# Standard vs Higher Scale in Civil Service



## bobby04 (9 Apr 2008)

Could anyone clarify the difference (apart from the amount of money obviously) between the Standard salary scale and the Higher salary scale for civil service jobs eg. HEO? How do you get onto the Higher scale etc.?


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## Staples (9 Apr 2008)

Under some agreement some time ago, every department is allowed to assign 10% of its staff in certain (not all) grades to a higher scale pay.  To get on to the higher scale, therfore, you need to be already on the standard scale.  Elevation to the higher scale is meant to be on merit but given the difficulties of comparing this fairly, the practice in many departments is to given those with the longest service in the grade (including, therfore, those who couldn't get promoted from the grade ).

The idea was good in theory, but in pracice it's been a bit of a mess that suits very few (apart from the 10% obviously) and annoys far more. 

By higher scale, you may also be referring to the Depat of Finance practice of paying its staff more than the equivalent grades in other government departments.  Officially, I think the purpose of this arrangement is to reflect the increased lvel of responsibilities that other departments just couldn't hack.


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## bobby04 (9 Apr 2008)

I think that explains it well Staples, thank you very much.


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## Welfarite (10 Apr 2008)

I don't think that is right. All new recruits to CS are paid at higher scale as they are paying higher rates of PRSI (Class A). The standard rate is paid to those who were recruited at Class B rate of PRSI, the lower pay reflecting the lower rate of PRSI they pay.

What staples is talking about is "uplift" rates of pay, an arbitrary way of "rewarding" the best 10% of any grades .


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## tinkerbell (10 Apr 2008)

Yep I think thats its alright.  I pay the higher rates and get the higher rate of pay but often wondered about it alright when I received the various salary scales


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## xeresod (11 Apr 2008)

There are 2 pay rates - pre '95 and post '95 - and within each of those, a standard and higher scale.

The OP mentioned HEO, so [broken link removed] the link to the PSEU pay rates for that grade. 

As an example the Point 1 on each scale for HEO is;

Pre '95 Standard €45,422
Pre '95 Higher €48,175

Post '95 Standard €47,812
Post '95 Higher €50,712


I've only worked in 2 different departments, but both of those assigned people to the higher scales on a competetitive basis, similar to a competetition for promotion (but scaled down).


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## Staples (11 Apr 2008)

With respect all around, I think I'm right.

The attached circular conatins two scales - one for pre-1995 and one for post.



WITHIN EACH SCALE, there are higher and standard sub-scales for some grades. Admission to the higher-scale posts is on the basis set out in my original post.

The differences between pre and post 1995 rates is a different matter. The increases in the pst 95 rates is to reflect the increased levels of PRSI that anyone coming into the civil service since that time is required to pay.


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## Orga (11 Apr 2008)

Staples is completely correct in every respect in this post - there is a more recent circular with the payscales taking into account the more recent 2.5% increase - search the finance web site


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## Faceless CS (11 Apr 2008)

Staples got it right re the Higher and Standard scale in each grade.  Government Departments have a large amount of discretion in choosing how to select staff for assignment to the Higher Scale.  Most seem to be base it on seniority.  

Staples also alluded to the fact that management grades (AP up) in central Departments (Finance & Taoiseachs) are paid more than counterparts in line Departments.  Confusingly they are sometimes called AP Higher Scale etc., or more commonly AP1, PO1 etc.


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## Welfarite (14 Apr 2008)

I stand corrected....you learn something new every day! Thanks, Staples and the rest of ye for putting me right.


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## ajapale (8 Apr 2011)

Related question posted today.


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