# Sue a debtor without a solicitor



## billythefish (1 Mar 2009)

I would like to take a debtor to the district court who has ignored all reminder and demand letters (debt is approx €500 and legal fees are unfeasible) but I don't know even where to start. I've looked at www.courts.ie but I don't think it was made for the layperson and I find it quite hard to follow. 

It would be nice if it had an A-Z guide on what I want to do (though maybe I'm being naive in thinking the law could ever be that simple...)

Can anyone help?


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## eeyore2502 (1 Mar 2009)

Have you checked if it is possible through the small claims court.  We have gone through the small claims court and it is quite easy but can be a lengthy process.


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## d2x2 (1 Mar 2009)

After the first reminder, I sent my debtors a letter with interest accrued on the bill. 

Then I named-and-shamed their company by posting a notice on my website, although only on a page that only they were likely to access. ("This page does not display correctly due to outstanding dues... (name of the company)"

They feared for their reputation and paid up. I lost any hope of doing any further work with them - but believe me I had no intention to ever deal with them again.

They threatened to sue etc. but they didn't have much of a case.

----

About small claims court, it will only deal with individuals not with companies/trade AFAIK.

Good luck


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## bond-007 (1 Mar 2009)

eeyore2502 said:


> Have you checked if it is possible through the small claims court.  We have gone through the small claims court and it is quite easy but can be a lengthy process.


Small claims cannot be used to recover debts.


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## bond-007 (1 Mar 2009)

billythefish said:


> I would like to take a debtor to the district court who has ignored all reminder and demand letters (debt is approx €500 and legal fees are unfeasible) but I don't know even where to start. I've looked at www.courts.ie but I don't think it was made for the layperson and I find it quite hard to follow.
> 
> It would be nice if it had an A-Z guide on what I want to do (though maybe I'm being naive in thinking the law could ever be that simple...)
> 
> Can anyone help?



For €500 it will be a lot of effort and there is no guarantee of getting anything back. 

You will need to prepare a civil summons with the details of your claim. You will need to have it stamped at the court and served on the defendant. If the defendant does not pay up you can proceed to court. 

You should really see a solicitor.


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## juke (1 Mar 2009)

The first form you need is 39.2 of the District Court Rules in Schedule C - Civil Summons for a debt or liquidated money demand.

This should be stamped for €20.00


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## billythefish (1 Mar 2009)

bond-007 said:


> For €500 it will be a lot of effort and there is no guarantee of getting anything back.
> 
> You will need to prepare a civil summons with the details of your claim. You will need to have it stamped at the court and served on the defendant. If the defendant does not pay up you can proceed to court.
> 
> You should really see a solicitor.


 
I've contacted solicitors and all of them are saying that should it go to judgement that their fees would swallow up the entire debt. I just feel that people like me really should be able to take people to court without any undue cost.


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## billythefish (1 Mar 2009)

d2x2 said:


> After the first reminder, I sent my debtors a letter with interest accrued on the bill.
> 
> Then I named-and-shamed their company by posting a notice on my website, although only on a page that only they were likely to access. ("This page does not display correctly due to outstanding dues... (name of the company)"
> 
> ...


 
We're a firm of accountants so I sincerely doubt our professional body would approve of us naming-and-shaming. Oh how I'd love to though. Although, it's not like he's a company. He's a taxi-driver and he clearly doesn't give a stuff....

Thanks for all the suggestions so far guys.


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## bond-007 (1 Mar 2009)

billythefish said:


> I've contacted solicitors and all of them are saying that should it go to judgement that their fees would swallow up the entire debt. I just feel that people like me really should be able to take people to court without any undue cost.


I would question those solicitors. You are entitled to your costs if you have to go to court. If the taxi driver toughs it out you could be out for the fees. It would depend if he owns anything of value. Remember that the sherriff is a really ineffective way to collect debts.

Follow the advice and look up the district court rules and do your own summons and get it stamped for 20 euro.


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## juke (1 Mar 2009)

Bond - Under the District Court Rules, the scale costs for a successful plaintiff would be just €45.00 plus vat - so if the op won, that's all that the debtor would have to pay. That's why it becomes cost inefficient for solicitors. So the op would have to pay the balance costs.

That said, I'm surprised any firm of accountant's regular solicitors wouldn't deal with this on a once off basis.

Hence I weakened.... and gave him a pointer...


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## bond-007 (2 Mar 2009)

€45 + vat is terrible. I can see now why solicitors are reluctant to take such cases.


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## billythefish (2 Mar 2009)

juke said:


> The first form you need is 39.2 of the District Court Rules in Schedule C - Civil Summons for a debt or liquidated money demand.
> 
> This should be stamped for €20.00


 
I founds Rule 39.2 on www.courts.ie but couldn't download anything. Have you any idea where I could download this?


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## Bronte (2 Mar 2009)

Go into the District court office and ask them where you get the forms, they can be most helpful and will guide you in what you are doing.  Please let us know how you get on each step of the way.  

Most small debts are not worthwhile going to a solicitor for as the costs outweight the debt.  Also it's can be very difficult to get a debtor to pay.  Sometimes just the service of the summons can make the debtor wake up and start to pay the debt.  It's not advisable to sue someone who has no assets and is on social welfare etc.


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## juke (2 Mar 2009)

billythefish said:


> I founds Rule 39.2 on www.courts.ie but couldn't download anything. Have you any idea where I could download this?



The form is in here

http://www.courts.ie/rules.nsf/53bd...0256f270054b152/$FILE/ATTL74G8/Schedule C.pdf

it's form 39.2


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## bond-007 (2 Mar 2009)

Bronte said:


> Go into the District court office and ask them where you get the forms, they can be most helpful and will guide you in what you are doing.


Some clerks can be helpful and others will tell you to go away and engage a solicitor. 


Bronte said:


> It's not advisable to sue someone who has no assets and is on social welfare etc.


That don't stop a lot of businesses such as the banks.
I often see cases where a debt of under €1000 is pursued with so much effort only for the creditor to fail to obtain an instalment order because the debtor is on SW.


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## murphaph (2 Mar 2009)

Unless this lad has a house in his own name I wouldn't bother with solicitors (costs rapidly get out of hand in my experience). Do the summons thing yourself and that might put the frighteners on him. Take it as far as you can yourself but going to solicitors is no good for such small debts with our current laws (or as Brendan once put it our "rogues charter").

You will remain liable to your solicitors for your costs regardless of whether an order for costs is made in your favour. You then have 2 debts to somehow extract from this individual and you're down another few hundred.

If he has a house/property it could be worthwhile as you can get the judgement registered against that and he'd eventually (subject to the statute of limitations I believe, so another possibility to walk away from your debts) have to cough up if he wanted to remortgage or sell up.

People owe us money too. It's a pain.


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## davidoco (2 Mar 2009)

I've a summons in MS Word that you can have if you PM me.

My own experience - typed it up, sent it to District Court with €18 (at the time), then sent stamped copy to debtor by reg post.
A week before Court debtor paid up debt.  Cheaper than going to Court with a solicitor for them.  Debt was €600+


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## MOB (2 Mar 2009)

Some solicitors offer a service where they will - for relatively small money - issue letters of demand to debtors, but without issuing proceedings.   So if you have twenty debtors, you send two 'frightener' letters to each, you perhaps get in payment from half of them and you write off the rest.

I do not necessarily recommend this course of action. Indeed, I generally refuse to threaten proceedings unless I am actually instructed to issue proceedings ( in a small town, you would otherwise get known for being all bark....), but it is nevertheless an option that OP might consider as a sort of half way house\low cost option.


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## billythefish (2 Mar 2009)

MOB said:


> Some solicitors offer a service where they will - for relatively small money - issue letters of demand to debtors, but without issuing proceedings.   So if you have twenty debtors, you send two 'frightener' letters to each, you perhaps get in payment from half of them and you write off the rest.
> 
> I do not necessarily recommend this course of action. Indeed, I generally refuse to threaten proceedings unless I am actually instructed to issue proceedings ( in a small town, you would otherwise get known for being all bark....), but it is nevertheless an option that OP might consider as a sort of half way house\low cost option.



that would be a good option for a business that has a lot of debtors. luckily, we would only maybe have 3 or 4 per year who decide they would rather not pay.


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## ajapale (14 Mar 2009)

admin bump


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