We have made an offer on a house the sellor wants to accept but on the basis that they keep doing viewings, in the hopes of gettin better offer. I told auctioneer no way that we wanted it off the market if they were accepting offer. Any advice in this situation? We are selling to buy this house also so we can't be put in the position where we have no where to live!!!
Vendor Wants To Accept Our Offer But Continue Viewings?
- Thread starter reb30
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Brendan Burgess
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Re: Vendor Wants To Accept Our Offer But Continue Viewins?
Hi reb
This is odd. Some vendors agree to sell it but keep showing it quietly and gazump you if they get a higher offer.
You should make your offer conditional on signed contracts being supplied by them to your solicitor within 14 days or withdraw the offer.
Make sure that if they send you blank contracts for you to sign first that you don't sign them. Otherwise they could hold onto them for a long time while negotiating with other buyers.
Brendan
Hi reb
This is odd. Some vendors agree to sell it but keep showing it quietly and gazump you if they get a higher offer.
You should make your offer conditional on signed contracts being supplied by them to your solicitor within 14 days or withdraw the offer.
Make sure that if they send you blank contracts for you to sign first that you don't sign them. Otherwise they could hold onto them for a long time while negotiating with other buyers.
Brendan
Re: Vendor Wants To Accept Our Offer But Continue Viewins?
I think the reason for this is unless you have a signed contract for the sale of your current house you are not in a position to sign the contract for the purchase of the new house. Once you have signed contract for your own home then you can call the shots. This very often means having to move out before you have a new home, but you can sometimes sell with a long closing and buy with a short closing. Otherwise rent or family/friends for a short while.
I think the reason for this is unless you have a signed contract for the sale of your current house you are not in a position to sign the contract for the purchase of the new house. Once you have signed contract for your own home then you can call the shots. This very often means having to move out before you have a new home, but you can sometimes sell with a long closing and buy with a short closing. Otherwise rent or family/friends for a short while.
Re: Vendor Wants To Accept Our Offer But Continue Viewins?
Make an offer and pay a deposit to the EA via your solicitor that is conditional on the house being withdrawn from the market.
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Re: Vendor Wants To Accept Our Offer But Continue Viewins?
The E/A will not stop showing the house(sale agreed) until he has a deposit and is satisfied the purchaser is in a position to sign contracts, subject to survey, in the next few weeks(sold). You would need a letter from your solicitor confirming signed contract on the sale of your own home and loan approval for any additional funds needed. If not selling your own home, a letter from Solicitor/Bank confirming you have sufficient funds/approval for the purchase.
Think about it, how long will it take to sell your house, 3 months, 6 or even longer in todays market. Will you get the price you need, will your circumstances change in this time.
In the absence of any other buyer the E/A may well bear you in mind but will continue showing and will sell to the first satisfactory offer who can sign a contract.
The E/A will not stop showing the house(sale agreed) until he has a deposit and is satisfied the purchaser is in a position to sign contracts, subject to survey, in the next few weeks(sold). You would need a letter from your solicitor confirming signed contract on the sale of your own home and loan approval for any additional funds needed. If not selling your own home, a letter from Solicitor/Bank confirming you have sufficient funds/approval for the purchase.
Think about it, how long will it take to sell your house, 3 months, 6 or even longer in todays market. Will you get the price you need, will your circumstances change in this time.
In the absence of any other buyer the E/A may well bear you in mind but will continue showing and will sell to the first satisfactory offer who can sign a contract.
Re: Vendor Wants To Accept Our Offer But Continue Viewins?
This happened my dad a couple of years back.
Lady selling house privately - no estate agent.
Dad paid deposit through solicitors and his solicitor drew up contracts, and sent it to the vendors solicitor.
In the mean time the lady selling the house, found out that her neighbours house was up for sale 50k more than she agreed to sell at to my dad, and started trying to sell it again.
Dad's solicitor informed dad to hold tight, it turned out that she couldnt sell the house to anyone else because no other solicitor would touch it once they found out that a deposit had been paid and contracts drawn up.
Vendor signed contracts four months later in April of that year
This happened my dad a couple of years back.
Lady selling house privately - no estate agent.
Dad paid deposit through solicitors and his solicitor drew up contracts, and sent it to the vendors solicitor.
In the mean time the lady selling the house, found out that her neighbours house was up for sale 50k more than she agreed to sell at to my dad, and started trying to sell it again.
Dad's solicitor informed dad to hold tight, it turned out that she couldnt sell the house to anyone else because no other solicitor would touch it once they found out that a deposit had been paid and contracts drawn up.
Vendor signed contracts four months later in April of that year
Re: Vendor Wants To Accept Our Offer But Continue Viewins?
There is a lot of confused thinking/posting going on in this post !! Twofor1 is the only one making any sense.
First things first:
1. If you're selling, you're the vendor.
2. If you're buying, you're the purchaser.
3. You're only a real, substantial, purchaser, if you have money to buy and no house to sell. If either of these are not met, you're not a real purchaser, you're a wannabe purchaser. And you don't get to make unreasonable demands
4. If vendor and purchaser , through the EA, get to the stage of agreeing a price and a closing date - neither of which are conditional on anything ( e.g. organise loan approval( already done), house to sell etc.,etc.,), they can start getting serious about contracts and taking the property off the market.
5. At that stage, Purchaser pays a refundable booking deposit to EA and shortly after Contracts WHICH ARE DRAWN UP BY THE VENDORS SOLICITOR!!!! are sent out, in duplicate, by the Vendor's solicitor unsigned by the Vendor. The Vendor does not sign them in advance. Its for the Purchasers to sign them, with the agreed closing date inserted and return them with the agreed deposit.
6. If the Vendor is going ahead, they should sign both and return one. There is now a binding contract in existence the conditions of which, if not fulfilled by either party lead to legal repercussions. If the Vendor does not, cannot or will not sign, its for the Purchaser to walk away - which they are free to do. Deadlines are the only thing that work.
Mostly, what everyone is trying to do at the moment is to get to completion stage a.s.a.p. after initial agreement with no dithering by either side - this means Purchaser being loan approved and capable of drawing down funds without delay and Vendor being in a position to move out. If Purchaser does not have funds or Vendor cannot move out, you cannot have a completion.
"Dad's solicitor informed dad to hold tight, it turned out that she couldnt sell the house to anyone else because no other solicitor would touch it once they found out that a deposit had been paid and contracts drawn up."
This is very confusing and it cannot have happened this way. It is far more likely that she was unable to find another Purchaser.
mf
There is a lot of confused thinking/posting going on in this post !! Twofor1 is the only one making any sense.
First things first:
1. If you're selling, you're the vendor.
2. If you're buying, you're the purchaser.
3. You're only a real, substantial, purchaser, if you have money to buy and no house to sell. If either of these are not met, you're not a real purchaser, you're a wannabe purchaser. And you don't get to make unreasonable demands
4. If vendor and purchaser , through the EA, get to the stage of agreeing a price and a closing date - neither of which are conditional on anything ( e.g. organise loan approval( already done), house to sell etc.,etc.,), they can start getting serious about contracts and taking the property off the market.
5. At that stage, Purchaser pays a refundable booking deposit to EA and shortly after Contracts WHICH ARE DRAWN UP BY THE VENDORS SOLICITOR!!!! are sent out, in duplicate, by the Vendor's solicitor unsigned by the Vendor. The Vendor does not sign them in advance. Its for the Purchasers to sign them, with the agreed closing date inserted and return them with the agreed deposit.
6. If the Vendor is going ahead, they should sign both and return one. There is now a binding contract in existence the conditions of which, if not fulfilled by either party lead to legal repercussions. If the Vendor does not, cannot or will not sign, its for the Purchaser to walk away - which they are free to do. Deadlines are the only thing that work.
Mostly, what everyone is trying to do at the moment is to get to completion stage a.s.a.p. after initial agreement with no dithering by either side - this means Purchaser being loan approved and capable of drawing down funds without delay and Vendor being in a position to move out. If Purchaser does not have funds or Vendor cannot move out, you cannot have a completion.
"Dad's solicitor informed dad to hold tight, it turned out that she couldnt sell the house to anyone else because no other solicitor would touch it once they found out that a deposit had been paid and contracts drawn up."
This is very confusing and it cannot have happened this way. It is far more likely that she was unable to find another Purchaser.
mf
Re: Vendor Wants To Accept Our Offer But Continue Viewins?
"Agree contracts. Vendor and purchaser each sign one duplicate agreed by solicitors, which are then exchanged by solicitors at the same time."
I don't see any difference here. You are right about the balance of power. This is all down to pigginess and stupidity and generally acting the maggot.
Solicitors work on the basis that their clients are serious - if it turns out that our clients are acting the maggot, whats to do?
In your suggestion, you are still going to have the problem of what happens if one won't sign?
And it regularly happens that a Purchaser makes it quite clear to a Vendor that unless those contracts are signed p.d.q. that they will walk. And since most Purchasers want to buy the property, it is unlikely that it can drag on - unless the Purchaser is willing to let it.
mf
"Agree contracts. Vendor and purchaser each sign one duplicate agreed by solicitors, which are then exchanged by solicitors at the same time."
I don't see any difference here. You are right about the balance of power. This is all down to pigginess and stupidity and generally acting the maggot.
Solicitors work on the basis that their clients are serious - if it turns out that our clients are acting the maggot, whats to do?
In your suggestion, you are still going to have the problem of what happens if one won't sign?
And it regularly happens that a Purchaser makes it quite clear to a Vendor that unless those contracts are signed p.d.q. that they will walk. And since most Purchasers want to buy the property, it is unlikely that it can drag on - unless the Purchaser is willing to let it.
mf
Re: Vendor Wants To Accept Our Offer But Continue Viewins?
If I was the vendor, I would want to continue the viewings pending signing of contracts - not to get more money but to ensure i had a sale. Unfortunately for my parents when trying to sell their home a few years back, they received an offer form a potential purchaser. The EA would not do any viewings once the 'offer' was accepted. Then the purchaser kept stalling & came back with a lower offer before pulling out of the sale completely.
If I was the vendor, I would want to continue the viewings pending signing of contracts - not to get more money but to ensure i had a sale. Unfortunately for my parents when trying to sell their home a few years back, they received an offer form a potential purchaser. The EA would not do any viewings once the 'offer' was accepted. Then the purchaser kept stalling & came back with a lower offer before pulling out of the sale completely.
"But there is absolutlely nothing to stop the vendor from sitting on the contracts. In that case as a buyer you can not go and buy another house, in case the vendor does eventually execute, but the vendor has the ability to tear up the contracts if desired. "
This is the nub of it. Yes there is something the Purchaser can do. This is not an open ended situation - a Purchaser who cannot get the signed Contracts back from the Vendor sets a deadline. And if the deadline is not met, and having advised the Vendor that they would walk away by that day unless the signed Contracts have been returned, the Purchaser is free to walk away. It really is that simple. They terminate any interest in the property and walk away from the situation. And go buy another house.
"I am in constant frustration with the legal profession. A solicitor acting for a buyer should be thinking of these things that might better protect the interests of their clients and trying to secure them. "
I am in constant frustration with the clients!!! The reason we have these frustrations is precisely because a lot of people ( both Vendors and Purchasers) insist on behaving badly. And as long as people behave badly, no amount of change of rules will make a blind bit of difference.
mf
This is the nub of it. Yes there is something the Purchaser can do. This is not an open ended situation - a Purchaser who cannot get the signed Contracts back from the Vendor sets a deadline. And if the deadline is not met, and having advised the Vendor that they would walk away by that day unless the signed Contracts have been returned, the Purchaser is free to walk away. It really is that simple. They terminate any interest in the property and walk away from the situation. And go buy another house.
"I am in constant frustration with the legal profession. A solicitor acting for a buyer should be thinking of these things that might better protect the interests of their clients and trying to secure them. "
I am in constant frustration with the clients!!! The reason we have these frustrations is precisely because a lot of people ( both Vendors and Purchasers) insist on behaving badly. And as long as people behave badly, no amount of change of rules will make a blind bit of difference.
mf
Re: Vendor Wants To Accept Our Offer But Continue Viewins?
Can the purchaser's solicitor not require that the contract done up by vendor's solicitor includes a period (e.g. 2 weeks) by which vendor must sign after purchaser has signed ,otherwise purchaser's signature is void ?
Can the purchaser's solicitor not require that the contract done up by vendor's solicitor includes a period (e.g. 2 weeks) by which vendor must sign after purchaser has signed ,otherwise purchaser's signature is void ?
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Brendan Burgess
Founder
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MF1
Thanks for that great post.
What is the normal practice here?
The purchaser returns the signed contract on Day 1
It comes back signed by the vendor on Day 10?
At what stage do you set a deadline?
Do you do it on Day 1, when you return the contracts?
Do you do it on Day 20, when you are getting worried?
What notice period do you set?
In the present case, where the purchaser is worried, can they insist on contracts being returned within 10 days?
Brendan
Thanks for that great post.
What is the normal practice here?
The purchaser returns the signed contract on Day 1
It comes back signed by the vendor on Day 10?
At what stage do you set a deadline?
Do you do it on Day 1, when you return the contracts?
Do you do it on Day 20, when you are getting worried?
What notice period do you set?
In the present case, where the purchaser is worried, can they insist on contracts being returned within 10 days?
Brendan
Well there is an element of how long is a piece of string!!!
In my most recent conveyance just before Christmas, Vendor issued contracts and sought their return within 14 days. Fat Chance! My clients had not ( despite being advised) organised life cover and as they were both late 40's there could well have been an issue there. So after 14 days Vendor is screaming for Contracts and Purchasers finally wake up and realise they need to get the finger out. So Contracts eventually get signed by Purchasers 2 days before completion, bedlam and nervous breakdowns all round but we close in a big heap just before Christmas.
You get a very good feel in a transaction from a relatively early stage as to what is likely to happen. Purchasers should be working towards a completion date and I suppose you don't get too worried for a week or so after sending back Contracts. But you'd start phoning after that and once your calls are not being returned, you'll begin to get suspicious. Very suspicious.
I'm wary of clients ( vendors or purchasers) setting unrealistic deadlines - normally from a position of terrific ignorance- because very often those unrealistic deadlines backfire. Yes of course a Purchaser can insist on a Vendor returning signed Contracts, and in todays climate it is almost a given that contracts will be back and signed within days. But I'd prefer to know why they are not being returned before jumping on the High Horse.
And one thing the EA's have a problem with is agreeing all of the three elements necessary between the parties:
Price
Contents
Closing date - the last being a huge bug bear. There is a massive difference between
vendors who are ready to move in 2-6 weeks and vendors who want 2-6 months. Some purchasers will happily agree to a long closing date but most want the deal done sooner.
mf
Brendan Burgess
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Thanks MF
Jut to be clear. There is nothing in the contract specifying a deadline for return of signed contracts by the vendor?
You assume that there will be no problem, but if you get worried, then you send a letter to the vendor's solicitors saying "Unless the signed contracts are returned within 14 days, the purchaser is pulling out of the contract". Is it that simple?
Jut to be clear. There is nothing in the contract specifying a deadline for return of signed contracts by the vendor?
You assume that there will be no problem, but if you get worried, then you send a letter to the vendor's solicitors saying "Unless the signed contracts are returned within 14 days, the purchaser is pulling out of the contract". Is it that simple?
I have just hung up the phone following a converstaion with my EA about the same issue.
I have gone sale agreed 3 times on my property, Each time the contracts were sent to the purchasers solrs who hummed, hawed dithered then changed their mind about buying.
I have gone sale agreed again & I have instructed the EA to show the house until the contacts are signed & the 10% deposit received.
I won't be stung again!!
I have gone sale agreed 3 times on my property, Each time the contracts were sent to the purchasers solrs who hummed, hawed dithered then changed their mind about buying.
I have gone sale agreed again & I have instructed the EA to show the house until the contacts are signed & the 10% deposit received.
I won't be stung again!!
Just to add to MF1's very informative post: in the UK they do things slightly differently; they 'exchange' contracts, so that vendor and purchaser are simultaneously bound at the time of exchange (which often takes place by phone - i.e. each party sends the other a signed contract, and at some later date, they agree that contracts are now 'exchanged').
In theory, this sounds better.
In practice the exchange of contracts is often delayed until very very close to completion, keeping everybody on tenterhooks and prolonging the period in which either party can pull out, often until after the solicitors have done quite a bit of their work.
Our contract procedures in Ireland are not systemically weak - there is no system which will not be abused by some people, and there is, as MF1 says, always the option to set a deadline.
In theory, this sounds better.
In practice the exchange of contracts is often delayed until very very close to completion, keeping everybody on tenterhooks and prolonging the period in which either party can pull out, often until after the solicitors have done quite a bit of their work.
Our contract procedures in Ireland are not systemically weak - there is no system which will not be abused by some people, and there is, as MF1 says, always the option to set a deadline.