Waste Water Treatment Systems. bio-cycle

F

FDH

Guest
Hi,

I'm going to be applying for PP on a site soon.
We're gotton a general indication that we wont be allowed use a septic tank, so we have to look at a waste-water treatment system.
I've tried Googling AAM - but have found nothing.

I've heard that these systems are troublesome..Is this true ?
There are a few different ones out there, bio-cycle probably beeing the best known..

Can anyone give an advice on the differents systems out there ?
What is the best one ?
and any rouch prices ?

Many Thanks,
FDH
 
FDH,

Generally when the Council give you FPP on condition that you install such a system they state that the waste water system must be Irish Agrement board approved.

Have a look [broken link removed]. It will give you a list of approved suppliers and contact details etc.
 
Personal Experiences..

Thanks Cushtie,

Exactly what I wanted.

But has anyone out their got these systems ?
are the maintenace free, cheap to run.. ?
Anyone had problems .....etc...
Any hidden costs ?

Many thanks,
FDH
 
Re: Personal Experiences..

www.biocycle.ie is the website for the genuine Biocycle unit (there are cheaper imitation units out there).

Cost is about €6,000 plus delivery (up to €650 depending on where you are) with annual maintenance of about €230/year I believe (call them and ask). This covers servicing and periodic replacement of the pump and air blowers which are a necessary part of the system.

According to the people I spoke with there, the large capacity of the unit means desludging only needs to be done every four years or so (as against every year at a cost of about €100) so theoretically annual running costs should be less than a standard septic tank.

There are alternatives: Puraflo (check the Bord na Mona website) is a good bit cheaper but a few people have told me they are troublesome. You'll find a list in the yellow pages.

You could also consider a reed bed system if you have the space, and the inclination.
 
not installed yet

One of the conditions I've had on my recent planning approval (finally) was that I have to enter into a long term maintenance contract with the manufacturer/ provider of the waste treatment system.
I am not surprised as I read a report somewhere in the last few months about these units installed in Ireland and the biggest reason for their failure is they are not properlly maintained. This report also seemed to indicate that in terms of planning permission, the use of septic tanks will be discouraged in the future, in favour of these full waste treatment systems. Obviously to reduce the risk to our groundwater.

I've had quotes for the Biocycle system (by far the most expensive in every way), Bord na Mona peat filtering system and the Enviropak unti. Leaning towards the Enviropak unit at the moment, but would consider the Biocycle unit if the finances stretch a bit more after the contractor's quotes come in (probably unlikely).
 
Re: not installed yet

In the good ole days, a farmer would empty your septic tank & spread it on his land. This 'shouldn't' happen in the future if the EU Nitrate (Nitrite?) directive is ever implemented/enforced.

Sluice
 
Re: not installed yet

Here's my dilemma. Received PP for my tank 5 yrs ago when preconditions were not given. Finally putting in the tank. Could dig a hole and fill it with stones if I wanted to and pipe the cr*p out to it. Or could put in a primo treatment plant a la Biocycle. What would you do? I want something that works and doesn't smell like Ringsend on a hot summer day!
 
BIO-CYCLE

Hi,

I rang Bio-Cycle - they quoted me 6750 + VAT and €230 euro per year SLA.

That's very steep compared to other systems.

Has anyone else got any good/bad experiences with any of these systems ?

Has anyone bought a Bio-Cycle ? if so - did they budge on the price ? Maybe offer a 5yr sla on the cheap or something ?

Thanks,
FDH
 
Puraflo

Am anxious to get anyone's feedback on the Bord na Mona Puraflo as I have the deposit cheque written (not posted) but I note above someone posts that 'they can be troublesome'. Can anyone refute or substantiate this based on experience?
 
Re: not installed yet

Let me qualify the above "troublesome" comment. "People" have told me that they "heard" that they can be "troublesome."

No personal experience beyond that.

Not impressed with the fact that never got a reply from Bord na Mona when I responded to their online query form.

But bottom line is that no septic system yet invented will be trouble free unless maintained - from hole in the ground cess pits to puraflos to biocycles to reed beds. Let's face it - sh*t needs work. Me, I want a system that keeps the work to a minimum, and I don't mind paying a few bob every year not to worry whether the topsoil is rising or whether that's sh*t down there bubbling over my lawn. :)
 
I am in australia and use biocycle, we have had lots of maintenance with this & again tonight I have had to ring the plumber because the alarm light is on & there is no frost as yet tonight. it has certainly been great as far as reusing the effluent but much more costly than an old septic tank. I am not very satisfied with the huge upkeep it has cost us in the last 5 1/2 years. Do your homework, wish we had known a bit more before committing..
 
cushtie said:
FDH,

Generally when the Council give you FPP on condition that you install such a system they state that the waste water system must be Irish Agrement board approved.

Have a look [broken link removed]. It will give you a list of approved suppliers and contact details etc.
Click to expand...
Could you please email me list of suppliers I can not download it
 
STUCKEY. Yep I have one which was in the house prior to my purchase. The system I have is a huge system but alas I have had thousands upon thousands of Euro of repairs with my system, which is continual. In fairness to the system, it works perfectly, and the problem is that it was installed incorrectly prior to Kingspan taking over Klargester. Therefore, although they are the agents Kingspan refuse to deal with my queries or requests or assit me as I think the system I have was the original of the species. If I require spares I must go to the UK to purchase them. Installed about 11 years ago I think. If you get a system which works properly (which most do) they are superb. Due to other matters I have had with Kingspan management I am unable to recommend them, but have you tried Bord na Mona who do a fantastic system and there are also many others whose systems do the same thing.
 
My architect has a Bio-Crete system on my planning application. Anyone go any toughts on this system. It seems to be a resonable price at just over 4k inc vat + delivery
 
STUCKEY said:
Could you please email me list of suppliers I can not download it
Click to expand...
Hey Stuckey,

The previous post (from way back when) was a link to a web page not a downloadable file. The website has undergone some changes since then, so the old URL no longer works.

Apologies, I can't quite link you direct to the info, but if you go to the [broken link removed] of the NSAI (National Standards Authority Ireland) webpage you can filter your search by "product area" (in this case "waste water treatment") and you can find the IAB (Irish Agrément Board) certified companies (as previously linked by Stuckey).

Worth having a look around the site, some useful information available on exactly what this does and does not certify.



While IAB certification is a minimium you should be looking for, I would suggest you take heed of the information provided on the Biocycle website...
Agrément certificates are sometimes presented as evidence that a system has Government approval, however Agrément certification is based on claims by suppliers, and the Agrément Board accepts no responsibility for system inadequacy or failure. These certificates should be treated with extreme caution as many of the statements and claims in them are untested unscientific and meaningless.
Click to expand...

(I have no connection with Biocycle, but they do make that point well so I'm happy to quote them)

Also of note from that page...
A new European Standard for domestic wastewater treatment plants has been formulated and transposed in Ireland as I.S. EN 12566. According to the Department circular 16/2006- , “On completion of the transition period for the standard in July 2008, all such plants should comply with the harmonized part of the standard”.
To ensure future compliance with legal requirements it would be in the interest of prospective purchasers and specifiers of treatment systems to establish the treatment system’s certified efficiency rating and the results of the other relevant EN 12566 tests, as non-compliance could adversely affect the value and viability of their properties.
Click to expand...
 
Just a quick note to advise my current situation with Envirocare who are meant to be Klargester in Ireland. My tank has been giving problems for years and packed up and after months and years of hasstle with the system (in house before I moved in), they arrived in May to inspect the problem and quickly advised that they would repair the fault. Previously refused to look at system as it was sold before Kingspan boughts the Irish rights. After months of promises and the engineer was capable of fixing the problems and after three times of having the tank cleared they refused to do the job. My own team will now do the job, but as for parts -- from Envirocare not a chance after waiting months despite all the promises in the world. Yesterday I contacted Klargester in the UK who have nothing to do with Envirocare or Kingspan and I ordered the parts and paid for them and should be with me on Monday morning. Basically if you want a Klargester Perculating system, try them in the UK and they have an agent in this country who has no ties with the other messers.
 
There are about ten different wastewater systems on the Irish market--I have studied most of them --I am a firm believer that you should generally try & match the system to where you live(eg local supplier is usu. more convenient if you need them for repairs,replacements etc) Also certain systems will suit certain ground conditions etc (eg high water tables are usu better served with concrete tanks which will not be as liable to lift out of the ground when desludged etc) Its a complex science --I have been dealing with good,bad & ugly sites for twenty years so dont be afraid to post me ! ps I have no direct financial involvement with any of the systems although I do have to select them for clients who know very little about them.
 
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