# kids kicking football outside gate.



## johnd

The kid across the street uses our gates as a goalpost. This drives my wife mad and she has told him time and again not to do so.  He is 15 and before him his older brother did the same but he at least stopped when my wife went out one day and screamed at him.   Today my wife went out in the car and saw the kid and mate in his garden and when she returned he was at our gate kicking ball across to his mate.  She lost it and almost pinned him to the garden wall, she made a show of herselve and when I got home she was so upset at the way she had swore at him.  We got a new porch unit recently and the football slams into it all the time.   Any advice please?


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## ClubMan

johnd said:


> Today my wife went out in the car and saw the kid and mate in his garden and when she returned he was at our gate kicking ball across to his mate. She lost it and almost pinned him to the garden wall


I hope you don't mean using the car!?  Even if this was just a hand to hand engagement she should be careful as she could easily be done for assault!


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## Pee

Give the lads a chance to grow up. From what I know of kids the more they're asked to stop the more they'll continue. As ClubMan says an adult has to be very careful on how they deal with children, especially children that are not in thier care, aside from the law neighbours have fell out for less.


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## johnd

It was with the car!  No, she did'nt hit him but was turning in as he went into garden to retrieve ball. He did almost fall into the bin though - so every cloud...


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## ClubMan

So - based on your original post she lost it and almost pinned him to the garden wall with the car ... *deliberately*? If that is the case then I suggest that she goes to anger management therapy as a matter of urgency before she harms somebody seriously! I am not joking.


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## johnd

> Give the lads a chance to grow up. From what I know of kids the more they're asked to stop the more they'll continue. As ClubMan says an adult has to be very careful on how they deal with children, especially children that are not in thier care, aside from the law neighbours have fell out for less.


 
Problem is its been going on so long. He's 15 and his brother 19, he also has another one age 8 so looks set to continuefor another 10 yrs. I dont think my wife's sanity will last that long. You might say sell but we cant afford to take out a bigger mortgage.


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## johnd

ClubMan said:


> So - based on your original post she lost it and almost pinned him to the garden wall with the car ... *deliberately*? If that is the case then I suggest that she goes to anger management therapy as a matter of urgency before she harms somebody seriously! I am not joking.


 
No ClubMan, Was not deliberate - she was turning in at the same time he was going in. where do they do anger management in Dublin? Can't find any classes in phone book.


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## z103

I really feel sorry for you. Many outsiders will wonder what the problem is, they're just kids kicking ball into onion net etc...

However, I've been at the receiving end and it's like Chinese water torture. It was a strong contributory factor for us moving. 

There's no real solution, apart from moving or murder, and by the sound of it your wife is close to the latter. (Stuff we tried included parking a car on the road to narrow the playing field, complaining to parents, confiscating the ball and actually joining in their game.)


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## ClubMan

johnd said:


> No ClubMan, Was not deliberate


Sorry - this bit misled me into assumine that it was...


johnd said:


> She lost it and almost pinned him to the garden wall


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## johnd

Sorry Clubman,

My turn of phrase maybe. We live on a narrow road and to take a turn needs a sweep so when she drove in and almost pinned him, she lost it!

Know any basic english classes I could attend while she is attending the Anger Management ones? By the way where are those anger management classes in Dublin?   Anyone know?


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## johnd

leghorn said:


> I really feel sorry for you. Many outsiders will wonder what the problem is, they're just kids kicking ball into onion net etc...
> 
> However, I've been at the receiving end and it's like Chinese water torture. It was a strong contributory factor for us moving.
> 
> There's no real solution, apart from moving or murder, and by the sound of it your wife is close to the latter. (Stuff we tried included parking a car on the road to narrow the playing field, complaining to parents, confiscating the ball and actually joining in their game.)


 
Thank you Leghorn,
 Nice to know someone understands what its like to have this daily.


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## Yoltan

johnd I can understand how annoying this is. Although the problem we have doesn't sound as bad as yours. It hasn't gotten to stage yet (and I hope it doesn't) where we're tearing our hair out. We have 2 new cars in the driveway and our main concern is the ball slamming into one of them. Why is it that these kids never kick a ball outside their own houses??


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## polly2000

Has anyone spoke to the parents?
You can call the gardai. They did come several years back when complaints were made on our road. It stopped the football although it did take repeat visits by the guards
I think I would approach the parents first and then if nothing improves call the guards


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## HMC

johnd said:


> The kid across the street uses our gates as a goalpost. This drives my wife mad and she has told him time and again not to do so.  He is 15 and before him his older brother did the same but he at least stopped when my wife went out one day and screamed at him.   Today my wife went out in the car and saw the kid and mate in his garden and when she returned he was at our gate kicking ball across to his mate.  She lost it and almost pinned him to the garden wall, she made a show of herselve and when I got home she was so upset at the way she had swore at him.  We got a new porch unit recently and the football slams into it all the time.   Any advice please?



John,
From what I can gather, it's your wife who is doing all the running here and getting herself into a right state.  No offence, but speaking as a lady myself (!), these lads couldn't care less what she says.  Next time, why don't YOU go out and speak to them in a calm, controlled manner rather than see your wife get upset.  Another suggestion, get yourself a football and start kicking at their wall when their parents are home, petty I know but...


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## bride2be

I had the same problem at my last house. All the boys on our road insisted on using my gates as a goalpost. This went on for years and everytime i told them to move they'd move but come back again and again......
It got to the stage where being polite and ladylike went out the window. I screamed and shouted abusively at them, but they'd laugh at me, and sure enough come back again. 
My boyfriend moved in and went out one night after we'd just about had enough and basically in a not so polite way went up to the lads who were about 16 yrs old, told them in a not so nice way that if they didn't remove themselves and the ball and stop playing at my gate that he would kill them! He warned them he was serious and that we'd had enough. They stopped. It was after i'd had this for 9 years. John i would recommend that you stand up to these lads and in a not so nice way tell them that if they don't remove themselves from your gate you are going to take matters a step further!


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## pc7

can you park your car outside the gates so the access won't be there for them, they'll soon find somewhere else


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## TTV

yes I have to agree, take something that is irritating and caused more than likely by the usual lack of facilities in this country and turn it into something extremely serious with death threats on teenagers and almost running over someone in a car. Is this thread serious? Does anybody remember growing up? If thats the type of advice being bandied around no wonder this country is the way it is..


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## TTV

was it for something similar that the guy in the UK was killed last week? Two 16 year olds if I remember, threathen to kill the wrong teenager and you bring the consequences on yourself..


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## Tarquin

I know


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## z103

> John i would recommend that you stand up to these lads and in a not so nice way tell them that if they don't remove themselves from your gate you are going to take matters a step further!


You were lucky.

When I tried this, I was threatened with a brick through the window. As has been mentioned above, the consequences of retaliation could be much worse.



> Does anybody remember growing up?


Yes, I certainly remember growing up. We wouldn't dare treat people like this.


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## pc7

have to agree with leghorn, 15 year olds can be quite intimidating, I was pretty innocent when i was 15 and seen adults/garda etc as authority figures. Doesn't seem to be the case now - not in all cases of course but a lot.


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## TTV

> And I admit it was getting to the stage where I and a few of my friends were seriously thinking about tackling them.



Please tell me this is a joke?



> We wouldn't dare treat people like this.



What, threaten to Kill people for annoyingly playing ball? Maybe run someone down in a car? They are teenagers for God's sake, do people not have more to worry about than kids playing with a ball? Have they broken anything? Done any damage? What exactly are they doing that is deserves death threats/getting the heavies around? If they were outside your house doing drugs then maybe you should be worried. Its always the person that gives the reaction that gets picked on by teenagers...its easy to say we dont undertand the situation but I used to be that teenager and I guess alot of other people did too and I have dealt with them kicking ball outside my house, if using a gate as a goal is the worst thing they do during these years then the futures bright...

Maybe you should just sell your house and get away from all the drastic ani-social behaviour caused by this foreign sport, that or just kill them pesky kids, Tarquin sounds like the person with a few friends who arent afraid of a few young lads...sounds like its building up to that anyway..


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## foxylady

TTV said:


> yes I have to agree, take something that is irritating and caused more than likely by the usual lack of facilities in this country and turn it into something extremely serious with death threats on teenagers and almost running over someone in a car. Is this thread serious? Does anybody remember growing up? If thats the type of advice being bandied around no wonder this country is the way it is..


 
Your right. People seem to forget they were kids once too. Surely playing ball is not a criminal offence and its keeping kids on the straight and narrow. Would people prefer if they were robbing cars etc?


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## TTV

I had to read the original post to make sure I didnt miss anything...surely there must be some heinous behaviour I had glanced over but no..true enough the crime worthy of advisng death threats/sending around the heavies ..


> ..uses our gates as a goalpost.


I think you might get some more reasoned answers by speaking to a few of the teenagers..


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## Goggin

"Unless you have been there, don't assume you can understand how bad it can get"

As per Tarquin I completely second the above. Its not a simple case of somebody playing football. Do you think these people are responding this way because they have a problem with kids playing football? Its the continual invasion of space and privacy thats the issue. I have had similar experiences in the past and it is torture.


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## MandaC

Its easy to say, sure its no harm when they are not constantly hanging around outside your house. When I visited my mam a couple of years ago, there were teenagers playing football outside the house. 

I did not see any harm in them so went in. When I came out a couple of hours later, teenagers gone and a huge dent on the bonnet of my brand new 206 which was about 2 months old at the time. The mark of the ball could clearly be seen on the top of the bonnet. I was absolutely fuming. No one was around offering to pay for the damage either.

Needless to say, once bitten, twice shy, no more kids are let play ball in the vicinity of my house, be it outside the house, on the road or even use the trees outside my house as a goal. They are told in no uncertain terms where to go. I would not enter into any crap with them, just ask them what house they live in and suggest they play there. Politely of course.  Kids have to play somewhere - let their parents organise that for them.  If the parents want to take responsibility for any damage that occurs, I have no problem with them playing.


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## z103

> I had to read the original post to make sure I didnt miss anything...surely there must be some heinous behaviour I had glanced over but no..true enough the
> I think you might get some more reasoned answers speaking to a few of the teenagers..



...and did you actually read any of the other posts? - such as kids threatening to put a brick through my window, or kids stabbing people?

This isn't just a once off incident people are refering to, it goes on for months or years. The constant thud of footballs off your car or front windows. Kids climbing over your back wall to get their ball back. On and on and on. 

As was mentioned earlier, unless you've been in this situation, it can be hard to understand.



> Your right. People seem to forget they were kids once too. Surely playing ball is not a criminal offence and its keeping kids on the straight and narrow. Would people prefer if they were robbing cars etc?


I wouldn't have dared carry on in the way these kids do.

TBH, when you're in that situation, you couldn't honestly care less what these kids do, so long as it's away from you and your property.


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## aircobra19

I'm with Tarquin and Goggin on this. Had lots of problems with this in our area.  I moved out so got away from it. But its definately like chinese water torture. The parents move their kids away from their house because its so annoying. We used to get it all day and even as late as 11 or 12. Ball bouncing off cars, flowers, windows, walls and constant tresspass as the kids get their ball, usally traming over anything in their path. This despite there being a green and a football pitch less then 2 mins walk away. Its one thing if it bunch of smaller kids, but teenagers is another thing entirely. Its one thing to play football or hang around where you are not bothering anyone. But once you do it knowing you are bothering someone and usually it includes damaging propery and tresspass then its antisocial. 

The problem certain layouts, especially cul de sacs, end houses etc are naturally atractive to kids and street football. So while there are kids the problem will keep reoccuring. Especially in those areas with young families, as each generation goes through.

Its really down to parenting and being respectful of your neighbours. So if an appeal to the kids and the parent fails I think your on a loser. The local community cops are rarely able to resolve it. If I was stuck with it, I think I'd buy some old cars and park them really awkwardly. As usually once the space is awkward they stop. Perhaps even change the layout of the gates etc. Its very stressful and some people lose the plot completely over it. But you have to be careful to stay within the law, otherwise things can escalate and become much worse. 

Its something I'll aways consider when choosing a place to live.


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## TTV

> ...and did you actually read any of the other posts? - such as kids threatening to put a brick through my window, or kids stabbing people?


eh, if you mean the stabbing by the two 16 year olds then I actually wrote that...and what did you say to the kids to provoke them? Anyway where are we going on here? Have these kids threathened anyone? Did they dent a car? Did anyone say anything about windows? No they                               ..use a gate as a goalpost.

My advice, get them some nets and maybe even jerseys...a bit of positivity might calm down all the violent tendancies floating around...I guarantee alot of the posters here will run into greater difficulty when their teenage child gets into something more serious...and to think of it, imagine how you would feel if they were your children, kicking a ball in an estate and being threatened with death or the potential of fully grown men actually going to hunt them down and tackle them? 

Alot of ye seem well out of touch with the youth of today...


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## musicfan

Unless you have been in a situation like this, you cannot understand how annoying it was.
We were in a similar situation - young boys playing football up against the side of the house, ball repeatedly bouncing off the windows, wall etc
Tried speaking to them and their parents but no real improvement, the constant thud of the ball against the house is annoying to say the least.  
The most annoying thing is - these kids didn't even live in our estate - presumably they weren't allowed play beside their own houses and on their own green because it was too annoying for their parents.
For any parents reading this, remember that other people shouldn't have to suffer and listen to footballs belonging to your kids bouncing off the side of the house.  If you have kids playing football - make sure they play beside your house and not beside some strangers house/property.


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## TTV

And thats my point, would you equate annoying with the need for death threats, losing it and nearly running someone over in a car?

Given the shoddy nature of houses built over the last few years are we to get the balaclavas and bats out everytime a neighbour plays there music too loud and we can hear it through the walls? This is equally as annoying but what can you do if its within the law? 

I dont know, i guess people just dont realise the seriousness of threathening somone with death these days - do it to as seriously to a member of the Garda and you'll find out the legalities pretty soon..


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## Goggin

"Alot of ye seem well out of touch with the youth of today"

and buying 15 year olds jerseys and nets is?

Maybe in some idyllic areas......


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## TTV

out of touch with sarcasm too eh?


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## Goggin

sorry - couldnt find the smiley face thingy


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## z103

> Alot of ye seem well out of touch with the youth of today...


I don't want to be 'in touch' with the youth of today. They are other people's ignorant kids.



> My advice, get them some nets and maybe even jerseys...


If that's your advice, you don't seem very 'in touch' yourself. The kids that were kicking footballs against my front windows woundn't be interested in nets and jerseys. They could well afford them themselves, and would only serve to make them look ridiculous in front of their mates.

They weren't really even playing a 'game' - just idly kicking the ball from one side of the road to the other. It's not the sporting aspect they are interested in. I know this because I joined in once.


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## aircobra19

TTV said:


> ...Alot of ye seem well out of touch with the youth of today...



I agree with you that people are going way overboard if they go the route of threating kids/teenagers. You have to stay within the law. However the point is this can escalate and people AND teenagers go postal. Its not a small or trival thing. You can see the depth of feeling on it. 

Maybe try one of those teenager sonic thingys. 
[broken link removed]

The thought occurs to me if mobile phone blockers were legal (and they are not) that would work equally aswell.


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## musicfan

I'm not saying that giving death threads to the kids is right but unless you have lived with this situation day in day out, you can't understand how annoying it is.

I for one was glad of the rain all summer as it stops the kids kicking their football against the side of my house day in day out up till 11pm at night.

The kids in my area don't even live in my estate - they have their own (larger green) right accross the road but presumably their parents don't want them kicking ball there as its so annoying and frustrating!

I'm aware they are only kids but as a previous poster said they're somebody else's kids - if I wanted kids outside the house all day, I'd have my own thanks very much.

Parents should be aware where they're own kids are playing and should be aware that other people don't want them kicking ball against the side of their house.


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## BlueSpud

Might I suggest that posters who have not been the subject of this type of harassment keep their sanctimonious opinions to themselves. This sort of thing can wreck your head and being given lines "we were all kids once..." is no help at all. If it annoys you, it annoys you. It doesnt annoy some people.


Try & help the OP with workable suggestions.


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## Goggin

TTV said:


> Maybe you should just sell your house and get away from all the drastic ani-social behaviour caused by this foreign sport, that or just kill them pesky kids


 

Actually not doing too badly on the old sarcasm yourself TTV


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## Carpenter

Wow, this debate has got rather heated!  I had the misfortune of living beside a rented property for a short while where the "adolescent" occupants (all apprentices, straight out of school, first time living away from home etc) would party every night, play hurling and football on the green area (to the exclusion of the local children) and treat the residents front gardens as sidelines.  Foul language, "boy racer" congregations in the evenings and a host of anti social behaviour were the norm for a good number of months.  Life was hell living beside this and I suffered sleep deprivation and stress as a result.  I eventually took action (well within the law) and had the gurriers evicted.  The self righteous parents of some of the individuals involved complained that they were: "only kids, first time living away from home etc".  So what, in respectable society we are all entitled to live as we please, AS LONG AS we don't intrude on the privacy  of someone else and their enjoyment of their own home.  So what's this got to do with the original post and subsequent thread?  Well I too dreaded the summer evening for that time those gurriers lived beside me and I Know the annoyance that reckless and inconsiderate ball games can have on ones nerves!  And yes, i've noticed that most of the teenagers who (shall we say) have a little less regard for their neighbours rarely kick ball outside their own house and mam and dad couldn't care less. Rant over!


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## Jaid79

Goggin said:


> "Unless you have been there, don't assume you can understand how bad it can get"
> 
> As per Tarquin I completely second the above. Its not a simple case of somebody playing football. Do you think these people are responding this way because they have a problem with kids playing football? Its the continual invasion of space and privacy thats the issue. I have had similar experiences in the past and it is torture.


 
Things are never that bad that you have to go out and be abusive to a couple of kids. I’ve had issues with some neighbouring kids and never resorted to kicking the **** out of them or even threaten to.

When I was a teenager, I used to have a few neighbours like you. I guess you and your ilk where there kids that stayed inside watching TV and not out side playing and learning social skills..


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## musicfan

If you read this thread in full, its about the nuisance that kids are continually playing football against end walls, garden walls, cars, etc etc etc despite being asked not too.  Is disrespecting other people and their properties in this way one of the 'social skills' that you learned while you were younger??????  I think we could do with a few less adults / kids with social skills like this in the world. 

When I was younger, I was brought up to respect other people adults and their properties and would not have dreamed of being a nuisance to other people. And my parents would not have allowed me to be a nuisance to other people - unlike the parents of the kids being talked about in this thread!

As for the previous comment ' things are never that bad', only people who have to live with these 'children' kicking football on their property, can know that yes it can get this bad!!  Im not suggesting death threats etc but it is exhausting, frustrating, stressful, annoying.


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## Carpenter

musicfan said:


> If you read this thread in full, its about the nuisance that kids are continually playing football against end walls, garden walls, cars, etc etc etc despite being asked not too. Is disrespecting other people and their properties in this way one of the 'social skills' that you learned while you were younger?????? I think we could do with a few less adults / kids with social skills like this in the world.
> 
> When I was younger, I was brought up to respect other people adults and their properties and would not have dreamed of being a nuisance to other people. And my parents would not have allowed me to be a nuisance to other people - unlike the parents of the kids being talked about in this thread!


 
Well said, I think that encapsulates the whole argument.  It's about respect.


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## GeneralZod

Try putting some obstacles around the gatepost to make the ball bounce off at awkward angles.


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## musicfan

I don't think homeowners should have to put up obstacles around their own gates because of *other* peoples kids!I don't think the ball bouncing awkardly would have any effect on these kids - they'd probably think it was great!!

These people have bought their homes, no doubt working a long day to pay a huge mortgage and should be entitled to relax in their own home in the evenings without the constant threat of a ball breaking a window, or bouncing of the wall and listening to the contstant thud thud of the ball off their wall.

I'd say there's a good chance that the people in this thread who say other people are overreacting, are the very ones who don't care that *their* kids are a nuisance to other people - as long as they are not playing football beside *their *house!!!!


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## TDON

The bottom line is, even the parents of these kids don't want them playing outside their own house. They don't want _their_ cars dented or scratched with high velocity balls. They don't want _their_ pretty flowers in _their_ front gardens trampled on. They want to be able to sit in their front living room and watch the news etc. in peace after their evening meal, without _their_ front windows and doors sounding like the walls of a squash court. So they send them out to play outside your house, to damage your property.

The thing is, you can't speak to these kind of kids, who actually come from parents, who don't even have respect for other peoples property. The message is never taught to them in the first place. And if the parent don't get it then neither will they.

All the Gardai will do, is tell them to move on. But that's fine until the next evening, when it's the same thing all over again. You probably need to move as that is no situation to live in, plus who in their right mind would want to live beside people like this for the rest of their days. And that is no disrespect to you or your wife. However, in the meantime, might I suggest the erection of a CCTV angled to protect your property. You must display a notice that there is a surveillance camera in operation for the purposes of personal protection. Then draw their attention to it and tell them that should they damage your property you will have evidence and will sue them for criminal damage. Might help. Might not. Hope it does. At least when they say in future "oh well it wasn't my little angel, he/she is a good boy/girl and wouldn't do that", you can say "well, hey, guess what, I have the evidence, dispute that!!


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## Jaid79

musicfan said:


> If you read this thread in full, its about the nuisance that kids are continually playing football against end walls, garden walls, cars, etc etc etc despite being asked not too. Is disrespecting other people and their properties in this way one of the 'social skills' that you learned while you were younger?????? I think we could do with a few less adults / kids with social skills like this in the world.
> 
> When I was younger, I was brought up to respect other people adults and their properties and would not have dreamed of being a nuisance to other people. And my parents would not have allowed me to be a nuisance to other people - unlike the parents of the kids being talked about in this thread!
> 
> As for the previous comment ' things are never that bad', only people who have to live with these 'children' kicking football on their property, can know that yes it can get this bad!! Im not suggesting death threats etc but it is exhausting, frustrating, stressful, annoying.


 
Point taken musicfan, I would have shown repect too and discontinued from playing football in the drive. I also knew kids back then that would be less well mannered. The way around that in almost all cases back then was aproach the kids parents. 

I have been in the same position and dealt with it, but never would I have considered beating or giving a death threat to a teenager or younger. Hence I said things are never that bad. They maybe come that bad if the person dealing with them has anger issues.

Jaid


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## Jaid79

musicfan said:


> I'd say there's a good chance that the people in this thread who say other people are overreacting, are the very ones who don't care that *their* kids are a nuisance to other people


 
You are a completey misguided in what you have said above, do you have kids? 

Jaid


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## Jaid79

TDON said:


> The bottom line is, even the parents of these kids don't want them playing outside their own house. They don't want _their_ cars dented or scratched with high velocity balls. They don't want _their_ pretty flowers in _their_ front gardens trampled on. They want to be able to sit in their front living room and watch the news etc. in peace after their evening meal, without _their_ front windows and doors sounding like the walls of a squash court. So they send them out to play outside your house, to damage your property.
> 
> The thing is, you can't speak to these kind of kids, who actually come from parents, who don't even have respect for other peoples property. The message is never taught to them in the first place. And if the parent don't get it then neither will they.
> 
> All the Gardai will do, is tell them to move on. But that's fine until the next evening, when it's the same thing all over again. You probably need to move as that is no situation to live in, plus who in their right mind would want to live beside people like this for the rest of their days. And that is no disrespect to you or your wife. However, in the meantime, might I suggest the erection of a CCTV angled to protect your property. You must display a notice that there is a surveillance camera in operation for the purposes of personal protection. Then draw their attention to it and tell them that should they damage your property you will have evidence and will sue them for criminal damage. Might help. Might not. Hope it does. At least when they say in future "oh well it wasn't my little angel, he/she is a good boy/girl and wouldn't do that", you can say "well, hey, guess what, I have the evidence, dispute that!!


 
A bit dramtic!


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## musicfan

Jaid79 said:


> musicfan said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'd say there's a good chance that the people in this thread who say other people are overreacting, are the very ones who don't care that *their* kids are a nuisance to other people quote]
> 
> You are a completey misguided in what you have said above, do you have kids?
> 
> Jaid
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Its totally irrelevant whether I have kids or not.
> 
> My point is that if you have been in the situation where kids playing football are making your life a misery, you will understand the situation and will not allow your own kids to be a nuisance to other people.
> 
> Parents should ensure that their kids are not being a nuisance to anyone else - but these parents are the ones who won't let their kids play beside their own house but will happily let them be a nuisance to other people.
> 
> As much as all parents love their own children, they should respect the fact that other people dont want to have them kicking their ball against the side of their house day in day out!
> 
> If any parents of kids playing football outside today, tomorrow or next week (and not beside their own house!) could have a think about where they are playing and if they are being a nuisance to other people and put a stop to it if they are - have respect for your neighbours!!
> 
> If you've made a decision to have kids - let them play in your garden and don't have them being a nuisance to other people who haven't had your kids!!!!  Your kids - your responsibility - not your neighbours!!!!
Click to expand...


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## aircobra19

I think its one of those situations, where if you need it explained to you, you'll never understand. 

Accept it can be incredibly stressful. But everyone should say within the law.


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## Tarquin

And


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## Bronte

I have kids and if they were using a neighbours wall/gatepost to play on I would be very angry with them but I would expect the neighbour to complain to me in the first instance because it is disrespectful to other's people property.  I've had kids playing ball in gardens and it falling into ours and the kids retrieved it either by climbing over the wall or going through our gate, have no problem with that either as I understand it's just young kids playing.  

If I had a child of whatever age kick a ball at me deliverately I'd just confiscate the ball.  End of story - let their parents call the guards on me for theft if they like.

If this didn't work I'd  call the guards as many times as it would take them to get it sorted.  

OP- why don't you take out your garden seat and sit at the driveway for a few evenings reading a book - after a few days of this they might find somewhere else to play.    Maybe you could play some classical music (or something else uncool) at the gate to drive them away, or get rid of the gates, something about your gate is obviously attracting them.


----------



## Pique318

Dunno how much they are but one of THESE might be a good investment.

Football starts, mosquito starts. football ends, mosquito ends.

Worth a look (listen) ?


----------



## BlueSpud

Jaid79 said:


> When I was a teenager, I used to have a few neighbours like you. I guess you and your ilk where there kids that stayed inside watching TV and not out side playing and learning social skills..


 

That's a cheap and nasty assumption about the TV, for all you know their kids are kicking football in a FIELD.

Anyway, since when did continuing to kick a ball against a neighbours house, despite being repeatedly asked not to, constitute _learning social skills_? More like _learning *anti-*social skills_.

You seem to have a lot of empathy for these kids, did/do you harass your neighbours like this?


----------



## musicfan

Bronte said:


> I have kids and if they were using a neighbours wall/gatepost to play on I would be very angry with them but I would expect the neighbour to complain to me in the first instance because it is disrespectful to other's people property. I've had kids playing ball in gardens and it falling into ours and the kids retrieved it either by climbing over the wall or going through our gate, have no problem with that either as I understand it's just young kids playing.


 
Unfortunately not all parents would be angry with their kids - like you say, you can understand its just young kids playing. Which is fine, if you don't mind kids using your walls / gates as goalposts.

A lot of other people can understand its young kids playing as well but don't want other peoples kids playing against their wall - especially when their parents don't want them kicking ball against their own walls!!! Parents should see other peoples point of view!!!


----------



## Goggin

_"When I was a teenager, I used to have a few neighbours like you. I guess you and your ilk where there kids that stayed inside watching TV and not out side playing and learning social skills.."_

Having deciphered your assumption about me Jaid I can only say it is unhelpful.

Whether I have kids or not is irrelevant. I'm young enough to remember that as a child if it was pointed out to me that I was annoying somebody I would would have stopped pronto.To repeatedly return to an area that I have been asked to stay away from would not have entered my mind - particularly if somebody was getting upset by it. My parents would have been down on me like a ton of bricks too.

As a regular person, without the need for anger management classes, I think it would be fairly normal human behaviour to get annoyed if somebody repeatedly did something that you asked them not to do. This does not mean that I am in any way condoning or suggesting violence of any kind. It is up to everybody to stay within the law and to control their emotions.

Unfortunately if the complaints are only coming from one house it is very easy to be branded as "moaners". For the OP - is there any chance you could get some other neighbours involved/on your side to talk to the kids? It worked for the main part in our situation.


----------



## Paulone

It is annoying. I lived in an area with on-street parking only, and the cul-de-sac was popular with a group of student soccer players living round the corner. The car has several scratched-in soccerball scuffs on the doors, roof and bonnet. Not a thing that can be done - although in the greater scheme of things, its not really of much consequence.

Your house must be particularly attractive to these teenagers - maybe the gate posts were ideally situated. I'd say the actions of the lady of the house will not have helped as the teens would probably enjoy provoking that sort of reaction again.

If the ball comes into your garden and you can get hold of it before they do, you can offer it back only on condition they don't use your gateposts again, or warn them that if balls keep coming in and hitting the porch, you'll start keeping the balls after the third strike - leave the glass open and remove breakables to allow the balls in and keep an eye out to run for the balls before they do. The minute that they cause tangible damage, such as dents in the car, broken glass or destroyed plants or pots, then you can demand that they make good the damage - you can use the camera on most mobiles to record their activities from the window for the purpose of proof.

If you have a set of gates, make a point of keeping them closed. If the gates are too low, consider having a higher set fitted. If the odd scuff mark on the car doesn't worry you, block the drive by parking the car right across the front of it. Gateposts as goalposts arent much use when they can't be got at.

Try and get it into perspective too. I don't believe its illegal for someone to retrieve a ball from your garden, particularly if there is no obstacle to their entering. No one has a 'right' to the pavement or roadway outside their house because they are owned by everyone.

Talk to your neighbours on both sides too - maybe they have had problems as well and any approach can be taken in coordination between the three of you.

There's been a lot of talk about parents of teenagers not taking responsibility, but when faced with irrefutable evidence or a Gard knocking on the door, even the most toughened 'my son's an angel' parent will find it hard to deny there's a problem.


----------



## TDON

Jaid79 said:


> A bit dramtic!


 
When you are dealing with people, that are of the opinion, that its ok for this to happen to you and your property & you are thus left, with not one, single, solitary, other alternative, it is *not *in the least.


----------



## TDON

aircobra19 said:


> I think its one of those situations, where if you need it explained to you, you'll never understand.
> 
> Accept it can be incredibly stressful. But everyone should say within the law.


 
Hear! Hear!


----------



## carpedeum

A lot of these comments are getting out of hand. There are also broader issues to be taken into account.

I live on an estate in Swords, County Dublin. I would never allow my children to use someone else's gate pillars or posts as goalposts. However, I do let them use our own driveway. Other parents of other kids also allow their driveways to be used. The only stipulation is that they don't play near the other neighbours' cars and that they (we parents!) will be liable for damage done to other neighbour's cars and houses. 

What I do find extraordinary is that certain neighbours even object to kids kicking a ball outide the kids own houses! They also object to them using the green spaces for football, hurling, cricket etc all because a couple of neighbours have taken a decision to plant daffodils on this green space! When I was growing up, it was accepted that the "greens" on Dublin housing estates were used for football etc.

One neighbour who bullies the kids sees no problem in his dog, sometimes wandering the cul de sac without a lead, soiling the footpaths and gardens where children of all ages play. He also uses foul language and issues physical threats when giving out to children. 

An increasing amount of people (most don't have any children or are investor landlords) don't want children playing on paths and roads or on green spaces anymore. This decrease in physical activity is contributing to the deterioration of child health, childhood obesity and social behaviour problems.

Play is an important element of childhood.

Some of the newer housing estates in Swords, e.g. Waterside on the Malahide-Swords Road and Holywell in Kinsealy have few play areas for children and are dominated by car parking. A contributory factor may be the lack of front gardens, more compact houses and the narrower roads. Foxwood residents on Drynam Road, similar to what is happening on other estates in Dublin, have been campaigning against plans to build more houses on long established green spaces! 

Is childhood to be spent looking at TV or in boxrooms in front of Playstations and XBoxes?


----------



## musicfan

I think a lot of the posters on this thread have absolutely no problem with kids playing football in their own gardens or on the public green areas in estates where there is room to play football without damaging other people's properties.

I for one object to kids (from the estate accross the road from me) who play football in the very tiny green area right beside my house and repeatedly kick their ball up against the wall of my house/windows and into my back garden.  

These kids have a much larger green area in their own estate which is not beside any houses.  Presumably their parents don't like them playing there and do not see my point of view when I have objected to them playing there in the past. 

I agree that kids shouldn't spend their childhoods on front of the TV etc but if there are no suitable green areas in estates for kids to play, this is not sufficient reason to damage and disrespect other peoples properties in the estate who may or may not have kids of their own.

If someone has bought or rented a property in an estate, surely they have the right to peace and quiet in their own house and not have other kids making their life a misery.............


----------



## RainyDay

carpedeum said:


> One neighbour who bullies the kids sees no problem in his dog, sometimes wandering the cul de sac without a lead, soiling the footpaths and gardens where children of all ages play.


Call the dog warden at your local authority.


----------



## aircobra19

carpedeum said:


> ....
> An increasing amount of people (most don't have any children or are investor landlords) don't want children playing on paths and roads or on green spaces anymore. ....



Is playing on roads healthy for kids?


----------



## tinkerbell

We have much the same here too.  We live in a small cul de sac with a good sized green in between the road thats next to ours.   The people at the green end are always out ordering the kids to play outside their own houses or at the entry to the cul de sac, which leads on to a busy main road - the green being the safest option from every angle.   They don't want the balls hitting off their garden walls and damaging the paint!  Bit daft I think because there is thick shrubbery between.   Even apart from football, they don't want the kids playing there at all - yet late at night the gangs with cider, etc. arrive and find it a good hiding place.  Yet same people won't call the gardai - us further down end up doing that!  People can be very odd?


----------



## triplex

_in respectable society we are all entitled to live as we please, AS LONG AS we don't intrude on the privacy of someone else and their enjoyment of their own home._

Carpenter,  you ummed up in a nutshell - anybody that doesn't agree, i hope you're soon subject to same kind of thing as OP - then'll you'll change your tune..

plonkers!


----------



## Crazychick

Get some thick, dirty, greasy oil and smear it all over the gates.  The ball will be covered in it, and so will their clothes.  Should do the trick.


----------



## miselemeas

A friend of mine had a similar problem and informed the guys quietly that if they continued playing ball in front of his house he would go immediately to their school (bluffed that he knew where they attended) and report them to the Principal. It worked! I think sometimes they are more scared of being hauled over the coals at school than by their parents.


----------



## wheels

Crazychick said:


> Get some thick, dirty, greasy oil and smear it all over the gates.  The ball will be covered in it, and so will their clothes.  Should do the trick.



As daft as it sounds I think that's a great idea. They are annoying you so annoy them or at least their parents in a non treathening way. If anything it'll give you a laugh.


----------



## Guest112

Having read quickly through this thread,Its obvious that some of you are obsessed with these ball kickers. Why on earth would anyone sign up for estate living if you cant get along with your neighbours, old and young.
Shouldn't that be the biggest priority not some shaggin piece of 07 metal in your driveway.

When I was young we had a fabulous goal post at the gates of a neighbours house ( a district Justice) Every so often the lovely old gent would come out and apologise that he had to interrupt the game as he needed to reverse the car out. No problems what so ever, not with him, not with anyone. Just kids growing up, hanging out, kicking ball.

My own conclusion is that people nowadays are venting right left and centre, blowing fuses for the slightest thing that encroaches on their perfect world, their perfect houses and their perfect shining cars. Have we really become this nation of highly stressed materialistic, "me me" people. Its absolutely disgusting.


----------



## z103

> Why on earth would anyone sign up for estate living if you cant get along with your neighbours, old and young.
> Shouldn't that be the biggest priority not some shaggin piece of 07 metal in your driveway.



You're making a lot of assumptions there. Many people can't afford a house in the country, and live in estates because they have to. 

I drive a 10 year old car, but I still like to take care of it because I worked hard for it. Even if I was into cars why can't my piece of 07 metal be my biggest priority? Why should I have to put up with people damaging it?


----------



## Guest112

Leghorn my friend, Just remember that somethings in life are free and giving is more satisfying than receiving.................

Dont squander all your living days measuring everything in terms of affordability. Concentrate on value, not price.


----------



## z103

> Leghorn my friend, Just remember that somethings in life are free and giving is more satisfying than receiving.................
> 
> Dont squander all your living days measuring everything in terms of affordability. Concentrate on value, not price.



What has that got to do with the price of fish oh wonderous oracle? - This thread is about kids kicking footballs off of other people's property.

"Love thy neighbour as thyself" springs to mind.


----------



## Nige

Maybe I'm missing something, but why doesn't the OP just close their gates?


----------



## musicfan

APHRODITE said:


> Why on earth would anyone sign up for estate living if you cant get along with your neighbours, old and young.
> Shouldn't that be the biggest priority not some shaggin piece of 07 metal in your driveway.
> 
> My own conclusion is that people nowadays are venting right left and centre, blowing fuses for the slightest thing that encroaches on their perfect world, their perfect houses and their perfect shining cars. Have we really become this nation of highly stressed materialistic, "me me" people. Its absolutely disgusting.


 

There is a huge difference between getting on with your neighours and allowing other peoples 'darling' kids to wreck your property!!!!

And if somebody is working hard to pay for that piece of '07 metal in your driveway' or to pay off a huge mortage of course they are entitled to treat this as their priority!  I have paid for my car and my property with my hard earned money so why should I allow other people's kids to destroy it??????  Particularly when these kids are only playing football beside my house because their parents don't want their own '07 metal in their own driveway and their house wrecked by their own kids...............


----------



## Marie

TTV said:


> eh, if you mean the stabbing by the two 16 year olds then I actually wrote that...and what did you say to the kids to provoke them? Anyway where are we going on here? Have these kids threathened anyone? Did they dent a car? Did anyone say anything about windows? No they ..use a gate as a goalpost.
> 
> My advice, get them some nets and maybe even jerseys...a bit of positivity might calm down all the violent tendancies floating around...I guarantee alot of the posters here will run into greater difficulty when their teenage child gets into something more serious...and to think of it, imagine how you would feel if they were your children, kicking a ball in an estate and being threatened with death or the potential of fully grown men actually going to hunt them down and tackle them?
> 
> Alot of ye seem well out of touch with the youth of today...


 
No - I don't think the posters here who have had difficulties with neighbouring childrens' behaviour are 'out of touch with the youth of today'.  Perhaps those defending 'the youth of today' haven't really picked up the seriousness of the situation.  Three youngsters who live at the end of my road kick their ball against a high wall adjacent to my house.  When it gets caught in the branches of the trees behind the wall they throw sticks and branches up to dislodge it, or bring out their mountain-bikes and prop them against the wall, then stand on each other's shoulders to reach it.........above my new car.  Incidentally this is a one-way system with a 45degree hill leading up to my house whichi s on a sharp bend so motorists coming round are faced with these three boys in the middle of the road.  When my chest-pains from the stress and anger got to frightening proportions by last Sunday afternoon I went out, went up to them and very politely and quietly pointed out the danger they were putting themselves in, the concern I had about my car, the potential source of accident to approaching motorists.  I got jeered at, one of the boys actually turning his back pointedly and bouncing the ball on the ground to drown out what I was saying.  I tried to engage the youngest boy, reminding him there was a large, safe park with goal-posts 5 minutes walk away.  I got more jeers.  I phoned the police who wearily said they would try to release someone to send them out to 'have a look at the situation'.

A neighbour's Lexus was badly scratched along the side recently by these kids scraping along it with their mountain bikes and skateboards.  He went to the parents who ridiculed him on the grounds they were 'only children'.

And yes - we have all been children, and all started out self-centred and thinking only of what we wanted and ourselves.............until we were trained and educated by parents and teachers and by the values of the surrounding society to be aware of the presence and rights of others which must be respected.  That certainly has changed.  My Lexus-owning neighbour is planning to move to a more rural location where he can garage his car; a friend who went through the 'football on the street' torture for years has actually sold up and moved to another (less lawless!) city.  I am strongly considering it, though in every other way where I live suits me fine.  One of my lasting childhood memories is of my grandmother who was a gifted gardner, who after three warnings to the local kids who kicked their ball into the garden and damaged her creation came out with a scissors, held the ball aloft and punctured it firmly before throwing it contemptuously back amongst them.  Unfortunately this clear, clean, direct dealing with children is no longer possible because of the muddled thinking and values which now pass for 'childrearing' and 'love'.   Pah!!


----------



## Marie

APHRODITE said:


> Having read quickly through this thread,Its obvious that some of you are obsessed with these ball kickers. Why on earth would anyone sign up for estate living if you cant get along with your neighbours, old and young.
> Shouldn't that be the biggest priority not some shaggin piece of 07 metal in your driveway.
> 
> When I was young we had a fabulous goal post at the gates of a neighbours house ( a district Justice) Every so often the lovely old gent would come out and apologise that he had to interrupt the game as he needed to reverse the car out. No problems what so ever, not with him, not with anyone. Just kids growing up, hanging out, kicking ball.
> 
> My own conclusion is that people nowadays are venting right left and centre, blowing fuses for the slightest thing that encroaches on their perfect world, their perfect houses and their perfect shining cars. Have we really become this nation of highly stressed materialistic, "me me" people. Its absolutely disgusting.


 
This makes me very, very angry!  I work extremely hard in a stressfull job in public-sector psychiatric services.  The hospital I work in is 16 miles from my home and there is no direct public transport.  I need my car to see my patients.  I also need peace in my domestic environment in order to be able to fulfil my social role.  This thread is getting wilder and wilder.  Dragging in red herrings like 'lack of green areas' and recommending to people whose peaceful occupancy of their homes are being destroyed by CHILDREN that they cover their environment with diesel, move, buy devices that destroy the hearing of those around them, knock down their walls, leave their doors open, concrete over their flower-beds etc., etc., is _extraordinary_!  No! No! No!  The CHILDREN must STOP!


----------



## Marie

...........and the children are breaking the law of the land.  It is _illegal _to play football on the public highway.


----------



## SarahMc

I am involved in a project which sought to preserve and encourage traditional street games for children and young people.  There are huge advantages for children both physically and socially.

I find the suggestion that children be confined to playing in their own gardens incredibly sad.  Children have been playing together in communal spaces for generations.  The only difference now is the prevalence of cars, so I suppose it depends on your value system. 

I find this whole thread depressing.  And yes, I'm also a mother, and although not the mother of kick the kerb playing teenagers, I suspect the chalk from the hopscotch could be offensive to some posters on here!


----------



## z103

> I find the suggestion that children be confined to playing in their own gardens incredibly sad. Children have been playing together in communal spaces for generations. The only difference now is the prevalence of cars, so I suppose it depends on your value system.



Where was that suggestion made?
Ireland is full of parks and open spaces that can be used.



> I am involved in a project which sought to preserve and encourage traditional street games for children and young people.


You're _encouraging_ children to play on the street? FFS.


----------



## Teapot

It could be that parents are not always available to take children to a park also it is very unsafe to let them go there alone.  Therefore, the children are probably kicking a ball around near to their homes where an eye can keep on them.  As for cars getting scratched this is unfortunate but is there evidence that the same children that are playing ball near the cars are doing it.   

  I would rather have my children playing ball outside my gate instead of them to be somewhere that I cannot keep an eye on them.  It is a shame that there is zero tolerance with young people for just having an innocent game of ball outside their homes.  It make me wonder about the people that complaining where did their children play, or are allowed to go to the park on their own.


----------



## z103

> I would rather have my children playing ball outside my gate instead of them to be somewhere that I cannot keep an eye on them.


Unless you are constantly watching your children, I don't think you are really keeping an eye on them. Nonces will show up where kids are to be found.


----------



## SarahMc

> Where was that suggestion made?


 
Here



> If you've made a decision to have kids - let them play in your garden and don't have them being a nuisance to other people who haven't had your kids!!!!


 


> You're _encouraging_ children to play on the street? FFS.


 
Yes, and never once in wide ranging consultation with resident's associations, community groups  etc. did anyone express concern or negativity.  In fact the most helpful both in terms of contributions and encouragement were active retirement groups and older people.

Maybe because they played outside as children and brought their own children up to play outside/ are less likely to have cars / not be stressed from working all day / have a greater sense of community.

And folks, if you are worried about children playing ball outside your house, wait 'til parkour hits your estate, you'll be buying balls in bulk and foisting them upon your neighbours children!


----------



## z103

I find it most disheartening that there are people who do not see a problem with allowing their children to cause such anguish to others. People that allow and indeed encourage children to commit illegal, anti-social acts. Selfishly impinging on other people's lives.

Other people certainly are hell, and I'm so glad that that episode in my life is behind me.

Well there's nothing really more I can add to this discussion.


----------



## aircobra19

SarahMc said:


> I am involved in a project which sought to preserve and encourage traditional street games for children and young people.  There are huge advantages for children both physically and socially....



If they avoid the cars and survive.


----------



## Marie

Well this has been enlightening as to where today's 'children's'  destructiveness, arrogance, contempt of anything outside their own narcissistic desires and sheer stupidity come from!  

Yesterday evening when the lads got out on the street with their ball I decided that this time, instead of moving my car to a safer place - which on Saturday evening in the town centre might be a couple of miles! - I would take the advice given on this forum.  I brought out my chair, my newspaper and my mobile.  They entertained themselves with loud 'music' from their mobiles and thump! thump! thump! went the ball against the wall about two or three feet in front of my parked vehicle.  The ball repeatedly hit the car - the front windscreen, the bonnet, the right-hand mirror.  I caught it all on my mobile.  

After a time the ring-leader appeared to find his abusive running commentary on myself, and his attacks on my vehicle, insufficient and began to kick the ball hard and repeatedly straight into the face of a mate who was not kicking ball but was eating take-away fish-and-chips leaning against my wall.  

Anyone who thinks it is OK for kids to live and eat and 'relate' (!?) in the streets of today's cities and towns are naive in the extreme.  Children - particularly pre-pubescent boys - need  support, guidance and boundaries and structure for their energy.  Those  who abrogate responsibility  saddle the rest of the community (including those of us whose property or person comes in the way of these unfortunate ferral children) with the consequences of that neglect.


----------



## Marie

leno said:


> I agree fully with SarahMc. Most of us very hard in order to buy our homes and have our fancy 07 cars, or whatever, but it is very disheartening to read that so many 'not-in-my-back-yard' people basically begrudge children from kicking a ball outside their gates. This country will probably be beset by an obesity epidemic in years to come, much of which is related to the lack of outdoor pursuits for children.
> 
> I would have thought that most people understand that the kids kicking ball on the street (which is almost always in an estate by the way, and not on a major road) are typically well-adjusted individuals who will grow up reasonably fit and healthy and will buy homes and cars of their own which might occasionally get hit by a stray ball. Big deal !!!!
> 
> I'm sure most of the posters who oppose street football were dancing in the streets during Italia '90 and USA '94, so the fact that they have such a problem with spontaneous games of ball is rather hypocritical. Kids don't always have a suitable green space nearby, and many such spaces (where they do exist) are fairly forbidding in winter, being typically soaked wet/overgrown/badly lit.
> 
> So lay off on the kids. Most of them are probably decent young people who, although they occasionally hit OUR cars, or OUR windows, are just growing up and do not - in general - mean any real harm ...


 
That beautifully captures the adult apathy that is creating a lost generation.  Vote-carrying, tax-paying adults accept lack of proper amenity for their childrens' safety and development in the form of absence of sports- and leisure-centres, parks and recreation-grounds and settle instead for the kids tormenting the local populace to the point of anguish and/or moving home.  There's a model to give a child on how to engage with their world!

Incidentally the situation in question is _not _an estate (where incidentally I consider it is equally unacceptable!)  This ball-playing takes place in a street in the middle of a large town, on a busy one-way system at the top of the 45degree hill with a SHARP LEFT BEND  where drivers have to break, swerve and slow suddenly as they come suddenly upon these young footballers, putting them and their passengers and passing pedestrians at risk.


----------



## aircobra19

leno said:


> I agree fully with SarahMc.  Most of us very hard in order to buy our homes and have our fancy 07 cars, or whatever, but it is very disheartening to read that so many 'not-in-my-back-yard' people basically begrudge children from kicking a ball outside their gates. This country will probably be beset by an obesity epidemic in years to come, much of which is related to the lack of outdoor pursuits for children.
> 
> I would have thought that most people understand that the kids kicking ball on the street (which is almost always in an estate by the way, and not on a major road) are typically well-adjusted individuals who will grow up reasonably fit and healthy and will buy homes and cars of their own which might occasionally get hit by a stray ball. Big deal !!!!
> 
> I'm sure most of the posters who oppose street football were dancing in the streets during Italia '90 and USA '94, so the fact that they have such a problem with spontaneous games of ball is rather hypocritical. Kids don't always have a suitable green space nearby, and many such spaces (where they do exist) are fairly forbidding in winter, being typically soaked wet/overgrown/badly lit.
> 
> So lay off on the kids. Most of them are probably decent young people who, although they occasionally hit OUR cars, or OUR windows, are just growing up and do not - in general - mean any real harm ...



Your making light of a problem that nothing to do with money, or childrens health. Its about respecting other people and not making their life a misery. Letting your kids torment your neighbours because you are too lazy to make an effort yourself is the cause of the problem.


----------



## Teapot

Why not have a word with your community police and let them know what is going on also tell them the time that the ball playing is taking place as well are reporting the  damage that the ball is doing to your car.   All the police have to do is make an appearance and have a word with them.  The police will also caution about damage to cars and if they are responsible for it their parents will have to pay for the repairs.



  Teapot


----------



## Gordanus

leghorn said:


> Nonces will show up where kids are to be found.



I presume by nonce you mean paedophile?  this seems outright paranoia. Only where there is no parental supervision; where a 5 yr old is left in charge of a 2 yr old.  At least in estates, parents are around - looking out windows occasionally, walking around etc.  Where there are tower blocks, blocks of flats etc, it's much harder for parents to supervise at a distance in the same way.


----------



## aircobra19

Teapot said:


> Why not have a word with your community police and let them know what is going on also tell them the time that the ball playing is taking place as well are reporting the  damage that the ball is doing to your car.   All the police have to do is make an appearance and have a word with them.  The police will also caution about damage to cars and if they are responsible for it their parents will have to pay for the repairs.
> 
> Teapot



That wasn't our experience of the  community police.


----------



## musicfan

Have read through the last few posts in this thread and am shaking my head in amazement!!

To suggest that people who don't want kids damaging their property with footballs are responsible for the childrens obesity problem in ireland is ludicrous!!! 

Its a lazy parent that will allow their kids to play football and damage people property........ Why not take the time to provide them with proper exercise or least ensure they are playing football where there is room and not damaging peoples' houses and cars etc etc. 

I'm not going to let my car and house be ruined by selfish kids / parents just so they won't get fat - thats not my problem but my house and car is!!!

I have no problem with kids playing football or hopscoth etc in COMMUNAL areas in the estate - that what the green areas are for!!  But I don't consider the end wall of my house and my car to be communal areas.  In my area, this is where the kids are playing - not on the green COMMUNAL areas!!!!

Also, if there are no suitable areas for the kids to play in your estate - why did you move there in the first place - did it not occur to you to have a look to see if there was somewhere safe and suitable for your kids to play.  Just because there is no 'suitable' playing areas for your kids doesn't mean you can use my wall and car to play football against...........


----------



## Marathon Man

Grow some pyracantha near the gate.  It may take some time to grow but will be well worth it.  The thorns/spikes will puncture the ball and they are quite painful when they pierce the skin (when retrieving the ball).  

I have several along my back wall and they have stopped people coming over from the roadway behind.   It will be 18 months/2 years before they become relatively strong but they may do the trick anyway in the meantime.


----------



## zag

For *generations* children have been playing in the streets of *every* town and city across pretty much all of Europe, and most of the entire planet.  This is of course when they were not down the mine, in the fields or in the factory.  They have also been playing in communal land, parks, waste land, etc . . .

For all this time they have also (at least some of the time) been breaking windows, damaging trees and annoying neighbours.  This is not new.

What is new is that in some/many cases when this damage is caused there is no means to resolution or remediation.  The 'grown up' no longer appears as a figure of authority, the police have no time for this, the parents don't accept responsibility.

This to me is the key difference - years ago, many parents sense of community and of right was sufficient to ensure that when they were aware of a nuisance caused by their children they would see to it that their children stopped.  Nowadays, it seems that many parents (yes, I am a parent) see attempts to give out to their children as an affront, a challenge, an insult to them and to their family.

Of course, my rose tinted glasses aren't perfect and i realise that through the generations there were kids who were never controlled, parents who didn't care, neighbours who were annoyed and 'tortured' for years but I believe this was the exception rather than the rule.

On a positive note - my father came home from holidays a few years ago to find a foot shaped dent in the roof of his car.  He was not impressed, but none the less he recognised that this did not affect the ability of his car to be driven or of the roof to keep the rain off.  A few days after he came back, a sheepish looking teenager presented at the front door with a parent in tow.  The teenager apologised, explained he had run over the top of the car as a dare and offered to pay for the damage to be fixed.  The 'brand' garage wanted to charge something like €900 to do a bit of panel beating (can we say 'Celtic Tiger' ?), but my dad just whacked it back into shape himself.  Kid learned a lesson in the practical cost (or at least the potential cost in this case), and the social cost of doing something like that and causing damage in the process.  And how idd all this come about ?  Because the parent in this case took the time and effort to recognise that the behaviour was not acceptable and correcitve action was taken.

This however, is different than the situation as described by the original poster and some recent ones where children have been advised that they are causing damage and nuisance and still persist with their behaviour.  I don't envy people in this situation.

z


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## zag

I agree with Marathon Man - grow something very spiky along the boundary.  I don't know what we have in the back garden but it may well be pyracantha as described above - we have lost countless of our own footballs to its spikes.  They go through every sort of ball that hits it.

z


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## musicfan

1234 said:


> Next time the ball lands in your driveway, just take the damm ball away from them. Problem solved!


 
Been there done that - 5 mins later they have another ball.  The loss of one football (or two or three.....) isn't enough to stop these 'darling' little monsters..............


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## TDON

If theses kids are hanging around your house, even if it is ridiculous that they would be playing on a road and all they are doing is playing hopscotch, hide & seek, comparing teachers & homework, gossping etc, how can anyone say that "people on my side of this argument" would find that offensive. 

That is not what's been talked about here. It's about kids causing damage to property, that hasn't cost them or their parents a cent and making other peoples life hell. These callous individuals are the ones causing the problem here as they have actually instigated the attack in the first place. Then they take no responsibilty for it, but why would they, when that's they way they've been brought up. The children see their parents being rude, arrogant & unsympathetic to their neighbours plight and are therefore learning by what they see. 

I have actually seen a 4 year old out on the road on her own, at 9.30 p.m. stick up the middle finger on each hand, turn and stick out her bum and go "pooooo", all the time her mother was indoors getting sozzled. The only thing I can say to myself is "they will reap what they sow"


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## musicfan

leno said:


> The world doesn't revolve around your property or your personal concerns.


 

I'm not asking for the world to revolve around my property!! However, my property is my concern as I work hard to pay for it. 

All I ask is that other parents take responsibilty for their kids and ensure that my property is not damaged by their kids. If other people are damaging my property then it is my concern - it should also be the concern of parents who are allowing their kids to cause this damage. 

Are you suggesting that I ignore damage to my property just so kids can play football??? If I go out tonight to cause damage to the property belonging to the parents of these kids then I will be held responsible and must face the consequences. Kids (and if they are too young) and their parents must be held responsible for their actions and the damage and distress that they are causing to other people and their property.


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## Marie

zag said:


> For *generations* children have been playing in the streets of *every* town and city across pretty much all of Europe, and most of the entire planet. This is of course when they were not down the mine, in the fields or in the factory. They have also been playing in communal land, parks, waste land, etc . . .
> 
> For all this time they have also (at least some of the time) been breaking windows, damaging trees and annoying neighbours. This is not new.
> 
> What is new is that in some/many cases when this damage is caused there is no means to resolution or remediation. The 'grown up' no longer appears as a figure of authority, the police have no time for this, the parents don't accept responsibility.
> 
> This to me is the key difference - years ago, many parents sense of community and of right was sufficient to ensure that when they were aware of a nuisance caused by their children they would see to it that their children stopped. Nowadays, it seems that many parents (yes, I am a parent) see attempts to give out to their children as an affront, a challenge, an insult to them and to their family.
> 
> Of course, my rose tinted glasses aren't perfect and i realise that through the generations there were kids who were never controlled, parents who didn't care, neighbours who were annoyed and 'tortured' for years but I believe this was the exception rather than the rule.
> 
> On a positive note - my father came home from holidays a few years ago to find a foot shaped dent in the roof of his car. He was not impressed, but none the less he recognised that this did not affect the ability of his car to be driven or of the roof to keep the rain off. A few days after he came back, a sheepish looking teenager presented at the front door with a parent in tow. The teenager apologised, explained he had run over the top of the car as a dare and offered to pay for the damage to be fixed. The 'brand' garage wanted to charge something like €900 to do a bit of panel beating (can we say 'Celtic Tiger' ?), but my dad just whacked it back into shape himself. Kid learned a lesson in the practical cost (or at least the potential cost in this case), and the social cost of doing something like that and causing damage in the process. And how idd all this come about ? Because the parent in this case took the time and effort to recognise that the behaviour was not acceptable and correcitve action was taken.
> 
> This however, is different than the situation as described by the original poster and some recent ones where children have been advised that they are causing damage and nuisance and still persist with their behaviour. I don't envy people in this situation.
> 
> z


 
Zag has put the point very well.  Kids have always played on the streets and got into trouble from time to time.  I grew up in Ballyfermot when it was "Bally-far-out", a satellite mega-estate at the time where there were no civic amenities. The new Leisure Centre has just arrived - 50 years after the people.......but 'sin e sceal eile'!  Our exploits were legion and we were often in trouble.  That's how we learned and changed.  Any annoyance we created for neighbours was never intentional and never (in my own case anyway!) motivated by spite. 

Kids still play 'in the streets' but apart from that everything else has changed  Shared public areas are not cared for or valued, are regarded as someone else's responsibility; adults (including police and teachers) are not respected by many children who simply don't accept authority.  Parents (even sensible thoughtful ones!)are between a rock and a hard place because the surrounding culture is one of instant gratification, irresponsibility and selfishness.  Police and other authorities can do little about childrens' behaviour because of their status as minors they are exempt from the  laws of the land as these apply to adults.  However as a number of posters have already observed, children today are far, far more sophisticated than formerly.  They (naturally!) exploit this immunity.  Bad behaviour by young people in the public space is also - as has been pointed out - now more prevalent and their responses to being challenged more deadly - see recent headlines.

This, together with parents whose idea of child-rearing stops at buying their children the latest 'must-have' as soon as it appears - from football strips to high tech - makes for bored restless confused young people who have no experience of dialogue and no conception of others or of difference.  They are shocked and angry and react with hostility and destructiveness when anything is expected of them because that has not been a factor in their socialisation.

This is not OK.  In my professional experience  narcissistic minors become dangerous teenagers and dysfunctional destructive adults.  The journey, as they say, starts with the first step and youngsters who cause distress to their neighbours are well on their way along that highway.  To suggest we all just sit back and let them practice on our persons and property for a future of antisocial greed is not responsible but unless the entire community puts reasonable standards of behaviour in place, and enforces them, individuals who try to stand against it alone are ****ing into the wind.


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## Marie

1234 said:


> Next time the ball lands in your driveway, just take the damm ball away from them. Problem solved!


 
Part of the problem - and something I think needs to be reviewed - is that children are not subject to the rigours of law in the same way as adults.  These children kicking ball in the street are minors and not liable for damage they cause and the process of transferring liability to parents in the legal system is patchy.  However as an adult I am liable for anything I do to them or their property.  There are strict limits limiting what adults can do vis-a-vis children in public places - whatever they are doing to our property or cars - and still be within the law.  This is the anomoly and the problem.


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## Guest112

Such a mountain out of such a little molehill ......................


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## Goggin

APHRODITE said:


> Such a mountain out of such a little molehill ......................


 
Oh how I would love to put you in a situation like this for 12 months to see if your molehill grew into a mountain


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## musicfan

Hear hear!!!!

People who make comments like this have either never been in this situation or else see absolutely no problem with their kids damaging other peoples properties.

Its parents with this attitude that make it impossible for situations like this to be resolved - they see no problem with their kids damaging other peoples houses and cars..............


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## Summer

There is nothing new about this old chestnut. For decades kids have played football on the roads in Dublin. Most families choose to live in estates so their children will have friends and the roads will not have as much traffic, cul de sacs being a particular favourite. Marie I do not know what age you are but I do remember Ballyfermot being a no go area in Dublin with skinhead gangs. Because the cost of houses has increased does not necessarily mean that some areas have improved.  Could this be the cause of the problem? The original poster did say the 15 year old lived across the road.


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## Marie

Summer What point you are making, in response to which aspect of the subject under discussion?  People don't appear to be reading this thread very carefully so I will recap briefly.  This is my last post on the subject as I've said all I want to say and heard enough.  

The original poster asked for advice and response on the stressful situation his family lives under where antisocial behaviour by children/young people in the environment are creating stress.  His wife - who is there all day - is particularly affected.

Myself and a number of other respondents to the thread  are in the same position.  In addition we are having our property damaged.

Suggestions on how to deal with activities of young people in public which impact on those around them ranged from moving home, buying and installing CCTV, building walls higher, sitting outside monitoring the young peoples' behaviour, getting the police, informing parents, confiscating the football, threatening to inform schoolteachers, growing pyracanthus hedges, getting someone big and wild and hairy to scare the s**t out of them.

So far so good.  However in the experience of those adults amongst us who have encountered these situations these strategies rarely work, singly or collectively.  We then tried, collectively, to understand and contextualise how this situation - of adults being intimidated by children - had come about.

The answer emerged from the attitudes of a large number of respondents on this thread.  These criticise those experiencing the intimidation as ridiculous and support the child perpetrators as harmless.  This is (as you will confirm by re-reading the thread)  _precisely _what the parents of these destructive illmannered children say when their children's activities are brought to their attention.

OK?


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## carpedeum

Just purchased a set of full size plastic goalposts from Smyths that fit perfectly between the pillars in my driveway, allowing my 9 and 10 year olds play in front of our house. They work a treat! One bonus is that our cars are safely protected in our driveway behind the nets which can easily be dragged aside should we want to go out! Other neighbours on our estate, including two neighbours opposite, are going to do the same. 

The extra bonus is that they can be transported by the youngest of children and assembled on the communal green spaces too... when the same people who object to kids playing on the green are at work! 

People (most have no kids) at the other end of the cul de sac are still complaining... mostly because they have to slow down when entering the cul de sac! What must these people be like to work with!



Spread the news! An Irish solution to an Irish problem!


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## vontrapp

Interesting thread this one and I can see both sides. We vontrapps have been subject to this for a year or more and to describe it as annoying is putting it mildly. We have had our porch window broken on two occasions which cost us €120 each time to have fixed. On both occasions we didn't know who did it but the fathers of the kids involved turned up within a few days having found out about it and offered to pay for the damage. I refused on the grounds that we hope to have kids one day ourselves and I could be on the other end of it. Plus it leaves the responsible parents on the hook should it happen again. Both times we were dropped in a bottle of wine for the inconvenience. We are lucky in that our neighbours did something about it once something happened.

However, when inevitably it restarts again the football does not happen outside the houses that these kids live in. The attitude of these parents is they'll buy off any inconvenience as long as the annoyance isn't in their own front yard.

Myself and the neighbours either side of me had a chat about it in the front garden one evening and we agreed that whenever it kicked off we'd all be out to tell them to clear off. Problem solved within a matter of weeks. To the original poster I suggest speaking with your other neighbours who no doubt are just as annoyed, and tackle it as a group.

But remember -- these are kids and they'll be back in a few weeks. Don't take it personally and don't think that getting angrier than you did last time will be more effective. If you measure your response on a scale of 1 to 5, you need to respond with a 1 or 2 each time, not 1 then 2 then 3 etc.

By the way there is a green area where the lads can play but they prefer tarmac "cos the ball bounces up better". I used to slag them and say "you think Steve Gerrard practices on tarmac?". Cue slagging and a move to the grass.


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## CCOVICH

vontrapp said:


> We have had our porch window broken on two occasions which cost us €120 each time to have fixed. On both occasions we didn't know who did it but the fathers of the kids involved turned up within a few days having found out about it and offered to pay for the damage.


 
Fair play to them, and to you.  Glass in our front door was broken last year and it cost around €250 to get fixed.  Noboby came forward unfortunately.


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## musicfan

> Why the big issue over a game of ball????????


 
Some posters are missing the point here. There is no issue over a game of ball - the issue is when this ball causes DAMAGE.

I know kids - play thats what they do but last time I looked in the dictionary the explanation for playing did not include causing damage to other people's property!!!!

Unfortunately not all parents are willing to take responsibility for their kids actions.......


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## Summer

Marie said:


> Zag has put the point very well. Kids have always played on the streets and got into trouble from time to time. I grew up in Ballyfermot when it was "Bally-far-out", a satellite mega-estate at the time where there were no civic amenities. The new Leisure Centre has just arrived - 50 years after the people.......but 'sin e sceal eile'! Our exploits were legion and we were often in trouble. That's how we learned and changed. Any annoyance we created for neighbours was never intentional and never (in my own case anyway!) motivated by spite.
> 
> Kids still play 'in the streets' but apart from that everything else has changed Shared public areas are not cared for or valued, are regarded as someone else's responsibility; adults (including police and teachers) are not respected by many children who simply don't accept authority. Parents (even sensible thoughtful ones!)are between a rock and a hard place because the surrounding culture is one of instant gratification, irresponsibility and selfishness. Police and other authorities can do little about childrens' behaviour because of their status as minors they are exempt from the laws of the land as these apply to adults. However as a number of posters have already observed, children today are far, far more sophisticated than formerly. They (naturally!) exploit this immunity. Bad behaviour by young people in the public space is also - as has been pointed out - now more prevalent and their responses to being challenged more deadly - see recent headlines.
> 
> This, together with parents whose idea of child-rearing stops at buying their children the latest 'must-have' as soon as it appears - from football strips to high tech - makes for bored restless confused young people who have no experience of dialogue and no conception of others or of difference. They are shocked and angry and react with hostility and destructiveness when anything is expected of them because that has not been a factor in their socialisation.
> 
> This is not OK. In my professional experience narcissistic minors become dangerous teenagers and dysfunctional destructive adults. The journey, as they say, starts with the first step and youngsters who cause distress to their neighbours are well on their way along that highway. To suggest we all just sit back and let them practice on our persons and property for a future of antisocial greed is not responsible but unless the entire community puts reasonable standards of behaviour in place, and enforces them, individuals who try to stand against it alone are ****ing into the wind.


I replied to this point. Summer


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## TDON

carpedeum said:


> Just purchased a set of full size plastic goalposts from Smyths that fit perfectly between the pillars in my driveway, allowing my 9 and 10 year olds play in front of our house. They work a treat! One bonus is that our cars are safely protected in our driveway behind the nets which can easily be dragged aside should we want to go out! Other neighbours on our estate, including two neighbours opposite, are going to do the same.
> 
> The extra bonus is that they can be transported by the youngest of children and assembled on the communal green spaces too... when the same people who object to kids playing on the green are at work!
> 
> People (most have no kids) at the other end of the cul de sac are still complaining... mostly because they have to slow down when entering the cul de sac! What must these people be like to work with!
> 
> 
> 
> Spread the news! An Irish solution to an Irish problem!


 
If all parents did this then there wouldn't be a problem. But when they get fed up and say move that goalposts, I'm sick of it, blah! blah! , it will probably end back up across the drive of people who don't own it.


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## RobRiley

This has been mentioned before so didn't want to start a new thread.

I live in Nottingham, UK.

Kids kicking a football against the side of my house is driving me mad. The kids don't care and the council isn't interested.

How can I make it stop!?


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## mathepac

Unless you move from Nottingham to Ireland RobRiley, you are unlikely to get advice on this site, sorry.


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## Sue Ellen

mathepac said:


> Unless you move from Nottingham to Ireland RobRiley, you are unlikely to get advice on this site, sorry.



Wouldn't agree.  

OP have you tried contacting your Community Liaison Officer/Community Police Officer or Residents' Association to see if they can help?


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## Purple

Sue Ellen said:


> Wouldn't agree.
> 
> OP have you tried contacting your Community Liaison Officer/Community Police Officer or Residents' Association to see if they can help?



or the Sheriff.
.
.
.
.
soory, I couldn't resist.


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## liaconn

I sympathise. I know how tortuous that kind of carry on can be. We have a problem with teenage skateboarders clattering and banging on the path and steps outside our apartment block. The noise would make you want to scream after about ten minutes. When a few of us raised it on our neighbourhood forum, we had a couple of people who live nowhere near where the problem occurs telling us 'ah shure it's only kids playing' and 'isn't it lovely to see them out doing something healthy instead of damaging propery' etc etc. It's amazing how 'tolerant' some people are on other people's behalf.


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## David_Dublin

Could you open the gate? Or are they kicking into an open gate? I think talking to the parents has to be a first step.


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## AlbacoreA

carpedeum said:


> Just purchased a set of full size plastic goalposts from Smyths that fit perfectly between the pillars in my driveway, allowing my 9 and 10 year olds play in front of our house. They work a treat! One bonus is that our cars are safely protected in our driveway behind the nets which can easily be dragged aside should we want to go out! Other neighbours on our estate, including two neighbours opposite, are going to do the same.
> 
> The extra bonus is that they can be transported by the youngest of children and assembled on the communal green spaces too... when the same people who object to kids playing on the green are at work!
> 
> People (most have no kids) at the other end of the cul de sac are still complaining... mostly because they have to slow down when entering the cul de sac! What must these people be like to work with!
> 
> 
> 
> Spread the news! An Irish solution to an Irish problem!



By protecting your own cars you acknowledge its an issue but its ok to encourage them to play on the roads once yours are protected? Thats some solution.


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## landlords

Unbelievable


----------

