given that it's only 4 years ago) ...

c) your solicitors bank should be quickly able to establish through what bank in the UK the drafts were negotiated ...

d) what your solicitors bank won't know (unless/until they are told by the 'foreign' bank) is into what account(s) these drafts were lodged ...

What I can't fathom is why it has taken 2.5 years to find this information out ...

Hope you get to the bottom of it soon.

Regards,


BM


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## Rightly dun (14 Sep 2008)

Bank Manager if I was to post all the things that I cant believe you would say you don’t believe me because it is to far fetched. 
You might be able to help me with this one if as your name suggests you are a Bank Manager. Why is it possible for a company which is Regulated by IFSRA and holds a ten year Licence as a MAI to open a bank account and within one year transfer the control of this account to a company which is not Regulated by IFSRA.
The reason I say within one year is that the auditor of this company did not know of its existence. 
If I am correct An investment intermediary, including an unincorporated entity, is required to submit to the Financial Regulator, not later than six months after the end of the relevant reporting period, annual audited accounts in respect of the investment intermediary.
Now because the Auditor may be able to say that he did not know of this account at the time of his audit and may not have a duty to report this to the regulator. He has known now for well over a year and if this company has meet the requirements of the regulator then they would have to have submitted the annual audited accounts for the following year at this stage, remember we are talking about the audit of year ending 31st December 2005.
If any one would like to comment on this fire away.


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## Rightly dun (11 Feb 2009)

*Update *​Its only been over 3 years since I have asked where these Drafts were lodged and guess what they told me( they told me nothing) they told me that they were lodged in Barclays bank 54 Lombard street London.
So now my solicitor has to request as to what account they were lodged to. Forgive me for being so thick is this not what we have been requesting for the last 3 years.
New information I only found out last week was that the account where they were lodged was opened in 1999. So I went back to the CRO web site and downloaded the documents for that time. To my disbelief the Directors of this company ( the founding Directors ) at that time were.

1. Only one of the Directors of this company at the present.
2. The other two Directors at that time are the partners of the auditing company that now audit the company.
3. These two Directors have on several occasions in writing denied the existence of this account and said because they knew nothing of it they would not have picked it up in their audit.
4. It takes two Directors to open a bank account , so how was this account opened when two of the three directors deny any knowledge of it.


Nobody will answer any of my questions about this, IFSRA, CRO,ODCE, and the department of Justice.
Its not that they wont say that it is right or wrong they wont say anything. They will not answer any of my emails.
Maybe they might answer one of my little girls questions to my wife.
Are the men in white coats going to come and take Daddy away.


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## Mpsox (12 Feb 2009)

54 Lombard street is the old head quarters of Barclays and was their registered office until a few years ago. It doesn't necessarily means it was a branch and that the drafts in question were lodged there.

I'm presuming that the drafts were crossed with something like "a/c payee only" on the front


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## Rightly dun (12 Feb 2009)

According to the legal department of National Irish Bank the drafts were lodged in Barclays Lombard Street.
*Mpsox *you presumed right of course they were crossed with a/c payee only. This is my whole problem with all the agencies I have had to deal with over the last three years, I did everything up and above board and have shown that this company did not and backed everything that I have said with hard copy documents and they are still driving around Dublin in their Mercedes and still opening new Companies the latest one just two weeks ago.


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## Mpsox (12 Feb 2009)

if you believe you have been defrauded, have you considered making a formal complaint to the Gardai?


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## DrMoriarty (12 Feb 2009)

Given that this appears to be a criminal matter and _sub judice_, I have unapproved _Rightly_ _dun_'s last post (which contained various serious allegations) and am closing this thread.


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