My ex's PIP says he can get my name off the joint mortgage?

B

BobbyBee

Registered User
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Hi There
I hope somebody can give me some advice.
I moved out of the home in 2011, I have a joint mortgage. I have two children and they live with me, have been renting ever since I moved out, my ex partner stayed on in the house. Ex partner is in public sector with good salary, but has opted not to pay for over two years and never fully met the mortgage repayments. The house is subsequently entered into legal proceedings, going to court for the 3rd time in October. I have just been contacted by Cork Insolvency to say they need my co-operation, as the ex partner is applying for Personal Insolvency Agreement. The mail that I received states that the consent they require is to have my name removed from the Deeds of the Property and liability regarding same also removed. They are stating the benefit to me is that I will no longer be liable for the debt or any negative equity attached thereto, and that my liability to the Mortage Provider will be finished. My question, is this something I must run to give my consent to? I feel that this is hugely beneficial to my ex partner, and that I have contributed to the mortgage repayments for 4 years, and now being told to sign documents, when this all could have been prevented, as he is in a well paid job (double what I earn), he just opted to not pay, and take the easier route out by now going for a huge write off and restructured mortgage etc. I am aware the house is in negative equity, but ex will no doubt get a write off, and pay less than what I pay for rent, and own the property outright.

Any advice/comments - much appreciated.
 
You really need to give the numbers to get proper advice.
Value of house
Amount of the mortgage
Which lender
Is it a cheap tracker?
Does your ex have other assets or liabilities?
Do you have a separation agreement? Will you be entitled to a share of his pension on retirement?
What ages are your children?
Does your husband pay maintenance?


BobbyBee said:
The mail that I received states that the consent they require is to have my name removed from the Deeds of the Property and liability regarding same also removed. They are stating the benefit to me is that I will no longer be liable for the debt or any negative equity attached thereto, and that my liability to the Mortage Provider will be finished.
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This makes no sense to me. I don't see why the lender would agree to let you off the mortgage if you have a good income. Maybe lenders are doing this as part of PIAs, but I am surprised that they are.

First, you should talk to a solicitor.

You should separately consult a PIP who might negotiate with Cork Insolvency on your behalf.

But the long-term maintenance is also a big issue, and probably a bigger issue.

If what he is proposing is acceptable to the bank, you end up free of any liability which is a pretty good position to be in.

Brendan
 
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Hi Brendan
The value of the house is approximately 230K
Arrears approx 55K
Lender EBS
Not a tracker, on variable rate of 3.7%
We were never married? we were together 7 years
Children - 8 and 6
He pays 100 per week if and when he wants

We going back to Circuit Court for in October, is it not too late to engage with a PIP at this stage?
Brendan, it is not myself that has the good salary, it is the ex living in the house, I am renting at 1K per month with my two children, and the last agreement in court was that he had a test period of 3 months for 875euro.
May I ask why the long term maintenance is an issue?

Thanks so much
Miss B
 
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I would have thought that the biggest issue to be resolved here is that he pays proper maintenance for his children. I presume that as part of his proposed PIA, he is saying that he has to pay €10k a year for his two children. But he presumably doesn't pay anything like that.

When a couple with children separate, they usually do an agreement which covers everything and not just the children or not just the house.

You have a valuable card to play. You can either go into court and consent to the repossession or your solicitor can negotiate with him and get a proper formal legal agreement done up for the maintenance of his children.

Why did you and the children move out? Why did he not move out and leave you and the children in the family home?

It can be difficult to tell the full story in a public forum. You really need a solicitor to advise on what is the best deal for you.

If he refuses to pay you maintenance, you would object to doing any deal on the house, so he will never be able to sell it without your consent. At some stage, it will return to positive equity and you can insist on getting your share of it.

It's obviously much better if the two of you sit down and reach some agreement. But he seems totally irresponsible, so you should look after your own interests.

Brendan
 
Brendan Burgess said:
I would have thought that the biggest issue to be resolved here is that he pays proper maintenance for his children. I presume that as part of his proposed PIA, he is saying that he has to pay €10k a year for his two children. But he presumably doesn't pay anything like that.

When a couple with children separate, they usually do an agreement which covers everything and not just the children or not just the house.

You have a valuable card to play. You can either go into court and consent to the repossession or your solicitor can negotiate with him and get a proper formal legal agreement done up for the maintenance of his children.

Why did you and the children move out? Why did he not move out and leave you and the children in the family home?

It can be difficult to tell the full story in a public forum. You really need a solicitor to advise on what is the best deal for you.

If he refuses to pay you maintenance, you would object to doing any deal on the house, so he will never be able to sell it without your consent. At some stage, it will return to positive equity and you can insist on getting your share of it.

It's obviously much better if the two of you sit down and reach some agreement. But he seems totally irresponsible, so you should look after your own interests.

Brendan
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Hi Brendan
He has a court order to pay 100euro per week, but like I say, this is not up to date either - he skips at least once per month, does not contribute to schooling, outings or anything like it. It is not that he totally refuses, he just pays when he feels like it, if he happens to take the kid for a hair cut he sure deducts that off the maintenance too.

He would not move out of the house, and it was a volatile relationship, so I had no option but to leave with the two children.

I forgot to answer your earlier question as well, he has no other debt apart from the house, no credit cards or HP's, just the house and the maintenance. You mentioned in your first reply that the long term maintenance is an issue, in what way? When I see a solicitor, do I ask her to renegotiate?

He will not be able to get a restructured mortgage without getting a huge write off which the Insolvency Agency will surely get, and he will end up paying less than what I am paying rent, and I have the two children. I would just feel totally outdone, just signing a consent form. I have also contributed four years of repayments to the property.

Your advice is much appreciated, thank you
 
It seems to me that paying €5,200 a year for the maintenance of his children is very low when he is a well paid public servant who is paying €875 for his accommodation alone, but I know nothing of these issues and don't know what is reasonable. What does your solicitor say?

Brendan
 
Brendan, to be honest - I have been to court numerous times, he seems to be walking away laughing!!! he has been paying 80 for 2 years and 100 for the last two years. I need to change Solicitors, which I will be doing this week, to try and sort out the house as well as maintenance. I will definitely give you an update. Your advice has been very valuable to me.
 
Just to be clear, I have no idea what the level of maintenance should be. It seems to me that €100 a week is low, but maybe that is what the going rate is.

Brendan
 
I understand, but you have a fairly strong card to play as joint owner of the house.

But your solicitor should advise you best on how to play it.

I don't see why you should co-operate at all with someone who is not paying you proper maintenance.

Brendan
 
Can you get him to pay maintainance through the court? That way if he doesn't pay he is automaticaly in contempt of court. My apologies if I have garbled this, but it is what I understand.
 
In regards to maintenance, see below from Citizens Information

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/e...ivorce/maintenance_orders_and_agreements.html

Enforcing a maintenance order
In cases where a parent/spouse/civil partner fails to comply with a court order and does not pay the amount awarded, an attachment of earnings order can be sought from the court, if the person is in employment or on a private pension. This order results in the maintenance amount being deducted at source by the parent's/spouse's/civil partner's employer. If the parent/spouse/civil partner is self-employed, an enforcement summons can be applied for.

The Civil Law (Miscellaneous Provisions) Act 2011 has amended the legislation to give the District Court the power to regard a failure by a parent/spouse/civil partner to comply with a court order as contempt of court and to deal with it accordingly, including by means of imprisonment

The District Court in making a maintenance order can direct that the payment under the order be made to the District Court Clerk if the court considers that it would be proper to do so. The Circuit Court may as part of its order direct that a maintenance order is payable through the District Court. The District Court has a fully computerised payments system for the receipt and transmission of payments received.
 
Brendan Burgess said:
I understand, but you have a fairly strong card to play as joint owner of the house.

But your solicitor should advise you best on how to play it.

I don't see why you should co-operate at all with someone who is not paying you proper maintenance.

Brendan
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Hi Brendan, so apparently a creditors meeting has been postponed in order to give me opportunity to seek legal advice. I do not qualify for legal aid, and really do not have money for solicitors. The Insolvency Group advised that in the Personal Insolvency Arrangement they are requesting that I be fully released from my liability to EBS and be removed from the Title Deeds. This obviously has to be approved by the Bank. Am I right in thinking they want my "consent" as co-borrower before the creditors meeting?

Thanks for any advice.
 
I am not a solicitor or a PIP, so I can't really advise any further.

I suggest that you write to the PIP and say that you will not be consenting without legal and debt advice and you cannot afford legal advice. However, if your ex pays you €1,000, you will take legal and debt advice.

Brendan
 
Brendan Burgess said:
I am not a solicitor or a PIP, so I can't really advise any further.

I suggest that you write to the PIP and say that you will not be consenting without legal and debt advice and you cannot afford legal advice. However, if your ex pays you €1,000, you will take legal and debt advice.

Brendan
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Thank you, good idea - I will write to the PIP.
 
BobbyBee,

You sound like you're in a difficult situation. Raising 2 children with very little support and on a reasonable salary cannot be easy. I don't know why you'd consider doing anything to help out your ex. It seems like he has a lot more to gain by this deal than you, so in my opinion you should not do a thing unless he makes it very well worth you while. Creditors know that they've nothing to gain by going after you for anything.
 
Hi,was in similar situation never married,bought property in 2007 with ex partner.3 children 5,8,10 so i feel your pain hun.after the break up i left the property,he stayed.the house naturally went into arrears,he pays 130 for maintenance, through the courts and has missed alot of payments along the way.sick of going through the courts.but we did manage to sort out the house through PIP.the arrears were extremely high and was in negative equity also.the deal was that i would come off the mortgage and he would solely take responsibility.i was wary at first,thinking there was a catch....
but the PIP assured me that it was a one time deal and i could walk away and get my life back on track.i agreed and have never looked back.i believe he got 20 thousand of arrears wrote off and is paying the mortgage till he is 70 odd,which is fine by me.my gut tells me that he will mess that up down the road and guess what???it will have nothing to do with me...stay strong girl...
 
Hello guys,
I was married with two kids. Tried to go insolvency route but my ex has left the country so finding it impossible to get him to sign his name off the mortgage. So left here dealing with it by myself. The house is going to be repossessed and I'm going to be left with the legal bills and the arrears as well. What I wouldn't give to have the option of walking away debt free. Best of luck with it.
 
Hey Sarah33,
I am in exactly the same position as you, I have refused to sign, and going back to District Court on 12 October, I just felt that he is walking away with everything, he stayed on in the house, with his new partner etc, and basically opted not to pay a cent for about 2 years. Plus he want's to also reduce his maintenance to 60euro per week for the children, 8 & 6, just feels like he is getting away with murder. I went to a Solicitor and said that I also contributed to the mortgage whilst I was there during the first 3years of the mortgage and thought I am very fair by taking what was paid in the three years and dividing it by two, which only came to over 8K. In my heart and soul I know, he will not pay me a penny!!! but thought it is worth a try. This has not been communicated to anybody but my Solicitor. After reading your post, I am thinking, should I just walk away from it, or do I approach the PIP and advise that I will sign on the condition that he pays me out the 8K, the house will not be in negative equity forever. Your thoughts/comments appreciated
 
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