# Ireland's most successful sports achiever



## Duke of Marmalade (8 Mar 2014)

I need AAM support. I got into an argument with folk who claimed that You Know Who was Ireland's most successful sports achiever. I pointed out that Arkle had easily surpassed the achievements of YKW. Arkle won the pinnacle of his world sport from 1964 to 1966. YKW never got beyond the quarter finals of his sport on a world stage.

The argument degenerated into questions about Arkle's ethnicity and at that stage I switched off.


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## Delboy (8 Mar 2014)

YKW plays a sport thats only taken seriously in about 8 countries worldwide (despite all the hype in this country) . So if it's Ireland most successful achiever on a world stage, thats him out.

Eamon Coughlan would be up there....the 'chairman of the boards'. Though no Olympic medal.
Barry McGuigan would also be up there...
Martin Sheridan won 3G and 1B at 2 Olympic games for the US, but was born in Mayo

Some serious greats have played GAA in both codes, but as it's only Irish based, that might rule them out in a search like this.
Though Jim Stynes would be close for the greatest as he more than made his mark in Aussie rules- he's revered down there

I'd go for Stephen Roche. What he did in 1987 (only himself and Eddie Merckx have won the triple crown) was oustanding.

Also, is this 26 or 32 county stuff we're talking here....George Best and Joey Dunlop!!!


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## Lex Foutish (9 Mar 2014)

Very good thread, Duke. 

I watched some of yesterday's match. I'm one of the few people in Cork who isn't hugely into YKW's sport but I realised that he's a once in a generation kind of guy. An outstanding player of his sport and an outstanding guy off the pitch also. You couldn't say that about some sporting greats. (And his wife is gorgeous! 

Delboy, Eamonn Coughlan is my all time Irish sporting hero. I was a bit of an athlete in my day and I just loved the man! My favourite Irish sporting moment ever was his 5,000m win in the 1983 World Championships in Helsinki. I was abroad and watched it in the bar of the hotel I was staying in. From Wikipedia........

_Coghlan was nicknamed "The Chairman of the Boards" because of his success on indoor tracks. He won 52 of his 70 races at 1500 m and 1 Mile from 1974 to 1987. He set the world record for the indoor mile run with a time of 3.52.6 at the San Diego Sports Arena[4] in San Diego in 1979. He lowered this to 3:50.6 in 1981 and then bettered it to 3:49.78 in 1983 at New Jersey's Meadowlands Arena indoor arena. His record stood until 1997 when it was broken by Morocco's Hicham El Guerrouj in a time of 3:48.45. It is still the second fastest indoor mile of all time and is still, more than 30 years on, a European record. Coghlan's 1983 time was the fastest mile ever run in the United States until 10 June 2007, when Daniel Kipchirchir Komen ran 3:48.28 outdoors in Eugene, Oregon. It remains one of only four sub-3:50 miles run on American soil.[5] By and large, Coghlan was more successful at indoor running notwithstanding a later world title in 1983 over 5000 meters.
Coghlan also set the record for the indoor 2000 meter run at 4:54.07 in 1987 which stood until Haile Gebrselassie of Ethiopia ran 4:52.86 in 1998 (which was broken in 2007 when Kenenisa Bekele of Ethiopia ran 4:49.99). Coghlan won the world famous Wanamaker Mile at the Millrose Games in NYC's Madison Square Garden a record seven times (1977, 1979–81, 1983, 1985, 1987) his last win being at the age of 34._ 

He was also the first man over 40 years of age to run a sub 4 minute mile. (He ran 83 sub 4 minute miles in his career.)

Wee Barry was great but he didn't have the number of wins as World Champion that would have him rated as our best ever. 

Sonia also has to be very close to the top of the list. 

1987 was an incredible year for Stephen Roche but there's a lot of innuendo about the place about him, though it has to be said that none of it has ever been proven.

Michelle Smith is our most sussesful Olympian but innuendo has dogged her career also. And it must be stressed that she wasn't stripped of any of her Olympic medals, despite getting a 4 year ban later in her career.

But to me, our greatest ever sports person has to be Padraig Harrington. A short few years ago, 3 Majors for an Irishman would have been the stuff of fantasy but he achieved it! It's hard to see him win another, given the way he's playing at the moment but no other Irishman has achieved such sporting success on the international stage. 

Langer, Olazabal, Lyle, Goosen, Jacklin, Miller, Norman, Couples, Furyk and Love have all won fewer Majors that he has. Stricker, Garcia, Montgomerie, Westwood, Donald, Stenson and Poulter have never won any Major......

I've had the pleasure, over the past 15 years or so of being up close and personal with many European and USPGA Tour players and Padraig Harrington would probably come out tops, in my opinion, as the nicest and most obliging one of them all. I've been in his company a number of times and he's a very ordinary guy, totally unaffected by his sporting successes. 

I just hope he can re-discover the form he had a few years ago and get back on the winning trail again.


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## Joe_90 (9 Mar 2014)

Lex, a very coherent reply although I was a little surprised with your conclusion. In the context of the question "most successful sports achiever" YKW is the greatest Irish exponent of his craft and one of the greatest to ever play the game in the eyes of those more qualified than me to judge but how does one measure success, clearly much harder in a team sport.

My vote would have been Eamonn Coughlan, that look on the last corner is brilliant. Katie Taylor would also deserve a mention.


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## Duke of Marmalade (9 Mar 2014)

I guess you guys are just too young. Watch this. Let me set the scene. Millhouse had won the 1963 Cheltenham Gold Cup in style and so far as the Brits were concerned was invincible. Arkle changed all that and went on to dominate the sport for 3 years.  A famous mural in Londonderry screamed "to hell with the Pope and Arkle".

But this was surely the most gripping moment of them all.  Steve Davis was the Millhouse of snooker and after he took an 8 frame lead it was clear that Dennis Taylor would be no Arkle.  But Steve fell at that final ball.  Even watching it now I expect a different ending  Yep Dennis is from the 6 counties but if snooker was an Olympic sport he would be wearing green.

The most overrated achievement by a long shot is Italia 90.  Ireland played 5 games and won none of them (Romania on penos).  They scored 2 goals in 8 hours of actual play.


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## Deiseblue (9 Mar 2014)

Best , Danny Blanchflower , Jennings ,Brady , Giles , Keane & McGrath .

Great players who graced the World's best & most popular sport - a true World stage !

If I had to pick one it would be George Best


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## Paddyman (9 Mar 2014)

Sean Kelly or Sean Drea?


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## Ceist Beag (10 Mar 2014)

YKW was at the top of his sport for 14 years. His record shows:
Most capped international ever
6 nations all time top try scorer
6 nations player of the year 3 times
4 times a British & Irish Lion - one of only 3 players in 125 years to do so
4 Triple Crowns
3 Heineken Cups
1 (hopefully 2) 6 Nations Championships

What is remarkable about him is the longevity of his career at the very top. He is still our best center and probably would be next year if he stayed on. He is unquestionably our best player in the best period in Irish rugby ever and is widely acknowledged as the best 13 ever to play the game (in fact he has redefined the role to how a 13 now plays).
IMHO there is nobody else in any sport who has represented Ireland as well, for as long, and is held in as high regard around the world.
All that aside though, I really don't see why we need to have this argument - why deride one in order to further another? We can appreciate all our great sports stars without needing to knock others. 
I for one feel extremely grateful to have witnessed the absolute genius of Brian O'Driscoll and am proud that he is not only Irish but that he is the epitome of a gentleman as well and has represented his country so well on so many occasions. He deserves all the credit he gets in my book.


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## Liamos (10 Mar 2014)

I prefer to watch sportspeople who provide great & skillful moments. Give me George Best over Roy Keane anyday, Alex Higgins over Dennis Taylor, The Dublin / Kerry teams of the seventies over todays versions.


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## Sunny (10 Mar 2014)

Ceist Beag said:


> All that aside though, I really don't see why we need to have this argument - why deride one in order to further another? We can appreciate all our great sports stars without needing to knock others.


 
I agree but I guess these sorts of arguments helps makes sport interesting!

YKW deserved all the plaudits that he gets. If he was Australian or Kiwi, we would all be drooling over what he has achieved. I was in Brisbane in 2001 when he scored that try for the Lions and I will never forget the Aussies reaction to it afterwards.

I was in Sydney a few months earlier to witness Sonia win silver and go so close to achieving Gold. She is worthy of being on any list especially when you consider how she was robbed of the world title by the Chineese. It just never worked for her at Olympics until Sydney. 

What Padraig Harrington has achieved in Golf is outstanding and probably doesn't get the recognition that it deserves. 

I was a huge fan of Stephen Roche when I was younger. I remember being glued to the tv in 87. However, there are too many questions about him individually and cycling in general from that time. 

Closer to home and just because they don't play a global game doesn't mean I appreciate players like Henry Shefflin any less. I would pay to watch the Gooch play football every week and in my mind, you can only say that about truely great sports stars.  

Therefore my top 10 in no particular order are YKW, Sonia O'Sullivan, Roy Keane, Padraig Harrington, Colm Cooper, Henry Shefflin, Ruby Walsh, Eamonn Coghlan, George Best and James Cecil Parke (Google him. Amazing character!)

I know that list has a very modern slant....


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## Duke of Marmalade (10 Mar 2014)

Sunny said:


> Therefore my top 10 in no particular order are YKW, Sonia O'Sullivan, Roy Keane, Padraig Harrington, Colm Cooper, Henry Shefflin, Ruby Walsh, Eamonn Coghlan, George Best and James Cecil Parke (Google him. Amazing character!)
> 
> I know that list has a very modern slant....


_Sunny_ that is an extremely racist line-up.  Where is Arkle, Nijinsky, Istabraq?


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## TarfHead (10 Mar 2014)

Lex Foutish said:


> Michelle Smith is our most sussesful Olympian but innuendo has dogged her career also.


 
Innuendo ? Never saw it called that before .



Lex Foutish said:


> But to me, our greatest ever sports person has to be Padraig Harrington.
> 
> Langer, Olazabal, Lyle, Goosen, Jacklin, Miller, Norman, Couples, Furyk and Love have all won fewer Majors that he has. Stricker, Garcia, Montgomerie, Westwood, Donald, Stenson and Poulter have never won any Major.


 
Major wins when Tiger was absent don't have the same status .

And if any of the other names had ganged up on Harrington and spear tackled him into the tee box, then he could be mentioned in the same conversation as YKW.


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## Liamos (10 Mar 2014)

Duke of Marmalade said:


> _Sunny_ that is an extremely racist line-up.  Where is Arkle, Nijinsky, Istabraq?



In my opinion, you can't include horses in the discussion.


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## Duke of Marmalade (10 Mar 2014)

Liamos said:


> In my opinion, you can't include horses in the discussion.


I own this thread. I carefully chose the title to have an all inclusive meaning of Irishness. 

You know it is amazing to reflect that we are a World power in Horse Racing and next to soccer and athletics that is a very international pursuit. For the narrow minded I am prepared to make the restriction you are imposing and for me Eamonn Coghlan shades it. Dennis Taylor's black ball win was the most exhiliarating moment though. Harrington's achievement is, in statistical terms, huge. How many other country's boast triple Major winners? All the same it takes luck to win three majors, Harrington never really dominated his sport. YKW dominated his sport but Ireland are not just good enough at Rugby and Rugby is simply not international enough for him to claim the title.


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## so-crates (10 Mar 2014)

Duke of Marmalade said:


> _Sunny_ that is an extremely racist line-up.  Where is Arkle, Nijinsky, Istabraq?



Speciesist rather than racist  They are all Irish!


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## Ceist Beag (10 Mar 2014)

TarfHead said:


> And if any of the other names had ganged up on Harrington and spear tackled him into the tee box, then he could be mentioned in the same conversation as YKW.



lmao


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## Sunny (10 Mar 2014)

Duke of Marmalade said:


> I own this thread. I carefully chose the title to have an all inclusive meaning of Irishness.
> 
> You know it is amazing to reflect that we are a World power in Horse Racing and next to soccer and athletics that is a very international pursuit. For the narrow minded I am prepared to make the restriction you are imposing and for me Eamonn Coghlan shades it. Dennis Taylor's black ball win was the most exhiliarating moment though. Harrington's achievement is, in statistical terms, huge. How many other country's boast triple Major winners? All the same it takes luck to win three majors, Harrington never really dominated his sport. YKW dominated his sport but Ireland are not just good enough at Rugby and Rugby is simply not international enough for him to claim the title.


 
Jump racing is not a very international pursuit. Outside Ireland, the UK and France, there is very little interest in it so using your logic about international sport, can Arkle really be included?


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## The_Banker (10 Mar 2014)

Duke of Marmalade said:


> I own this thread. I carefully chose the title to have an all inclusive meaning of Irishness.
> 
> You know it is amazing to reflect that* we are a World power in Horse Racing* and next to soccer and athletics that is a very international pursuit. For the narrow minded I am prepared to make the restriction you are imposing and for me Eamonn Coghlan shades it. Dennis Taylor's black ball win was the most exhiliarating moment though. Harrington's achievement is, in statistical terms, huge. How many other country's boast triple Major winners? All the same it takes luck to win three majors, Harrington never really dominated his sport. YKW dominated his sport but Ireland are not just good enough at Rugby and Rugby is simply not international enough for him to claim the title.



Would we be if it wasnt for the tax breaks?

Also, is horse racing a real sport? I always feel it is just an extension of the gambling industry...
I won £1 on Red Rum in 1977 and "my mother" took it for my credit union account... Never forgave her. 

As a child I grew up watching Jimmy Barry Murphy play hurling on Leeside... Now there was a sporting legend !


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## Purple (10 Mar 2014)

Lex Foutish said:


> Very good thread, Duke.
> 
> I've had the pleasure, over the past 15 years or so of being up close and personal with many European and USPGA Tour players and Padraig Harrington would probably come out tops, in my opinion, as the nicest and most obliging one of them all. I've been in his company a number of times and he's a very ordinary guy, totally unaffected by his sporting successes.



I was in school with the guy (though he probably doesn't remember me) and I agree.


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## Purple (10 Mar 2014)

I don't think we've ever had anyone who has been as good as BOD for as long in any sport.
I always find it noteworthy that Iris women seem to be relatively so much better as sport than Irish men. 
I don't think horses should be on the list; two legs good, four legs bad


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## Lex Foutish (10 Mar 2014)

Lex Foutish said:


> *Michelle Smith is our most sussesful Olympian but innuendo has dogged her career also*.





TarfHead said:


> Innuendo ? Never saw it called that before



I could have put it a little stronger, I suppose, but the thought of Sue Ellen and [broken link removed] at my front door with sledge hammers kinda discouraged me!


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## Delboy (10 Mar 2014)

Ceist Beag said:


> YKW was at the top of his sport for 14 years. His record shows:
> Most capped international ever
> 6 nations all time top try scorer
> 6 nations player of the year 3 times
> ...



1 championship (with 6 teams in it and 2 of them are Italy and Scotland) in 14 years and this was the best period in Irish rugby ever!!! That sums rugby up in this country for me...all hype and very little substance. But thats another debate

YKW is without doubt a remarkable sportsman...and 1 of the best that this country has produced. But there's a lot better that have come from this island and competed internationally IMO


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## Ceist Beag (11 Mar 2014)

Delboy said:


> 1 championship (with 6 teams in it and 2 of them are Italy and Scotland) in 14 years and this was the best period in Irish rugby ever!!! That sums rugby up in this country for me...all hype and very little substance. But thats another debate


True the international team has underachieved but don't forget that Irish clubs have won 5 of the last 8 European club cups so it is not all hype and very little substance as you put it (also I think Italy and Argentina might take issue with your point about only 8 countries taking rugby seriously).


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## Delboy (11 Mar 2014)

I said I would'nt get involved but...can't....resist...!!

The Irish 'club' sides are basically half the Irish team each + a few world class others from abroad! It always seems very unfair to me that we have such strong teams at that level. But thats another debate.

Italian rugby players take the sort seriously at the level they play i.e. they train just as hard as the super powers. But does Italy itself take rugby seriously?

And thats defo my final input on this part of the debate as we're taking it off topic


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## Sunny (11 Mar 2014)

Delboy said:


> I said I would'nt get involved but...can't....resist...!!
> 
> The Irish 'club' sides are basically half the Irish team each + a few world class others from abroad! It always seems very unfair to me that we have such strong teams at that level. But thats another debate.
> 
> ...


 
Well considering the Italians play their rugby in front of over 70,000 fans in the Stadio Olimpico, I would suggest they take it as seriously as anyone else. Of course it doesn't rank the same as football just the same as rugby here doesn't rank the same as GAA or soccer.

The success or failure of teams has nothing to do with the achievements of individuals. It's like saying John Giles wasn't a great footballer because he never qualified for the world cup and didn't win the European Cup with Leeds. Lots of great sports people have played for poor teams especially at international level. 

I don't really get your point about Irish provincial rugby.


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## ivuernis (11 Mar 2014)

It's hard enough comparing people within the same sport from different eras let alone different sports. Then you have people who compete in individual sports versus those in team sports. Also, horses don't count.

I'll probably get castigated for this but I think we take sport far too seriously in this country and too much of the nation's self-worth seems to be invested in the achievements of our sports people.


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## Liamos (11 Mar 2014)

ivuernis said:


> It's hard enough comparing people within the same sport from different eras let alone different sports. Then you have people who compete in individual sports versus those in team sports. Also, horses don't count.
> 
> I'll probably get castigated for this but I think we take sport far too seriously in this country and too much of the nation's self-worth seems to be invested in the achievements of our sports people.



Bah humbug!


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## Duke of Marmalade (17 Mar 2014)

so-crates said:


> Speciesist rather than racist  They are all Irish!


I see that none other than Ruby Walsh is an arch speciesist. I would also like to point out that you would never catch Arkle blubbing in public.


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## notagardener (18 Mar 2014)

If Liverpool win the Premiership, it would have to be Brendan Rogers

 I agree with Padraig Harrington and BOD being in the shortlist, AP McCoy would have to be up there too - incredible record


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## One (24 Mar 2014)

Judged mainly for efforts over long career BOD would take my vote. If I was judging solely on the basis of producing glimpses of sporting genius, I would have to vote George Best.


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## mathepac (6 May 2014)

Boys and girls, ladies and gentlemen, might I introduce to you the one, the only, the magnificent Ms. Katie Taylor, 

current 60kg Olympic Champion
current 60kg European Union Amateur Champion (4 Championships in total)
current 60kg European Amateur Champion (6 Championships in total)
current 60kg World Amateur  Champion (4 Championships in total)
plus international tournament victories, and multiple boxer of the Championship awards.

There is no-one, man, woman or beast who has put together a competitive achievement list like Katie's, not BOD, Shefflin, Harrington, Arkle, Master McGrath, the Rackards or any name you chose to conjuer up.

Bear in mind that she turned her back on a blossoming soccer career with Ireland, a very useful Gaelic football career with significant under-age achievements, a possible professional soccer career with Arsenal Ladies,  and you have our supreme sports achiever who is still only 27 years of age.

I run out of superlatives when I speak about this young woman. I am in awe of her. For almost ten years, in the international boxing arena, she has proven herself peerless. She simply is our greatest.


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## Liamos (6 May 2014)

notagardener said:


> If Liverpool win the Premiership, it would have to be Brendan Rogers
> 
> No need to worry about that then!


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## Leo (6 May 2014)

mathepac said:


> Boys and girls, ladies and gentlemen, might I introduce to you the one, the only, the magnificent Ms. Katie Taylor,



Great ambassador, but it's such a minority sport though, she's Ireland's only elite lady. If we're going for minority sports, why not multiple record holder Eoin Keith?


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## mathepac (7 May 2014)

Leo said:


> Great ambassador, but it's such a minority sport though, she's Ireland's only elite lady.  ....


I agree wholeheartedly that she's a great ambassador, but I disagree that it's a minority sport. Amateur boxing is one of the sports where we achieve success well in excess of population size. One of the people who played an enormous part in her sport getting Olympic recognition and world status is Katie Taylor.

It's hardly Katies' fault that other athletes of her gender cannot reach her elite status.

I can't see her achievements being equalled or surpassed for a long time, if ever.

She is Ireland's most successful sports achiever, a wonderful role model for her generation and a genuinely nice person.


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## Leo (7 May 2014)

mathepac said:


> I agree wholeheartedly that she's a great ambassador, but I disagree that it's a minority sport. Amateur boxing is one of the sports where we achieve success well in excess of population size.



How do you define a minority sport then? Boxing overall is a minority sport here, and in most of the world. Ladies boxing is a minority within that minority. For her 2012 world title, only 58 competed for that title. There are very few sports where being the best of 58 competitors would mark you out as a world champion.


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## PatMacG (7 May 2014)

Leo said:


> How do you define a minority sport then? ... .


I'm not trying to define a minority sport, I'm making a strong case for Ireland's most successful sports achiever, Katie Taylor. Based on her accumulated Olympic, World, European and European Union titles (15 major titles in ten years)  I think there is no competition for my nomination.



Leo said:


> ...  Boxing overall is a minority sport here, and in most of the world. Ladies boxing is a minority within that minority. For her 2012 world title, only 58 competed for that title. There are very few sports where being the best of 58 competitors would mark you out as a world champion.


For the World Snooker Championship, just completed a small number of elite players out of 130-ish registered players participated in the final stages having won through preliminary matches.

Snooker is a minority sport defined perhaps by the number of elite players. On the other hand, based on the interest it generates it might be considered mainstream. Darts, croquet, badminton, squash, clay-pigeon shooting, fishing, rowing, cycling etc might be minority sports at a competitive level based on the number of elite competitors, but there is huge interest in them.

So what do you mean by minority sport?


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## Firefly (8 May 2014)

PatMacG said:


> I'm not trying to define a minority sport, I'm making a strong case for Ireland's most successful sports achiever, Katie Taylor. Based on her accumulated Olympic, World, European and European Union titles (15 major titles in ten years)  I think there is no competition for my nomination.
> 
> For the World Snooker Championship, just completed a small number of elite players out of 130-ish registered players participated in the final stages having won through preliminary matches.
> 
> ...



Is that you mathepac?!!


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## Leo (8 May 2014)

I'd define minority sports by participation levels, and if you're talking about international success, then I think you have to look solely at the numbers competing at the elite level. Sonia's achievements in a much more competitive field outshine Katie's.


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## notagardener (8 May 2014)

Leo said:


> I'd define minority sports by participation levels, and if you're talking about international success, then I think you have to look solely at the numbers competing at the elite level.* Sonia's achievements in a much more competitive field outshine Katie's.[/*QUOTE]
> 
> I tend to disagree with the above.Throughout Sonia's career she has had access to world class training facilities. She attained a scholarship in the USA in 1990 which gave her the platform to prepare for the World Student games in 1991 where she went on to win gold in the 1500M and silver in the 3000M. No doubt a brilliant performance and she went on to have a fantastic career. When you consider the facilities Katie had at her disposal, a shed in Bray with no toilet or running water and her coach her Dad working full time in his day job it's incredible what she went on to achieve.. I must add, in my opinion


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## notagardener (8 May 2014)

Liamos said:


> notagardener said:
> 
> 
> > If Liverpool win the Premiership, it would have to be Brendan Rogers
> ...


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## Leo (9 May 2014)

notagardener said:


> I tend to disagree with the above.Throughout Sonia's career she has had access to world class training facilities.



But so did thousands of others you see, not dozens, and that's my point .


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## notagardener (10 May 2014)

Leo said:


> But so did thousands of others you see, not dozens, and that's my point .



Ah but that's my point too, dozens of others did - Katie didn't


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## mathepac (7 Jun 2014)

Well done again Katie Taylor. 

"The Olympic champion beat France’s Estelle Mossely to claim an unprecedented sixth successive European Elite lightweight title in Bucharest, Romania today." The Examiner website

Not only did she win herself, but her achievements have attracted other young Irish women into the sport of amateur boxing, with outstanding success.

What more can I say? She's truly our greatest.


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## Duke of Marmalade (7 Jun 2014)

Aidan O'Brien today became the only trainer to train three winners in a row of the World's most important and well known classic - the Epsom Derby, a history spanning more than 230 years.


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## Purple (9 Jun 2014)

Duke of Marmalade said:


> Aidan O'Brien today became the only trainer to train three winners in a row of the World's most important and well known classic - the Epsom Derby, a history spanning more than 230 years.



That's great but it's a bit like calling the guy who develops running shoes a sportsman.


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## mathepac (9 Jun 2014)

Purple said:


> That's great but it's a bit like calling the guy who develops running shoes a sportsman.


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## Duke of Marmalade (9 Jun 2014)

Purple said:


> That's great but it's a bit like calling the guy who develops running shoes a sportsman.


Well of course you have eliminated both Aidan O'Brien and Katie Taylor there. I was careful in my choice of words _"sports achiever"_ to include horse racing or motor sport or indeed female sports achievers.

The Sunday sports sections were quite revealing for this debate. Both Katie and Aidan had on Saturday achieved remarkable goals and records in their quite separate persuasions. I have to say the coverage of Aidan's achievements swamped that of Katie and indeed RTE also gave the same priorities. And that is just the Ireland Sundays. A similar perusal of the UK Sundays for example would probably not even mention Katie but would be possibly equally effusive on Aidan's unique 230 year achievement.


.


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## Purple (9 Jun 2014)

Duke of Marmalade said:


> Well of course you have eliminated both Aidan O'Brien and Katie Taylor there.


 How so?


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## mathepac (9 Jun 2014)

Duke of Marmalade said:


> ... The Sunday sports sections were quite revealing for this debate. ....


In what way? I tend to form my opinions on this and other matters independently. The  remit of the sports editors  to flog newspapers or column inches of ads by pandering to populist themes doesn't influence me.

Professional horse-stuff is commercial and sells newsprint, superlative consistent performances by an amateur sportswoman doesn't. What's new?


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## Duke of Marmalade (9 Jun 2014)

Purple said:


> How so?


Neither would qualify in a strict sense as a "sportsman", which is what I thought the thrust of your point was.


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## Purple (9 Jun 2014)

Duke of Marmalade said:


> Neither would qualify in a strict sense as a "sportsman", which is what I thought the thrust of your point was.



My apologies if I was not clear. I meant that the person who engages in the sport (the jockey, the driver, the footballer, the boxer etc.) is the sportsperson. The people who train the horse, design the car etc. are critical to the achievement of the sportsperson but are not themselves athletes or sportspeople. That in no way diminishes their achievements though.


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## Duke of Marmalade (30 Aug 2015)

I see the BBC's Brendan Foster claiming that Mo Farah is the best ever British sportsperson.  Leaving aside the fact he (Mohamed) was born in Somalia, I was underwhelmed by the studio's suggested challengers:  Ian Botham Johnny Wilkinson

Stephen Hendry won 7 snooker world championships and surely that makes him a shoe in.  Or are Somalians more British than Scots?


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## cremeegg (7 Sep 2015)

If you are extending the question to look across the water, Stephen Redgrave is the world's greatest achiever in sport


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## Duke of Marmalade (9 Sep 2015)

cremeegg said:


> If you are extending the question to look across the water, Stephen Redgrave is the world's greatest achiever in sport


Never heard of him, but having looked up Wiki I see what you mean.  Easily the winner - he must have been pretty sore that the panel didn't even give him a mention.


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## mathepac (24 Sep 2015)

Could I congratulate Ireland's greatest ever sports achiever, Katie Taylor for adding to her accumulation of title by winning yet another Gold Medal in the inaugural European Games in June 2015. Without a shadow of doubt our greatest ever, male or female.


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## Duke of Marmalade (17 Mar 2017)

Ireland have just had their greatest sporting achievement EVER in beating the English 19/9 at Cheltenham and yet RTE News & Sports majors on the GAA club championships being played before an empty stadium, with the sensational aforementioned success an afterthought.  Unbelievable


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## Delboy (17 Mar 2017)

Duke of Marmalade said:


> Ireland have just had their greatest sporting achievement EVER in beating the English 19/9 at Cheltenham and yet RTE News & Sports majors on the GAA club championships being played before an empty stadium, with the sensational aforementioned success an afterthought.  Unbelievable


You've obvously had an 'enoyable' Paddys day!
A half empty stadium in Croker equates to probably close to 40,000 spectators. Not bad for 3 country parishes and a rugby/milllionaires strongold in Sth Dub.
RTE showed nothing of the 2 finals live. The sports section of the news covered it alright. And there's a 1 hour highlights package on now.

Meanwhile, on planet Ryle Nugent, we've just had nearly 4 hours of a live minority sport...rugby. And even then, a very much subsection within that sport...u-20's and womens.

Both feel free to have a go at GAA...a national pastime amongst certain groupings in this country


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## Duke of Marmalade (18 Mar 2017)

Delboy said:


> You've obvously had an 'enoyable' Paddys day!
> A half empty stadium in Croker equates to probably close to 40,000 spectators. Not bad for 3 country parishes and a rugby/milllionaires strongold in Sth Dub.


Watching Ireland trounce England at Cheltenham was most enjoyable, yes.

What I saw of the GAA coverage was completely empty stands behind the goals.  Ok they cut to a section of the crowd wildly cheering some goal but I got the distinct impression this was the sum total of spectators. Even The Donald would be embarrassed to describe the attendance in the thousands.
And another thing, what about the endless coverage of GAA results on Sunday evening. They aren't finished until you get to the Under 8s, Inter County, LGBT Camogie, Division 10Z


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## Delboy (18 Mar 2017)

ok, trolling. You got me


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## Delboy (18 Mar 2017)

.


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## PMU (18 Mar 2017)

mathepac said:


> Could I congratulate Ireland's greatest ever sports achiever, Katie Taylor for adding to her accumulation of title by winning yet another Gold Medal in the inaugural European Games in June 2015. Without a shadow of doubt our greatest ever, male or female.


No. It's Michelle Smith de Bruin.  Three golds and a bronze at the Atlanta Olympics.  Four golds and three silvers at the Vienna and Seville European Aquatic Championships.  The National Aquatics Centre should be named after her.


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## Dan Murray (19 Mar 2017)

Duke of Marmalade said:


> Ireland have just had their greatest sporting achievement EVER in beating the English 19/9 at Cheltenham....



What a week in Cheltenham - I am still whacked - a true test for man and beast - not even going to mention the Duke's grammar....


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## Vanessa (19 Mar 2017)

mathepac said:


> Boys and girls, ladies and gentlemen, might I introduce to you the one, the only, the magnificent Ms. Katie Taylor,
> 
> current 60kg Olympic Champion
> current 60kg European Union Amateur Champion (4 Championships in total)
> ...


Can you name any of the opponents who she defeated?


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## mathepac (20 Mar 2017)

No


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## thedaddyman (20 Mar 2017)

Domestically it has to be Jimmy Barry Murphy. Find me someone else who won All Ireland,Provincial and National League and All stars in both hurling and football with his county  and county, provincial and All-Ireland club medals in both hurling and football with his club before then managing his county to minor and senior All-Ireland titles. In his spare time, he even played League Of Ireland soccer with Cork Celtic.

At international level, hard to look beyond Tony McCoy.


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## Carnmore (25 Oct 2018)

Why is there a 4 page discussion about this?

Naming boxers, racehorse trainers et al is fatuous.

It's unequivocally James Cecil Parke.


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## Purple (26 Oct 2018)

Carnmore said:


> Why is there a 4 page discussion about this?
> 
> Naming boxers, racehorse trainers et al is fatuous.
> 
> It's unequivocally James Cecil Parke.



When it comes to tenis you can't forget about Mabel Cahill, an Irish woman with 5 US Open titles.


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## Carnmore (29 Oct 2018)

Purple said:


> When it comes to tenis you can't forget about Mabel Cahill, an Irish woman with 5 US Open titles.



James Cecil Parke was an all-round sportsman while simultaneously studying law. Would put the modern-day sponsored single sports "achievers" to shame.


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## odyssey06 (30 Oct 2018)

Carnmore said:


> James Cecil Parke was an all-round sportsman while simultaneously studying law. Would put the modern-day sponsored single sports "achievers" to shame.



It's sad in some ways but the reality is that you have to be a single sports achiever, you simply can't compete as an all rounder, or even as someone balancing studies and a single sport. You would fall foul of the "jack of all trades, master of none" ...

Look at the difference in rugby players athleticism between the 1980s and today.


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## Purple (30 Oct 2018)

Carnmore said:


> James Cecil Parke was an all-round sportsman while simultaneously studying law. Would put the modern-day sponsored single sports "achievers" to shame.


Everyone playing GAA works or Studies full time. Rugby players have to go to college at the same time as playing; it's a requirement of getting a contract. There are also rugby players who have represented their county in Hurling and Football and people who have represented their country in other sports while playing rugby (Jordan Larmore springs to mind). Then there's our greatest ever boxer who played soccer for Ireland as well as winning Olympic medals and European and world titles.


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