# Heading into our 40's Zero Savings



## Jollyman (3 Jan 2023)

*Personal details*
Age: 39
Spouse’s/Partner's age: 40
Number and age of children: 4 children – 10 Months, 2 Years, 5 Years & 7 Years

*Income and expenditure*
Annual gross income from employment or profession: *€95,000*
Annual gross income of spouse: €53,000

Monthly take-home pay about: *€6,600*

Type of employment: e.g. Civil Servant, self-employed:* Private Company, Wife Civil Servant*

In general are you:
(a) spending more than you earn, or *Struggling to break even*
(b) saving? *nothing


Summary of Assets and Liabilities*
Family home worth *€900K with an €330K *mortgage
Pension fund: *€200K



Family home mortgage information*
Lender: BOI
Interest rate 3%

Value: €900K
Mortgage: €330K

(No need to tell us the monthly repayments or what term is left)

*Other borrowings – car loans/personal loans etc N/A*
Do you pay off your full credit card balance each month? No
If not, what is the balance on your credit card? Circa €2k 

Car loan: €480 per month
Child Care: €640 a month at only 2 days a week care
Standard household utilities: Electric, Oil, Insurance, TV, Broadband €440 a month

*Buy to let properties
*
Not applicable

*Other savings and investments:*

Do you have a pension scheme? Company that i work for pay €800 per month into a pension
Savings = €35K Children's allowance in a credit union account
Do you own any investment or other property? No
*Other information which might be relevant*
Life insurance: €348K cover 
Health Insurance €3,600 Annually

One holiday per year Staycations

No frivolous expenditure. Live like hermits. We simply don’t have the spare cash. We are the classic example of what people would outwardly see as ‘successful’ 


*What specific question do you have or what issues are of concern to you?*
We took out the mortgage in Jan 2008 at €405k now in 2023 at €331k and 23 years left assume thats the majority of the payments going to the interest over the capital. Still its depressing viewing! We have fixed in 2020 at 3% for 5 years.

What i want from this is to identify what we can do, or where i can free up cash or investment options for the future. Should we use the €35k savings against the mortgage, i really want to lower the duration and save as much as possible on the interest going forward. I know there is possible breaking fees on the fixed term if i was to pay the lumpsum another option is to convert our garage using the €35k which was built to house standards to a self contained flat for rental possibly we are based in a popular coastal area with great views etc

I'm also keen to explore a mortgage top-up or buying a fixer upper somewhere or a local parcel of land for future potential sites is this something that would be possible based on current circumstances.

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## nest egg (3 Jan 2023)

First things first - pay off the credit card from the credit union funds - do it immediately.


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## RedOnion (3 Jan 2023)

Firstly, you don't have zero savings. You've got 35k in the credit union. You're in a good position for a couple with 4 very young children.

There won't be any break fees at the moment, funding rates are much higher than when you fixed.

In your shoes, I would:
1. Pay off the credit card, and don't use it as a source of funding again except in emergencies. 
2. Pay 30k off the mortgage. 
3. Refix immediately for another 5 years at 3%. That rate is still available from BOI, but could change any day. This will provide you certainty on outgoings for the next 5 years.
You could shorten the term to 20 years, and have the same monthly payments.  You'll be mortgage free at 60.

Forget about land and buy to let's for now. Keep your life simple. Make tax relieved pension contributions instead, you've a lot of headroom to do so.


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## nest egg (3 Jan 2023)

Second thing - track your expenses for a month or two - you need to understand where the money is going. You'll then have options as to what course of action to take. It will give a tremendous feeling of control.

Third thing - once you've set your budget, and determined what you can save, do it via your pension scheme. It's automatic, you get a 40% top up from the tax man, it's maintenance free and compounds tax free.


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## PGF2016 (3 Jan 2023)

Sell house for €900k. Buy house for €600k. You will then have no mortgage and can divert the mortgage payments to savings and living a little instead of living like hermits. 

Living is more important than having an expensive house but living like hermits.


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## Ceist Beag (3 Jan 2023)

Income per month is €6600
Outgoings listed in OP amount to €1560 per month
Add in monthly mortgage repayments of say €2k
That leaves €3k per month unaccounted for. You really need to understand where this money is going.


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## Jollyman (3 Jan 2023)

PGF2016 said:


> Sell house for €900k. Buy house for €600k. You will then have no mortgage and can divert the mortgage payments to savings and living a little instead of living like hermits.
> 
> Living is more important than having an expensive house but living like hermits.


Yes this is tempting me all the time, we bought the site built the house a great location and great views with lots of family history over the past 12 years its hard to convince my wife and im iffy enough also on it, but commercially it makes perfect sense.

 Ideally buy a parcel of land and build again with potential for future sites in the location, but I'm not sure how local needs apply if i sell my own and look for a new planning permission etc im sure my kids would qualify for local needs down the line as we would be from the vicinity.


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## Jollyman (3 Jan 2023)

Ceist Beag said:


> Income per month is €6600
> Outgoings listed in OP amount to €1560 per month
> Add in monthly mortgage repayments of say €2k
> That leaves €3k per month unaccounted for. You really need to understand where this money is going.


Yes ill post the budget, was using a previous money makeover post as a template. Kids activities alone is another €600 a month on top of the childcare, grocery shopping is circa €800 a month now, the cost of living at the moment has really put an additional squeeze on us hence this post.


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## Jollyman (3 Jan 2023)

nest egg said:


> Second thing - track your expenses for a month or two - you need to understand where the money is going. You'll then have options as to what course of action to take. It will give a tremendous feeling of control.
> 
> Third thing - once you've set your budget, and determined what you can save, do it via your pension scheme. It's automatic, you get a 40% top up from the tax man, it's maintenance free and compounds tax free.


I will get at this tracking tonight and post it.


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## skrooge (3 Jan 2023)

Firstly with four kids you should give yourself some credit. You're not in that bad a financial position. As others have said you've €35k in deposits, that's something. 

Start recording your spending so you can see where you're spending your money. Try to avoid cash as it's harder to track. Debit/credit card transactions can be reviewed at the end of the month. Even a couple of months of this should point you in the direction of what you're spending money on.

The savings are a good rainy day fund. However, I'd clear your credit card - it's your most expensive debt (and also relatively small so get rid of the outstanding balance). If you feel like you're struggling perhaps consider getting rid of the card, especially if you can't commit to clearing it every month. 

If you're stretched financially I would not reduce the term of your mortgage. Why turn the screws on yourself... Leave the term as it is and overpay those months that you have spare cash. All going well you'll pay off your mortgage as quick as if you had shortened the term but without forcing yourself into a corner.


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## Sarenco (3 Jan 2023)

You have yet to turn 40 and already have -

- €570k in house equity(!);
- €200k pension fund;
- Accrued civil servant pension entitlements; and
- €35k in after-tax savings.

I would say you are doing exceptionally well for somebody at your age and stage in life (particularly with four young kids).

If you paid off the credit card and car loans from your credit union savings, your cash flow position would improve hugely.


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## huskerdu (3 Jan 2023)

You are going through a very expensive stage of your life and the cost of everyhting is going up, so I sympathise.

You should do a few things
- A very detailed analyssi of where your money goes so you can be ruthless about cutting out expenditure that doesnt add value to your lives. I dont mean cut out all luxuries but think hard about which ones are important and which ones you can drop
- Pay off the CC bill
- Get rid of any notions that you can afford a site or second property in the next decade. Your priorities are ( in no particular order)  - pay off your mortgage, continue pension payments, live a good life with your kids, have a bit of a buffer for unexpected expenses. Your current mortgage wont be paid off until you are in your early 60s, why would you take on further loans, even if someone would give you one


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## Itchy (3 Jan 2023)

Jollyman said:


> Car loan: €480 per month
> 
> 
> One holiday per year Staycations



What's the balance of the car loan? This should be addressed after the credit card debt is cleared.

Staycations are luxury compared to value that could be had in Spain/Portugal, think outside the box!

You're not doing too bad at all.


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## Zion2022 (3 Jan 2023)

How are you coming home with only €6,600 per month with those gross incomes? Assuming no pension contribs, you should be bringing in around €8,300 per month? Add in another €560 for child benefit. Should be closer to €9k a month which is a different situation entirely.

Would need to be some mighty AVCs going on which you don’t mention to bring the net income down that far?

If you are only taking home €6,600 then 4 kids and a €900k house (and the running costs that brings), it’s no suprise you aren’t exactly rolling in excess cash.


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## goingforgold (3 Jan 2023)

I think the headline here is misleading. You have over 600k in net wealth plus pension value. You are not a hard luck case. If you are struggling on a day to day basis then you really need to consider moving to a 'cheaper' house. With that income and that house value you really shouldn't be struggling. 
You are 'successful', you're just not managing your cash flow very well.


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## T McGibney (3 Jan 2023)

goingforgold said:


> I think the headline here is misleading.


It's not even factually correct.


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## nest egg (3 Jan 2023)

T McGibney said:


> It's not even factually correct.


I think a lot of people are guilty of compartmentalising their money - I suspect the OP isn't thinking of the 35k as savings, but likely as a fund for their children's education or similar. It would explain why they didn't pay off the CC using it.


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## nest egg (3 Jan 2023)

Jollyman said:


> I will get at this tracking tonight and post it.


If you can get into the habit of doing it every month, you'll also be able to see the impact of the changes you make over time too.

Start hacking away at all expenses - switch utility providers, review subscriptions, and take control - decide what's important (and what's not) to spend your hard earned money on.

You've taken the first step in posting here, and as others have mentioned, you're in a better position than you probably think. Best of luck!


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## Jollyman (3 Jan 2023)

nest egg said:


> I think a lot of people are guilty of compartmentalising their money - I suspect the OP isn't thinking of the 35k as savings, but likely as a fund for their children's education or similar. It would explain why they didn't pay off the CC using it.


Exactly this yes we would feel guilty using it.


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## Jollyman (3 Jan 2023)

T McGibney said:


> It's not even factually correct.


Yes agreed it’s a cash flow / money management I’m struggling with.


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## ClubMan (3 Jan 2023)

Jollyman said:


> Exactly this yes we would feel quirky using it.


It's quirky not to, in my opinion.


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## Jollyman (3 Jan 2023)

goingforgold said:


> I think the headline here is misleading. You have over 600k in net wealth plus pension value. You are not a hard luck case. If you are struggling on a day to day basis then you really need to consider moving to a 'cheaper' house. With that income and that house value you really shouldn't be struggling.
> You are 'successful', you're just not managing your cash flow very well.


Wealth yes so agreed headline is misleading not intentionally so, but it’s wealth I have no access to. I currently have a balance in my current account of €90 in my current account and using a one for all I got at Christmas to do the weekly shop in Tesco!


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## Jollyman (3 Jan 2023)

Zion2022 said:


> How are you coming home with only €6,600 per month with those gross incomes? Assuming no pension contribs, you should be bringing in around €8,300 per month? Add in another €560 for child benefit. Should be closer to €9k a month which is a different situation entirely.
> 
> Would need to be some mighty AVCs going on which you don’t mention to bring the net income down that far?
> 
> If you are only taking home €6,600 then 4 kids and a €900k house (and the running costs that brings), it’s no suprise you aren’t exactly rolling in excess cash.


Will detail this through tonight with my wife and put more info behind it


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## Jollyman (3 Jan 2023)

ClubMan said:


> It's quirky not to, in my opinion.


Sorry spelling error now edited!


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## Jollyman (3 Jan 2023)

I should add my wife is currently on maternity leave unpaid so additional pinch being felt especially post Santa for four kids


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## Jollyman (3 Jan 2023)

Itchy said:


> What's the balance of the car loan? This should be addressed after the credit card debt is cleared.
> 
> Staycations are luxury compared to value that could be had in Spain/Portugal, think outside the box!
> 
> You're not doing too bad at all.


I’ll get the car loan value tonight. Staycation is a week in November in centre parcs for €1,200 which is value for money in my opinion. I have been outside the box bought a caravan went on a holiday with three kids under 4 promptly sold it two weeks later (not recommend but sold at a profit)


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## RedOnion (3 Jan 2023)

Jollyman said:


> I should add my wife is currently on maternity leave unpaid


Get your details together for a tax return. You could be due a refund if your wife worked part of last year, and you didn't reallocate tax bands and credits.


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## interested21 (3 Jan 2023)

Jollyman said:


> I will get at this tracking tonight and post it.


With the Open-Banking technology available now this has never been easier. You don't need to trawl through transactions in Excel (unless you want to!). Check out YNAB or Spendee. Both have free trials.


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## Zion2022 (3 Jan 2023)

Jollyman said:


> I should add my wife is currently on maternity leave unpaid so additional pinch being felt especially post Santa for four kids


Ah. This changes everything.  Assumed this wasn’t case due to child care payments.

So in essence you’re currently a €95k single income household, with €680 of childcare payments, a €480 car loan, 4 kids and living in a €900k house. You’re living a lifestyle far beyond your current income level.
Assuming your wife will return to work at her old job. Your household income jumps from €6,600 to €9,000 per month (although likely with some additional childcare cost) and it’s a completely different story financially.


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## Jollyman (3 Jan 2023)

RedOnion said:


> Get your details together for a tax return. You could be due a refund if your wife worked part of last year, and you didn't reallocate tax bands and credits.


Pretty sure we didn’t, I’m not too up on any of that stuff hence why posting here also. I’ll arrange that also thanks


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## Jollyman (3 Jan 2023)

Zion2022 said:


> Ah. This changes everything.  Assumed this wasn’t case due to child care payments.
> 
> So in essence you’re currently a €95k single income household, with €680 of childcare payments, a €480 car loan, 4 kids and living in a €900k house. You’re living a lifestyle far beyond your current income level.
> Assuming your wife will return to work at her old job. Your household income jumps from €6,600 to €9,000 per month (although likely with some additional childcare cost) and it’s a completely different story financially.


Correct house valued at €900k mortgage is €330 monthly payments of €1,660


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## Zion2022 (3 Jan 2023)

Jollyman said:


> Correct house valued at €900k mortgage is €330 monthly payments of €1,660


I wouldn’t be too hard on yourself, which you seem to be. People underestimate how hard it is to be a single income household.

A €95k single income household takes home the same net amount as two €40k incomes, which is slightly less than what a 20 odd year old graduate teacher makes.
I don’t think many households of two young teachers could ever dream of putting together the net worth you have, all whilst supporting a wife and 4 kids. To me it seems you’re doing remarkable well to be where you are.


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## LS400 (3 Jan 2023)

Jollyman said:


> *Income and expenditure*
> Annual gross income from employment or profession: *€95,000*
> Annual gross income of spouse: €53,000



I have to scratch my head when I read situations like this, your both on good salaries. I don't know how long your on this income, but it must have been pretty decent to get a mortgage of €400k, and yet only paid off €70k in 15 years.. That just doesn't fit for someone who lives pretty frugal. 

We've all got the usual expenses, kids, mortgages etc etc, I just don't get it, your no dummy on a 95k income. 

Your shouldn't even have to be thinking of down sizing to make ends meet. 

My advice, on that income, pay now for some professional advice, before its too late, it will be money well spent.


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## 2bmortgagefree (3 Jan 2023)

Jollyman said:


> Yes this is tempting me all the time, we bought the site built the house a great location and great views with lots of family history over the past 12 years its hard to convince my wife and im iffy enough also on it, but commercially it makes perfect sense.
> 
> Ideally buy a parcel of land and build again with potential for future sites in the location, but I'm not sure how local needs apply if i sell my own and look for a new planning permission etc im sure my kids would qualify for local needs down the line as we would be from the vicinity.


You are not guareented planning again especially if you live in an area of amenity.


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## Jollyman (3 Jan 2023)

LS400 said:


> I have to scratch my head when I read situations like this, your both on good salaries. I don't know how long your on this income, but it must have been pretty decent to get a mortgage of €400k, and yet only paid off €70k in 15 years.. That just doesn't fit for someone who lives pretty frugal.
> 
> We've all got the usual expenses, kids, mortgages etc etc, I just don't get it, your no dummy on a 95k income.
> 
> ...


Paid €70k off the capital the interest is what has been paid circa €160k I think total to mortgage €230k to dates


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## Jollyman (3 Jan 2023)

2bmortgagefree said:


> You are not guareented planning again especially if you live in an area of amenity.


Yes that’s what I was thinking and we had to jump through a lot of hoops to prove need for our planning originally. Unless the COCO would take into account downsizing due to means etc


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## ClubMan (3 Jan 2023)

Jollyman said:


> Paid €70k off the capital the interest is what has been paid circa €160k I think total to mortgage €230k to dates


Maybe it's not the central issue here, but the mortgage figures seem very confusing, and possibly incorrect to me (as they seem to be to @LS400?).

You borrowed €405k at the start of 2008 on what seems to be a 38 year term and the balance has only dropped to €335k after 15 years? Seems strange to me. I would've expected the capital balance to be lower assuming rates of < 5% to date?


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## gnf_ireland (3 Jan 2023)

@Jollyman 
You have said that short term cashflow is the main issue, esp after Santa and your wife on maternity leave.
As suggested by others, the first two things you should do is pay off the car loan and credit card from the 35k savings - both are likely to be high interest and by doing this you remove the interest payments. Think of it as a 2-5 year interest free loan if you want, and pay it back in once your wife is back working

Secondly, work out what your after tax income should be (no shortage of online calculators) - and check if you are jointly assessed [this may be useful for you if you wife has not been earning]. Also keep a tight track of what you spend money on for the next 2 months, and you will be amazed where some of it goes. Only then will you really put a proper budget in place - and try and stick to it

But as others said, you are not in a bad place, just cashflow is tight, and you have liquidity in the 35k that you need to use to aid better financial decisions. Ignore the other conversation on the other thread - this supersedes it !


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## cremeegg (3 Jan 2023)

Long term you are fine, two excellent pensions, equity in the house.

You would like more cashflow now to live a little. You could move to a cheaper house, but why should you, you have 4 kids, that's a lot of value you get from the house. 

No one has picked up on this,


Jollyman said:


> another option is to convert our garage using the €35k which was built to house standards to a self contained flat for rental


up to €14,000 tax free would be a nice extra.

The one other thing is that your expenses may rocket when the kids are looking at 3rd level.


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## LS400 (3 Jan 2023)

I thought the €14,000 tax free only applied to a room within the main house? Surely that’s a stand alone rental.


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## Jollyman (3 Jan 2023)

ClubMan said:


> Maybe it's not the central issue here, but the mortgage figures seem very confusing, and possibly incorrect to me (as they seem to be to @LS400?).
> 
> You borrowed €405k at the start of 2008 on what seems to be a 38 year term and the balance has only dropped to €335k after 15 years? Seems strange to me. I would've expected the capital balance to be lower assuming rates of < 5% to date?



Please see attached drawn down in 2008 and topped up then also to finish the build so €308k plus €100k have listed out exact statement switched and combined both in Jan 2021 and added €20k for some home improvements.


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## Jollyman (3 Jan 2023)

gnf_ireland said:


> @Jollyman
> You have said that short term cashflow is the main issue, esp after Santa and your wife on maternity leave.
> As suggested by others, the first two things you should do is pay off the car loan and credit card from the 35k savings - both are likely to be high interest and by doing this you remove the interest payments. Think of it as a 2-5 year interest free loan if you want, and pay it back in once your wife is back working
> 
> ...


Is it ok to post tax credits cert here for comment or review?


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## Jollyman (3 Jan 2023)

LS400 said:


> I thought the €14,000 tax free only applied to a room within the main house? Surely that’s a stand alone rental.


Yes I believe your correct has to be adjoined to main building


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## RedOnion (3 Jan 2023)

Jollyman said:


> Is it ok to post tax credits cert here for comment or review?


Remove all identifying information first. Are you jointly assessed?


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## Jollyman (3 Jan 2023)

RedOnion said:


> Remove all identifying information first. Are you jointly assessed?


Yes we are see attached


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## LS400 (3 Jan 2023)

It looks like your chipping approx 10k on main loan and only 2k per year on the €100k top up, that’s crazy on your income, also, what’s with 2019 missing?


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## Jollyman (3 Jan 2023)

LS400 said:


> It looks like your chipping approx 10k on main loan and only 2k per year on the €100k top up, that’s crazy on your income, also, what’s with 2019 missing?





Paying as per the advised charges have never overpayed


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## RedOnion (3 Jan 2023)

Jollyman said:


> Yes we are see attached


You can reallocate the tax bands so you have 49k for 2023, so more of your income will be at lower rate, it'll help the cashflow, but not make any net difference to the year if your wife earns over 31k. You can do it online, and your employer will receive updated details for next payroll.

What was your wife's income in 2022? You might be due a decent tax refund.


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## Jollyman (3 Jan 2023)

RedOnion said:


> You can reallocate the tax bands so you have 49k for 2023, so more of your income will be at lower rate, it'll help the cashflow, but not make any net difference to the year if your wife earns over 31k. You can do it online, and your employer will receive updated details for next payroll.
> 
> What was your wife's income in 2022? You might be due a decent tax refund.


Her income gross for 2022 she only worked until start of march so approx €10k


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## RedOnion (3 Jan 2023)

Jollyman said:


> Her income gross for 2022 she only worked until start of march so approx €10k


Her maternity benefit was also taxable, but you're due a chunky enough refund based on the way credits / bands were split.


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## Jollyman (3 Jan 2023)

Jollyman said:


> View attachment 7056View attachment 7056View attachment 7057
> Paying as per the advised charges have never overpayed


Bare in mind I was 24 when I got the mortgage only graduated on salary of €24k the €95k is only with the past year


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## Jollyman (3 Jan 2023)

RedOnion said:


> Her maternity benefit was also taxable, but you're due a chunky enough refund based on the way credits / bands were split.


And that credit will be decided by us completing tax returns I assume and these should be done when? Thanks so much for the help and advice


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## RedOnion (3 Jan 2023)

Jollyman said:


> And that credit will be decided by us completing tax returns I assume and these should be done when? Thanks so much for the help and advice


You can do it whenever you like now. Sooner you do it, the sooner you get the cash!


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## Jollyman (3 Jan 2023)

RedOnion said:


> You can do it whenever you like now. Sooner you do it, the sooner you get the cash!


Thanks I’ll let you know how it goes


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## Protocol (3 Jan 2023)

Between 2013 and 2022 the ECB rate was low, 1% or less.

Yet your mortgage rate was 3.7% to 4.58%.

That seems like a relatively high mortgage rate?

That seems to be part of the reason the capital balance is not reducing?


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## Jollyman (3 Jan 2023)

Protocol said:


> Between 2013 and 2022 the ECB rate was low, 1% or less.
> 
> Yet your mortgage rate was 3.7% to 4.58%.
> 
> ...


Yes we were young and naive mortgage with EBS Didn’t know what a tracker was and from memory was never presented as an option.


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## ClubMan (3 Jan 2023)

Jollyman said:


> Yes we were young and naive mortgage with EBS Didn’t know what a tracker was and from memory was never presented as an option.


Were you the guy on the bus?


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## Jollyman (3 Jan 2023)

ClubMan said:


> Were you the guy on the bus?


His 1st cousin (‘


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## RentingD (4 Jan 2023)

Have you looked at the National Childcare Scheme if children are in a registered provider? Might make a saving there.

500 on children's activities - i presume swimming lessons, a good investment. I find there is pressure to have children signed up to everything and it's expensive in terms of time aswell as money. Worth thinking about.

Children go through clothes and toys. Lots of people clearing out things and would be happy to give them to you. I gave car seats and a cot to a colleague lately and he gave me a voucher for a sports shop for my crew. We both saved.


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## Jollyman (4 Jan 2023)

RentingD said:


> Have you looked at the National Childcare Scheme if children are in a registered provider? Might make a saving there.
> 
> 500 on children's activities - i presume swimming lessons, a good investment. I find there is pressure to have children signed up to everything and it's expensive in terms of time aswell as money. Worth thinking about.
> 
> Children go through clothes and toys. Lots of people clearing out things and would be happy to give them to you. I gave car seats and a cot to a colleague lately and he gave me a voucher for a sports shop for my crew. We both saved.


Yes have looked at that, our provider is not registered but the savings are not enough to entice us to move away from a resource the kids love and is convenient and flexible for us.

Activities swimming lessons x 2 gymnastics  x2 Irish dance x 1 taekwando x 1 zumba and zumbini x 1 each soccer x 2 GAA Yearly membership.

We have toys coming out our ears and kids want for nothing only grandkids on both sides of family so overly splashed out on but we are trying with years to discourage toys for birthdays and Christmas etc. another point we have two birthdays the first two weeks of Jan which compound the toys issue. We have gotten yearly membership to fota and to a local pet farm this year instead from family which makes more sense and presents of clothes so making progress.


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## Peanuts20 (4 Jan 2023)

Jollyman said:


> Pretty sure we didn’t, I’m not too up on any of that stuff hence why posting here also. I’ll arrange that also thanks



From a tax perspective, don't just look at credits etc, make sure you are claiming for everything you can, especially on the health front. With 4 kids, I'd expect you've racked up some bills that are not covered by your health insurance and those can be deducatable.  I'll stand corrected on this but I think you can go back 5 years. Some other poster may confirm that


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## Jollyman (4 Jan 2023)

Peanuts20 said:


> From a tax perspective, don't just look at credits etc, make sure you are claiming for everything you can, especially on the health front. With 4 kids, I'd expect you've racked up some bills that are not covered by your health insurance and those can be deducatable.  I'll stand corrected on this but I think you can go back 5 years. Some other poster may confirm that


Yes think we cover ourselves ok on this one, and yes we have had a few issues that were not covered. 5 years is correct.


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## so-crates (4 Jan 2023)

Peanuts20 said:


> From a tax perspective, don't just look at credits etc, make sure you are claiming for everything you can, especially on the health front. With 4 kids, I'd expect you've racked up some bills that are not covered by your health insurance and those can be deducatable.  I'll stand corrected on this but I think you can go back 5 years. Some other poster may confirm that



4 years back for claiming tax credits. https://www.revenue.ie/en/personal-tax-credits-reliefs-and-exemptions/four-year-rule/index.aspx

It is an exercise but it is worth doing, check all of them, health expenses will probably be the biggest element in your case  but don't forget about working from home credits (there will be different calculations for each year as they have changed what counts and what refund you can claim due to the pandemic). Also worth mentioning the stay and spend scheme though it may not apply or you may no longer have the receipts as it was between 01/10/2020 and 30/04/2021. Revenue are prompt on the refund too. Just make sure you have all your receipts/evidence to upload. They require them uploaded now since last year, before that, aside from the stay and spend scheme, you didn't have to give them the receipts at the point of claiming you just had to keep them.


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## Clamball (4 Jan 2023)

I think you are doing great, just suffering a temporary cash flow issue.   This is what the €35K is for, no point having that in the bank and only €20 in your pocket.

Pay off the car and credit card with you savings.
Track your income and outgoings for a couple of months to see where your money is going, really consider each outgoing, what works best for your family, what your savings and spending goals are for the year.

What is 2023 going to be like
Is the wife going back to work full time
How much will childcare increase/decrease
What months will be expensive - like Aug/Sept back to school.
How much do you want to spend on each birthday/baptism/anniversary/Christmas etc., and then plan for it.   You might decide to spend €500 for each event or €20, but usually if it is planned the kids will love it, whether it is sandwiches on the beach or a day out to Fota.
What are you deducting from your salary before take home and can you afford that and running a family of 6.

I would stick with the €900K house, it probably suits your family size and you sound like it is in a wonderful spot. 

 It is very hard at your stage of life to save because you have a lot of outgoings and responsibilities.

What would look good is
1) Rainy day fund
2) Planned spendings and savings
3) A full understanding of your income and outgoings.  This gives you control.
4) Then you can plan for mortgage reduction/pension/ additional income streams etc.

If you and your wife decide that holidays are important then plan and save for them, including spending money
If you prefer to spend on sport and kids activities then go for that.
You just need to decide what works for your family and then don’t spend money in areas that you don’t prioritise.


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## Jollyman (4 Jan 2023)

Clamball said:


> I think you are doing great, just suffering a temporary cash flow issue.   This is what the €35K is for, no point having that in the bank and only €20 in your pocket.
> 
> Pay off the car and credit card with you savings.
> Track your income and outgoings for a couple of months to see where your money is going, really consider each outgoing, what works best for your family, what your savings and spending goals are for the year.
> ...


Thanks so much for your reply feedback is greatly appreciated. Starting this thread alone has given me great focus to put more emphasis on our finances and getting things setup for now and into the future. 

We have decided to pay the car loan and credit card with the €35k but setup an account to maintain the car payments for there duration to put back into the kids savings which will be relocated to a long term savings account. My wife is returning to work in March four days a week. Childcare will stay the same two days a week with grand parent covering the other two days.

I have started up a tracker of current spend and setting up a budget for future at the moment.

Rainy day fund will be priority I have next years centre parcs deposit paid, wife would like to go on at least one foreign holiday a year with a Disney land Florida (estimate €6-10k)and a Lapland (priced €8k for three nights) talked about in the next two years, personally I’d be fine never leaving Munster!


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## Look ahead (5 Jan 2023)

Jollyman said:


> a year with a Disney land Florida (estimate €6-10k)and a Lapland (priced €8k for three nights) talked about in the next two years, personally I’d be fine never leaving Munster!


Its great to plan for nice vacations/experiences when kids are young. 
If you live in scenic area I would def consider converting the garage for tourist purposes.


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## Jollyman (5 Jan 2023)

Look ahead said:


> Its great to plan for nice vacations/experiences when kids are young.
> If you live in scenic area I would def consider converting the garage for tourist purposes.


Thank you, yes i know its great to get the kids out see the world and travel! Travelling with 4 kids under 6 is far from what the bloggers or instagrammers would portray it though, our kids are great but you would personally come home from a holiday feeling like you need a holiday


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## Jollyman (6 Jan 2023)

Can someone comment on below it seems very high deductions per fortnight what should we look at here?

We also got an AVC Statement this week with €18k in it, she no longer pays into same, what should be done with this?

Gross Salary€63,426.00FortnightlyGross Pay€ 1,902.00DeductTax€ 392.30DeductASC€ 108.00DeductLPT€ 13.31DeductUSC€ 58.19DeductPRSI€ 76.09DeductPension 160€ 84.65DeductPension 320€ 36.03DeductCornmarket Income Protection€ 43.00DeductCornmarket Diability Protection€ 10.81DeductINMO€ 11.50Total Deductions€ 833.88Nett Pay€ 1,068.12


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## Protocol (6 Jan 2023)

My income protection costs 0.86% of gross.

Your INMO income protection seems to cost 1.76%, double mine.


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## ClubMan (6 Jan 2023)

Jollyman said:


> Can someone comment on below it seems very high deductions per fortnight what should we look at here?


You should log into your Revenue myAccount and make sure that you're claiming all relevant tax credits for this year and 2019-2022 and, if necessary, request a balancing statement for those years.


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## Pinkpanter (6 Jan 2023)

Gross pay 1902 *26 pay periods per year equals 
€49,452


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