# Wireless home audio system



## carraig king (23 Jan 2006)

I will be moving into a new house in the coming months and wish to install a wireless multi-room audio/video system. The main one I have come across is the Philips Streamium model. Has anyone used this product, or can anyone advise me of other suitable products etc.


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## MonsieurBond (23 Jan 2006)

carraig king said:
			
		

> I will be moving into a new house in the coming months and wish to install a wireless multi-room audio/video system. The main one I have come across is the Philips Streamium model. Has anyone used this product, or can anyone advise me of other suitable products etc.



I haven't heard it in the flesh. It gets some generally positive reviews on the Net.

Check out the [broken link removed] as an alternative - only streams at 802.11b but is a very polished solution. Note that neither solution supports songs downloaded from Apple's iTunes Music Store.


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## Wexfordman (23 Jan 2006)

Sonos, is he way to go in my opinion. I have had a wired system for the last four years, and about 2 months ago, replaced it with the Sonos Wireless system. I also looked at the streamium, but it was too limited (only 4 zones I think). Take a look at www.sonos.com 

Wexfordman


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## DaithiMc2005 (23 Jan 2006)

A bit ignorant about all this wireless stuff to be fair......!!
Can you tell me a few things?
Does all the music have to be stored digitally on a PC?
Does that then mean the PC has to be powered up to operate the audio system?
Can you link radio into it??


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## Wexfordman (23 Jan 2006)

Daithi,

From the point of view of the Sonos system which I have. 

1) You can connect ordinary line in sources to it
2) You can connect a cd player to it etc if you want, but it would be a bit pointless
3) In order to use a music system to its fullest extent, you need to be able to pick and select your tracks for each source without having to be in front of the source if you know what I mean. Its pointless having to go back to your CD player to pick and select your tracks.
4) Following on from point three, you need a place to store all you music, like in mp3 formate or something else. There are two choices, a) a pc, which would need to be turned on, in order for you to play the music stored on it, b) a NAS, which is basically a networked hard drive for storing all your music on. Option B is best for a number of reasons.
4) The SONOS can also stream live internet radio (today fm etc) in WMA format, so no need for a standard tuner.

CD players are outdated and cumbersome. My old multiroom system used to work of different audio sources, SAT box, CD jukebox, radio tuner and DVD player, all of which I could play in any room. However, due to the face that I had no way of selecting tracks, wihtout knowing what cd number and track number they were on on my cd jukebox, the idea of multiroom was kind of killed. Having upgraded to the sonos system, all this is fixed, and I have what I would call a true multiroom system with full control and access to all my music. Have you looked at teh SONOS website ?

Wexfordman


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## Wexfordman (23 Jan 2006)

Sorry,

Sonos does not do video by the way!!! However, my solution for video is going to be windows media centre, which I think is here to stay and improve. Not sure how long life streamium will be in this regards.

Wexfordman


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## DaithiMc2005 (24 Jan 2006)

Thanks for that Wexfordman - I had a brief look at the website but I will have a better look again.
Will I find details about the NAS that you mentioned above?


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## JohnnieKippe (27 Jan 2006)

Hello WexfordMan from a fellow wexford man !

I love the look of SONOS and am moving house in a few months so i might go mad and but it. I have a few questions for you ;

1. I have my CDs on my PC in an iPod/iTunes configuration. Can Sonos be hooked up to iTunes so I get the playlists, podcasts, etc. ?

2.Can I use the speakers from my old stereos for Sonos ?

3. Where did you buy the system from ?

4. can you use speakers outside on a deck ?

thanks.


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## jalla (28 Jan 2006)

BTW, Can Media centre be easily connect with Sky + and other terestrial TV stations ?

Thanks,

J


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## Wexfordman (28 Jan 2006)

Johnnie,

Bought the system locally in Cork (I'm and ex pat!!!), O'Callaghans on Oliver Plunket st. You can buy over the net also, but no advantage, and I like the idea of having someone to go back to if something goes wrong.

As far as I know, Sonos can work off of Itunes, but I think there will be an issue with playing music you purchased through I-tunes due to copyright stuff.

You can use your old speakers no problem as long as they are the correct impedence and you are talking about the ZP100 sonso player (there is a newer cheaper ZP80 out which requres an external amp, but I dont see the point of it to be honest).

You can use speakers outside, as long as they are outdoor speakers, or else you take them in when its wet!!!. Speakers are really your own call, or you can buy the speakers sonos sells. You can get outdoor speakers that look like rocks, or how about these [broken link removed]?

Regards,
Wexfordman


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## JohnnieKippe (30 Jan 2006)

Wexfordman,

how can i find where it is sold ?

how much does it cost ?


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## Wexfordman (30 Jan 2006)

Johnnie,

 You can get it online from or via dealers at www.sonos.com  You could also get it locally if they have a dealer in wexford I am not sure. I bought mine in Cork from a shop, and got a few quid off it (I bought 6 zones and 2 controllers). I do like the idea of getting it locally rather than online as yo get to see it before you buy, and if something goes wrong you havve someone to smack!!!

   Cost, they are not cheap, but for what you get, and comparing it to any other similar product around the place (I have done a lot of research on it, and this is my second multiroom system after my first got fizzled in a lighning strike), you will not get better, either in the product or for the value it is.

  Its about 1500 yoyo for two zones and one controller as a package, and you can get mix and match deals too. Have a look at www.sonos.com

The great thing about the system is its expandable, you can start off with one or two rooms and work your way up. My last system was a wired one with six zones, six sources, and wall mounted keypads. The main unit got fried with lighting, effectively knocking the whole this out. If this happened with sonos, because they are modular, you wont lose the whole system.. Thanks to the insurance co, they covered the cost of my sonos system. If you want details of where I got it in Cork, let me know.

Regards,
Wexfordman


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## JohnnieKippe (30 Jan 2006)

Thanks for the info WexfordMan. I live in Dublin now (ex-pat aswell) and rang a few of the dealers from the sonos website today to enquire about prices but not much luck. they all said they dont do it or they'll ring me back with prices. I think I want a 4 zone setup (maybe start with 2) which I guess will set me back around 3K. Its a lot of money , but I've started to justify it to my wife by saying 'well, compared to the price of the new house, its not much, yet it will change a bog standard house into a cool state of the art house'.


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## MonsieurBond (31 Jan 2006)

JohnnieKippe said:
			
		

> Thanks for the info WexfordMan. I live in Dublin now (ex-pat aswell) and rang a few of the dealers from the sonos website today to enquire about prices but not much luck. they all said they dont do it or they'll ring me back with prices. I think I want a 4 zone setup (maybe start with 2) which I guess will set me back around 3K. Its a lot of money , but I've started to justify it to my wife by saying 'well, compared to the price of the new house, its not much, yet it will change a bog standard house into a cool state of the art house'.


The [broken link removed] might be a cheaper solution than Sonos, although without the album art. It likewise does not stream video.

Update: Oops - I see that this already been suggested in this thread... by me!

However, I see that Sonos now support Apple Lossless Encoding, which provides better sound quality at the expense of requiring larger file sizes. I personally am not mad on streaming 128kbps files around - they sound great on an iPod but not so good on big speakers on a serious hi-fi unit. So called "detail expansion" systems to resurrect lost data sounds like a poor alternative to me.

Roku [broken link removed] lossless codecs this unless you have a separate server e.g. the Slimserver. Mind you, if you're going that route, you should also consider the Squeezebox coupled with the Slimserver, since they are from the same people. Note that the Roku Soundbridge only supports 802.11b which is slower. (Good hi-fi orientated review of Roku here.)

However, overall, the Roku or Squeezebox approach strikes me as a cheaper and easier way to get into the whole audio streaming idea, to see if it works for you in your environment, suits your lifestyle etc., rather then sinking lots of money into a Sonos system which requires a separate device to fit into your hi-fi. 

The Philips Streamium has the same all-or-nothing approach which I don't like. I like the idea of a modular solution.

(I see that Sonos have a forthcoming product - the  - which is cheaper and designed to integrate into an existing hi-fi. This might be interesting to listen to when it comes out. Good review of the Sonos kit here.)

I am sure that Roku upgrades to 802.11g or even n will come in the future, and who knows, maybe even a software upgrade to allow protected AAC files (i.e. files downloaded from the iTunes Music Store) to be played!

If only there was a decent LCD remote for the Apple Airport system, then it would be a good choice too, for building a system in a modular fashion.


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## Wexfordman (31 Jan 2006)

First off, opologies if I sound over protective about my little sonos. Sonos is one of the only products I can honestly say, I will defend to the death!!

The difference as far as I can see with Sonos and Roku etc are, first and foremost, the user interface, which is exceptional. It does to the multiroom systems what Ipod did to mp3 players, and you will see the obvious similarities.

The second difference, and this is an exclusive as far as I know, is the ability of sonus to synchronise zones, which rokus does not do. That is you can play one track in all zones, and it will be synchronised. This is a very important feature when looking at multiroom systems, as otherwhise all you may as well put in a seperate cd player/tuner in all your rooms.

Not sure what you mean by sonos requiring a seperate device to plug into your hifi Bond ? Can you explain ? The only thing Sonos needs with the ZP100 is a set of speakers ? Both systems do require a centralised source (in the case of Sonos, this can be a pc or NAS,), but Sonos, will also, as an additional feature accept a seperate external source and pipe it to any of the other rooms with a zp in it. Think of it this way, if you have a ZP in one room with a sattelite receiver, all you have to do is plug in audio left and right into the external input source of teh ZP100, and then its availalbe anywhere else in your house!!!

Sonus is a modular system, you build it up one room at a time, so not sure what if any comparison there is to Rokus here.

Yes, sonos is more expensive, but looking at the feature list, for obvious reasons.

Again, I am not putting any product down or anything, but as I said, Sonos is the one and only product I have ever come accross where I will honestly say I would defend to the death  Thats the most positive statement I can make about it really, and you wont find me ever again saying anything like this about anything else.

Wexfordman

Wexfordman


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## MonsieurBond (1 Feb 2006)

Wexfordman said:
			
		

> The difference as far as I can see with Sonos and Roku etc are, first and foremost, the user interface, which is exceptional. It does to the multiroom systems what Ipod did to mp3 players, and you will see the obvious similarities.


Certainly, the LCD remote is very nice.



			
				Wexfordman said:
			
		

> The second difference, and this is an exclusive as far as I know, is the ability of sonus to synchronise zones, which rokus does not do. That is you can play one track in all zones, and it will be synchronised. This is a very important feature when looking at multiroom systems, as otherwhise all you may as well put in a seperate cd player/tuner in all your rooms.


Not sure if the Roku does this, but the Squeezebox does according to this review.



			
				Wexfordman said:
			
		

> Not sure what you mean by sonos requiring a seperate device to plug into your hifi Bond ? Can you explain ? The only thing Sonos needs with the ZP100 is a set of speakers ? Both systems do require a centralised source (in the case of Sonos, this can be a pc or NAS,), but Sonos, will also, as an additional feature accept a seperate external source and pipe it to any of the other rooms with a zp in it. Think of it this way, if you have a ZP in one room with a sattelite receiver, all you have to do is plug in audio left and right into the external input source of teh ZP100, and then its availalbe anywhere else in your house!!!



The ZP100 includes an amplifier. You plug speakers into it - either the Sonos ones or better still, buy some better speakers from someone else.

If you already have a hi-fi amp, you may not want to plug the speakers into the Sonos unit, as they will already be connected to your amp. This is where the ZP80 comes in - it integrates with your existing hi-fi amp.



			
				Wexfordman said:
			
		

> Sonus is a modular system, you build it up one room at a time, so not sure what if any comparison there is to Rokus here.
> 
> Yes, sonos is more expensive, but looking at the feature list, for obvious reasons.
> 
> Again, I am not putting any product down or anything, but as I said, Sonos is the one and only product I have ever come accross where I will honestly say I would defend to the death  Thats the most positive statement I can make about it really, and you wont find me ever again saying anything like this about anything else.


Not disagreeing. Just stating that the Roku has a cheaper cost of entry and requires few pieces of equipment.

I personally am going to wait for something which streams video as well before I invest. 

Anyway, enjoy your Sonos, Wexfordman.

Please do post to say where you bought it and if it lives up to your expectations!


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## efm (1 Feb 2006)

Wexfordman,

I was looking at the Sonos site and in the set up guide it said that at least one of the ZP100's needs to be directly connected to the wireless network.  Is this correct ?  Is this a similar requirement for all wireless audio systems ?

Also initially want to listen to the Sonos through my home cinema / stereo system - what audio outs does the sonos have?


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## brian.mobile (1 Feb 2006)

Do you need speakers in every room.

I mean properly integrated into walls / ceilings? 

Or do you use proprietry hifi ones?

B


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## Wexfordman (1 Feb 2006)

Mr Bond (cant spell french me!!)

"Not disagreeing. Just stating that the Roku has a cheaper cost of entry and requires few pieces of equipment."

Yep, the Roku is cheaper, but they are different products pretty much. Does the Roku require an amp  by the way, I'm not sure!!!. Also, how does the Roku require fewer pieces of equipment, all sonos needs is a source and a set of speakers when you look at it. I will give you one thing, it would be nice if Sonos was cheaper, but when you compare the two products, or Sonos agains any other multiroom quipment (wired or wireless), you will see why the price difference.

Brian,

You need speakers in whichever room you want music in, which is whichever room you will have a zoneplayer in. They dont have to be integrated or ceiling mounted etc, you can use normal stereo speakers or whatever you want. Just make sure they are the correct impedence.

EFM,

  The frist zp has to be pyhsically connected (via ethernet/lan cable) to your source. This could mean that it is plugged directly into your router, directly into your pc or NAS or whatever. Think of it as an amp, in order to hear music, it has to be connected to a source (cd player etc). Once the first zone is wired, then all the rest can be wireless (assuming no range probelms etc).

Listening to sonos through your cinema system is a doddle. The ZP100 has both standard speaker outputs, but it also has audio left/right ouputs that can be connected to an amp. It also has audio left/right inputs, so you can connect your home cinema system to it, and listed to movies/tv or radio (if your cd player has one) etc in stereo anywhere else in the house.

Once you have BB, you an also listen to any internet radio station in the world, in any room (except realplayer stations).

The ZP80 is a cheaper version of the ZP100, in that the ZP80 does not have an amp, so you must use an external amp (your home cinema system for example) to listen to music. Might be a cheaper option for one of your zones. Personally, I would go for the ZP100's all the time though

Another feature with each ZP, you get 4 ethernet ports as well. So for example, my ZP in the living room is behind my telly, and next to my XBOX. the ZP connects wireless back to the first ZP, but because it has 4 ethernet ports on it, I simply hook up my xbox to it, and I am live, without having to run cable for it, or buy expensive adaptors for the xbox.

Can Roku do that mr Bond 

Think I might be getting a little obsessive now!!

I bought my system in O'Callaghans electrical, Oliver Plunket st cork. There is a guy there that deals specifically with multirrom systems that I would advise anyone ask speak to him. I could give his name, but not sure if its wise to on this public forum (would his first name be okay).

Otherwise, if anyone PM's me I will provide his contact details etc

Wexfordman


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## MonsieurBond (2 Feb 2006)

Wexfordman said:
			
		

> Mr Bond (cant spell french me!!)
> 
> "Not disagreeing. Just stating that the Roku has a cheaper cost of entry and requires few pieces of equipment."
> 
> Yep, the Roku is cheaper, but they are different products pretty much. Does the Roku require an amp  by the way, I'm not sure!!!. Also, how does the Roku require fewer pieces of equipment, all sonos needs is a source and a set of speakers when you look at it. I will give you one thing, it would be nice if Sonos was cheaper, but when you compare the two products, or Sonos agains any other multiroom quipment (wired or wireless), you will see why the price difference.


The Roku connects over Wi-FI (802.11b unfortunately, not g) to your music share and connects via optical or coaxial connection for optimum sound quality. Does not require an amp.

Sonos streams at the higher 802.11g speed, is more expensive but more impressive design wise - particularly the LCD handheld remote. Requires its own amplifer at present until the Z80 option comes out, which turns me off, as I don't wish to invest in a second amp. Does not have optical or coax connections unfortunately. 

Neither system is perfect - neither play protected AAC files (songs downloaded from iTunes Music Store). However the Roku does play Microsoft's Plays-For-Sure protected WMA files which I believe the Sonos currently does not.



			
				Wexfordman said:
			
		

> EFM,
> 
> The frist zp has to be pyhsically connected (via ethernet/lan cable) to your source. This could mean that it is plugged directly into your router, directly into your pc or NAS or whatever. Think of it as an amp, in order to hear music, it has to be connected to a source (cd player etc). Once the first zone is wired, then all the rest can be wireless (assuming no range probelms etc).


This restriction does not apply to the Roku Soundbridge or the Squeezebox, afaik.



			
				Wexfordman said:
			
		

> The ZP80 is a cheaper version of the ZP100, in that the ZP80 does not have an amp, so you must use an external amp (your home cinema system for example) to listen to music. Might be a cheaper option for one of your zones. Personally, I would go for the ZP100's all the time though


Not just cheaper, but a response to a customer need - many customers prefer to use their existing amp and not to buy a second one. This is why the ZP80 will be introduced.



			
				Wexfordman said:
			
		

> Another feature with each ZP, you get 4 ethernet ports as well. So for example, my ZP in the living room is behind my telly, and next to my XBOX. the ZP connects wireless back to the first ZP, but because it has 4 ethernet ports on it, I simply hook up my xbox to it, and I am live, without having to run cable for it, or buy expensive adaptors for the xbox.
> 
> Can Roku do that mr Bond


I think that wireless router functionality is best left to a wireless router. 
However, if you don't have one already, the ethernet ports on the Sonos are indeed useful.

There are other differences between the two systemsm and neither is perfect - Roku has inferior security at present for example (WEP but not WPA). You can't remove the rechargeable battery in the Sonos remote, for example. 

*Bottom line: 

*Given the actual bandwidth you will get on current wi-fi technology, none of the solutions mentioned is really suited to high bitrate streaming e.g. lossless encoding. None are suitable for streaming video.

However, if you want a wireless audio system _now_, and can afford it, I would also go for the Sonos. (Although I would wait for the Z80 non-amp option to come out if you have a decent hi-fi or home cinema amp already. No point in paying for two big boxes to sit in your hi-fi rack!)

If you can't afford Sonos, Roku or Squeezebox are good options. Or for that matter, the Apple Airport system, if you can live without the remote. (It's certainly very cheap.)

Otherwise, wait for a MIMO or 802.11n option to come out next year.

...Final thought - you could wait for Apple to launch a Sonos-killer, or else to buy Sonos as has been rumoured on the Net!


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## JohnnieKippe (3 Feb 2006)

WexfordMan,

Do you use the speakers that come with SONOS or do you recommend other speakers. Is the ZP80 available yet for hooking up to a living room surround sound setup. any good recomendations on a surround sound setup as I need to upgrade this too.


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## Wexfordman (4 Feb 2006)

Johnie,

I dont use the sonos speakers, I have ceiling mounted speakers (put them in when I was building for an older multiroom system). I cant say how good or otherwise the Sonos ones are I'#m afraid. Speakers are very subjective, you can spend 50 quid or 5k on a set of speakers. I would drop into a hifi shop and have a listen to some systems (is there a richersounds or something lke that near you). Ditto for the surround sound system, in fact you could get a few quid off of you bought your speakers in the same place (in fact whoever you get oyour sonos off of will likely sell all this gear too, so a bulk buy should give you a nice discount)

Not sure when the ZP80 is going to be about, I did hear in March. The idea of using a zp 80 with your surround sound amp probably makes sense.

Wexfordman


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## JohnnieKippe (14 Feb 2006)

Yippie. Ordered my Sonos Introductory Bundle with speakers yesterday. Hope to have them in 5 days or so. Can't wait !


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## Wexfordman (14 Feb 2006)

Welcome to the Club!! Let us know how you get on

Wexfordman


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## JohnnieKippe (14 Feb 2006)

Wexfordman said:
			
		

> Welcome to the Club!! Let us know how you get on
> 
> Wexfordman




Hi Wexfordman, 

I will let you know how I get on.

If I got an Xbox360 am I right in thinking that I can hook that up to a ZP100 and avail of the Live gameplay without cables, etc. If I put Windows Media centre on the PC can I then send video,photos to the TV via the xbox ? Is that how yours is set up ? does it work ok ?


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## MonsieurBond (14 Feb 2006)

Wexfordman said:
			
		

> The difference as far as I can see with Sonos and Roku etc are, first and foremost, the user interface, which is exceptional. It does to the multiroom systems what Ipod did to mp3 players, and you will see the obvious similarities.
> 
> * The second difference, and this is an exclusive as far as I know, is the ability of sonos to synchronise zones, which rokus does not do. *That is you can play one track in all zones, and it will be synchronised. This is a very important feature when looking at multiroom systems, as otherwise all you may as well put in a separate cd player/tuner in all your rooms.
> 
> Wexfordman


You may be interested to learn that a recent firmware upgrade on the Apple Airport Express now offers the same multi-room synchronous playback feature.

Airport Express / AirTunes also costs a fraction of the price Sonos solution - [broken link removed], if you already have a wireless network.

You can use your laptop as a wireless controller.

Also, being an Apple device, it will stream copy-protected AAC files purchased from the iTunes music store.


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## Wexfordman (14 Feb 2006)

Bond,

You can also buy a Lada for a fraction of the price of an Audi, both will get you there in the end, but I know which I'd rather have.

Johnnie,

The set up you described is exactly what I have. XB0X connected to ZP, which is wireless connected to the other ZP's and one ZP is hardwired to my router. Only exception is my PC is not media centre edition yet, but I can use the XBOX360 to view all music and jpegs etc until I get full functionality MCE PC (of course I dont use the XBOX360 for music, I have Sonos to do that!!).

Regards,
Wexfordman


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## MonsieurBond (14 Feb 2006)

Wexfordman said:
			
		

> Bond,
> 
> You can also buy a Lada for a fraction of the price of an Audi, both will get you there in the end, but I know which I'd rather have.
> 
> Wexfordman


Wexfordman, you are being a bit facetious here. 

I would not wish to see this topic degenerate into a "mine is better than yours" juvenile debate.

I have stated previously that I like the Sonos system.

However, it is expensive and has down disadvantages.

I learned today and posted here the fact that Apple's Airport solution now supports multi-room, as I think that other AAM readers will be interested in this as a cheaper alternative to Sonos etc. I personally do not wish to invest significant money in this technology initially until I have dabbled with streaming audio in order to see how it works in my own environment.


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## JohnnieKippe (14 Feb 2006)

Wexfordman said:
			
		

> Bond,
> 
> 
> The set up you described is exactly what I have. XB0X connected to ZP, which is wireless connected to the other ZP's and one ZP is hardwired to my router.



Excellent. In the meantime I will set up my standard Xbox to Sonos for live play. I think I need to use xbconnect.com to play as my xbox is modded so I think I can't play on Live.


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## Wexfordman (21 Feb 2006)

MonsieurBond said:
			
		

> Wexfordman, you are being a bit facetious here.
> 
> I would not wish to see this topic degenerate into a "mine is better than yours" juvenile debate.
> 
> ...


 

Bond,

Thats a bit harsh!!!! My statement was a point of view and nothiong more, and I was merely informing people of my opinion that the solution you offered was not anywhere near the standard of the Sonos solution. You are correct in pointing out a solution and letting people be aware of it, as I am in pointing out the differences. One particular case you pointed out was to use a laptop as a remote controller with airport express. Yep, thats a solution alright, but not in any way comparable to the Sonos solution, in fact a very, very second rate solution imho. As is, and dare I say it again, the soltuion of buying a lada instead of an Audi. Both products will get you there, there is nothing wrong with either, but one is a very much neater and sleeker solution than the other. Thats not an insult or anything else, and its not knocking one product over the other, but it is pointing out in a comparable way the differences.

What both of us are doing here (and should continue to do so), is pointing out the different products availalble and their pros and cons, dont read anything more into it than that, I am certainly not interested in a slagging match either, I am contributing to an informative thread on multiroom systems, based on my personal expereinces as a consumer and user of multiroom audio systems over the last 5 years, thats all.


Regards,
Wexfordman


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## brian.mobile (21 Feb 2006)

This thread is priceless!

BM


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## MonsieurBond (24 Feb 2006)

brian.mobile said:
			
		

> This thread is priceless!
> 
> BM



Glad to entertain as well as to inform.


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## JohnnieKippe (27 Feb 2006)

Got my SONOS last week. Great little system. Notr cheap but I guess you get what you pay for.


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## MonsieurBond (3 Mar 2006)

JohnnieKippe said:
			
		

> Got my SONOS last week. Great little system. Not cheap but I guess you get what you pay for.


For those who don't want to sink lots of money into a music (only) streaming product, or who already have a big music collection on their PC or Mac and simply want a good streaming music client (as opposed to paying for another music server [FONT=&quot]à[/FONT] la Sonos), there is a good review of the new Squeezebox on the Register.

> Squeezebox 3 costs $299 (£172), which is a snip. There's even an Ethernet-only version for $249 (£143). ... With the SlimDevices product you can send songs from your archive to multiple Squeezeboxes around your home. It's not quite up there with Sonos for large-scale multi-room set-ups, but then it's cheaper. You pay your money, you take your choice.
> 
> *Verdict:*
> Excellent sound quality, cross-platform support, eminently affordable price. Looks great too... *98%*


 Full article here: [broken link removed] - By Tony Smith 2nd March 2006 15:26 GMT (c) RegHardware.co.uk.


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## boskonay (25 Jul 2006)

Anyone got a ZP80 yet? Can the ZOne PLayer 80 be used as the one that hard-wires to the network?


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## JohnnieKippe (25 Jul 2006)

boskonay said:
			
		

> Anyone got a ZP80 yet? Can the ZOne PLayer 80 be used as the one that hard-wires to the network?



Not yet but will get one soon.


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## boskonay (26 Jul 2006)

Just ordered one, will let you know


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## boskonay (31 Jul 2006)

Hey guys,

Pack arrived today and set up was a breeze. I installed the ZP80 in the office hard-wired to the LAN in the house. Set-up took less than 5 minutes, and the controller was working a few minutes after that.

I went for the two ZP100's with Sonos speakers bundle, and setting them up (wireless) was just as quick and effortless. Sound from the Sonos speakers is excellent, and all the kit is extremely durable and well built - top quality bits and pieces.

Am having great fun, and am a little afraid I too will become a Sonos evangelist!!


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## kfpg (2 Aug 2006)

Hope this is not too far off topic!

My house is wired for multi room audio in 4 rooms and outsied on the deck but I have yet to buy a system. Looking at the rave reviews of wireless things like Sonos does anyone think I would be better to go with that and take the hit on the wiring cost which was done during the build?

I presume there are pros and cons of wired versus wireless I just dont know them? A big thing for me is I want to be able to hear all my existing CD collection on whaterver system I buy. I was looking at Bose Lifestyle because you can copy or 'rip' in to its memory all of your CD's quite quickly. Anyone any helpful comments?


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## boskonay (2 Aug 2006)

You can buy a Sonos set-up and use the network wiring you might already have? You can certinaly use the speakers if you've installed ceiling or wall mounted units.

Sonos uses the music you have on your PC or NAS locally, you simply pop your CD's into your PC, 'rip' them to mp3 format with Windows Media Player (automagically should do it) and then you can play those tracks anywhere in the house.


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## JohnnieKippe (2 Aug 2006)

Can anyone recommend a NAS so I don't have to leave the PC on for SONOS.


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## Wexfordman (3 Aug 2006)

As pervious poster said, the sonos can be wired or wireless whichever you want (or dont want for that matter). One of the big advantages I find with the Sonos is that it is completely modular. 1 player for 1 room, 2 players for 2 rooms etc, and the storage point and controllers are also seperate. My previous system was an all in one multiroom system, where everything was in one box. It went bang, so everything was gone, and very expensive to repair. 

With a modular system like Sonos, if you are unlucky enough to break or damage something, your system still works, its cheaper and easier to get it fixed also if you want to.

I would say any system that is modular in this way is the way to go, and being a Sonos user now for the best part of a year, it gets my thumbs up over any other system I know.

Regards,
Wexfordman


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## boskonay (4 Aug 2006)

For NAS I use - http://www.elara.ie/products/detailsfull.asp?productcode=ECE1188672&productID=183179

Works really well, and the RAID means it can lose a disk without losing my music


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## MonsieurBond (4 Aug 2006)

boskonay said:
			
		

> For NAS I use - http://www.elara.ie/products/detailsfull.asp?productcode=ECE1188672&productID=183179
> 
> Works really well, and the RAID means it can lose a disk without losing my music



Nice but pricey - I was looking at the 500GB Western Digital version which is much more reasonable - [broken link removed].

In the end, as I needed a USB drive as well, I bought a 250GB USB external hard disk first - a steal at [broken link removed] (excluding postage but I usually buy a few things together to take this pain away). I plan to buy another one of these (possibly a bigger one) and plug the two of them into one of [broken link removed] to share them on my wireless LAN.

You can do software RAID, but I will probably just back one up to the other using Ghost or something similar on a regular basis.


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## JohnnieKippe (4 Aug 2006)

MonsieurBond said:
			
		

> In the end, as I needed a USB drive as well, I bought a 250GB USB external hard disk first - a steal at [broken link removed] (excluding postage but I usually buy a few things together to take this pain away). I plan to buy another one of these (possibly a bigger one) and plug the two of them into one of [broken link removed] to share them on my wireless LAN.
> .


I already own a 250GB external USB hard drive. Can I just buy that €95 thing you linked to there and then I can access the music on the external hard drive even when the pc is off ?


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## boskonay (4 Aug 2006)

Yes, it will work, just remember your speed will be limited by the USB transfer rate (will still work fine tho)


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## MonsieurBond (4 Aug 2006)

boskonay said:
			
		

> Yes, it will work, just remember your speed will be limited by the USB transfer rate (will still work fine tho)


If you buy one of these and plug the external hard disk into it, then connect it to your router either wired or wirelessly, then you will be able to access your music even when the PC is off.

If you use a Ethernet link to a USB drive, the speed will be slowerthan when you access it via USB from your PC (Ethernet is 100 MB per second as opposed to USB 2.0 at 480 MB per second).

Thus, you can connect your existing external USB drive to an Ethernet hub, and plug this into your router, and access the music or video files or whatever from the hard disk at Fast Ethernet speeds IF USING A LAN CABLE.

If you are connecting to your router wirelessly, you will most likely get a much slower read speed of (in theory) 56MB/s  but in practice you will probably get around 20MB/s. Fast enough to stream compressed audio (as this is what we are discussing) but possibly not fast enough for lossless audio and most likely not fast enough for video, for example.


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## JohnnieKippe (4 Aug 2006)

Now I'm not sure whether to go for that €95 thing or get that functionality plus another 300gb hd for an extra €140

[broken link removed]


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## OhPinchy (10 Aug 2006)

Has anyone used the Noxon 2 from Terratec? a (possibly OTT) review. Seems like a decent piece of kit for €178 (on komplett.ie).

I'm thinking about using one for my kitchen/dining room when my extension is complete. 

Wexfordman - can you recommend a decent budget priced set of ceiling speakers, and what cabling should I run in for these?

Thanks


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## inchbyinch (20 Oct 2006)

Hi all

Fantastic thread with some informed and emotive debate going on, which to be fair is exactly what this thing is all about. I'm in the planning stage of a new house and would love to have a central data base of music which any1 in the house can tap into. It is my intention to wire the house with cat 5 cable to every room (you can never have too much of the stuff) so won't particularlly have to rely on a wireless system (all concrete walls and floors in the house so wireless will be limited any how). My ideal system would have the following

1)Kitchen/Living/Hallway and Deck Zone 1
2) dining/sitting room Zone 2
3) bedrooms Zone 3-6

This would give every one in the house the option to play whatever music they want in their own room. This is obviously not going to be cheap but I presume there are systems out there that would allow one to start small and add on to them as they go on!

Q1. What are my options regarding systems? 
Q2. What sort of budget am I looking at? 5K?
Q3. I will need a controller unit in every room but will I also need a central database location?

This is obviously comming from a planning point of view and i realise I'm in hte lucky position of being able to pre wire a house for this. Any help will be much appreciated.

tks
ibi

PS won't be installing for a while so perhaps future systems will be more suitable!


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## Wexfordman (21 Oct 2006)

Inchy,


By the sounds of it you are going for 6 zones. My Sonos setup is also for 6 zones, and the cost (excluding speakers) for 6 zones plus 2 controllers was about 3.5k. Again, having first had a different multiroom system whcih consisted of hardwired keypads mounted into the walls, I would sya they are a bad idea.
The controlers for the sonos are extremly functional, and one of the best I have see. Far superior in my opinion to any system utilising a wired keypad set up.The zones can also be controlled from any pc connected to your home network (As I type this on my laptop, I am selecting music to play also)
 I find 2 controllers is more than enough for my 6 zones, I keep one in the living room, and the other in the kitchen. 

Also, as you mentioned the sonos is expandable, so you can start small and work your way up. The wireless zoneplayers are exceptional, as they act as repeaters for each other and the contorller, so for my house (single story 2100sq ft block construction) I have no problem with the wireless setup, although as you say, with a new build, you would be better off wiring your zoneplayers (some of mine are as I already had some cabling in place)

I would suggest if you do plan to use a sonos, cat5 them bact to eachother, but spread them about the house to give you good wireless coverage for your controllers.


Someone asked earlier about what type of cabling and speakers to recommend. I have ceiling mounted speakers that I bought about 5 years ago in Waterford, so cant really remember price etc, but they are good quality. You dont have to go for ceiling mount if you dont want, in fact I would be in two minds about it if I had to do it again (would probably ceiling mount the bathroom, kitcehn and bedrooms though). Speakers are a personal thing, I would shop around and listen to the quality of them, especially ceiling mounts as you are going to have to live with the quality of the sound, and the look of them for a long time (its not easy to fill in a big f$%k off speaker hole should you ever want to). 

Speake wire, just go for a good quality cable reasonably priced (dont fall for this gold plated oxygen free stuff that will be spouted at you and is really pricy for the lengths of wire you will need to be running). That sort of stuff is for real audiophiles who would not listen to an MP3 if you tied them down and stapled thier ears to the speakers!!
Wexfordman


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## carraig king (1 Nov 2006)

Having started this thread many months ago I have recently purchased two sonos ZP100 bundle packs. Once setup i was amazed and delighted with product. Itis very easy to use and I like the fact that you can configure alot of the settings songlists etc directly from the PC program.Whilst some people say it is a bit expensive the great strength of the product is its adaptability and flexibility. Quite easily I can move a zone player to another room and connect it again quickly. We had ceiling mounted speakers installed and the quality is excellent. I would highly recommend this product for anyone. I must also thank all the contributors to this thread for the help and good advice that I have received.


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## HW1 (2 Nov 2006)

In a similar position to inchbyinch, have recently started building a house and really want to install a multi room audio system. Got a couple of quotes from different companies for a 6 zone system but they came in ridiculously expensive.

A Sonos system seems to be the way to go, judging by the previous posts, was wondering if such a system would be difficult to install as am not much of a techie - if I buy the stuff and hand it all to my electrician will he be able to set it up for me?

Is a networked hard drive different from a standard external hard drive? 

Are wall mounted keypads a better method of control than a remote control?

(apologies for the newbie questions..)


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## Wexfordman (2 Nov 2006)

HWI

A networked hardrive is different from a standard external harddrive, they cost around 200 yoyo's for 160Gb, so not too dear, and a doddle to set up. I currently just use my desktop for storing my sonos music, but a networked hard drive is the way to go really.

As far as install of the sonos, it lliterally is plug and play, takes about 5 mins to set up a zone. If you are a new build, the only thiing you will need to consider is prewire for speakers if you want, and prewire for lan cable ideally. THis will be based on how you want to distribute your zone players, but the more distributed they are the better as you will get better coverage for the wireless handheld remote. We are talking about cable runs here, nothing more, if you cant do it yourself, your electrician shold be able to do it (ask him if he can terminate cat5 cables). The important thing here is you plan your layout properly, which is not a big deal to be honest.

With regards in wall keypads versus handheld controllers (like the sonos), my personal opinion is the handheld controller is better for a number of reasons, and I say this as I have expeereince of both in my current house:-

1) Every piece of technology has a limited lifespan, no matter how much you pay for it. A wall mounted keypad will eventuall fail, or become defunct or redundant, and you are left with a nice hole in your wall in a very obvious spot to cover, or else lumbered trying to get a replacement system that is the same size as the older one. This is what happened to me when my first multroom system got damaged. I now have 6 funny looking keypads distributed about the house which are no longer used.

2) Keypads are generally not as user friendly as handhelds, and you will not find any keypad anywhere that is as friendly as the sonos one.

3) Handhelds are generally not required in the same numbers as wall mounted keypads. For example, my older multiroom had 6 keypads for 6 zones. I now have a 6 zone sonos system using 2 handheld controllers, and find that it is perfectly suffeceint. You generally only use 2 or 3 rooms on a regular basis for multiroom, with any other rooms on a rarer basis, hence 2 keypads for me is perfect. Also, with the sonos, desktop/laptop controller software is available (free), so you can use any pc anywhere in the hous as a controller also.

Where are you based ?

Regards,
Wexfordman


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## JohnnieKippe (2 Nov 2006)

I have 2 zones and 1 controller. I find Sonos great. I switched from holding the music on my PC to holding it on a 500GB Network drive I got from Komplett. My PC is in a room off the sitting room and I found the sound from the PC fan too loud, so now I only have the PC on when I use it but Sonos works all the time.

Wexfordman,
You sparked my interest when you mentioned controlling from a laptop. At the moment I can control it from the desktop that is connected to the 1st Zone. I have a wireless laptop that I use around the house. Can I use that as a controller aswell ?

Where abouts in wexford are you based ?


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## Ron Burgundy (2 Nov 2006)

i wired a new house for 3 zones on sunday, i'll hold the music on a mac mini in my cinema and i'll run the master bathroom, the master bedroom and the decking area outside from it.

i ordered the wall cradle to charge and hold it, i'm really looking forward to seeing it in action, i'm housing 2 of the zone boxes in my attic so it looks great with just the controller in view at any time.


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## JohnnieKippe (2 Nov 2006)

Still waiting for the invite to see this hi tech pad of yours Ron


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## Ron Burgundy (2 Nov 2006)

walls still have to be plastered so i have to get into it myself. Myself and my mate laid over 500 meters of cable at the weekend for phone, network, sonos and sky/sky+.


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## JohnnieKippe (2 Nov 2006)

What is your cinema set up ?


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## Ron Burgundy (2 Nov 2006)

Mission Cube Speakers

Pioneer reciever

NEC 42" Plasma

NEC LT20 projector

Mac Mini ( with bluetooth mouse and keyboard )

XBox 360

Pioneer hard drive dvd recorder

Electric Remote control screen

Sky + box

Sonos wireless music system

thats about all i can think of, i'll put up the spec of the receiver and the dvd later when i'm home.

in the rest of the house i have wired 5 network points for computers, sky + and sky multiroom for 4 lcd screens and sonos as i said.


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## HW1 (2 Nov 2006)

Wexfordman,

Am based in Galway. Am planning to run as much cable as possible throughout the house now to have it in place if needed in the future, the capability of the Sonos system to add new zones seamlessly when needed really appeals. 
Will have to check it out next time I'm in the big smoke, don't seem to be any Sonos agents over thsi direction at the moment.


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## JohnnieKippe (2 Nov 2006)

You lucky lucky bugger


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## Wexfordman (3 Nov 2006)

HWI,

I bought mine from a dealer in Cork, if you are ever down this direction. PM me if you want their details. I am sure you would find a dealer in limerick either.

One of the advantages of having your zone players distributed about the house, is that it will ensure seamless wireless coverage for the handheld controller. Just a point to note.

Good luck with it, great to see more people interested, I have yet to hear of a dissapointed user.

Wexfordman


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