# Noisy children



## Yachtie (23 May 2012)

Hi all,

I need to rant and I also need advice if anyone has any. 

Our family of three, including a 2 year old child own a semi-d in a 'nice' area. There are 13 houses on our cul-de-sac and six of them have children aged between 8 and 14. Our house is sort of half way down the street at the end of which is a very nice and huge park with payground and all kinds of sports grounds in it.

Over the last five evenings, the boys on the street, aged 10-12 have been bringing out a basketball hoop onto the street and playing basketball at the end of our driveway which is also about 3 meters from our young child's bedroom. The first night, I went out at 8.30-ish pm and asked them calmly to move away as out 2yr old was trying to go to sleep. They went away for 5 minutes and came back.

On the second night, they did the same and I went out again and explained that our child goes to bed at 8pm and pleaded with one of the boys who has a sibling of the same age teling him that he should know how upset and cranky young children get when they are tired and can't sleep. They went into the house next door (semi-d) and were howling and causing all kinds of racket until around 10.30pm. I texted the parents and asked them to ask the boys to keep it down as our 2yr old was woken up and is really upset. I got a reply to say that the boys are over-excited. 

The following night, they were back at it again and when we asked them to move, we were told that it isn't our road and they can do as they please.

On the fourth night, we parked our cars on street in order to reduce the amount of space they had for basketball and hoping that they'd get the message and move away. Reinforcements from neighbouring roads came in and there were about 15 children with 15 balls on about 2 meters (with of the road), bouncing balls of our cars. We called the gardai and they came along 20 minutes later. 

It's needles to say that the gardai were practically useless as they kept saying that children are children and they have the right to play and if they weren't intentionally damaging our property there is nothing they can do. They did go to talk to two of the parents though but came back with the same 'children are children',...

We have written to one of the parents who is also our road's representative to the Resident Association asking him to deal with this. We have pointed out that we have as much right to live in our home peacefully as children have to play and that IF we are the only residents bothered by the noise, it should be easy to move play elsewhere and resolve the issue. I am not sure how this is going to work out because we weren't home yesterday evening and I dread going home this evening and having to put up with this kind of bullying. Those children look into our living room window to see if we are there and then congregate just to be a nuisance. 

Before anyone asks, we haven't fallen out with any of our neighbours, we mind our own business and are not in anyone's way. There are no noisy parties or a lot of guest ' traffic' in our house. 

I just don't understand how can parents allow this, knowing that it's upsetting somebody. 

Thanks for reading and does anyone have any advice?


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## Firefly (23 May 2012)

Get out your hose and wash your driveway...basketball is no fun when the ground is wet


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## dereko1969 (23 May 2012)

Where do you want the children to play? I think you're over reacting myself, it is the first bit of decent weather the children will have had all summer. 

Your initial reaction has made you a target I'd say, as for calling the Garda that's a total waste of resources and writing to other parents, could you not just call into them? Writing to me seems to indicate the wish to keep a record and escalating matters.

Could your child move in a back bedroom?


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## Yachtie (23 May 2012)

Firefly said:


> Get out your hose and wash your driveway...basketball is no fun when the ground is wet


 
Didn't think of that! I can do even better and bring out my powerwasher. Thanks!



dereko1969 said:


> Where do you want the children to play? I think you're over reacting myself, it is the first bit of decent weather the children will have had all summer.
> 
> Your initial reaction has made you a target I'd say, as for calling the Garda that's a total waste of resources and writing to other parents, could you not just call into them? Writing to me seems to indicate the wish to keep a record and escalating matters.
> 
> Could your child move in a back bedroom?


 
No offense but I think that your comment is a close representative of parent's attitude. The reason why our child can't move into a back bedroom is the same as why we can't watch TV or read in our utility room instead of our living room. They can play wherever they like as long as they are not a nuisance to anyone. There are other families very with young children and retired couples living on our street. As I have mentioned, there is a huge park 30 meters down the road and IF we are the only ones bothered, there should be no problem in them congregating in front of any other house.


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## Pique318 (23 May 2012)

dereko1969 said:


> Where do you want the children to play? I think you're over reacting myself, it is the first bit of decent weather the children will have had all summer.


I think you're missing a major piece of info.


> Our house is sort of half way down the street at the end of which is a * very nice and huge park with payground and all kinds of sports grounds  in it*.


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## micmclo (23 May 2012)

Playground is probably locked up by 8pm
I know closing times vary during the year with daylight but the council staff won't be around that late


They play outside your house Yachtie as their parents warned them off playing outside their own.


Keep on top of that head of the residents committee, they can get this sorted. 
Gardaí are a waste of time and will only escalate it unnecessarily


You have your neighbours mobile number, that's good as it shows you have some sort of relationship with them and can work with them.
I'd say most people don't even know their neighbours names


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## Yachtie (23 May 2012)

Thanks for your replies Pique and mimiclo!

This is so upsetting, we are reluctant to be seen anywhere in the front of our house as that only brings more children and more noise. I guenuinely feel like we are being bullied in our own home. Why should we live in our house with curtains drawn on bright sunny evenings or be made to go out and just wander around in order to avoid torment by a bunch of 10 year olds???


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## micmclo (23 May 2012)

Why aren't they playing down the end of the cul de sac anyway?

If they have one hoop and want to make a half court they should be down there with the boundaries, not halfway up the road with you


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## Firefly (23 May 2012)

Something to consider perhaps?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Mosquito

The other thing I would do is to identify who owns the basketball hoop and speak to their parents.


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## micmclo (23 May 2012)

Would the child in the house not hear it too though?

It's fine for a shop and adult workers but it might upset the young one in the house


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## Yachtie (23 May 2012)

micmclo said:


> Why aren't they playing down the end of the cul de sac anyway?
> 
> If they have one hoop and want to make a half court they should be down there with the boundaries, not halfway up the road with you


 
Exactly BUT it they went to the end of the road (where it is also twice as wide to form a turning circle) they wouldn't be bothering anyone! 



Firefly said:


> Something to consider perhaps?
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Mosquito
> 
> The other thing I would do is to identify who owns the basketball hoop and speak to their parents.


 
I have contacted a security company which supplies those only ten minutes ago. Will have a quick chat with my husband this evening, work out what circle it would cover and order. 

'Those' (the hoop owner) parents are the ones who don't want the racket in front of their front window as they have another child the same age as our boy.


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## Molli (23 May 2012)

Yachtie I feel sorry for you having to put up with this. I blame the parents of these children who should be able to speak and explain to them that they're upsetting your little child at bed time. The fact they have plenty more space to play on and insist at being near your house is very annoying. It also sounds like they're just being plain brazen about it the fact its continuing. I would feel the same if I was in your shoes and I would feel bad if I thought any of my children were acting like that and upsetting somebody. Its really hard to know what to do the fact that their parents wont take it on board.


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## Ceepee (23 May 2012)

Yachtie said:


> Hi all,
> "The following night, they were back at it again and when we asked them to move, we were told that it isn't our road and they can do as they please."



You need to try and identify which children belong to which family, and 'pick them off' one by one.  Surely not all the parents have a couldn't-care-less attitude.  Try to work out which parents will be receptive and approach them, so at least you can break up the group one by one.



Yachtie said:


> "We have written to one of the parents who is also our road's representative to the Resident Association asking him to deal with this."



Go and knock on this person's door this evening and ask them to come round for a cup of tea and a chat.  Involve him/her in the problem and in finding the solution.



Yachtie said:


> "I just don't understand how can parents allow this, knowing that it's upsetting somebody."


 
You're right, this is a parent issue.  If a reasonable tone with the kids doesn't work, go to the parents.  Don't slide into a situation where the kids perceive you as The Grumpy Neighbour or they will start to goad you.  This evening, or next evening it happens, one of you stay home with the toddler, and the other go and knock on a few doors.  Kids suddenly get quite nervy if they see that it's their parents being chatted to.

Best of luck to you.  Some day your child will be out shooting hoops on the street, so don't forget to take the long view!  Keep the peace, but let the grown-ups know that it's taking its toll on the toddler.


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## Yachtie (23 May 2012)

micmclo said:


> Would the child in the house not hear it too though?
> 
> It's fine for a shop and adult workers but it might upset the young one in the house


 
I have asked the question and was told that it is very directional. Household model covers the area of about 10-12 meters of open space at 60 degrees angle but does not penetrate through walls or windows. The company which supplies those devices assured me that it would have no effect on our child as he would be behind it or on other children in their houses since the sound doesn't penetrate through the walls and windows.

It seems to cost in the range of €400 but it might be a bargain if it will preserve our mental health.


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## micmclo (23 May 2012)

Yachtie said:


> Exactly BUT it they went to the end of the road (where it is also twice as wide to form a turning circle) they wouldn't be bothering anyone!
> 
> 'Those' (the hoop owner) parents are the ones who don't want the racket in front of their front window as they have another child the same age as our boy.



Have your husband pick up the hoop and carry it down to this wide area or to their house so
But do it in a nice way,_ sorry lads, we'll move this on for you, here follow me, lots of room, here you go
_
Repeat as necessary over the next few days

As you say, they are up near you as their parents don't want to deal with the racket. 

They would be brazen if they carried it back up to you


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## Leper (23 May 2012)

Yachtie, you probably brought much of this on yourself - kids will be kids.  Writing to parents is quite a formal (and bringing residents association into the picture just as bad) procedure when you could just have knocked on the door and talked with them.  We were all young once and probably played ball on the road also along with chasing games etc. Personally, I would rather see kids play ball games than be stuck behind some cretinous computer game.

Perhaps I am not being fair to you as all we have are the facts laid out above. My tuppencehalpennyh worth is that you live in a built up area and others have rights also.  If you want total privacy then move to the sticks.

Please, no offence meant to anybody.


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## Molli (23 May 2012)

Yachtie did mention she texted the parents. The fact the boys said to her it was'nt her road and they could do as they please sound like something a parent may have said to them. With that kind of reaction its hard to get places. It would be great if the problem could be solved in a nice neighbourly way for all concerned.


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## Sunny (23 May 2012)

Stop the clocks. Children are trying to sleep. I sometimes wonder how young children in war zones get to sleep.  Be grateful that they are playing and not involved in other anti social behaviour. Sounds like a great neighbourhood for your kids to be growing up in. If they are annoying you that much, TALK to the parents. Are other neighbours annoyed? Get them to talk to the parents as well. Forget texting. You are an adult.


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## Purple (23 May 2012)

Sunny said:


> Stop the clocks. Children are trying to sleep. I sometimes wonder how young children in war zones get to sleep.  Be grateful that they are playing and not involved in other anti social behaviour. Sounds like a great neighbourhood for your kids to be growing up in. If they are annoying you that much, TALK to the parents. Are other neighbours annoyed? Get them to talk to the parents as well. Forget texting. You are an adult.



+1 Texts can be read and re-read.


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## roker (23 May 2012)

I cannot believe all of the negative attitude towards Yachtie. Everyone is entitled to peace in their own home.
We have had trouble with footballs in our street which is a small cu-de-sac. I called them across and explained the damage that a ball does when it glances of the paint of a car (it causes multi scratches), and to go and play beside their parent’s cars. Since then some of the other neighbours have complained as well.


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## Yachtie (23 May 2012)

Thanks for all your replies. It's actually good to hear opinions from different angles as I am sure you will all agree it is very hard to be 100% objective when one is emotionally involved in a situation. 

I guess, I could now point out that albeit formal, we have chosen a letter as a means of communication more to emphasize seriousness of our grief and allow recepient to perhaps read it twice rather than engage in emotional and possibly fueled by that moment's anger verbal encounter with the parent(s). 

We have received a reply which states that we are the world's worst neighbours, that we are the ones bullying and intimidating children on our street and that they will keep doing as they please.

ETA. And they all know that our child is not bothered but we are only using him to torment our neighbours children.


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## Purple (23 May 2012)

Sending letters is a really bad idea.


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## TreeTiger (23 May 2012)

Be very careful.  This could escalate out of all proportion and if you think it's bad now, you could find it impossible if it gets worse.

I wish I could offer a solution, but all I have is sympathy.  We had years of basketball going in our neighbours driveway, and give me a bunch of teens playing football over that any day!  That thump, thump would drive you mad.  The neighbours told us that we live in an estate and basically had to suck it up.  They are the noisiest people I have ever heard, they shout rather than talk, their screaming house alarm has gone off on a regular basis, their dog has a hissy fit if someone is  anywhere near their house, etc. etc.

As they are in an end house we are the only ones really badly affected by the noise, so we don't have the support of other neighbours.  The only option open to us is to take them to court.  But we have to live beside them and if we do that we don't know how much worse things could get.

So what I do is stay friendly with the other neighbours and live in hope for the day that I can "escape" my home to live somewhere else!

Would inviting some neighbours you get on with to come into your house to listen to the noise help?


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## becky (23 May 2012)

I suspect the letter was read 15 times and you are now in danger of falling out with neighbours.

I'd call over and explain why you sent a letter/text.  I see where you're coming from now that you've explained it but if you were on the receiving end of such a letter you would probably have reacted the same way.

I don't see a solution that you will like as their backs are up now.

Is there any way you could put the baby to bed later and have her(or is it a he) up earlier - the days are only getting longer now.  I know it's sounds extreme but she won't always have to go to bed at 8.  In a few years time hopefully she will be out playing basketball on a summers evening.

When I'm arriving home from work I love to see the kids out on the green having fun with their friends.


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## AgathaC (23 May 2012)

There was a similar situation in an estate I lived in, a few years ago. One person did ask the kids nicely to move away from her house, (her little fellow was a very poor sleeper due to health reasons) and in fairness, there was plenty of other space on the green. It didn't work, so she went to the parents, and asked them to get them to play elsewhere, and it was sorted amicably.
I hope that you can sort something out. As another poster said, I wish I had a solution, and you do have my sympathy.


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## Marion (23 May 2012)

Yachtie.

It's very difficult when there is a gang syndrome. Individually the children are no doubt fine.

Ultimately your privacy is being impacted upon. The children are looking in your windows and are acting in a manner that says they will rule outside your house. This is unacceptable behaviour.

Fifteen (15) basketballs bouncing outside your house? Baby or no baby this is an absolute disgrace and needs to be addressed. I doubt anybody could tolerate this level of noise outside any home. It was clearly orchestrated and a deliberate action to annoy you.

This bad behaviour truly beggars belief and I would say shame on the parents who would condone this bullying and anti-social behaviour.

You will have to be very strong to deal with this. Try not to let it upset you too much. 

I don't have any answers but you will have to find a solution somehow to enable you to live peacefully in your own home.

I would try and appeal to the children's sense of what is fair.  They really do have an innate sense of this. You mentioned that you spoke with one child. But it wasn't successful.

Is there an obvious leader to whom you might be able to make an appeal? There is always somebody to whom the others will defer.

Best wishes

Marion


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## micmclo (23 May 2012)

Please no more notes, they just don't work

People read them many times and look at every sentance, word and comma
They see hidden messages where none exists and take offence where none was intended
They dwell and stew and read some more and by the time they meet you they've worked themselves up to be vexed

Face to face from now on
Works a lot better


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## thedaras (23 May 2012)

You seemed to have escalated the brewing argument..
You called the Gardai! for kids..you have now escaleted it even more!
Now the parents have the Guards calling to their hall doors .
Then you  get the residents association involved..



I would say that some of the parents would not be too bothered that you are upset, once you ,wrote letters,called the guards and got the residents association involved,and it appears they have succeeded!


Here is my advice for what its worth..
For example,People with very young children have no idea what its like to have a ten to teen..I have seen parents whose kids are babys and they boot up the roads in their cars,until..the day their kids need to go outside to play and suddenly they are all over everyone and anyone who goes faster than 10km.
They "forget" they did it for years themselves,and how it felt to others.

So lets look at things from their point of view,
Their kids were out playing,the sun has arrived,the kids are in their sights playing basketball,then they get a letter,then the Guards are called,then the residents association are informed.
Now you have got their backs up.

I would suggest that if you contuine to complain in the manner you have been,you will dread living there,and that is no solution,you may end up moving the kids,but the neighbours will despise you and make life a misery
It is wrong of them,but its almost garenteed that it will be nothing to do with you wanting a bit of peace and more to do with letters,Guards etc.They will become entrenched.
If I were you,I would look for a solution that will bring me some peace now and into the future,so how do you do this?
Firstly DO NOT escalate the situation..
If you are seen as a fair and reasonable person,it will stand to you.so dont go overboard.

The next time the kids are out playing,go out and play with them,bring one of your kids with you and let the other kids get to know them,pretend that you want them to show your little ones how great they are at basketball.
Then after a couple of nights ,say kids you know what little" johnnie" is sick,I think he will have to go to bed early tonight,but he loves you guys and wants to play with you,then ask them have they any ideas how you can get him to bed without wanting to play out with them?

There will always be one who will want to please you and they will suggest that they move a bit away,while you are trying to get "johnnie " to sleep.
You then go on to tell them how brilliant an idea that is,and what a great kid he is for helping out..

So what Im saying is,you are always better off making friends with them.
If the parents nose has been put out,you have a double problem,in that the parents will now actively encourage them to annoy you.However if the kids like you,they will be less inclined too.

It is always the case that those who like you,are less likely to want to upset you,the reverse is true also,that those who dislike you will want to upset you or at least not take your feelings into account.

In the past I have dealt with young couples moving into their lovly new homes with their lovly new kids,and wham ,a neighbours kid does something they dont approve of,the situation escalates,and now its the parent against parent,whereas the kids have forgotten all about it.

I understand the kids and the parents are being unreasonable but you have to fight this in such a way that you get the best outcome,if that means having to bite your tongue,having to let things go,overall you will be happier.
I hope this is of some use to you,I understand that as a parent with a young kid it is stressful and annoying,but you need to box clever and get your needs 
met.
Failing that, when your kids are old enough,teach them to play basketball outside the exact same house/s that were prepared to make your life a misery!


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## AgathaC (24 May 2012)

Marion said:


> Yachtie.
> 
> It's very difficult when there is a gang syndrome. Individually the children are no doubt fine.
> 
> ...


+1 to everything that Marion has said. It is very easy to say 'it's nice to see them playing outside having fun with their friends...'. It is, but it is quite a different story if you are trying to get a child to sleep etc. I wish you the best OP, I hope that you can reach a solution.


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## Firefly (24 May 2012)

Next time they set up outside...go out and ask them if you can play too!!


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## Sunny (24 May 2012)

AgathaC said:


> +1 to everything that Marion has said. It is very easy to say 'it's nice to see them playing outside having fun with their friends...'. It is, but it is quite a different story if you are trying to get a child to sleep etc. I wish you the best OP, I hope that you can reach a solution.


 
Children sleep in the middle of bustling cities, beside train tacks, beside airports, beside football stadiums, beside concert venues etc etc. Kids playing basketball at 8pm while probably annoying is hardly the best example of anti social behaviour I have heard of. 

As for the kids with the 15 basketballs, I am amazed that around 15 kids just happened to have 15 basketballs. It also sounds like they did that once and they did it to wind you the OP up which obviously worked. 

As long as they are not damaging your property or involved in serious incidents of anti social behaviour, I don't see what right you have to say who can and can't make noise out on the road just because your have a child. The Guards were right. Playing basketball is not disturbing the peace. Do you want to ban people cutting their grass after 8pm as well? Do you want to ban early morning rubbish collections?


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## micmclo (24 May 2012)

Sunny said:


> As long as they are not damaging your property or involved in serious incidents of anti social behaviour, I don't see what right you have to say who can and can't make noise out on the road just because your have a child.



True but then the neighbours who own the hoop don't want it outside their house.



> 'Those' (the hoop owner) parents are the ones who don't want the racket in front of their front window as they have another child the same age as our boy.



So they send the children down the street to Yachtie's house

Yachtie is complaining over something the other neighbours aren't willing to put up with either

If there is going to be basketball, let the owner have it outside _their_ house.


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## Sunny (24 May 2012)

micmclo said:


> True but then the neighbours who own the hoop don't want it outside their house.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
Yeah, fair enough. Sorry, I missed that bit of the story!


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## micmclo (24 May 2012)

Wait until Championship season and the kids get hurls and sliotars

The local bodyshop will be doing a roaring trade with all the dents


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## bullbars (24 May 2012)

Marion said:


> Baby or no baby this is an absolute disgrace and needs to be addressed. I doubt anybody could tolerate this level of noise outside any home. It was clearly orchestrated and a deliberate action to annoy you.
> 
> This bad behaviour truly beggars belief and I would say shame on the parents who would condone this bullying and anti-social behaviour.
> 
> ...


 
This situation is shocking. Imagine, todays youths out playing sports on summers evening. What next boyscouts offering to cut your grass, or even worse those bloody birds out chirping. Why in my day youths were suspicious and inactive semi-zombies that slouched around street corners. I never took the time to think about how good we had it... 

Another poster advised a move to the sticks; let me nip that one in the bud for you now; all these bloody wild animals keep making this "moo" and "baah" sound. then the owner has the cheek to drive in to the lovely fields with some noisy machinery. Let me tell you my letter writing skills were truely tested that day. 

What is the world coming to? I'm away to lock my doors and peer nervously through the curtains. Good day.

Edit: And the question must be asked, how are the parents shelling out for Basketballs? There was a separate thread on people having kids without being able to afford them, I'd say this is a simmiliar set up, have the kids but can't afford to keep them inside curtailed by video games and television.


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## Yachtie (24 May 2012)

bullbars said:


> This situation is shocking. Imagine, todays youths out playing sports on summers evening. What next boyscouts offering to cut your grass, or even worse those bloody birds out chirping. Why in my day youths were suspicious and inactive semi-zombies that slouched around street corners. I never took the time to think about how good we had it...
> 
> Another poster advised a move to the sticks; let me nip that one in the bud for you now; all these bloody wild animals keep making this "moo" and "baah" sound. then the owner has the cheek to drive in to the lovely fields with some noisy machinery. Let me tell you my letter writing skills were truely tested that day.
> 
> ...


 
Your contribution to the thread is appreciated as any other, even though it isn't helpful. We aren't, can't and shouldn't be all the same. This sitaution may be ridiculous to you while it's very upsetting and stressful to my family and it isn't up to you to judge our level of 'weirdness' and whether we are bothered by the bird song. 

Weirdly enough, we really are bothered by deliberate congregation of a gang standing on the footpath and looking into our house to see if we are there and paying attention, or doing something to get our attention to then commence all kinds of racket just because we asked them not to and just because they can.

I played outside with my friends when I was a child but back in the day, our parents were a lot stricter and a neighbour complaining about you was the worst offence you could commit and it was frowned upon by other children too. There was a boy I went to school with and nobody ever wanted to play with him because he was a trouble maker and he would get not only himself but his rare playmates into trouble too which then reduced their 'street' popularity. Those days are clearly gone and as I have only this kind of mentality for a yardstick, I can't comprehend what's going on and consequently don't know how to deal with it.


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## dereko1969 (24 May 2012)

We had a situation a good number of years ago where kids from the estate backing onto ours used to sit on the back wall and stare into the house, my mother giving out ensured there were more the next day and the day after.

Ignoring them was the only solution difficult as it was and annoying having your curtains closed on a summers day. They soon got bored and moved off to annoy someone else.


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## ney001 (24 May 2012)

Situations like this can get out of control very very quickly. 

Now, it seems that you have already escalated the situation to the extent of calling gardai so now you need to calm it all down a bit.  I would suggest a reasonable conversation with the parents involved, explain the stress and hassle it's causing etc etc.   Failing that, simply ignore these kids for the next short while, realistically they are going to get bored hassling you soon, furthermore the weather will change and we'll have rain for a few weeks and they will forget all about the basketball.  

If you continue to go out and give out about and send letters, they will not forget about it.  There is also a likelihood that you are now very sensitive to every little movement they make outside your front door and this has heightened both your sense of hearing and your anxiety.  Chill out for a while, try not to let it get to you so much.  Kids get bored quickly, at the moment you are the road 'grumps' we all had them when we were kids and we all hassled them with footballs etc - but it was never malicious it was just kids being kids and it sounds like this is the same kind of thing.


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## roker (24 May 2012)

Sunny said:


> As long as they are not damaging your property or involved in serious incidents of anti social behaviour, I don't see what right you have to say who can and can't make noise out on the road just because your have a child. The Guards were right. Playing basketball is not disturbing the peace. Do you want to ban people cutting their grass after 8pm as well? Do you want to ban early morning rubbish collections?


 
Noise is well accepted as pollution, interesting the early morning rubbish collection does wake us up especially with the reversing alarm. Also you should consider that a lot of society is on shift worker for our convenience.


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## Bronco Lane (24 May 2012)

Just be careful. Dark evenings and Halloween are only a few months away. It might get messy.


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## Sunny (24 May 2012)

roker said:


> Noise is well accepted as pollution, interesting the early morning rubbish collection does wake us up especially with the reversing alarm. Also you should consider that a lot of society is on shift worker for our convenience.


 
 What if the OP's child was in the back room and the kids were in next doors back garden and playing basketball at 8pm. Would you call that noise pollution?


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## Molli (24 May 2012)

Maybe Yachtie if you could go back to the neighbours and say that things really got on top of you and you were totally stressed out and dont want to fall out with any of the neighbours that maybe they would appreciate that and be a bit more thoughtful towards you. Just wondering do you know these neighbours fairly well? Would you visit them on occassions? Bring your husband with you as its easier with two to explain. Tell them maybe you acted too quickly. I sincerely hope you get it sorted out soon as it must be really difficult for you.


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## MrMan (25 May 2012)

Ignoring children is the only solution. I think this thread is further proof of the disconnect between Ireland of old and the celtic tiger era. Can you imagine neighbours calling the guards over noisy kids 20 years ago?

People are almost set in complain mode these days.


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## Leper (25 May 2012)

Calling the Gardaí for children playing probably earned Yachtie Douze Points in the Local Buachaill or Cailín Gan Geal Competition.  The written complaints probably ensured overall winner each year for life also.  But, what will eventually happen when Yachtie Óg gets a little older?  Beware the Valley of the Squinting Windows.

In fairness to Yachtie the situation from his/her points of view were rolled out and in support of the sleeping child.  There are many silent Yachties in every road, street and avenue in Ireland who ring our police for the least thing. Ireland has become a why-should-I-put-up-with-any inconvenience state which probably was an inheritance of the Celtic Tiger.  Can you imagine your local police station where gardaí are returning from some unpleasant stabbing scene and the phone rings and some I'm-a-taxpayer looney wanting children's playing noise quelled on the road?

The thing is, Yachtie will be blamed for every future appearance of the Gardaí on the road.  If a traffic fine is delivered, Yachtie will be blamed.
I think we have become a dispassionate people with the I-love-me and I am always right syndrome. I reckon the whole nation will have to take one giant chill pill and learn to live and let live.


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## Mouldy (25 May 2012)

Cease and desist all contact, all complaining and all conflict immediately. Do not approach your neighbours again for any reason.

The kids will get bored/forget about bothering you and indeed, playing basketball, after the next fortnight of rain that is inevitably coming down the tracks (its summer after all).

Also, remember the old saying “This too, shall pass”. These children will be older next year and will have moved on from playing outside to drinking their parent’s alcohol in the park.

I’ve lived in my current home for 6 years and the first two were mental with kids being really noisy until all hours and really making me lose sleep for fear that my house or car would be damaged. Never happened. Years of peace followed but now there is another wave coming through. They don’t (and won’t) even know I exist. 

Kids don’t acknowledge the existence of anything they are not interested in. Don’t give them a reason to take an interest in you. But since you already have, stop. 
They’ll find something else to do or someone else to annoy. By the time your little one is old enough to go out and do the same thing these kids will be long gone.

M


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## PaddyW (25 May 2012)

Do you know anyone who's kids you can 'borrow' for a few nights? Give them a  basketball, or maybe more, and send them down in front of the house of the kid who owns the basketball hoop. Get them to play there for as long as possible. If they do get asked to move, well, they can't go down the road to your place as there's kids already playing basketball up there and 'we want to have our own game down here'. Might make those parents appreciate the noise that is being caused.. Or you could take the ignoring the kids approach, that might work as well.


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## Ceist Beag (25 May 2012)

Leper said:


> Calling the Gardaí for children playing probably earned Yachtie Douze Points in the Local Buachaill or Cailín Gan Geal Competition.  The written complaints probably ensured overall winner each year for life also.  But, what will eventually happen when Yachtie Óg gets a little older?  Beware the Valley of the Squinting Windows.
> 
> In fairness to Yachtie the situation from his/her points of view were rolled out and in support of the sleeping child.  There are many silent Yachties in every road, street and avenue in Ireland who ring our police for the least thing. Ireland has become a why-should-I-put-up-with-any inconvenience state which probably was an inheritance of the Celtic Tiger.  Can you imagine your local police station where gardaí are returning from some unpleasant stabbing scene and the phone rings and some I'm-a-taxpayer looney wanting children's playing noise quelled on the road?
> 
> ...



Possibly phrased a little bit harshly Leper but pretty much along the same lines I was thinking. I can just imagine the Gardai being asked to come out because children are playing basketball at 8:30 in the evening - how dare they! And can you imagine the great excitement for those children when a Garda car comes along to watch what they're up to!


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## Marion (25 May 2012)

yachtie said:
			
		

> Reinforcements from neighbouring roads came in and there were about 15 children with 15 balls on about 2 meters (with of the road), bouncing balls of our cars.



I would not want to have 15 basketballs strike my car. I wouldn't call this type of behaviour "play".

Marion


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## Sunny (25 May 2012)

Marion said:


> I would not want to have 15 basketballs strike my car. I wouldn't call this type of behaviour "play".
> 
> Marion


 
15 basketballs boucing off a car would do damage. If there was damage, then that is a criminal offence. Did the Guards just ignore the damage that was caused to the car? If there wasn't damage, they were obviously just trying to get a response and it worked. By the way, I know basketball clubs that don't have 15 basketballs. Must be some popular sport in that area.


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## liaconn (25 May 2012)

MrMan said:


> Ignoring children is the only solution. I think this thread is further proof of the disconnect between Ireland of old and the celtic tiger era. Can you imagine neighbours calling the guards over noisy kids 20 years ago?
> 
> People are almost set in complain mode these days.


 
I think that's an unfair post. In the 'Ireland of old' parents took complaints from neighbours seriously and did not just dismiss them with a 'kids will be kids' attitude. Children themselves also had a bit of healthy respect for adults and, if ordered to move away and play elsewhere, would do so. Too many parents nowadays just defend their kids against all complaints and all accusations raising a bunch of annoying little brats who turn into the kind of self entitled adults who can't see why they shouldn't play music at ear blasting levels, leave their dog out barking in the garden all night and basically do anything they like because it's _their_ house and consideration for the neighbours shouldn't come into it.

I agree that calling the guards was a bit extreme, but I do sympathise with people having to put up with noisy kids constantly playing outside their house and getting cheek and provocation if they dare say a word to those kids and a disinterested attitude from the parents when they try to sort it out reasonably. It's hardly surprising that some people end up over reacting.


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## DB74 (25 May 2012)

Sunny said:


> 15 basketballs boucing off a car would do damage. If there was damage, then that is a criminal offence. Did the Guards just ignore the damage that was caused to the car? If there wasn't damage, they were obviously just trying to get a response and it worked. By the way, I know basketball clubs that don't have 15 basketballs. Must be some popular sport in that area.



OP never mentioned that there were 15 basketballs


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## truthseeker (25 May 2012)

I cant believe some of the responses here. 

Yachtie, it would drive me mad even without a child trying to sleep, and the fact that you asked for them to move on and tried to address it peaceably only to be met with 'its not your road and we can do as we please' which is an adults answer from a childs mouth if ever I heard it, just goes to show that the parents of these people are the ones to blame and not the kids themselves.

However, you have tried to solve it in peace, you have escalated it by calling the Guards, and still no joy.

The only answer is to make the area right outside your home unattractive to them using suggestions already given like mosquito, powerhouse etc..

In my day if we continued playing a ball game outside someones house who wasnt happy with it they would take the ball off us. Parents calling down would get roared at and Guards called would tell us that it was a civil matter. No one was bothered paying a solicitor for one ball so parents would tell us kids to move on and play elsewhere.

I am not suggesting you do the above - but it worked when I was a kid.


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## Yachtie (25 May 2012)

Thanks for all the replies again!

I want to reply to all of you but keep failing as I get emotional and I wouldn't want to come accross as flippant and rude to those who feel that we should shut up and put up.

I really appreciate all your feedback and it seems that majority agrees that ignoring them and not rising to the provocation is probably the best way to go. All my senses are on the highest alert and this isn't easy. Last night, a milkman came to deliver this morning's milk and collect payments (to / from several houses) for last week. Those boys went straight to him demanding that he moves his van and getting rather rude when he told them that he would 'in a minute'.


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## Firefly (25 May 2012)

Yachtie said:


> Last night, a milkman came to deliver this morning's milk and collect payments (to / from several houses) for last week. Those boys went straight to him demanding that he moves his van and getting rather rude when he told them that he would 'in a minute'.


 
 I'd definately ignore them in that case. God knows what you might draw on you. 

I'd have fun with that mosquito thingie though  (Just don't get caught!).


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## Sunny (25 May 2012)

Yachtie said:


> Thanks for all the replies again!
> 
> I want to reply to all of you but keep failing as I get emotional and I wouldn't want to come accross as flippant and rude to those who feel that we should shut up and put up.
> 
> I really appreciate all your feedback and it seems that majority agrees that ignoring them and not rising to the provocation is probably the best way to go. All my senses are on the highest alert and this isn't easy. Last night, a milkman came to deliver this morning's milk and collect payments (to / from several houses) for last week. Those boys went straight to him demanding that he moves his van and getting rather rude when he told them that he would 'in a minute'.


 
Nobody is saying that you should put up and shut up. People are simply pointing out that you seem to be upsetting yourself over kids playing basketball at 8pm on a summers evening. Fine it's annoying but at worst, they will have stopped by the time Winter comes. There are people trying to bring up kids beside houses that have constant parties that go on all night. Not trying to belittle your issue but I honestly don't see why you are letting it get to you to the extent where your senses are on highest alert. You make is sound like you are under seige and if that is the case, contact your community officer in your local Guards and ask him to talk to your neighbours on your behalf if you don't want to face them.

Not worth making yourself sick over.


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## MrMan (25 May 2012)

liaconn said:


> I think that's an unfair post. In the 'Ireland of old' parents took complaints from neighbours seriously and did not just dismiss them with a 'kids will be kids' attitude. Children themselves also had a bit of healthy respect for adults and, if ordered to move away and play elsewhere, would do so. Too many parents nowadays just defend their kids against all complaints and all accusations raising a bunch of annoying little brats who turn into the kind of self entitled adults who can't see why they shouldn't play music at ear blasting levels, leave their dog out barking in the garden all night and basically do anything they like because it's _their_ house and consideration for the neighbours shouldn't come into it.
> 
> I agree that calling the guards was a bit extreme, but I do sympathise with people having to put up with noisy kids constantly playing outside their house and getting cheek and provocation if they dare say a word to those kids and a disinterested attitude from the parents when they try to sort it out reasonably. It's hardly surprising that some people end up over reacting.


 
You reinforce my point if anything; the parents who defend the kids are selfish and are only thinking of what would make their life more comfortable, which is also what the OP wants. If you live in an estate you're going to have to deal with noise, especially if there is plenty of kids and teens present. You control what happens from your gate to the back of your house, after that you're going to have to accept that not everything will run according to your needs. 
If things go beyond a certain threshold then you need to be able to show some tact, and approach the kids or the parents in friendly manner. Once you put pen to paper you will reinforce the will of the parents to not let the uppity resident (their new percetion, not necessarily the reality)tell them what to do.
Dealing with neighbours is not the same as dealing with business, so keeping things informal is key.


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## Mouldy (25 May 2012)

The tip about wetting the road was a good one and not something that pople will cop on to when its done either. But don't throw in some builders sand for added effect


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## liaconn (25 May 2012)

MrMan said:


> You reinforce my point if anything; the parents who defend the kids are selfish and are only thinking of what would make their life more comfortable, which is also what the OP wants. If you live in an estate you're going to have to deal with noise, especially if there is plenty of kids and teens present. You control what happens from your gate to the back of your house, after that you're going to have to accept that not everything will run according to your needs.
> If things go beyond a certain threshold then you need to be able to show some tact, and approach the kids or the parents in friendly manner. Once you put pen to paper you will reinforce the will of the parents to not let the uppity resident (their new percetion, not necessarily the reality)tell them what to do.
> Dealing with neighbours is not the same as dealing with business, so keeping things informal is key.


 
But the OP did try initially to sort it out informally but just met with bland, unhelpful attitudes. Of course you have to deal with noise on an estate, but parents should also be able to deal with complaints about their children in a manner that does not antagonise the complainant. I think asking that kids don't erect their basketball hoop right in front of your house instead of their own houses is a perfectly fair request and any reasonably copped on parent would just say 'yes, sure, sorry about that' rather than arguing about it.

I'm not saying going to the Guards was an effective thing to do. I'm saying I can see how people nowadays get antagonised to the degree that they over react because they've just had enough. Far too many parents nowadays are way too precious about their kids. If a neighbour doesn't want them playing outside their house, just tell your kids to play elsewhere. If they disobey you, ground them for a few nights, stop their pocket money, whatever. It won't kill them, and will avoid a lot of aggro.

I have, on occasion, had to ask kids to stop skateboarding right beneath my balcony or congregate in big gangs under my sitting room window when there's a green a few yards away. They just push off elsewhere, no hassle. Obviously better brought up than the brats Yachtie is dealing with.


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## truthseeker (25 May 2012)

MrMan said:


> If things go beyond a certain threshold then you need to be able to show some tact, and approach the kids or the parents in friendly manner.



The OP tried the friendly approach and on the third night was told, by children, that it wasnt her road and they could do as they wanted. Thats clearly coming from parents.



MrMan said:


> Once you put pen to paper you will reinforce the will of the parents to not let the uppity resident (their new percetion, not necessarily the reality)tell them what to do.



You see, this is the bit I dont understand. I wouldnt think the neighbour was being uppity, Id be annoyed that my kid was bothering the neighbours!

The reality these days is that this country is populated by selfish ignorant eejits who are raising the next generation of thugs. 

Children, if they are bothering neighbours, should be put in their place by their parents. End of. This business of 'its not your road, we can do what we like' - from a CHILD! It says it all about the parenting going on.


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## liaconn (25 May 2012)

truthseeker said:


> The OP tried the friendly approach and on the third night was told, by children, that it wasnt her road and they could do as they wanted. Thats clearly coming from parents.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
And even if somebody did think their neighbour was being uppity (which I don't Yachtie) surely it makes more sense to say to your kids 'look, she doesn't want you playing there so just STOP! That's the end of it, no arguments ' instead of jumping to your kids' defence over every little thing. Then maybe they might grow up to be responsible adults who know how to consider others, rather than self centred,  self absorbed horrors who think the world owes them a favour.

Been a lot of stuff in the papers recently about parents whinging and whining when their badly behaved kids eventually get thrown out of their schools by beleaguered principals. Too many silly 'no one can say no to my precious darling' parents around nowadays.


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## Sunny (25 May 2012)

They are playing on a bright summers evening. They are not selling drugs or driving stolen cars up and down the street. What happens during the winter when it's wet and dark? Do they still hang around making noise? My girlfriend does some night shifts. During the summer, kids play outside her house all day. She might complain about lack of sleep but never in a million years would she go out and tell them to stop if they were just playing. We need a bit of perspective here. So far, all I have heard is that they play basketball on the street and are cheeky. Hardly grounds for the riot squad. 

I agree that is bad that the parents seem to be ignoring the OPs concerns but this is temporary. Ignore them and they will go away.


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## liaconn (25 May 2012)

Sunny said:


> They are playing on a bright summers evening. They are not selling drugs or driving stolen cars up and down the street. What happens during the winter when it's wet and dark? Do they still hang around making noise?* My girlfriend does some night shifts. During the summer, kids play outside her house all day. She might complain about lack of sleep but never in a million years would she go out and tell them to stop if they were just playing.* We need a bit of perspective here. So far, all I have heard is that they play basketball on the street and are cheeky. Hardly grounds for the riot squad.
> 
> I agree that is bad that the parents seem to be ignoring the OPs concerns but this is temporary. Ignore them and they will go away.


 
Well, bully for her but that doesn't mean that someone going out and nicely asking children to move away from the house because your baby is trying to sleep/the racket from their skateboards are driving you mad are wrong. It's part of life and growing up. We were often told off by adults when we were kids, ordered to play somewhere else etc. We just did what we were told. If our parents had received a complaint about us we knew we would be in big trouble. That way we are all, I hope, considerate neighbours who don't blast out music, keep our front gardens in a state, let our kids annoy other people etc.  We just learnt, from a young age, that you have to consider other people living around you.


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## Sunny (25 May 2012)

Oh stop with the sanctimonious rubbish! So you never answered back to an adult? You never disobeyed? Never did anything you knew to be bold? Even after getting given out to, you never 
mis-behaved again? If that is the case, then bully on you.


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## truthseeker (25 May 2012)

Sunny said:


> They are playing on a bright summers evening. They are not selling drugs or driving stolen cars up and down the street. What happens during the winter when it's wet and dark? Do they still hang around making noise? My girlfriend does some night shifts. During the summer, kids play outside her house all day. She might complain about lack of sleep but never in a million years would she go out and tell them to stop if they were just playing. We need a bit of perspective here. So far, all I have heard is that they play basketball on the street and are cheeky. Hardly grounds for the riot squad.



I dont think anyone suggested the riot squad.

When I was growing up, my 'right' to play outside was much much less important than the 'right' of any adult in the area who didnt want me playing there. It was non negotiable. Even if I was just sitting quietly, if an adult told me to get lost, my parents would back that adult - and not me. Because I wasnt allowed to annoy people. 

I certainly would have been very very heavily punished if I had escalated annoyance in the manner described in this thread. And the giving of cheek to a neighbour would not have been tolerated.


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## Sunny (25 May 2012)

Out of curiousity, does every patent here know where their teenage child is 24 hours a day?


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## truthseeker (25 May 2012)

Sunny said:


> Oh stop with the sanctimonious rubbish! So you never answered back to an adult? You never disobeyed? Never did anything you knew to be bold? Even after getting given out to, you never
> mis-behaved again? If that is the case, then bully on you.



I dunno about you Sunny, but if I back cheeked an adult or disobeyed or otherwise acted the maggot, I got grounded. Or otherwise punished. I certainly didnt get told by my parents 'tell yer woman its not her road and you can do what you like'.


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## liaconn (25 May 2012)

Sunny said:


> Oh stop with the sanctimonious rubbish! So you never answered back to an adult? You never disobeyed? Never did anything you knew to be bold? Even after getting given out to, you never
> mis-behaved again? If that is the case, then bully on you.


 
I'm not being sanctimonious. Calm down! and stop being so reactive. I'm saying that we knew our parents wouldn't defend us if a neighbour complained about us (in fact we would get an earbashing) so we modified our behaviour accordingly and, as a result, did not grow up to think we could do what we liked because 'it's my road as much as yoru's'. I'm not blaming the kids, of course kids will try it on, I'm blaming silly parents who can't just say 'no' to their kids or 'tough, you just can't play there' or whatever but must always defend them and protect them from any complaints.

And I'm also pointing out that just because your girlfriend doesn't complain doesn't mean people who do are in the wrong. That's just the approach she takes, other people ask the kids to jog on.


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## truthseeker (25 May 2012)

Sunny said:


> Out of curiousity, does every patent here know where their teenage child is 24 hours a day?



OP said these are 10-12 year olds, not teenagers.


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## Sunny (25 May 2012)

truthseeker said:


> I dont think anyone suggested the riot squad.
> 
> When I was growing up, my 'right' to play outside was much much less important than the 'right' of any adult in the area who didnt want me playing there. It was non negotiable. Even if I was just sitting quietly, if an adult told me to get lost, my parents would back that adult - and not me. Because I wasnt allowed to annoy people.
> 
> I certainly would have been very very heavily punished if I had escalated annoyance in the manner described in this thread. And the giving of cheek to a neighbour would not have been tolerated.



I have already said that patents attitude is wrong but you would swear it never happened in the good old days....... I was there. It did.


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## callybags (25 May 2012)

Would bribery work?

It certainly did when we were kids. The promise of a new leather football ( showing my age now  ) worked wonders with us and got us off the street and into a park.


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## Sunny (25 May 2012)

truthseeker said:


> I dunno about you Sunny, but if I back cheeked an adult or disobeyed or otherwise acted the maggot, I got grounded. Or otherwise punished. I certainly didnt get told by my parents 'tell yer woman its not her road and you can do what you like'.



Same for me but we played on our street from early until late at night and people with young children didn't complain. It was a neighbourhood. Kids were expected to play.


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## Firefly (25 May 2012)

Sunny said:


> So far, all I have heard is that they play basketball on the street and are cheeky. Hardly grounds for the riot squad.


 
I think, in fairness, that the OP doesn't mind children playing outside. However, the constant bump, bump, bump of a basketball would also drive me mad...especially when the kids can, but don't, play outside their own houses!


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## Sunny (25 May 2012)

callybags said:


> Would bribery work?
> 
> It certainly did when we were kids. The promise of a new leather football ( showing my age now  ) worked wonders with us and got us off the street and into a park.



You mean it happened back when you were young? Shock!!


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## liaconn (25 May 2012)

Sunny said:


> I have already said that patents attitude is wrong but you would swear it never happened in the good old days....... I was there. It did.


 
It wasn't nearly as prevalent though. Once you knew your parents might get wind of the word that you were annoying a neighbour you stopped pretty damned quick. Nowadays it sometimes feels like the vast majority of parents will hear no wrong about their kids, will tell their kids they have 'rights' about this, that and the other (trivial stuff I mean) and are basically doing their kids no favours, because said kids grow up to think there are no consequences for their actions, no matter what they do.

There's a difference between a bit of divilment and downright rude and obnoxious behaviour, backed up by parents. The latter just makes annoyed neighbours go on the defensive,  and situations escalate.


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## truthseeker (25 May 2012)

Sunny said:


> Same for me but we played on our street from early until late at night and people with young children didn't complain. It was a neighbourhood. Kids were expected to play.



Oh they complained in my neighbourhood alright. And when they did, my parents backed the neighbour NOT me.

There were a few places it was ok for us to play, a couple of green areas and then outside our own homes. But we were not allowed use a ball outside anyones house at all.

Actually, I went out and asked 2 young lads playing outside with a ball recently to mind the cars, they moved along no problem but when I looked at the cars that had been hit (mine included) there were some really nasty dents and paintwork damage. Now, Im not being sanctimonious here, but I would NEVER have been allowed to damage someones car that way.


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## Sunny (25 May 2012)

Nobody has to accept damage to their property. Nobody has to accept anti social behaviour. But putting up mosquito machines in the middle of an estate as a solution to this problem is ridiculous. You are asking to be sued. There is a reason why plently of businesses and local authorities refuse to use them. The safety of them is not properly tested. 

Remember the good old days when we called into neighbours if we had a problem. Now we text them and contact resident associations. That's the sad part of this story.


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## truthseeker (25 May 2012)

Sunny said:


> Remember the good old days when we called into neighbours if we had a problem. Now we text them and contact resident associations. That's the sad part of this story.



Only because texting wasnt around in the 'good old days'.

In my estate growing up The Res (residents association) were the source of fear for us kids!! They used to report to parents if they saw kids messing, kissing, smoking, acting the maggot in any capacity, and if the parents didnt step up to the plate, The Res would send a delegation of 10 adults to someones house to speak to them about the issue. My own mother was terrified of The Res. 

I actually thought of another solution for the OP. 

When the kids set up the basketball hoop, get into some really geeky sportswear and go out and join in the game, make sure you try to act all 'down with the kids' and use plenty of totally outdated slang, and todays slang in the wrong context.

Theyll hate that. They wont want to attract the attention of that weirdo who wants to join in the game so they will play elsewhere.


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## liaconn (25 May 2012)

Sunny said:


> Remember the good old days when we called into neighbours if we had a problem. Now we text them and contact resident associations. That's the sad part of this story.


 

Remember the good old days when you could call into neighbours if you had a problem and they would treat you with respect and courtesy and apologise if their kids were causing you annoyance.

People who recall 'the good old days' need to see it from both sides. There's no point telling people to remember those days if parents no longer react in the same way. My parents' attitude was 'if you're annoying the neighbours then stop whatever you're doing that's annoying them, no arguments'. 

Nowadays people are aware that if they call into a neighbour with a complaint they're likely to be met with, at best a dismissive 'oh chill out' attitude and, at worst, abuse, high indignation and insults. No wonder so many people hide behind letters and texts.


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## Sunny (25 May 2012)

I was being sarcastic about recalling the good old days. People need to cop themselves when they say this never happened in their day or no kids of theirs would be involved in something like that.


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## Sunny (25 May 2012)

8.39 and kids are screaming and laughing outside. Just thought I would mention it.


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## johnd (25 May 2012)

bullbars said:


> This situation is shocking. Imagine, todays youths out playing sports on summers evening. What next boyscouts offering to cut your grass, or even worse those bloody birds out chirping. Why in my day youths were suspicious and inactive semi-zombies that slouched around street corners. I never took the time to think about how good we had it...
> 
> Another poster advised a move to the sticks; let me nip that one in the bud for you now; all these bloody wild animals keep making this "moo" and "baah" sound. then the owner has the cheek to drive in to the lovely fields with some noisy machinery. Let me tell you my letter writing skills were truely tested that day.
> 
> ...


 

This from a man who previously posted about a neighbour building a SHED too close to him???


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## johnd (25 May 2012)

Sunny said:


> 15 basketballs boucing off a car would do damage. If there was damage, then that is a criminal offence. Did the Guards just ignore the damage that was caused to the car? If there wasn't damage, they were obviously just trying to get a response and it worked. By the way, I know basketball clubs that don't have 15 basketballs. Must be some popular sport in that area.


 
Lets be honest here, the guards are useless in the situation. They don't want to get involved in criminal matters never mind anti social behaviour from local brats. My sympathy is entirely with the OP as we had a similar situation for years. All these people advising "talk to the kids or their parents" live in a different world from the rest of us. These kids don't care cos they are kids, their parents don't care as long as they are not bothering them. 

They play in front of your house because you are a decent person. Once, whern the kid opposite couldn't play in fromt of my house he went to a neighbours house. This neighbour was known as a tough nut but the kid obviously didn't think it applied to him. Two minutes later and the whole road know exactly what our neighbour thought of the kid, his looks,his hair, his parents and what he would do to him if he came anywhere near his house in future. Contary to what other posters have warned it didn't make the situation worse because nobody went near that house again. Ever.

Moral of the story? Do exactly as my neighbour did (if you can put up with the looks from the doting parents) 

Good luck


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## johnd (25 May 2012)

Sunny said:


> Oh stop with the sanctimonious rubbish! So you never answered back to an adult? You never disobeyed? Never did anything you knew to be bold? Even after getting given out to, you never
> mis-behaved again? If that is the case, then bully on you.


 
Your girlfriend would feel different as you would if you had a young baby/child and trying to have some peace. You're probable very young and its hard to have sympathy when you have never been in that situation.


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## johnd (25 May 2012)

Sunny said:


> Out of curiousity, does every patent here know where their teenage child is 24 hours a day?


 
Well they would if they got a text and then a letter about it! Yes! I did know where my kids were when they were teenagers as they spend most of their time in Bed!


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## Yachtie (25 May 2012)

Sunny said:


> 8.39 and kids are screaming and laughing outside. Just thought I would mention it.



Lucky you, there were close to 20 kids running riot and about 6 parents just watching on the footpath immediatelly outside our house until 10.10pm.  Our two year old who normally goest to sleep at 8pm fell asleep just now. His room was too hot and we couldn't open any windows in order to avoid the noise. 

To be quite honest, I am feeling nearly suicidal over this level of belligerence and obnoxious behaviour. Being stuck indoors with blinds closed and having to deal with a tired and cranky toddler on top of the racket is just too much.


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## Molli (26 May 2012)

Yachtie that is dreadful behaviour by those youngsters and worse by the parents looking on and allowing that to happen. What about the neighbours right next door to you, does it effect them or do they have young children that need to get to sleep early? If you had other neighbours that would back you on your complaint then at least it would'nt be just you on your own. Its very upsetting for you having this ongoing and its also upsetting for your little child. Hopefully this will stop soon. Would it be worth a try again going to somebody in the residents assosc?


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## Leper (26 May 2012)

Forums by their nature attract every form of life (even lepers) and sometimes the person posting a problem/scenario does not get the response that is wanted.  We can argue that anybody coming on here must take the good with the bad. But everybody is different and what one believes now may not be the same that was believed in the past. Opinions change, people change and I would advise everybody participating on these forums to take everything with a grain of salt. I think it is time to bring this thread to an end.


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## Guest105 (26 May 2012)

I have an idea, next time the kids come and play basketball or whatever on your patch go out and ask if you can join in their game,  I reckon they will be gone in the blink of an eyelid


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## Teatime (26 May 2012)

To be honest Yachtie's neighbours (the parents) sound like idiots. Nothing worse than a mob like that. No doubt there is a ringleader looking for some neighbourhood power, you know the type.

My main concern is that your kid will find it hard to make friends and might even get bullied when he gets older - no doubt those idiot parents will endorse it inadvertently.


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## orka (26 May 2012)

Yachtie, I have huge sympathy for you – it’s very unfair of the other parents to push the noise away from their house to outside yours. There is definitely less respect for others than 20/30/40 years ago when parents would have sided with other parents/adults rather than reinforcing their child's already inflated sense of entitlement. However, you are unfortunately now in a situation where there is nothing you can do to force a change. The guards can’t do anything and the parents won’t do anything and the kids are probably taking delight in annoying you at this stage, knowing that there will be no consequences for them. 





Yachtie said:


> They can play wherever they like as long as they are not a nuisance to anyone.


Ideally yes but if they are doing nothing illegal then they can play where they like full stop.





Yachtie said:


> IF we are the only ones bothered, there should be no problem in them congregating in front of any other house.


Again, ideally yes but if they WANT to congregate/play on public property in front of YOUR house, there’s nothing to stop them. 

As others have said, for the sake of your child in years to come, you really really do not want to become the weird grumpy neighbours. We lived next to a couple about 15/20 years ago and the wife was always complaining about something – parking, noise, children drawing with chalk on the pavements etc. We have moved since but I still see her and think ‘daft old bat’ (she’s about the same age as me, in her 40s) – and I’ve told my children stories about her and her antics – they love hearing about them especially when we see her out and about. I’m sure (well not really) that she might be a perfectly reasonable person who thinks she has been persecuted by evil inconsiderate neighbours.

Some suggestions:
1. The wet ground idea was a good one (disguised as obsessive car-washing not deliberate action to get rid of them); a bit of mud thrown in (from cleaning your boot after a trip to the beach/park) would make it particularly unpleasant to play basketball.

2. Do any of the kids have older sisters you could ask to babysit for you? This would help in two ways – she would (hopefully...) see that you are not grumpy tyrants hellbent on making life miserable for kids who just want to play on a sunny evening; and if she has to get a fractious toddler to sleep amidst the thump thump thump, she might manage to shoo them away and also mention to her parents that it is a genuine problem.

3. 





Yachtie said:


> The reason why our child can't move into a back bedroom is the same as why we can't watch TV or read in our utility room instead of our living room.


You need to consider what’s best for your child – digging in your heels and not moving him because you shouldn’t have to doesn’t solve your problem. I would read in the utility room and eat dinner in the bathroom if I felt it would get my toddler to sleep.


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## Marion (26 May 2012)

I wouldn't worry too much about the children getting on. Yachtie's child is 2.  

Nobody can determine who will befriend another. Yachtie's child will (presumably) attend school and will make friends there. Her child will not rely solely on their neighbours to play. 

There are many children where I live. Some never ever play on the green areas. They have their own social outlet. Other children live on the greens.

I wouldn't worry too much about neighbouring children being friends. The children mightn't even like each other anyway when they might be of an age to befriend each other.

What's important is that Yachtie and her family will be able to live in their home and be able to enjoy it.

Hopefully, the problem as outlined will run its course and the children will get bored and move on elsewhere.


Marion


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## MrMan (26 May 2012)

truthseeker said:


> The OP tried the friendly approach and on the third night was told, by children, that it wasnt her road and they could do as they wanted. Thats clearly coming from parents.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
The OP may have felt that their approach was friendly, but if the next step was to go formal, then I would wonder about the initial contact. Anyway that opportunity is gone now, and I think that the OP needs to step back and think about why someone would let this rule their life to the point that they feel 'suicidal'. Open the windows and the kid may even get used to noise, it might not be a bad idea. 

The fact that you can describe a bunch of 10 year olds as the next gen of thugs really shows how far we sometimes let small situations blow up in conflict. 
I played on the road always as a kid, and it was never considered 'bothering the neighbours'.


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## bullbars (27 May 2012)

johnd said:


> This from a man who previously posted about a neighbour building a SHED too close to him???


 
congratualtions on mastering the search function, however your investigation concluded prematurely. I had actually enquired about how close I could build a dwelling to the shed. Have another go.


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## liaconn (27 May 2012)

Sunny said:


> I was being sarcastic about recalling the good old days. People need to cop themselves when they say this never happened in their day or no kids of theirs would be involved in something like that.


 

It's not the kids we're giving out about, it's the parents. Of course kids were always up to that kind of thing. However, nowadays, instead of neighbours getting apologies from the parents and the kids having manners put on them, neighbours trying to engage directly with parents get rolled eyes, insulting remarks or even being told to eff off. Then, when people avoid direct confrontation with parents and use residents' associations, letters etc you have people saying 'but why didn't you just talk to the parents?'

I also hate this attitude that if kids are driving their neighbours mad with basket balls, skateboards etc  'oh well, at least they're not joyriding, doing drugs etc'.  If an adult neighbour was playing blasting music at 3 oclock in the morning would you say 'Oh well, at least they're not drink driving or robbing a bank...'?


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## MrMan (28 May 2012)

kids playing basketball at 8pm is akin to an adult blaring music a 3am in the morning? Your argument just went up in smoke imo.


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## liaconn (28 May 2012)

MrMan said:


> kids playing basketball at 8pm is akin to an adult blaring music a 3am in the morning? Your argument just went up in smoke imo.


 
Where did I say one was akin to another? I am saying that as a general argument excusing one piece of annoying behaviour because 'ah shure, they could be doing something really illegal' is not a valid argument in my view. People do not apply it to adults, so why apply it to children.


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## MrMan (28 May 2012)

liaconn said:


> Where did I say one was akin to another? I am saying that as a general argument excusing one piece of annoying behaviour because 'ah shure, they could be doing something really illegal' is not a valid argument in my view. People do not apply it to adults, so why apply it to children.



You asked would someone have the same response to an adult blaring music at 3am as they have to kids playing noisily at 8pm. 

I don't think it's a case of what the kids could be doing, they are kids and they are playing on a public area at a reasonable hour.
They are not a gang or thugs as they have been described, and I doubt if they are having a riot. they are kids and they are playing.


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## liaconn (28 May 2012)

MrMan said:


> *You asked would someone have the same response to an adult blaring music at 3am as they have to kids playing noisily at 8pm. *
> 
> I don't think it's a case of what the kids could be doing, they are kids and they are playing on a public area at a reasonable hour.
> They are not a gang or thugs as they have been described, and I doubt if they are having a riot. they are kids and they are playing.


 
Yes, and I've explained the context in which I made that remark. At no point did I equate one thing with the other.


Also, I don't recall anyone calling the kids 'thugs'. One poster remarked that some idiotic laxadaisical, 'no one can say a word about my kids' parents were rearing the next generation of thugs. I took her to mean that if kids aren't taught to have respect for other people now and to sometimes be just told 'no' by their parents, they will grow up to be self entitled thugs.


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## Yachtie (28 May 2012)

Thanks for all your replies, advice and sympathy. It really means a lot to be heard and somewhat understood, so my genuine thanks to all of you. 

If I may add to this that my main grievance is not with the kids but with the parents. As a parent of a child who is rapidly growing and will want to play outside with other children in a few years, I would be genuinely horrified to find out that a neighbour or anyone has told my child off for whatever reason on more than one occasion and that my child has ignored and disobeyed the elder. As an adult, I reserve the right to make my own judgement of the situation and even if I felt that the ‘other person’ was overly-sensitive, grumpy, unfriendly, intolerant or plain weird, that still will not give MY child the right to be a nuisance. ‘Daring, that lady / gentleman doesn’t like you being there / doing that so please take it elsewhere and we’ll all get on nicely’,… and all that. It really is a mentality issue.


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## ney001 (28 May 2012)

Yachtie said:


> To be quite honest, I am feeling nearly suicidal over this level of belligerence and obnoxious behaviour. Being stuck indoors with blinds closed and having to deal with a tired and cranky toddler on top of the racket is just too much.




Alright Yachtie - quite a statement there.  Look, we can all say what we want, give you suggestions, argue each side of it; but from your comment here you are clearly letting the situation get in on you so you now need to take yourself out of the situation for a short time.  Can you get out of the house for a few days just for the remainder of these sunny afternoons, maybe go stay with a relative etc??.  Probably sounds extreme but your comment above strikes me as being very extreme so I think a little space and time might just put some perspective on the issue.   As I said earlier, you are extremely sensitive to the situation right now and as such every little thing will set you off, to the point of listening in as they speak to the milkman - let him deal with them if he thinks they are rude, don't get any more involved than you are.  You need to get control of the situation before it gets to extreme levels & I don't want to offend you but you need to get control of your emotions on this one.

Also - I'm no expert on toddlers but I do believe that young children pick up on vibes around them and perhaps this is adding to his inability to sleep, he could be picking up on your tension ......... either way just try to get out for a few days.  Rain will be back next week


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## truthseeker (28 May 2012)

MrMan said:


> The fact that you can describe a bunch of 10 year olds as the next gen of thugs really shows how far we sometimes let small situations blow up in conflict.



Im sorry, but when a person feels as follows:



Yachtie said:


> To be quite honest, I am feeling nearly suicidal over this level of belligerence and obnoxious behaviour. Being stuck indoors with blinds closed and having to deal with a tired and cranky toddler on top of the racket is just too much.



I dont consider it to be a small situation.

Im not sure what bit you dont understand, the fact that neighbours and neighbours children are making someones life hell, or that someone has valid feelings of extreme frustration and upset as a result of the antics outside their window.

Yachtie - as you are feeling so awful about this, you need to address the effect that the noise is having on YOU first. Please get earplugs. Boots do great ones shaped like little xmas trees, you wont hear much through them. That will at least get your own frustration down a bit. Your own annoyance is being compounded every time you hear any bot of noise from outside and you need to break that cycle.

For your child, very heavy curtains to block out as much noise as possible, and what about one of those white noise machines? I got one from amazon around xmas time as the noise from surrounding apartments can be hard to get to sleep through and you can set it for a half hour or an hour or whatever, it really does blot out noise, there are different loops, the sea, rain, jungle noises etc....


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## thedaras (29 May 2012)

I was thinking about this,and it reminded me of a friend of mine who moved into a housing estate with her twin boys aged 12.
At the age her boys were at,they slept in until at least 11 or 12 on a saturday,also during the summer they would also get up late.She was a stay at home mother.
She told me that during the summer and on Saturdays and Sundays,they were woken up every time..by the children next door.
There were three children under five living next door to her,and they went out to the back garden most mornings and would play with balls and shout and make noise from 8.15 in the morning.This is what little children do..
Interestingly when her boys where in the back garden playing ball etc until half 9 at night,her neighbour was complaining that they were too noisy.
The moral of the story is ,when you have small kids,you want everyone to be quiet in the evenings,they when they are older you want peace in the morning ..
I was at my friends house yesterday and the two little ones next door to her ,were out in their back garden all day,playing and making noise,on the other side of her is a teenager,who had his friends over and they were having a great time in the sun,signing and playing music,while we sat in her garden with our radio on..all the while thinking ,that  when we had little kids ,that was what they did,and when her kids are in the garden thats what they do.


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## MrMan (29 May 2012)

truthseeker said:


> Im sorry, but when a person feels as follows:
> 
> I dont consider it to be a small situation.
> 
> Im not sure what bit you dont understand, the fact that neighbours and neighbours children are making someones life hell, or that someone has valid feelings of extreme frustration and upset as a result of the antics outside their window.



The OPs hysterical reaction doesn't quite make everyone else a culprit. A once peaceful estate has now descended into chaos, or could it be an over reaction from a mother of a young child. 

Are they really making someones life hell, would this constitute hell for you?, it most definitiely wouldn't for me anyway.


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## liaconn (29 May 2012)

MrMan said:


> The OPs hysterical reaction doesn't quite make everyone else a culprit. A once peaceful estate has now descended into chaos, or could it be an over reaction from a mother of a young child.
> 
> Are they really making someones life hell, would this constitute hell for you?, it most definitiely wouldn't for me anyway.


 
The mother only called the Guards when a group of kids were causing damage to her and her husband's cars. 

The problem here is that some stupid parents couldn't just say to their kids 'move your basket ball hoop away from that lady's house. She doesn't like the noise keeping her baby awake'.

Simple!


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## MrMan (29 May 2012)

liaconn said:


> The mother only called the Guards when a group of kids were causing damage to her and her husband's cars.
> 
> The problem here is that some stupid parents couldn't just say to their kids 'move your basket ball hoop away from that lady's house. She doesn't like the noise keeping her baby awake'.
> 
> Simple!



If 15 kids were smacking 15 basketballs off of someones car, I would  expect Guarda action, and i would also expect that there was substantial  damage done to the car. If the guards decided that this was not the  case, we can't simply say that the guards are useless on these  occassions, because I presume the Guards have to use a little sense and  perspective in their work.

We are also talking about a cul de sac of 13 houses, and the OPs house  is smack in the middle, so where exactly should the kids go to stop  noise from their playing? They are going to be heard by her if they are  playing anywhere on the street. 
The OP also said that when they were asked to stop playing in front of her house that they went inside next door and were howling and causing all kinds of racket until 10.30pm. They obviously weren't bothering the neighbour, or maybe they are immune to the sounds of kids terrorising their neighbours.

Storm in a teacup - simple.


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## bullbars (29 May 2012)

MrMan said:


> The OPs hysterical reaction doesn't quite make everyone else a culprit.


I have to agree. I’ve just had a read through this thread again, the hysterics and hyperbole is laughable at times. You could take the emotive language used here and is it would be similar to a gangland attack in south central L.A.



MrMan said:


> A once peaceful estate has now descended into chaos, or could it be an over reaction from a mother of a young child.


By the OP’s own admission it’s a ‘nice’ area. Families looking to move in to a prospective area generally welcome the sight of neighbouring families playing together.  



MrMan said:


> Are they really making someones life hell, would this constitute hell for you?, it most definitiely wouldn't for me anyway.


Again another over reaction- It would be a real eye opener if the OP had to spend a few weeks in a hellish estate. 
The OP stating that they are “suicidal” over this issue is a disgusting reference to a very serious condition. Kids playing outside you house does not bring this on, if it does you have bigger issues to worry about.



liaconn said:


> It's not the kids we're giving out about, it's the parents.


Both groups are getting tarred, feathered and condemned in this thread. 



liaconn said:


> Of course kids were always up to that kind of thing.


“That kind of thing” – you mean “playing”, although that just doesn’t have the same sinister spin to it.



liaconn said:


> However, nowadays, instead of neighbours getting apologies from the parents and the kids having manners put on them, neighbours trying to engage directly with parents get rolled eyes, insulting remarks or even being told to eff off.


 
If the OP had engaged directly with the parents directly instead of sending letters, then I doubt this would’ve been as big an issue. Nice generalisation on the “yoof” of today by the way. None of those things actually happened here but hey why not add some padding to this story. 



liaconn said:


> Then, when people avoid direct confrontation with parents and use residents' associations, letters etc you have people saying 'but why didn't you just talk to the parents?'.


That is exactly what should’ve been done here. Parent’s of the children ,or should I say offensive feral delinquents, could have been contacted by walking 20 yards to them if this kids didn’t listen the first time. The first they knew of this, The Guards were at the door. Nice to know you neighbour.



liaconn said:


> I also hate this attitude that if kids are driving their neighbours mad with basket balls, skateboards etc 'oh well, at least they're not joyriding, doing drugs etc'. If an adult neighbour was playing blasting music at 3 oclock in the morning would you say 'Oh well, at least they're not drink driving or robbing a bank...'?


You hate the attitude of sports being compared to drug dealing but it fits your argument to make the same leap of the imagination from loud music to bank robbery??



johnd said:


> Lets be honest here, the guards are useless in the situation.


 
Because they never should’ve been involved in the first place. It was a waste of their resources.



johnd said:


> They don't want to get involved in criminal matters never mind anti social behaviour from local brats.


Yes, the guards steer well clear of criminal matters_. (Adjusts tin foil hat.) _



johnd said:


> My sympathy is entirely with the OP as we had a similar situation for years. All these people advising "talk to the kids or their parents" live in a different world from the rest of us. These kids don't care cos they are kids, their parents don't care as long as they are not bothering them.


Thank God we do live in a different world. It’s called the real world. Feel free to join it. 



johnd said:


> They play in front of your house because you are a decent person.


 
(Tin foil hat back on) Yes that is top of the list of a kids selection criteria for where they can play.



johnd said:


> Once, whern the kid opposite couldn't play in fromt of my house he went to a neighbours house. This neighbour was known as a tough nut but the kid obviously didn't think it applied to him. Two minutes later and the whole road know exactly what our neighbour thought of the kid, his looks,his hair, his parents and what he would do to him if he came anywhere near his house in future.


So you and your neighbour intimidate children. Congratulation you both must be extremely tough. Next week why not run over some puppies. Nice little pick-me-up.



johnd said:


> Contary to what other posters have warned it didn't make the situation worse because nobody went near that house again. Ever.


From a social stand point that is not a good thing. 



johnd said:


> Moral of the story? Do exactly as my neighbour did (if you can put up with the looks from the doting parents)


So we should all toughen up, man our posts at our front gates and ear bash every youngin’ that even dares think of the streets as a place to play. Nice. Maybe “someone” could be employed to patrol the dark streets and run these little mites down where they play. _#recession-busting-tip-no-245_



johnd said:


> Good luck


I wish the children in your locality the same. Here I was thinking disciplining our children in this manner was gone. I’m off to fetch my cane so.


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## bullbars (29 May 2012)

This has become a farcical thread and spun far from the OP’s original story. The children’s parents don’t care; the children aren’t children- now a mob of ill-repute urchin’s intent on car demolition by basketball. The only way is to go to your gate and show yourself up as the local nut job so no-one will ever go near your house. Ever again.
That’ll be nice when your kids grow up and nobody wants to play with them. 



Yachtie said:


> Hi all,





Yachtie said:


> I need to rant and I also need advice if anyone has any.


Going back to the OP – Fine you were having a rant, I’ve ranted about my neighbours as well but there is give and take. Picture yourself a few years down the line and your kids are out playing, will you want the guards called and letters in the door?



Yachtie said:


> Our family of three, including a 2 year old child own a semi-d in a 'nice' area.


It’s a ‘nice’ area but you want it your way. It’s obvious these are the issues (I use that word lightly) that go hand in hand with urban living. As I said, what will happen when your children grow up, would you like your neighbours having the guards at the ready? 



Yachtie said:


> Our house is sort of half way down the street at the end of which is a very nice and huge park with playground and all kinds of sports grounds in it.


As you didn’t approach the parents, you don’t know if they were permitted to go to the park after a certain time. It’s easy to dismiss them to the park but next week we’ll have a thread about a gang of youths down at the park unsupervised and we couldn’t enjoy a quiet day etc. etc. 



Yachtie said:


> Over the last five evenings, the boys on the street, aged 10-12 have been bringing out a basketball hoop onto the street and playing basketball at the end of our driveway which is also about 3 meters from our young child's bedroom.


Whether three metres or 12 metres, the noise of kids playing will travel, basketballs will go up and down the road. You were given advice to move the child to a back bedroom and dismissed that as akin to you watching tv in the utility room, a good leap of imagination. We went through the same thing, kids trying to sleep, some people working nights, noise outside. It would’ve been an easy short term solution to move the child to a back bedroom, especially if you wanted to open windows. 



Yachtie said:


> The first night, I went out at 8.30-ish pm and asked them calmly to move away as out 2yr old was trying to go to sleep. They went away for 5 minutes and came back. .


Did you explain it to them when they came back. Perhaps they thought give the baby a few minutes to go to sleep and we’ll be fine to go again. They are kids, sometimes they do have to be told twice. Or three times.



Yachtie said:


> On the second night, they did the same and I went out again and explained that our child goes to bed at 8pm and pleaded with one of the boys who has a sibling of the same age telling him that he should know how upset and cranky young children get when they are tired and can't sleep. They went into the house next door (semi-d) and were howling and causing all kinds of racket until around 10.30pm.


So despite what has spouted throughout this thread they did indeed listen to you, not only that they went indoors and were supervised. Granted ,they made a bit of noise whilst inside but are you going to raise your kids in silence? Will you appreciate the text at 2-3-4-5 o’clock if a baby is howling??



Yachtie said:


> I texted the parents and asked them to ask the boys to keep it down as our 2yr old was woken up and is really upset. I got a reply to say that the boys are over-excited.


So this is the first communication with the parents? Text messages are insincere, juvenile and can have a tendency to misrepresent your feeling. In fairness, they went in-doors when you requested, your baby does not govern the bed time for the neighbourhood children 



Yachtie said:


> The following night, they were back at it again and when we asked them to move, we were told that it isn't our road and they can do as they please.


“Back at it again” – They were playing. Please stop the sinister over tones of what they were actually doing. The response was inappropriate/rude/smart. A quick walk over to your neighbour would’ve softened their cough even if you didn’t bring up the remark. They were pushing the boundaries, kids do that, we’ve all done that.



Yachtie said:


> On the fourth night, we parked our cars on street in order to reduce the amount of space they had for basketball and hoping that they'd get the message and move away. Reinforcements from neighbouring roads came in and there were about 15 children with 15 balls on about 2 meters (with of the road), bouncing balls off our cars.


So nowadays, friends don’t call over; they SUMMON REINFORCEMENTS. Maybe the 15 balls were required as they planned 15 sorties out of the trenches and “over the top” to engage the enemy cars. This is getting a bit like West-side story/Dads army-esque. 
This could’ve been sorted if you spoke to the parents or gone and spoke to them again. I recall neighbours asking us to move as a child. We were young, we just wanted to play. Unfortunately the aul ones didn’t understand the repercussions if we didn’t resurrect the 2-0 deficit in that evenings soccer game. Children’s priorities do differ.



Yachtie said:


> We called the gardai and they came along 20 minutes later.





Yachtie said:


> It's needles to say that the gardai were practically useless as they kept saying that children are children and they have the right to play and if they weren't intentionally damaging our property there is nothing they can do. They did go to talk to two of the parents though but came back with the same 'children are children',... .


You called the guards on children playing. That is how you treat your neighbours? All they received was a text message at this point asking them to keep the noise down, whilst the children were indoors early. Now they have the guards knocking at the door. The social stigma from this is not nice. You said yourself that it is a nice area, yet you are quick to issue letters and call the guards for a frivolous and unwarranted matter. You should have been cautioned for wasting their time.



Yachtie said:


> We have written to one of the parents who is also our road's representative to the Resident Association asking him to deal with this. .


Is that what residents associations are for- A complaints handling body?




Yachtie said:


> We have pointed out that we have as much right to live in our home peacefully as children have to play and that IF we are the only residents bothered by the noise, it should be easy to move play elsewhere and resolve the issue.


Ah, the not-in-my-back-yard argument. This will be nice when you children are out to play some day. I hope the small area outside your house keeps them occupied because if you keep this up that’s all they’ll see of their street where they grew up.



Yachtie said:


> I am not sure how this is going to work out because we weren't home yesterday evening and I dread going home this evening and having to put up with this kind of bullying.


It is not bullying. It is your over-reaction to innocence that has caused this tension.



Yachtie said:


> Those children look into our living room window to see if we are there and then congregate just to be a nuisance.


Careful now, what they may also have established is an OP or “Observation post” close to the front lines to ensure that you are indeed home before calling in reinforcements.
So now instead of making noise by playing sports, they are a nuisance because they are outside. This has really become laughable now. 



Yachtie said:


> Before anyone asks, we haven't fallen out with any of our neighbours, .


I wouldn’t be so sure of that. The children “Summoned Reinforcements” you called the guards for no reason.



Yachtie said:


> we mind our own business and are not in anyone's way. There are no noisy parties or a lot of guest ' traffic' in our house.


What will happen the day you do have party; maybe a family birthday, communion. You’ve now set a precedent that there shalt be no noise and everyone shall live in silence. That’d would put a dampner on proceedings if the guards showed up at your door instead of a friendly neighbour just popping their head in with a request.



Yachtie said:


> I just don't understand how can parents allow this, knowing that it's upsetting somebody.


They don’t know, all you did was send a text message asking them to keep it down one evening, next thing they see is the guards at their door and letters in the door.
How can parents allow this? “This” is children playing. Nothing more.

I look on this thread with complete disdain. Neighbours are now nothing more than a forced nuisance ready to annoy one at a whim. Other neighbours hide behind curtains and get others to do their dirty work. Moreover, apparently many of you never experienced a childhood where you ran, hid, played and grew up with friends. I seem to be a guilty party here.
I confess I did do the following m’lud:
1. Missed the goal and clipped Mrs Walshes tree. Two crab apples dropped. Presumed dead.
2. Hid at Mr. Breen’s bins. They were inside his front gate.
3. Hopped in to Mr. Mulligans garden to retrieve a stray ball. It was a good shot but the wind took it over the bush I swear.
4. Exceeded noise levels when I scored the winner against the next road over. We were 5-2 down but next-goal-the-winner superseded that. (street rules)
5. The following rematch I dishonestly said that Jimmy Killeens goal did not count as it went over the post. The post was my jumper. I do apologise for not having regulation posts.

Should any of you wish to contact my parents to report these serious matters, I beg of you not to contact the ‘Gendarmerie’. I will go quietly home.


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## thedaras (29 May 2012)

liaconn,I cant find where the OP called the Gardai only after damage to her and her husbands cars.
Can you point that out?
If anyone damages your property ,you of course have a legitimate right to complain and demand to be compensated for it..but as I said I dont see where she called the Gardai ,after damage was done to her and her husbands cars.Did I miss that?
I got the impression that she called them because there was kids making noise with basketballs..?


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## Sunny (29 May 2012)

bullbars said:


> 5. The following rematch I dishonestly said that Jimmy Killeens goal did not count as it went over the post. The post was my jumper. I do apologise for not having regulation posts.
> 
> .


 
Knew it you lying sod.

Jimmy


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## truthseeker (29 May 2012)

MrMan said:


> Are they really making someones life hell, would this constitute hell for you?, it most definitiely wouldn't for me anyway.



It would for me, if either my sleep or my childs (I dont have one but if I did) was being disturbed.

More upsetting would be the fact that these kids are actually targeting the OPs house when she is in deliberately to provoke a reaction.

I did have a pretty hellacious time recently with neighbours, so I know how upsetting it can be. You cant relax in your own home waiting for the noise to start again. Granted, for me it was happening from 3am thru to the next morning, weeknights too, but still, I do hate unnecessary noise. I cope with earplugs and a white noise machine, as I suggested to the OP.

There is a poster who has picked apart the OPs posts (and others) in a sarcastic manner. Thats not helpful and it makes the poster look like they are just being smart when they hear someone has an issue. Maybe this poster isnt bothered by noise? Or maybe they have no empathy.

I can appreciate both the upset of having my peace disturbed, the tenterhooks of waiting for the noise to begin again and the feelings of utter frustration and anger that arise from such issues. Mental torture is a valid form of upset.

To suggest the OP is over reacting emotionally would suggest to me that people just dont get it. There is a failure to understand the level of frustration noise can cause. One persons over reaction is anothers under reaction, its all subjective. Maybe some people dont like how the OP reacted, thats their issue, but it doesnt invalidate the OPs feelings.

And, as already pointed out many posts ago - why dont these kids play outside their own homes? The reason, as Ive no doubt is obvious, is because their own parents have moved them along. So why is the OP being villified for wanting them to move along?


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## Sunny (29 May 2012)

truthseeker said:


> And, as already pointed out many posts ago - why dont these kids play outside their own homes? The reason, as Ive no doubt is obvious, is because their own parents have moved them along. So why is the OP being villified for wanting them to move along?


 
The OP already said the kids went into the neighbours house after telling them to go away. Assuming they are like normal estates and the houses are close together, then it doesn't sound like the kids were that far away from their own home. 

No-one here is defending noise pollution or anti social behaviour. We are simply pointing out that kids playing at 8.30pm on a bright summers evening is neither.


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## truthseeker (29 May 2012)

Sunny said:


> No-one here is defending noise pollution or anti social behaviour. We are simply pointing out that kids playing at 8.30pm on a bright summers evening is neither.



I havent bothered going back to find the post that says it, but didnt they carry on screaming their heads off til after 10pm on that occasion? And in response to a text she simply got - they are over excited. So why didnt the parents tell them to pipe down at that point? And save the over excitement for when people are not trying to get a child to sleep?


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## Sunny (29 May 2012)

truthseeker said:


> I havent bothered going back to find the post that says it, but didnt they carry on screaming their heads off til after 10pm on that occasion? And in response to a text she simply got - they are over excited. So why didnt the parents tell them to pipe down at that point? And save the over excitement for when people are not trying to get a child to sleep?


 
How would the OP have liked a text in the middle of the night asking her to stop her 2 year old from making a racket because her neighbours kids were trying to sleep. Welcome to the world of semi detached living.


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## liaconn (29 May 2012)

thedaras said:


> liaconn,I cant find where the OP called the Gardai only after damage to her and her husbands cars.
> Can you point that out?
> ..?


 
In her first post she said:

On the fourth night, we parked our cars on street in order to reduce the amount of space they had for basketball and hoping that they'd get the message and move away. Reinforcements from neighbouring roads came in and there were about 15 children with 15 balls on about 2 meters (with of the road), bouncing balls of our cars. We called the gardai and they came along 20 minutes later


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## liaconn (29 May 2012)

truthseeker said:


> .
> 
> There is a poster who has picked apart the OPs posts (and others) in a sarcastic manner. Thats not helpful and it makes the poster look like they are just being smart when they hear someone has an issue. Maybe this poster isnt bothered by noise? Or maybe they have no empathy.
> 
> ...


 
I totally agree with this. There seems to be a feeling amongst some people that anyone who asks kids to keep the noise down a bit, go and kick their ball somewhere else or whatever are anti 'children playing'. That's not the case. In a modern housing estate there has to be give and take. Of course you're going to have to put up with noise out on the road on Summer nights and nine times out of ten people just put up with it. But sometimes a neighbour might come out and ask the kids to move somewhere else because their baby is trying to sleep/they have to be up really early in the morning/they have a splitting headache, whatever. Unless someone is constantly and unreasonably complaining, the sensible thing for parents to do is just tell their kids to go and play somewhere else. Give and take works both ways. It's not all about people just putting up with children's noise because they live on a housing estate, it's also about children sometimes having to curtail their noise or activities because they too live on a housing estate where there are other people who have to be considered.

People over analysing every encounter, as one or two posters are doing on here (one in a particularly obnoxious, not to mention silly and provocative, manner), are in my view the ones who escalate minor problems and events. If someone's upset, then they're upset. It doesn't kill children to go and play somewhere else if they're upsetting one of the neighbours. Getting up on your high horse about your children's 'rights' is hardly going to lead to good relations with your neighbours.


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## Ceepee (29 May 2012)

I feel sorry for poor old Yachtie.  There are few things more deeply frustrating than your infant child being kept awake.  If you do not have children, you may not understand that, or if you have older children, you may have forgotten the early years, but at least have a bit of empathy for a poster who, by her own admission, is having a rant and is at the edge of reason with upset by what she perceives as intransigent parents and a bunch of belligerent, sniggery kids.


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## Molli (29 May 2012)

If I were in Yachties shoes I would feel very annoyed also. Little children can get so upset when overtired. Then sleep is a battle not to mind having to put up with the outside noise.I don't know Yachties situation but if she's working all day and has to face all this when she gets home it must be very draining and stressful for her. I would'nt look forward to it. Also what effects one person may have no effect on another but I'd be very slow to judge or make light of how anybody reacts to a given situation.


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## thedaras (29 May 2012)

Yachtie said:


> > Hi all,
> > I need to rant and I also need advice if anyone has any.
> 
> 
> ...


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## bullbars (30 May 2012)

truthseeker said:


> It would for me, if either my sleep or my childs (I dont have one but if I did) was being disturbed.


This was at 8:30p.m. it was children playing. It cannot be described as excessive and out of the ordinary. Had it been at 1/2/3:00 a.m. you would have a point.



truthseeker said:


> More upsetting would be the fact that these kids are actually targeting the OPs house when she is in deliberately to provoke a reaction.


No they are not. 
They were playing outside their own houses at a reasonable hour.
Night 1: requested to stop and did
Night 2: requested to stop and did. They even went in to their own houses. 
Night 3: Playing again but the guards were called. 

Nothing they did was an attempt to “ provoke” the OP. This is another incorrect use of inflammatory words that distort the situation in favour of your argument. Simple words just don’t make them sound malicious do they.



truthseeker said:


> I did have a pretty hellacious time recently with neighbours, so I know how upsetting it can be. You cant relax in your own home waiting for the noise to start again. Granted, for me it was happening from 3am thru to the next morning, weeknights too, but still, I do hate unnecessary noise. I cope with earplugs and a white noise machine, as I suggested to the OP.


This is a separate and very different scenario. I do recall reading about this, if I’m correct you did attempt to resolve this through different avenues. Please correct me if I am wrong on that.
Also, note you used ear plugs/white noise machine ; the OP was offered a very simple and plausible solution. Move the child to a back room (especially if they had to open a window) This was shot down as akin to watching television in a utility room. The OP showed no attempt to budge but she should get her way. 



truthseeker said:


> There is a poster who has picked apart the OPs posts (and others) in a sarcastic manner. Thats not helpful and it makes the poster look like they are just being smart when they hear someone has an issue. Maybe this poster isnt bothered by noise? Or maybe they have no empathy.


My ears are burning.
I’m am bothered by noise. I don’t like it when my neighbour cuts the grass on a Saturday after I have sampled some fine wine the night before. I don’t like it when the post man / milkman comes early. If I work irregular hours, can I stop the builders down the street from working during the day. However, unlike the OP and some of you here, I can differentiate between malicious and outlandish behaviour and people just getting on with their lives. Can I demand that all these people stop making noise if and when I request at a whim? Think of the world we’d live in. 



truthseeker said:


> I can appreciate both the upset of having my peace disturbed, the tenterhooks of waiting for the noise to begin again and the feelings of utter frustration and anger that arise from such issues. Mental torture is a valid form of upset.


Mental torture is a valid form of upset. Except that’s not the case here. But hey, it again sounds a lot more victimising than “playing”. 



truthseeker said:


> To suggest the OP is over reacting emotionally would suggest to me that people just dont get it.


Ah I see, you agreeing with the OP means you ‘get it’ and we are so clearly wrong. The OP went from speaking to the children, who complied with the request to calling the guards, with a text and a letter thrown in- but that wasn’t over reacting. Nice.



truthseeker said:


> There is a failure to understand the level of frustration noise can cause. One persons over reaction is anothers under reaction, its all subjective. Maybe some people dont like how the OP reacted, thats their issue, but it doesnt invalidate the OPs feelings.


It’s been mentioned numerous times that everyone recognises that noise within reason can be annoying but there has to be give and take. In this case the OP wanted her own way and refused to budge. Nice neighbour. As I said, this will be fine until the OP’s children want to play outside someday. 

As Sunny put it:



Sunny said:


> No-one here is defending noise pollution or anti social behaviour. We are simply pointing out that kids playing at 8.30pm on a bright summers evening is neither.


 



truthseeker said:


> And, as already pointed out many posts ago - why dont these kids play outside their own homes? The reason, as Ive no doubt is obvious, is because their own parents have moved them along. So why is the OP being villified for wanting them to move along?


As already pointed out by the OP, the children were playing outside their own home, as Sunny’s post states: 


Sunny said:


> The OP already said the kids went into the neighbours house after telling them to go away. Assuming they are like normal estates and the houses are close together, then it doesn't sound like the kids were that far away from their own home





liaconn said:


> I totally agree with this. There seems to be a feeling amongst some people that anyone who asks kids to keep the noise down a bit, go and kick their ball somewhere else or whatever are anti 'children playing'.


So, Instead of playing outside their own home they should go down the road and play outside someone else’s? Sorry but apparently that’s termed as “ calling in reinforcements” and “mentally torturing others”. I know I  was not allowed a certain distance from the house at certain ages, could it be that this is the case again here. Responsible parents wanting to keep an eye on their children outside their own home? But that wouldn’t quite fit your argument.



liaconn said:


> That's not the case. In a modern housing estate there has to be give and take. Of course you're going to have to put up with noise out on the road on Summer nights and nine times out of ten people just put up with it.


Exactly. But the problem here is the OP wants to take but no give. 



liaconn said:


> But sometimes a neighbour might come out and ask the kids to move somewhere else because their baby is trying to sleep/they have to be up really early in the morning/they have a splitting headache, whatever.


That is what happened and the kids complied, a number of times. Yet the OP can still feel free to text them (when they’ve gone indoors to facilitate her needs) to tell them to keep it down. Kids do get overexcited sometimes. This is an isolated incident at a reasonable hour. Would the OP appreciate a text every time the child woke during the night telling her to keep it down? 



liaconn said:


> Unless someone is constantly and unreasonably complaining, the sensible thing for parents to do is just tell their kids to go and play somewhere else


Wait I thought they were only supposed to play outside their own houses?



liaconn said:


> Give and take works both ways. It's not all about people just putting up with children's noise because they live on a housing estate, it's also about children sometimes having to curtail their noise or activities because they too live on a housing estate where there are other people who have to be considered.


Correct. However the OP just wants it their way.



liaconn said:


> People over analysing every encounter, as one or two posters are doing on here (one in a particularly obnoxious, not to mention silly and provocative, manner), are in my view the ones who escalate minor problems and events.


I disagree therefore am obnoxious. I deal with each argument separately, I find it clearer that way. I shall try to be more ambiguous in future.



liaconn said:


> If someone's upset, then they're upset.


So it gives them license to rule over the neighbours? You’ve said in your posts there is give and take. All we’ve heard is that the OP’s child wants to sleep (with windows open) on a summers evening. The children playing are targeting, mentally torturing, calling in reinforcements, driving her suicidal (a disgusting reference) ,all this despite complying with the OP’s requests to stop. How are they doing this – by playing sports. Yes I see how I’ve overreacted. 
Perhaps I should have kept a level head and advocated johnd’s approach, they’ve targeted the decent neighbour ( I wonder if the A-team could help??) Best thing is to get the wife out to try to clip them with the car and then become the neighbour psychopath so they come within 20 yards of your house. Even if they wer etold to move down the road.



liaconn said:


> It doesn't kill children to go and play somewhere else if they're upsetting one of the neighbours.


So they can please one and go down the road and upset another. You are quite correct; it didn’t kill the children when they did actually comply with the OP’s requests to stop.



liaconn said:


> Getting up on your high horse about your children's 'rights' is hardly going to lead to good relations with your neighbours.


Nobody has referred to childrens ‘rights’ but what we have advocated is a that there are reasonable noise levels that you will have to put up with living in semi-d housing estates. If, in this case, they are still causing distress there are reasonable agreements that can be met from both sides – Not my baby has to sleep everyone be quiet.

Getting on your high horse and calling the guards, sending letters and texts without explain the situation is hardly going to lead to good relations with your neighbours.


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## liaconn (30 May 2012)

thedaras said:


> Yachtie said:
> 
> 
> > I quoted the above to remind others that advice was asked for and given
> ...


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## Ceist Beag (30 May 2012)

A quite simple solution to defuse the whole situation is to simply keep the 2 year old child awake until later in the evenings. It is summer after all and what harm in changing the routine a little bit so that they go to bed at 9:30pm instead of 8pm.


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## Firefly (30 May 2012)

Ceist Beag said:


> A quite simple solution to defuse the whole situation is to simply keep the 2 year old child awake until later in the evenings. It is summer after all and what harm in changing the routine a little bit so that they go to bed at 9:30pm instead of 8pm.


 
Hi Ceist,

Problem with that is trying to get the child to revert to the "normal" bedtime after the summer 

Firefly.


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## Ceist Beag (30 May 2012)

That's what the shorter evenings are there to help with Firefly!  Remember a 2 year old can't tell the time!!


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## Sue Ellen (30 May 2012)

This thread has run its course so time to close off.


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