# Parking Fine while in valid space in Cork on a Sunday



## Spicey (5 Jan 2011)

I am just wondering if a Parking Fine is correct!

I have just received a "Fixed Charged Offence" from Cork City Council for parking in a valid parking space in a street off Oliver Plunkett Street on a Sunday before Christmas. 

On the day in question we found a small printed notice - not a parking ticket - saying that a fine would be issued.

On Sundays Oliver Plunkett Street (OPS) is a pedestrianised street. The roads into OPS are blocked with bollards but the roads leaving OPS are not. When we saw a space on one of the side roads out of OPS we reversed up the street into the valid space - not sure if this was right or wrong! 

The notice just received mentions that there was a sign on the information plate on the Traffic Sign saying that the Street was pedestrianised. This was not the case as we had looked after seeing other cars with the small printed notices on them.

Should I pay the 40 euro or do I have a case to argue?

SpiceY


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## Leo (6 Jan 2011)

Reversing into that street was illegal. If they had signs indicating a padestrian zone at the legitimate entry points, then the fine is valid.


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## Spicey (6 Jan 2011)

Ok thanks Leo! I didn't realise reversing up the street would be illegal!


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## Crugers (6 Jan 2011)

What road sign(s) were displayed where you entered the street?
Was the road marked or signed as NO ENTRY?
Was the Pedestrian Zone in force when you drove (either forwards or reverse) along it? (Some streets like Grafton Street in Dublin are(or at least were) only in force for certain hours each day!)
For what offence are you being fined on the Fixed Fine Notice?


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## Spicey (6 Jan 2011)

Hi Crugers,

There was no sign displayed where we entered.
There was no road marking or sign saying No Entry.
The pedestrian Zone was in force on the main street from about 11am. There is a one way system in operation and you cannot access the main street because the bollards are on the entry roads yet there are no signs or bollards on the exit roads. 
The offence is "Parking in a road or an area at the entrance to which traffic sign number RUS021 (pedestrianised street or area) was provided during the period indicated on the information plate....."

I suppose if you think about it - the one way entrance roads were blocked as stated above!

It's just quite annoying when the "City" was crying out for shoppers to come in during the cold snap and the fact that it was a Sunday also! Not one of the shops were open on the street we parked on so it was very quiet and also while we were unloading the kids a jeep reversed up the street in full view of a Garda who said nothing! 
I am also surprised that the little notice put on the windscreen is a valid parking ticket as it was not issued by a traffic warden as far as I am aware. Their parking tickets will have all the details including vehicle number and signature etc. This was a 4" x 3" printed sign with a docket number only!


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## wbbs (6 Jan 2011)

I got one of those little notices once and actually thought it was a joke, figured some pranksters printed them up and stuck them on cars for fun.   So I just took it off and ignored it, weeks later I got fine for parking in a disabled space, the space I was in was not a disabled space but was between two such spaces.   I called to local garda station to protest and was told put it in writing to Chief Superintendent.   I did this, also enclosed photo of space I had been parked in showing it was not a disabled space, I figure the person who gave me the ticket presumed there was a row of 3 spaces with me in the middle one.  

Received letter weeks later saying they would not be pursuing it, no admission they were wrong though.   I might add I would never park in a disabled spot, wouldn't even pull into it to post a letter!


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## PetrolHead (7 Jan 2011)

Spicey said:


> Hi Crugers,
> 
> There was no sign displayed where we entered.
> There was no road marking or sign saying No Entry.
> ...




I think you've answered your own question. 'One way' can't be circumvented by by virtue of the fact your car is pointing in the right direction...


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## Crugers (7 Jan 2011)

PetrolHead said:


> I think you've answered your own question. 'One way' can't be circumvented by by virtue of the fact your car is pointing in the right direction...


 
While I agree that the direction the car is pointing doesn't circumvent the 'one way' rule - if the entrance to the road is NOT marked as no entry (or if there was both a no left and a no right turn sign on the road from which you entered) then you can't be expected to be aware that the road is ONE WAY.
But anyway - it seems that the offence was parking in a pedestrianised zone!
So - if you entered a street that wasn't marked NO ENTRY(and/or no left/right turn into) and didn't have any notice at that entry to say it was a pedestrianised zone I'd be of the opinion that you could have a strong case against being fined.

Name the street you actually parked on?


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## Ceist Beag (7 Jan 2011)

Crugers said:


> While I agree that the direction the car is pointing doesn't circumvent the 'one way' rule - if the entrance to the road is NOT marked as no entry (or if there was both a no left and a no right turn sign on the road from which you entered) then you can't be expected to be aware that the road is ONE WAY.



I think the OP was well aware it was a one way street and that they were entering in the wrong direction! 
Oliver Plunkett Street, Cork


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## Crugers (7 Jan 2011)

Ceist Beag said:


> I think the OP was well aware it was a one way street and that they were entering in the wrong direction!
> Oliver Plunkett Street, Cork


 
Well good for you!
But...


Spicey said:


> ...I have just received a "Fixed Charged Offence" from Cork City Council for parking in a valid parking space in a street *off *Oliver Plunkett Street...


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## Ceist Beag (7 Jan 2011)

Ahh selective quoting! I think the below is the one I was referring to Crugers! So regardless of where the car was parked, it could only have got to that street by reversing up a (closed) one way street!


Spicey said:


> The roads into OPS are blocked with bollards but the roads leaving OPS are not. When we saw a space on one of the side roads out of OPS we reversed up the street into the valid space - not sure if this was right or wrong!


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## Complainer (7 Jan 2011)

wbbs said:


> I got one of those little notices once and actually thought it was a joke, figured some pranksters printed them up and stuck them on cars for fun.   So I just took it off and ignored it, weeks later I got fine for parking in a disabled space, the space I was in was not a disabled space but was between two such spaces.   I called to local garda station to protest and was told put it in writing to Chief Superintendent.   I did this, also enclosed photo of space I had been parked in showing it was not a disabled space, I figure the person who gave me the ticket presumed there was a row of 3 spaces with me in the middle one.
> 
> Received letter weeks later saying they would not be pursuing it, no admission they were wrong though.   I might add I would never park in a disabled spot, wouldn't even pull into it to post a letter!



Don't know about your particular situation, but the marked area adjacent to disabled parking bays has a particular purpose. Wheelchair users may need extra space at the side or rear of the car to lift their chair in and out, and to slide out into their chair.


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## Crugers (7 Jan 2011)

Ceist Beag said:


> Ahh selective quoting! I think the below is the one I was referring to Crugers! So regardless of where the car was parked, it could only have got to that street by reversing up a (closed) one way street!


 
Apologies Ceist Beag, on re-reading my post it reads a little to 'smart assed' I don't mean it to be!

The link you posted was the entrance to Oliver Plunket Street from Grand Parade and was obviously marked as no entry. So it is obvious that you must not drive or reverse into OPS at that junction. 

However the OP parked on a street *OFF* Oliver Plunket Street.

If the entrance used to gain access the street is NOT marked in any way as being no entry, then you could reverse up, drive up, reverse down or drive down that street.

For instance, Montague Street runs between Harcourt Street and Camden Street in Dublin 2. The Harcourt Street end is (or was at one time) marked with a solid white line backed by a broken white line across its width, a regulatory road marking indicating No Entry. Harcourt Street being a one way street also has(or had) a 'Regulatory Traffic Sign' saying No Left Turn into that end of Montague Street. So there is no way to enter Montague Street at the Harcourt Street end without disobeying a regulatory sign or marking.
However the Camden Street end of Montague Street has no road markings and no regulatory traffic signs. The street is in effect a one way street but it is not marked a such. If it is not marked as being one way, then you couldn't, IMHO, be fined or sanctioned in any way for driving or reversing along its length in either direction as long as you have not disobeyed any regulatory signs or marking.

It seems odd to me that you could have a street, designated as 'one way only' but have no regulatory road signs at the 'wrong end' to control traffic and even odder that you could have a valid parking zone in a street 'closed' at one end and No Entry at the other...

However the OP appears to have been fined because they parked in a pedestrian zone. So the question is - is the road entrance that they used to gain access to the parking space marked as a pedestrian zone and secondary to that, did they disobey any regulatory signs or markings when entering the street.

If the answer to both is NO then they would have a strong case for disputing the fine!
If on the other hand they ignored any of the above signs then it would be a case of 'pay up'...


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## dereko1969 (7 Jan 2011)

but with Montague Street there is another couple of streets off it before you get to Harcourt Street so it is 2 way but you just can't enter from Harcourt Street.


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## wbbs (7 Jan 2011)

Re disabled space case - there are 2 together then another space with no markings whatsoever and then another disabled space.  Think they leave those spaces big enough to allow for doors etc.

Worth a letter to station to clarify, what have you to lose!


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## Crugers (7 Jan 2011)

dereko1969 said:


> but with Montague Street there is another couple of streets off it before you get to Harcourt Street so it is 2 way but you just can't enter from Harcourt Street.


Yep. Montague Lane is bisected by Montague Street. If you exit Montague Lane (North) onto Montague Street there is a white arrow on blue regulatory sign meaning you MUST turn left and proceed towards Harcourt Street but there are no regulatory signs or markings for exiting from Montague Lane (South).


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## Thirsty (7 Jan 2011)

Reminds me of the Tommy Cooper joke

I had a note on my car the other day, it said _parking fine_ and I thought  - "that was nice"...


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## Leo (10 Jan 2011)

Complainer said:


> Don't know about your particular situation, but the marked area adjacent to disabled parking bays has a particular purpose. Wheelchair users may need extra space at the side or rear of the car to lift their chair in and out, and to slide out into their chair.


 
Such spaces are clearly marked. If someone parked in one of these, a photo of the space would only serve to strenghten the Garda case against them.


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## Spicey (11 Jan 2011)

Thank you all for your input. 

I reckon I better just suffer the consequences of shopping in Cork City at Christmas and part with my hard earned & badly needed 40 euro.


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