Threatened nurses strike

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Purple

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Nurses are threatening industrial action if they do not get a 10.5% pay increase while reducing their working week to 35 hours. What justification are they offering for this? They have enjoyed substantial pay increases in recent years and the standard working week in this country is 39 hours. I do not think that they will have much public support for their actions.
It also shows their claim that their primary concern is the care of their patients is false and exposes the true motivation for the A&E protests last year as being primarily motivated by self interest.
 
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The INO have being harping on about the 35 hr week for decades. Strange how they're always calling for more staff (or in INO speak "beds") yet seem to think what effectively would be a 10% reduction in staff will be beneficial.

Interesting program running on BBC2 at the moment "Can Gerry Robinson Fix the NHS". Superficially at least the Irish health system has a similar structure, ineffective hospital management - check, primadonna consultants - check, disaffected nurses - check.
 
Diziet said:
Healthcare professionals other than nurses are on a 35 hour week. Nurses are on 39. Are they supposed to be happy about it?
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What other healthcare professionals working in wards and outpatient departments are on a 35 hour week?
 
beattie said:
One would think there was an election on the way......;)
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They are quite up front about making this an election issue.

The INO are a trade union for nurses and are mandated to lobby for them. They are not mandated to lobby for patients, or anyone else. Everything they say and do should be taken in that context.
Just remember this the next time you hear anyone on the radio or TV bleating on about patient rights and conditions in hospitals. What they are really looking for is more money.
 
Purple said:
Just remember this the next time you hear anyone on the radio or TV bleating on about patient rights and conditions in hospitals. What they are really looking for is more money.
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The health budget has drastically increased in the past few years and it is still an embarrassment IMO. Just throwing more money at this problem will be just be wasting more money without associated reform. Having said that there are too many vested interests in the health service and I include the INO. Even though I wouldn't vote for the PD's I think Harney is the only one in the gov who can tackle the VI's. Martin was clearly out of his depth.
 
ashambles said:
Interesting program running on BBC2 at the moment "Can Gerry Robinson Fix the NHS". Superficially at least the Irish health system has a similar structure, ineffective hospital management - check, primadonna consultants - check, disaffected nurses - check.
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I also saw this programme and the waste and poor management was frightening. I've no doubt that the same goes on in our hospitals.
 
Purple said:
The INO are a trade union for nurses and are mandated to lobby for them. They are not mandated to lobby for patients, or anyone else. Everything they say and do should be taken in that context.
Just remember this the next time you hear anyone on the radio or TV bleating on about patient rights and conditions in hospitals. What they are really looking for is more money.
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i take it that by 'anyone' you mean anyone from the INO.................I hope...........
 
Purple said:
The INO are a trade union for nurses and are mandated to lobby for them. They are not mandated to lobby for patients, or anyone else. Everything they say and do should be taken in that context.
Just remember this the next time you hear anyone on the radio or TV bleating on about patient rights and conditions in hospitals. What they are really looking for is more money.
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I presume we should take any bleating from the HSEA or IBEC or SFA in the same context?

I don't know much about the nurses issue. I did work for a medical supplies company some years back that used to take good nurses off the wards into sales jobs. Give them a company car and 9-5 M-F hours, pay them pocket money and the nurses were like pigs in the proverbial.

If we want a decent health services, we need to keep good nurses on the wards.
 
Yorky said:
This same union is always banging on about patient rights and dignity etc which really is a case of crocodile tears as their wage/hours demands only serve to divert money from where it is needed.
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I don't think you quite get it Yorky. Adequate nurses' pay is required to keep nurses in their chosen career. Without adequate pay, they quit and go work elsewhere (why shouldn't they!) Without adequate staffing levels, not enough wards can be kept open and not enough beds can be properly managed. More and more patients continue to queue up for treatment regardless, leading to backlogs, overcrowding, delays, etc. In the midst of this, those nurses that are left have to cope with ever increasing workloads, longer hours, stress, inadequate pay etc. Do you follow the trend here? The nurses are the most vocal advocates of patient rights cos they are the ones who see first hand what is required, andthis includes paying nurses enough money to keep nurses at work. Try working a few hours in their shoes and see if your view is the same. And no, I'm not a nurse, I don't work in medicine at all, but I know a lot who do and I wouldn't do what they do, nor put up with their lot for ten times the money. They even have to pay for their own Christmas party!
 
oopsbuddy said:
I don't think you quite get it Yorky. Adequate nurses' pay is required to keep nurses in their chosen career. Without adequate pay, they quit and go work elsewhere (why shouldn't they!) Without adequate staffing levels, not enough wards can be kept open and not enough beds can be properly managed.
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The same can be said for any career. I have seen no evidence that their are any major staffing shortages in nursing. Agency and non national nurses seem to be filling the gaps.
oopsbuddy said:
More and more patients continue to queue up for treatment regardless, leading to backlogs, overcrowding, delays, etc.
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and the INO opposed a HSE directive last year that would have allowed faster admission to wards when A&E was overcrowded. The problem of overcrowding is caused by structural inefficiencies. All attempts to remedy this situation have been obstructed by the INO as they use any proposed change as an excuse to press for a pay increase.

oopsbuddy said:
In the midst of this, those nurses that are left have to cope with ever increasing workloads, longer hours, stress, inadequate pay etc.
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They no longer take blood, or do most of the orderly type work that took up much of their time 15 or so years ago. What is the average working week for nurses now?
oopsbuddy said:
Do you follow the trend here? The nurses are the most vocal advocates of patient rights cos they are the ones who see first hand what is required, and this includes paying nurses enough money to keep nurses at work.
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What I take from this is that you agree that nurses are not the selfless vocational workers that they portray themselves to be but are just like the rest of us and are motivated, to a large extent, by money. What I see is that every time they have a choice between lobbying government to spend very large but still limited resources on patient care of nurses pay they lobby for nurses pay.
I do not see how patient care will be improved by reducing the number of hours of nursing care offered by 10%.
I do not accept that nurses in general are badly paid. I do think that senior levels are very under paid; the matron of a hospital has a staff of hundreds and a budget of millions. For that sort of responsibility they should be on 100k plus.

My main gripe is not that they are looking for a pay increase, it's the dishonest way in which they present their case.
 
Purple, what I take from your last message is that you seem to have some serious issues with nurses! Do I take it from what you say that nurses must be selfless vocationed individuals who should not care what they get paid cos they should be happy doing what they do? I think they must be selfless and vocationed to do what they do in the first place, and YES, they should also be motivated by money - why shouldn't they be? They have to pay rent or a mortgage, raise a family, etc. just like everyone else, and if they don't start standing up and shouting about their pay demands, nobody is going to do it for them. The cost of living is going up for everyone, nurses too. You hardly think they should all live in a nurses' home and be happy to have the opportunity to work in a hospital on shiftwork, nights, weekends, long days, and all for modest wages, just for the pleasure of the job? Your last point about what should be the going-rate wage for a matron is closer to the mark, but why just at that level? The level of responsibility carried by all health professionals is enormous, and these are highly qualified and experienced professionals, and they can't just clock off at 5.00 every day and pick up where they left off the next morning. Talk to some nurses and gather their views.
 
Purple said:
I have seen no evidence that their are any major staffing shortages in nursing. Agency and non national nurses seem to be filling the gaps.
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Isn't the huge proportion (between 30% & 60% from what I've seen) of non-national nurses evidence of a staffing shortage in itself?
 
How so? What has the nationality of foreign national workers got to do with it? Who's to say that c. 100% of the demand is not satisfied in which case the nationality of the individuals in question is not really relevant?
 
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