Voting is a farce

In Australia and I believe some other European countries one faces a fine if one doesn't vote. I too agree with this sysytem, once you are able to spoil your vote if completely dis-satisfied.
I also believe there is no incentive for politicians to be any good as there are elections every few years so it's not in their interest to make policies which take the future into account. Just short term parochial gain.
 
shnaek said:
I also believe there is no incentive for politicians to be any good as there are elections every few years so it's not in their interest to make policies which take the future into account. Just short term parochial gain.
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Isn't this a problem with how voters measure & assess their politicians rather than any inherent problem in the political system itself.
 
RainyDay said:
Isn't this a problem with how voters measure & assess their politicians rather than any inherent problem in the political system itself.
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I agree completely. I think that on balance, accross the political spectrum, we get better than we deserve from our TD's.
 
Purple said:
I agree completely. I think that on balance, accross the political spectrum, we get better than we deserve from our TD's.
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Can someone define for me..."what we deserve"?

Not directly aimed at you Purple
 
Gabriel said:
What about those who couldn't be arsed voting because they don't feel there's anyone out there worth voting for?
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If they think that they could do better then they could always stand for election themselves. Or they could become politically active in order to influence the selection of "better" candidates?
 
ClubMan said:
If they think that they could do better then they could always stand for election themselves. Or they could become politically active in order to influence the selection of "better" candidates?
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This is always the same answer that comes back. Sorry - I don't buy it.
We're a happy little country really so most of us don't care all that much. At days end I go home to my nice house in my nice car. We're a relatively wealthy country so our politicians get away with murder. The 'get involved or shut up' argument is wasted on me.
I want my cake and to be able to eat it. I want to not have to get involved in politics but have competent people doing it and doing it right. There's too many farces going on for me to have any confidence in any of the FF boys and the other crowd(s) just seem like a bunch of clowns if you ask me.

I'm afraid I might be alone in also thinking the electorate isn't all that bright. An unpopular one that I'd say :) The rise of SF is a good example of this.
 
Gabriel said:
I'm afraid I might be alone in also thinking the electorate isn't all that bright. An unpopular one that I'd say :)
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No, I'd sort of agree with this. But it's not that I think the electorate isn't all that bright. Uninformed may be a better word. As someone said above politics (or at least the running of the government, the constitution and so on) should be taught at primary and secondary level. I can only remember one civics class (we did civics for about two months in 1st year and that was it) where we were shown diagrams which represented the Dail and the Seanad and PR voting was explained. As a teenager I probably knew more about the American constitution (possibly still do) because of all those films and sitcoms where you'd see kids learning the 5th amendment etc.
 
Rubbish.

What about those who couldn't be arsed voting because they don't feel there's anyone out there worth voting for? ...
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I want to not have to get involved in politics but have competent people doing it and doing it right.
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Ok! Let’s say that with your winning argument above that you have convinced me and everybody else that there is absolutely nobody in the country who is worth voting for at local or at national level.

So, nobody votes. We therefore have no politicians at local or national level.

Who is going to run the country on a day-to-day basis? Who is going to represent us in Europe?

You want competent people. Who will decide who is competent to do the job? Do we want a democracy or is there another political system that you would prefer?

Marion
 
Marion said:



Ok! Let’s say that with your winning argument above that you have convinced me and everybody else that there is absolutely nobody in the country who is worth voting for at local or at national level.

So, nobody votes. We therefore have no politicians at local or national level.

Who is going to run the country on a day-to-day basis? Who is going to represent us in Europe?

You want competent people. Who will decide who is competent to do the job? Do we want a democracy or is there another political system that you would prefer?

Marion
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That's a simplistic retort.

I'll spell it out then. *Some* people in this country feel disenfranchised with the whole system and do not look at the vast majority of political figures as people worth voting for. I happen to know there's some worth voting for.

Your answer, the like it or lump it answer and most of the rehashed, jaded replies here are exactly why myself and many others will just never bother. The real answer goes deeper than dealing in simplistic scenarios where no one votes and we have no politicians.
In reality there will always be people who vote - but I know that my problem will become more and more of a problem for this country, as a whole, over the years. Just look at the voting turnout figures recently?

Here's another way of looking at it. Why is me not wanting to vote my problem? Surely it should be FF's problem and they should be doing something about it? Simple logic for FF/FG/Lb. Why do people not want to vote come the big day? Answer = ....
 
Marion said:
You want competent people. Who will decide who is competent to do the job?
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If a politician is not competent he should not be re-elected but it is amazing to see how the ones involved in the biggest scandals over the years always seem to get back in!!!
 
They get back in because they have highly efficient electoral machines. They go out and get the votes - they ensure that people get to the voting stations.

Marion
 
Marion said:
They get back in because they have highly efficient electoral machines. They go out and get the votes - they ensure that people get to the voting stations.

Marion
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Which brings us back to "the electorate".
 
Which brings us back to "the electorate".
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Yes, indeed it does.

It highlights the importance of casting one's vote in order to ensure that these "incompetents" or those who have been engaged in shady dealings will not be re-elected.

If we don't endeavour to ensure that they will not be re-elected, then we can't really complain about the standards of our politicians.

Marion
 
As all good reactionaries will tell you, democracy is the 'dictatorship of the proletariat'. Therein lies its greatest flaw and its supreme vindication.

However, "if a nation expects to be ignorant and free, in a state of civilization, it expects what never was and never will be." (Thomas Jefferson, 1816). Put another way, if 51% of the voting population prefers bread and circuses, then bread and circuses we shall have — or 'nice cars' and 'nice homes', whatever...
Clubman said:
Do you have any practical/realistic suggestions for improvements on the situation as you see it?
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Absolutely none! :eek: Other than political activism/running for election...
 
DrMoriarty said:
Because it's more tedious/less satisfying than the alternatives?
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I'm sure that has something to do with it, but question is why have so many people total apathy to Irish politics?
 
I think the point gabriel is that you seem to be waiting for the low turnout of voters to start bothering the politicians. And it should. But I think the reality of it is that those politicians who are most corrupt are going to be least bothered by this as they will always have their people to vote them back in.
 
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