# Buying out Mother's Siblings



## TheFatMan (3 Jun 2011)

Hi Folks 

Any advice and suggestions welcome here.

My mother was 1 of 5 siblings that inherited 20% of her mothers house. The house is on the market and is not shifting, no big suprises there in this market.

I'm thinking of buying out the other 80% from the 4 siblings (my aunts and uncles). Going into partnership with my Mammy (cant beat and Irish Mammy as a business partner) and getting into the buy to let market. 

Plan on offering €125K for the house, which will in effect mean I only have to come up with €100K to buy out the 80% of the house and my mum holds her 20% or €25K.

Is there a way for me to do this so that 4 siblings wont know who is involved at all or until dont know until such a time as they cant back out of the sale agreement? 

Reason is my mothers family are a nest of vipers, we've had nothing to do with them for many years and this inheritance is more of an annoyance as we have to deal with them again until the estate gets settled. My Uncle and Aunt are dual executors of the will, calling the shots and trying to shaft everyone in the process. 

I see an opportunity here for my mum and I to make a few bob over the long term but dont want the vipers to be aware of whats happening until its too late.

All advice welcome


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## Paddyman (3 Jun 2011)

You have as much right to bid as any other person. However I understand very well the way families work. 

Your best bet is to put in an anonymous bid through a different solicitor. Explain to the solicitor your reasons and requirements. Chances are he/she will have seen it all before. You are doing nothing illegal.

My cousin was in the same boat as yourself and this is how she handled the matter. Good Luck!


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## Bronte (6 Jun 2011)

If there is such ill will in the family why on earth would you want to have anything to do with this property which no doubt will cause even more agro.  

Also is it a good idea for you mother to go into business with you, for what reason?  Very messy.


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## Complainer (6 Jun 2011)

Paddyman said:


> Your best bet is to put in an anonymous bid through a different solicitor. Explain to the solicitor your reasons and requirements.


But when you come to exchange contracts, the identities of the purchasers will be known.


Bronte said:


> If there is such ill will in the family why on earth would you want to have anything to do with this property which no doubt will cause even more agro.
> 
> Also is it a good idea for you mother to go into business with you, for what reason?  Very messy.



Dead right.


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## beffers (6 Jun 2011)

TheFatMan said:


> Plan on offering €125K for the house, which will in effect mean I only have to come up with €100K to buy out the 80% of the house and my mum holds her 20% or €25K.



If you are going to pay 125,000 for the house, that is what you are going to pay to purchase it. Your mothers 25K will be given to her when the sale closes. It can't be set aside for her to give to you to go towards the purchase price _prior_ to you buying it. If relations were good between you and the executors, I suppose you could work something out where by you offer 100,000, and your mother waives her share of the inheritance in return for you putting her name on the deed once the house sells. But if you are trying keep this all hush hush, I am not sure how you can do that without letting the cat out of the bag.



> Is there a way for me to do this so that 4 siblings wont know who is involved at all or until dont know until such a time as they cant back out of the sale agreement?


Estate agents and solicitors do not normally disclose to the buyers and vendors who their clients are. When I sold a house last year, I was nosy so I asked the estate agent who the buyer was. She told me he was a single male professional who was a first time buyer, but other than that she could divulge no other details as she has a duty of care to protect her clients privacy. She was similarly vague when he asked her who I was. My side had no idea who we were selling to until closing. You should have no  problem protecting your privacy in the negotiation stage, especially if you instruct the estate agent and solicitor that on no account should personal information about you be given to the other side. However, closing is a whole other ball game. Do your mother and you share the same last name? Would the other sides solicitor know who you are, just by seeing your name on paperwork? If they do, there is no way to stop them from stalling to go back to their side and telling them who you are. If they back out, you could always threaten them with losing their deposit. Or perhaps you could sign power of attorney over to your solicitor to bid on your behalf, and purchase the house on your behalf. That way your privacy is protected all the way, but the solicitor will cost you a few bob to do that.


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## csirl (7 Jun 2011)

If you want to get into buy-to-let with your mother, wouldnt it be easier to wait until the house is sold (so your mother gets her money) and just buy a similar house elsewhere? Would eliminate a lot of potential hastle with mothers siblings.


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## TheFatMan (7 Jun 2011)

*Thanks*

Hi Folks

Thanks for all the advice.

To answer a few of your queries:

Why this house?: It has good development potential, is in good condition/location and its the only 1 my mother has a 20% share in. House prices are dropping it started on market at 180K currently on for 140K and by my estimate not currently worth more than 120-130K. Other houses in similar area would require a lot more work to put back into the rental market.

Other reason is that this nest of vipers we call family have installed a cousin in a "caretaker" capacity in the property. Its in the executors interest to allow the price fall as low as possible in order to make the property affordable for his son to purchase.

I'd like to be in a position to drive the price back up a little even if I don't get it my mum still wins.

Beffers thanks for the advice regarding the transfer of deeds, ownership and finances involved. Still early days need to put some finances in place. Should this fall through I may very well buy something on my own in the area. But as I said this house has a lot more potential than many.


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## csirl (8 Jun 2011)

TheFatMan said:


> Hi Folks
> 
> Its in the executors interest to allow the price fall as low as possible in order to make the property affordable for his son to purchase.


 
The Executor has to make every effort to have the house sold within 12 months of the person passing away. If you lodge an offer in writing, and it is the only offer, then he is obliged to take it. If his son puts in an offer and you put in a higher offer, he is obliged to sell to you.


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## TheFatMan (8 Jun 2011)

csirl said:


> The Executor has to make every effort to have the house sold within 12 months of the person passing away. If you lodge an offer in writing, and it is the only offer, then he is obliged to take it. If his son puts in an offer and you put in a higher offer, he is obliged to sell to you.


 
Hi CSGirl, will didnt pass probate within the 12 months due to confusion about my gran's name of the death cert. Issue was eventually resolved and house went on market just before probate was granted. 

What obligates the executor to always accept the higher offer? Surely they have some discretion and could accept a quick cash offer over 1 that required financing and delay.


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## ondeball (8 Jun 2011)

Keep away from it if you've any sense. They'll find out in the end so, depending on how close you are, you shouldn't do this unless you don't mind having nothing to do with them in future.

A lot of families down our way have been split apart by less.


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## Complainer (8 Jun 2011)

csirl said:


> The Executor has to make every effort to have the house sold within 12 months of the person passing away. If you lodge an offer in writing, and it is the only offer, then he is obliged to take it. If his son puts in an offer and you put in a higher offer, he is obliged to sell to you.


Is there anything in place to mitigate the Executor's conflict of interest here? Could the Executor's son magically come up with a bid that is €50 above the highest bid, by pure coincidence of course.


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## csirl (8 Jun 2011)

Complainer said:


> Is there anything in place to mitigate the Executor's conflict of interest here? Could the Executor's son magically come up with a bid that is €50 above the highest bid, by pure coincidence of course.


 
If he did, he'd have to buy at that price and if his is the highest bid, it should be sold to him. The executors role is to extract the max. value from the estate for the beneficiaries. It is within the beneficiaries interest to have a biddling war between two people to drive up the price.


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## Complainer (8 Jun 2011)

csirl said:


> If he did, he'd have to buy at that price and if his is the highest bid, it should be sold to him. The executors role is to extract the max. value from the estate for the beneficiaries. It is within the beneficiaries interest to have a biddling war between two people to drive up the price.


But he could have an unfair advantage, by getting inside information on the level of bids.


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## TheFatMan (8 Jun 2011)

Thanks again folks, honestly the relationship with this side of the family was never great. Just dont want them to know whats going on until they have to. 

Have what I need here now thanks


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