Key Post: Property in Brazil - Any advice?

Re: Property in Brazil - Any advice?

Hi Noel - Perhaps if you could explain how you came to choose Avatar and/or Brazil, others might be able to help you tease out the pro's & con's of such an investment.

In the meantime, check out these discussions on foreign property;

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Re: Property in Brazil - Any advice?

Maybe I'm getting cynical in my old age but I think the name and web link should be removed from this in case it's spam - good way for spammers to get past automatic deletion is to ask a question rather than blatently say 'look at my Brazil property investment'. I'm sure this has succeeded as people will be tempted to look at the website. Also, maybe it's just a typo but the question doesn't read as if it was written by a native English speaker, adding to my suspicion.

Moderator - feel free to delete this if you want.
 
Re: Property in Brazil - Any advice?

I know very little about Brazil but it would strike me as being extremely foolhardly for the average Irish person to buy property there. The logistical problems in researching, monitoring and controlling an investment there would be colossal, given the huge geographical distances involved and the time and (presumably high) expense of flying out there on a regular basis.
 
Re: Property in Brazil - Any advice?

Hi Mags - It's possible that you're right here, though given that I edited the original post to make it a link, I doubt if this particular post is spam - I'd have thought that any spammer would have been a bit more bullish about their product.

But in general, we prefer to see sensible, logical discussion of such issues here, rather than censorship of discussion.
 
Re: Property in Brazil - Any advice?

fairy nuff rainyday

curiosity got the better of me and I had a look at the website - reinforced my view I'm afraid. For a non-refundable deposit of £1,000 you book your villa - except if you take the pre-inspection tour (for, curiously enough £1,000 non-refundable, send it to this address) - the 4 day trip leaves on the last Wednesday of the month ('but we're flexible') from East Midlands airport (Brazil from East Midlands!) - no other airline is allowed to land where they go except that they have special permission from the state authorities to land there. The buy-to-let option is particularly appealing as you get 3 years rent in full, up-front and you can also get a 0% mortgage which can be in the names of up to 10 people.
 
Re: Property in Brazil - Any advice?

The buy-to-let option is particularly appealing as you get 3 years rent in full, up-front
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I know nothing about this company and haven't the time to research it in any detail, but I'm curious about this point. Is this genuine, or is it achieved by bumping up the sale price to raise an upfront "refund" to the buyer.

I have never heard before of anyone paying rent three years in advance. Maybe they do things differently in Brazil. Still sounds strange to me.
 
Re: Property in Brazil - Any advice?

I just wonder why, if there are such easy fortunes to be made in property in Brazil, would these guys setup a company to market property development in Brazil - surely they'd be better off just sinking all their money directly into the property itself?
 
Is this for real

This same scheme was mentioned in an article on foreign prop investment in the property section of either the Sunday Tribune or the Sunday Business Post a few weeks back. It sounds too good to be true for sure. Buy a villa for £33,000 and get £17000 back immediately and another £17000 in 3 years in guaranteed rent paid in advance by the Bank of Brazil. That means villa paid for in 6 years without ever having to lift a finger - maybe visit once obviously for £1000.

Is there any regulatory body (based in Ireland) where one could check if everything is above board? or who should opne be directing such questions at
 
Re: Is this for real

www.itacare.com.br/english.php

Hi,

check out the above link to find out what property really costs and what rents you might realise. Brazil is not doing so bad at present, as a tourist destination, and due to issues (Iraq etc.) elsewhere it is extremely popular with North Americans.

I can direct someone directly to a Brazillian friend for info, if they feel suspicious about a deal.
 
Property in Brazil

It must be a real sign that the Celtic Tiger is about to collapse. From the boom in local property/apartments, to the fetish for Spanish property, to the streets of Hungary and the bays of new Zealand, we now have Brazilian property. Are we going property mad? It seems to me taht if you just mention property, people will jump to buy it. And we have all sorts of so called advisors (many unregulated) selling what appears to be sure fire investments.
If it looks too good to be true.....
What chance the investor getting a full factfind, a Preliminary Disclosure Certificate and a cooling-off notice with this investment?
Hopefully it won't be as painful as a Brazilian wax (though not that I have any personal experience of either).
 
Are we going property mad?

Why have people made so much money in the Irish property Market over the past 10 years or more? Because Irish property prices have skyrocketed.
Why are people beginning to look abroad for investment opportunities? Because the Irish property market has pretty much peaked, or at least does not promise the same kind of growth that it has done in the recent past. Also, other countries have investment opportunities to. Ireland does not have a monopoly on making money in property.

Undeniably, people make money from property. In fact, rich people make an unbelievable amount of money from property investment, both at home and abroad.

Certainly, there are risks involved in foreign investment, and quite posibbly, the website mentioned earlier in this post is bogus, or at least too good to be true. I'm not arguing with that. But I'm sure there are other ways to ge involved in Brazilian property.

Noel, my advice is the same as advice already posted elsewhere on this board and advice given to me by other people. Investigate the company thoroughly and possibly look into other avenues. I'm sure they are not the only property investment company out there. Maybe they are bogus! Maybe not! Cover evrey single angle and if needs be get a solicitor involved to check out the company.

Don't listen to negativity. Nobody ever got rich by listening to people who put ideas down out of hand.
 
Re: Are we going property mad?

Nobody ever got rich by listening to people who put ideas down out of hand.
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I'm not sure that I'd agree with this, but I'd definitely agree with its corollary, i.e. Lots of people got poor by NOT listening to those who put down ideas.

I'm not suggesting that everyone should rule out property investment in Brazil, but I see lots of greed-driven people ready to dive into whatever proposal promises the best return - proceed with extreme caution.
 
Are we going property mad?

That's my point exactly Rainyday.

What I said was that Noel should, in my humble opinion, look thoroughly into this company. Perhaps property in Brazil is very good at the moment and has a bright future. I'm sure, if Avatar prove to be a bunch of cowboys, checking into them first can do no harm.

However, Avatar is unimportant to the overall investment idea. I agree with you that extreme caution should be taken, as it should with ANY property investment! Avatar may not be the best way to do it. Reseach, time & effort will reveal the best way forward.
 
Re: Are we going property mad?

Hi piggy

That's exactly why I am so sceptical about Irish people being enticed to invest in Brazil. How on earth is it logistically possible for an ordinary or novice Irish investor to travel there to do the research that would be necessary? From Travelocity.com I see that it takes 15 to 22 hours to fly from Dublin to Rio. The cheapest flights there cost USD 700 return if you are not picky about when you want to go. However if you specify specific dates (I picked June 10 outward at June 17 return and July 1 outward and July 8 return) the cost jumps to at least USD 3169 return per person.

Most property owners will tell you that is necessary (often unavoidably so) to visit the property (sometimes on an emergency basis) from time to time - usually a number of times each year. Given this fact, the logistics, and flight costs alone, of a Brazil investment are simply insane.

Doing a company search on Avatar, as you suggest, will be unlikely to yield much information for you, apart from the identity of the directors and other company officials. It will definitely not tell you anything about how worthwhile is any investment they promote - any more than research on reputable domestic auctioneers such as Sherry Fitzgerald or Hooke & McDonald will tell you much about whether a property investment in Dartry, Dingle or Donegal is likely to be a success.
 
Are we going property mad?

Hi Tommy,

I do agree with a lot of your points. However, I would take you up on a few things.
Firstly, there are Irish people who invest in 'distant' countries. They usually use Property Management companies so that they do not have to make emergency visits. I know I've used him before as an example and I don't want to get into a discussion about him, but 'Rich Dad' does exactly this.

I do agree that it may be a risky business (especially somewhere like Brazil) so you'd need to be fully aware of what you are doing, I'd imagine.

Lastly, although I do agree with a lot of what you've said, there are other ways of researching a company other than knowing who the managing directors are? Talking to them in person and seeing exactly what they have to offer would certainly help. But I don't know anything about them so I don't want to comment anymore on them.
Finding someone who has used them would tell you volumes about them too.
 
Re: Are we going property mad?

Hi Piggy

My point is very, very simple - Brazil is much too far away from Ireland, and it costs too much to fly there, for it to be a viable investment proposition for any ordinary Irish investor.

This applies regardless of all other factors - the investment itself, or indeed the people promoting it. And just because "Rich Dad" says it is a good idea shouldn't blind anyone to the obvious impracticalities. After all, not all of us can rely on the proceeds of zillions of book sales to underwrite our investments, or indeed our airfares...
 
Are we going property mad?

I did say that I didn't want to get into a discussion on Rich dad. He started off in property Investment (no books) and used Property Management companies, which is what you would do if investing in Brazil.

Anyone wanting to invest there should try to talk with people who have already done it.

I disagree that it is impractical.
 
Re: Are we going property mad?

Anyone wanting to invest there should try to talk with people who have already done it.
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Provided that they can trust those people to give honest feedback & not try to 'talk up the market' in their own interest. And if those people have only 'discovered' Brazil recently, is their experience really going to count for much in assessing a long-term investment. And if they are long-term investors in Brazil, is this really relevant - as they won't have crystal balls to allow them to see into the future of property in Brazil.
 
Property in Brazil - any advice

My brother has lived in Brazil for the last number of years and I have visited him myself and had look around more out or curiosity than anything else.

Property there ( unless it was bought years ago ) is a no no at the moment because of the poor performance of their currency ( the real - pronounced Hay-aye ) against the US Dollar. He and his wife have a numbe rof property investments but they are almost all commercial property ( offices etc ).

The majority of residential property values have decreased over the last 5- 10 years by approx 25%.

This is all anecdotal stuff I know but that's whats happening on the ground over their guys. If you really must invest buy a hotel in Rio
 
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