# Trouble with a tenant and rent allowance



## peteb (20 May 2008)

Hi,
I have an unfortunate situtation and am looking for any advice on the matter. I have a house rented out where the tenant had a 12 month lease which was up on the 10th May. I met with him in March and he told me that he was made redundant in his old job but had got a new one so no issue there. I told him that I intended to sell the property so the lease wasnt going to be renewed. He was fine with that but concerned that he would have to move while his kids were in school so being the understanding person I am I agreed that he could stay until end of June when schools finished.

This month the rent was due to be in the account by 10th and when there was no sign i sent him a mail on the Wednesday last week (having left time for a weekend bank transfer to go through). He informed me that his wife lodged the money to the wrong account and they had to get the bank to retrieve it and it would take a few days. He said he was going to look to get a house from the council and needed me to send him a notice to quit the property which i did, giving him till 9th July.

Still no sign of the money and when I check the mail this morning I find quite a long winded email explaining that he was made redundant and had gone to the welfare etc with regards to rent, etc. So he completely played me and the money was never going be there like he said. He has said the health board are going to pay the rent this Thursday. But in the meantime he is now looking for me to sign a rent allowance/suppliment form.

Two questions - Considering that he has got a notice to quit, do i have to sign this form for two months? 
Can I get him out any early than the quit notice previously stated.

Thanks


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## minion (21 May 2008)

Ah, the trouble with rent allowance.

I would ring the health center and find out some more.  If he is getting rent allowance then try to get it paid directly to your bank account.  Sign nothing for him, but bring it to the health center and sign it and hand it in yourself after talking to them about this.

You can also serve him notice due to non-payment of rent.  He may not cooperate though.


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## murphaph (21 May 2008)

minion said:


> Ah, the trouble with rent allowance


This is hardly a problem with rent allowance-the tenant was in gainful employment when he signed the lease! It's a problem with unemployment.


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## minion (21 May 2008)

murphaph said:


> This is hardly a problem with rent allowance-the tenant was in gainful employment when he signed the lease! It's a problem with unemployment.



Nope.  Read the rent allowance thread.

Problem : 

Week 1 : "I'm just waiting for my rent allowance to come through."
Week 2 : "Im still waiting for it"
Week 3 : "Im not getting it"

Rent Allowance : A ready made excuse not to pay your rent for weeks.  And even then they might not even get it.


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## S.L.F (21 May 2008)

Seems to me he has lied to you.

Fool me once shame on you! 
Fool me twice shame on me!

Kick him out he has not paid the rent the contract is broken.


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## Bronte (22 May 2008)

Maybe he thought he would get rent allowance into his hand and would have paid you with it but he's discovered it doesn't work so fast in social welfare land.  He's probably in a desperate situation (redundancy, no money and mouths to feed).  If he gets the rent allowance would you be happy with that, you have to decide what you'd be happy with, you can't get him out straight away, notice or not it's illegal and could land you in very hot water, so you should try and minimise your losses.  Why don't you go and meet him.  In any case make sure that you gave him a legally valid notice to quit - one that complies with the PRTB rules and if you're not registered with the PRTB make sure you do it now.


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## Angrygirl (22 May 2008)

Get him out quick
I had a problem with a rent allowance tenant, "money is late due to social welfare". "i'll have it next week" "the social welfare don't like me down here" (that was the best one)
Her rent was 6 weeks late, i gave her written notice to leave, she did this and took the social welfare money and all my appliances and crockery from the kitchen with her... 
It cost me two months mortgage payments and to replace all the items she took with her..

He has already proved he was sneaky by lying to you and making you think the payment was on the way..
I wouldn't trust him at all now as he is taking advantage of you letting him stay on till his kids finish school and stringing you along for rent...


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## peteb (22 May 2008)

Well thankfully the rent appeared in the account today. But i have no intention of signing that form. I dont see why i should have to considering he has a notice to quit the property and its no longer available for rent. Am i correct in assuming that if he submits that, the HSE come out to check ur house out? If i signed it, he could just use my address and move on to the next place and not tell them hes getting rent allowance.  I actually know someone who did that!!

Its purely on principal, i made it quite clear at the start no rent allowance. it was in the ad.


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## Captin Sobel (22 May 2008)

It is bizarre that rent allowance is not paid directly from revenue to Landlord, if it were then Landlords might be more comfortable letting their property to those on rent allowance.

regardless being late on rent twice is unacceptable.  And at that point you're being taken advantage of.

Best of luck with it.


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## liketoknow (22 May 2008)

why not sign the form?
if you want your rent you need to sign it as normally the health board wont pay rent unless the form is signed indeed stating the man does in fact rent from you.

he was more than likely afraid of not having a roof over his childrens heads and that is why he lied , to give himself a few days to try and sort out the mess .

for anyone saying oh kick him out , think of the children, and if you were in the same situation would you want to be just chucked out kids and all even though you were more than likely doing your level best to resolve the situation???

HAVE A HEART.

OP , i think you have been very patient and i think you are very good natured in bearing with this guy, but you probably feel a little annoyed as he lied to you . this in understandable but he probably felt he had no other choice.


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## liketoknow (22 May 2008)

the rent allowance can be paid directly from health board to landlord .
years back when i received rent allowance i signed the form to have it paid directly to the landlord so i had no need to worry about it.
and each month i recieved a receipt from the hb to say they paid the landlord.


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## gipimann (22 May 2008)

Rent Supplement may be paid directly to landlords by the HSE, but it doesn't happen in all areas of the country.   Some landlords were under the impression that if they were receiving money directly, they had a contract with the HSE if anything went wrong (they don't).   So in some areas, the Superintendent Community Welfare Officers have decided they won't pay directly to landlords.


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## gearoidmm (22 May 2008)

Angrygirl said:


> Get him out quick
> I had a problem with a rent allowance tenant, "money is late due to social welfare". "i'll have it next week" "the social welfare don't like me down here" (that was the best one)
> Her rent was 6 weeks late, i gave her written notice to leave, she did this and took the social welfare money and all my appliances and crockery from the kitchen with her...
> It cost me two months mortgage payments and to replace all the items she took with her..


 
As a matter of interest, did you take this any further - calling the Gardai etc.  This is stealing and should be reported.


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## peteb (22 May 2008)

Like to know, I hear what you are saying but the fact of the matter was that i met with him in February and told him that the contract wasnt been renewed in May, and then gave him till June so he has had adequate notice. Im not the V de P. And its not my moral obligation to ensure he has a roof over his head!
And effectively the man isnt renting from me because the lease is up.


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## DonKing (22 May 2008)

liketoknow said:


> why not sign the form?
> , think of the children, and if you were in the same situation would you want to be just chucked out kids and all even though you were more than likely doing your level best to resolve the situation???
> 
> HAVE A HEART.




I think you're getting the landlord mixed up with the HSE/department of Social Welfare. The landlord has no obligation to the children.


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## Bronte (23 May 2008)

OP - what is your reason for not signing the form?


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## Angrygirl (23 May 2008)

gearoidmm said:


> As a matter of interest, did you take this any further - calling the Gardai etc. This is stealing and should be reported.


 
Yea I called the Gardai and said that I had a lease with her agreeing to all the items that were in the apartment and they said its my word against hers that she took the items, I also had to get carpets cleaned and repaint the whole place (what she was doing in such a short space of time i'll never know) So I wrote to social welfare advising them she never paid me the rent they issued to her and all the damage and missing items and outstanding bills she refuses to pay..
I then spent about two hours finding letting agents in Dublin and surrounding areas and emailed them as to the type of tenant this woman is, i dont want another landlord getting caught out with her like i have..


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## peteb (23 May 2008)

Bronte,
My reason is that I originally stated and made it quite clear from the outset that I wasnt accepting rent allowance. 
And secondly his lease is up and hes due to be moving out and Im not putting my name to a form where he could be doing whatever with the rent allowance after he's done in my place.


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## lightswitch (23 May 2008)

peteb, not exactly relevant at this stage but just curious.  If a landlrod has a lease with a tennant for a year and after 6 months the said tennant becomes unemplayed and want to get rent allowance.  Would the landlord not have to accept that?  just wondering!


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## peteb (23 May 2008)

Lightswitch,

I dont think theres any legal obligation to accept rent allowance as its not written into discrimination laws to say no.  Obviously you would just have a problem getting the rent and have to go to the PRTB for resolution on the matter and to get a tenant out for non-payment of rent!
My own view is that how he gets the rent is not my problem and my contract is with the tenant and no other party.


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## minion (23 May 2008)

lightswitch said:


> peteb, not exactly relevant at this stage but just curious.  If a landlrod has a lease with a tennant for a year and after 6 months the said tennant becomes unemplayed and want to get rent allowance.  Would the landlord not have to accept that?  just wondering!



My personal view on this would be that they have proved themselves to be a reliable tennant, have hit on some hard times and i would be perfectly agreeable to go with the rent allowance.  Its not so much of a risk as taking it from day one because you know have a relationship with the person and can make that call much more easily.  And i would be fine woth it as long as they were up front with me from the start.

The reason I dont accept rent allowance up front anymore is that its too easy for the person to just mess you around and do untold damage and walk away without penalty.  I prefer to negate this by getting tennants with a job and references and not someone who is depending on a third party to give them their rent and could say at any stage "Sorry, they wont give me rent allowance, tough."  It has happened.

Having said that I sometimes do allow people on rent allowance upfront, but its purely down to if i like them, but i never advertise that i accept it.


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