# Work injury, was persuing ex-employer via PIAB, now going court route, process Q's?



## Skary (26 Mar 2007)

I am looking for advice on a case I have coming up

2 years ago, I sustained an injury at work - this was due to being instructed to perform a duty without the correct training or supervision. 

Since then, I have been to hell and back (though sometimes I think I am still there) 

I was not initially going to take any action, however, after a few months when the bills started piling up and the pain continued and was getting worse, I decided to approach my (now ex) employer through the PIAB. The employer took as long as posssible before rejecting to have the claim assessed. As a result, I approached a solicitor (who has been nothing more than fantastic) and we are now taking the case to court.

The solicitor has recently informed me that it may be another year before we get a date in court and this in itself is causing more mental anguish than its worth!

* Has anyone else been involved in a case like this?

Did the respondent offer to settle out of court?

How long did it take to get to court?

What kind of questioning were you subject to in court? 
*
(Whilst I have been nothing but clear, concise and honest from the word go, I still feel like they are going to try and turn the tables on me and make me feel guilty about trying to get my costs covered - which incidentally are now bordering on €10k and are ongoing) 

Any advice is welcome


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## nelly (27 Mar 2007)

*Re: High Court Case*

they are playing hard ball in so far as not agreeing to PIAB whatever settlement it was. your solicitor will be able to advise you on costs. However i would cut your losses if you have have ever signed training records etc or have being doing something you should not have as they may have had a PI on you when you were off sick and spotted you running a road race for example. Why do they think they have a strong case. 
uaually more deals are done on the steps then in the courtroom - your solicitor will advise you of this too. 
If you are telling the truth and they don't have signed training records etc then it does look good. 
Try get another job to take your mind off of it!


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## Skary (27 Mar 2007)

*Re: High Court Case*

Thanks for your post Nelly, 
I never signed training records at all, and if they have had a PI on me all that would do is strengthen my case, as I had to go  through major surgery, was on crutches and in a brace for months and now I still walk with a limp, and probably will for an indefinate period of time.  What really gets me is that the director was fully aware that it happened and is now seemingly trying to dispute it. It makes me wonder if they are just trying to cover that they did not do things properly from their side, like document it in the accident report book as is required by law? 
In the mean while - I am trying to keep my mind on anything else but the case - but its not always easy!


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## ACA (27 Mar 2007)

*Re: High Court Case*

Similar scenario happened to a friend of mine. We both worked for a local supermarket in the deli and one day due to an obstruction on the floor, she fell. To cut a long story short, this lady's life has changed radically and the company that she worked for for 4 years were complete pigs to her! PIAB wasn't up and running at that time, May 2005, and the supermarkets insurance company dragged their heels for over 12 months before even entertaining her solicitor. They made her feel that she was seeking compensation for nothing and generally belittled her injury as much as possible. This lady needed injections into her spine to try and rectify some of the damage, she will be in pain for the rest of her life, she used to walk 3-4 miles a day, mind her grandchildren and was very fit for a lady in her early 50's. Eventually last October, the insurance co. offered her 25k all-in settlement and mainly because she couldn't take any more aggro - she accepted it. Her medical bills came to almost 18k - and this lovely lady will never work again - scandalous!

*If* you and your solicitor feel that you are on firm ground, I'd advise you to start playing hard ball back! You are under no obligation to talk to them - let your brief do that, (it's what they're being paid for!) Discuss with your solicitor a figure that you'd be happy with for your pain and suffering PLUS medical and PLUS legal, (if they refused to entertain PIAB, they should cover this)

If however you believe that they have proof that maybe you weren't as incapacitated as originally alleged - have a long chat with your brief - to decide on the best way to proceed.


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## Murt10 (27 Mar 2007)

*Re: High Court Case*

Did you claim Disablement Benefit from Department of Social and Family Affairs (see link below). This claim would be in addition to and completely separate from any civil cases that are ongoing. 

The is independent of you, the company and their insurers. They have no axe to grind with anyone and neither will they be seeking to protect anyone. It will send out its own investigators if necessary, if here is some dispute as to what happened or if the employer is not being cooperative and the inspectors may interview such other people as they want i.e. witnesses etc.

http://www.welfare.ie/publications/sw31.html

You may also be entitled to Medical Care which will assist with the cost your medical costs

http://www.welfare.ie/publications/sw34.html


Get your application in for both as soon as possible.


Murt


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## Welfarite (27 Mar 2007)

*Re: High Court Case*

I have been called as a witness to High Court cases similar to yours, usually by the plaintiff. In my opinion, and this is only an opinion, the whole process is driven by the inusrance company defending the case. every Tom, Dick adn Harry will be called as witnesses by both sides in agame of bluff (all costing money) adn then the case will probably be settled "on the steps" as they say. My most recent case to attend was settled this way (going on since 1999 until last week!). I presumed through what I heard that an offer made to claimant was rejected adnt hen an "improved" offer was accepted on the morning of the court....horsetrading to the end!


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## iwsf (27 Mar 2007)

*Re: High Court Case*

Hello , i am involved in 3 court case against my builder who is trying to take from me the house we paid him to build. All i can tell you is that it takes FOREVER. I already spent 3 solid days in court and guess what , the judge still doesn't even know what the case is about !!!!  So good luck you will need some


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## Skary (27 Mar 2007)

*Re: High Court Case*

Hi All, thank you for your posts. 
ACA - in reference to your last line para, there is no proof that they could possibly try and conjure which would help them, as I have not tried to pull the wool over anyones eyes at any time.  It is awful to hear about your friend   I cant believe that people can be treated so badly.
Murt, Thank you for your advice, I had sent in an application for disablement benefit, I did not realise I could apply for it, but by the time I found out, the application period had lapsed, so I was referred onto a different section who paid me benefits whilst I was out of work.  I will have a look into the medical benfits though, as this would be a massive help. 
Welfarite, thank you for your post - I cant believe that cases can drag on for so long - surely Insurance companies would want to get it over with as quickly as possible especially where the medical costs are still ongoing and piling up - well - that would be common sense to me anyway..
Iwsf - I hope that you get sorted out soon - I know the degree of stress you are probably under and the adverse affects that it has.  
Thank you all again for your posts, it is highly appreciated


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## Lomond (27 Mar 2007)

*Re: High Court Case*

Was involved in a case at work concerning an injury to an employee carrying a box and its connection with manual handling training/records. Lawyers, expert consultants, barrister team were all involved (kiching... kiching) and whilst we were standing in the corridor waiting for our hearing ....the deal was done.

I heard at the time that this often happens with the insurance company making the final call as to whether to stay in the game or fold. Its sounds a like a poker game with each side wondering how strong the other's hand is or how far they are willing to see it thru to the end.

By the sound of your case and the injury's, I would do as has been mentioned before - sit back and let your legal team do the work.

Hope everything works out for you


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## Skary (28 Mar 2007)

*Re: High Court Case*

Thanks for your post Lomond.  
How long did the case take? 
I just think its crazy - it does feel just like a poker game, which is silly as they havent a leg to stand on -   As I mentioned in a previous post, my Solicitor is great and has talked me through all the steps, but he reckons its going all the way to trial. 
It really helps getting advice and feedback from people who have been through this - because as much as a solicitor tells you things, its a part of their day to day business and it does not affect them they way it affects the parties involved  
I wish I could put it out my mind till it happens, but not that easy..


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## ajapale (28 Mar 2007)

*Re: Work injury, persuing ex-employer via PIAB, some questions on process*

Ive expanded the title somewhat to more accurately reflect the question.
aj


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## Murt10 (29 Mar 2007)

*Re: High Court Case*



Skary said:


> I had sent in an application for disablement benefit, I did not realise I could apply for it, but by the time I found out, the application period had lapsed, so I was referred onto a different section who paid me benefits whilst I was out of work.  I will have a look into the medical benfits though, as this would be a massive help.
> 
> They may have referred you back to the section that paid you while you were out sick so that the injury can be investigated and declared an occupational accident. Disablement benefit cannot be paid if your injury is not caused by an occupational accident. 1st things 1st.
> 
> ...


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## Skary (30 Mar 2007)

*Re: Work injury, persuing ex-employer via PIAB, some questions on process*

Thanks for the expansion of title AJ, only thing is that although I *was *persuing them through PIAB, the ex empl rejected any assessment thereby kicking PIAB out the picture and is now why I have had to take the court route - I started the court process approx 18 months ago..
So the thread title is unfortunately not accurate


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## bond-007 (30 Mar 2007)

*Re: Work injury, persuing ex-employer via PIAB, some questions on process*

Is that not the biggest weakness of the PIAB, everyone can simply disagree with them and the matter is back to the normal court route? Therefore the PIAB simply delays matters further than the old system? The PIAB could be simply rendered useless by people simply rejecting all their offers.


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## parsi (30 Mar 2007)

*Re: Work injury, persuing ex-employer via PIAB, some questions on process*

I know of a case where a person was crashed into (head-on) buy someone on the wrong side of the road (overtaking a line of traffic) and was subsequently sued through the PIAB. 

To be honest the PIAB's greatest benefit (being able to bring a case easilY) is also its greatest drawback. Their stats page shows a breakdown on successful claims but doesn't mention how many were rejected.


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## ajapale (30 Mar 2007)

*Re: Work injury, was persuing ex-employer via PIAB, now going court route, process Q'*

Ill get it right eventually! Question now reads:
*"Work injury, was persuing ex-employer via PIAB, now going court route, process Q's"
*


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## Skary (30 Mar 2007)

Thanks AJ 
Parsi, I agree - there are some cases where its much easier - and I cant help but think to myself that if mine HAD been settled through PIAB that the people in question would have saved themselves so much money! (And I suppose I would have been saved the mental anguish - but I would still be severely out of pocket for medical expenses as they have more than quadrupled since the respondent rejected the assessment!)
And as great a benefit as the PIAB is - Bond 007 - you are so right - its simply a case of the respondent saying NO and they PIAB cant do anything more except issue you with the papers to pursue through the courts. Maybe those respondents think/hope that if they reject through PIAB that the plaintiff will just drop the case? I wonder how many people just drop the whole thing because they think that it is too much hassle?
Murt - thank you so much for that info - am looking into it


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## Hi52 (4 Apr 2007)

Sorry to wade in at the end of the thread but the reason for your employer playing hard ball may not be that they have a strong case against you but the fact that they have a large excess in their insurance policy. Many companies accept a large excess in order to reduce their premiums and fight any litigation in the hope that the claimant gives up (as the lady did in one of the posts above) and accepts a poor offer.

 If the claimant continues with their case by not accepting their offer, the company will fight it all the way (as due to their excess, they will only pay up to a certain amount) and may win/lose. But win or lose it sends out a clear message to the other employees in the company that they will fight all claims and that puts off any other potential litigants.


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## mo3art (4 Apr 2007)

*Re: Work injury, was persuing ex-employer via PIAB, now going court route, process Q'*

10 years ago I was injured in the workplace, having been instructed to do something that I was not trained to do.  I received a potentially lethal injury and was unable to work for over 2 years, I still suffer pain and limited movement in one of my limbs from this injury.
My company refused to pay my medical expenses, and reimburse me for time off work so I had to take my case to court - this was before PIAB.  It took me over 3 years to get to court, as the extent of the injuries were unclear and I was in constant pain so it was hard to quantify what my needs would be in the future.
The day of the hearing, I settled out of court for a lower amount than what the courts could potentially have awarded.  I felt at that stage it had gone on too long and that I didn't have the strength to go through a full court case.
It is a long journey to take a personal injury case to court.  It's stressful, emotional, draining and puts severe pressure on you and your relationships.  Best of luck with it all.


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