Nobody told me about notional service purchase

[analysis]

The only thing I was informed about since joining the public service was the AVC. Nobody explained that there was another way of topping up your pension. Now this site explains that there was a much better NSP procedure pre 2006. Does anyone else feel like this - let down by the employer and the union? If we took an action on this would we get anywhere?

 

[RainyDay]

Seems strange - Have you raised this with your HR department? Is there an NSP scheme available for your employer?

 

[mula]

The only thing I was informed about since joining the public service was the AVC. Nobody explained that there was another way of topping up your pension. Now this site explains that there was a much better NSP procedure pre 2006. Does anyone else feel like this - let down by the employer and the union? If we took an action on this would we get anywhere?

talk to joe

 

[Protocol]

In teaching, etc. there is no local HR office, so there may not be awareness of notional service purchase.

Whereas, the Cornmarket reps know well who to target!!!!

 

[oysterman]

The DES has never kept it a secret - the green book they send teachers at the time they join the scheme has all the details. Naturally, many don't get around to reading it. That's why the blame rests squarely with the teaching unions. They are forever allowing their members to be bombarded with sales pitches by Cornmarket for poor value AVCs (at least in terms of charges relative to what is elsewhere available) but have never to my knowledge facilitated proper information provision to their members. Complain to your union. Put down a motion for your annual convention - it won't get on the agenda but at least you'll have tried.

 

[ajapale]

.... since joining the public service ..

Hi Analysis and welcome to AAM,

The public service is a very very large entity. What part of the PServ do you work in?

Many young entrants have no interest in avc's (of any sort) and just have a vague idea that they pay a superannuation deduction.



aj

 

[smarthinking]

There was a guy in Cork, ex lecturer in Cork I.T. I think who had some headlines in the paper around election time about the poor information given to public servants about purchase of notional service. Does anyone have contact details for him?

 

[saibhreas]

Hi analysis,
I work in the Civil Service and our partnership committee organised a talk on personal finance by Colm Rapple about 2 years ago which I attended. The question was raised - which is better notional service or avc's to top up pension?
He stressed that it was impossible to give a clear rule of thumb on which was best. Said the sums would have to be done individually for each separate case. He didn't (wouldn't, actually) elaborate at all, so I don't know exactly what he meant. But I gathered that there are a lot of variables and that it's a complex question.
No excuse for you not being made aware of all the options though.

 

[mula]

Hi analysis,
I work in the Civil Service and our partnership committee organised a talk on personal finance by Colm Rapple about 2 years ago which I attended. The question was raised - which is better notional service or avc's to top up pension?
He stressed that it was impossible to give a clear rule of thumb on which was best. Said the sums would have to be done individually for each separate case. He didn't (wouldn't, actually) elaborate at all, so I don't know exactly what he meant. But I gathered that there are a lot of variables and that it's a complex question.
No excuse for you not being made aware of all the options though.

imho buying years through nsps depends on what options you want in retirement. if you want to keep early retirement open before 60 then its not an option.if you prefer to have a lumpsum at retirement and control and the speed of which you draw your money down then prsa avcs is a better option. some people like the certain of a fixed pension every year and if you fall into this catogory and dont plan to retire early then buying years is most likely for you. if you choose the avc route then dont use any of the union providers as their charges are the massive. get a quote for nsps work out how long you'd have to live before you'd start to benefit and if it seems to long then go the avc route. dont fall for the recommended provider rubbish about salary deduction as you can organise this yourself through your personal tax credits and save a bundle on charges.

the 3 recommended union avc providers as far as im aware are

cornmarket/irish life who charge 500 euros up front and then 5% of your contribution each month from there on in. if you plan to top up its another 300 euros each time for there advice and a 1% salary deduction fee per month

marsh 5% of your contribution and a 1.75% mgmt charge plus a 3 or 4 euros a month admin fee

personal and finance/new ireland / corporate and personal
many different names wonder why? they charge a whooping 25-30% of your first years contribution/top up and a crazy 2.75% annual mgt charge

mula

 

[RainyDay]

imho buying years through nsps depends on what options you want in retirement. if you want to keep early retirement open before 60 then its not an option.if you prefer to have a lumpsum at retirement and control and the speed of which you draw your money down then prsa avcs is a better option. some people like the certain of a fixed pension every year and if you fall into this catogory and dont plan to retire early then buying years is most likely for you.

It is worth noting that the early retirement option is not an option for more recent joiners (those who joined post 1995, I think).

 

[mula]

It is worth noting that the early retirement option is not an option for more recent joiners (those who joined post 1995, I think).

they cant go earlier then 55 but can go between 55-60 with the actuarial reduction applied

 

[RainyDay]

they cant go earlier then 55 but can go between 55-60 with the actuarial reduction applied

There is no mention of any ability to get benefits prior to 65 in the FAQs (pdf download), which say;

Annex 2 – For New Entrants on or after 1 April 2004

For members who are “new Entrants” (as defined in the Public Service Superannuation (Miscellaneous Provisions) Act 2004) on or after 1st April 2004, the compulsory retirement of Age 65 is removed.

Q. How do the changes introduced for staff recruited on or
after 1st April 2004 affect my pension?
The main changes are:
· You will now qualify for payment of a pension or preserved pension at age 65.
· [Prison Officers minimum retirement age will be 55 and will continue to qualify for preserved benefits at age 60 which is also their maximum retirement age].
· Except for Prison Officers, the compulsory retirement age of 65 is removed.
· Service after age 65 will reckon for pension purposes subject to a maximum of 40 years service.

Do you have a source for this?

 

[mula]

There is no mention of any ability to get benefits prior to 65 in the FAQs (pdf download), which say;


Do you have a source for this?

yes, its in that FAQ

entrants after 2004 have a preserved retirement age of 65 which means they can go early between 55- 65 but will still be hit with a actuarial reduction.
ppl in before this have a preserved retirement age of 60 which means they can go between 50-60 but will be hit with the actuaril reduction

see below

b.​

What are Actuarially Reduced Benefits? With effect from 1
April 2004, a facility was introduced to allow a member who has
a minimum of 2 years’ qualifying service to retire from age 50 (or
55 for “new entrants” (except Prison Officers) on or after 1st
April 2004) with immediate, actuarially reduced superannuation
benefits in lieu of preserved benefits at a later date. This
provides greater flexibility to members in terms of retirement
planning.

happy days

​

 

[Haille]

Tok early retirement 1 year ago.I purchased notional service from the Dept.Remember the earlier you join the % contribution is lower.