# IBEC calls for new SSIA Scheme



## Brendan Burgess (26 Feb 2019)

https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2019/0226/1032942-ibec-leadership-conference/

Was the last SSIA scheme successful?

It was good for those who were well off enough and organised enough to participate in it. But we ended up with higher taxes/more borrowing to fund it.

Was it good for the economy? I thought that the maturing SSIAs caused problems with a rush of money into the economy at the wrong time.

I don't know why IBEC proposes stuff like this.

Brendan


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## odyssey06 (26 Feb 2019)

If only there was some way we could control our interest rates if we think economy is over heating... which is what I think SSIA was trying to do indirectly, but the problem was that the government couldn't time the release of the funds to match an economic downturn.


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## Brendan Burgess (26 Feb 2019)

I see that Governor Lane suggested this recently 

*Central Bank governor: ‘Bring back SSIAs to cool growth’*

Goodbody said the “bonanza” boosted consumption by at least €1.9bn in 2006 and by €3.5bn in 2007, with cars, holidays, and home improvements expected to be the main beneficiaries.


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## noproblem (26 Feb 2019)

odyssey06 said:


> If only there was some way we could control our interest rates if we think economy is over heating... which is what I think SSIA was trying to do indirectly, but the problem was that the government couldn't time the release of the funds to match an economic downturn.



I have often wondered if the whole lot had gone belly up just as the SSIA's were coming to fruition would they have been paid out in full?


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## RETIRED2017 (26 Feb 2019)

A stamp duty type tax ring fenced is the way to go to cool the economy if it starts over heating

Lets say we had a high stamp duty on houses and such like if the started overheating people knew would be taken off once house prices  leveled off ,kind of engineered negative Equity,works better on secondhand houses,
Even now to have high stamp duty once they reached a certain level would be a way of cooling runaway prices,
If we can do it with rent zones on landlords private owned houses it should be possible to do,


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## lledlledlled (26 Feb 2019)

I'd prefer an exact copy & paste of the UK's ISA system. Much better for all parties than SSIA.


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## lledlledlled (26 Feb 2019)

RETIRED2017 said:


> A stamp duty type tax ring fenced is the way to go to cool the economy if it starts over heating
> 
> Lets say we had a high stamp duty on houses and such like if the started overheating people knew would be taken off once house prices  leveled off ,kind of engineered negative Equity,works better on secondhand houses,
> Even now to have high stamp duty once they reached a certain level would be a way of cooling runaway prices,
> If we can do it with rent zones on landlords private owned houses it should be possible to do,



It's almost impossible for a young family to buy a 3-bed semi in dublin. You want to impose higher stamp duty on them now too?


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## Palerider (26 Feb 2019)

I bought a new 5 series with both our ssia’s in January 2008 costing me €67000, the lunacy of it.

Let’s do it again, I have more sense now, I promise..


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## odyssey06 (26 Feb 2019)

Palerider said:


> I bought a new 5 series with both our ssia’s in January 2008 costing me €67000, the lunacy of it.
> Let’s do it again, I have more sense now, I promise..



So you pretty much gave the 25% topup straight back to the government in VRT? As I suspect, did most people in VAT or stamp duty or CGT or whatever.


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## noproblem (26 Feb 2019)

Palerider said:


> I bought a new 5 series with both our ssia’s in January 2008 costing me €67000, the lunacy of it.
> 
> Let’s do it again, I have more sense now, I promise..



Nah, the Irish are only a couple of generations away from being in pure poverty and think when they've got money nowday's that they know what to do with it, when in fact most of them haven't got a clue. There's no shame in this, it's just something that takes a lot of time to handle. It's not just trhe ordinary man and woman i'm talking about either. Just have a gander of the names that went into NAMA. Most living the high life, borrowed up to their "whatever", drove the Merc, etc, lived in a lap of luxury and not a cent to rub together. No difference at all between them and the little cowboys selling houses to one another, sure who gave a damn, it would last forever, houses in all parts of the world, helicopter rides to the Galway races, etc, etc, etc. Come on Paschal Donoghue, start another SSIA, wonderful people on great salaries giving you great advice on why it should be done. How could THEY be wrong. Sound familiar?  And by the hokey will Paddy let it rip if it happens? You can bet your life he/she will.


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## Purple (27 Feb 2019)

Brendan Burgess said:


> https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2019/0226/1032942-ibec-leadership-conference/
> 
> Was the last SSIA scheme successful?
> 
> ...


It's a stupid idea and procyclical in the medium term.


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## Brendan Burgess (27 Feb 2019)

Séamus Coffey has done an excellent review of it here 

*Do we need another SSIA scheme? *

His conclusion 

"But, it is doubtful that [the savings rate]  needs to be higher.  It might be that, given the risks we face, that we need other sectors to be doing a bit of saving (the government sector maybe); after a decade of deleveraging the household sector can probably afford to cut loose a bit." 

This seems reasonable to me. Do we need a government which can barely balance its books during an economic boom to spend more money encouraging us to save?


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## Purple (27 Feb 2019)

Brendan Burgess said:


> This seems reasonable to me. Do we need a government which can barely balance its books during an economic boom to spend more money encouraging us to save?


Maybe an SSAI where the government was doing the saving?
I'll happily pay more tax if for every Euro I pay the government cuts expenditure by €1.25 and takes the total off the national debt. Think of it terms of giving back some of the money we have stolen from our children and grandchildren.


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## odyssey06 (27 Feb 2019)

Purple said:


> Maybe an SSAI where the government was doing the saving?
> I'll happily pay more tax if for every Euro I pay the government cuts expenditure by €1.25 and takes the total off the national debt. Think of it terms of giving back some of the money we have stolen from our children and grandchildren.



Would there be a way for the government to set up the national solidarity bonds you get in the post office to do this - well the national debt part?


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## Purple (27 Feb 2019)

odyssey06 said:


> Would there be a way for the government to set up the national solidarity bonds you get in the post office to do this - well the national debt part?


Don't ask me; I specialise in hyperbole, not constructive suggestions.


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