# Working part time with the dole



## witchymand (25 Oct 2003)

Hi, could anyone give me some advice regarding the dole.  I am on Unemployment assistance, but there is a strong chance that I could soon get a part time job working two mornings a week, would I still get paid off the dole for the remaining days, and would what I earn affect my dole money?
Would appreciate some advice,
many thanks


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## Johno (25 Oct 2003)

You would have to notify the dole office off your part time work and yes you would still get paid but your earnings from your part time job your be taking into account.


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## BG (26 Oct 2003)

I agree with Johno's response but some specific details would help get a more specific response. Are you sure its Unemploment Assistance (UA)you're on and not Unemployment Benefit(UB)?  If its UB then you will be paid for the 4 out of 6 days you are not working.  If its UA then the amount of income you earn is important as this is a mean-tested payment.  Also, are you claiming for yourself only or are you claiming for adult dependent + children?  Are you unemployed less than a year, Long term unemployed or Very Long Term Unemployed? Do you qualify under any 'Back to work schemes' or for any grants?

If you post your details I'm sure there are a few contributors who could respond or if you e-mail me to my link I'll get back to you next Saturday(as I'm away till then) without access to AAM  

BG


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## Tommy (28 Oct 2003)

*Two mornings*

If its only two mornings a week, surely they could just pay you cash in hand, and avoid all the paperwork?


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## Protocol (28 Oct 2003)

*typical*

That would constitute both social welfare and tax fraud.


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## Tommy (29 Oct 2003)

*part timers*

Sure, who's to know ?


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## Protocol (30 Oct 2003)

*morals*

The person themselves will know, and if they have any backbone or moral fibre, will know that they should not be defrauding their neighbours.

Their families, me, you, all pay more tax because the frausters pay less.

Surely they would be proud to contribute towards the education, defence and healthcare of society.

I pay approx 21.5% of my salary in tax.  I don't mind, that's not that much compared to other countries.

Anyway, income up to 11,600 per annum is tax-free in Ireland, so this person probably wouldn't pay any tax.

Protocol


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## Tommy (30 Oct 2003)

*Re: morals*

I'm sure everyone knows that the unregistered user "Tommy" who posted above isn't me


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## witchymand (5 Jan 2004)

*re: working part time*

Hi BG,
sorry for the huge delay in getting back to you.  Yes I am on U/A and I am claiming for myself and my 2 year old son, I have been on it about a year and half, and am still looking around for a part time job, which would offer me two full days work a week.  So would you know would I be means tested or would I be just docked the 2 days from the dole office?
many thanks


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## CM (6 Jan 2004)

*..*

Why don't you just take a full time job, and put your child in a creche or with family for the day ?

Quite why we still feel under an obligation to pay out unemployment benefit to people in this country when there's a labour shortage, I don't know.

The multi-seat STV electoral system means that none of the politicians have the nerve to challenge our over generous welfare system.


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## Elcato (6 Jan 2004)

*Re: ..*

Hi witchymand - As far as I know there is opportunities for 3 day weeks. I suggest asking about this at the SW office as well as making quiries about the back to work scheme that was running up to a while ago. They have come a bit more human at the offices now and welcome people who try to sort themselves out for the better. The UA is usually means tested but you still might be better off with the 3 day week if even to give you a break from the family running.
Good luck.


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## <A HREF=http://pub145.ezboard.com/baskaboutmoney.s (6 Jan 2004)

*Re: ..*



> Quite why we still feel under an obligation to pay out unemployment benefit to people in this country when there's a labour shortage, I don't know.



It's a common misconception that Unemployment Benefit is money for nothing - it's nothing of the sort and is based on a person's PRSI ("stamps") payment history and, as such. a fundamental right of our social insurance system. Similarly Unemployment Assistance is another level of safety net to cater for those people who are unable to find gainful employment but who don't have the necessary PRSI payments to qualify for UB. I've availed of UB in the past and would make no excuses for doing so based on the amount of PRSI that I've paid over my working life.


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## CM (6 Jan 2004)

*..*

This "arra sure feck 'em, I've paid me stamps, why shouldn't I rely on some other eejit to subsidise me ?" attitude is really saddening.

Social welfare should be there for those who can't work, not for those who won't work through a lifestyle choice.


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## <A HREF=http://pub145.ezboard.com/baskaboutmoney.s (6 Jan 2004)

*Re: ..*



> This "arra sure feck 'em, I've paid me stamps, why shouldn't I rely on some other eejit to subsidise me ?" attitude is really saddening. Social welfare should be there for those who can't work, not for those who won't work through a lifestyle choice.



I don't see that attitude represented here to be honest. I have no qualms about having drawn UB for several months when I was unemployed and could not find a job and I would not hesitate to do it again if necessary. Being made redundant is not a lifestyle choice. :rolleyes


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## Elcato (6 Jan 2004)

*Re: ..*

This "arra sure feck 'em, I've always had a job, why should I have to subsidise some other eejit who mustn't be arsed to go looking for a job just cos they can't get one ?" attitude is really saddening.


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## CM (6 Jan 2004)

*..*

ClubMan / 0: Am I missing something ? This contributor has *not* been put in this position through being made redundant and is now actively seeking for a full time career. Rather, they are looking for someone else to pay them social welfare while they could work, but couldn’t be bothered. 

A *very* different situation


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## <A HREF=http://pub145.ezboard.com/baskaboutmoney.s (7 Jan 2004)

*Re: RE:*

Could a moderator please delete irrelevant posts such as the above from now on. They add nothing to the discussion of the substantive issues in hand and serve only to distract people who are merely looking for answers to queries. Thanks.


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## rainyday (7 Jan 2004)

*Re: ..*

Deletions made. I'd suggest ignoring any such contributions in future is probably the best response.


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## <A HREF=http://pub145.ezboard.com/baskaboutmoney.s (7 Jan 2004)

*Re: ..*



> Am I missing something ? This contributor has not been put in this position through being made redundant and is now actively seeking for a full time career. Rather, they are looking for someone else to pay them social welfare while they could work, but couldn’t be bothered.



I thought that you were responding directly to my comment above. My situation and that of the original contributor seem to be slightly different all right. However if s/he is entitled to UB/UA even while working part time then s/he should claim it in my opinion.


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## Tom (7 Jan 2004)

*Get yer claim in*

Too right. 

We pay enough tax in this country. 

Ye should be able to claim as much as you can from those feckers in government. 

To hell with the begrudgers like CM.


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## Johno (7 Jan 2004)

*Re: RE:*

Tom,
Your not claiming from "Those feckers in Goverment" but from all tax payers in the country.

Johno


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## Tom (7 Jan 2004)

*Begrudgers of the world unite and take over !*

As 0 says above, its only your entitlement.

If idiots like you are prepared to go out there and work your This post will be deleted if not edited to remove bad language off to pay taxes, then I know that I'm perfectly happy to sit back, watch some telly, and take your money off you.

And, here's the beauty, I don't even have to go down now once a week to sign on, they'll just put it straight into my bank account. 

Nice !!!!!


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## Lucretia1 (7 Jan 2004)

*Re: RE:*

Good man Tom.  And here's a better one for you. You can buy a pair of nylon stockings for a couple of Euro, get a school bag with a length of copper pipe in it, to look like a sawn-off, pay a visit to your local Post Office or Bank and get thousands.  Sure isn't all that money insured? And anyway, banks make huge profits, so you're only taking back some of them.  

Right up your street.


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## <A HREF=http://pub145.ezboard.com/baskaboutmoney.s (7 Jan 2004)

*Re: Begrudgers of the world unite and take over !*

I don't agree with Tom's attitude as facetiously (?) expressed above but claiming welfare benefits to which one is legitimately entitled (as opposed to "dole fraud" or whatever), regardless of one's motivation or attitude, is in no way comparable to armed robbery!


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## rainyday (7 Jan 2004)

*Re: RE:*

You know that if you just ignore the trolls (OTT provocative posts), they will just go away and find someone else to annoy on other bulletin boards.


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## Johno (7 Jan 2004)

*Re: RE:*

Tom,

I take exception to being called an idiot especially by  someone with your attitude.

Johno


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## <A HREF=http://pub145.ezboard.com/baskaboutmoney.s (7 Jan 2004)

*Re: RE:*



> You know that if you just ignore the trolls (OTT provocative posts), they will just go away and find someone else to annoy on other bulletin boards.



Not sure who you're referring to but I was responding to Lucretia1 who is a registered user and past contributor.


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## Lucretia1 (8 Jan 2004)

Hey 0, Hey 0 (it's off to work I go), 

Tom said 





> If idiots like you are prepared to go out there and work your This post will be deleted if not edited to remove bad language off to pay taxes, then I know that I'm perfectly happy to sit back, watch some telly, and take your money off you.



I fully agree with availing of your entitlements, but neither UB nor UA entitles you to sit back and watch some telly.  Both are intended as temporary arrangements to assist you while seeking other employment.  Anyone who chooses to sit back and watch telly "and take [our] money off [us]" is engaging in Social Welfare fraud, which is effectively stealing off other tax & PRSI-paying members of society and in my book _is_ comparable to other forms of stealing.


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## <A HREF=http://pub145.ezboard.com/baskaboutmoney.s (8 Jan 2004)

*Re: RE:*

Looking for a new job is not a 9-5 task in my experience. There are lots of opportunities to watch telly when waiting for interviews, callbacks etc. Personally I prefer to go to the library.


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## Tom (9 Jan 2004)

*Library*

And the beauty of the library is that those working fools end up paying for that too.

Thanks lads, keep up the good work, and keep the cash flowing !


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## witchymand (9 Jan 2004)

*Cm you are soooo outta touch*

In reply to CM's comments about me working full time, to be really honest working full time would be an easier life than looking after a child, as they are hard work, very hard.  Unfortunately 1. I do not have any family members to look after my son
2. I have worked for years before I had my son, because of the system that we live in if I were to get a full time job and bung my kid in a creche, probably about 90% of my wages would go on the creche, also I would lose my medical card, so I would be worse off and it would be my son that suffers, so I am trying my best to get back into the work force as I want to work, yes I actually want to work, but yet I want my son not to suffer by my working.  I could easily annoy  you all the more and say I wanna sponge off the state and sit at home all day, but y'know what I don't want to do that, I actually want to work, and yes part time.


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## Full time working Mum (9 Jan 2004)

*Working part time through choice*

Witchymand,

I too want to work part time,  keep my medical card, etc,and not have to bung my child into a creche,  but reality for many people is different.

And would you believe that some people who work full time actually have to look after their children in the evenings and at weekends too.

If people choose to work part time, that is their choice and they should not be given unemployment benefit.
The system may be unfair and does not particularly suit anyone,  but we all have to live by it, not just some of us.


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## CM (9 Jan 2004)

*..*



> If people choose to work part time, that is their choice and they should not be given unemployment benefit.



Hear ! Hear !

Fair play to you FTWM. 

Loss of social welfare benefits being the reason not to go back to work ?

As I've often said before (and this is from someone who has experienced unemployment) social welfare is FAR too generous in this country, and particuarly now when we have a labour shortage.


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## witchymand (10 Jan 2004)

*working part time*

In reply to the lady that works full time.  I don't think my whole point of my first post it has been understood at all.  I have looked into working full time, but if I was to work full time, I would be more than likely homeless, I worked full time 2 years ago, and nearly ended up starving, I then asked my job would they change my job to part time but they wouldn't, so I went on U/B for a few months and have since been on U/A which I struggle with but at least I am not starving.  I will now tell you exactly how much I got 2 years ago, I got in Euros 889 per month.  Now my rent at the moment is 140 euro per week, which is 560 euro per month, I spend approx 80 euro a week on food for me and nappies etc, which works out at 320 a month, so the total to that is 880 euro which leaves me with a grand total of 9 euro to put my child in a creche, I would gratefully appreciate your realism on what creche is available for 9 euro per week in Dublin and I will join you and work full time,


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## Full time working Mum (10 Jan 2004)

*Working full time*

Witchmand,
it was your second post that I was replying to where you stated you "wanted" to work part time that annoyed me, not the first.  Also,  your comment that working full time is easier than looking after a child.  Working full time,  many women have the stress of a full time job along with the stress of the child at evenings and weekends, and during the day whilst at work you are still fretting over the child,  and watching the clock to make sure you do not get a fine picking the child up, so it is certainly not any easier working than being at home and it is unfair when women who do not work make these kind of comments.

Financially,  my wages cover the creche €800 and the mortgage €600  and car repayments €144 and leaves me with €450 which is not a lot, although I appreciate it is better than your situation.  but it is still tough going and difficult just to make ends meet after a month of very hard slog.

The problem seems to be the price of childcare and there is absolutely no tax relief available at all.

Also,  there is little difference for some people between the basic wage and the social welfare which is another problem in itself.

It really would have been easier for me to "declare" myself an unmarried mother and get the benefits, etc, while still having my partner living there, but I would not go down that route and I feel the way the system is structured at the moment, it is too easy to take advantage of.

I am not saying for one moment that this is the case in your situation, but I know of many people who do this and it makes my blood boil

I hope it works out for you.


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## witchymand (11 Jan 2004)

*attention of working mum*

Hi, apologies if I came across as if I was rude to full time working mums, that is certainly not at all what I meant.  I too could have and have often been pressured (including by the dole office) to claim lone parents, but I never did, the reason I did not is because I felt if I signed up to that I would never get off it, and I do want to get off the dole, I was hoping to start off part time working and hopefully educate myself at a night class that I am pursuing, so I can then better myself to work full time in the future.  I know how hard it must be to be working and worrying about your children, whenever I am away from my son for a few hours I worry, so I know what you mean.


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## S (12 Jan 2004)

*You are doing fine witchywand*

Listen witchywand, its hard for any single mom, full time, part time or not working all.  Granted some do take advantage, but they will get theirs in the end, a rant of which I'm not going into now. 

You are doing best for your child and thats exactly what every parent needs to do.  I should say actualy that its hard for any parent right now.  Childcare is such a massive hurdle even with two incomes.  The people who give out about scabbing or sponging of the system do have a point, yet everyone is individual and for some, like you, working full time leaves you and your child worse off.  I commend your efforts, it is hard, but it WILL pay off.  

Hold your head high and let the ignorant think what they like, what do they know anyway?


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## apologies (12 Jan 2004)

*?*

I meant witchymand, I swear.  Sorry


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## mmclo (12 Jan 2004)

*2 1/2 days*

The cash in hand point may be relevant there is a minimum number of hours you need to work on order for it to be considerdd work by the revenue, maybe 8 hrs a week...could be worht looking in to. This would only keep the person out of the tax system, all work would need to be declared in terms of social welfare


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## mmclo (12 Jan 2004)

*Lone Parents*

I wouldn't knock Lone parents payment either. Until recently there was a graduated element in it where it was paid at a reduced level for those returning to work. Those entitled to it should claim. Unfortunately the graduated element along witht the Back to Education and Back to Work Allowances have all fallen fowl of McCreevy et al. 

Due to recent SW cutbacks there is less incentive to use these schemes to get back in to work and education. Maybe people should concentrate their fire on the people who make these decsions and not the mother in question who is doing her best to get back into work


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## Murt10 (1 Feb 2004)

*Re: attention of working mum*

Witchymand


From your posts it appears that you may be a Lone Parent and if you qualify for UA (a means tested payment) you will also probably qualify for One Parent Family Payment (another means tested payment). You might want to take a look at this link 

www.welfare.ie/publications/sw82.html

"5. How are Earnings from Employment/Self-Employment Assessed?

If you are working, your income from employment or self-employment is assessed as follows:

 €146.50 of weekly earnings is completely disregarded 

half of the remainder of your earnings up to €293.00 per week is assessed as means. "



Murt


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