# Do you have a household budget?



## Bamhan (4 Jan 2006)

I wasn't sure where to ask this so please move if necessary.

After a lengthy and at times heated debate last night chez moi we have come to the harsh conclusion that we need some serious belt tightening over the coming months.

We seem to be able to control our big areas of spending very well ie mortgage, creche etc but when it comes to day to day things it is a lot harder.
We were trying to come up with a realistic figure of what we need to run our home day to day and boy is it dificult.
Is it just me or how do other people manage their finances.

I am looking for some hints and tips on how to manage daily expenditure so that we have enough to cover what we need but reign in the spending a bit.

I must admit to a somewhat scatty way with dealing with money while my other half is an accountant and wants to control things down to the last penny.....

A happy medium is what I am looking for......so we can still buy things within reason but that I could for example when asked come up with a ball park figure of what it takes to run our household for a week.....

Has anyone come up with a solution which works?


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## Henny Penny (4 Jan 2006)

Hi Bamhan

I would say cash cash cash. Leave laser/credit cards at home and only spend what you have in cash.  

Another piece of advice is stay away from the shops. If you don't go in they can't take the money out of your pocket. 


Good luck


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## ribena (4 Jan 2006)

I am the worlds worst when it comes to money.  I'm a spend spend spend gal and wish I had wads of cash cash cash to meet it!!  I would agree with Henny Penny, before I ever got a credit card I always had cash in my purse and no bills.  Ever since I went plastic I never have any cash and seem to have bills all around me!  A friend of mine a few years ago was building a house and told me that she gave herself a budget of I think IR£40 at the time and that's all she withdrew from the ATM every week.  She used that to get her lunch etc. during the week.  They had a small entertainment budget set aside and if they didn't have the cash, they did without.  It worked for her anyway and I'm sure we could all survive if we made cutbacks in certain areas.


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## annR (4 Jan 2006)

A friend of mine does the same thing, she withdraws a certain amount of cash each week and does with that.  Just get receipts for every little thing so you know where it's all gone.  Keep it realistic by using this for expenses you have every week so it's roughly the same each week.  
Things like household bills etc you might be better off using direct debit.


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## TarfHead (4 Jan 2006)

One income, 2 adults, 2 kids, one mortgage, 2 cars.

Out of my salary, I transfer a set amount each month to the joint account. Half of this is ear-marked for the weekly grocery shop and all utilities. The other half is ear-marked for everything else. 

What is spent on the first half is (sort of) based on reality - looking back over the bills we can figure out how much to allow for the main weekly grocery shop and all utilities. The other half is mainly consumed through cash and that is what is difficult to track.

I, being pedantic and anal, would prefer to see an electronic transaction for everything. She, being her, prefers to have cash in purse as using Laser '_can be a hassle_'.

"You took out €100 on Monday and again on Thursday ! WTF ?"

I take out €40 cash on a Friday and make it last the week - newspapers, Eastlink, DART fares and small out-of-pocket stuff when out and about with the kids at the weekend.

Drinking money ? Hah ! Chance would be a fine thing.
Social life ? Hah ! See above.

Haven't cracked it yet.


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## Danmo (4 Jan 2006)

Hubbys salary goes into joint account and covers mortgage and a few DDs. Mine goes weekly into a diff account and we use this for entertainment, groceries etc etc. I have been cutting down on dds by trying to pay off loans early etc. Goal this year is to clear credit cards and a credit union loan and build up savings. May even forgo summer holiday. Sounds miserable but we had 3 breaks this year abroad which I think is a tad excessive. Will just have a couple of long weekends courtesy of aer lingus this year. Want to do some jobs in house and will pay cash. If no cash they will just have to wait. Agree with Henny Penny - I gotta stay out of shops. "Just looking" usually ends up costing.


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## Carpenter (4 Jan 2006)

My wife and I try and write out a budget for the year ahead and this is usually revised/ reviewed as the year progresses.  It gives us a general goal/ picture of our spending.  However we find that the biggest items of expenditure in our household are the weekly grocery shop, heating and baby essentials.  We plan our meals for the week ahead and try to be as economical as we can with our food bill, whilst still enjoying a good, varied diet.  We had a lot of extra expense last year with a new baby- it's great if you can borrow equipment from family as it really eats into the finances otherwise.  We couldn't manage without a budget plan but it sometimes leads to heated debate- especially when items like: "how many shoes/ blouses/ handbags do you need?" enter the debate.  This is soon countered with: "how many tools do you need/ why do you need another drill?".  After working out our annual expenditure we aim to save a minimum amount each month, into SSIAs and our "rainy day fund".  
A well thought out budget gives you some sense of control over your finances and helps to even out the highs and lows during the year.  It's also beneficial for planning holidays, treats etc.  we both get paid monthly so we "allow" ourselves a treat or two when payday comes- afterall what's it all for otherwise?


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## Cyrstal (4 Jan 2006)

I try to stick to a budget of sorts, and I go gung ho at sticking to it...and then lo and behold something happens to blow it out of the water...new wheels for the car, car service, a birthday I'd forgotten about...the list goes on....oh to win the lotto!!


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## annR (4 Jan 2006)

Tarfhead

I also prefer to do everything electronically and tend to lose track of cash withdrawals and what I spent it on.  I need cash but I'm useless at knowing when I last withdrew some cash and how much I need for the week, partly because I shop in Lidl with cash (I don't use Laser).

It might help if you make a point of getting receipts for *everything*.  At the end of the month, I spend an hour totting it all up.  I make 3 columns for bank transfers, cash and credit card.  Make rows like 'gas bill', 'supermarket' 'miscellaneous'  'clothes'.  Fill in all the boxes.  Make another row at the bottom called 'Other cash'.  This is the cash withdrawals MINUS the cash expenses = cash that you don't know what you spent it on.  

This sounds like hassle but it will at least give you some sort of picture of where the cash goes, how much you're losing track of, and also the overall total spending on everything by every method of payment.


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## TarfHead (4 Jan 2006)

annR said:
			
		

> This sounds like hassle but it will at least give you some sort of picture of where the cash goes, how much you're losing track of, and also the overall total spending on everything by every method of payment.


 
I agree, but my own difficulty is that I need my wife to maintain those records, as she initiates all of those transactions, and that sort of record-keeping is anathema to her.

And if it was spent on pretty frocks and shiny nails, I would have a better clue, but it's not - there's little to show for it at the end of the month.


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## icantbelieve (4 Jan 2006)

I hate cash, visa and laser for everything, that way it can all be downloaded into an excel spreadsheet I put together a few years back. I have one page detailing all my main outgoings creche, food, gas, phone etc where the amounts are fed in from the other pages containing visa and laser card statements. I've been doing this for 3 years now so am at the point where I've a good idea of what a standard month costs and what kind of non-standard spending can we afford. Don't get me wrong, I spend as much as anyone but this way I know where I stand and what needs to be done to afford holidays etc.
The best thing you can do is draw up the list of what's coming in and what's going out. A lot of the time the untraceable items that are putting you in the red are down to cash burning a hole in your pocket. Because its spent on small things it is forgotten about, two adults every week buying coffee, papers, womens magazines, chocolate, scratch cards, cigarettes etc, easily becomes €200-300 per month.


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## Ben (4 Jan 2006)

Completely agree with icantbelieve

There is no point picking out of the air an amount you think is reasonable for running your household and trying to stick to it. If it is not based on your reality, It won't work. Also trying to benchmark yourself against other people won't work. 
I firmly believe that you cannot manage your money unless you know where it is going.
I track all my expenditure and have done so for a few years. I carry a small note book / diary with me always (A lesson from my mother before Alvin Hall and Eddie Hobbs) and I write in anything I purchase (no matter how small) during the day. Once a week I input these figures into a Money Manger program that came with the home computer. My husband does the same.
If you do this, even for a couple of months, you find that the amount you spend on e.g. groceries each month etc. tends to be roughly the same. For example, I know that we roughly spend €450 per month on groceries. I mentally deduct this amount from our income the same way I would the mortgage.
I think that if you don't know where your money is going, especially when you are part of a couple it can lead to unnecessary tension and stress. While it can seem a bit anal to track everything it is not time consuming at all. 
Also, it isn't always about cutting back. Budgeting is not about being miserly. Sometimes it is just about realising and *accepting* what it costs to be you and making more informed decisions about how you spend what is left over in your income after all the 'necessary' expenditure.


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## Ann-Marie (4 Jan 2006)

Just moved into our house in sept. We leave my wages in the bank to pay mortgage, life insurance, pension and what is left over after paying that is left in my bank for a rainy day.
With his wages we get shopping i put €100 in a box weekly whatever we don't spend goes into the box towards the following weeks shopping and we save in the credit union weekly and when we got our first bills in i paid them in full and every week after that i put €10 or €20 into each bill so when the bill comes in we are in credit or the bill isn't that high so makes things easier when the bill comes in. 
We would usually go out once a week for a few drinks or invite friends around


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## Bamhan (4 Jan 2006)

It looks like we will have to go back to running our lives as we did when we had no money at all......my husband lost his job just in time for me to begin unpaid maternity leave.
We were determined not to touch the savings and had to learn to live on a budget.
We were really rigid with it and you know what we managed to save during that time as we realised what we were spending our money on.
While I feel sick at the thought of going back to counting the pennies maybe it is the way to go.
God we both earn decent salaries but our outgoings are huge......
It is time to get the daily spending under control....
I will go back to the notebook and the recording my spending.
By the way Tarfhead you could actually be my husband talking.......freaky.....


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## ribena (4 Jan 2006)

MABS do a good [broken link removed] which I hope to go through tonight to see where all my dosh is going...


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## annR (4 Jan 2006)

TarfHead said:
			
		

> I agree, but my own difficulty is that I need my wife to maintain those records, as she initiates all of those transactions, and that sort of record-keeping is anathema to her.
> 
> And if it was spent on pretty frocks and shiny nails, I would have a better clue, but it's not - there's little to show for it at the end of the month.


 
Just get her to keep all receipts and you tot them up at end of month if you really want to know where it's going.  If necessary get her to write a wee note on any receipts which don't say what it was for.


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## PGD1 (4 Jan 2006)

Hi,

I have a budget sheet and a daily expenditure sheet.

At the beginning of each year I fill out the Budget sheet. I list all incoem and outgoing and make sure there is 3kish left over afterwards, for emergnecies. Obviously I would like this 3k figure to go up over time.

I'm at the stage where I can have a very accurate figure for estimated outgoings throughout the year as I have been tracking everything electronically for about 3 years now.

I also have a cashflow page.

Essentially it lists date, item, amount and balance... for our 1 joing current account.

I then project this 1 year ahead... i.e. I put entries in for every day for 1 year. I think fill it in with planned expenditure. I have this at a very detailed level. This is excellent for showing the highs and lows of cash in the account and you can adjust expenditure accordingly so yu never go into overdraft.

Back to the budget... You should work out all money in first, then work out all fied costs (mortgage, gas/oil/, insurances, fuel etc etc)... things yo HAVE to spend money on. 

See how much you have left per year.
Work out a Variable Costs list   i.e. clothes/entertainment/holidays/meals/presents etc etc and see how much you can spend on them, ensuring you leave a buffer of a few thou for emergencies.

Spit your variable budget up by type and divide by 12 to see how much you can spend per month.

You then have two choices....
1) take that cash out at the beginning of the month and if it's spent then don't worry what it is spent on... as long as you don't take more out
2) have a printout of the categories and totals and everytime you spend money just write in the item and reduce the figure... quick and easy.

I have had great success with this system.


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## ClubMan (4 Jan 2006)

There are some useful budgeting and debt management resources in the Banking, Borrowing and Credit Cards forum.


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## POBHD28 (4 Jan 2006)

Not sure if this would be of any great benefit to the original poster, being that there's an accountant at large in her house, but I use a neat little package called Acemoney and I've found it invaluable in managing our domestic finances. (No financial interest or affiliation with the folks who make it, by the way.)

Like several of the other male posters here, I freely admit to being boring and pedantic about such matters and have no problem whatsoever in seeking out receipts, keeping note of what I spend each day, etc. My wife does it only grudgingly, but it has been essential for us over the last couple of years. 

Once you do this for a few months, you can get a good (and often eye-opening) picture of where the money is going. Only then can you draw up a meaningful budget for yourself. Tools like Acemoney are by no means essential, but they are useful, especially for getting overviews, graphs and so on. Nothing like a bar chart plummeting ever downwards to persuade you that steps need to be taken.

Also, as regards the point made about car wheels, birthdays and so forth blowing the budget out of the water, if you track your spending for a year, you'll have a much better handle on when these are likely to crop up and can budget accordingly. You could take the simplistic approach of adding up all your big annual expenses and dividing by twelve to see how much you should be putting aside each month into a rainy day fund to deal with these when they crop up.


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## Bamhan (4 Jan 2006)

My accountant husband would like nothing better than to record every single item of expenditure and income.....he even has his own spreadsheet designed and all......
We did that for a while.....me very very grudgingly and thought I could leave all that crap behind me once we were both earning decent wages.
I got the shock of my life last night when he showed me an analysis of what we spent last year.
While not beyond our means as I doubt very much my other half would allow that to happen.....the greatest proportion of our money went on misc.....silly things we just don't keep track of.........
He was busy looking at the big picture, managing long, medium and short term savings and investments while I had absoluctely no idea whatsover what I earned, what we owed, what I spent.....
Seems a wonder we are together at all......
I think it is my attitude to money which needs to be called into question rather than my actual spending.


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## annR (4 Jan 2006)

Bamhan

I think it is an attitude thing.  I don't think I could function in an anxiety free way if I didn't know what state my finances were in or unless I had some good plans laid out.  Other people don't seem to think like that at all.  Are you not concerned about what your financial state will be in 5 years time, or whether you will have sufficient pension, or whether you will be able to afford the kid's education?


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## Bamhan (4 Jan 2006)

No I know we have a secure financial future, or at the very least have made as much effort as is humanly possible to ensure that this will be the case....it is the here and now I am concerned with....all this saving for the future and what about living life now.
Anyway why marry an accountant and then have to control finances (like buying a dog and barking oneself)


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## D8Lady (4 Jan 2006)

Hi Bamhan
I found this MSN article to be very useful.
http://moneycentral.msn.com/content/Savinganddebt/Learntobudget/P36153.asp

Essentially, you live on 60% of income - groceries, utilities & daily expenses.
10% paid to pension.
10% paid to paying down debt or long term saving/investments.
10% paid to irregualar expenses e.g. holidays, car /home repairs
10% for fun.

As a guideline its very useful, easily modifiable based on your own set of circumstances. I like the idea that fun should be on the agenda.
If you & hubby can agree on what percentages work for both of you, then DDs can be set up facilitate it.


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## mo3art (4 Jan 2006)

We have a budget for day to day expenses - basically I withdrawn €50 each for our spending money and a further €70 for petrol.  Everything after that is allocated to bills, food, debts and savings.  We spend €200 per month on food & alcoholic drink - very little on socialising tbh.
At the moment the savings are down a bit because of Christmas.  We save approx 30% of our net income, 10% of which is for spending money on special occasions over the year including holidays - the remainder is for a rainyday.....
It's a big improvement on this time last year when all our finances were servicing day to day spending, bills & debts.  We are now down to the "big 2" - car & mortgage with the intention of paying a large lump sum off the car loan shortly and clearing it (higher interest rate).  Ultimately we would hope to increase our mortgage repayments and reduce our term by about 20 years - paying off our mortgage within the next 8 years!
We are both still in our mid-twenties so it would give us an opportunity to expand our family with less stress about debt or go travelling without having to worry about servicing debts.  We both earn under the average industrial wage, btw, just very careful with our money after being badly burned.....


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## Gordanus (5 Jan 2006)

these budgeting ideas sound great.   I did keep a record a couple of years ago of every penny out for 3 months, helped a lot, and I discovered that the main thing I hadn't factored in was the presents for the birthday parties the kids had been invited to.  They were happening a lot more often than i had thought, even though I was doing the ferrying in most cases.  But what about when your income, like mine, is very irregular due to being self-employed? Some months almost zero income, some months mega income (relatively speaking!)


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## Past30Now (5 Jan 2006)

I've kept a track of most of our expenditure on Microsoft Money for the last four years - we use credit cards for most day to day spending - however all I do for cash withdrawels is record them as such -  I don't attempt to track what we spent the cash on. Other than that it works quite well.

Past30


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## ThereseM (8 Feb 2006)

Hi
I am currently trying to budget as I have been overdrawn since I can't remember when.  It all started when I decided to up my SSIA to the max. limit so I could save for the future but forgot to check to see could I afford the present.  The bitter truth is I can't.  Lots of people have there own ideas.  My sis gets her statement goes through it & her cash receipts & figured out how much she spends each month.  She looked at what she was spending her money on & decided on a budget from that.  Personally I don't know why a single woman on 42k needs to budget but that's just me, live a little I say.  How the other half live!!  I myself have tried doing obvious things like making a little extra at dinner time & bringing it in to have for lunch the next day as I costed out I was spending 4.50p/day x 5=€22.50 a wk= €90p.mth. It's like someone else posted earlier, the little things add up soooo much!! 
Good luck with the budget,
ThereseM


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## TarfHead (8 Feb 2006)

This is a good week.

Yesterday I learned that, through work, I could get a discount from BT Ireland on broadband and line rental.

Today I learned that I could pay less to VHI for the same cover *and* get partial refunds on GP visits. In last 2 months, we've handed over €250 to the GP which is hard to budget for.

Not a fortune in either case but better off in my pocket that theirs.


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## Janet (8 Feb 2006)

D8Lady said:
			
		

> Hi Bamhan
> I found this MSN article to be very useful.
> http://moneycentral.msn.com/content/Savinganddebt/Learntobudget/P36153.asp
> 
> ...



That's an interesting article and I quite like the calculator in it.  Of course, I'm nowhere near having 20% to pay towards irregular expenses and just fun as I'm putting as much as possible towards paying off my loan.  But I like the idea of putting percentages on things - it's someting I do in a sort of vague way (remember one of my sisters telling me years ago that rent shouldn't be more than a quarter of gross income or a third of net) but only for my biggest expenses i.e. loan and rent.  Must take another look at my budget and work out the percentages properly.  It'd be good to be able to think to myself that in a few years when loan is paid off I'll be able to use x% of income for y purpose.


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## Janet (8 Feb 2006)

TarfHead said:
			
		

> This is a good week.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Joining the HSA has helped me enourmously in this regard.  There are a couple of threads on this if you wanted to search and see if it's something that might be of use to you.  As it's a cash plan it doesn't interfere with VHI/BUPA.  It also forced me to keep all my receipts together as you can only send three at a time and must claim the money within 6 months so I was doing it on a regular basis with the result that now I've gotten my P60 I can fill out my Med Form 1 and 2 to claim tax back straight away - something I've not yet ever actually gotten around too.  Once I've done it for this year, I'm going to try and find all the receipts for previous years to claim as well but at least going forward I'll be on top of this.


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## blueshoes (8 Feb 2006)

me and partner have never had a budget and its only in the last couple of weeks that we have decided to sort this out like we never seem to have anymoney between us end up taking money from bank machine, credit card whatever anyways we added everything up and on paper it seems that we should have €300 over! but we dont, so as eddie suggests, we got a note book and i now write down everything that we buy and bills payed and savings. we were so amazed that just like during the week we could spend up to 200 on takeaways, fags, credit (even tho we have house phone and bill is always huge!) also the baby cant run it up (cant talk yet!!), magazines, petrol, car wash (i like my car clean), and bits and bobs. so i decided no more of this crap and going out in the evening to get o an ice cream or wot ever. we used to shop in tescos would come to about 130 and we would be out buying more stuff by friday and eating 2takeaways. so dont go anymore we go to aldi and spend €50 and this food does the whole week ok 1takeaway, we dont touch my partners bank accout this is for morgage, bills,loans ete. then my money is for food and saving. we have run up two credit card bills and like were trying to pay them of they never seem to go down. have cut them up (wish i never got them) credit union loan nearly paid of thats ok. and partner has boi loan which is 200 pm. also then theres kays bill. and the rest its soo hard to stick to a budget of some sort. we have an appoitment with mabs on friday so hopefully they can point us in the right direction


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## Guest127 (8 Feb 2006)

tarfhead: dont believe all you hear or read about bt and line rental and broadband. suggest you have a gander at the IT forum, search for the topic on being overcharged by bt for broadbanda+line rental package. if you dont mind a bit of hassle, phoning comreg, making numberous phone calls to bt then its right your street. Me? I signed up for bb+lr in october. still being billed by eircom for line rental as bt say I didnt apply for lr ( written confirmation with me) also they advertise €15 off for the first 4 months but dont actually apply it. in fact they charge you for broadband from the day you apply -not the day you actually switch over.
back to this topic. yes I do keep a household budget and Icould not manage without it. basically set aside money each fortnight for esb/home heating oil etc in one section. car insurance/house insurance and other larger bills in seperate section. put aside €40 each fortnight strictly for Christmas Shopping. ( crazy but necessary) try and put aside money each fortnight for college campus for next sept but have fall back savings which were seperately set up for university costs which I can draw on anyway, but obviously the more I can put aside regulary the less I have to dip into these savings.Seperately put aside  money for holiday/special occasions or just plain emergency ,deposit into ebs at level I can sustain that particular fortnight. might vary from one period to another. Always clear off cc as soon as bill arrives or before next one comes anyway. without a budget I could not manage, simple as that.


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## TarfHead (8 Feb 2006)

cuchulainn said:
			
		

> tarfhead: dont believe all you hear or read about bt and line rental and broadband.



My experience is different to yours.
I'm already with them for calls & line rental & BB and they're giving me 15% off BB & line rental monthly charges - €6 saving per month.
The principal issue I have with them is they f'ed up my billing and sent me a threatening letter, but they'd have to do worse than that to get me crawling back to eircom.


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## DrMoriarty (9 Feb 2006)

TarfHead said:
			
		

> Yesterday I learned that, through work, I could get a discount from BT Ireland on broadband and line rental.


Sorry to drag this slightly off-topic, but how does that 15% discount work, TarfHead — do you work for a company that's a BT business customer or something?

I have the same package as yourself at home, and have had much the same billing experience. But when they sent me a (completely unwarranted) threatening letter I kicked up such a stink that the head of their 'Customer Services', in a written apology, assured me that there's be no further nasty letters, nor any risk of disconnection, until they'd sorted out the long-standing billing cock-ups on their side. That was in November 2005, and I've effectively been on interest-free credit ever since...  _(Don't worry, I have the money put aside for whenever they finally get around to looking for it!)_

To return to the OP's query — there are some useful budgeting tips to be had on  (home to the famous ).


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## TarfHead (9 Feb 2006)

DrMoriarty said:
			
		

> Sorry to drag this slightly off-topic, but how does that 15% discount work, TarfHead — do you work for a company that's a BT business customer or something?


 
Yes


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