ECC misleading headline:1 in 3 goods fail to arrive when shopping online

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nt00deep

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That was the headline this morning on the radio, and I waited, and waited, and waited for the correction. It did not materialise.

Here is a snip from an email I sent to the European Consumer Centre asking for clarification on their press release and interview on Morning Ireland.

"I heard with amazement this morning that one third of goods ordered online in the EU are not delivered. This was the opening of the interview on Morning Ireland. I awaited a correction, but it did not materialise, altough I did sense from the interviewee that in fact the "one third" phrase referred to one third of cases/complaints handled by ECC related to non-delivery.

I heard a similarly misleading opening statement on the Ryan Tubridy show, but did not get a chance to hear the piece in full.

I had a look at your press release this morning and indeed your fine report, and I have reached the same conclusion I reached after listening to the piece on Morning Ireland. It would appear that one third of cases/complaints handled by ECC relate to non-delivery, but it is not correct to extrapolate this to conclude that one third of all goods ordered online are not delivered, because account is not taken of the number of online orders for which case/complaint are not referred to yourselves (which I can only assume are positive experiences for the most part).

If my reading of your data is correct, then the headline quoted on your website and on the radio media this morning is misleading. A logical interpretation of the headline would be that of the 318,000 consumers shopping online in 2005, over 100,000 of them had experienced a failure to deliver. Clearly that is a shock statistic, and I don't believe it for a minute.

Instead of the headline "1 in 3 goods fail to arrive when shopping online" would it not be correct to say "1 in 3 complaints re: shopping online relate to delivery failure".

I am amazed that none of the media organisations that carried the story picked up on this.

Can you confirm that my understanding of the data in your report is correct and that we do not have a 33% failure rate when ordering online.

I should say that I have no affiliation to any online businesses, but I do work in the IT industry. My interest here is as an interested shopper, rather than as a worried trader."

(end quote)

If anyone is interested in looking at this, the press release and report are here ...
[broken link removed]

I await clarification from ECC, but if my take is correct, I can't believe such a shock (and misleading) statistic was left stand. Just in case I don't get a response from ECC, I would be curious to hear if anyone heard the statistic being clarified/questioned/corrected in any other media outlets.
 
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Re: 1 in 3 goods fail to arrive when shopping online

I'm not really surprised. Most "news" coverage these days seems to be regurgitation without research or question of press releases issued by various bodies. Fair play to you for taking the time to challenge them on this.
 
Re: 1 in 3 goods fail to arrive when shopping online

I have received the reply from ECC.

In summary, my theory is correct regarding the headline being inaccurate.

A snip of the underlying data is as follows. In 2005 in Ireland, over 380,000 consumers shopped online. ECC Dublin heard from 222 consumers who experienced problems with shopping online. One third of them (approx 75) related to failure to deliver, and one quarter of the failure to deliver cases (approx 20) were cases where the consumer had actually been charged for the undelivered product/service.

Look at it another way: 55 consumers reported problems where goods failed to arrive, but they were never charged for them, so these would relate to failure to confirm/process the order on the part of the vendor. Only approx 20 cases related to consumers having paid for product and not receiving the product.

20 cases of product paid for and not delivered. 55 cases of product ordered, not delivered, but not paid for. 380,000 active online shoppers. The conclusion: "1 in 3 goods fail to arrive when shopping online".

Even allowing for a generous extrapolation to account for consumers that had problems but did not report them to ECC, how anyone could report (without tongue in cheek) the stated headline really does beggar belief.
 
Re: 1 in 3 goods fail to arrive when shopping online

I also emailed RTE about their misleading interview this morning and their incorrect summary on their 'Morning Ireland' news web page.

I haven't had a reply so far.
 
Re: 1 in 3 goods fail to arrive when shopping online

The most stupid report I heard on Morning Ireland happened a few years ago.

It was regarding the actual speed of cars when caught with radar guns. Basically because cars are not moving directly at the gun, but at an angle, the speed measured is "incorrect". The report suggested that this would put
speeding cases in jeopardy, as someone might be "incorrectly" clocked at 60 kph when they were only going at 50. they even had some solicitor in saying "oh, it sounds like these drivers might have a case".

Of course as an Junior Cert. Ordinary level maths student would be shouting at the radio at that stage, if your car is moving at an angle to the radar gun it only makes your speed DECREASE.
Since statistics is part of Leaving Cert. maths, it is even less likely that they know what they are talking about... :rolleyes:
 
Re: 1 in 3 goods fail to arrive when shopping online

ClubMan said:
...Fair play to you for taking the time to challenge them on this.
Click to expand...


Agreed.



I'd love to know, out of those who registered complaints of one form or another, how many referrred to the same websites - for example, could we quickly discover that there are infact only a handful of websites involved in these complaints, or are there several hundred being complained about etc.

A shame we can't get a list of them, but I guess that would be too much to hope for.

Furthermore, the headline is a real shame as there are many positive aspects to shopping online and many many thousand of online retailers, which are legit, do deliver etc

Regards

G>
 
Re: 1 in 3 goods fail to arrive when shopping online

heard Brendan on the Matt Cooper show this evening and when Matt asked the question of Brendan, about 1 in 3 goods not being delivered, and before Brendan even had a chance to reply Matt took it upon himself to ask ( and answer) his own question ' is this a case of An Post not delivering the goods' Brendan then went on the explain one of his own cases where he received an empty box and when he brought it to the seller's attention they replaced it. Personally I have ordered cds and dvds from different companies, tickets from ticketmaster, cosmetics from strawberry, other goods from amazon and ebay and everything arrived ok, if sometimes a day or two later than advertised. Strawberry probably being the closest to actual promised delivery times.
 
Re: 1 in 3 goods fail to arrive when shopping online

It certainly was heartening to hear Brendan and Matt Cooper open and close the issue in 10-words or less this evening.

The scary thing about all of this is that in the reply from ECC, they mention "ECC-Net wants to encourage consumers to shop online. ... Our annual report ... hopefully facilitates a debate on how the European online marketplace can be made safer and therefore more attractive to potential online shoppers".

A laudible objective, but I don't think the penny really dropped that the headline in the press release, carried on at least two radio shows unchallenged, has probably had the opposite effect. How many potential online shoppers are having second thoughts having listened to RTE this morning and having missed Matt and Brendan this evening.
 
Re: 1 in 3 goods fail to arrive when shopping online

Believe it or not, I had not seen the press release or noticed this thread. But the press release headline could not be any clearer:

1 in 3 goods fail to arrive when shopping online, according to new ECC-Net Report


When the researcher told me today they wanted to discuss the headline from the Examiner, I immediately knew that it must be wrong. I read the ECC report in a few minutes and it was genuinely misleading. I was very anxious to dismiss the notion that online shopping was not safe so I asked Matt to make sure to mention this headline.

Brendan
 
Re: 1 in 3 goods fail to arrive when shopping online

This press release is an absolute disgrace. The worst thing about it is the sentence "As in 2003 and 2004, 1 out of 3 goods on average did not arrive to consumers who bought online.", implying that this is the third year in succession that this error has been made.

If the ECC has so badly misled the public not once but three times on such an important issue, then we must conclude that they are either very incompetent or very careless. If we cannot depend on their work being presented properly, then they should be abolished or at the very least, heads should roll at the highest level.

Does anyone know to whom, if anyone, they are accountable or answerable?
 
Re: 1 in 3 goods fail to arrive when shopping online

Im surprised they still havent acted to correct the headline.

I believe consumer advocates should be vocal and proactive (as well as being accurate). I enjoy Tina Leonard's (manager, ECC Dublin) radio shows and have posted here about them in the past.

Unless Im mistaken Tina Leonard shared a platform withe Brendan recently on the Matt Cooper show?

About Us
ECC Dublin provides free and confidential information on consumer rights in the EU and assists consumers with cross-border disputes. The Centre is a member of the European Consumer Centre Network.

The Centre is based at 13A Upper O'Connell Street, Dublin 1. The phone line (01 8090600) is open to the public from Monday to Friday between 9.30am and 1pm. Our fax number is 01 8090601 and you can email us at info@eccdublin.ie
Staff members

Manager Tina Leonard
Legal Adviser Elena Calavia
PR & Marketing Manager Mary Denise O'Reilly
Administrator Emma Byrne
Dispute Resolution Adviser Susan Reilly
Consumer Adviser Juan Bueso
Consumer Adviser Arthur Hilliard
Click to expand...
 
Re: 1 in 3 goods fail to arrive when shopping online

ajapale said:
Im surprised they still havent acted to correct the headline.
Click to expand...

Note that the headline on this thread (as it currently stands) is equally incorrect & misleading! :)
 
Re: 1 in 3 goods DO NOT fail to arrive when shopping online

Well spotted ubiquitous. I hadn't discovered the ability to amend a thread title until now.

I don't expect a correction to the ECC press release any time soon though.
 
Re: ECC misleading headline:1 in 3 goods DO NOT fail to arrive when shopping online

If you download the pressrelease and open the document in word and then click file>properties it is possible to see the initials of the person who wrote the misleading headline. Then again the pressrelease is signed by its author.
 
Re: ECC misleading headline:1 in 3 goods DO NOT fail to arrive when shopping online

I emailed the author and asked if she would like to post her comments here.
 
Re: ECC misleading headline:1 in 3 goods DO NOT fail to arrive when shopping online

Got a reply from Mary Denise O'Reilly of the ECC.

"Thank you for updating me on the discussion taking place on
www.askaboutmoney.com. We would be delighted to make a comment on this
site and will do so in due course"
 
Re: ECC misleading headline:1 in 3 goods DO NOT fail to arrive when shopping online

This daft headline has been reproduced verbatim in the Westmeath Weekend free newspaper. Well done to the ECC on spreading FUD on on-line commerce. This sort of [broken link removed] consumers can do without, thank you very much.
 
Re: ECC misleading headline:1 in 3 goods DO NOT fail to arrive when shopping online

Is there any trade association which represents on line traders in Ireland or Europe?
 
Re: ECC misleading headline:1 in 3 goods DO NOT fail to arrive when shopping online

In fairness to the Irish Office the misleading statement seems to derive from the [broken link removed] (pdf format).

5.3 Type of problem
Every e-commerce complaint and dispute that is reported to an ECC office is registered and categorised.
The ECC registration form contains numerous categories for the different types of problems that consumers experience. There are 8 main categories, with a further 36 sub-categories.
The main categories, as they appear in the ECC registration form, are problems relating to:
(1) the product;
(2) redress;
(3) delivery;
(4) contract terms;
(5) selling techniques;
(6) price & payment;
(7) ethical aspects;
and (8) other.
Percentages in this section have been rounded off.

The most common complaint by far concerns problems with delivery, which were the cause of 46% of all e-commerce complaints and disputes reported to the Network in 2005.

Problems relating to the quality or condition of the product represent the second most common area, with 25% of complaints and disputes. Problems regarding price & payment, contract terms and redress account for 8%, 8% and 5%, respectively.

Delivery – 46%
Problems relating to the delivery of the product are the most common complaint reported
to the ECC Network. As was the case in 2003 and 2004, the most common problem encountered is the non-delivery of ordered goods. Other problems falling within this category include the delay of the delivery or the order only being partially delivered.
Non-delivery of ordered goods 38 %
Delayed delivery 3 %
Order only partially delivered 3 %
Other problems with delivery 2 %
Click to expand...

The following uk website also points to the inaccurate headline which must have appeared europe wide:

http://www.out-law.com/page-7024.

The most common complaint received concerns the non-delivery of goods. Though the ECC has released a statement claiming that one in three items bought online fails to arrive, in fact the statistics say that 38% of the complaints received by the body relate to goods not received.
Click to expand...
 
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