# Housing Assistance Payment, HAP



## mathepac (21 Apr 2016)

HAP has now replaced RSA etc and is being run by local government through some of the local authorities.

Citizens information has no up-to-date information available, some council websites do, but my question seems to get no treatment.

Can a family member rent out a house under HAP to a relative? All requisite rules will be complied with and the relative is registered with the local authority as having a housing need.


----------



## Bronte (21 Apr 2016)

I recently had a new tenant and they were told this is the new scheme.  Instead of rent supplement.  I've had a look at the two info booklets I printed from the council but they don't seem to mention relatives.  I believe it shoudl be ok if your tenant complies with the 'housing need' requirment and you fit the bill as a landlord.

I had a look at the HAB form I filled in, it doesn't ask if you're related.  One important thing, it asks for a tax clearance cert, that's new.  But it gives you 6 months to get it (my accountant has applied for me as I live abroad and that is another story)


----------



## mathepac (21 Apr 2016)

Thanks for prompt response. Clearance cert, PRTB registration, building insurance documentation, etc. are not a problem and the need is genuine.


----------



## Bronte (21 Apr 2016)

I was on the phone to the council HAP today and asked your question to them.  No problem for someone like me in business so many years, ie legit landlord AND no problem if tenant is legit too.  I presume not ok say a parent buying a house and child deliberately creating a housing need etc.

They pay monthly in arrears by the way, mine is being backdated to the end March he said, tenant there since Feb.  Not that I got a letter, but tenant did, I'm awaiting a copy of letter from tenant to figure it all out, he was told I'd be paid a couple of weeks ago but not in the account which is why I phoned. 

They pay on a certain date each month.   Also the tenant doesn't pay the landlord, he pays the council ! No ceilings unlike rent allowance, as in the rent can be anything, but then the tenant will have to pay you the difference.  But there is a cap on the max they will pay, ie the current rent allowance figures. 

Please keep me (and others posted) on your experiences until we can all be 'experts'. 

It would seem to me with the rent being paid in arrears the deposit needs to be two months, my foreign tenant has loads of money according to my sibling and we should have charged more.  Argh. 

I did all the paperwork and am utterly amazed that they sent an email to sibling as one document was unacceptable and I was able to get them the correct bank statement with my address on it.  By email.  Looks like they have arrived in the new millenium at last.


----------



## mathepac (21 Apr 2016)

Thanks for that.

I have just been talking to my local Local Authority and believe me while there are improvements, the system overall is held together by goodwill, doggedness, spit and sticky tape. It's a mixture of the LA web-site, Dept of Environment Rules, LA social housing data-base and bits of paper held together manually by stake-holder intervention at various stages. LA staff, landlords, tenants and Dept of Environment.

The HAP financial system is administered centrally from Limerick I'm told and the LA has to send bank details for LL payments to Limerick to be set up. This takes a minimum of two weeks. They do not pay deposits and only work in arrears as you say which potentially means a prospective client has to find a month's advance rent and the security deposit elsewhere (HSE, Social Protection, family or payment on the drip with an understanding landlord).

I've spoken with the out-going Minister's Office, Alan Kelly and with the HAP programme office in Wexford (053) 911 7418  and the LA. Between current LAs (Limerick, Cork Co Co, Waterford, Kilkenny Co Co, Louth Co Co Sth Dublin Co Co & Monaghan Co Co) who are piloting the scheme and final full rollout, there are lots of opportunities to make savings by using technology smarter and dispensing with forests fun of paper and printer-ink.


----------



## mathepac (21 Apr 2016)

And then there is the other piece of paper where the tenant agrees to pay the LA their rent contribution. In my area the max HAP for a single person is €390 / month and the minimum means-tested tenant contribution is €25 / week payable to the LA. The tenant is responsible for paying the difference between 390 and the actual rent to the LL.

First opportunity for simplification using the above figures is for the LA to pay the LL  281.67 / month (390.00 - 108.33). Less paper and less payments / reconciliations to track immediately. Also less LA jobs, so more money for social housing.


----------



## Bronte (21 Apr 2016)

mathepac said:


> And then there is the other piece of paper where the tenant agrees to pay the LA their rent contribution.



I didn't see that bit of paper but the tenant must have signed it and given it to the LA (Local Authority/Council) I was told it is being rolled out in the country over the next year for all the existing rent allowance tenants so I want to understand it for them. 

I agree with you about the paperwork, they make it very complicated when I could have done everything by email.


----------



## mathepac (21 Apr 2016)

The tenant can do even less by email. There's a big red endorsement  across the tenant's HAP application form. I'm quoting here guys don't beat me up over the red all caps:- 

*"HAP APPLICATIONS ONLY ACCEPTED IN PERSON DURING CLINIC TIMES AS FOLLOWS:-
9.00AM - 12.30PM
NO POSTAL APPLICATIONS"
*​Presumably the agreement between the tenant and LA is also signed at this meeting as otherwise, outside of the major urban centres, the poor tenant needs to make multiple long journeys to the LA HAP offices, potentially delaying agreements and payments.


----------



## plant43 (16 Jun 2016)

Does anyone know what the LA requires for "Proof of ownership/entitlement to act as landlord of the property" assuming the property has a mortgage on it? Thanks!


----------

